Talk:Main Page/Archive index/194

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Coronavirus and Vietnam

Here is my latest: "How did Vietnam dodge Covid-19?" I didn't realize that the name of Stephen Cameron, a recently recovered patient, is censored in Vietnam. He is a pilot for Vietnam Airlines, something we're also not allowed to say. PeterKa (talk) 22:37, 30 June 2020 (EDT)

This article can be considered the second part of the series: "Return of the virus." PeterKa (talk) 09:08, 2 August 2020 (EDT)

The fastest way to end the riots

Cut off H1-B visas to any company that funds BLM, Antifa, or any of the other pro-riot groups. "In 2019, five top tech companies — Facebook, Apple, Amazon, Microsoft, and Google — were collectively granted nearly 27,000 H1-B visas, over 30% of the total visas available to private companies." PeterKa (talk) 00:03, 20 July 2020 (EDT)

Trump doesn't have that tool in his chest anymore—at the beginning of the summer, he cancelled them for 2020 altogether. VargasMilan (talk) Monday, 00:13, 20 July 2020 (EDT)
In the Chicago Grant Park riot on Thursday you can see the Police were ill-prepared, not wearing helmets while pelted with rocks; that was immediately followed by the Portland reprisal on fed action by burning down the Police union headquarters. It's fairly obvious there is some nationwide strategic coordination. These fools don't realize their Twitter flashmob coordination is all monitored by NSA, as well as their funding and money-laundering activity by Treasury FinCEN. In the new GOP Congress, we'll need Congressional hearings to investigate this latest liberal communist coup attempt against the United States. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 08:42, 20 July 2020 (EDT)

Despite exaggerations, fears relieved: surge of FL, TX, AZ cases at last shown to be artifact of skillful flattening of curve toward end of epidemic

"The real story out of Florida is incredible: 150,000 #SARSCoV2 positive tests in the last two weeks, and effectively NO change in either total hospitalizations or ICU use statewide. Case mix? A huge advance in medicine? This is the story real reporters should chase."—Alex Berenson

IOW, just as the cases (some exaggerated) were filling the hospitals, previous cases' timelines coincided to be discharged all during the same short period. This offers no comfort to those still with severe infections toward the end of the Wuhan virus syndrome, but alleviates recent fears of the dangers of overloading hospital capacities as a result of previous prudent epidemial policy measures. VargasMilan (talk) Monday, 00:09, 20 July 2020 (EDT)

But expect a slow decline in new cases/fatalities. The curve is flat, remember? VargasMilan (talk) Monday, 00:21, 20 July 2020 (EDT)

Also, the Washington Post knows this is its last opportunity to take shots at virtuoso Trump by means of the Wuhan virus. Monday is going to be all hands on deck to play up the false positives as much as they can. VargasMilan (talk) Monday, 00:40, 20 July 2020 (EDT)

Time for a "New Hong Kong"

Now that I solved America's riot problem, I'm moving on to the Hong Kong issue. With China getting bossy, it's time to organize a "New Hong Kong." Perhaps an island can be purchased from the Philippines for this purpose. I got this idea from writing about Justinian for the Byzantine Empire article. His enemy King Khosrow of Persia created a city in Iraq for Greek prisoners and refugees. The city was called Wēh Antīōk Khosrow. We can translate this name as "Khosrow's Antioch -- way better than Justinian's." PeterKa (talk) 00:36, 20 July 2020 (EDT)

Hong Kong is lost - at least in the near term. The current type of economic sanctions imposed by countries against China are not working. The Chinese know that if they give freedom to Hong Kong that other Chinese will want freedom. So the Chinese are hanging tough. And it doesn't appear as if Western countries are willing to implement harsh economic sanctions against China as they do not feel it is in their financial interest.
Militarily, China controls the China Sea. Ships are more vulnerable now due to drones and hypersonic missiles. So the current state of affairs resembles WWII in the Pacific where the victor is the one with the greater manufactoring capacity. And right now, China can produce more ships than the USA.
Maybe Western Countries will get fed up with China at some point and be tougher towards China. If China keeps taking economic bites out of Europe by becoming an increasingly stronger economic competitor, the Europeans could get fed up and take a tougher stand against China.Conservative (talk) 07:27, 20 July 2020 (EDT)
Exclusive: Global banks scrutinize their Hong Kong clients for pro-democracy ties - sources. It looks like the leading banks in the world are taking the Chinese governments side.Conservative (talk) 07:37, 20 July 2020 (EDT)
Every summer in July the CCP politburo bigshots spend a few days at the Beidaihe beach resort where secret closed door future policy directions are discussed. Rumor is Xi is in trouble and faces some tuff questioning. If there is to be a change in Xi's domestic and foreign policy, historically it comes out of the Beidaihe vacation. This is what happened to Mao and Deng. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 08:31, 20 July 2020 (EDT)
"In April 2020, an internal report circulated by the China Institutes of Contemporary International Relations, a government-affiliated think tank associated with China’s top intelligence agency, contained a grave warning for China’s leadership. According to reporting by Reuters, it concluded that “global anti-China sentiment is at its highest since the 1989 Tiananmen Square crackdown.”[1]
"Last month, France summoned China’s ambassador to protest a publication on the website of China’s embassy that criticized Western handling of coronavirus."[2] When France starts becoming more assertive towards you, that is not a good sign.
The world is starting to get fed up with China due to: the coronavirus pandemic they caused; China's unfair trade policies; their brutal domestic policies towards ideological dissent; cybertheft; their pollution; and finally, their growing foreign politicy belligerence (debt trap financing; military belligerence; rude diplomacy, etc.).
Abraham Lincoln was right. "You may fool people for a time; you can fool a part of the people all the time; but you can’t fool all the people all the time.”[3]Conservative (talk) 09:22, 20 July 2020 (EDT)
Hence the importance of our two new articles: China Cold War and CCP propaganda war. Heads up: the South China Morning Post (scmp) formerly was an one of the foremost authoritative source on Mainland China. No more. It's been infiltrated and taken over by the CCP. We should try to keep these articles updated to feed the Google algorithm, without citing scmp. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 10:21, 20 July 2020 (EDT)

In the short to midterm, I don't see how the USA could lose an economic/trade war with China if it was determined to win. China sells a lot more to the USA than the USA sells to China.

But I don't see the USA winning a naval war against China due to China being able to manufacture more ships.Conservative (talk) 10:11, 20 July 2020 (EDT)

The danger is fourth generation warfare, China escalating things right up to below all out hot war. Releasing the coronavirus in retaliation for tariffs, etc. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 11:00, 20 July 2020 (EDT)
After all is said and done, praying that Xi Jinping and/or the CCP are thrown out (or bow out which is unlikely), is a good thing to do. China is making a lot of enemies and China has a lot of debt. Xi Jinping/CCP/China are not invincible.Conservative (talk) 10:36, 20 July 2020 (EDT)
In the short to midterm, China a paper tiger.
"As per Institute of International Finance, China’s total domestic debt hit 317% of its GDP in first quarter of 2020, up from 300% last year, registering a largest quarterly increase. What’s worse, this data under-reports the true picture of China’s indebtedness, since a lot of debt is taken by local governments through financing vehicles that are not reflected in balance sheets. Since 2008, the annual growth in China’s domestic debt has been 20%, which has outpaced its GDP growth. Add to it the political culture of central Chinese leadership being favourably disposed towards local governments that have shown “development” backed by an ever increasing debt burden.
"And China is set to take on more debt as it tries to beat the Covid-19 induced slowdown to increase its spending. With Beijing announcing advance quota of local government special purpose bonds to the tune of 1 trillion yuan to fund infrastructure projects, it is now almost a given that debt at the local level—which is non-transparent and often violates banking rules—is set to balloon further. The move will ensure local government debt will more than double as compared to last year from 1.9 trillion yuan in 2019 to almost 3 trillion yuan this year.
"A banking crisis and systemic collapse of the financial sector are now looming large amidst growing concerns that many of the debts taken at household level and at local government level are at a very high risk of default. This could hit China’s state-dominated financial system hard and unravel the non-transparent financial dealings that have been the hallmark of its growth model. In fact, the extent of regulatory lapses can be gauged from the fact that Ministry of Finance has been forced to call out certain regional governments for illegal fundraising in multiple audit reports. Obviously, the pandemic will slow regional economies and will drive down revenues of local governments, which will limit their ability to repay/refinance previous large amounts of debt, leading to large scale defaults."[4]
Long term, the Chinese have more fire in the belly than Americans to be prosperous.
The USA and China both have a lot of debt and an aging/obese population. The USA/China people need to improve themselves and sober up.Conservative (talk) 11:11, 20 July 2020 (EDT)
And their latest GDP report of 3.2% growth in the second quarter is a bunch of hooey. China does not subscribe to GAAP, and CCP basically owns everything, so ultimately they will quote FDR about their domestic debt and say "we owe it to ourselves". The domestic creditors have no legal recourse in CCP courts to collect what is owed to them. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 11:32, 20 July 2020 (EDT)

Chinese military capabilities

Participants in this new discussion section talk about what the Chinese might do militarily, but the truth is, in general, Chinese weapon systems never work as advertised. Meanwhile, Trump has thoroughly modernized our own military. That would explain why Chinese sabre-rattling, like that done in recent times, often goes ignored. VargasMilan (talk) Monday, 13:07, 20 July 2020 (EDT)

China has a 700-ship "Green water" navy; the U.S. has a 400-ship "Blue water" navy. Ss also this recent vid, 3 REASONS CHINESE LIAONING WILL NOT LAST AN HOUR AGAINST USS RONALD REAGAN PROTECTING JAPAN. The sooner it's taken out, the better, so as to prevent China the time of gaining experience and training on how to operate an aircraft carrier. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 13:29, 20 July 2020 (EDT)

Three Gorges Dam

This has never been mentioned in Conservapedia, and we don't get too many China discussions, so an opportunity to report this probably deserves to be taken: The Three Gorges Dam is no longer safe and is in fact prone to overflow. Its central location means hundreds of thousands of lives are endangered should it fail. VargasMilan (talk) Monday, 14:40, 20 July 2020 (EDT)

I made a brief mention on MPR of flooding in Wuhan, but yes, this needs expansion. And in a way it is related to the widespread corruption and mental illness that is the result of a war on morality and higher virtues and standards conducted by athiest Marxists.
The construction of the crumbling dam, and its current management, is merely a continuation of the same bureacratic corruption behind the CCP virus coverup. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 14:54, 20 July 2020 (EDT)
Yes, I do remember you posting that now, Rob. Well, now there's more about it!
I looked at the reports, and yet, while I agree there is a good chance of massive flooding because they didn't dig deep enough, there's also a good chance the dam itself will hold. The reports say "it's reached its capacity", but the truth is that dams are supposed to be built with what's called a "factor of safety"—they take the worst-case scenario and then build the dam to be able to support twice or three-times that amount. But what would prevent that from happening would be if the communists who commissioned the dam had been persistently demanding the impossible while it was being built in terms of speed or cost of materials. VargasMilan (talk) Monday, 15:17, 20 July 2020 (EDT)
The only way the dam can hold is by flooding downstream communities, including Wuhan up to the first level of buildings. Some 38 million people have been affected. Do you follow Joshua Phillips? he has a nightly broadcast at 10:30 EDT that goes about 15-20 minutes with important updates on all things China. He usually even supplies links to sources in the description section. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 16:25, 20 July 2020 (EDT)
No I don't, thanks for the link. It's probably a good idea these days to keep up with China. VargasMilan (talk) Monday, 16:48, 20 July 2020 (EDT)
Financial implications if the Three Gorges Dam fails
  • ~350 million people, enormous manufacturing, and a huge portion of China’s GDP below the damn
  • major risk to the pharmaceutical supply chain
  • source materials for things made in India or the US and elsewhere
RobSTrump 2Q2Q 21:19, 24 July 2020 (EDT)


Amidst the Democrat riots and coronavirus, WWIII and Cold War II are being overlooked. Time for an update. The PRC in 2020 is way more powerful than the Third Reich or the USSR combined ever were, and presently engaged in the same aggression and human rights abuses. Tensions are ratcheted up daily. The CCP has no regard for the lives of its own people, be it through man made bio weapons, floods, earthquakes, locust plagues, gulags, slave labor, or organ harvesting so long as it aids in clinging to power. In today's world (rather than send an army after Saddam or Hitler as in the past), this is countered with the Global Magnitsky Act.

