Debate:Is Obama a Muslim?

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Arguments that Obama is a Muslim

The following list of claims was originally from the Barack Obama page, but additional claims may be added.

(guidelines: a "CLAIM" argues for the premise, a "RESPONSE" argues against; use "COUNTER" to argue against a RESPONSE, i.e. favoring the premise.)

  • CLAIM: Obama's background, education, and outlook are Muslim, and fewer than 1% of Muslims convert to Christianity.
    • RESPONSE: This is actually two claims:
      • CLAIM: Obama's background, education, and outlook are Muslim.
        • RESPONSE: Based on what evidence? There is a rumor that he was educated in a Madrassa in Indonesia, but this is patently false; Obama did attend a local public school (not a madrassa) in Jakarta between the ages of 6 and 8, where he received some Muslim education as is standard in the Indonesian public school system; after that he was enrolled in a Roman Catholic school. He did not appear to take his religious studies seriously in either school, according to his own accounts (and possibly witnesses).
      • CLAIM: Fewer than 1% of Muslims convert to Christianity.
        • RESPONSE 1: Possibly true, but this is only relevant if Obama was at some point a Muslim. He was never a Muslim.
          • COUNTER: Never was a Muslim, hmmmmmm. If his father was a Muslim, that would make Obama a Muslim at birth.
            • RESPONSE: This depends on several things: (1) whose laws you recognize (Muslim? Christian? US?); (2) even if you choose to favor Islam's laws over the others, there is some vagueness which requires further research. (3) If he's claimed as a Muslim by the Muslims (or some group of them), would this prevent him from also being a Christian, as he clearly has shown far more interest and activity within that faith than within Islam?
        • RESPONSE 2: his father was an ex-muslim atheist. We have no proof to counter that. Obama was never a Muslim.
          • COUNTER: no proof exists that Senoir was an Atheist.
            • RESPONSE: His family says he was. They are more authoritative than anything except proof as to someone's personal beliefs.
        • RESPONSE 3: The 1% issue is a fallacy of weak induction called the "composition fallacy". Every argument it gets into will be a weak argument.
  • CLAIM: Obama's middle name (Hussein) references Husayn, who was the grandson of Muhammad, which most Christians would not retain.
    • RESPONSE 1: Most Christians also wouldn't run for president of the United States; does this prove that Obama also didn't do that?
    • RESPONSE 2: What evidence do you have that most Christians would not retain the middle name they were given at birth just because it references a mythological figure from another religion?
    • RESPONSE 3: Even if most Christians would decide to change their birth name as you claim, how does this prove that Obama is not a Christian because he did not? "Most" is not "all". Are you implying that any Christian who would not do such a thing isn't a "real Christian"?
  • CLAIM: Obama recently referred to his "Muslim faith."
    • RESPONSE: The description for the YouTube video linked to as support for that claim says " It is as clear as day that he's putting sarcastic quotes around "my Muslim faith" since the entire question is about his (actual) Christian faith."
  • CLAIM: Obama said the Muslim call to prayer is "one of the prettiest sounds on Earth at sunset," and recited "with a first-class [Arabic] accent" the opening lines: "Allah is Supreme! ... I witness that there is no god but Allah ...."
    • RESPONSE 1: How does this prove he's a Muslim? Probably many professors of Islamic studies would also be able to do these things, but that doesn't make them all Muslims. What it makes them (and Obama) is educated (and possibly gifted in the area of language) -- both excellent qualities in a world leader.
    • RESPONSE 2: The only source for this allegation is apparently NYT columnist Nicholas Kristof (NYT, 2007-03-06, "Obama: Man of the World"), who (as I understand it) is generally rather positive about Obama. Perhaps this is being taken out of context?
  • CLAIM: Obama stated that the autobiography of Malcolm X, a Nation of Islam leader who became a Muslim, inspired him in his youth.
    • RESPONSE 1: Many black people were influenced by Malcolm X. You'll have to show a high degree of correlation between "being influenced by Malcom X" and "converting to Islam while denying it publicly".
    • RESPONSE 2: "Nation of Islam" is not part of the Islamic religion but was founded in the US, presumably based loosely on Islamic ideals. Do you have any evidence that Obama is a NoI member? Wouldn't NoI be very interested in publicizing Obama's membership if he had joined, as a way of promoting themselves?
  • CLAIM: Obama raised nearly $1 million and campaigned for a Kenyan presidential candidate who had a written agreement with Muslim leaders promising to convert Kenya to an Islamic state that bans Christianity.
    • RESPONSE 1: Where is the evidence that Obama campaigned for Odinga?
