https://conservapedia.com/api.php?action=feedcontributions&feedformat=atom&user=Phillipps 2026-06-18T09:05:39Z User contributions MediaWiki 1.24.2 https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User:Phillipps&diff=573041 2008-11-30T03:43:28Z

<p>Phillipps: /* Fine tuning of the Universe */</p> <hr /> <div>{{User Evo}}<br /> <br /> {{User evolutionScience}}<br /> <br /> {{User Political Compass|-3.00|-4.56}}<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> I am Canadian (and proud of it). I love classical music and sushi (and cheesecake for that matter). Nothing is better than a good book. I am extremely interested in history and science.<br /> I have been to:<br /> :The United States (Florida, Washington D.C., Boston)<br /> :Canada (born there)<br /> :England (lived there)<br /> :France<br /> :Belguim<br /> :Italy<br /> :The Cayman Islands (lived there)<br /> :Egypt<br /> :The Bahamas<br /> :The Dominican Republic<br /> <br /> I have always wanted to visit Germany (beautiful country) and Poland which has the last old growth forest (over several thousand years old, and funnily enough protected by Hermann Göring) left on the Eurasian plain.<br /> <br /> I have always wanted to write what I accept as fact, so here goes:<br /> <br /> ==Atheism==<br /> I am an Atheist (I suppose technically an Agnostic). <br /> ===Why===<br /> The burden of proof is on the one who asserts that something exists (ie Russel's Teapot) and I have not heard any sufficiently persuasive arguments (but there are many) for the existence of God. However, it is possible (since we cannot prove a universal negative, unless we go everywhere) that somewhere in the universe there might be a god. <br /> ===Morality===<br /> I think that an Atheist can still be moral even though they do no believe in God (or gods). There are two arguments that I have found that are very good for this:<br /> 1. Reciprocation<br /> I do not want to be robbed, murdered, cheated, etc., so why should I do the same to others? If we all did what was good only for ourselves this would happen: <br /> :1. General stealing (great gain for the individual)<br /> :2. Revenge against the stealer (to get the goods back, possibly murder)<br /> :3. Gradual escalation of violence until the current social and political fabric of the world collapses.<br /> :4. Survival of the fittest arises, culture and learning goes out the window.<br /> 2. For the good of society<br /> The world works because of a freedom in trade, action and thought. This allows for great scientific breakthroughs, sophisticated trading networks, etc. These only work if there is a general level of peace and security in the society as a whole. Being afraid of murder and theft (among other things) would be no help at all. This was seen during the Early Mediaeval Period (once called the Dark Ages), when, because of lawlessness and no stability, trade, both domestic and foreign, pretty much collapsed (although there was some).<br /> <br /> ===Origins of Life===<br /> Yes, it is true, I accept the Theory of Evolution as the best answer to the origin of life as we know it (ie Tree of Life). I do not think that God (or an Intelligent Designer) created some of the species, and evolution took over from there (what I like to call the orchard of life).<br /> Evolution is falsifiable (cat giving birth to a dog, humans appearing ''in solid rock'' next to dinosaurs, DNA strands that do not mutate ''at all'')<br /> <br /> ===Cambrian Explosion===<br /> One of the more misunderstood phenomena. The Cambrian Explosion was the rapid &quot;explosion&quot; of most major complex organisms about 520 MYA (millions of years ago). This is pointed out as being the spot where there God or an intelligent designer intervened because everything appeared so quickly. There are two problems with this:<br /> *1. Organisms before that had soft bodies, which don't fossilize easily<br /> *2. The &quot;explosion,&quot; we have to keep in mind, was over millions of years<br /> <br /> ===Age of the Earth===<br /> I have heard many, many claims that the Earth is only 6,000 years old, with various proofs offered (and I will not respond to all of them, yet) such as:<br /> *1. Mud on the Sea Floor<br /> *2. Winding up of the Galactic arms<br /> *3. Agriculture is too recent<br /> *4. History is too short<br /> *5. Human pop. too small<br /> *6. Too little H. Sapien skeletons<br /> *7. Comets (only last a few thousand years)<br /> *8. Too little Helium in the atmosphere<br /> *9. Fading of Earth's magnetic field, and <br /> *10. (my personal favourite) Erosion of the continents.<br /> ====Responses====<br /> *1. Plate tectonics is a wonderful thing. Mud goes down to the sea floor, eventually becomes sedimentary rock, comes back up with the rising continental plate (or goes back into the mantle)<br /> *2. Density waves have been proposed as a possible explanation for this. DW are like sound waves; areas of compression and areas of rarefaction. Stars move in and out of these waves (as do air molecules in sound waves). These density waves would also kick off star formation in there dense regions (also explaining why there are so many supernovae in the arms; there are bigger stars there).<br /> *3.+4. You really need agriculture to have civilization, as it support larger population with fewer people, so those left over can do useful things like live in cities, rule over others, etc. Some have suggested that writing was started for tax purposes (the ruler wants all he can get). The modern reader has to appreciate the fact that even conceiving of writing is a huge step in culture: the Incas didn't have it (and they were around for thousands of years). For agriculture, one could draw the analogy with moveable type for the printing press; it seems obvious now, but it took a while to come up with. While ancient man had all of the intelligence, it had none of the advances in technology and learning (all of the hardware, none of the software).<br /> *5. The human population is another one that is a bit odd. The increase in human population is accelerating: more people equal an even greater generation after (in developing countries anyway), and the massive increase in agricultural production in the 19th and 20th centuries didn't hurt.<br /> *6. This can be easily explained. Fossilization is a rare event; it takes the right conditions (dying during a volcanic eruption, during a flood or near a silty river) and it has to be buried quickly. There are so many fossils of dinosaurs because they were around for hundreds of millions of years, our earliest ancestors only about 3 million.<br /> *7. I don't quite understand this one. While individual comets don't last that long, there are a lot of them (some astronomers estimate up to 1 trillion).<br /> *8. Helium is a light gas, light enough to escape the earth's gravity through its own energy (or be blown off by the solar wind).<br /> *9. Some scientists have suggested that the earth's magnetic field is going to flip (north becomes south, and vice versa). Geologists have found evidence of this in the rocks in Hawaii (iron rocks, when cooling, preserve a record of the earth's field strength and direction).<br /> *10. This is a silly one. Creationists, when making certain claims, forget the other side of the equation. In this case, the plates constantly move, some going into the mantle, and some rise up (and give us the Himalayas, the Tibetan Plateau, and the Rocky Mountains, among others).<br /> <br /> ==Science==<br /> I do think that science is the answer to life's mysteries. Evidence and rational arguments are infinitely preferable to blind faith.<br /> ===Scientific Method===<br /> Everyone should know this.<br /> *1. Define question (ie see something and ask why? or how?, or any other related question)<br /> *2. Do research (observe phenomenon, try to find any previous work on the topic)<br /> *3. Form hypothesis (educated guess, the educated bit comes from step #2)<br /> *4. Define procedure and gather materials (what are you going to do in the experiment, and what will you be using)<br /> *5. Perform experiment and gather data (preferable many, many times)<br /> *6. Analyse data <br /> *7. Draw conclusions<br /> *8. If #7 disproved your hypothesis, redo steps #3-7<br /> *9. Publish results<br /> *10. Retest (usually by other scientists)<br /> ===Science doesn't know everything===<br /> If this were to happen, science would cease to exist. Science is all about change and new ideas as the old ones are constantly changed or thrown out. I have heard of the example of the migratory patterns of birds on this website, and how we haven't found an answer to that (thus implying that God has something to do with it). This is the whole point of science; to find out about the world. It is wrong to think that because the scientific community doesn't know something, they never will; it might just take a while.<br /> ===Fine tuning of the Universe===<br /> Frequently cited by others as proof of the existence of God (or gods). While I do agree that this does pose a problem, I think that there will be an answer. <br /> Many scientists go back to the anthropic principle (the universe is the way it is because if it were different we wouldn't be here to observe it). However, Stephen Hawking, in his excellent book ''A Brief History of Time'' talks about a GUT (Grand Unified Theory), that he thinks, once made, will give an answer to:<br /> *1. Why the universe exists in the first place, and<br /> *2. Why it developed in the way that it did.<br /> The GUT would involved &quot;quantum gravity,&quot; or something that explain what exactly goes on in a singularity (which is what the universe was once, according to the Big Bang theory) and also explain why things happened like they did when the universe was extremely small.<br /> Many things have been proposed for a GUT, more famously &quot;string theory&quot; (which is admittedly little more than extremely sophisticated guessing currently, because we don't have powerful enough machines to test it). Hopefully when the LHC particle accelerator (Large Hadron Collider) comes online in May, we will know more about the extremely small things in the universe (including the Higgs boson, which might explain why matter has mass), because of course faster speeds equal smaller bits of debris.<br /> <br /> <br /> =Logical Fallacies=<br /> My favourites<br /> *Appeal to Authority<br /> **This shouldn't be confused with putting one's trust in a scientific consensus: individual scientists can be fallible, but the scientific community, in a robust and rigorously researched field, is fairly trustworthy<br /> *Argument Ad Hominem<br /> *Straw Man<br /> *Argument from final consequences<br /> **A theory is wrong because bad things will arise from it (or is right because of good consequences). <br /> *Argument ad populum<br /> *Lottery fallacy<br /> **I haven't found the proper name for this fallacy, but it goes something like this: there are million-to-one odds for Bob winning the lottery, then he wins. The odds are so steep that there ''must'' be a conspiracy to make him win. This is obviously false; there are a million people who purchase a ticket, someone is going to win.<br /> <br /> For grades 4-7 (I skipped grade 5) I went to a private Christian school (First Baptist Christian School, in the Cayman Islands).<br /> <br /> I also happen to think that citations '''must''' be included with articles. Don't write whatever you would like and find citations in a few weeks (or expect other people to do it), or even worse, not citing it all (even after criticism).<br /> <br /> Phillipps is not my real name. He was a 19th century bibliomaniac (person who obsessively collects books) who amassed the largest private collection of manuscripts, as well as English legal books, and pretty much any other kind of book. Unfortunately he bankrupted his company doing it. It took over a century to auction off all of his books (which he endowed to the British Library, although they didn't want them)<br /> <br /> I think that the Atheism article should be balanced and ordered. I have been observing the various talk pages around Conservapedia, and I have noticed the same pattern: User suggests reform, initial acceptance by a few users, reform dies. Because of this I will attempt to reformat the &quot;Atheism&quot; article and show everyone a better alternative.</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User:Phillipps&diff=573039 2008-11-30T03:32:58Z