What is the Global Magnitsky Act? It is modeled after the Magnitsky Act which originally targeted Russian oligarchs. The U.S. controls the vast bulk of international money transfers which are delineated in dollars. When Magnitsky sanctions are placed upon individuals, such as Putin, Ayatollah Khamenei, Kim jong-un etc and their intimate business partners, it makes it difficult or impossible for them to profit from their corruption. Any American who does business with these people faces FBI investigation and harassment (like they attempted to frame Roger Stone and Michael Flynn for). Additionally, U.S. allies such as France, Germany, the U.K., Canada, Mexico, Brazil, etc or corporate entities such Airbus, likewise face sanctions and FBI harassment. So the Global Magnitsky Act has the effect of invoking a world-wide boycott, embargo, sanction (whatever word you choose to use) against targeted individuals from trading in U.S. dollars. (So the law encourages targeted individuals to trade among themselves using something other than U.S. dollars. Fortunately, (a) the amount of trade is fractional compared to the aggregate of global trade, and (b) they are all so corrupt and don't trust each other, making it hard to agree on an honest unit of measure to use as currency between themselves. This explains the spiking gold price; so sanctioned individuals who can't afford gold don't get any slack trading their home currency with sanctioned individuals in other countries).

So what's next? What is the Trump card the U.S. can play to serve the cause of U.S. interests, human rights, and liberation of the Chinese people? If global sanctions were placed upon all 90 million members the Chinese Communist Party, the whole structure of the Chinese government would implode. It won't happen in a day, but the mere threat of talking about this next phase of the scenario is creating open factions in the CCP, and resentment against dictator-for-life Xi Jinping, who can have that honorary title removed by CCP members shortening his life or some other way. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 11:38, 31 July 2020 (EDT)

In The News - Planned Parenthood

This would be a good article for In The News.

Setback for pro-aborts: Planned Parenthood in New York disavows Hillary Clinton's hero, racist eugenicist Margaret Sanger, and plans to remove her name from a Manhattan Planned Parenthood clinc.[1] --TheNewRight (talk) 12:19, 21 July 2020 (EDT)

I'm surprised that an organization that murders so many black lives would actually admit their founder was an avowed racist. It's hard to find actually honest progressives these days; back then, you could tell that they were honest about their intentions when they put on an ugly white costume to go around lynching people they hate. —LiberaltearsMay Dataclarifier be well! | Don't be an anti-Catholic zealot! Tuesday, 12:49, 21 July 2020 (EDT)

Flashback: Northwest

From what I've read here, BLM may actually be a front for the Communist Party USA. Obama's involvement in agitating the BLM protesters to continue rioting, vandalizing and even targeting the police is making it more and more evident that the usurper in the White House has to be stopped. Northwest (talk) 10:00, 18 July 2016 (EDT)

VargasMilan (talk) Tuesday, 16:20, 21 July 2020 (EDT)

VargasMilan may be right about the presidential 2020 election. A Trump electoral college landslide may happen

An anonymous poll in Las Vegas taken by a cab driver indicates a Trumpslide in 2020: Betting on a Trumpslide.

I also read this: The Rasmussen Reports daily Presidential Tracking Poll for Tuesday shows that 48% of Likely U.S. Voters approve of President Trump’s job performance. Fifty-one percent (51%) disapprove.[5] This is a significant rise in Trump's approval rating by Rasmussen in recent times.

I think many of the polls may be wrong because the mainstream press wants to rig them and due to shy and sneaky Republican ladies who don't want to admit they are voting for Trump and the "Silent Majority".

Many voters probably believe the coronavirus is going to be solved soon by an upcoming vaccine and they are voting for Trump due to: their pocketbooks; due to the far left having undue influence on the Democratic Party and the incompetent, corrupt and lackluster Joe Biden being the Democrat running for president. The riots and the Democratic governors/mayors responses to them don't help either. I think many people are having lockdown fatigue also.

If the Democrats picked someone more electable than Hillary and Biden, maybe Trump would have never been elected once and possibly twice.

It's very hard to predict the election (Trump is a relentless fighter, incompetent pollsters, swing states, changing/unexpected events, etc.).

The coronavirus is rising in the USA. How much is Trump's fault is hard to know. America has the largest obesity problem in the world and many people with underlying conditions as a result (Obesity suppressing immune systems too plus taxes the bodies system). Americans are very independent and it may be hard to get them to comply with social distancing, masks, etc. The U.S. press does a poor job educating the public as well. I do think America could have done a better job mitigating the pandemic.Conservative (talk) 03:26, 22 July 2020 (EDT)

I promised some people I would spend a whole lot of time on a certain endeavor and pare down my following of politics. This is the last time I comment on politics until at least November 5, 2020. In fact, I am not going to follow political news until November 5, 2020.Conservative (talk) 05:43, 22 July 2020 (EDT)

Christians cannot afford to be indifferent to politics, Conservative. Imo, we have to be very involved in it, as it is part of winning the world for Christ the King. Wherever Christians form a moral majority, that moral majority must vote its values in the polling booth. NishantXavierFor Christ the King 09:14, 23 July 2020 (EDT)

Thank you and best wishes on keeping your sabbatical (short of desperate Democrats/communists facing prison with nothing to lose attempting a general insurrection, based on a false flag operation, for example. Then it's all hands on deck!) VargasMilan (talk) Wednesday, 17:59, 22 July 2020 (EDT)
Right-wingers have more guns. You won't need me. :)
Seriously, since 2003 I have been involved in ideological conflict online. I am tired of it. I am taking the advice of The Steve Miller Band: "Lovey dovey, lovey dovey, lovey dovey all the time"!
"There is a time for everything, and a season for every activity under heaven: a time to be born and a time to die, a time to plant and a time to uproot, a time to kill and a time to heal, a time to tear down and a time to build, a time to weep and a time to laugh, a time to mourn and a time to dance, a time to scatter stones and a time to gather them, a time to embrace and a time to refrain, a time to search and a time to give up, a time to keep and a time to throw away, a time to tear and a time to mend, a time to be silent and a time to speak, a time to love and a time to hate, a time for war and a time for peace." - King Solomon (Ecclesiastes 3: 1-8)Conservative (talk) 18:51, 22 July 2020 (EDT)
The hidden Trump vote = record gun sales. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 19:08, 22 July 2020 (EDT)

Theory as to why Trump shifted his attitude and showed his appreciation for "keyboard warriors" by putting some of their work on his Twitter feed

"The Democrats have made Trump into one of us.
"By attacking him endlessly, they've transformed him from the president to an American citizen facing all the same oppression we do.
"When you think about Trump, the first thing that comes into your mind is his persecution."—Carlos Osweda

VargasMilan (talk) Thursday, 05:00, 23 July 2020 (EDT)

Trump has so swollen the minds of activist and hidden socialists with anger by slighting their ideas without their being able to tell how much he's actually examined them, if it all, that they are pushed into thinking the best way to recover ground with the voting public is to extend their usual play of assuming high dudgeon combined with ignoring the facts that make that posture irrelevant, into every possible avenue of prospected advantage.

All Trump has to do is guide them by raising their prospects selectively into areas where these socialists must cross over boundaries of which the voting public won't approve, but of which these same socialists incorrectly think the public's familiarity with their conveniently mistaken political assumptions has caused them to tolerate the hostility that motivates the crossing of those boundaries equally well.

A good example? A respect for law and its responsible enforcement. How could they be so blind? If they can't publicly examine their ideas, they at least deserve to have the closure of seeing Trump feel their pain caused by the dismissal of their ideas in a definite way, even if they have to present the non-self-inflicted component of it on a larger scale than what it is in reality to make sure it happens!

That's the badly kept secret: good sense is the White Whale; the permanent majoritarian victor that underlies all the frustration the Captain Ahab that is cultural Marxism can't slay. The idealists like Starbuck don't know it; the cynics can't depend on it as a rallying point without losing the idealists.

Can we expect another foray against "Western Civilization"? Of course. News events are the cultural Marxists' slot machine. If enough surrogates for good sense are framed as persecutors within a short enough time period with the help of rechanneling that frustration, it will induce the idea that maybe good sense needs to be abandoned as a foundation. Is this possible? So far the principle brought to national attention that those who are favored by the police are actually persecuted by them, has levitated without visible means of such support for months now. As respect for good sense diminishes, respect for histrionics fills the empty space (and the "best" given the right-of-way at the intersection). VargasMilan (talk) Thursday, 09:06, 23 July 2020 (EDT)

A lot of Bernie voters frustrated with the system are going to side with President Trump. President Trump has a great army at his side. All those who still care about saving western civilization. President Trump can and imo will win in a landslide victory, as you said, Vargas, this November. NishantXavierFor Christ the King 09:16, 23 July 2020 (EDT)

That's a good point to mention, NishantXavier. Some Bernie bros are populists who may really end up preferring an anti-establishment conservative like Donald Trump over some "moderate" establishment Democrat hack like Joe Biden. I've seen leftists outraged over the fact that around 15% (if I remember correctly) of Bernie supporters are willing to back Trump over Biden. If President Trump appeals to that base with economic opportunities, he can potentially win in a landslide. —LiberaltearsMay Dataclarifier be well! | Don't be an anti-Catholic zealot! Thursday, 11:51, 23 July 2020 (EDT)

Jack Dorsey re-testifies to Congress Monday

Jack Dorsey, the founder of do I say it? Misled Congress? Lied to Congress? Perjured himself? Over whether Twitter practiced political censorship. There was a picture leaked and passed around on Twitter (which was naturally censored) showing a Twitter moderator's management console programmed with large buttons labelled with various censorship tasks like, for example, "shadowban". In this case, the subtle minds at Twitter have cleverly concealed what the button label might mean, so although we would need a modern-day Sherlock Holmes to learn the operation to which it truly refers, I suspect it has something to do with the prohibition of large summer umbrellas, though I've steeled myself to the prospect of discovering it applies to the performance of some equally fiendish behavior. VargasMilan (talk) Thursday, 17:26, 23 July 2020 (EDT)