    • RESPONSE 2: While this might demonstrate that Obama was friendly to Islam, this does not prove that he is Muslim. The Eisenhower administration arranged a coup-d'etat in Iran in 1952, replacing the democratically-elected president with a monarchy. Does that make Eisenhower an anti-democratic royalist? Donald Rumsfeld shook hands with Saddam Hussein; does that make him a Muslim terrorist?
  • CLAIM: Obama's claims of conversion to Christianity arose after he became politically ambitious, lacking a date of conversion or baptism.
    • RESPONSE 1: Has anyone bothered to ask his church (or his office) to see if they have a record of this?
    • RESPONSE 2: Many people do not keep track of these dates.
  • CLAIM: On the campaign trail Obama has been reading "The Post-American World" by Fareed Zakaria, which is written from a Muslim point-of-view.
    • RESPONSE: So... everyone who reads that book is a Muslim?
  • CLAIM: Contrary to Christianity, the Islamic doctrine of taqiyya encourages adherents to deny they are Muslim if it advances the cause of Islam.
    • RESPONSE 1: Ah-HA! So every time he denies he's a Muslim, that PROVES he really IS! ...Hey, maybe you're a Muslim too! Go on, prove me wrong.
    • RESPONSE 2: A vital component of all conspiracy theories is that evidence against the claim is forged and there for constitutes evidence for it. The issue represents a known glitch in human reasoning and a trap that you cannot easily reason someone out of; the "9/11 truthers" are the same way.
  • CLAIM Obama uses the Muslim Pakistani pronunciation for "Pakistan" rather than the common American one.
    • RESPONSE: Right, and I bet he uses "C.E." instead of "A.D." in his dates, and maybe even the Metric System. He also pronounces "divisive" with a short "i" in the second syllable. What in the world does this have to do with anything?
      • COUNTER: If educated, you pronounce what you have learned. Where did he learn the Muslim use of Pokistan? Occidental teach this? University of Chicago teach this? Does Harvard teach this? Only a Muslim knows the proper way to pronounce so he was taught by Muslims.
        • RESPONSE 1 fallacious argument. This still does not demonstrate any evidence for Muslimhood. For one thing, many non-muslims pronounce Pakistan this way (and probably many Muslims give it the more American pronunciation).
        • RESPONSE 2: I don't know, but the obvious answer would be in the Indonesian public school he attended early in life. There are certainly many places a well-educated person might pick up an odd (or perhaps more correct) pronunciation.
        • RESPONSE 3: "Only a Muslim knows the proper way to pronounce so he was taught by Muslims." - and yet you clearly are claiming to know the muslim way to pronounce it (otherwise you would not know whether or not his pronunciation is the correct muslim form) by your own logic therefore, YOU are a muslim.
  • CLAIM: Many of Obama's statements about religion conflict with Christianity, leading one group to demonstrate with a 7-part video series, "Why Barack Obama is Not a Christian."
    • RESPONSE: Christianity has a wide range of views on a lot of different subjects, and any one person's views are bound to be "un-Christian" by someone's lights. When I have time, I will review the linked videos and respond in more detail. (Reason #1, Reason #2, Reason #3)
  • CLAIM: Obama was thoroughly exposed to Christianity as an adult in Chicago prior to attending law school, yet no one at law school saw him display any interest in converting. Obama unabashedly explained how he became "churched" in a 2007 speech: "It's around that time [while working as an organizer for the Developing Communities Project (DCP) of the Calumet Community Religious Conference (CCRC) in Chicago] that some pastors I was working with came around and asked if I was a member of a church. 'If you're organizing churches,' they said, 'it might be helpful if you went to a church once in a while.' And I thought, 'I guess that makes sense.'"
    • RESPONSE: Perhaps he is simply not very enthusiastic about Christianity. Many people who aren't Muslims feel the same way.
  • CLAIM: Obama is mentioned as helping to organize the 1995 million man march led by black Muslim leader Louis Farrakhan from the Nation of Islam.
    • RESPONSE: ...and therefore...? (This is basically the Malcolm X argument in a weaker form.)
      • COUNTER (I think): if Obama organized a rally for Hitler, then we can clearly say he was a Nazi supporter. But Obama organized a rally for Jew bigot Farrakhan, he can't possibly be a Muslim supporter. (yeah right)
        • RESPONSE That's not proof, and only circumstantial evidence, that he was NOI. And aside from the NOI is not Islam.
          • COUNTER The correlation is more than justified. What cause did Obama support? a Muslim cause.
            • RESPONSE 1: Read up on the million man march. It wasn't a Muslim cause.
            • RESPONSE 2: Since when does supporting "a Muslim cause" automatically make one a Muslim?
            • RESPONSE 3: What do you mean by "a Muslim cause"? Muslims favor male dominance in marriage and firm suppression of homosexuality -- does that mean Conservapedia is Muslim, just because Conservapedia also supports these causes?

