User talk:SamHB

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User talk:SamHB/Archive 1 User_talk:SamHB/archive_2

Red telephone for Cons

Cons: Thank you for dealing with the matter of Special:Contributions/Cal_Um. I know that you recognize that you are not an expert in relativity and know better than to get into the technical details of these discussions, and I appreciate that. (I wish more people recognized their limitations in this area; you can look up my recent controversies.) But this was a clear case of you recognizing that this guy was a troublemaker, and coming to my aid.

And now I see that there has been another case, with Special:Contributions/Bobbillyman69, taken care of by Andy. Vandals look at the Recent Changes log: "Oh, look! Relativity is on today's dinner menu!" We old-timers know all about that phenomenon.

SamHB (talk) 12:21, 7 March 2017 (EST)

Your welcome. I just happened to see it. I am guessing that for the foreseeable future that you and Andy are going to have to maintain the article as far as keeping it in accordance to compromise you two reached as far as the wording of the article. I don't think I will be of much help in the future. Again, I just happened to see that particular vandal.Conservative (talk) 12:32, 7 March 2017 (EST)

A liberal is wanted for an online dialogue

A liberal is wanted to have a single online dialogue. Please let them know at if you are interested. Conservative (talk) 21:15, 29 March 2017 (EDT)

Here is their contact page: Conservative (talk) 21:25, 29 March 2017 (EDT)
Well, I'm somewhat flattered, but significantly puzzled, by this. From looking at the web page, it looks like some kind of general liberal/conservative debate site. Currently focused on Obamacare, but with a wider outlook in general. My guess is that they are looking to increase their "contributor staff", particularly liberals, and they came to you. Or, more likely, you discovered them.
I'm not interested in contributing to such a site. And one thing puzzles me about it. There are thousands of liberal/conservative discussions/debates/controversies that take place every day. I find myself in such discussions several times per day. So these people want to create yet another one? With nothing noteworthy about it? They will be (already are) totally drowned out by the discussions already going on around the internet. I have about a dozen such web sites already bookmarked.
Now, about your choice of correspondent: I'm flattered, of course. But, when you needed to find a liberal friend, you came to Conservapedia? Well, perhaps you contacted 97 other liberal acquaintances, besides EJamesW, AlanE, and myself. Actual liberals are a rare and endangered species here.
About my politics. You put in some question, that you seem to have deleted, asking whether it's really true that I'm a liberal. Well, compared to most people, especially the admins, here at CP, I am way far left of the norm. But relative to the outside world, I am rather middle-of-the-road. (I can't speak for EJamesW or Alan, but I would guess that they are similar.) I actually hold a lot of conservative and "traditional" views, though that doesn't seem to mean much at CP. For example, I am appalled that we have a President who is a serial adulterer and is on his third marriage. And, all through the cold war, I was on the side of freedom, not the side of the murderous Communist thugs who were out to conquer the world. I believe in American exceptionalism, and believed that the United States was a beacon of liberty to the whole world. I was relieved when the Soviet Union collapsed. But now Russia, the descendant of the Soviet Union, is ruled by Vladimir Putin, a descendant of the Communists, one who invades other countries and fairly openly has his political opponents murdered. I am appalled that our current President doesn't have a problem with this.
SamHB (talk) 14:10, 1 April 2017 (EDT)
OK. Thanks for letting me know your decision promptly. Conservative (talk) 18:03, 1 April 2017 (EDT)
I hope that it is possible to be a social conservative, a fiscal conservative, a political conservative, but still believe in rule of law, quantum mechanics, special relativity, and recent advances in machine learning/artificial intelligence. I never thought of SamHB as being a "liberal." JDano (talk) 18:39, 1 April 2017 (EDT)

OK. SamHB is less on the left spectrum that I thought. Conservative (talk) 11:11, 2 April 2017 (EDT)