<p>Phillipps: /* Origins of Life */</p> <hr /> <div>{{User Evo}}<br /> <br /> {{User evolutionScience}}<br /> <br /> {{User Political Compass|-3.00|-4.56}}<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> I am Canadian (and proud of it). I love classical music and sushi (and cheesecake for that matter). Nothing is better than a good book. I am extremely interested in history and science.<br /> I have been to:<br /> :The United States (Florida, Washington D.C., Boston)<br /> :Canada (born there)<br /> :England (lived there)<br /> :France<br /> :Belguim<br /> :Italy<br /> :The Cayman Islands (lived there)<br /> :Egypt<br /> :The Bahamas<br /> :The Dominican Republic<br /> <br /> I have always wanted to visit Germany (beautiful country) and Poland which has the last old growth forest (over several thousand years old, and funnily enough protected by Hermann Göring) left on the Eurasian plain.<br /> <br /> I have always wanted to write what I accept as fact, so here goes:<br /> <br /> ==Atheism==<br /> I am an Atheist (I suppose technically an Agnostic). <br /> ===Why===<br /> The burden of proof is on the one who asserts that something exists (ie Russel's Teapot) and I have not heard any sufficiently persuasive arguments (but there are many) for the existence of God. However, it is possible (since we cannot prove a universal negative, unless we go everywhere) that somewhere in the universe there might be a god. <br /> ===Morality===<br /> I think that an Atheist can still be moral even though they do no believe in God (or gods). There are two arguments that I have found that are very good for this:<br /> 1. Reciprocation<br /> I do not want to be robbed, murdered, cheated, etc., so why should I do the same to others? If we all did what was good only for ourselves this would happen: <br /> :1. General stealing (great gain for the individual)<br /> :2. Revenge against the stealer (to get the goods back, possibly murder)<br /> :3. Gradual escalation of violence until the current social and political fabric of the world collapses.<br /> :4. Survival of the fittest arises, culture and learning goes out the window.<br /> 2. For the good of society<br /> The world works because of a freedom in trade, action and thought. This allows for great scientific breakthroughs, sophisticated trading networks, etc. These only work if there is a general level of peace and security in the society as a whole. Being afraid of murder and theft (among other things) would be no help at all. This was seen during the Early Mediaeval Period (once called the Dark Ages), when, because of lawlessness and no stability, trade, both domestic and foreign, pretty much collapsed (although there was some).<br /> <br /> ===Origins of Life===<br /> Yes, it is true, I accept the Theory of Evolution as the best answer to the origin of life as we know it (ie Tree of Life). I do not think that God (or an Intelligent Designer) created some of the species, and evolution took over from there (what I like to call the orchard of life).<br /> Evolution is falsifiable (cat giving birth to a dog, humans appearing ''in solid rock'' next to dinosaurs, DNA strands that do not mutate ''at all'')<br /> <br /> ===Cambrian Explosion===<br /> One of the more misunderstood phenomena. The Cambrian Explosion was the rapid &quot;explosion&quot; of most major complex organisms about 520 MYA (millions of years ago). This is pointed out as being the spot where there God or an intelligent designer intervened because everything appeared so quickly. There are two problems with this:<br /> *1. Organisms before that had soft bodies, which don't fossilize easily<br /> *2. The &quot;explosion,&quot; we have to keep in mind, was over millions of years<br /> <br /> ===Age of the Earth===<br /> I have heard many, many claims that the Earth is only 6,000 years old, with various proofs offered (and I will not respond to all of them, yet) such as:<br /> *1. Mud on the Sea Floor<br /> *2. Winding up of the Galactic arms<br /> *3. Agriculture is too recent<br /> *4. History is too short<br /> *5. Human pop. too small<br /> *6. Too little H. Sapien skeletons<br /> *7. Comets (only last a few thousand years)<br /> *8. Too little Helium in the atmosphere<br /> *9. Fading of Earth's magnetic field, and <br /> *10. (my personal favourite) Erosion of the continents.<br /> ====Responses====<br /> *1. Plate tectonics is a wonderful thing. Mud goes down to the sea floor, eventually becomes sedimentary rock, comes back up with the rising continental plate (or goes back into the mantle)<br /> *2. Density waves have been proposed as a possible explanation for this. DW are like sound waves; areas of compression and areas of rarefaction. Stars move in and out of these waves (as do air molecules in sound waves). These density waves would also kick off star formation in there dense regions (also explaining why there are so many supernovae in the arms; there are bigger stars there).<br /> *3.+4. You really need agriculture to have civilization, as it support larger population with fewer people, so those left over can do useful things like live in cities, rule over others, etc. Some have suggested that writing was started for tax purposes (the ruler wants all he can get). The modern reader has to appreciate the fact that even conceiving of writing is a huge step in culture: the Incas didn't have it (and they were around for thousands of years). For agriculture, one could draw the analogy with moveable type for the printing press; it seems obvious now, but it took a while to come up with. While ancient man had all of the intelligence, it had none of the advances in technology and learning (all of the hardware, none of the software).<br /> *5. The human population is another one that is a bit odd. The increase in human population is accelerating: more people equal an even greater generation after (in developing countries anyway), and the massive increase in agricultural production in the 19th and 20th centuries didn't hurt.<br /> *6. This can be easily explained. Fossilization is a rare event; it takes the right conditions (dying during a volcanic eruption, during a flood or near a silty river) and it has to be buried quickly. There are so many fossils of dinosaurs because they were around for hundreds of millions of years, our earliest ancestors only about 3 million.<br /> *7. I don't quite understand this one. While individual comets don't last that long, there are a lot of them (some astronomers estimate up to 1 trillion).<br /> *8. Helium is a light gas, light enough to escape the earth's gravity through its own energy (or be blown off by the solar wind).<br /> *9. Some scientists have suggested that the earth's magnetic field is going to flip (north becomes south, and vice versa). Geologists have found evidence of this in the rocks in Hawaii (iron rocks, when cooling, preserve a record of the earth's field strength and direction).<br /> *10. This is a silly one. Creationists, when making certain claims, forget the other side of the equation. In this case, the plates constantly move, some going into the mantle, and some rise up (and give us the Himalayas, the Tibetan Plateau, and the Rocky Mountains, among others).<br /> <br /> ==Science==<br /> I do think that science is the answer to life's mysteries. Evidence and rational arguments are infinitely preferable to blind faith.<br /> ===Scientific Method===<br /> Everyone should know this.<br /> *1. Define question (ie see something and ask why? or how?, or any other related question)<br /> *2. Do research (observe phenomenon, try to find any previous work on the topic)<br /> *3. Form hypothesis (educated guess, the educated bit comes from step #2)<br /> *4. Define procedure and gather materials (what are you going to do in the experiment, and what will you be using)<br /> *5. Perform experiment and gather data (preferable many, many times)<br /> *6. Analyse data <br /> *7. Draw conclusions<br /> *8. If #7 disproved your hypothesis, redo steps #3-7<br /> *9. Publish results<br /> *10. Retest (usually by other scientists)<br /> ===Science doesn't know everything===<br /> If this were to happen, science would cease to exist. Science is all about change and new ideas as the old ones are constantly changed or thrown out. I have heard of the example of the migratory patterns of birds on this website, and how we haven't found an answer to that (thus implying that God has something to do with it). This is the whole point of science; to find out about the world. It is wrong to think that because the scientific community doesn't know something, they never will; it might just take a while.<br /> ===Fine tuning of the Universe===<br /> Frequently cited by others as proof of the existence of God (or gods). While I do agree that this does pose a problem, I think that there will be an answer. <br /> Many scientists go back to the anthropic principle (the universe is the way it is because if it were different we wouldn't be here to observe it). However, Stephen Hawking, in his excellent book ''A Brief History of Time'' talks about a GUT (Grand Unified Theory), that he thinks, once made, will give an answer to:<br /> *1. Why the universe exists in the first place, and<br /> *2. Why it developed in the way that it did.<br /> The GUT would involved &quot;quantum gravity,&quot; or something that explain what exactly goes on in a singularity (which is what the universe was once, according to the Big Bang theory) and also explain why things happened like they did when the universe was extremely small.<br /> Many things have been proposed for a GUT, more famously &quot;string theory&quot; (which is admittedly little more than extremely sophisticated guessing currently, because we don't have powerful enough machines to test it). Hopefully when the LHC particle accelerator (Large Hadron Collider) comes online in May, we will know more about the extremely small things in the universe (including the Higgs boson, which might explain why matter has mass), because of course faster speeds equal smaller bits of debris.<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> For grades 4-7 (I skipped grade 5) I went to a private Christian school (First Baptist Christian School, in the Cayman Islands).<br /> <br /> I also happen to think that citations '''must''' be included with articles. Don't write whatever you would like and find citations in a few weeks (or expect other people to do it), or even worse, not citing it all (even after criticism).<br /> <br /> Phillipps is not my real name. He was a 19th century bibliomaniac (person who obsessively collects books) who amassed the largest private collection of manuscripts, as well as English legal books, and pretty much any other kind of book. Unfortunately he bankrupted his company doing it. It took over a century to auction off all of his books (which he endowed to the British Library, although they didn't want them)<br /> <br /> I think that the Atheism article should be balanced and ordered. I have been observing the various talk pages around Conservapedia, and I have noticed the same pattern: User suggests reform, initial acceptance by a few users, reform dies. Because of this I will attempt to reformat the &quot;Atheism&quot; article and show everyone a better alternative.</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=Talk:Punctuated_Equilibrium&diff=417834 2008-03-31T21:00:38Z

<p>Phillipps: </p> <hr /> <div>== ernst mayr and hopeful monster ==<br /> <br /> Here is something I found:<br /> <br /> &quot;But Gould’s views irritated the crusty, ninety-year-old Mayr, his Harvard colleague. In an interview, Mayr described Gould’s hopeful monster concept as “total rot,” “a lead balloon,” and “a red herring” (Rennie, p. 25).&quot; [http://www.christiancourier.com/articles/read/those_missing_links] [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 17:31, 15 June 2007 (EDT)<br /> <br /> ==Punctuated Equilibrium==<br /> There was very little here, and misrepresented the theory, so I added what it actually says, instead of an oversimplification.--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 17:00, 31 March 2008 (EDT)</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User:Phillipps&diff=417778 2008-03-31T19:19:07Z

<p>Phillipps: /* Fine tuning of the Universe */</p> <hr /> <div>{{User Evo}}<br /> <br /> {{User evolutionScience}}<br /> <br /> {{User Political Compass|-3.00|-4.56}}<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> I am Canadian (and proud of it). I love classical music and sushi (and cheesecake for that matter). Nothing is better than a good book. I am extremely interested in history and science.<br /> I have been to:<br /> :The United States (Florida, Washington D.C., Boston)<br /> :Canada (born there)<br /> :England (lived there)<br /> :France<br /> :Belguim<br /> :Italy<br /> :The Cayman Islands (lived there)<br /> :Egypt<br /> :The Bahamas<br /> :The Dominican Republic<br /> <br /> I have always wanted to visit Germany (beautiful country) and Poland which has the last old growth forest (over several thousand years old, and funnily enough protected by Hermann Göring) left on the Eurasian plain.<br /> <br /> I have always wanted to write what I accept as fact, so here goes:<br /> <br /> ==Atheism==<br /> I am an Atheist (I suppose technically an Agnostic). <br /> ===Why===<br /> The burden of proof is on the one who asserts that something exists (ie Russel's Teapot) and I have not heard any sufficiently persuasive arguments (but there are many) for the existence of God. However, it is possible (since we cannot prove a universal negative, unless we go everywhere) that somewhere in the universe there might be a god. <br /> ===Morality===<br /> I think that an Atheist can still be moral even though they do no believe in God (or gods). There are two arguments that I have found that are very good for this:<br /> 1. Reciprocation<br /> I do not want to be robbed, murdered, cheated, etc., so why should I do the same to others? If we all did what was good only for ourselves this would happen: <br /> :1. General stealing (great gain for the individual)<br /> :2. Revenge against the stealer (to get the goods back, possibly murder)<br /> :3. Gradual escalation of violence until the current social and political fabric of the world collapses.<br /> :4. Survival of the fittest arises, culture and learning goes out the window.<br /> 2. For the good of society<br /> The world works because of a freedom in trade, action and thought. This allows for great scientific breakthroughs, sophisticated trading networks, etc. These only work if there is a general level of peace and security in the society as a whole. Being afraid of murder and theft (among other things) would be no help at all. This was seen during the Early Mediaeval Period (once called the Dark Ages), when, because of lawlessness and no stability, trade, both domestic and foreign, pretty much collapsed (although there was some).