This is a rubbish way to pursue a debate. I can see why the original arguments were laid out like this, but adding more & more unsigned comments to the middle of this is just making a mess. Much better to put any new suggestions or criticisms below. Just offering my opinion. Sideways 13:04, 13 November 2008 (EST)

I really like this way of doing it, although I think a shorthand signing with a key at the bottom would be better, if no one objects I'll look at the page history and do that tomorrow.
The point is not who said something but whether it makes sense. A comment which hasn't been refuted is one for which nobody has been able to think of a refutation (or felt strongly enough about it to write it down here, anyway). I wouldn't object to people signing their comments, but what might be more useful is if people would indicate their agreement with any comments they agree with, not just their own. --woozle 10:42, 19 November 2008 (EST)

While I agree, do you think it will actually make a difference? They're not going to change the Obama article unless Obama gets denounced by every mosque from here to mecca, and even then they'd probably just call it deceit. EternalCritic 13:21, 13 November 2008 (EST)

Agreed. A question I'd like to pursue with the "in crowd" here is: what is the philosophical basis of Conservapedia's fact-base? Is it ultimately derived from Andy Schlafly's authority (i.e. ultimately whatever he says is true is true as far as Conservapedia is concerned), or from Scripture (in which case: how do we decide between multiple conflicting interpretations?), or from objective reality, or what? --woozle 10:42, 19 November 2008 (EST)

NormanS's View

I agree with the above, there is little to no evidence that Obama is a Muslim. In fact the whole myth seems to have been started by Andy Martin, a colourful "lawyer" (he was rejected from the bar) who is known for his racist rants against Jews and other groups and his frivolous lawsuits. As an Australian based McCain supporter and a pretty Conservative Christian I was upset when Obama won. However, the reason I oppose him is because of his policies, not because of some misguided claim about his religion. If you really were interested in making personal attacks against him you'd be better off accepting his claim that he's a Christian and then pointing out how hypocritical he is. That said, there is no integrity in attacking a person's character over their policies, regardless of their political ideology.

As one of the articles posted in the news section stated, the repeated claims that Obama was a Muslim made people vote for him, not against him. The article in its present state reads as a parody and does nothing to help the conservative cause. If this project is to have any credibility it must be rewritten to a balanced viewpoint which discusses his policies, rather than making ridiculous strawman arguments and personal attacks. NormanS 21:45, 11 November 2008 (EST)

A couple of things to add to the above. 1. Andy Martin started this rumour (in 2004), claiming he had "evidence" that Obama was a Muslim & had lied to the America people about his faith, though Martin did not make any of this alleged evidence available to the public or even make it clear what kind of evidence it was. 2. A week before the election, Andy Martin appeared on CNN, retracting his claim that Obama is a Muslim, and replacing it with an even crazier theory - that Obama is the long lost son of the journalist and left-wing activitist Frank Marshall Davis. Again he claimed to have uncoverded proof of this, but offered no evidence whatsoever. See this film. Since Martin now states that Obama is not a Muslim, this clearly proves him to have been lying about having any real evidence that Obama was.
As Norman says, Andy Martin has a history of spurious and vicious lawsuits and paranoid racist statements, and this is the guy you are giving credence to if you believe the myth that Obama is a Muslim. This is who started it. Clearly this was intended as a tactic to stop people voting for Obama. It hasn't succeeded & it's too late now. We should just let it go & get on with our lives. Clinging to this silly racist rumour can only damage Conservapedia's credibility. And it is a racist rumour - if we were talking about a white politician, this rumour wouldn't exist at all.
That said, I don't expect this to make any difference at all. This subject has been debated over & over, but Andrew Schlafly is determined to cling on to this story, even in opposition to most of the editors here & some of the prominent administrators. I hope he is willing to engage in this debate, but I really don't think he will. Sideways 07:33, 12 November 2008 (EST)