If he were a government employee, it's "lack of candor"; if it's a mere mortal or ordinary human being it's "lying." RobSTrump 2Q2Q 17:45, 23 July 2020 (EDT)
(Rob is referring to recent FBI Office of Professional Responsibility reports, like the one on corrupt former Deputy Director Andrew McCabe, which use that phrase repeatedly.) VargasMilan (talk) Thursday, 17:57, 23 July 2020 (EDT)
That's about half of it; while Gen. Flynn was on the government payroll at the time he is alleged to have been guilty of a "lack of candor", after he quit he was charged with "lying". RobSTrump 2Q2Q 18:03, 23 July 2020 (EDT)
I think that the affectionate partiality by government workers toward language that secretly diverts the imputation of guilt away from their fellow stewards of government spending is a loyalty (to oneself) that we see far too seldom these days and, in its way, is among the many of those magnificent chivalrous preoccupations (with oneself) that make elite America truly what it is—and furthermore, to be honest, that I find really quite adorable! If you're out there and want to do an interview for a large liberal publication—I'm ready and available! VargasMilan (talk) Thursday, 18:40, 23 July 2020 (EDT)
Look at the flip side: none of the goons Trump sent into Portland can be charged with lying in the legitimate dispatch of their duties. But every one they drag off the streets will be charged with a federal crime and, at a minimum, bankrupted like Gen. Flynn. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 18:54, 23 July 2020 (EDT)
You ought to see the Federal Courthouse in my town: a nuclear bomb can go off and that building will still be standing. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 18:59, 23 July 2020 (EDT)
RobS, that's 2010s thinking! Don't you know nowadays harmless domestic terrorists indicted by their persecutors in law enforcement get their defenses paid for by the National Lawyer's Guild? VargasMilan (talk) Thursday, 19:29, 23 July 2020 (EDT)
I can only assume the lack of street arrests is cause investigators are following the money from George Soros and Borealis Philanthropy through money transfers to DSA, Antifa, and BLM board members down to street komandos and operatives. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 19:49, 23 July 2020 (EDT)

Who was America's first racist president?

With Joe Biden shooting off his idiotic mouth again, we need to get a handle on this one: "Biden claims Trump is America's 'first' racist president." I see this as yet another category in which Woodrow Wilson, our 28th president, represents the bottom of the barrel. He was a supporter of the Confederacy, the KKK, and segregated federal employees. See "The 11 Most Racist U.S. Presidents." Of course, this brings to mind Biden's claim that Obama was "articulate and bright and clean." These days, it's so hard to find a black man who is truly clean that once you find one, you automatically start thinking about putting him in the Oval Office. Did Biden have a joint appearance with Jesse Jackson or Al Sharpton and go away thinking, "Holy, cow, what a stinkbag!" PeterKa (talk) 01:28, 24 July 2020 (EDT)

Peter, Biden had to say something, and let me explain. There's a conservative meme floating around that goes "People thought that Obama would be the post-racial president, but he turned out to be the most racial president." As I'm sure you know, Biden's campaign's job is to find any well-known damaging generalizations that might prevent his attractiveness as a candidate from reaching its full effect and counter them. But this is sometimes done for many such perspectives, like the one you mentioned, true or false, at once, with something that blocks and replaces them, or at least confuses them. This is often done by means of time-wasting disputations his supporters can use even though people know they aren't true, but are effective because they are annoying enough for people aged 18-49 to respond to. VargasMilan (talk) Friday, 04:42, 24 July 2020 (EDT)
(A) Why are Biden's boys tearing down statues of Washington and Jefferson if they were not the first racist presidents, and (B) Why hasn't Biden condemned senseless violence and vandalism of tearing Washington and Jefferson statues since they obviously were not America's first racist presidents? RobSTrump 2Q2Q 11:25, 24 July 2020 (EDT)
Trump started a new catch phrase you're supposed to say whenever you bring up Biden's family: "Where's Hunter Biden?" VargasMilan (talk) Friday, 22:19, 24 July 2020 (EDT)

MPR John Durham Washington Examiner article

"The politically charged review, which shifted into a criminal investigation last fall, has been criticized by Democrats as a scheme to damage President Trump's rivals ahead of the 2020 election

There it is again! You'll notice if it damages his rivals it will be wholely rooted in the self-inflicted kind of damage. But because they're damaged they get the moral supremacy anyway. And didn't Plato tell us punishments are medicinal for the soul? Don't we have the right to a government that sees that justice is done even when we ourselves are wrong? Damaged instead of punished on the basis of what? Gee, I wonder why they didn't characterize the evidence that would determine that.

Maybe the whole Justice Department should recuse itself, since the suspects attempted high treason against their boss, and so they have a conflict of interest. Do you think if Trump's "rivals" shoot themselves in the foot in the course of trying to frame Trump's staff for a crime, they're immune from punishment because the results are too ironic? We won't know because they don't mention that activity as part of the case either. "You can't punish them, or even mention in a news article they inadvertently provided the very evidence that points to their wrongdoing!" Now Trump is blameworthy just because he can't help it that he's lucky?

"and hailed by Republicans who claim the Russia investigation was a partisan hit job."

"Claims" backed by (scandalously voluminous) evidence or without evidence? I guess it doesn't matter. NOT!

Of all the half-baked so-called news reportage that I've had to slog through of gonzo journalists trying to get their digs in seeking petty revenge against Trump over the course of his presidency, this ranks about somewhere in the middle!

VargasMilan (talk) Friday, 14:58, 24 July 2020 (EDT)

Trump style dialogue

Do you remember the news stories about the mayor of Portland telling Trump not to bring federal troops to Portland and Trump saying that he would? It turns out Trump had already BEEN in Portland for two-and-a-half weeks! On July 4th he deployed every non-Defense Department military agent he could find to Portland! Lol. Trump didn't send the official U.S. military so there wouldn't be any media leaks. It worked!

They spent their time conducting surveillance to identify who was in charge and to track those people's locations, arresting the wildest attackers in the mob groups and infiltrating the crowds to strategically to prevent mob flare-ups from focusing onto single individuals so they didn't get killed.

VargasMilan (talk) Friday, 22:14, 24 July 2020 (EDT)

Trump has mentioned Sun Tzu on his Twitter feed.
"Be extremely subtle, even to the point of formlessness. Be extremely mysterious, even to the point of soundlessness. Thereby you can be the director of the opponent's fate." - Sun Tzu Conservative (talk) 16:08, 25 July 2020 (EDT)


So what you are saying is that a man who lowers his mask to take a drink whilst in his own bubble is denying science when for weeks upon weeks liberal Trump has denied there is a problem, the leader of this website has gone on about "Mask Police", conservatives have been wearing mesh masks to give a middle finger to the rest us. Fauci has saved 1000s, Trump has killed 1000s. Conservapedia's new pro death stance is very enlightening. What a bunch of sycophantic always Trump holes your all are.--CanonD (talk) 14:47, 25 July 2020 (EDT)

As far as Anthony Fauci, he was sitting next to a friend in the ballpark too. He was not merely sitting next to his wife. So he was not social distancing. As far as his claim that he was merely taking a drink, in the picture his hands were folded and not holding a drink. Anthony Fauci did behave hypocritically and he did it in public.
Recently, a person from New Zealand whose political views skew to the secular left indicated to me that the USA had poor leadership when it comes to the coronavirus epidemic. Due to excessive nationalism, rather than investigate this matter more fully, I decided to point out to him that some nations that are atheistic/nonreligious/evolutionistic in their ideology have had less than a stellar response to the pandemic (China/UK/some European countries).
Looking back, given that there are 195 countries in the world and that the USA is among the top countries in deaths by coronavirus per 100,000 people [6][7], I should have been more open to the notion that America has had poor leadership during this pandemic. And the current administration is not entirely to blame since the coronavirus has a bigger effect on overweight and aging populations (the USA did not transform itself into an overweight/aging population in the last 4 years). By the way, the UK, which is the fountainhead of Darwinism, has the highest rate of covid-19 deaths per 100,000 people in the world!
Next, I am a big believer in masks and social distancing. I not only wear a common blue masks that many others wear in public, but I cover it with a t-shirt mask that I form. So I double mask! I also social distance. In addition, soon I am getting a face shield which are very inexpensive to get.
As far as Trump, although he did make some good decisions regarding the coronavirus pandemic (restricting visitors from China early on, etc.), I wish he had made some better decisions as far as the pandemic.Conservative (talk) 18:48, 25 July 2020 (EDT
Trump Finally Wears a Mask & Loves it! Comedian John Di Domenico.Conservative (talk) 20:34, 25 July 2020 (EDT)
Trump Rants & Hypes Rebooted Corona Task Force Show! New Guests New Sponsors! - Comedian John Di DomenicoConservative (talk) 08:03, 26 July 2020 (EDT)
Many liberals/leftists have been engaging in mass protests during the coronavirus pandemic which is a flagrent disregard of social distancing. Shame! In addition, because many liberals/leftists went to poorly run, public schools and/or are lazy researchers so they don't understand medical science well and fail to understand why hydroxychloroquine works best when supplemented with zinc (see: Vladimir Zelenko's coronavirus treatment). Conservative (talk) 09:14, 26 July 2020 (EDT)

Flashback: Russiagate

"The Robert Mueller IMPLOSION: It’s time for Barr and Trump to prosecute the deep state traitors, or the American people will never regain any faith in the justice system."—Mike Adams, July 25, 2019, Newstarget.

There are supposedly numerous secret grand juries being conducted, but as RobS said, Washington DC is a bad venue, and I don't know if moving it elsewhere is permissible in U.S. federal court. VargasMilan (talk) Saturday, 20:35, 25 July 2020 (EDT)

We're supposed to get big news this week. Thus far, it looks like the respected Brookings Institutions neck is on the block - something no one has written about yet and will be YUGE. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 10:44, 29 July 2020 (EDT)

That's enough!

Conservative promised to stop posting political opinions from his computer rig, but he did it again. When is he going to learn that being a chatterbox will prevent him from being invited to professional golf matches, fishing tournaments and especially libraries. What? The polymath Conservative not allowed at our storehouses of knowledge?

We tried to hide the section totally authored by a non-troll (n.b.: this is rote sarcasticul) because we knew it would be too big of a temptation, but he found it anyway, reposted the troll commentary and before we could stop him, replied and replied. Not just replied, but replied and replied. His wise admonitions were imprinted all over the discussion page before anyone could stop him.

Conservative has become addicted to Conservapedia! When I was over at his house for dinner I was the unwilling object of more than one embarrassed glance from his computer rig between the main meal and the dessert course. I really thought he had turned himself around. I'm angrier than I sound and more sympathetic to those who'd like to put lumps on Conservative's head than I'd like to admit.

But in spite of all of that, I'm sure he's still a very nice person.

On unrelated subject, does anyone know the definition of the word "enabler" and how you can avoid being one? (As context it was said by a very picky person.) VargasMilan (talk) Saturday, 22:27, 25 July 2020 (EDT

What does BIDEN stand for?