<br /> <br /> ===Origins of Life===<br /> Yes, it is true, I accept Darwinian Evolution (or the Theory of Evolution, or, as I like to call it, the TOE) as the best answer to the origin of life as we know it (ie Tree of Life). I do not think that God (or an Intelligent Designer) created some of the species, and evolution took over from there (what I like to call the orchard of life).<br /> Evolution is falsifiable (cat giving birth <br /> <br /> ===Cambrian Explosion===<br /> One of the more misunderstood phenomena. The Cambrian Explosion was the rapid &quot;explosion&quot; of most major complex organisms about 520 MYA (millions of years ago). This is pointed out as being the spot where there God or an intelligent designer intervened because everything appeared so quickly. There are two problems with this:<br /> *1. Organisms before that had soft bodies, which don't fossilize easily<br /> *2. The &quot;explosion,&quot; we have to keep in mind, was over millions of years<br /> <br /> ===Age of the Earth===<br /> I have heard many, many claims that the Earth is only 6,000 years old, with various proofs offered (and I will not respond to all of them, yet) such as:<br /> *1. Mud on the Sea Floor<br /> *2. Winding up of the Galactic arms<br /> *3. Agriculture is too recent<br /> *4. History is too short<br /> *5. Human pop. too small<br /> *6. Too little H. Sapien skeletons<br /> *7. Comets (only last a few thousand years)<br /> *8. Too little Helium in the atmosphere<br /> *9. Fading of Earth's magnetic field, and <br /> *10. (my personal favourite) Erosion of the continents.<br /> ====Responses====<br /> *1. Plate tectonics is a wonderful thing. Mud goes down to the sea floor, eventually becomes sedimentary rock, comes back up with the rising continental plate (or goes back into the mantle)<br /> *2. Density waves have been proposed as a possible explanation for this. DW are like sound waves; areas of compression and areas of rarefaction. Stars move in and out of these waves (as do air molecules in sound waves). These density waves would also kick off star formation in there dense regions (also explaining why there are so many supernovae in the arms; there are bigger stars there).<br /> *3.+4. You really need agriculture to have civilization, as it support larger population with fewer people, so those left over can do useful things like live in cities, rule over others, etc. Some have suggested that writing was started for tax purposes (the ruler wants all he can get). The modern reader has to appreciate the fact that even conceiving of writing is a huge step in culture: the Incas didn't have it (and they were around for thousands of years). For agriculture, one could draw the analogy with moveable type for the printing press; it seems obvious now, but it took a while to come up with. While ancient man had all of the intelligence, it had none of the advances in technology and learning (all of the hardware, none of the software).<br /> *5. The human population is another one that is a bit odd. The increase in human population is accelerating: more people equal an even greater generation after (in developing countries anyway), and the massive increase in agricultural production in the 19th and 20th centuries didn't hurt.<br /> *6. This can be easily explained. Fossilization is a rare event; it takes the right conditions (dying during a volcanic eruption, during a flood or near a silty river) and it has to be buried quickly. There are so many fossils of dinosaurs because they were around for hundreds of millions of years, our earliest ancestors only about 3 million.<br /> *7. I don't quite understand this one. While individual comets don't last that long, there are a lot of them (some astronomers estimate up to 1 trillion).<br /> *8. Helium is a light gas, light enough to escape the earth's gravity through its own energy (or be blown off by the solar wind).<br /> *9. Some scientists have suggested that the earth's magnetic field is going to flip (north becomes south, and vice versa). Geologists have found evidence of this in the rocks in Hawaii (iron rocks, when cooling, preserve a record of the earth's field strength and direction).<br /> *10. This is a silly one. Creationists, when making certain claims, forget the other side of the equation. In this case, the plates constantly move, some going into the mantle, and some rise up (and give us the Himalayas, the Tibetan Plateau, and the Rocky Mountains, among others).<br /> <br /> ==Science==<br /> I do think that science is the answer to life's mysteries. Evidence and rational arguments are infinitely preferable to blind faith.<br /> ===Scientific Method===<br /> Everyone should know this.<br /> *1. Define question (ie see something and ask why? or how?, or any other related question)<br /> *2. Do research (observe phenomenon, try to find any previous work on the topic)<br /> *3. Form hypothesis (educated guess, the educated bit comes from step #2)<br /> *4. Define procedure and gather materials (what are you going to do in the experiment, and what will you be using)<br /> *5. Perform experiment and gather data (preferable many, many times)<br /> *6. Analyse data <br /> *7. Draw conclusions<br /> *8. If #7 disproved your hypothesis, redo steps #3-7<br /> *9. Publish results<br /> *10. Retest (usually by other scientists)<br /> ===Science doesn't know everything===<br /> If this were to happen, science would cease to exist. Science is all about change and new ideas as the old ones are constantly changed or thrown out. I have heard of the example of the migratory patterns of birds on this website, and how we haven't found an answer to that (thus implying that God has something to do with it). This is the whole point of science; to find out about the world. It is wrong to think that because the scientific community doesn't know something, they never will; it might just take a while.<br /> ===Fine tuning of the Universe===<br /> Frequently cited by others as proof of the existence of God (or gods). While I do agree that this does pose a problem, I think that there will be an answer. <br /> Many scientists go back to the anthropic principle (the universe is the way it is because if it were different we wouldn't be here to observe it). However, Stephen Hawking, in his excellent book ''A Brief History of Time'' talks about a GUT (Grand Unified Theory), that he thinks, once made, will give an answer to:<br /> *1. Why the universe exists in the first place, and<br /> *2. Why it developed in the way that it did.<br /> The GUT would involved &quot;quantum gravity,&quot; or something that explain what exactly goes on in a singularity (which is what the universe was once, according to the Big Bang theory) and also explain why things happened like they did when the universe was extremely small.<br /> Many things have been proposed for a GUT, more famously &quot;string theory&quot; (which is admittedly little more than extremely sophisticated guessing currently, because we don't have powerful enough machines to test it). Hopefully when the LHC particle accelerator (Large Hadron Collider) comes online in May, we will know more about the extremely small things in the universe (including the Higgs boson, which might explain why matter has mass), because of course faster speeds equal smaller bits of debris.<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> For grades 4-7 (I skipped grade 5) I went to a private Christian school (First Baptist Christian School, in the Cayman Islands).<br /> <br /> I also happen to think that citations '''must''' be included with articles. Don't write whatever you would like and find citations in a few weeks (or expect other people to do it), or even worse, not citing it all (even after criticism).<br /> <br /> Phillipps is not my real name. He was a 19th century bibliomaniac (person who obsessively collects books) who amassed the largest private collection of manuscripts, as well as English legal books, and pretty much any other kind of book. Unfortunately he bankrupted his company doing it. It took over a century to auction off all of his books (which he endowed to the British Library, although they didn't want them)<br /> <br /> I think that the Atheism article should be balanced and ordered. I have been observing the various talk pages around Conservapedia, and I have noticed the same pattern: User suggests reform, initial acceptance by a few users, reform dies. Because of this I will attempt to reformat the &quot;Atheism&quot; article and show everyone a better alternative.</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User:Phillipps&diff=417394 2008-03-30T20:01:39Z

<p>Phillipps: /* Cambrian Explosion */</p> <hr /> <div>{{User Evo}}<br /> <br /> {{User evolutionScience}}<br /> <br /> {{User Political Compass|-3.00|-4.56}}<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> I am Canadian (and proud of it). I love classical music and sushi (and cheesecake for that matter). Nothing is better than a good book. I am extremely interested in history and science.<br /> I have been to:<br /> :The United States (Florida, Washington D.C., Boston)<br /> :Canada (born there)<br /> :England (lived there)<br /> :France<br /> :Belguim<br /> :Italy<br /> :The Cayman Islands (lived there)<br /> :Egypt<br /> :The Bahamas<br /> :The Dominican Republic<br /> <br /> I have always wanted to visit Germany (beautiful country) and Poland which has the last old growth forest (over several thousand years old, and funnily enough protected by Hermann Göring) left on the Eurasian plain.<br /> <br /> I have always wanted to write what I accept as fact, so here goes:<br /> <br /> ==Atheism==<br /> I am an Atheist (I suppose technically an Agnostic). <br /> ===Why===<br /> The burden of proof is on the one who asserts that something exists (ie Russel's Teapot) and I have not heard any sufficiently persuasive arguments (but there are many) for the existence of God. However, it is possible (since we cannot prove a universal negative, unless we go everywhere) that somewhere in the universe there might be a god. <br /> ===Morality===<br /> I think that an Atheist can still be moral even though they do no believe in God (or gods). There are two arguments that I have found that are very good for this:<br /> 1. Reciprocation<br /> I do not want to be robbed, murdered, cheated, etc., so why should I do the same to others? If we all did what was good only for ourselves this would happen: <br /> :1. General stealing (great gain for the individual)<br /> :2. Revenge against the stealer (to get the goods back, possibly murder)<br /> :3. Gradual escalation of violence until the current social and political fabric of the world collapses.<br /> :4. Survival of the fittest arises, culture and learning goes out the window.<br /> 2. For the good of society<br /> The world works because of a freedom in trade, action and thought. This allows for great scientific breakthroughs, sophisticated trading networks, etc. These only work if there is a general level of peace and security in the society as a whole. Being afraid of murder and theft (among other things) would be no help at all. This was seen during the Early Mediaeval Period (once called the Dark Ages), when, because of lawlessness and no stability, trade, both domestic and foreign, pretty much collapsed (although there was some).<br /> <br /> ===Origins of Life===<br /> Yes, it is true, I accept Darwinian Evolution (or the Theory of Evolution, or, as I like to call it, the TOE) as the best answer to the origin of life as we know it (ie Tree of Life). I do not think that God (or an Intelligent Designer) created some of the species, and evolution took over from there (what I like to call the orchard of life).<br /> Evolution is falsifiable (cat giving birth <br /> <br /> ===Cambrian Explosion===<br /> One of the more misunderstood phenomena. The Cambrian Explosion was the rapid &quot;explosion&quot; of most major complex organisms about 520 MYA (millions of years ago). This is pointed out as being the spot where there God or an intelligent designer intervened because everything appeared so quickly. There are two problems with this:<br /> *1. Organisms before that had soft bodies, which don't fossilize easily<br /> *2. The &quot;explosion,&quot; we have to keep in mind, was over millions of years<br /> <br /> ===Age of the Earth===<br /> I have heard many, many claims that the Earth is only 6,000 years old, with various proofs offered (and I will not respond to all of them, yet) such as:<br /> *1. Mud on the Sea Floor<br /> *2. Winding up of the Galactic arms<br /> *3. Agriculture is too recent<br /> *4. History is too short<br /> *5. Human pop. too small<br /> *6. Too little H. Sapien skeletons<br /> *7. Comets (only last a few thousand years)<br /> *8. Too little Helium in the atmosphere<br /> *9. Fading of Earth's magnetic field, and <br /> *10. (my personal favourite) Erosion of the continents.<br /> ====Responses====<br /> *1. Plate tectonics is a wonderful thing. Mud goes down to the sea floor, eventually becomes sedimentary rock, comes back up with the rising continental plate (or goes back into the mantle)<br /> *2. Density waves have been proposed as a possible explanation for this. DW are like sound waves; areas of compression and areas of rarefaction. Stars move in and out of these waves (as do air molecules in sound waves). These density waves would also kick off star formation in there dense regions (also explaining why there are so many supernovae in the arms; there are bigger stars there).