The constitution says that there should be no religous test for office.... Just a thought. --Chris

I've totally avoided getting into the question of "why is it so terrible if Obama actually were Muslim?" because the article never actually says "...and therefore he shouldn't be President." Colin Powell did an excellent job of addressing that issue in his endorsement (which I won't link for fear of accidentally promoting evil liberal concepts like diversity and religious tolerance). --woozle 14:11, 13 November 2008 (EST)
I must admit that I am confused about this point. Why should we care if he were a Muslim? Are all Muslims evil? Are all Muslims terrorists? Do all Muslims want to damage the USA? What point is being made here?--Tolerance 15:46, 18 November 2008 (EST)

What's the Point?

I don't see what good it does to say that Obama is a muslim. Why can't we just take him at his word and let God judge his heart? Conservapedia's dwindling credibility is at stake; we will only look foolish if we make such unproven claims. I say we spend more time talking about how Obama is a baby-killer and a socialist-- both established facts (though the term "baby-killer" isn't widely used). --Ben Talk 14:23, 13 November 2008 (EST)

I second this suggestion, though probably for different reasons. --woozle 21:05, 13 November 2008 (EST)

Retitle Request

This page should be renamed "Why Obama is not a Muslim." Just for the sheer number of excuses given here. It seems that Obama was born a Muslim, disputed. That he took Muslim classes, disputed. That his stepfather was Muslim, disputed. Later in life, he extensively reads about Muslims leaders, disputed. Exclusively organized a march for the Nation of Islam, disputed. Friends with known Muslims, disputed. Pastor of twenty years is an outspoken defender of Muslims, disputed. Helps in the election of Muslims in Kenya, disputed. Get my drift? Just can't possibly be a Muslim. --Jpatt 23:56, 13 November 2008 (EST)

I think this argument was brought forth in an earlier discussion on this topic and was easily defeated. Think of all the "disputed" things as individual pieces of evidence in a bigger puzzle. Lets say you are a detective trying to solve a crime. You may find 10 different things in your investigation which point to a certain suspect. Each thing individually may be disputed, and no individual one may be the "smoking gun", but from the sheer amount of them one can deduce that the suspect is most likely the perpetrator. --DRamon 00:04, 14 November 2008 (EST)
So, the volume of accusations is proof they are true? HDCase 00:05, 14 November 2008 (EST)
The volume is just a pattern. The only way we will know for sure is if Obama says, yes, all along my heart belongs to Muhammed. Even then, I am sure the left would discount it all as "ahh, he really didn't take it all seriously." --Jpatt 00:10, 14 November 2008 (EST)
So... you can't actually know, but you're just going to say you're right anyway because it works better for you politically? HDCase 00:12, 14 November 2008 (EST)
Clever, but no. Likely Muslim- yes. I want him to succeed, believe me my family is counting on him. There are over 1 billion Muslims, being a Muslim isn't a bad thing. Secret Muslim is something much different, much. Did you ever here of prophesy? The anti-Christ comes impersonating Christ. I want to believe these are not the end times. One way we will know for sure is how Obama governs as leader.--Jpatt 00:19, 14 November 2008 (EST)
Personally, I don't buy into hocuspocus future-sight jibberjabber. So yes, I've heard of prophecy, but no, I don't give it any heed. But I can see how you'd get "impersonating Christ" from someone accused of being a socialist. HDCase 00:24, 14 November 2008 (EST)
You be best to educate yourself on Revelation. It seems Barry is called many things, and such a short life so far, Commie Messiah.--Jpatt 00:34, 14 November 2008 (EST)
Every Pope, Peter the Great, and most U.S. Presidents have been called antichrist. It's a bit premature to suggest he'll be more powerful than all of those when he hasn't been sworn in yet; he could turn out to be another Buchanan. --Interiot 09:45, 14 November 2008 (EST)
Right, I don't believe in futuresight, therefore I should take its claims seriously. Aside from that, both sides insult the other frequently. How does that prove anything? You're slinging mud just to see if any sticks. HDCase 13:17, 14 November 2008 (EST)

The Pattern

HDCase raises the point that it's not that any one of these points is the smoking gun, it's the pattern towards which they all point -- the puzzle into which they all seem to fit. This is a point which needed to be raised, because I think it's what the original article was driving at although it didn't say so explicitly.