Biggest idiot the Democrats ever nominated? Boring imitation Dumbo with an elongated nose? The American people will never vote for me, but my 600 lawyers will put me in office anyway? I guess that last one doesn't really work. See "Why Has Biden Hired 600 Lawyers?" PeterKa (talk) 09:29, 26 July 2020 (EDT)

"Baseball teams and organizations constantly need a new influx of talent. If they let their bench languish, they will eventually get into trouble because our beloved favorites will eventually falter."[8]
Baseball has some similarities to politics. And Democrats have a weak bench.Conservative (talk) 09:20, 26 July 2020 (EDT)
It's a generational transfer, and the upcoming generation bears no resemblance to its forebears who once believed in two-party democracy. Biden himself never believed in two-party democracy. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 09:43, 26 July 2020 (EDT)

Is this a clone of Kamala Harris?

[9] —unsigned edit by User:RobSmithUser talk:RobSmith 08:53, 26 July 2020 (EDT)

Florida numbers total hoax (fraud)

Florida: 223,000 positive #SARSCoV2 tests in three weeks - 10,000 a day - and ~NO CHANGE in hospitalizations or ICU occupancy statewide. You say epidemic, I say a lot of people getting colds, let’s call the whole thing off. (We’ll see if Florida has any excess mortality in July.)—Alex Berenson

Conservative said "Republicans are still in denial" about the cases two weeks back.

Conservative thought Democrat activists piling on were the Gentlemen Jims of U. S. politics, even though Laura Loomer proved when you take pictures of ballot boxes nowhere near where they're supposed to be, they take your phone away and invalidate the recount at 11:59:53 pm.

Thankfully, Laura Loomer is running for Congress in Florida's 21st Congressional District and has raised 2.5x more than her opponent, and nobody likes Bill DeBlasio anymore, who took a suspicious measuring stick to the positive tests there because that's really his business and his own state had the most.

Seriously, though (you'll like this, Conservative) Trump played a Jedi mind trick on Gavin Newsom, governor of California, whom Laura Loomer also protested, by first complaining about all the forest service firefighting money he took, and then by trying really hard to be his friend, and he must have told him (falsely) his campaign told him he needed a West Coast ten-pin, because it looked like he was being rejected there, and Trump was really image-conscience and going to read a list of Wuhan flu advice at the White House, and he needed Newsom to thank him again. Instead Newsom insisted that Trump jawbone for Newsom on liberal social issues, and when Trump declined, Newsom announced that he was leading California as a "nation-state".

Well, everything Newsome tried didn't stop the cases, probably because he was still letting in the illegal aliens, and Trump didn't warn him. Everybody in California remembered what Newsom did, and how he went out of his way to do things differently than Trump, like allow the enormous communist protests to take place without any calls for medical restrictions, so it looked like he wasn't listening, and then he tried micromanaging the crisis so he'd look engaged, but everybody thought he was gutting the economy just to go through the motions of making tough decisions. Lol.

VargasMilan (talk) Monday, 18:34, 27 July 2020 (EDT)

The 1968 Pandemic (H3N2 virus) killed about 100,000 Americans.[10] In 1968, America had a population of about 200,000,000 people.[11] Since the USA's population is currently about 328,000,000 people, that would be about 164,000 people who died in today's era all other things being the same.
So far 150,000 people died of coronavirus in the USA if the commonly cited estimate is accurate.
Reuter's reports: Over 224,000 COVID-19 deaths forecast in U.S. by November 1, says University of Washington's IHME.[12]
The 1968 pandemic lasted until 1970 and happened during Richard Nixon's presidency. Nixon served from 1969 until 1974 (He won a second term, but was impeached due to the Watergate burglery coverup). Nixon had a big virus epidemic and civil/racial unrest and won as a law and order president in 1968.
In the USA, Operation Warp Speed (OWS) aims to deliver 300 million doses of a safe, effective vaccine for COVID-19 by January 2021, as part of a broader strategy to accelerate the development, manufacturing, and distribution of COVID-19 vaccines, therapeutics, and diagnostics (collectively known as countermeasures).[13]
Will DonaldTrump dodge the coronavirus epidemic and tough economy bullets? Time will tell.Conservative (talk) 21:04, 27 July 2020 (EDT)
"We keep reading that 'Covid cases reach this or that milestone!'
But do we really know what a "Covid case is?" According to new CDC rules, you don't need to have even been tested or have symptoms to be a "case." You may have been labeled as a "case" and not even know it."
"As I recall, 2019-20 was predicted to be a very heavy flu season, and yet, it turned out to be a light flu season and a heavy Covid season.
Could that be because we were just coding flu cases as Covid?"
There is no controlling legal standard for reporting Covid fatalities reported to the CDC, and the regulations they do have explicitly state they are only aspiring to 50% accuracy and reward health care providers each time Covid is the cause of death and give them nothing if it isn't. There are no examinations by the residing county's coroner's office to confirm the cause of death unless a crime is involved.
@Hale_Razor noticed an interesting pattern:
March: DEATHS!
April: DEATHS!
July: CASES!
VargasMilan (talk) Tuesday, 00:14, 28 July 2020 (EDT)

BLM teaches children to become trannies

Many donated to Black Lives Matter thinking that the group had something to do with racial equality or stopping police brutality. But it turns out that its real agenda is something else entirely. Schools in California are adopting a curriculum created by BLM that promotes transgenderism. See "California School Board Faces Ire of Parents After Teacher Reveals Shocking Union-Backed BLM Curriculum." Did George Floyd die to promote this form of child abuse? Public schooling in America seems to have run its course. Perhaps we can use private or religious education to put children beyond the reach of these monsters. PeterKa (talk) 23:46, 27 July 2020 (EDT)

Mike S. Adams

Mike S. Adams (no relation to the Mike Adams up on this page), commentator on social Marxism, for those who knew him in person or through his satirical writings, was known by us to be assassinated in his home by a firearm last week—he had no financial motive to take his own life as he was set to collect his pension as a professor; no personal motive, he had droves of adoring fans on TownHall; no mental motive, as he had a model conservative intellect for dealing firmly but not harshly with those who saw him as an obstacle to their vengeance and power over those who sought success by the legitimate means of being of use and service to their community rather than extorting a kind of ransom to escape destructive abuse the way they themselves achieved success. And no spiritual motive as he was a devout Baptist.
I will miss his humor the most; he stuck mostly to bad puns on his Twitter account—it was heavily shadowbanned to the point that he probably could have been a Top Conservative on Twitter otherwise, but his influence was enormous; the 2.2 million follower account of Ann Coulter repeated news of his suspicious death. But his longer riffs I liked the best; his most perfected trope was a deadpan satirically earnest engagement with the empty glittering appearances of liberal insight at face value; I'd be in hysterics at the times when the more foolish his liberal challenger became to extricate themselves from exposure of their insincerity, the more satirically apologetic he became.
Don't get me wrong, the idea of political assassination is scary as h--- to someone who grew to appreciate and even adopt his clever sensibilities (the best example is probably when I use the phrase "that's big of you"), but he also had a heavy side using his discernment skills as a professor of criminology, as, frankly, some of the liberals he'd encounter at their Meccas at the state liberal arts colleges were psychological and emotional messes.
Especially in his books he'd resort to an analysis that was however as deep as he'd happen to encounter in the opinions of others along the way, like of feminism, where I didn't want to go, and when I went past my qualms out of a desire to support him financially, I'd be sorry I did. I had to stop reading him when I went to work among certain liberals; his analysis in a column would bring you to a certain point of looking briefly at motives brought up in each one, one at a time, that frequently forced you to hesitate when you encountered it again until what you remembered grew to a kind of cascade that had a way of blocking the direct kind of communication.
But as I let on, what he did write (he also gave speeches) was really quite instructional (and harrowing) after the ideas were reinforced on repetition about how liberals had corrupted the intellectual education that is supposed to take place at our colleges and universities.
In the months before his death the issue he cared the most about was being against abortion, saying something like "if in a political discussion if you can't get that right I wouldn't trust you to get anything right". Which brings me to the chilling suspicion that someone thought when the founder of Twitter re-testified in Congress, that there would be a prospect of the end of shadow-banning and in consequence, some nefarious person feared Mike Adams' could find success as a powerful, well-known abortion opponent on Twitter.
I'd like to add some comforting generalities here to be kind, but what's kind of preventing that is the feeling of being the private witness to a crime, as, like I said, I belong to the few among whom what they know just happens to indicate he didn't have any known motive to take his own life. VargasMilan (talk) Tuesday, 01:44, 28 July 2020 (EDT)
Well, if part of your credibility for accuracy's going to go down in flames (that is, at the only place where I wrote about it, above), I did it in the best possible way: defending a flawed but inspiring conservative being piled on by a horde of mendacious undeservedly-esteemed liberal pseudo-journalists.
There was no assassination, but had Mike Adams lived, his reputation would have undoubtedly been trashed and smeared even like President Clinton's top admiral would have, who, as Rush Limbaugh reported at the time, had even less reason to commit suicide, though having done so, after being summoned by a journalist for questions about a medal on his uniform that turned out to be fully deservedly-earned. Mike apparently had applied for his job with a mis-statement on his résumé for which he thought he'd be legally liable, having just agreed to leave his teaching post at a state university at age 55 for a settlement of $500,000.
He may very well have made the mis-statement before he converted to Christianity and later "converted" to conservatism, but never having corrected it.
Maybe you're wondering if you've never heard of him, what his relationship is to mainstream conservatism. I don't remember what his opinion of Trump was, but Adams was the subject of a seven-year's duration lawsuit that reached U.S. Federal Appeals Court. You've probably heard of his attorney, and friend, David French, who worked at National Review Online. Peter Ka and 1990's guy reported on him for us as being a pretty well-known anti-Trumper in Trump's first run for office, prospectively competing against Trump in a candidacy that was a sort of centerpiece for the damage the neo-conservative movement did to itself in relation to the U.S. federal elections that year.
The self-account of the lawsuit represented by French (who no longer lists his National Review Online experience on his Twitter bio) shows him redeeming himself, at least in my eyes, as he rung up a defeat on behalf of a conservative client whose political philosophy he didn't entirely share, against a clique of insincere beneficiaries of academic freedom devoting themselves to stifling others with regard to the only academic freedoms having to do with the American Constitutional protections that matter as bearing a cost outside of equal opportunity: the freedom of political viewpoint.
David French noted Adams wasn't a racist, but in his eulogy he seems to have unwittingly proved that to be understatement, though it was already known by his regular readers. Sporadically, the North Carolinan resident wrote articles that put words in the mouths of his adversaries in an effort of presenting a reconstruction of what could be the quite plausible attitude motivating the dumbing-down of various educational standards at his college system that all-too apparently could be explained by cynical exploitation of blacks and other politically-distinct minorities. He wrote with the realization that rather, accounts suggested the same to be molding their targets into loyal cliques to be used as political bludgeons all while slighting, if not exacting, the cost of the loss of providing them a fundamental mastery of the liberal arts that would help them succeed as citizens and/or in a chosen career field.
Opposing counsel used these fairly audacious reconstructions, always made in passing, of dialogues and descriptions that subsequent evidence of detrimental outcomes sadly confirmed that the motivating attitudes portrayed in them, as I said, were quite plausible, themselves in a cynical way. They were gathered and read together and, without their context in open court, French reports Adams, whom he feared would speak too plainly of his unvarnished disdain for self-serving doctrinaires, "crumbled" in confidence to the point of low responsiveness as the "half-African-American...jurors' eyes narrowed". He had all at once faced the prospect of not only having mistakenly disappointed the jurors by being subject to the presentation of a scornful misrepresentation of his views, but, should he lose the case, even being "discredited as a vicious bigot".
"Fortunately, we rallied," wrote French, "The evidence was just too overwhelming. When we caught his department chair contradicting her previous sworn testimony the jurors’ eyes narrowed again, but this time their anger was directed at the defendants. By the next day, the light was back in Mike’s eyes. The happy warrior had returned."
I don't have time to draw up a full picture of Mike's contributions, and the loss he was facing before his demise, tonight, but I hope if you did a web search of his contributions to conservatism, you'll be inclined to understand better when I tell you that representations of his being prejudicial to blacks and other politically-distinct minority groups themselves are components of commonly-used abusive ploys by liberal activists to present conservatives that way to hide their own complicity in actually only being that way themselves. VargasMilan (talk) Thursday, 04:11, 30 July 2020 (EDT)