<br /> *3.+4. You really need agriculture to have civilization, as it support larger population with fewer people, so those left over can do useful things like live in cities, rule over others, etc. Some have suggested that writing was started for tax purposes (the ruler wants all he can get). The modern reader has to appreciate the fact that even conceiving of writing is a huge step in culture: the Incas didn't have it (and they were around for thousands of years). For agriculture, one could draw the analogy with moveable type for the printing press; it seems obvious now, but it took a while to come up with. While ancient man had all of the intelligence, it had none of the advances in technology and learning (all of the hardware, none of the software).<br /> *5. The human population is another one that is a bit odd. The increase in human population is accelerating: more people equal an even greater generation after (in developing countries anyway), and the massive increase in agricultural production in the 19th and 20th centuries didn't hurt.<br /> *6. This can be easily explained. Fossilization is a rare event; it takes the right conditions (dying during a volcanic eruption, during a flood or near a silty river) and it has to be buried quickly. There are so many fossils of dinosaurs because they were around for hundreds of millions of years, our earliest ancestors only about 3 million.<br /> *7. I don't quite understand this one. While individual comets don't last that long, there are a lot of them (some astronomers estimate up to 1 trillion).<br /> *8. Helium is a light gas, light enough to escape the earth's gravity through its own energy (or be blown off by the solar wind).<br /> *9. Some scientists have suggested that the earth's magnetic field is going to flip (north becomes south, and vice versa). Geologists have found evidence of this in the rocks in Hawaii (iron rocks, when cooling, preserve a record of the earth's field strength and direction).<br /> *10. This is a silly one. Creationists, when making certain claims, forget the other side of the equation. In this case, the plates constantly move, some going into the mantle, and some rise up (and give us the Himalayas, the Tibetan Plateau, and the Rocky Mountains, among others).<br /> <br /> ==Science==<br /> I do think that science is the answer to life's mysteries. Evidence and rational arguments are infinitely preferable to blind faith.<br /> ===Scientific Method===<br /> Everyone should know this.<br /> *1. Define question (ie see something and ask why? or how?, or any other related question)<br /> *2. Do research (observe phenomenon, try to find any previous work on the topic)<br /> *3. Form hypothesis (educated guess, the educated bit comes from step #2)<br /> *4. Define procedure and gather materials (what are you going to do in the experiment, and what will you be using)<br /> *5. Perform experiment and gather data (preferable many, many times)<br /> *6. Analyse data <br /> *7. Draw conclusions<br /> *8. If #7 disproved your hypothesis, redo steps #3-7<br /> *9. Publish results<br /> *10. Retest (usually by other scientists)<br /> ===Science doesn't know everything===<br /> If this were to happen, science would cease to exist. Science is all about change and new ideas as the old ones are constantly changed or thrown out. I have heard of the example of the migratory patterns of birds on this website, and how we haven't found an answer to that (thus implying that God has something to do with it). This is the whole point of science; to find out about the world. It is wrong to think that because the scientific community doesn't know something, they never will; it might just take a while.<br /> ===Fine tuning of the Universe===<br /> Frequently cited by others as proof of the existence of God (or gods). While I do agree that this does pose a problem, I think that there will be an answer. <br /> Many scientists go back to the anthropic principle (the universe is the way it is because if it were different we wouldn't be here to observe it). However, Stephen Hawking, in his excellent book ''A Brief History of Time'' talks about a GUT (Grand Unified Theory), that he thinks, once made, will give an answer to:<br /> *1. Why the universe exists in the first place, and<br /> *2. Why it developed in the way that it did.<br /> The GUT would involved &quot;quantum gravity,&quot; or something that explain what exactly goes on in a singularity (which is what the universe was once, according to the Big Bang theory) and also explain why things happened like they did when the universe was extremely small.<br /> Many things have been proposed for a GUT, more famously &quot;string theory&quot; (which is admittedly little more than extremely sophisticated guessing currently, because we don't have powerful enough machines to test it). Hopefully when the LHC particle accelerator (Large Hadron Collider) comes online in May, we will know more about the extremely small things in the universe (including the Higgs boson, which might explain why matter has mass), because of course faster speeds equal smaller bits of debris.<br /> <br /> For grades 4-7 (I skipped grade 5) I went to a private Christian school (First Baptist Christian School, in the Cayman Islands).<br /> <br /> I also happen to think that citations '''must''' be included with articles. Don't write whatever you would like and find citations in a few weeks (or expect other people to do it), or even worse, not citing it all (even after criticism).<br /> <br /> Phillipps is not my real name. He was a 19th century bibliomaniac (person who obsessively collects books) who amassed the largest private collection of manuscripts, as well as English legal books, and pretty much any other kind of book. Unfortunately he bankrupted his company doing it. It took over a century to auction off all of his books (which he endowed to the British Library, although they didn't want them)<br /> <br /> I think that the Atheism article should be balanced and ordered. I have been observing the various talk pages around Conservapedia, and I have noticed the same pattern: User suggests reform, initial acceptance by a few users, reform dies. Because of this I will attempt to reformat the &quot;Atheism&quot; article and show everyone a better alternative.</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User:Phillipps&diff=417392 2008-03-30T20:01:13Z

<p>Phillipps: </p> <hr /> <div>{{User Evo}}<br /> <br /> {{User evolutionScience}}<br /> <br /> {{User Political Compass|-3.00|-4.56}}<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> I am Canadian (and proud of it). I love classical music and sushi (and cheesecake for that matter). Nothing is better than a good book. I am extremely interested in history and science.<br /> I have been to:<br /> :The United States (Florida, Washington D.C., Boston)<br /> :Canada (born there)<br /> :England (lived there)<br /> :France<br /> :Belguim<br /> :Italy<br /> :The Cayman Islands (lived there)<br /> :Egypt<br /> :The Bahamas<br /> :The Dominican Republic<br /> <br /> I have always wanted to visit Germany (beautiful country) and Poland which has the last old growth forest (over several thousand years old, and funnily enough protected by Hermann Göring) left on the Eurasian plain.<br /> <br /> I have always wanted to write what I accept as fact, so here goes:<br /> <br /> ==Atheism==<br /> I am an Atheist (I suppose technically an Agnostic). <br /> ===Why===<br /> The burden of proof is on the one who asserts that something exists (ie Russel's Teapot) and I have not heard any sufficiently persuasive arguments (but there are many) for the existence of God. However, it is possible (since we cannot prove a universal negative, unless we go everywhere) that somewhere in the universe there might be a god. <br /> ===Morality===<br /> I think that an Atheist can still be moral even though they do no believe in God (or gods). There are two arguments that I have found that are very good for this:<br /> 1. Reciprocation<br /> I do not want to be robbed, murdered, cheated, etc., so why should I do the same to others? If we all did what was good only for ourselves this would happen: <br /> :1. General stealing (great gain for the individual)<br /> :2. Revenge against the stealer (to get the goods back, possibly murder)<br /> :3. Gradual escalation of violence until the current social and political fabric of the world collapses.<br /> :4. Survival of the fittest arises, culture and learning goes out the window.<br /> 2. For the good of society<br /> The world works because of a freedom in trade, action and thought. This allows for great scientific breakthroughs, sophisticated trading networks, etc. These only work if there is a general level of peace and security in the society as a whole. Being afraid of murder and theft (among other things) would be no help at all. This was seen during the Early Mediaeval Period (once called the Dark Ages), when, because of lawlessness and no stability, trade, both domestic and foreign, pretty much collapsed (although there was some).<br /> <br /> ===Origins of Life===<br /> Yes, it is true, I accept Darwinian Evolution (or the Theory of Evolution, or, as I like to call it, the TOE) as the best answer to the origin of life as we know it (ie Tree of Life). I do not think that God (or an Intelligent Designer) created some of the species, and evolution took over from there (what I like to call the orchard of life).<br /> Evolution is falsifiable (cat giving birth <br /> <br /> ===Cambrian Explosion===<br /> One of the more misunderstood phenomena. The Cambrian Explosion was the rapid &quot;explosion&quot; of most major complex organisms about 520 MYA (millions of years ago). This is pointed out as being the spot where there God or an intelligent designer intervened because everything appeared so quickly. There are two problems with this:<br /> 1. Organisms before that had soft bodies, which don't fossilize easily<br /> 2. The &quot;explosion,&quot; we have to keep in mind, was over millions of years <br /> ===Age of the Earth===<br /> I have heard many, many claims that the Earth is only 6,000 years old, with various proofs offered (and I will not respond to all of them, yet) such as:<br /> *1. Mud on the Sea Floor<br /> *2. Winding up of the Galactic arms<br /> *3. Agriculture is too recent<br /> *4. History is too short<br /> *5. Human pop. too small<br /> *6. Too little H. Sapien skeletons<br /> *7. Comets (only last a few thousand years)<br /> *8. Too little Helium in the atmosphere<br /> *9. Fading of Earth's magnetic field, and <br /> *10. (my personal favourite) Erosion of the continents.<br /> ====Responses====<br /> *1. Plate tectonics is a wonderful thing. Mud goes down to the sea floor, eventually becomes sedimentary rock, comes back up with the rising continental plate (or goes back into the mantle)<br /> *2. Density waves have been proposed as a possible explanation for this. DW are like sound waves; areas of compression and areas of rarefaction. Stars move in and out of these waves (as do air molecules in sound waves). These density waves would also kick off star formation in there dense regions (also explaining why there are so many supernovae in the arms; there are bigger stars there).<br /> *3.+4. You really need agriculture to have civilization, as it support larger population with fewer people, so those left over can do useful things like live in cities, rule over others, etc. Some have suggested that writing was started for tax purposes (the ruler wants all he can get). The modern reader has to appreciate the fact that even conceiving of writing is a huge step in culture: the Incas didn't have it (and they were around for thousands of years). For agriculture, one could draw the analogy with moveable type for the printing press; it seems obvious now, but it took a while to come up with. While ancient man had all of the intelligence, it had none of the advances in technology and learning (all of the hardware, none of the software).<br /> *5. The human population is another one that is a bit odd. The increase in human population is accelerating: more people equal an even greater generation after (in developing countries anyway), and the massive increase in agricultural production in the 19th and 20th centuries didn't hurt.<br /> *6. This can be easily explained. Fossilization is a rare event; it takes the right conditions (dying during a volcanic eruption, during a flood or near a silty river) and it has to be buried quickly. There are so many fossils of dinosaurs because they were around for hundreds of millions of years, our earliest ancestors only about 3 million.<br /> *7. I don't quite understand this one. While individual comets don't last that long, there are a lot of them (some astronomers estimate up to 1 trillion).<br /> *8. Helium is a light gas, light enough to escape the earth's gravity through its own energy (or be blown off by the solar wind).<br /> *9. Some scientists have suggested that the earth's magnetic field is going to flip (north becomes south, and vice versa). Geologists have found evidence of this in the rocks in Hawaii (iron rocks, when cooling, preserve a record of the earth's field strength and direction).<br /> *10. This is a silly one. Creationists, when making certain claims, forget the other side of the equation. In this case, the plates constantly move, some going into the mantle, and some rise up (and give us the Himalayas, the Tibetan Plateau, and the Rocky Mountains, among others).