To me, however, what this pattern points toward is this:

  • a man who had what many Americans would see as a rather unconventional upbringing -- which happened to include a lot of exposure to Islam
  • a man who followed his conscience rather than thinking "what will look bad on my political resume, down the road?"
  • a man for whom many people have strong antipathy, for a number of reasons-- and who is therefore likely to be seen in a sinister light no matter what the evidence. Some of the accusations above only "work" at all because of the sheer volume and repetition of the "Obama is Muslim" big lie -- he defends himself against discussion of "my Muslim faith", and that becomes additional "proof".

I mean, look, what indications has the guy ever really given that he's Islamic rather than, say, just another obnoxious (to you) liberal? Seems to me you'd be better off accusing him of being a closet atheist; I could probably make a case for that if I had the inclination. But Muslim?

Some people will believe what they want to believe regardless of the evidence -- and it's part of what makes America great that this is ok. We can tolerate a diversity of ideas and still get along with each other -- "We could stand touching noses for a week at a time and never see eye-to-eye". (Just don't go expecting your point of view to be taken seriously if you don't have the evidence to back it up.) --woozle 18:48, 19 November 2008 (EST)

Muslim discussion is Obama's fault

It's the Obama mandate not to answer questions. It is his fault these possibly rumor, possibly truth exists. He says that he is not a Muslim. Hello, not good enough. Specific questions to answers needed (which he fails to provide). --Jpatt 17:45, 16 November 2008 (EST)

He shouldn't have to repeat his awnser. Once is enough. --Ekeegan 00:05, 18 November 2008 (EST)
So specific questions to answers are not needed because...... he said he is Christian? It seems that Obama was born a Muslim, "No, I am Christian." That he took Muslim classes, "No, I am Christian." That his stepfather was Muslim, "No, I am Christian." Later in life, he extensively reads about Muslims leaders, "No, I am Christian." Exclusively organized a march for the Nation of Islam, "No, I am Christian." Friends with known Muslims, "No, I am Christian." Pastor of twenty years is an outspoken defender of Muslims, "No, I am Christian." Helps in the election of Muslims in Kenya, "No, I am Christian." Get my drift? No need to ask him anything because we have the answer already.--Jpatt 00:15, 18 November 2008 (EST)
Ignoring his answers doesn't mean he did not give them. Obama born a Muslim? No, he said pretty plainly that his father was an atheist, and besides, you don't get religion until you are old enough, Islamic law may say that he inherited the religion, but 'only if you follow Islamic law, which he does not, because he is not a Muslim. That he took Muslim classes?Yes, he did go to a public school in Indonesia, where he doubtlessly received a minor amount of Muslim instruction between the ages of 6 and 8, he then went on to a catholic school where he received doubtlessly received Catholic instruction from 8-10, I don't see people running around spouting how Obama is a Catholic even though the Catholic is more likely to have stuck since he got it when he was older and there for likely remembers more, in either case he left for his grand parents place after that and from that point on there is no connection until he becomes involved with the black liberation movement (which I'm sure he became involved in because of the Draw to Islam, because it had nothing else to offer him, its not as if he is a black man... oh right, he is black, silly me) Later in life he extensively reads about Muslims leaders We are involved in a nuber of conflicts and trade situations with a part of the world that is primarily Muslim, he would have to be an Idiot not to, you know who else reads extensively about Muslims? Bush 43. You know who reads extensively about Christians? Richard Dawkins, Does that make him a christian? No it does not. Exclusively organized a march for the Nation of Islam I'll admit I don't know anything about any march that he organized exclusively, I do know that he was involved in getting people organized for marches and the like, and that the Black issue that NOI dealt with was Obama's main issue at the tie, so it seems likely that that is the reason. Friends with known Muslims Heck yes he is, he is open and up front about this and there is no problem with that. People of different faiths can be friends so long as they aren't bigoted idiots, can you be friends with a Muslim? Would a Muslim be friends with you? Pastor of 20 years an outspoken defender of Muslims So was my Catholic Priest, that doesn't make him or me or my old priest a Muslim, there is nothing wrong with Islam that isn't wrong with a whole lot of other religions, there is no reason to attack it (exclusively) so there is a great deal of reason to stand up for it, even if you aren't a member your self. Helps in election of Muslims in Kenya Both Barrack Obama and the Kenyan Govt. have come out and said there is no truth to that story. The Story is based on a fax of unknown origin and unknown destination (i.e. someone could have made it and faxed it from one end of the office to the other) and cites the PAC Firends of Senator BO, but no such PAC exists. Obamas finances have been well looked at, and there is no missing million dollars, and there is no record of him dealing with this. Just like the birth in Kenya story the only evidence to support it is that there is no evidence around it because it's not even remotely plausible. You are clutching at straws, but Obama actually answered the questions, hes not a Muslim, and there is nothing he can do about that (well he could convert) the problem you have isn't that he hasn't been forthcoming, its that you are wrong and unhappy about it. --Brendanw 15:18, 18 November 2008 (EST)
Thanks for the insight. It is still 100% Obama's fault this controversey exists. It is like pulling teeth without meds. --Jpatt 15:36, 18 November 2008 (EST)
I'm sorry but I don't buy that you even looked. Most of these issues have been discussed pretty widely, if you only listen to conservative talk radio or very conservative talking heads you wont get that sort of information, but if you pop on to snopes or read the economist or WSJ (both conserative papers I might add) you will get most of the information. The problem is not that Obama didn't put the information out, its that you have coddled your self in undiverse media that has insulated you from the facts in this case. Just like you wouldn't get information on a republican getting screwed over unfairly in the San Fransisco Chronical you aren't going to get information on how a demopcrat is being slighted on the rush limbaugh show. --Brendanw 23:35, 18 November 2008 (EST)