Doesn't help him though, does it, when some petty tyrant of the field decides to burn a conversation and give him a day off just because they can. AlanE (talk) 00:24, 3 April 2017 (EDT)
Sigh. Semper idem. --AugustO (talk) 02:25, 3 April 2017 (EDT)
Well, actually, he can't. No, to be precise, he can, but he may not. It's interesting that this happened shortly after I complained about abuse of block power here, and his reply seemed to acknowledge that it was not within his authority to block me—"That's not up to me at this point, but to one of the admins".
I suspect that Northwest is probably feeling a bit guity about having violated his position of trust so blatantly by blocking someone over a content dispute. He may not realize that I am well respected by the admins; I've been around a while and they know me well. I've had some run-ins with Ed Poor, and he blocked me a couple of times for my abrasiveness, but we have since made peace. If Northwest looks at my block log, he will see that, until this week, none of my blocks involved "liberal POV". Mostly they were by people who had a rather checkered history of honesty, or for totally bogus claims of sockpuppetry with people I had never heard of.
It's ironic that all this happened only 2-1/2 hours after I put the lyrics to America on my user page, specifically calling out the lines
Confirm thy soul in self-control,
Thy liberty in law!
That was aimed at Donald Trump, who seems to have little self-control, little respect for law, little knowledge of American history and traditions, and little knowledge of, and respect for, the teachings of Jesus. But, as we say in this country: if the shoe fits, wear it.
In a few days I may go over to his talk page and try to make peace. To try to convince him that we can make CP a better place if we all work together. And that it would be better not to toss around the words "liberal" and "leftist" with such wild abandon, because it just makes CP look less respectable and trustworthy to do so. And that one doesn't need to be a "leftist" to oppose murderous thug Vladimir Putin.
SamHB (talk) 22:38, 13 April 2017 (EDT)
To make it short and to the point: You were warned before about your behavior on CP and you didn't want to listen (specifically regarding numbers 9 and 10 - especially number 10, which you violated several times before - at How Conservapedia Differs from Wikipedia), so that's how you got the day off. To read how both you and AlanE are talking about this, you both come off sounding like the liberal media pundits who complain about Donald Trump's travel ban against specific Islamic countries and his proposed illegal immigration ban.
Your comment "And that it would be better not to toss around the words "liberal" and "leftist" with such wild abandon, because it just makes CP look less respectable and trustworthy to do so" also reflects exactly the type of things liberals say regarding CP (at the Liberal Style article, under Debate and rhetorical tactics):
"Like to use the phrase 'reflects poorly on the site' when talking about the liberal articles on Conservapedia."
And numbers 5 and 6 under Liberalism in the same article:
"Calling the use of the term liberal when used in a derogatory context 'stupid'"
"Will often deny being a liberal, or will claim to be a 'true conservative', while spouting liberal and Democrat talking points and criticizing basic conservative beliefs and principles."
And under Personal traits (again in the same article):
"Concealing one's liberal views rather than admitting them"
But at day's end, this is still Conservapedia, not Liberalpedia. Northwest (talk) 09:11, 14 April 2017 (EDT)
I could parody being a liberal, but when pressed to the wall all my inner contradictions and stupidity would come out, which might then just seal the deal. RobSCIA v Trump updated score:CIA 3, Trump 2 13:15, 13 April 2017 (EDT)
I puzzled by several aspects of this. By "parody being a liberal" do you mean make fun of liberals with over-the-top humor, the way Stephen Colbert used to parody conservatives on his "Colbert Report"? (He shows his politics in a different way in his present show.) Or do you mean "Convincingly pretend to be a liberal, in a way that would trick one into believing that I am sincere?" Any intelligent and well-informed person (which you are) can do that. What do you mean by "my inner contradictions and stupidity would come out"? That you would have a hard time convincingly imitating the stupidity of liberals (liberals and conservatives both have consistency problems) so that your ruse would be unsuccessful? Or that your personal "contradictions and stupidity" would make you unable to do the job? And what do you mean by "seal the deal"? Succeed at your imitation? Or let others succeed at unmasking your attempts? SamHB (talk) 22:51, 13 April 2017 (EDT)
You covered all bases quite well. Parodying a liberal is not hard. If you come to a juncture where you're at a loss, and you have to think "What would be the appropriate liberal response?", you just say something nonsensical and contradictory, and it would pass. That's what I mean by seal the deal - there would be no question I'm a liberal speaking from the heart. Poe's Law. RobSCIA v Trump updated score:CIA 3, Trump 2 19:07, 14 April 2017 (EDT)


(No, I'm not referring to E-cigarettes.) Cons, please do not vape other people's talk pages, OK? I know that what you recently vaped here was insignificant, but please don't do it. SamHB (talk) 18:14, 14 April 2017 (EDT)

9th anniversary

Congratulations on your 9th anniversary here! Despite disagreements, edit wars, and 19 blocks, you are still around! I know a number of people don't agree with you on various topics, and even I disagree on some things you believe (most notably, macroevolution) but I appreciate that you have "stuck it out" and are still trying to make CP better. I also appreciate your insights on matters which have been influenced by things long before I was here. You were also the only one when I first joined who seemed to be making an effort to help me learn the ropes and how things work here (an effort I am trying to pass on to others now). Thanks for your efforts! --David B (TALK) 11:49, 28 April 2017 (EDT)

Re: Claims of familiarity with CP guidelines

Since you claim to be familiar with, and "well versed in", Conservapedia's guidelines (per your edit on 1990'sguy's talk page), here's a refresher from the Member Accounts section:

  • Conservapedia is a politically conservative, Christian encyclopedia project. We welcome opposing views, but are not interested in users who come here only to change articles to their ideology (as you've insisted on doing with selected articles here as of late to change them to fit liberal POV, despite your claims otherwise - ed.), or disrupt by constantly arguing on the article talk pages that we are "wrong" (likewise - ed.). Trolling comments, incivility and personal attacks can be removed from discussion pages.
  • We are not a debate forum, but a project. If you contribute, where you can, by adding substantive content, abiding by our Guidelines, we welcome you. If not, remember it is a big Internet, and you should go where you can support the goals of that project.

Northwest (talk) 18:37, 28 April 2017 (EDT)

Go write up a Popeye episode, son. JohnZ (talk) 18:43, 28 April 2017 (EDT)
This applies to you too, JohnZ, just so you know. Northwest (talk) 19:13, 28 April 2017 (EDT)

re: Liberal article

I made some revisions to the liberal article to make it more accurate. And made some talk page edits indicating my reasons for the changes. For example, liberalism is not communism or Nazism. Attila the Hun was not a liberal, etc.

If you want to review the article periodically to make sure my changes stick, it would be appreciated.

I will pay you the courtesy of not having all or most liberals equated with Attila the Hun, Adolf Hitler, Mao or Stalin. I would ask you, however, to have the decency to not publicize private emails.

By the way, I have been to Framingham, MA and got along with all the people I met. The people I met in Framingham did not give me Nazi salutes. And I did not see any Nazi flags on front lawns. Nor did I see any statues of Lenin while on Massachusetts thruways or while in Framingham. Conservative (talk) 01:45, 9 May 2017 (EDT)