<br /> <br /> ==Science==<br /> I do think that science is the answer to life's mysteries. Evidence and rational arguments are infinitely preferable to blind faith.<br /> ===Scientific Method===<br /> Everyone should know this.<br /> *1. Define question (ie see something and ask why? or how?, or any other related question)<br /> *2. Do research (observe phenomenon, try to find any previous work on the topic)<br /> *3. Form hypothesis (educated guess, the educated bit comes from step #2)<br /> *4. Define procedure and gather materials (what are you going to do in the experiment, and what will you be using)<br /> *5. Perform experiment and gather data (preferable many, many times)<br /> *6. Analyse data <br /> *7. Draw conclusions<br /> *8. If #7 disproved your hypothesis, redo steps #3-7<br /> *9. Publish results<br /> *10. Retest (usually by other scientists)<br /> ===Science doesn't know everything===<br /> If this were to happen, science would cease to exist. Science is all about change and new ideas as the old ones are constantly changed or thrown out. I have heard of the example of the migratory patterns of birds on this website, and how we haven't found an answer to that (thus implying that God has something to do with it). This is the whole point of science; to find out about the world. It is wrong to think that because the scientific community doesn't know something, they never will; it might just take a while.<br /> ===Fine tuning of the Universe===<br /> Frequently cited by others as proof of the existence of God (or gods). While I do agree that this does pose a problem, I think that there will be an answer. <br /> Many scientists go back to the anthropic principle (the universe is the way it is because if it were different we wouldn't be here to observe it). However, Stephen Hawking, in his excellent book ''A Brief History of Time'' talks about a GUT (Grand Unified Theory), that he thinks, once made, will give an answer to:<br /> *1. Why the universe exists in the first place, and<br /> *2. Why it developed in the way that it did.<br /> The GUT would involved &quot;quantum gravity,&quot; or something that explain what exactly goes on in a singularity (which is what the universe was once, according to the Big Bang theory) and also explain why things happened like they did when the universe was extremely small.<br /> Many things have been proposed for a GUT, more famously &quot;string theory&quot; (which is admittedly little more than extremely sophisticated guessing currently, because we don't have powerful enough machines to test it). Hopefully when the LHC particle accelerator (Large Hadron Collider) comes online in May, we will know more about the extremely small things in the universe (including the Higgs boson, which might explain why matter has mass), because of course faster speeds equal smaller bits of debris.<br /> <br /> For grades 4-7 (I skipped grade 5) I went to a private Christian school (First Baptist Christian School, in the Cayman Islands).<br /> <br /> I also happen to think that citations '''must''' be included with articles. Don't write whatever you would like and find citations in a few weeks (or expect other people to do it), or even worse, not citing it all (even after criticism).<br /> <br /> Phillipps is not my real name. He was a 19th century bibliomaniac (person who obsessively collects books) who amassed the largest private collection of manuscripts, as well as English legal books, and pretty much any other kind of book. Unfortunately he bankrupted his company doing it. It took over a century to auction off all of his books (which he endowed to the British Library, although they didn't want them)<br /> <br /> I think that the Atheism article should be balanced and ordered. I have been observing the various talk pages around Conservapedia, and I have noticed the same pattern: User suggests reform, initial acceptance by a few users, reform dies. Because of this I will attempt to reformat the &quot;Atheism&quot; article and show everyone a better alternative.</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User:Phillipps&diff=417388 2008-03-30T19:53:24Z

<p>Phillipps: /* Responses */</p> <hr /> <div>{{User Evo}}<br /> <br /> {{User evolutionScience}}<br /> <br /> {{User Political Compass|-3.00|-4.56}}<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> I am Canadian (and proud of it). I love classical music and sushi (and cheesecake for that matter). Nothing is better than a good book. I am extremely interested in history and science.<br /> I have been to:<br /> :The United States (Florida, Washington D.C., Boston)<br /> :Canada (born there)<br /> :England (lived there)<br /> :France<br /> :Belguim<br /> :Italy<br /> :The Cayman Islands (lived there)<br /> :Egypt<br /> :The Bahamas<br /> :The Dominican Republic<br /> <br /> I have always wanted to visit Germany (beautiful country) and Poland which has the last old growth forest (over several thousand years old, and funnily enough protected by Hermann Göring) left on the Eurasian plain.<br /> <br /> I have always wanted to write what I accept as fact, so here goes:<br /> <br /> ==Atheism==<br /> I am an Atheist (I suppose technically an Agnostic). <br /> ===Why===<br /> The burden of proof is on the one who asserts that something exists (ie Russel's Teapot) and I have not heard any sufficiently persuasive arguments (but there are many) for the existence of God. However, it is possible (since we cannot prove a universal negative, unless we go everywhere) that somewhere in the universe there might be a god. <br /> ===Morality===<br /> I think that an Atheist can still be moral even though they do no believe in God (or gods). There are two arguments that I have found that are very good for this:<br /> 1. Reciprocation<br /> I do not want to be robbed, murdered, cheated, etc., so why should I do the same to others? If we all did what was good only for ourselves this would happen: <br /> :1. General stealing (great gain for the individual)<br /> :2. Revenge against the stealer (to get the goods back, possibly murder)<br /> :3. Gradual escalation of violence until the current social and political fabric of the world collapses.<br /> :4. Survival of the fittest arises, culture and learning goes out the window.<br /> 2. For the good of society<br /> The world works because of a freedom in trade, action and thought. This allows for great scientific breakthroughs, sophisticated trading networks, etc. These only work if there is a general level of peace and security in the society as a whole. Being afraid of murder and theft (among other things) would be no help at all. This was seen during the Early Mediaeval Period (once called the Dark Ages), when, because of lawlessness and no stability, trade, both domestic and foreign, pretty much collapsed (although there was some).<br /> <br /> ===Origins of Life===<br /> Yes, it is true, I accept Darwinian Evolution (or the Theory of Evolution, or, as I like to call it, the TOE) as the best answer to the origin of life as we know it (ie Tree of Life). I do not think that God (or an Intelligent Designer) created some of the species, and evolution took over from there (what I like to call the orchard of life).<br /> Evolution is falsifiable (cat giving birth <br /> <br /> ===Cambrian Explosion===<br /> One of the more misunderstood phenomena. The Cambrian Explosion was the rapid &quot;explosion&quot; of most major complex organisms about 520 MYA (millions of years ago). This is pointed out as being the spot where there God or an intelligent designer intervened because everything appeared so quickly. There are two problems with this:<br /> 1. Organisms before that had soft bodies, which don't fossilize easily<br /> 2. The &quot;explosion,&quot; we have to keep in mind, was over millions of years <br /> ===Age of the Earth===<br /> I have heard many, many claims that the Earth is only 6,000 years old, with various proofs offered (and I will not respond to all of them, yet) such as:<br /> *1. Mud on the Sea Floor<br /> *2. Winding up of the Galactic arms<br /> *3. Agriculture is too recent<br /> *4. History is too short<br /> *5. Human pop. too small<br /> *6. Too little H. Sapien skeletons<br /> *7. Comets (only last a few thousand years)<br /> *8. Too little Helium in the atmosphere<br /> *9. Fading of Earth's magnetic field, and <br /> *10. (my personal favourite) Erosion of the continents.<br /> ====Responses====<br /> *1. Plate tectonics is a wonderful thing. Mud goes down to the sea floor, eventually becomes sedimentary rock, comes back up with the rising continental plate (or goes back into the mantle)<br /> *2. Density waves have been proposed as a possible explanation for this. DW are like sound waves; areas of compression and areas of rarefaction. Stars move in and out of these waves (as do air molecules in sound waves). These density waves would also kick off star formation in there dense regions (also explaining why there are so many supernovae in the arms; there are bigger stars there).<br /> *3.+4. You really need agriculture to have civilization, as it support larger population with fewer people, so those left over can do useful things like live in cities, rule over others, etc. Some have suggested that writing was started for tax purposes (the ruler wants all he can get). The modern reader has to appreciate the fact that even conceiving of writing is a huge step in culture: the Incas didn't have it (and they were around for thousands of years). For agriculture, one could draw the analogy with moveable type for the printing press; it seems obvious now, but it took a while to come up with. While ancient man had all of the intelligence, it had none of the advances in technology and learning (all of the hardware, none of the software).<br /> *5. The human population is another one that is a bit odd. The increase in human population is accelerating: more people equal an even greater generation after (in developing countries anyway), and the massive increase in agricultural production in the 19th and 20th centuries didn't hurt.<br /> *6.<br /> <br /> ==Science==<br /> I do think that science is the answer to life's mysteries. Evidence and rational arguments are infinitely preferable to blind faith.<br /> ===Scientific Method===<br /> Everyone should know this.<br /> *1. Define question (ie see something and ask why? or how?, or any other related question)<br /> *2. Do research (observe phenomenon, try to find any previous work on the topic)<br /> *3. Form hypothesis (educated guess, the educated bit comes from step #2)<br /> *4. Define procedure and gather materials (what are you going to do in the experiment, and what will you be using)<br /> *5. Perform experiment and gather data (preferable many, many times)<br /> *6. Analyse data <br /> *7. Draw conclusions<br /> *8. If #7 disproved your hypothesis, redo steps #3-7<br /> *9. Publish results<br /> *10. Retest (usually by other scientists)<br /> ===Science doesn't know everything===<br /> If this were to happen, science would cease to exist. Science is all about change and new ideas as the old ones are constantly changed or thrown out. I have heard of the example of the migratory patterns of birds on this website, and how we haven't found an answer to that (thus implying that God has something to do with it). This is the whole point of science; to find out about the world. It is wrong to think that because the scientific community doesn't know something, they never will; it might just take a while.<br /> ===Fine tuning of the Universe===<br /> Frequently cited by others as proof of the existence of God (or gods). While I do agree that this does pose a problem, I think that there will be an answer. <br /> Many scientists go back to the anthropic principle (the universe is the way it is because if it were different we wouldn't be here to observe it). However, Stephen Hawking, in his excellent book ''A Brief History of Time'' talks about a GUT (Grand Unified Theory), that he thinks, once made, will give an answer to:<br /> *1. Why the universe exists in the first place, and<br /> *2. Why it developed in the way that it did.<br /> The GUT would involved &quot;quantum gravity,&quot; or something that explain what exactly goes on in a singularity (which is what the universe was once, according to the Big Bang theory) and also explain why things happened like they did when the universe was extremely small.<br /> Many things have been proposed for a GUT, more famously &quot;string theory&quot; (which is admittedly little more than extremely sophisticated guessing currently, because we don't have powerful enough machines to test it). Hopefully when the LHC particle accelerator (Large Hadron Collider) comes online in May, we will know more about the extremely small things in the universe (including the Higgs boson, which might explain why matter has mass), because of course faster speeds equal smaller bits of debris.<br /> <br /> For grades 4-7 (I skipped grade 5) I went to a private Christian school (First Baptist Christian School, in the Cayman Islands).<br /> <br /> I also happen to think that citations '''must''' be included with articles. Don't write whatever you would like and find citations in a few weeks (or expect other people to do it), or even worse, not citing it all (even after criticism).<br /> <br /> Phillipps is not my real name. He was a 19th century bibliomaniac (person who obsessively collects books) who amassed the largest private collection of manuscripts, as well as English legal books, and pretty much any other kind of book. Unfortunately he bankrupted his company doing it. It took over a century to auction off all of his books (which he endowed to the British Library, although they didn't want them)<br /> <br /> I think that the Atheism article should be balanced and ordered. I have been observing the various talk pages around Conservapedia, and I have noticed the same pattern: User suggests reform, initial acceptance by a few users, reform dies. Because of this I will attempt to reformat the &quot;Atheism&quot; article and show everyone a better alternative.</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User:Phillipps&diff=417387 2008-03-30T19:45:42Z