Donald J. Trump

Trump has a way of holding his head up with quiet dignity and foresightedness through this Covid fakery/Antifa/BLM activism period, but he's gotta be thinking: "What a bunch of idiots." VargasMilan (talk) Tuesday, 01:56, 28 July 2020 (EDT)

Trump always plays his cards very close to his chest. And, with the exception of the CCP bio attack, he already has contingencies in place. His biggest mistakes happen when the media forces him to reveal a card he's holding, which he does reluctantly and is usually combination of him tossing a bone to pacify them, tinged with a bit of pride and arrogance. But no one has a record of being 2 or 3 years ahead of policy directions, if not 20 or 30 years as Trump does. It goes unappreciated in an age of 30 second sound bytes that are forgotten in a day or two.
Trump is the anti-Nixon. Nixon put a vision in place that maintained the peace and avoided nuclear war with the communists for 48 years under all administrations, Democrat and Republican. Trump between 1986 and 1996 was already saying it was a mistake - it would kill American jobs and destroy "the middle class" (to borrow a Marxist term). Trump truly is a visionary as Nixon was, and will set the course for a division of the world for decades to come, as Nixon did, whether he or not he is recognized as the architect of the coming international structure of world peace. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 10:37, 29 July 2020 (EDT)

What is John Roberts up to?

"Multiple sources familiar with the inner workings of the Court" have been in contact with CNN. In other words, Chief Justice John Roberts is leaking again. So much for judicial discretion. What does Roberts have to say for himself? Mostly that Kavanaugh is a dip who has to be "guided by Roberts." Aside from such self-promotional revelations, we learn that Roberts wasn't so keen on the recent DACA decision. Why did he vote for it? Supreme Court opinions are written by the senior justice in the majority. As chief justice, Roberts has a motive to vote with the majority even when he doesn't agree with it. See "More Leaks From The Supreme Court, All Of Which Make Roberts Look Powerful." PeterKa (talk) 06:15, 28 July 2020 (EDT)

All nine justices will be leaking before long: "Leaks From the Supreme Court, Part II: Justice Gorsuch Looks Decisive and In Control." PeterKa (talk) 05:47, 29 July 2020 (EDT)

As things heat up....

One problem I'm encountering is distinguishing between ordinary garden variety corruption in the Uniparty and Deep State, and communist objectives in the Democrat establishment. While communism is by definition corrupt, sometimes Deep State corruption has no ideological basis beyond selfish motives and interests. But the same can also said about some of the most vocal advocates of destroying the constitution and the American system of government. Lord, help me to discern. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 10:50, 29 July 2020 (EDT)

RobS is absolutely right. So back off!
Seriously though, I can't imagine anyone would be disappointed if you scaled back your deep state chronicles. Seriously, who else is taking the heat? Another wiki is what? still doing PR for them? VargasMilan (talk) Wednesday, 17:07, 29 July 2020 (EDT)

Coronavirus, masks, medical vector, USA, Japan and East Asia

"Yet masking became almost universal, and though there is no proof it was a magic bullet, Japan’s virus success indicates it had a serious impact. The country has experienced only 7.68 deaths per million, compared with 385 per million for the United States."[14]

"If you’re wondering whether to wear or not to wear, consider this. The day before yesterday, 21 people died of COVID-19 in Japan. In the United States, 2,129 died. Comparing overall death rates for the two countries offers an even starker point of comparison with total U.S. deaths now at a staggering 76,032 and Japan’s fatalities at 577. Japan’s population is about 38% of the U.S., but even adjusting for population, the Japanese death rate is a mere 2% of America’s...

If 80% of a closed population were to don a mask, COVID-19 infection rates would statistically drop to approximately one twelfth the number of infections—compared to a live-virus population in which no one wore masks."[15]

"But in most democracies that have had the greatest success in fighting COVID-19, including South Korea, Taiwan, Hong Kong, Singapore, and Japan, mask-wearing is common practice."[16]

"When Singapore and South Korea figured out that if as a medical provider you wash your damn hands before and after, without exception, every potential contact with an infected person or surface even if you didn't have a mask on for 30 minutes during casual conversations with others (e.g. neither of you is hacking) transmission to and between their medical providers stopped."[17]

Only Conservative would quote Vox Day, so I know he wrote this section. I heard of this conversation in Florida: "Hey! There are hardly any Covid patients in this hospital?" "Shh! We don't want them here!" VargasMilan (talk) Thursday, 23:20, 30 July 2020 (EDT)

Italicizing websites

As in Twitter or TownHall or Unz Reader. How about it? It's the twenties! VargasMilan (talk) Thursday, 07:11, 30 July 2020 (EDT)

"In essence, the conservative person is simply one who finds the permanent things more pleasing than Chaos and Old Night. (Yet conservatives know, with Burke, that healthy 'change is the means of our preservation.')...
Burke’s reminder of the necessity for prudent change is in the mind of the conservative. But necessary change, conservatives argue, ought to be gradual and discriminatory, never unfixing old interests at once." - Russell Kirk.[18]Wikignome72 (talk) 10:01, 30 July 2020 (EDT)
There is subtle point here; nobody italicizes public utilities like ATT; but the Manuel of Style say publishers should be italicized like NYT. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 11:09, 30 July 2020 (EDT)
IOWS, we the public can strip Big Tech of their Section 230 immunity as a fait accompli before any legislation by treating them as publishers. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 11:13, 30 July 2020 (EDT)

Applying your guys' philosophy, if you were writing the movie script to Finding Nemo, the characters would all sound like whales. VargasMilan (talk) Thursday, 23:41, 30 July 2020 (EDT)

Though after all day making important decisions, maybe it's the little ones that can end up being the tough ones! VargasMilan (talk) Thursday, 23:47, 30 July 2020 (EDT)

Americans need to use more wisdom as far as the coronavirus pandemic. Herman Cain didn't need to die

Herman Cain, the former CEO of Godfather's Pizza, was diagnosed with COVID-19 last month and admitted to an Atlanta-area hospital on July 1, 10 days after he attended President Trump’s rally in Tulsa, Okla.[19]

Why are Americans having protests and political rallies in the middle of a pandemic? The Singaporeans and Japanese who have a far better handle on the coronavirus pandemic aren't doing this. What's wrong with using common sense? Do the Singaporeans and Japanese have better schools with better science education? Do their cultures better balance responsibilities and rights when it comes to pandemics?


P.S. Viruses and the grave don't care about your constitutional rights, liberty or politics! Neither does gravity!

P.S.S. Colonial America had quarantines. There is no constitutional right in the USA to avoid using common sense measure to mitigate/end a pandemic.Wikignome72 (talk) 13:37, 30 July 2020 (EDT)

Dick Morris said the same thing yesterday. If Trump supporters do not start wearing masks, you might as well start saying "Heil Biden!" RobSTrump 2Q2Q 13:44, 30 July 2020 (EDT)
Trump should have better educated himself about masks and lead by example by wearing a mask. In addition, he should have used the Defense Production Act to ramp up PPE and coronavirus testing production. There are several areas where the Trump Admnistration could have done better.
The clock is running out. Trump might not have enough time to turn around the current situation as far as the pandemic/economy.
The saving grace is that if Biden is elected, a Republican will probably win in 2024. Wikignome72 (talk) 13:55, 30 July 2020 (EDT)
I'm not sure what's happening; next the MSM might even say Herman Cain was Black. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 16:19, 30 July 2020 (EDT)

I am not going to focus on the petty matters that some people focus on such as someone's skin pigmentation. There is a whole world out there that doesn't have anything to do with skin pigmentation.Conservative (talk) 16:48, 30 July 2020 (EDT)

If you don't vote for Biden, you're not Black. This gringo protester is more Black than the Black doctor who saved 350 lives with hydroxychloroquine. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 17:08, 30 July 2020 (EDT)
The press and many liberals/leftists focus on skin pigmentation, gayness and feminism. They are part of a weird cult. I choose not to participate in their bizarre world or focus on it. If a race war happens in the USA, I will endeavor to relocate to Northern Ireland/Ireland or the Philippines.Conservative (talk) 17:40, 30 July 2020 (EDT)
Well, you know what's going to happen? Communists will accuse Trump of murdering blacks after Cain's death, even though he wasn't Black, per Biden. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 17:45, 30 July 2020 (EDT)
America's politics is messed up. Sadly, many countries have worse governments.Conservative (talk) 17:47, 30 July 2020 (EDT)

Why is there no Wuhan virus book written by a conservative exposing the abusive influences and questionable statistics and thoroughly documenting just what the facts are, and the political motivations of why they might have been distorted? I suspect Trump focused on vaccines and abandoned treatment because there are no financial interests promoting (OH)--chloroquine, and the vaccine interests are like the "inferior man" in the Chinese oracle I quoted that Trump must publicly associate with.