No Nazi flags? No Lenin statues? Not one? I guess Massachusetts is going soft. It must be all the political correctness or something.  :-) I haven't seen any of that stuff in my trips to upstate New York either. Or in my trips to Iowa, Arizona, Arkansas, Kentucky, Michigan, Virginia, Alabama, Tennessee, or Missouri. What's the world coming to?
Seriously, I have noticed your recent attempts to inject some reasonableness into certain articles, and I appreciate that. (I'm serious this time!) In fact, I have recently noticed some rather decent articles here. But plenty of awful ones, like "liberal" and its ilk. I'm trying to improve the good ones, while ignoring the awful ones. But you need to know that my ability to "make changes stick" is very limited, though I'll try. See my block log, the history of the Pussy Riot article, and the last half of the "A liberal is wanted for an online dialogue" section above (as well as a paragraph below), to see what I'm talking about. So someone might undo anything I do (and block me in violation of policy). But I'll try.
I don't consider "not having all or most liberals equated with Attila the Hun, Adolf Hitler, Mao or Stalin" to be a courtesy to me personally. It's a courtesy to Conservapedia. But I appreciate it in any case.
About the email: Perhaps I should have redacted the email address, but I considered that the name was so nondescript that it must have been a garbage gmail account that you created. If you have gotten spam on that account, I apologize. However, I think the general content of emails can't be considered private. (Just ask Hillary Clinton!) And most of the message was just hawking your own pages right here at CP, along with one link to a vimeo clip to an old Star Trek thing.
Peace, my non-Nazi non-Communist friend, SamHB (talk) 13:45, 9 May 2017 (EDT)
Follow-up: I have redacted the email more thoroughly; I assume from Cons's vaping that that is what he wanted me to to. He can't possibly have wanted me to conceal the fact that he sent it, since he openly announced it in advance on this page.
But if you do anything that goes against Conservapedia policy (as you've done repeatedly over time, and even recently), you will stand a chance of being blocked again (and despite what you otherwise think, blocking someone for violating CP policy is not "illegal"), so don't go thinking you can game the system just so you can get your way and get liberal POV imposed on this site. All you're doing every time you bring this up is that you're showing you prefer to ignore the rules of this site (and your history here, once again, proves that). Northwest (talk) 23:43, 9 May 2017 (EDT)
SamHB, I look at your restoration and its skepticism that more than one person has edited using the User: Conservative account.
The edit log shows that the User: Conservative account created the Atheism and the persecution of homosexuals article. The edit log shows that the User: Conservative account created the Gay bowel syndrome and Homosexuality and Parasites articles. No intelligent person believes that these articles are the work of one person. The footnoting style is radically different for the Atheism and the persecution of homosexuals article and frankly the article lacked machismo as soon as it used the alphabet soup of LGBTQ. Frankly, I don't even know what all those letters stand for. Why is the Q even used? It seems redundant.
You still not reconciled this blaring incongruently which was even noticed by a non-fan of the User: Conservative account. There must be some reason why you are not coming up with a reasonable explanation of the incongruity? What is it?
By the way, the explanation is so simple. More than one person has edited using the User: Conservative account.Conservative (talk) 13:45, 30 May 2017 (EDT)

re: "I'm going to organize this in broad categories. That's the right thing to do for articles about scientists"

Bill Nye is an engineer. He is not a scientist. Stop engaging in credential inflation! I realize that evolutionism is exceedingly weak. But try to not engage in desperation tactics and make efforts to control yourself. :)Conservative (talk) 11:46, 1 June 2017 (EDT)

Well, it's the right thing for articles about science popularizers too.
Sorry, I should have said "science popularizers". The fact that he's an engineer is irrelevant.
I think the suggestion that I need to make efforts to control myself is a little harsh for such an infraction as calling him a scientist instead of a science popularizer. It doesn't strike me as anywhere near as great a failure of self-control as spending years pretending to be multiple people, or spending years making tens of thousands (hundreds of thousands? millions?) of edits, deletions, renamings, cross-links, and ineffably pointless changes to image sizes, mostly for an utterly obsessive corpus of foolishness.
But we're still friends. I enjoy sparring with you. And I've got more stuff to do in reply to your previous edit on this page. But first, I need to change an image size.
SamHB (talk) 18:18, 1 June 2017 (EDT)

talk page second archive

You user talk page is insanely long. I think you are overdue for User talk:SamHB/archive 2. Conservative (talk) 09:03, 2 June 2017 (EDT)

You're right. Done. Thank you. SamHB (talk) 18:12, 3 June 2017 (EDT)

Nice job

I read your user page archives - really entertaining, and they made me realized how wretched I was to write articles for Cons, even if they did get on the Main Page. Please, don't stop believing in relativity. Hold onto that feeling.--Nathan (talk) 16:34, 4 June 2017 (EDT)

re: well-intentioned and level-headed people

You wrote: "You need to know that user "Conservative" is not in any way typical of the people we have here. There are a lot of well-intentioned and level-headed people here, and you could have been a member of that community."