<p>Phillipps: /* Responses */</p> <hr /> <div>{{User Evo}}<br /> <br /> {{User evolutionScience}}<br /> <br /> {{User Political Compass|-3.00|-4.56}}<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> I am Canadian (and proud of it). I love classical music and sushi (and cheesecake for that matter). Nothing is better than a good book. I am extremely interested in history and science.<br /> I have been to:<br /> :The United States (Florida, Washington D.C., Boston)<br /> :Canada (born there)<br /> :England (lived there)<br /> :France<br /> :Belguim<br /> :Italy<br /> :The Cayman Islands (lived there)<br /> :Egypt<br /> :The Bahamas<br /> :The Dominican Republic<br /> <br /> I have always wanted to visit Germany (beautiful country) and Poland which has the last old growth forest (over several thousand years old, and funnily enough protected by Hermann Göring) left on the Eurasian plain.<br /> <br /> I have always wanted to write what I accept as fact, so here goes:<br /> <br /> ==Atheism==<br /> I am an Atheist (I suppose technically an Agnostic). <br /> ===Why===<br /> The burden of proof is on the one who asserts that something exists (ie Russel's Teapot) and I have not heard any sufficiently persuasive arguments (but there are many) for the existence of God. However, it is possible (since we cannot prove a universal negative, unless we go everywhere) that somewhere in the universe there might be a god. <br /> ===Morality===<br /> I think that an Atheist can still be moral even though they do no believe in God (or gods). There are two arguments that I have found that are very good for this:<br /> 1. Reciprocation<br /> I do not want to be robbed, murdered, cheated, etc., so why should I do the same to others? If we all did what was good only for ourselves this would happen: <br /> :1. General stealing (great gain for the individual)<br /> :2. Revenge against the stealer (to get the goods back, possibly murder)<br /> :3. Gradual escalation of violence until the current social and political fabric of the world collapses.<br /> :4. Survival of the fittest arises, culture and learning goes out the window.<br /> 2. For the good of society<br /> The world works because of a freedom in trade, action and thought. This allows for great scientific breakthroughs, sophisticated trading networks, etc. These only work if there is a general level of peace and security in the society as a whole. Being afraid of murder and theft (among other things) would be no help at all. This was seen during the Early Mediaeval Period (once called the Dark Ages), when, because of lawlessness and no stability, trade, both domestic and foreign, pretty much collapsed (although there was some).<br /> <br /> ===Origins of Life===<br /> Yes, it is true, I accept Darwinian Evolution (or the Theory of Evolution, or, as I like to call it, the TOE) as the best answer to the origin of life as we know it (ie Tree of Life). I do not think that God (or an Intelligent Designer) created some of the species, and evolution took over from there (what I like to call the orchard of life).<br /> Evolution is falsifiable (cat giving birth <br /> <br /> ===Cambrian Explosion===<br /> One of the more misunderstood phenomena. The Cambrian Explosion was the rapid &quot;explosion&quot; of most major complex organisms about 520 MYA (millions of years ago). This is pointed out as being the spot where there God or an intelligent designer intervened because everything appeared so quickly. There are two problems with this:<br /> 1. Organisms before that had soft bodies, which don't fossilize easily<br /> 2. The &quot;explosion,&quot; we have to keep in mind, was over millions of years <br /> ===Age of the Earth===<br /> I have heard many, many claims that the Earth is only 6,000 years old, with various proofs offered (and I will not respond to all of them, yet) such as:<br /> *1. Mud on the Sea Floor<br /> *2. Winding up of the Galactic arms<br /> *3. Agriculture is too recent<br /> *4. History is too short<br /> *5. Human pop. too small<br /> *6. Too little H. Sapien skeletons<br /> *7. Comets (only last a few thousand years)<br /> *8. Too little Helium in the atmosphere<br /> *9. Fading of Earth's magnetic field, and <br /> *10. (my personal favourite) Erosion of the continents.<br /> ====Responses====<br /> *1. Plate tectonics is a wonderful thing. Mud goes down to the sea floor, eventually becomes sedimentary rock, comes back up with the rising continental plate (or goes back into the mantle)<br /> *2. Density waves have been proposed as a possible explanation for this. DW are like sound waves; areas of compression and areas of rarefaction. Stars move in and out of these waves (as do air molecules in sound waves). These density waves would also kick off star formation in there dense regions (also explaining why there are so many supernovae in the arms; there are bigger stars there).<br /> *3.+4. You really need agriculture to have civilization, as it support larger population with fewer people, so those left over can do useful things like live in cities, rule over others, etc. Some have suggested that writing was started for tax purposes (the ruler wants all he can get). The modern reader has to appreciate the fact that even conceiving of writing is a huge step in culture: the Incas didn't have it (and they were around for thousands of years). For agriculture, one could draw the analogy with moveable type for the printing press; it seems obvious now, but it took a while to come up with. While ancient man had all of the intelligence, it had none of the advances in technology and learning (all of the hardware, none of the software).<br /> *5. The human population is another one that is a bit odd. The increase in human population is accelerating: more people equal an even<br /> <br /> ==Science==<br /> I do think that science is the answer to life's mysteries. Evidence and rational arguments are infinitely preferable to blind faith.<br /> ===Scientific Method===<br /> Everyone should know this.<br /> *1. Define question (ie see something and ask why? or how?, or any other related question)<br /> *2. Do research (observe phenomenon, try to find any previous work on the topic)<br /> *3. Form hypothesis (educated guess, the educated bit comes from step #2)<br /> *4. Define procedure and gather materials (what are you going to do in the experiment, and what will you be using)<br /> *5. Perform experiment and gather data (preferable many, many times)<br /> *6. Analyse data <br /> *7. Draw conclusions<br /> *8. If #7 disproved your hypothesis, redo steps #3-7<br /> *9. Publish results<br /> *10. Retest (usually by other scientists)<br /> ===Science doesn't know everything===<br /> If this were to happen, science would cease to exist. Science is all about change and new ideas as the old ones are constantly changed or thrown out. I have heard of the example of the migratory patterns of birds on this website, and how we haven't found an answer to that (thus implying that God has something to do with it). This is the whole point of science; to find out about the world. It is wrong to think that because the scientific community doesn't know something, they never will; it might just take a while.<br /> ===Fine tuning of the Universe===<br /> Frequently cited by others as proof of the existence of God (or gods). While I do agree that this does pose a problem, I think that there will be an answer. <br /> Many scientists go back to the anthropic principle (the universe is the way it is because if it were different we wouldn't be here to observe it). However, Stephen Hawking, in his excellent book ''A Brief History of Time'' talks about a GUT (Grand Unified Theory), that he thinks, once made, will give an answer to:<br /> *1. Why the universe exists in the first place, and<br /> *2. Why it developed in the way that it did.<br /> The GUT would involved &quot;quantum gravity,&quot; or something that explain what exactly goes on in a singularity (which is what the universe was once, according to the Big Bang theory) and also explain why things happened like they did when the universe was extremely small.<br /> Many things have been proposed for a GUT, more famously &quot;string theory&quot; (which is admittedly little more than extremely sophisticated guessing currently, because we don't have powerful enough machines to test it). Hopefully when the LHC particle accelerator (Large Hadron Collider) comes online in May, we will know more about the extremely small things in the universe (including the Higgs boson, which might explain why matter has mass), because of course faster speeds equal smaller bits of debris.<br /> <br /> For grades 4-7 (I skipped grade 5) I went to a private Christian school (First Baptist Christian School, in the Cayman Islands).<br /> <br /> I also happen to think that citations '''must''' be included with articles. Don't write whatever you would like and find citations in a few weeks (or expect other people to do it), or even worse, not citing it all (even after criticism).<br /> <br /> Phillipps is not my real name. He was a 19th century bibliomaniac (person who obsessively collects books) who amassed the largest private collection of manuscripts, as well as English legal books, and pretty much any other kind of book. Unfortunately he bankrupted his company doing it. It took over a century to auction off all of his books (which he endowed to the British Library, although they didn't want them)<br /> <br /> I think that the Atheism article should be balanced and ordered. I have been observing the various talk pages around Conservapedia, and I have noticed the same pattern: User suggests reform, initial acceptance by a few users, reform dies. Because of this I will attempt to reformat the &quot;Atheism&quot; article and show everyone a better alternative.</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User:Phillipps&diff=417386 2008-03-30T19:44:13Z

<p>Phillipps: /* Responses */</p> <hr /> <div>{{User Evo}}<br /> <br /> {{User evolutionScience}}<br /> <br /> {{User Political Compass|-3.00|-4.56}}<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> I am Canadian (and proud of it). I love classical music and sushi (and cheesecake for that matter). Nothing is better than a good book. I am extremely interested in history and science.<br /> I have been to:<br /> :The United States (Florida, Washington D.C., Boston)<br /> :Canada (born there)<br /> :England (lived there)<br /> :France<br /> :Belguim<br /> :Italy<br /> :The Cayman Islands (lived there)<br /> :Egypt<br /> :The Bahamas<br /> :The Dominican Republic<br /> <br /> I have always wanted to visit Germany (beautiful country) and Poland which has the last old growth forest (over several thousand years old, and funnily enough protected by Hermann Göring) left on the Eurasian plain.<br /> <br /> I have always wanted to write what I accept as fact, so here goes:<br /> <br /> ==Atheism==<br /> I am an Atheist (I suppose technically an Agnostic). <br /> ===Why===<br /> The burden of proof is on the one who asserts that something exists (ie Russel's Teapot) and I have not heard any sufficiently persuasive arguments (but there are many) for the existence of God. However, it is possible (since we cannot prove a universal negative, unless we go everywhere) that somewhere in the universe there might be a god. <br /> ===Morality===<br /> I think that an Atheist can still be moral even though they do no believe in God (or gods). There are two arguments that I have found that are very good for this:<br /> 1. Reciprocation<br /> I do not want to be robbed, murdered, cheated, etc., so why should I do the same to others? If we all did what was good only for ourselves this would happen: <br /> :1. General stealing (great gain for the individual)<br /> :2. Revenge against the stealer (to get the goods back, possibly murder)<br /> :3. Gradual escalation of violence until the current social and political fabric of the world collapses.<br /> :4. Survival of the fittest arises, culture and learning goes out the window.<br /> 2. For the good of society<br /> The world works because of a freedom in trade, action and thought. This allows for great scientific breakthroughs, sophisticated trading networks, etc. These only work if there is a general level of peace and security in the society as a whole. Being afraid of murder and theft (among other things) would be no help at all. This was seen during the Early Mediaeval Period (once called the Dark Ages), when, because of lawlessness and no stability, trade, both domestic and foreign, pretty much collapsed (although there was some).<br /> <br /> ===Origins of Life===<br /> Yes, it is true, I accept Darwinian Evolution (or the Theory of Evolution, or, as I like to call it, the TOE) as the best answer to the origin of life as we know it (ie Tree of Life). I do not think that God (or an Intelligent Designer) created some of the species, and evolution took over from there (what I like to call the orchard of life).