In 2011, Herman Cain outlined his wanting to build a wall at the U.S.-Mexico border: "It would be about 20-feet high. It would have electrified barbed wire at the top. And on this side of it, it would have a moat ... and yes it would have alligators." VargasMilan (talk) Friday, 00:05, 31 July 2020 (EDT)

America's Declaration of Independence speaks of "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness".
Donald Trump's #1 priority is the custodian of American lives. You can't have liberty or the pursuit of happiness in this world if you are dead.
Donald Trump failed on the coronavirus because the key to beating the coronavirus pandemic is prevention. An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. And Trump failed to promote masks and social distancing in public (when it is possible to do so). He did not lead from example or stress the importance of these two things.
It is true that Trump did well on the economic liberty front (lower taxes, enterprise zones in cities, less unnecessary regulation), the educational liberty front (school choice), the prison reform front and the religious liberty front. It is also true that in terms of liberty and "pursuit of happiness" Trump does oppose political correctness which is stiflying free speech.
On the other hand, if you fail on your #1 priority which is the protection of life, you may be voted out of office. On top of this, the coronavirus has negative effect on the economy.
If Trump wins, it will be due to Biden faltering when the public has a better chance of seeing him such as the debates. Or because you can't win the presidency by hiding from the spotlight, which Biden is doing. A bunker strategy to keep you out of the limelight is unprecedented in American politics in terms of it lasting for an entire presidential campaign (not sure about any presidential campaign which may have occurred during the Spanish flu). It might not work for Biden during the end of the campaign.Conservative (talk) 09:55, 31 July 2020 (EDT)
Trump—Today: I am replacing the mayors of large Democrat-run cities where 75% of the infections are occuring with military commanders to enforce Dr. Fauci's health recommendations.
Next day: "Trump removed from office for staging a coup and endangering Chinese-ancestried Americans and Chinese nationalists by turning non-Chinese-ancestried American against them by inducing the belief they were greatly dangerous for his having taken such drastic measures!" VargasMilan (talk) Friday, 13:02, 31 July 2020 (EDT)
Also, Cain had a brush with cancer 14 years ago that likely damaged his liver. VargasMilan (talk) Friday, 17:19, 31 July 2020 (EDT)
Donald Trump’s poll approval numbers Just SURGED Pass Barack Obama’s at the same time in their respective second terms. Joe Biden Campaign Begins to IMPLODE![20]
Donald Trump is like a Timex watch. He takes a licking, but keeps on ticking. The mainstream press and academia has hammerd on him during his presidency. The Democrats have hammerd on him. He faces a coronavirus pandemic and its attendant harm to the economy.
And yet he is beating Obama at the same time during his presidency and his approval numbers are going up among likely voters.
This is incredible. This certainly shows what a weak candidate Joe Biden is and how resilient Trump's support is.Conservative (talk) 20:01, 31 July 2020 (EDT)
I have a theory. A regression to the mean from one data point. Young liberal women are buying the toxic masculinity line and think some of them have taken over the Democratic Party in the form of Antifa and BLM. They are sending a message to Democratic leadership that they approve the toxic masculinity of Trump's bumbling misunderstanding of women over the hostile environment Antifa and BLM are promoting. They will vote for Trump as an act of political protest to change the Democratic Party leadership over to officers more suitable to women. VargasMilan (talk) Friday, 20:45, 31 July 2020 (EDT)
I have some theories: 1) Many people don't like the rioting and the defund the police idea. 2) The closer we get to the election, the more odd Joe Biden hiding in his basement during a pandemic will be. It strengthens the charge that he is too frail/old to be president. 3) People are getting lockdown fatigue. I am seeing more and more people be wearing mask scofflaws. Mask fatigue is setting as many Americans tend to be independent freespirits. I think people should wear masks in public, but many people are going to do what they are going to do despite what they are advised/told to do. 4) Joe Biden keeps being pushed to the left which hurts his appeal to moderates. For example, many blue collar, Reagan Democrats type people don't like Biden approving of much of the Green New Deal. 5) Some of the Bernie Sanders populists are getting mad at the Biden campaign and deciding to vote for Trump in the 2020 campaign. Conservative (talk) 10:08, 1 August 2020 (EDT)

Breaking: Maxwell's then-teenage accused-victim claims Vice President Al Gore and his wife Tipper Gore went to Epstein's 70-acre island

Maxwell U.S. Court of Appeals petition: Vice-president Al Gore and his wife, Tipper, were also guests of Jeffrey Epstein on his island.

In a November 14, 2016 deposition, Virginia Giuffre testified as per the court reporter's notes: "Virginia disclosed that Mr. Clinton's vice president Al Gore and his wife, Tipper, were also guests of Epstein on his island."

Giuffre also denied in the same testimony earlier reporting phrases about her associations with Epstein attributed to her; that is, phrases that looked like crude attempts by Maxwell's counsel to make it seem like she had implicated President Trump as being both familiar to herself and approving of Epstein's lifestyle.

RobS regalled us with Maxwell's father being an interesting person, but her lawyer sounds like a real shyster, and that Maxwell is going to fight like a wildcat to try to shake the bad publicity surrounding her base career of pandering she apparently carried out over a greatly prolonged period in a stupefaction as a lurid personal pre-occupation and actually try to rehabilitate her reputation after her expected prison sentence.

VargasMilan (talk) Friday, 01:04, 31 July 2020 (EDT)

70 acres isn't very big. One-tenth square mile. I wonder how they laid out the landing strip for the Lolita Express? I kind of always pictured that as a full-sized jet for some reason.

Well, the flight logs were released, but it's only available in bits and pieces on Twitter. So it looks like no one released the whole list on other news outlets. I think no one wants to be the first to do it, and those with the accounts on Twitter (unless they have millions of followers) who do are shooting themselves in the foot! They become the object of the enragement of celebrities and financially profit nothing! VargasMilan (talk) Friday, 01:49, 31 July 2020 (EDT)

They took helicopters and boats from the airstrip. Maxwell even was trying to get a helicopter pilot license.
I don't like these leaks; it could be an effort from within the prosecution or defense to affect the outcome of litigation.
Most people believe she'll cop a plea to finger higher-ups; but it'll be difficult to get Prince Andrew and other powerful foreign figures of his ilk. That's why the Gore leak looks suspicious, especially since there's no allegations of impropriety yet. They may have given up on foreigners already and are starting with high-profile Americans. It would be interesting to look at Al & Tipper's divorce laid against a timeline of when this happened. If memory serves right, Al was accused of sexual assault ("you crazed little sex poodle") 30 days after the press release of their separation (she knew it was coming).
Roger Stone is good source on this kind of dirt. He says Epstein & Maxwell basically were free-lancers, working alternatively for various clients, such as Mossad, CIA, etc or even private clients to set honeytraps, frame, and blackmail people. Some of it they probably even did on their own. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 02:29, 31 July 2020 (EDT)
No, no, no, no. You're getting mixed up. The stuff at the top including the Al Gore memory were court documents that were sealed by elitists by means of which were trying to establish a two-tier justice system. But Ann Coulter just reported on them to her two-million followers and linked to the released documents to get people to help share the blame!
The stuff at the bottom are public records, but the number and power of the celebrities are so great that you're in danger of getting whacked just like Epstein was. VargasMilan (talk) Friday, 02:52, 31 July 2020 (EDT)
From what you say, it sounds like Al had some kind of psychotic reaction. That's too bad. VargasMilan (talk) Friday, 03:14, 31 July 2020 (EDT)
The Gore divorce was effectively covered up. The escapades evidently occurred sometime before the announcement. Then came the announcement of the divorce. Then the announcement of sexual assault charges. An orderly process. Now, more than a decade later, I don't ever recall hearing how it was settled.
Tipper actually was the money in the family. She had $350 million. He didn't have half of that when they came out of he White House. She probably didn't want to pay his blackmail money.
And the divorce likely wasn't pathological; it may have never occurred if she had been First Lady at the time. But Bush v. Gore allowed them vacation time at Little Saint James (the airstrip was at Big Saint James). RobSTrump 2Q2Q 10:24, 31 July 2020 (EDT)
Maybe this is what's behind the Portland riots; they are trying to burn down the cop shop to destroy the original police report. [21] RobSTrump 2Q2Q 10:32, 31 July 2020 (EDT)
I was about to report here that the mob was reported to be assualting the Portland federal building in hopes of destroying criminal records and enlisting convicts as mercenaries for their cause. Instead they played right into Trump's hands, and the worst offenders got stuck like flypaper there without realizing they were now committing federal crimes. Meanwhile the federal non-Defense Department military inside weren't trapped, but pretty much just clocking in each day helping effect the arrests!
Ann Coulter has lost her mind. The quondam most logical woman in the world read the details of the unsealed court records that were released, and she misreported the scheme perpetrated by Maxwell's shyster attorney to plant false testimony against Trump by not mentioning that Guiffre refuted the details of the transparent scheme in her deposition in the same stack of records.
This was the testimony made-up from whole cloth reported by Ann Coulter that Maxwell's shyster lawyer placed in Guiffre's mouth: "Donald Trump was aiso a good friend of Jeffreys. He didn't partake in sex with any of us but he flirted with me. He'd laugh and tell Jeffrey, 'You've got the life.'"
This was Guiffre's testimony:

Q All right. What's inaccurate about the last statement on that page.

A "Donald Trump was also a good friend of Jeffrey's." That part is true.

[That turned out to be hearsay from Jeffrey Epstein. VM]

A (cont'd) "He didn't partake in any" of — "any sex with any of us but he flirted with me." It's true that he didn't partake in any sex with us, and but it's not true that he flirted with me.

Then the next sentence is, "He'd laugh and tell Jeffrey, 'you've got the life'" I never said that to her [Maxwell VM].

Q When you say, "He didn't partake in any sex with any of us," who is "us"?

A Girls. Just—

Q How do you know who Donald Trump — Trump had sex with?

A Oh, I didn't physically see him have sex with any of the girls, so I can't say who he had sex with in his whole life or not, but I just know it wasn't with me when I was with the other girls.

Q And who were the other girls that you were with in Donald Trump's presence?

A None. There — I worked for Donald Trump, and I've met him probably a few times.

Q When have you met him?

A At Mar-a-Lago. My dad and him, I wouldn't say they were friends, but my dad knew him and they would talk all the time — well, not all the time but when they saw each other.

Q Have you ever been in Donald Trump and Jeffrey Epstein's presence with one another?

A No.

Q What is the basis for your statement that Donald Trump is a good friend of Jeffery's?

A Jeffrey told me that Donald Trump is a good friend of his.

Q But you never observed them together?

A No, not that I can actually remember. I mean, not off the top of my head, no.

Q When did Donald Trump flirt with you?

A He didn't. That's what's inaccurate.

Q Did you ever see Donald Trump at Jeffrey's home?

A Not that I can remember.

Q On his island?

A No, not that I can remember.

Q In New Mexico?

A No, not that I can remember.

Q In New York?

A Not that I can remember.

