Talk:Essay:Teaching Closed-Mindedness

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"illogical, atheistic viewpoints result in mental problems"

By this statement do you mean all atheist viewpoints, atheist viewpoints not arrived at through rational inquiry, or something other? Corry 16:30, 18 August 2008 (EDT)

Atheistic viewpoints are illogical, full stop. If you cannot see this, then you have a certain problem with logic yourself, Corry. Bugler 16:32, 18 August 2008 (EDT)
Easy now, no need to make personal attacks. I'm just asking if the statement means one thing or the other. Corry 16:36, 18 August 2008 (EDT)
Based on the fact that the essay "Mystery:Do Liberal Teachings Cause Mental Illness?" was created eight days ago, I don't think it has gotten enough national traction yet for a central tenet of the "liberal agenda" to be denying "that illogical, atheistic viewpoints result in mental problems" when teaching public school children. Corry 16:44, 18 August 2008 (EDT)
Well, really. Does an argument have to be a hundred years old to be valid? Come on, now. Bugler 16:48, 18 August 2008 (EDT)
This essay is about a supposed liberal agenda of "inculcating an attitude of closed-mindedness" and that denying "that illogical, atheistic viewpoints result in mental problems" is one of the "basic tools of teaching closed-mindedness." In order for a nationwide liberal conspiracy to implement a plan of systemically denying something, that something would reasonably have to possess more nationwide exposure and credibility than Aschlafly's essay, which was penned eight days ago. Corry 16:57, 18 August 2008 (EDT)

Corry, that just shows that it has not been challenged up to now. To you, CP may be a growing online encyclopaedia. You may not realise the worth of Conservapedia and its founder, Andrew Schlafly, in combatting Liberal intolerance and distortion. Among its - and his - successes have been the exposing of 'Professor' Richard Dawkins and the Lenski so-called 'proof of evolution', and these latest articles are just further bricks in this impressive edifice of achievement. Bugler 17:05, 18 August 2008 (EDT)

Well, if it hasn't been challenged yet, how can it be a central tenet of a liberal agenda? If said essay makes national headlines or by some other means influences popular thought and a liberal push against that thought follows, then you would have a point. As it stands, though, none of these things have happened, and hence it doesn't make sense to include this point in the essay. Corry 17:19, 18 August 2008 (EDT)


It didn't take long for a liberal (Corry) here to grasp for a conspiracy theory. Funny how liberals never accuse the same about Hillary Clinton (who complained about a "vast right-wing conspiracy") or Michael Moore (the ultimate conspiracy theorist).

It doesn't take a conspiracy to deny that illogical, atheistic viewpoints result in mental problems. Indeed, Corry seems to be denying it here all by himself.--Aschlafly 17:08, 18 August 2008 (EDT)

Your essay very strongly implies a conspiracy by liberals to push certain ideas on kids- I don't have to grasp for a conspiracy theory when you invent one in an essay. And I don't think that the couple of people who have argued with you regarding your essay is enough to be any kind of liberal agenda, conspiracy, or whatever. Corry 17:19, 18 August 2008 (EDT)
The essay does not imply a "conspiracy" at all. Indeed, I'm going to add that as a point: accuse people who criticize you of being "conspiracy theorists." It's a common tactic by liberals to censor the other side. That does not imply they have a conspiracy to do so, but merely that such behavior flows from the belief system. Rest assured, there is no "conspiracy" to attend church either, even though tens of millions do so every week.--Aschlafly 17:58, 18 August 2008 (EDT)
You discuss the "liberal agenda." Doesn't a liberal agenda require coordination of more than one liberal? Wouldn't organization be required? And the church metaphor doesn't work- "conspiracy" implies something sinister, and I don't think that going to church is sinister at all. There is coordination, however- a bunch of people don't all randomly decide to show up at the same building at the same time with the common purpose if receiving communion, or morning prayers, or what have you. You, however, are implying that liberals are taking part in something that would require organization and coordination, and you obviously feel that the end is sinister. Corry 18:07, 18 August 2008 (EDT)

Any evidence for atheism resulting in mental illness?