First of all, User: Conservative is not merely one editor. So your petty personal attacks are lamer than you think. It is readily apparent that User: Conservative is more than editor. For example, the glaring topical/footnoting/writing style differences in the Atheism and the persecution of homosexuals article and some of the other homosexuality articles by the User: Conservative account. You have never explained these glaring differences.
Secondly, you have yet to find a single factual error in any of the articles written by the User:Conservative account. You merely dislike some of the articles because they conflict with some of your errant/miscreant, liberal notions. Conservative (talk) 22:29, 5 June 2017 (EDT)
Actually, I've been meaning to rip you to shreds, yet again, over that weird fantasy of yours. But there's usually something more urgent to do. Especially now, with the "abcqwe" issue. Trying to keep him on board is much more important than yet another go-around with you. SamHB (talk) 23:30, 5 June 2017 (EDT)
Your name is <name redacted>, everybody who has ever posted on this site knows your name is <name redacted>, people who died 100 years ago know your name is <name redacted>. People who will not be born until the 22nd century knows your name is <name redacted>. Insult your own intelligence(not hard to do I know) but the rest of us are not falling for it.
Actually, that's not my name, assuming that you were referring to me (SamHB) when you wrote "you" above. Maybe you are confusing me with someone else.
In any case, it is considered poor form to "out" or "dox" someone on a wiki. And the identity and personal info about the person you are perhaps referring to are well known. I suspect that you are about to be blocked, if you haven't already been blocked as I write this. And what you wrote above will likely be vaped, though I will restore it (with the name redacted) if that happens. SamHB (talk) 23:30, 5 June 2017 (EDT)
SanHV, why is the footnoting for Atheism and the persecution of homosexuals different from many other User: Conservative articles?
I found out this month what the Q is in the acronym LGBTQ stands for. Why does the article Atheism and the persecution of homosexuals use the term LGBTQ, but the other homosexuality articles created by the User: Conservtive account not use that term?
Probably because you are a klutz with your keyboard, as indicated by your spelling of "Conservtive". It stands for "queer", by the way.SamHB (talk) 00:59, 9 June 2017 (EDT)
Is the term LGBTQ one that I would likely use? For example, how often does the word "gay" appear in Conservapedia's homosexuality articles?
I wouldn't know. I'd have to read them. SamHB (talk) 00:59, 9 June 2017 (EDT)
Is the term "persecution of homosexuals" one that I would likely use? Why was there an internal battle within the User: Conservative account about the title of the article Atheism and the persecution of homosexuals? For example, why was the title of that article changed/moved?
Because you like to do that kind of thing, as anyone who looks at your contributions knows. SamHB (talk) 00:59, 9 June 2017 (EDT)
Liberals dominate the field of psychology. Do liberals excel in the field of psychology in order to be able to discern that more than one editor has used the User:Conservative account?
I doubt it. I doubt that, by and large, they give a hoot about the size of your "collective". SamHB (talk) 00:59, 9 June 2017 (EDT)
If liberals do excel in the discipline of psychology, why do so many psychology experiments and journal articles have an inability to be replicated? See: Over half of psychology studies fail reproducibility test, Nature, August 27, 2015
RobS, 1990sguy and Karajou have been told privately that more than one editor has used the User: Conservative account. There was an attempt to make one of these editors an editor of the User: Conservative account, but Aschlafly would not permit it.
Can you send me the email in which Andy said that? And, by "one of these editors" do you mean one of RobS, 1990sguy and Karajou? All you would have to do is privately send them your CP password. Andy would not know. In fact, if you mail me your password, at, I could become a member of your collective! The "sockpuppet" rule prohibits one person from having multiple CP accounts, but there's no rule about giving out your password. SamHB (talk) 00:59, 9 June 2017 (EDT)
Lastly, you couldn't rip a wet paper bad to shreds, let alone rip of member of the User: Conservative account to shreds. Conservative (talk) 02:04, 6 June 2017 (EDT)

By the way, a 2006 international survey reported that 30% of the Swiss reject evolution which is one of the highest national percentages in Europe.[1] Switzerland has one of the very highest standards of living in Europe.

Denmark has one of the highest rates of belief in evolution in Europe (See: Jon D. Miller; Eugenie C. Scott; Shinji Okamoto (11 August 2006). "Public Acceptance of Evolution". Science. 313 (5788): 765–766.).

The Swiss are known for yodeling.

I'm extremely fascinated, delighted, and enchanted to hear that. SamHB (talk) 00:59, 9 June 2017 (EDT)

The Danes are known for bestiality! A 2015 Jerusalem Post article indicates "Copenhagen has for long been the bestiality capital of Europe and has attracted many tourists mainly visiting to have sex with animals. Legislation against this practice was only enacted this year."[2] Conservative (talk) 02:28, 6 June 2017 (EDT)

There are some worthwhile projects that I want to accomplish. I am not going to continue this latest battle between us. It doesn't make sense to respond to every slight someone directs your way. I am moving on. Conservative (talk) 08:33, 6 June 2017 (EDT)
I regret using the word miscreant above. It wasn't necessary.
No hard feelings. SamHB (talk) 18:40, 6 June 2017 (EDT)
I also agree with you that it would have been nice to retain the editor who recently departed. Conservative (talk) 15:57, 6 June 2017 (EDT)
What??? To whom were you referring??? The one who was "showboating" and annoying Karajou and VargasMilan2 [sic]? I assumed you thought it was abcqwe, and I could find no evidence that he communicated with Karajou or VargasMilan. Who was it? Seriously, I'm curious. I'd like to know whether it was someone that I also disliked. SamHB (talk) 18:40, 6 June 2017 (EDT)
I just discovered that someone blocked User:Abcqwe. He made a number of posts to talk pages that irritated people. It seems as if he was spoiling for a fight and/or trying to gain attention. Conservative (talk) 17:13, 6 June 2017 (EDT)
You just discovered that now?????? Really? SamHB (talk) 18:40, 6 June 2017 (EDT)
For the record, he blocked himself indefinitely, but I changed the block to five years because indefinite blocks are problematic. --1990'sguy (talk) 17:23, 6 June 2017 (EDT)
OK. He was a provocateur at the end. No great loss. Conservative (talk) 17:57, 6 June 2017 (EDT)
But, was it necessary to delete his user and talk pages? Or is this just CP policy? --1990'sguy (talk) 18:24, 6 June 2017 (EDT)
No, it is not policy. Please restore them. SamHB (talk) 18:40, 6 June 2017 (EDT)

In terms of webmaster best practices, deleting low value pages is a beneficial thing to do. In 2017, Conservapedia is going to delete abandoned user pages and their respective talk pages. Andy has given the green light about this matter and he is not changing his mind about it. Conservative (talk) 20:00, 6 June 2017 (EDT)