VargasMilan (talk) Friday, 14:14, 31 July 2020 (EDT)

My take [in hopes to develop a narrative]. Epstein owned a condo at Mar-e-Lago, his onshore residence when not at Little St. James. Epstein used the Mar-e-Lago condo for two purpose: (1) to consort with new powerful, influential blackmail prospects, perhaps even Trump himself, for which if successful, Epstein could end up owning a portion of Mar-e-Lago; also as a rendezvous point for existing blackmail clients to hop on the Lolita Express for a trip to Fantasy Island. And (2) recruitment of new girls, such as Giuffre.
When Trump found out about Epstein recruiting Giuffre out of Mar-e-Lago, he banned Epstein from the complex (and likely refunded his money). Trump then needed to protect both his personnel reputation and the business reputation of Mar-e-Lago (we know had had presidential aspirations at this time as well).
His relation with Epstein changed at this point, c. 2008. We know he flew on the Lolita Express once, which likely can be explained as part of the business relationship before 2008 when he sold Epstein the condo. After Epstein's conviction and Giuffre's initial allegations, Trump turned the relationship around to use to his advantage: he knew about the suspicions of Bill Clinton (which likely could even be the source of Roger Stone's extensive documentation in the 2015 book, Clinton's War on Women). Trump knew the Mueller FBI and local authorities did nothing, i.e. Deep State corruption, for the rape of his former 15 year old employee. These events likely gave Trump further impetus to run for president (it also explains stiff opposition from the "establishment", i.e. Epstein's blackmail clients). The attorney for Giuffre and other victims says Trump was the only one willing to help with information, cause the local authorities, feds, and media refused to investigate.
To me it appears that while Trump had long standing ambitions to run for president, what happened to Giuffre affected him personally and threatened his business, and had a huge impact on his determination to strike back at the corrupt establishment and its facilitators. He knew this corruption went well beyond the President of the United States Bill Clinton, his apologists and defenders in media, Hollywood, and the elite donor class.
When the final bios are written a decade from now, I believe you'll see the recruitment and rape of a 15 year old employee of his by a confidential informant of Robert Mueller brought a sense of outrage and responsibility out of him to stand up do what he could to make things right. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 15:46, 31 July 2020 (EDT)

Suburban "protests"

Summary of MPR-linked story: Certain Antifa broke ranks and charged into the suburbs of Ukaipa, California, seeking the glory of becoming the vanguard. A group of four struck at a gas station/food mart, but were rebuffed. They attacked again with even less success, and this time one of the defenders took a black Antifa shirt from an Antifan as a souvenir. That Antifan notified the group the defender was in that that was a form of oppression. The Antifan group had had enough and walked back to Los Angeles. VargasMilan (talk) Friday, 20:20, 31 July 2020 (EDT)

I was looking at the Portland suburban protests. The Ukaipa protest may be a few weeks old. yet to getting reporting over the past month of riots in small towns which have occurred across the country. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 20:58, 31 July 2020 (EDT)

Trump's polling: We've seen it all before

Trump is now at 42 percent favorable and 56 percent unfavorable. That's a net favorability of -14, which sounds horrible. But on July 29, 2016, Trump was at -25 percent.[22] Given what happened in the Iowa and New Hampshire primaries, there is reason to believe that the polls dramatically overstate the actual level of support that Biden enjoys. PeterKa (talk) 10:22, 1 August 2020 (EDT)

According to the matchup numbers in the battlegrounds, Hillary was 2.3 percentage points ahead at this point in 2016, compared to 5.5 points for Biden now. See "Top Battlegrounds (2020 vs. 2016): Pennsylvania, Michigan, Wisconsin, Florida, North Carolina, Arizona." Check out Breitbart: "Poll: Trump Takes Lead over Biden" PeterKa (talk) 05:04, 3 August 2020 (EDT)
With the coronavirus situation happening and the effects it has on the economy (Plus the fact that the Biden-Trump debates have not happened), it's a bad idea to speculate about the 2020 presidential election at this point in time. It's still too early.Conservative (talk) 07:10, 3 August 2020 (EDT)

Patriot uprising on the South of Chile, is this the start of a Civil War?

Main article: Terrorism in the South of Chile and Argentina

On July 2020 left-wing political activists took over multiple municipalities on the Araucanía Region.

Video: --Capitalist.Chile (talk) 15:22, 2 August 2020 (EDT)

Events in Chile seem to be anticipating those in the US. Chile was a prosperous, stable democracy until protests started in October. A million people came out to protest a subway fare hike, 5 percent of the entire population. One hundred and twenty Walmarts were burned and looted.[23] All this was triggered by a 3 percent fare increase! Attention soon shifted from Santiago subway fares to the Chilean constitution. A constitutional referendum is scheduled for October. The current constitution is supposedly tainted by the fact that it was issued in by a military government back in 1980, much as ours is supposedly tainted by slavery. But the Chilean constitution is apparently not that difficult to amend. In fact, it has been amended over 30 times since 1980. The militaristic provisions were removed long ago. Pinochet's two-party system has been replaced by proportional representation. One remaining objection is that there are some supermajority requirements to protect the free market economy. Like the left in Chile, the Obama is using the riots to push a proposal to eliminate the filibuster, American's version of a supermajority requirement. PeterKa (talk) 04:12, 3 August 2020 (EDT)
The next steps after eliminating the filibuster and lowering the voting age is assassination of Supreme Court Justices. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 16:57, 3 August 2020 (EDT)
Yes, the events are very similar and the "indigenist" cause will be spread on the US as well.--Capitalist.Chile (talk) 18:30, 3 August 2020 (EDT)
U.S. Senator John McCain became a liberal hero in 2005 by joining the Gang of 14 in order to save the filibuster. Think of the amazing double funeral he got. Now he'd be just another "Jim Crow relic." In short, Obama reversed an entrenched position of the Democratic Party just by flinging out a nonsensical Jim Crow reference.
Why would Chile's protests anticipate those of the U.S? Is Venezuela, Soros, or whoever using Chile as a testing ground? PeterKa (talk) 00:15, 4 August 2020 (EDT)
In America we'd call them mestizos or mulattos (the Yellow Rose of Texas incidentally was a mulatta). RobSTrump 2Q2Q 01:58, 4 August 2020 (EDT)
Taos, New Mexico incidentally had a slave market long before whites ever showed up. Mestizos, or half Spanish half Indian, weren't wanted by either tribe and were sold to both. Kidnappings were common to bring them to market. So slavery wasn't invented by whites, it wasn't confined to blacks, and it was Angelo takeover of the Spanish Empire that put a stop to it. But try and tell that to some punk kid today or communist public school teacher and see what happens. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 02:07, 4 August 2020 (EDT)
Spanish people are. overwhelmingly, white Europeans, more so in the sixteenth century. Which brings me back to my point about Conservapedia's presentation of Europe...Rafael (talk) 11:58, 4 August 2020 (EDT)
That's a problem with Democrat identity politics; Latinos are Conquistadors - they never were slaves. Yet Democrats want them to forget their heritage and become part of the oppressed masses. The only basis for this is an appeal to them as victims of anti-Catholicism, which the atheist Marxists promoting this hate and division are themselves some of the biggest offenders. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 12:33, 4 August 2020 (EDT)
By Latino, I assume you mean central and south American hispanics. The social history of the region is fascinating because of the intermarriage of many indigenous people with the colonists, Spanish and Portuguese. In many countries, there was also intermarriage with slaves. Bottom line: south and central American hispanics are not the same as Spanish.
As for the Catholicism thing, maybe User:Conservative can correct me but the biggest growth in Latin America is among evangelicals and has been for decadesRafael (talk) 18:09, 5 August 2020 (EDT)

Ratioed tweets

How can someone start out so confidently and appealing to the interest of thinkers who pay attention to the topics of the day and yet end up so entirely missing the point? I don't know, but Twitter sure will tell you when it happens:

I'm not defending what Elliot Rodger did, but he was a lonely guy and women did treat him unfairly.—Bradley
I've read a lot of snarky stuff about Paul Ryan. But he ran honestly, beating the drum of his belief in tax cuts and a complete reimagination of the social safety net as something much smaller. He didn't hide. He put his ideas on paper and articulated them. There's honor in that.—Jonathan Allen
I happen to believe that hockey is violent. Canada also does not have roads so I am not shocked by this "accident" however I still give prayers.—Jennifer Mayers
I wish this were shocking...a sharia adherent Muslim (aka jihadi) at my plane as I head to AZ to speak at the Western Conservative Conference.—John Guandolo
Some people I admire see today's student mobbism as an outbreak of an ersatz religion, but I'd say their theory of social change is at least comprehensible given the era they inhabit.—David Brooks
I will kill any tax legislation that benefits @Delta unless the company changes its position and fully reinstates its position with @NRA. Corporations cannot attack conservatives and expect us not to fight back.—Casey Cagle
Woman puts up baby for adoption, he grows up to be a violent young man who will spend the rest of his life in prison for a mass murder. Tell me more about how abortions are wrong. #Florida #ParklandSchoolShooting—Hoodie Rebecca
I think it's super weird how people are blaming their diminished sense of well-being on the Trump administration. Personal events determine my quality of life; not who's in the WH.—Paige W. Cunningham
Snappy, alliterative, essentially true—President Trump had coined another one. For the first time, the target of his executive nicknaming was one of his own: "Sloppy Steve" Bannon, his ousted strategist.—NYT National News
Today, the FCC freed the Internet from public utility-style regulation to encourage investment and innovation.—FCC

VargasMilan (talk) Monday, 16:44, 3 August 2020 (EDT)

What determines whether a claim to some property (in the broadest sense) is a natural right?

I have a working theory that I use, that I haven't examined in a while. Like me, you've probably reversed a political opinion you've once held, like I did about world government. I didn't know that the United Nations was first chaired by the American communist infiltrator, Alger Hiss. I learned that when Conservative (the user) featured the Alger Hiss article on Main Page Left.

Well, when I first advanced the theory 29 years ago on a discussion board, I was shouted down and scorned. Later, I used it once on a different discussion board to solve a political puzzle someone had posed but without mentioning it in the form of a proposition. He wasn't sure I had the right answer, but he was very surprised, left and never came back!

Conservatives maintain strongly natural rights come from God not distributed out by a government, but how do we determine what is a natural right? VargasMilan (talk) Monday, 18:29, 3 August 2020 (EDT)