Who cares

who cares what is Obama's faith? is that REALLY important?--SocialDemocratic 10:45, 27 November 2008 (EST)

It is not important whether or not he is a Muslim. What counts is that we keep alive the seed of doubt in people's minds that he might be and this will help create a sense of anxiety in people who might be tempted to support him. GloriaL 10:07, 11 December 2008 (EST)

Gloria are you seriously suggesting that we should try to appeal to people's innate xenophobia or racism in trying to convince them that Obama is bad? Nrupert 13:49, 11 December 2008 (EST)

No, only their mistrust of the dishonest! GloriaL 13:55, 11 December 2008 (EST)


Obama Is An Atheist

I have presented this view elsewhere on Conservapedia. I maintain that Obama's apathy toward religion does not prove that he is a closet Muslim, but rather that he is a secret atheist. Occam's Razor argues that the simplest explanation is often the more likely, and I believe that the fact that Obama goes to the gym instead of to church simply indicates that his views on religion are tepid, not that he is staging secret Muslim prayer sessions. The fact that he says the sound of the Muslim call to prayer is beautiful simply indicates that he is another liberal with anti-American leanings. The list goes on. --Economist 23:38, 16 February 2009 (EST)

Or maybe he thinks the Islamic call to prayer is beautiful for the same reason he might think a song is beautiful. --- --OmarAlfarouqo 23:38, 16 January 2010 (EST)

My Dad thinks Obama is an athiest who says Christian things for political reasons. I'm not sure what I think, because personally, I think it's impossible to know for an absolute, positive fact where someone's faith in Christ is at. We can see plenty of indications, but we're not God and we can't "read someone's heart".
However, I do think that the "athiest theory" makes sense. I mean, he doesn't seem to agree with Christians in the political realm; he's a supporter of abortion (including radical, barbaric partial-birth abortion) and seems sympathetic to the cause of gay marriage, both views that are rare among Christians. Plus, I seem to recall his speech at the Easter banquet was rather odd ("There's just something about the resurrection that puts everything in perspective...") And it would make sense for him to pretend to be Christian and say Christian things; in America, it's pretty normal to have a Christian as commander-in-chief, and being an atheist could hurt support for him among Christians.
But I must emphasize: I do NOT know what his faith is. I am NOT God and I could be completely wrong about this. I'm not trying to say anything conclusive. --StoryMaker 13:35, 21 July 2011 (EDT)

Finally, some sense. Yes, I think Obama could be a secret Atheist, Agnostic or Deist. He would not have been elected if he admitted to being any of these. Not that it matters to me personally. --Baz Man

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