It is a "best practice" only because you have the technical permission, as an administrator, to do whatever you please. You can delete whatever you want, vape whatever you want, and block whomever you want, at any time. You even burned down this page on 10 January, 2015. I was never under the illusion that you would honor my request to restore his pages. And I can't help noticing that, shortly after you explained this "best practice", you deleted a few pages just to make the point. SamHB (talk) 00:59, 9 June 2017 (EDT)
Re: annoying Karajou and VargasMilan2 - see: He sometimes signed his posts "Nate". As far as VargaMilan2, see conversation I moved to the community portal. Conservative (talk) 20:23, 6 June 2017 (EDT)
I think User:Abcqwe began to be more of a provocateur after I posted this article American liberalism and 21st century political losses. Given that he is an American liberal, it probably triggered his backlash/bitterness/resentment.Conservative (talk) 20:33, 6 June 2017 (EDT)
I don't think Abcqwe annoyed Karajou or VargasMilan while he actually edited. They wrote what they did in response to the news that he was leaving. On top of that, it seems that Abcqwe uses a lot of sarcasm and sarcastic humor, and I think his "confession" displayed some of it. He also seems to have overexaggerated. Personally, I think he should have been more frank in his post, and I don't think his sense of humor helped at all. Many people probably got the impression that he was a parodist/liberal, while I think it is more believable that he was a more moderate person who originally joined in good faith. --1990'sguy (talk) 22:06, 6 June 2017 (EDT)
I seem to be the invisible man regarding Abcque. I was the one who tried to keep a lid on his vandalism. Did I need help? Yes. Did I ask for it?Yes. Did I get any from the lads wallowing in their anti liberal groupthinkfest, not giving a stuff for truth? No I did not. Do I still think that CP should be vehicle for information for homesckoolers? Yes. Is it ? No. Do I give a damn? Strangely, yes I do.
Sorry Sam. I have tried other forums to change an article title to allow me to correct the article. I want Joseph Belloc changed to Hilaire Belloc. Its simple really but the lads are too busy doing what they like doing. AlanE (talk) 03:08, 9 June 2017 (EDT)

Border fence for the unfree state of Massachusetts

Border fence for the unfree state of Massachusetts designed to keep people from leaving the state. See also: Free States Movement

Actually, I haven't seen any fences like that, except at MCI[1] Concord, where I go to visit my cousin (you know, the one who is a member of your collective; they let people edit Conservapedia from the slammer), who is serving a 5-year stretch for not being a "svelte Bible believing young earth creationist like Chuck Norris".

Joking about TAR

Question: Will TAR return? Conservative (talk) 13:24, 8 June 2017 (EDT)

I will consider it only if he agrees to completely stop link-spamming and adding categories. If not, I or someone else will be forced to block him. I agree that he made some good changes, but the bad far outweighed the good. --1990'sguy (talk) 15:00, 8 June 2017 (EDT)
I don't believe TAR is coming back. I was merely joking. Conservative (talk)

That joke is not the least bit funny. I doubt that 1990'sguy appreciated the humor. As I'm sure you recall, during the period when TAR was being removed from the site (which is chronicled at User_talk:DavidB4#Cleaning_up_after_the_blocked_users and User_talk:Aschlafly/Archive60#Re:_Cleanup_work_post_TheAmericanRedoubt, you repeatedly implied that you were somehow in private communication with him, and that, because of this, you could reassure everyone that he had no intention of coming back. But since you have a reputation for pretending to be in secret communication with people, just as you pretend to be multiple people, no one believed you. So Andy had to revoke his rights.

I don't believe he's coming back either, but not because of some private communication. It's because he would be shown the door instantly.

SamHB (talk) 00:33, 9 June 2017 (EDT)

At this point, I really am not concerned if you believe I have had various private conversations with people or if you believe more than one person has edited using the User: Conservative account.
It is probably best if we keep our communications cordial, but very limited in the future.Conservative (talk) 20:34, 10 June 2017 (EDT)
OK. The "ripping you to shreds" that I had planned will not occur. SamHB (talk) 12:31, 11 June 2017 (EDT)
A few points:
1. You called my liar and I have never lied at this wiki. More than one person has edited using the User: Conservative account. You may not accept this fact as being true, but that is your problem and not mine. Aschafly is certainly aware that the User: Conservative account has had more than one editor use it and Karajou is aware as well. I did a checker user on the User: Conservative account and at least one other editor has used the account in the last 3 months.
2. I should have been more cordial in my last communication with you. After all is said and done, I have decided to communicate far less on talk pages due to competing priorities. So any absence of communication with you isn't personal. Conservative (talk) 17:36, 11 June 2017 (EDT)

From warrior to diplomat

"Warrior to Diplomat

In his previous roles, Harald had focused primarily on marshaling the troops to defeat the competition. Now he found himself devoting a surprising amount of time to influencing a host of external constituencies, including regulators, the media, investors, and NGOs. His support staff was bombarded with requests for his time: Could he participate in industry or government forums sponsored by the government affairs department? Would he be willing to sit for an interview with an editor from a leading business publication? Could he meet with a key group of institutional investors? Some of these groups he was familiar with; others not at all. But what was entirely new to him was his responsibility not just to interact with various stakeholders but also to proactively address their concerns in ways that meshed with the firm’s interests. Little of Harald’s previous experience prepared him for the challenges of being a corporate diplomat.

What do effective corporate diplomats do? They use the tools of diplomacy—negotiation, persuasion, conflict management, and alliance building—to shape the external business environment to support their strategic objectives. In the process they often find themselves collaborating with people with whom they compete aggressively in the market every day.

To do this well, enterprise leaders need to embrace a new mind-set—to look for ways that interests can or do align, understand how decisions are made in different kinds of organizations, and develop effective strategies for influencing others."[3]

Harald made the transition. The Apostle Paul made the transition. I wonder if someone else can? :) Conservative (talk) 23:50, 11 June 2017 (EDT)