<br /> Evolution is falsifiable (cat giving birth <br /> <br /> ===Cambrian Explosion===<br /> One of the more misunderstood phenomena. The Cambrian Explosion was the rapid &quot;explosion&quot; of most major complex organisms about 520 MYA (millions of years ago). This is pointed out as being the spot where there God or an intelligent designer intervened because everything appeared so quickly. There are two problems with this:<br /> 1. Organisms before that had soft bodies, which don't fossilize easily<br /> 2. The &quot;explosion,&quot; we have to keep in mind, was over millions of years <br /> ===Age of the Earth===<br /> I have heard many, many claims that the Earth is only 6,000 years old, with various proofs offered (and I will not respond to all of them, yet) such as:<br /> *1. Mud on the Sea Floor<br /> *2. Winding up of the Galactic arms<br /> *3. Agriculture is too recent<br /> *4. History is too short<br /> *5. Human pop. too small<br /> *6. Too little H. Sapien skeletons<br /> *7. Comets (only last a few thousand years)<br /> *8. Too little Helium in the atmosphere<br /> *9. Fading of Earth's magnetic field, and <br /> *10. (my personal favourite) Erosion of the continents.<br /> ====Responses====<br /> *1. Plate tectonics is a wonderful thing. Mud goes down to the sea floor, eventually becomes sedimentary rock, comes back up with the rising continental plate (or goes back into the mantle)<br /> *2. Density waves have been proposed as a possible explanation for this. DW are like sound waves; areas of compression and areas of rarefaction. Stars move in and out of these waves (as do air molecules in sound waves). These density waves would also kick off star formation in there dense regions (also explaining why there are so many supernovae in the arms; there are bigger stars there).<br /> *3.+4. You really need agriculture to have civilization, as it support larger population with fewer people, so those left over can do useful things like live in cities, rule over others, etc. Some have suggested that writing was started for tax purposes (the ruler wants all he can get). The modern reader has to appreciate the fact that even conceiving of writing is a huge step in culture: the Incas didn't have it (and they were around for thousands of years). For agriculture, one could draw the analogy with moveable type for the printing press; it seems obvious now, but it took a while to come up with. While ancient man had all of the intelligence, it had none of the advances in technology and learning (all of the hardware, none of the software).<br /> <br /> ==Science==<br /> I do think that science is the answer to life's mysteries. Evidence and rational arguments are infinitely preferable to blind faith.<br /> ===Scientific Method===<br /> Everyone should know this.<br /> *1. Define question (ie see something and ask why? or how?, or any other related question)<br /> *2. Do research (observe phenomenon, try to find any previous work on the topic)<br /> *3. Form hypothesis (educated guess, the educated bit comes from step #2)<br /> *4. Define procedure and gather materials (what are you going to do in the experiment, and what will you be using)<br /> *5. Perform experiment and gather data (preferable many, many times)<br /> *6. Analyse data <br /> *7. Draw conclusions<br /> *8. If #7 disproved your hypothesis, redo steps #3-7<br /> *9. Publish results<br /> *10. Retest (usually by other scientists)<br /> ===Science doesn't know everything===<br /> If this were to happen, science would cease to exist. Science is all about change and new ideas as the old ones are constantly changed or thrown out. I have heard of the example of the migratory patterns of birds on this website, and how we haven't found an answer to that (thus implying that God has something to do with it). This is the whole point of science; to find out about the world. It is wrong to think that because the scientific community doesn't know something, they never will; it might just take a while.<br /> ===Fine tuning of the Universe===<br /> Frequently cited by others as proof of the existence of God (or gods). While I do agree that this does pose a problem, I think that there will be an answer. <br /> Many scientists go back to the anthropic principle (the universe is the way it is because if it were different we wouldn't be here to observe it). However, Stephen Hawking, in his excellent book ''A Brief History of Time'' talks about a GUT (Grand Unified Theory), that he thinks, once made, will give an answer to:<br /> *1. Why the universe exists in the first place, and<br /> *2. Why it developed in the way that it did.<br /> The GUT would involved &quot;quantum gravity,&quot; or something that explain what exactly goes on in a singularity (which is what the universe was once, according to the Big Bang theory) and also explain why things happened like they did when the universe was extremely small.<br /> Many things have been proposed for a GUT, more famously &quot;string theory&quot; (which is admittedly little more than extremely sophisticated guessing currently, because we don't have powerful enough machines to test it). Hopefully when the LHC particle accelerator (Large Hadron Collider) comes online in May, we will know more about the extremely small things in the universe (including the Higgs boson, which might explain why matter has mass), because of course faster speeds equal smaller bits of debris.<br /> <br /> For grades 4-7 (I skipped grade 5) I went to a private Christian school (First Baptist Christian School, in the Cayman Islands).<br /> <br /> I also happen to think that citations '''must''' be included with articles. Don't write whatever you would like and find citations in a few weeks (or expect other people to do it), or even worse, not citing it all (even after criticism).<br /> <br /> Phillipps is not my real name. He was a 19th century bibliomaniac (person who obsessively collects books) who amassed the largest private collection of manuscripts, as well as English legal books, and pretty much any other kind of book. Unfortunately he bankrupted his company doing it. It took over a century to auction off all of his books (which he endowed to the British Library, although they didn't want them)<br /> <br /> I think that the Atheism article should be balanced and ordered. I have been observing the various talk pages around Conservapedia, and I have noticed the same pattern: User suggests reform, initial acceptance by a few users, reform dies. Because of this I will attempt to reformat the &quot;Atheism&quot; article and show everyone a better alternative.</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User:Phillipps&diff=417382 2008-03-30T19:40:10Z

<p>Phillipps: /* Age of the Earth */</p> <hr /> <div>{{User Evo}}<br /> <br /> {{User evolutionScience}}<br /> <br /> {{User Political Compass|-3.00|-4.56}}<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> I am Canadian (and proud of it). I love classical music and sushi (and cheesecake for that matter). Nothing is better than a good book. I am extremely interested in history and science.<br /> I have been to:<br /> :The United States (Florida, Washington D.C., Boston)<br /> :Canada (born there)<br /> :England (lived there)<br /> :France<br /> :Belguim<br /> :Italy<br /> :The Cayman Islands (lived there)<br /> :Egypt<br /> :The Bahamas<br /> :The Dominican Republic<br /> <br /> I have always wanted to visit Germany (beautiful country) and Poland which has the last old growth forest (over several thousand years old, and funnily enough protected by Hermann Göring) left on the Eurasian plain.<br /> <br /> I have always wanted to write what I accept as fact, so here goes:<br /> <br /> ==Atheism==<br /> I am an Atheist (I suppose technically an Agnostic). <br /> ===Why===<br /> The burden of proof is on the one who asserts that something exists (ie Russel's Teapot) and I have not heard any sufficiently persuasive arguments (but there are many) for the existence of God. However, it is possible (since we cannot prove a universal negative, unless we go everywhere) that somewhere in the universe there might be a god. <br /> ===Morality===<br /> I think that an Atheist can still be moral even though they do no believe in God (or gods). There are two arguments that I have found that are very good for this:<br /> 1. Reciprocation<br /> I do not want to be robbed, murdered, cheated, etc., so why should I do the same to others? If we all did what was good only for ourselves this would happen: <br /> :1. General stealing (great gain for the individual)<br /> :2. Revenge against the stealer (to get the goods back, possibly murder)<br /> :3. Gradual escalation of violence until the current social and political fabric of the world collapses.<br /> :4. Survival of the fittest arises, culture and learning goes out the window.<br /> 2. For the good of society<br /> The world works because of a freedom in trade, action and thought. This allows for great scientific breakthroughs, sophisticated trading networks, etc. These only work if there is a general level of peace and security in the society as a whole. Being afraid of murder and theft (among other things) would be no help at all. This was seen during the Early Mediaeval Period (once called the Dark Ages), when, because of lawlessness and no stability, trade, both domestic and foreign, pretty much collapsed (although there was some).<br /> <br /> ===Origins of Life===<br /> Yes, it is true, I accept Darwinian Evolution (or the Theory of Evolution, or, as I like to call it, the TOE) as the best answer to the origin of life as we know it (ie Tree of Life). I do not think that God (or an Intelligent Designer) created some of the species, and evolution took over from there (what I like to call the orchard of life).<br /> Evolution is falsifiable (cat giving birth <br /> <br /> ===Cambrian Explosion===<br /> One of the more misunderstood phenomena. The Cambrian Explosion was the rapid &quot;explosion&quot; of most major complex organisms about 520 MYA (millions of years ago). This is pointed out as being the spot where there God or an intelligent designer intervened because everything appeared so quickly. There are two problems with this:<br /> 1. Organisms before that had soft bodies, which don't fossilize easily<br /> 2. The &quot;explosion,&quot; we have to keep in mind, was over millions of years <br /> ===Age of the Earth===<br /> I have heard many, many claims that the Earth is only 6,000 years old, with various proofs offered (and I will not respond to all of them, yet) such as:<br /> *1. Mud on the Sea Floor<br /> *2. Winding up of the Galactic arms<br /> *3. Agriculture is too recent<br /> *4. History is too short<br /> *5. Human pop. too small<br /> *6. Too little H. Sapien skeletons<br /> *7. Comets (only last a few thousand years)<br /> *8. Too little Helium in the atmosphere<br /> *9. Fading of Earth's magnetic field, and <br /> *10. (my personal favourite) Erosion of the continents.<br /> ====Responses====<br /> *1. Plate tectonics is a wonderful thing. Mud goes down to the sea floor, eventually becomes sedimentary rock, comes back up with the rising continental plate (or goes back into the mantle)<br /> *2. Density waves have been proposed as a possible explanation for this. DW are like sound waves; areas of compression and areas of rarefaction. Stars move in and out of these waves (as do air molecules in sound waves). These density waves would also kick off star formation in there dense regions (also explaining why there are so many supernovae in the arms; there are bigger stars there).<br /> *3.+4. You really need agriculture to have civilization, as it support larger population with fewer people, so those left over can do useful things like live in cities, rule over others, etc. Some have suggested that writing was started for tax purposes (the ruler wants all he can get).<br /> <br /> ==Science==<br /> I do think that science is the answer to life's mysteries. Evidence and rational arguments are infinitely preferable to blind faith.<br /> ===Scientific Method===<br /> Everyone should know this.<br /> *1. Define question (ie see something and ask why? or how?, or any other related question)<br /> *2. Do research (observe phenomenon, try to find any previous work on the topic)<br /> *3. Form hypothesis (educated guess, the educated bit comes from step #2)<br /> *4. Define procedure and gather materials (what are you going to do in the experiment, and what will you be using)<br /> *5. Perform experiment and gather data (preferable many, many times)<br /> *6. Analyse data <br /> *7. Draw conclusions<br /> *8. If #7 disproved your hypothesis, redo steps #3-7<br /> *9. Publish results<br /> *10. Retest (usually by other scientists)<br /> ===Science doesn't know everything===<br /> If this were to happen, science would cease to exist. Science is all about change and new ideas as the old ones are constantly changed or thrown out. I have heard of the example of the migratory patterns of birds on this website, and how we haven't found an answer to that (thus implying that God has something to do with it). This is the whole point of science; to find out about the world. It is wrong to think that because the scientific community doesn't know something, they never will; it might just take a while.