Hiss didn't just chair the meeting, he authored the UN Charter, which is still the basis of much international law - written by a Stalinist.
Property is basically an extension of one's labor. For example, a person who builds their own log cabin home. They cut the trees, haul the wood, lumber it, and nail it together. A person who burns down the home didn't just destroy property, they stole time or years of life of the builder. The crime is equal to, or worse than, enslavement, approaching murder (the thief cometh to kill and destroy).
In a monied society, currency represents the labor of workers. Inflation steals their labor and transfers it to others. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 18:48, 3 August 2020 (EDT)
Let's talk about the labor theory and then get back to the other threads you started.
Yahoo! had a news service that treated conservatives abusively and consequently through their efforts earned about a million dollars in ill-will by the public. It was an extension of labor, but do we have a natural right to ill-will that the government should take positive steps to help everybody attain? VargasMilan (talk) Monday, 19:04, 3 August 2020 (EDT)
(ec) Walter O. Williams says 'slavery is a moral crime because it interferes with property rights'. What are those property rights? To labor to feed yourself, through working the land or by barter and exchange, not by theft. These are natural rights.
Trade unionists back in the day often said, "everybody has a right to eat"; Marxists today claim "healthcare is a right". Food and healthcare are produced by labor. Nobody has the right to another person's labor (or property, the same thing). That is a violation of natural rights. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 19:11, 3 August 2020 (EDT)
In the illustration of the builder of the log cabin, let's say it took 2 years of extensive labor to build it. Then another 2 years to replace it. That's a loss of four years enjoyment of the fruit of his labor. He could have easily spent the 2 years or 4 years in some otter pursuit that maybe gave him more enjoyment or profit. Would 8 or 12 years of equal value compensation satisfy the debt of loss to his life? RobSTrump 2Q2Q 19:25, 3 August 2020 (EDT)
You are talking about the right of compensation for opportunity cost, am I correct? VargasMilan (talk) Monday, 20:10, 3 August 2020 (EDT)
Yes, that's one way of stating ot. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 20:11, 3 August 2020 (EDT)
Everyone knows Lincoln started the Gettysburg Address with "Four score and seven years ago", a pretty exact number since the founding of the nation, almost as though as he were conveying impatience. VargasMilan (talk) Monday, 20:14, 3 August 2020 (EDT)
(ec) Let's say the victim is age 40 at the time of settlement, with a remaining 38 years life expectancy. Let's say he's doubled his compensation of 8 years. The settlement doesn't really compensate for the portion of his life he has to enjoy the fruit of his labor, neither does it take into consideration the decades it took him to acquire the skills. In sum, the point I am really making is the violation of natural rights, be it theft, arson, or even excess taxation, is no small matter that has a huge, unfair impact on the life of the victim that's almost incalculable. We live in society today where governments, political parties, ideologies, and the educational systems venerates impingement on natural rights - the simple basic human right to labor and feed oneself without stealing or violating other people's natural rights. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 20:23, 3 August 2020 (EDT)
Gretchen Whitmer would not allow the purchase of seeds for backyard vegetable gardens in the spring planting season during lockdown. This is Holodomor 2.0. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 20:38, 3 August 2020 (EDT)
Ha-ha Rob, Rob don't you know the difference between per se and per accidere? They just didn't want anyone lingering or dawdling in the supermarket. It reminds me of that opera, though: The Useless Precaution.
Maybe you remember when a New York City mayor issued orders restricting the size of Big Gulp soda drinks sold at convenience stores. The hue and cry was on every conservative radio and TV talk show and editorial column.
But the government has always been making those exceptions if you can extrapolate from two data points.
Did you know who was the first person to try to regulate the food of New Yorkers? It was Thomas Jefferson. Government established among men to secure "Life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness" Jefferson? Yes, and I can prove it.
1807: Blood was soon shed, but Jefferson did not shrink. The new army was stationed along the Canada frontier. The gunboats and frigates patrolled the coast. On every side dangers and difficulties accumulated. "I did not expect a crop of so sudden and rank growth of fraud and open opposition by force could have grown up in the United States." At Newburyport an armed mob on the wharf prevented the custom-house officers from detaining a vessel about to sail. The collectors and other officers were ill-disposed, or were harassed by suits at law for illegal detentions. Rebellion and disunion stared Jefferson in the face, but only caused him to challenge an outbreak and to invite violence.
"That the Federalists may attempt insurrection is possible," he wrote to Gallatin, "and also that the governor would sink before it; but the Republican part of the State, and that portion of the Federalists who approve the embargo in their judgments, and at any rate would not court mob law, would crush it in embryo. I have some time ago written to General Dearborn to be on the alert on such an occasion, and to take direction of the public authority on the spot. Such an incident will rally the whole body of Republicans of every shade to a single point,—that of supporting the public authority."
The Federalists knew when to rebel. Jefferson could teach them little on that subject. They meant first to overthrow Jefferson himself, and were in a fair way to gratify their wish; for the people of New England—Republican and Federalist alike—were rapidly rallying to common hatred of the President. As winter approached, the struggle between Jefferson and Massachusetts became on both sides vindictive. He put whole communities under his ban. He stopped the voyage of every vessel "in which any person is concerned, either in interest or in navigating her, who has ever been concerned in interest or in the navigation of a vessel which has at any time before entered a foreign port contrary to the views of the embargo laws, and under any pretended distress or duress whatever." When a permit was asked for the schooner Caroline of Buckstown on the Penobscot, Jefferson replied,—
"This is the first time that the character of the place has been brought under consideration as an objection. Yet a general disobedience to the laws in any place must have weight toward refusing to give them any facilities to evade. In such a case we may fairly require positive proof that the individual of a town tainted with a general spirit of disobedience has never said or done anything himself to countenance that spirit."
Jefferson went still further in his reply to a petition from the island of Nantucket for food. "Our opinion here is that that place has been so deeply concerned in smuggling, that if it wants it is because it has illegally sent away what it ought to have retained for its own consumption."
Of all the old Republican arguments for a policy of peace, the commonest was that a standing army would be dangerous, not to foreign enemies, but to popular liberties; yet the first use of the new army and gunboats was against fellow-citizens. New England was chiefly controlled by the navy; but in New York the army was needed and was employed. Open insurrection existed there. Besides forcible resistance offered to the law, no one was ignorant that the collectors shut their eyes to smuggling, and that juries, in defiance of court and President, refused to indict rioters. Governor Tompkins announced that Oswego was in active insurrection, and called on the President to issue a proclamation to that effect. Jefferson replied by offering to take into the United States service the militia required to suppress the riots, and begged Governor Tompkins to lead his troops in person. "I think it so important in example to crush these audacious proceedings and to make the offenders feel the consequences of individuals daring to oppose a law by force, that no effort should be spared to compass this object."
When permission was asked to establish a packet on Lake Champlain, "I do not think this is a time," replied Jefferson, "for opening new channels of intercourse with Canada and multiplying the means of smuggling." The people who lived on the shores of Lake Champlain might object to such interference in their affairs, but could not deny the force of Jefferson's reasoning. Another application of a different kind was rejected on grounds that seemed to give to the President general supervision over the diet of the people:—
"The declaration of the bakers of New York that their citizens will be dissatisfied, under the present circumstances of their country, to eat bread of the flour of their own State, is equally a libel on the produce and citizens of the State. . . . If this prevails, the next application will be for vessels to go to New York for the pippins of that State, because they are higher flavored than the same species of apples growing in other States."


"I mean generally to express an opinion," continued the [Treasury] secretary [Gallatin], "founded on the experience of this summer, that Congress must either invest the Executive with the most arbitrary powers and sufficient force to carry the embargo into effect, or give it up altogether." That Jefferson should permit a member of his Cabinet to suggest the assumption of "the most arbitrary powers;" that he should tolerate the idea of using means "equally dangerous and odious,"—seemed incredible; but his reply showed no sign of offence. He instantly responded,—
"I am satisfied with you that if Orders and Decrees are not repealed, and a continuance of the embargo is preferred to war (which sentiment is universal here), Congress must legalize all means which may be necessary to obtain its end."
A person, through little or no fault of their own, may not be able to earn much from their honest endeavors. Do claims to the properties (broadly speaking) having to do with natural rights really come from labor then?
VargasMilan (talk) Monday, 23:43, 3 August 2020 (EDT)
That was a tariff issue, not an interstate commerce issue. He was putting America First and protecting the jobs of American farmers from Canadian contraband smugglers. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 23:53, 3 August 2020 (EDT)
Well...the embargo had to do with England and France, opponents in the Napoleonic wars, forcing America to only buy from them, and Jefferson retaliating by embargoing their whole countries. That caused quite a depression and cost the livelihoods of thousands of otherwise law-abiding people. VargasMilan (talk) Tuesday, 00:09, 4 August 2020 (EDT)
Is this some of the background issues related to the War of 1812 after he Jefferson left office? In GDP terms, the 1812 War is estimated to be the most expensive war in U.S. history. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 11:18, 4 August 2020 (EDT)
I didn't know that! I'm sure Great Britain insisting the United States and other free nations only buy from her ships when they bought cargo during the start of the Napoleonic Wars didn't help in what led up to the War of 1812. Meanwhile, though, the French wouldn't let anybody visit past the English Channel to trade. VargasMilan (talk) Wednesday, 13:17, 5 August 2020 (EDT)
It has to also be borne in mind that before the income tax, customs and tariffs were by far the primary source of revenue for the federal government. Tax evasion, i.e. smuggling, is a direct challenge to the legitimacy of government. The only direct taxation on the American people from the feds in those days was alcohol, tobacco, and firearms. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 16:12, 5 August 2020 (EDT)
And the excerpt above is very interesting indeed - relevant to today. I hope to God it isn't Howard Zinn. Who's the source? It gets more interesting on the 3rd, 4th, and 5th reading. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 16:19, 5 August 2020 (EDT)
Thank you! It was by none other than Henry Adams, grandson of John Quincy Adams. He was an Adams descendant, but wrote long books on Thomas Jefferson and James Madison. Go figure. His father was the American ambassador to Great Britain during the Civil War (He famously said, "You realize, this means war"). He finished History of the United States during the Presidency of Thomas Jefferson (1801-1809) in 1890 and History of the United States during the Presidency of James Madison (1809-1817) in 1891.
Library of America hates me. I put the Jefferson volume on the internet, and they responded by boasting about having the last redaction of the footnotes and lowering the price of the Jefferson volume to two dollars less than the Madison volume. VargasMilan (talk) Wednesday, 22:08, 5 August 2020 (EDT)
As to the War of 1812, maybe I spoke a little too soon; but here's the source and note the fineprint:
the War of 1812 cost about $1.6 billion in today’s prices, which appears, by contemporary standards, to be a relatively small amount. But using commonly available estimates of gross domestic product, the overall U.S. economy 192 years ago was less than 1/1,400th as large as it is now. So at the peak of the conflict in 1813, the war consumed more than 2% of the nation’s measurable economic output, the equivalent of more than $300 billion today.
Now take the $300 billion figure, compress that cost in the span of a year and some months, and compare it to every other war since, some that dragged on 4, 10, or 19 years. 1812 appears to be no small war as often characterized, and a tremendous amount of effort was expended in a relatively short span of time, comparatively.
One last observation from the reading: Unless the revenue from tariffs on imported flour, apples, and other foodstuffs could support a standing army to be used against citizens and foreign enemies, the government had no legitimacy or sovereignty. That's kind of the way capitalism works. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 16:45, 5 August 2020 (EDT)

RobS, this is a serious question—the Conservapedia Natural rights article is practically empty! VargasMilan (talk) Tuesday, 01:11, 4 August 2020 (EDT)
I'd have to do some reading and research, but if you want to get the ball rolling, I'll be happy to fill in where I can. We definitely need a property rights article which can spin off. RobSTrump 2Q2Q 01:35, 4 August 2020 (EDT)
I started doing the Socratic question thing because I thought that's what you wanted me to do. Evidently not! Since it's a mainstay of classical liberalism, I wondered if other conservatives had an opinion because, like I implied, I wanted to know if my opinion were way out in left field, and if so, I might be able to correct it and either way, would be able to help educate others.
I also randomly read something in John Stuart Mill this week where he said words like possible, depending on, necessarily, and their opposites had to do with confidence in the truth of propositions and strictly speaking not of things independent of ideas. This was related to the answer I read once and maintained lo these many years. VargasMilan (talk) Tuesday, 04:49, 4 August 2020 (EDT)
I understand an opposite to "natural" is "acquired" as in "acquired right". I think that's the opposite I mean as contradistinction. VargasMilan (talk) Tuesday, 04:54, 4 August 2020 (EDT)
But then again, an opposite of "right" is "privilege", so maybe the opposite I mean of "natural right" is "acquired privilege". VargasMilan (talk) Tuesday, 04:59, 4 August 2020 (EDT)
My ideas are more precise than they sound; I just want to give general ideas of where I'm going with this. VargasMilan (talk) Tuesday, 06:02, 4 August 2020 (EDT)

Running Mate Pick

Is there a typographical error? Did MPR mean "Michelle" rather than "Michael"? Thanks, FirstAmendment (talk) 15:40, 4 August 2020 (EDT)