I think you are making some good points in what you say, and it's certainly true that my ways of interacting with people on the internet (and in real life too) could use some improvement. But I'm having a hard time following your examples. I don't know who "Harald" is/was. Some ancient Nordic king? I know who the Apostle Paul was, but I don't see his situation as being relevant to business, the media, investors, or NGO's. And my situation isn't relevant to those things either. At least you didn't bring in Sun-Tzu. SamHB (talk) 17:20, 19 June 2017 (EDT)
SamHB, I was merely saying that I have decided to be more diplomatic.
Oh! I was reading way too much into what you were saying. (I often do that.) So you were saying that you want to "make the transition" and do a better job of persuasion and conflict management. OK, I will try to do the same.
As an example, I will try to calm GinnyS down. I think she may be cruisin' for a bruisin'. I will try to explain that you are an acquired taste, and that personal attacks are never allowed. And I'll try to make that same point to JohnZ, for when he comes back. He is in a situation that is similar in some ways but different in other ways. I think that, due to my longevity, I have gotten a certain amount of respect among the young-uns, and I can use that respect to get them to behave better.
SamHB (talk) 23:00, 30 June 2017 (EDT)
As an aside, as far as Trump, I have never seen a president attacked as much as Trump and with such venom. On the other hand, I have never seen a president counterpunch as much too (and sometimes in a very personal way). It is nothing new though. Burr/Hamilton had many exchanges of words before their duel. And Lincoln was viciously attacked by his critics if memory serves. Conservative (talk) 23:22, 29 June 2017 (EDT)
Trump deserves every bit of what he gets. He knows next to nothing about American government, institutions, history, or traditions, seems to know very little about Christianity (though I realize I'm suppose to remove the plank from my own eye before making accusations like that), and seems to know very little about the Christian notions of generosity, forgiveness, humility, and contrition. SamHB (talk) 23:00, 30 June 2017 (EDT)

If you know of any good faith editors who have edited in the last 5 years and...

If you know of any good faith editors who have edited in the last 5 years and they are not on my list at User talk:Wikignome72, please let me know.

I relied on: the recent changes list, my memory, user talk page edits for some of the active or formerly active editors. Conservative (talk) 15:11, 19 June 2017 (EDT)

Actually, yes, I could contribute a lot of names of people to keep. As you may know, I do a lot of "homework" or "research" here at CP, and I have a pretty good idea of who's who. Perhaps second only to you. But I think it's an unnecessary exercise to delete the old pages. And I sure hope your current deletion binge (well, deletion suggestion binge) isn't a reaction to my complaining, above, that you should not have deleted abcqwe's page.
By the way, I have been trying to make an addition to Wikignome72's page, saying essentially the same thing, for over 3 hours, getting edit conflicts each time. I'll wait until you come up for air.
If you actually want me to come up with a list of people that should be protected, I could do that. I would probably do it by going through the edit histories of all the articles that I have worked on and think are good, and noting everyone who contributed (who isn't a jerk).
SamHB (talk) 17:20, 19 June 2017 (EDT)

Some people our friend ought to keep

First preliminary, your quizzes are cute.

Second preliminary, I really think he ought to be welcomed, even if he is just you. I don't know why you keep deleting my attempts to welcome him. I like to keep up the pretense that he's a real person.

Third preliminary, I had no idea there was so much garbage in the user base. But I hope you don't think you are saving disk space; you aren't. Nothing ever really goes away in a computer database. Except "vaping", which you aren't doing.

I see the purge is in full swing. I've gone over the list, and there are a few people I recognize as having been, one way or another, significant people in CP's history. I'd like you (him, her) to consider restoring them. Some people left in anger (and at least one had some serious criticism of you personally.) But they are nevertheless part of our history. People won't know how we got here if they can't see our history. I've argued in the recent past that we should keep the "Parthian shot" of someone who has been blocked, so that, if they try to come back, we will know why they were kicked out and why they should not be allowed back in. But it's more than that. We need to remember the conflicts that have gone on in the past. Well, some of them; many people were just losers and deserve to be forgotten. Heck, isn't there a page called something like "Examples of censorship by the 'tolerant'"? I haven't looked at it lately, but we may be damaging it. We need to keep at least some of those examples around, don't we?

So here are a few people I've found so far. Is it possible to bring them back? I think it is, unless they have been "vaped", which I don't think they have been.

  • DanH Wasn't he a sysop and well-respected person? Wasn't he the chess player? I may misremember the details [I sure do!], but he was an important part of our history. I seem to have confused him with ...
  • DeanS Wasn't he a sysop and well-respected person? Wasn't he the chess player? And the Mormon who was concerned about whether there would be intolerance of Mormon? (Answer: none at all.) Wasn't he the person whose wife died? Wasn't he the geologist whose user name was originally "crocoite" (an interesting mineral), and then changed it in order to comply with the username policy? I may misremember the details, but he was an important part of our history.
  • MatthewQ I see there's been some back-and-forth on this. He was a somewhat interesting science contributor.
  • StaceyT Yeah, she was unhappy. But we need to see what sorts of things made people unhappy.
  • Ymmotrojam He was a big player at one time.
  • Coolguy Yes, he was recent, and p*ss*d some people off and was shown the door. But we need to see that history.
  • And, of course, you won't delete Philip J Rayment, right?

There are others that haven't been deleted (yet).

Did you know that DeborahB created her account when Conservapedia was only 6 days old? She was a true "founding mother".

SamHB (talk) 11:20, 20 June 2017 (EDT)

I will restore DanH.
MathewQ mere had "useful links" on his user page so there is no need to restore that, but I kept his user talk page.
StacyT was contentious and probably a sock of a man if I recall. Definitely a loser. Not restoring.
Ymmotrojam deleted his own user page and talk page. I am respecting his wishes and keeping those pages deleted.
Coolguy was a person who was not willing to engage in dialogue. Like many on the left, he was ignorant of history and/or wanted to engage in revisionism. He just wanted to pontificate. There are plenty of reasons to believe that various founding fathers were not Christians. But when you look at the state constitutions and various other important historical considerations, it is very apparent that Coolguy was pushing a very ignorant/false narrative of American history. I not going to bother to restore his user page or talk page. Conservative (talk) 13:31, 20 June 2017 (EDT)

Re: restoration of DanH and PJR. Looking into other restoration

The user pages of User:DanH and User:Philip J. Rayment (PJR) were so boring, it gave me an excuse to delete them. But I really shouldn't have deleted them. And I just discovered that TK made those pages boring with his revisions to those pages.