Is there any evidence / citation for the above comment? --BennettC 16:33, 18 August 2008 (EDT)

Not any real evidence, no. Murray 22:20, 19 November 2008 (EST)

Tons of evidence at Young Mass Murderers. Of course, those who want to deny causation can always exercise their free will to do so, just as tobacco companies denied that smoking caused cancer.--Aschlafly 21:08, 24 November 2008 (EST)
Yes. Go to the page Mystery:Do Liberal Teachings Cause Mental Illness? and the matter should be explained to your satisfaction. Best wishes, Bugler 16:37, 18 August 2008 (EDT)
I went there, and it doesn't really explain anything. Human 19:37, 26 August 2008 (EDT)

Also I have always thought that liberalism and atheism is about open mindedness. For example, atheists do not blindly believe in whatever is written in a book compiled 1400 years ago. Instead he uses the enquiring mind to find the truth about the universe. --BennettC 16:35, 18 August 2008 (EDT)

Atheistic minds are clamped firmly shut to the glory and wonderment of Creation. Bugler 16:50, 18 August 2008 (EDT)
BennettC, you've undoubtedly been taught that it is somehow open-minded to be liberal and insist on censorship of criticism, demonizing of conservatives, and learn to ridicule and name-call those who point out the lack of logic in liberal theories. Once you realize how closedminded liberal censorship is, you're taken the first step towards freedom and full mental health.--Aschlafly 17:11, 18 August 2008 (EDT)
Is this to imply that liberals are mentally ill? Are you also implying that I am mentally ill? Corry 17:35, 18 August 2008 (EDT)
I think it a fair possibility. Why? Do you see people with mental illnesses as in some way inferior? We know that Liberals are keen on eugenics - perhaps you feel the same way about the physically ill as well. Oh, wait - you guys support abortion for all kinds of 'reasons'. Enough said. Bugler 17:40, 18 August 2008 (EDT)
You go too far. Accusing me of supporting eugenics is desperate and insulting. If you want to descend into such antics then there is no point of talking to you at all. Good day. Corry 17:44, 18 August 2008 (EDT)

Hmm, one point in the essay is 'demonizing conservatives and misrepresenting their positions'. The above seems to be conservatives 'demonizing liberals and misrepresenting their positions'. Following this, by the points made by this very essay, this website teaches close-mindedness. As the Bible says, 'Judge not, lest ye be judged'. ANOther 17:51, 18 August 2008 (EDT)

We tell the truth about liberals, and don't demonize them.--Aschlafly 22:25, 26 August 2008 (EDT)
Only make them out to be fools by saying we all have a mental illness. And then hit us with the demon stick by saying ALL liberals want to censor conservatives. Then you come back again with the accustation of constant deception. Well, sir I testify here before you today to say; No I don't want censorship of prayer, I don't lie, I have no medically diagnosed mental illness or disorder. I wish to provide an environment in which a woman can give birth with out thinking about an abortion because she learned well enough to do the right things to avoid pregnancy or live in a land abundant enough for her to have that child. Knowing what I know about embryo development, the fertilized egg is not recognizable as a human being until the beginning of the 2nd trimester, anything after that is plain murder. In school, I don't want my teacher leading a prayer, as I would feel awkward not participating, even fearing that not participating could harm my grade or image; but if my classmate's faith dictates he should pray, more power to him. This shows he has true faith enough to overcome the peer pressure not to do it; and if you are going to have faith it might as well be a strong one. From now on I would like you to add "except Snotbowst; consult him on it as he is individual and one size does not fit all" to all further blanket statements. Better yet don't use blanket statments, or even better talk about why you are right, not why I am wrong, I will listen much more intently.--Snotbowst 19:45, 19 November 2008 (EST)
Forcing one's mind, or one's own mind, to accept contradictions and untruths predictably leads to mental illness. There have been prominent examples, such as Nietzsche going crazy.
Your long-winded, twisted explanation why you don't want censorship of prayer, but then do support it, illustrates the contradiction. I teach a large class and we begin with a prayer, which all or nearly all want. Do you want to censor it or not? You're living with a contradiction by simultaneously saying "yes" and "no".--Aschlafly 19:59, 19 November 2008 (EST)
To untwist, teachers in public schools are leaders. Leaders influence and maybe some parents don't want that being pushed on their children. So many conservatives complain about liberal bias in schools, and the same principle applies here. Something unwanted being pushed on someone who does not want it.
You mentioned "nearly all". What do you do with the student that doesn't want it? Force them to grin and bear it? Ask them to leave and alienate them? If you just let the students some time for free-time (since legally it cant be referred to as "prayer-time") to do as they wish. To make it better form a group specifically for prayer where only those who want it show up.
Teachers try hard to be neutral, they really do. My government teacher, who was a fairly hard-line democrat, went to lengths to try and present a neutral base or at best an equal platform. Once in awhile he would let something slip, but then my chemistry teacher (a hard-line Republican) would slip sometimes too. As long as the blackboard doesn't become a soapbox there is no problem.
And you know what I don't think I used the word 'yes'. And to be slightly snarky its not possible to say "yes" and "no" at the same time in a typed format. And, no, I wasn't saying it out loud as I was typing--Snotbowst 10:45, 21 November 2008 (EST)

People generally refer to the society described in Orwell's 1984 as crazy, with its consciously self-contradictory mottos such as War is Peace and Freedom is Slavery. --Ed Poor Talk 20:02, 19 November 2008 (EST)