So I restored those pages to their former glory. I did add a link to my atheism article from PJR's talk page by adding a bracket around his use of the word "atheists" on his user page. I am still in communication with PJR and his wife, and I know that PJR would not mind my small change.

I am looking into the DeanS restoration. I did not delete it. Conservative (talk) 14:22, 20 June 2017 (EDT)

User:DeanS user page history has been restored along with TK's replacing of the blanking by DeanS with a retired template. The retired template looks better. I don't think DeanS would have minded.
DeanS deleted his user talk page. I am going to keep it deleted.
I think DeanS left due to ill health, but it could have been due to disputes with evangelical Christians on the website (He was a Mormon) or some other reason. I have no idea. Conservative (talk) 14:32, 20 June 2017 (EDT)
As far as DeanS, I did a little detective work and restored his talk page to the version I think he would have wanted. Conservative (talk) 14:48, 20 June 2017 (EDT)
Thanks for attending to these details. As far as leaving the last version of something up, when it just says "retired", there's nothing wrong with that, as long as data squirrels like myself can look through the history and see what led to the retirement. That's what we should have—a historical record. (Excuse me, an historical record.) SamHB (talk) 15:34, 20 June 2017 (EDT)
I think PJR left due to a battle over gun owner rights/public safety controversies. But perhaps that was merely the final straw. Conservative (talk) 15:41, 20 June 2017 (EDT)

I restored the user page of User:JacobB as well. Conservative (talk) 15:58, 20 June 2017 (EDT)

I removed the striked out text from PJR's user page. It looked sloppy and I didn't see any real purpose in it. Next time I talk to PJR, I will see if he is fine with the edit. Conservative (talk) 17:32, 20 June 2017 (EDT)

Taking some of your advice

Greetings, Cons!

The long message you left for me yesterday was extremely interesting. I had to go back a long way (June 29, 2015) to find what you were referring to and refresh my memory of the issue. It's too bad that yesterday's message was lost in a wiki server malfunction.[2] The "advice" that you seem to have been referring to was that you should direct your persuasive energies into ways that are more likely to have an actual effect on people, such as human interaction, rather than writing Conservapedia articles. And you mentioned "opportunity cost", that is, the cost of one approach versus another in terms of actual payoff.

You ended with your usual argument against evolution, giving two web references. The first was to a page that had a religious web site in its name. As you know, I totally ignore any arguments about scientific topics appearing in religious web sites or religious publications. If one can't make an argument about a scientific topic (as opposed to, say, a topic of morality or ethics), without saying "because the Bible says so", I'm not interested.

The second web site was this. So I had to look. Though it was clear right from the start (though not from the URL itself) that it was a religious web site—it was from the PNN News and Ministry Network, and it also had front-page references to and It had five "questions for the evolution believer". I had to sit through a guy with a very irritating voice listing the questions. (Aren't there 15 questions elsewhere? This guy isn't even trying!)

The first was about abiogenesis. We all know that the question of abiogenesis, while interesting and having no known solution at present (or perhaps ever), lies outside of the issues of evolution/Biblical creation and young-Earth/old-Earth cosmology. So I had to sit through 55 seconds (opportunity cost!) of that nonsense.
The second one was about "language", making the point that the DNA code satisfies all the accepted criteria for being a language, yet is unique among languages in that it was not developed by humans. (Not true, by the way.) And so somehow this meant that evolution must not have happened. Huh?
It went downhill rapidly from there. The third was about sexual reproduction, and how "wasted energy" involved in this meant that evolution could not be correct. Or something. I stopped listening.

All things considered, sort of fun. But now, if you'll excuse me, I need to take your advice about taking my advice, and consider the opportunity cost of replying to you on my talk page. So long for now. SamHB (talk) 21:19, 7 July 2017 (EDT)

Essentially, I said that I am going to use my time better so I have a greater positive impact in life. Recently, I am more on track except for a comment on main page talk today.
In July of 2017, I will be working on a Conservapedia related project. But you will see no edits being performed by the User: Conservative account in relation to this project.
“Be extremely subtle, even to the point of formlessness. Be extremely mysterious, even to the point of soundlessness. Thereby you can be the director of the opponent's fate.” - Sun Tzu
Well, that's some advice I am not going to take. But if you think it works for you (I disagree) go right ahead. SamHB (talk) 10:58, 8 July 2017 (EDT)
此(译注:用间)兵之要,三军之所恃而动也 Conservative (talk) 22:12, 7 July 2017 (EDT)
I sent you a sour email recently about you publishing one of my emails recently. Looking back, I shouldn't have sent it.
No hard feelings. Enjoy your summer. Conservative (talk) 01:45, 10 July 2017 (EDT)

OK, I got the email. I want to apologize for any behavior that may have led you to believe I can't be trusted with private information. Let me assure you that I am a trustworthy person when I know what information is being kept confidential.

The email that you are referring to is presumably the message listed above somewhere (or maybe it's been archived by now), in which I divulged both the sender and the content. Of course I divulged the fact that you sent the message--you had already said publicly that you were going to send it. I assumed that the email name of the sender was not secret because it looked like a "throwaway" name of the sort that people often create. In fact, you have sent other emails to people with various names. I assumed that you don't consider them secret. If I harmed you by revealing the name, I apologize.

After you complained, I redacted everything in the email listed above except the content. I believed that the content was typical of the things you write all over the place at Conservapedia. It was largely references to your various articles, as is your writing style. If the particular content of that message was something you wanted protected, I apologize.

If you wish to vape the redacted message above on this page, go ahead; I won't complain or restore it. (As you know, I usually oppose vaping, especially on users' talk pages, and sometimes restore the vaped material.)

So I need to know just how much secrecy you desire:

  • Do you want me not to reveal even the fact of having received a message? Even if you said, here on this talk page, that you are going to send it or have sent it?
  • Do you want me not to reveal the user ID of the sender?
  • Do you want me not to reveal the content?
  • Do you want me not even to say that I have replied, or otherwise give any general information about what was discussed?

At the risk of violating the last point, I suspect that the project you referred to (which you also mentioned above on this page) is something I wouldn't be interested in. I know that, in the past, your projects have been things like an anti-evolution pamphlet. Now if you want to collaborate on an anti-creationist pamphlet (you know, things like "15 questions that creationists can't answer") by all means, sign me up.

SamHB (talk) 14:07, 13 July 2017 (EDT)

At Conservapedia, I am not going to discuss any of the off wiki activities of the editors who use the User: Conservative account. This is the simplest solution to potential problems caused by the intolerant left.
The simplest solution to the email issue is for me to no longer send you any emails. But perhaps I will change my mind on this matter. I can certainly pray about this matter. If we were to communicate privately it would probably be Skype communication due to constraints upon my time. I am going to strongly endeavor to be more efficient with my time and communicating via email can be more time intensive. But you have indicated that you are not interested in Skype communications so in all likelihood, I doubt there will be future private communications between us.
Again, no hard feelings. I will certainly endeavor to keep my communications with you at Conservapedia cordial. And again, enjoy your summer. Conservative (talk) 15:43, 13 July 2017 (EDT)
I just sent you an email. Conservative (talk) 07:43, 15 July 2017 (EDT)
I sent you an additional email. Conservative (talk) 08:20, 15 July 2017 (EDT)
I will keep my promise of confidentiality. So let me just say that there has been some traffic on the sam4557 email account of late. SamHB (talk) 09:29, 15 July 2017 (EDT)
I just sent you another email. Conservative (talk) 11:10, 15 July 2017 (EDT)
I sent you a small request via email. Conservative (talk) 11:34, 15 July 2017 (EDT)

re: polishing up my grammar and writing skills

I sent you a private email. Conservative (talk) 00:32, 31 July 2017 (EDT)

For Cons

I normally find "listicles" ("The 15 worst beaches", etc.) on the internet to be extremely stupid. But this one was actually entertaining. I especially liked item number 8. SamHB (talk) 01:33, 2 August 2017 (EDT)

I am cutting back on entertainment. I made a couple of promises to people that require stricter time management.
In terms of time management, I shouldn't have done any Conservapedia editing today. But I decided to get back on track.
"Top performers make mistakes, commit errors, and get off track just like everyone else. The difference is that they get back on track as quickly as possible." - How to Build a New Habit: This is Your Strategy Guide by James Clear[4]
There are so many internet cat videos, but so little time. :)Conservative (talk)

I did a little bit of additional editing to reflect some significant changes relative to some of the articles I have created in the past. But I really shouldn't have done that.

But I am getting back on track in terms of some important promises.

However, I will not be editing Conservapedia for 66 days (see this interesting study: How are habits formed: Modelling habit formation in the real world). You can hold me to this. On October 7, 2017, I will let you know how things went in terms of new habit creation and bad habit cessation.Conservative (talk) 10:34, 2 August 2017 (EDT)

Those 66 days just flew by. If you cannot model your habits on your own, perhaps you should try to get help from others? --AugustO (talk) 06:07, 10 August 2017 (EDT)
Are you forgetting that more than one editor uses the User:Conservative account and it's the specific editor who said he was taking time off that would be doing it? Northwest (talk) 06:30, 10 August 2017 (EDT)
AugustO, I am going to get back on track. I will not edit Conservapedia until Sunday, October 15, 2017. Conservative (talk) 07:00, 10 August 2017 (EDT)

AugustO, I am going to get back on track. I will not edit Conservapedia until Sunday, October 15, 2017

  • 13:37, 12 August 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+96)‎ . . 2018 Global Atheist Convention ‎
  • 13:37, 12 August 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+125)‎ . . 2018 Global Atheist Convention ‎
  • 13:19, 12 August 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+30)‎ . . Atheist fundraising vs. religious fundraising ‎ (→‎See also) (current)
  • 13:18, 12 August 2017 (diff | hist) . . (-12)‎ . . Fundraising ‎ (→‎Religious fundraising vs. atheist/irreligious fundraising) (current)
  • 13:17, 12 August 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+17)‎ . . Charity ‎ (→‎See also) (current)
  • 13:17, 12 August 2017 (diff | hist) . . (+30)‎ . . Fundraising ‎
  • 13:16, 12 August 2017 (diff | hist) . . (-1)‎ . . Fundraising ‎
  • 13:15, 12 August 2017 (diff | hist) . . (0)‎ . . m Fundraising ‎ (Conservative moved page Fund-raising to Fundraising) --IMcCleod (talk) 16:18, 12 August 2017 (EDT)
IMcCleod, do you also assume that only one editor uses the User:Conservative account (even though it has been made clear that it is used by multiple editors)? Northwest (talk) 23:16, 12 August 2017 (EDT)
IMcCloud, Christendom is playing a significant role in bringing the quarrelsome and socially challenged atheist movement to its knees and now atheists are shrinking in their global influence.
American atheist fundraising is now anemic. The atheist activist Lee Moore recently admitted concerning major atheist organizations in the United States: "Most of them are starved for cash. They're downsizing left and right."[5]
While I am pleased to see that the largely despondent atheist movement is imploding while Christendom is going one glorious victory after another (see: Atheist pessimism about the atheist movement and High morale of Christendom), I have decided to broaden my horizons (And SamHB has played a role in this matter).
As tempting as it is to add further information about the current state of affairs concerning the atheism vs. Christianity topic, I have decided that I must do better in keeping my commitment to be more focused in some of my current endeavors. Therefore, I am going to be completely resolute in this matter and not edit this wiki until October 18, 2017. Conservative (talk)


  1. Massachusetts Correctional Institution
  2. This seems to happen a lot with your contributions.