<br /> ===Fine tuning of the Universe===<br /> Frequently cited by others as proof of the existence of God (or gods). While I do agree that this does pose a problem, I think that there will be an answer. <br /> Many scientists go back to the anthropic principle (the universe is the way it is because if it were different we wouldn't be here to observe it). However, Stephen Hawking, in his excellent book ''A Brief History of Time'' talks about a GUT (Grand Unified Theory), that he thinks, once made, will give an answer to:<br /> *1. Why the universe exists in the first place, and<br /> *2. Why it developed in the way that it did.<br /> The GUT would involved &quot;quantum gravity,&quot; or something that explain what exactly goes on in a singularity (which is what the universe was once, according to the Big Bang theory) and also explain why things happened like they did when the universe was extremely small.<br /> Many things have been proposed for a GUT, more famously &quot;string theory&quot; (which is admittedly little more than extremely sophisticated guessing currently, because we don't have powerful enough machines to test it). Hopefully when the LHC particle accelerator (Large Hadron Collider) comes online in May, we will know more about the extremely small things in the universe (including the Higgs boson, which might explain why matter has mass), because of course faster speeds equal smaller bits of debris.<br /> <br /> For grades 4-7 (I skipped grade 5) I went to a private Christian school (First Baptist Christian School, in the Cayman Islands).<br /> <br /> I also happen to think that citations '''must''' be included with articles. Don't write whatever you would like and find citations in a few weeks (or expect other people to do it), or even worse, not citing it all (even after criticism).<br /> <br /> Phillipps is not my real name. He was a 19th century bibliomaniac (person who obsessively collects books) who amassed the largest private collection of manuscripts, as well as English legal books, and pretty much any other kind of book. Unfortunately he bankrupted his company doing it. It took over a century to auction off all of his books (which he endowed to the British Library, although they didn't want them)<br /> <br /> I think that the Atheism article should be balanced and ordered. I have been observing the various talk pages around Conservapedia, and I have noticed the same pattern: User suggests reform, initial acceptance by a few users, reform dies. Because of this I will attempt to reformat the &quot;Atheism&quot; article and show everyone a better alternative.</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User:Phillipps&diff=417265 2008-03-30T15:10:19Z

<p>Phillipps: </p> <hr /> <div>{{User Evo}}<br /> <br /> {{User evolutionScience}}<br /> <br /> {{User Political Compass|-3.00|-4.56}}<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> I am Canadian (and proud of it). I love classical music and sushi (and cheesecake for that matter). Nothing is better than a good book. I am extremely interested in history and science.<br /> I have been to:<br /> :The United States (Florida, Washington D.C., Boston)<br /> :Canada (born there)<br /> :England (lived there)<br /> :France<br /> :Belguim<br /> :Italy<br /> :The Cayman Islands (lived there)<br /> :Egypt<br /> :The Bahamas<br /> :The Dominican Republic<br /> <br /> I have always wanted to visit Germany (beautiful country) and Poland which has the last old growth forest (over several thousand years old, and funnily enough protected by Hermann Göring) left on the Eurasian plain.<br /> <br /> I have always wanted to write what I accept as fact, so here goes:<br /> <br /> ==Atheism==<br /> I am an Atheist (I suppose technically an Agnostic). <br /> ===Why===<br /> The burden of proof is on the one who asserts that something exists (ie Russel's Teapot) and I have not heard any sufficiently persuasive arguments (but there are many) for the existence of God. However, it is possible (since we cannot prove a universal negative, unless we go everywhere) that somewhere in the universe there might be a god. <br /> ===Morality===<br /> I think that an Atheist can still be moral even though they do no believe in God (or gods). There are two arguments that I have found that are very good for this:<br /> 1. Reciprocation<br /> I do not want to be robbed, murdered, cheated, etc., so why should I do the same to others? If we all did what was good only for ourselves this would happen: <br /> :1. General stealing (great gain for the individual)<br /> :2. Revenge against the stealer (to get the goods back, possibly murder)<br /> :3. Gradual escalation of violence until the current social and political fabric of the world collapses.<br /> :4. Survival of the fittest arises, culture and learning goes out the window.<br /> 2. For the good of society<br /> The world works because of a freedom in trade, action and thought. This allows for great scientific breakthroughs, sophisticated trading networks, etc. These only work if there is a general level of peace and security in the society as a whole. Being afraid of murder and theft (among other things) would be no help at all. This was seen during the Early Mediaeval Period (once called the Dark Ages), when, because of lawlessness and no stability, trade, both domestic and foreign, pretty much collapsed (although there was some).<br /> <br /> ===Origins of Life===<br /> Yes, it is true, I accept Darwinian Evolution (or the Theory of Evolution, or, as I like to call it, the TOE) as the best answer to the origin of life as we know it (ie Tree of Life). I do not think that God (or an Intelligent Designer) created some of the species, and evolution took over from there (what I like to call the orchard of life).<br /> Evolution is falsifiable (cat giving birth <br /> <br /> ===Cambrian Explosion===<br /> One of the more misunderstood phenomena. The Cambrian Explosion was the rapid &quot;explosion&quot; of most major complex organisms about 520 MYA (millions of years ago). This is pointed out as being the spot where there God or an intelligent designer intervened because everything appeared so quickly. There are two problems with this:<br /> 1. Organisms before that had soft bodies, which don't fossilize easily<br /> 2. The &quot;explosion,&quot; we have to keep in mind, was over millions of years <br /> ===Age of the Earth===<br /> I have heard many, many claims that the Earth is only 6,000 years old, with various proofs offered (and I will not respond to all of them, yet) such as:<br /> 1. Mud on the Sea Floor<br /> 2. Winding up of the Galactic arms<br /> 3. Agriculture is too recent<br /> 4. History is too short<br /> 5. Human pop. too small<br /> 6. Too little H. Sapien skeletons<br /> 7. Comets (only last a few thousand years)<br /> 8. Too little Helium in the atmosphere<br /> 9. Fading of Earth's magnetic field, and <br /> 10. (my personal favourite) Erosion of the continents.<br /> ====Responses====<br /> 1. Plate tectonics is a wonderful thing. Mud goes down to the sea floor, eventually becomes sedimentary rock, comes back up with the rising continental plate (or goes back into the mantle)<br /> 2. Density waves have been proposed as a possible explanation for this. DW are like sound waves; areas of compression and areas of rarefaction. Stars move in and out of these waves (as do air molecules in sound waves). These density waves would also kick off star formation in there dense regions (also explaining why there are so many supernovae in the arms; there are bigger stars there).<br /> 3.+4. You really need agriculture to have civilization, as it support larger population with fewer people, so those left over can do useful things like live in cities, rule over others, etc. Some have suggested that writing was started for tax purposes (the ruler wants all he can get).<br /> <br /> ==Science==<br /> I do think that science is the answer to life's mysteries. Evidence and rational arguments are infinitely preferable to blind faith.<br /> ===Scientific Method===<br /> Everyone should know this.<br /> *1. Define question (ie see something and ask why? or how?, or any other related question)<br /> *2. Do research (observe phenomenon, try to find any previous work on the topic)<br /> *3. Form hypothesis (educated guess, the educated bit comes from step #2)<br /> *4. Define procedure and gather materials (what are you going to do in the experiment, and what will you be using)<br /> *5. Perform experiment and gather data (preferable many, many times)<br /> *6. Analyse data <br /> *7. Draw conclusions<br /> *8. If #7 disproved your hypothesis, redo steps #3-7<br /> *9. Publish results<br /> *10. Retest (usually by other scientists)<br /> ===Science doesn't know everything===<br /> If this were to happen, science would cease to exist. Science is all about change and new ideas as the old ones are constantly changed or thrown out. I have heard of the example of the migratory patterns of birds on this website, and how we haven't found an answer to that (thus implying that God has something to do with it). This is the whole point of science; to find out about the world. It is wrong to think that because the scientific community doesn't know something, they never will; it might just take a while.<br /> ===Fine tuning of the Universe===<br /> Frequently cited by others as proof of the existence of God (or gods). While I do agree that this does pose a problem, I think that there will be an answer. <br /> Many scientists go back to the anthropic principle (the universe is the way it is because if it were different we wouldn't be here to observe it). However, Stephen Hawking, in his excellent book ''A Brief History of Time'' talks about a GUT (Grand Unified Theory), that he thinks, once made, will give an answer to:<br /> *1. Why the universe exists in the first place, and<br /> *2. Why it developed in the way that it did.<br /> The GUT would involved &quot;quantum gravity,&quot; or something that explain what exactly goes on in a singularity (which is what the universe was once, according to the Big Bang theory) and also explain why things happened like they did when the universe was extremely small.<br /> Many things have been proposed for a GUT, more famously &quot;string theory&quot; (which is admittedly little more than extremely sophisticated guessing currently, because we don't have powerful enough machines to test it). Hopefully when the LHC particle accelerator (Large Hadron Collider) comes online in May, we will know more about the extremely small things in the universe (including the Higgs boson, which might explain why matter has mass), because of course faster speeds equal smaller bits of debris.<br /> <br /> For grades 4-7 (I skipped grade 5) I went to a private Christian school (First Baptist Christian School, in the Cayman Islands).<br /> <br /> I also happen to think that citations '''must''' be included with articles. Don't write whatever you would like and find citations in a few weeks (or expect other people to do it), or even worse, not citing it all (even after criticism).<br /> <br /> Phillipps is not my real name. He was a 19th century bibliomaniac (person who obsessively collects books) who amassed the largest private collection of manuscripts, as well as English legal books, and pretty much any other kind of book. Unfortunately he bankrupted his company doing it. It took over a century to auction off all of his books (which he endowed to the British Library, although they didn't want them)<br /> <br /> I think that the Atheism article should be balanced and ordered. I have been observing the various talk pages around Conservapedia, and I have noticed the same pattern: User suggests reform, initial acceptance by a few users, reform dies. Because of this I will attempt to reformat the &quot;Atheism&quot; article and show everyone a better alternative.</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User_talk:Phillipps&diff=417061 2008-03-30T03:24:16Z

<p>Phillipps: /* re: Copying the conservapedia atheism article at this website */</p> <hr /> <div>'''Atheism Article'''<br /> <br /> Please do not recreate articles at atheism but rather use the talk pages. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 18:26, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> Sorry, I thought that it would be better to see it.--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 18:28, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> <br /> New Criticisms of Atheism Article.<br /> :Please note that everything below is both a work in progress and not an actual Conservapedia article. It is designed to be the complimentary article for my alternative article on atheism. Please don't edit or vandalize this, it is a personal project. I would like to thank all those that contributed to the original article: much of the wording below is that of others. (I'll get started on this later).<br /> <br /> == re: Copying the conservapedia atheism article at this website==<br /> <br /> Dear Phillipps,<br /> <br /> Please do not copy the conservapedia atheism article elsewhere on this website. Thank you. I erased your copying and will block you if you continue to persist. Thank you. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 22:28, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> : There's nothing wrong with him working on a draft of a new article (other than the possibility that he'll be wasting his time). That's precisely what's being done with the Intelligent Design article.<br /> : Phillipps, please hang fire for a little while while I continue to sort things out. I moved your draft to the wrong place and am having trouble fixing it.<br /> : [[User:Philip J. Rayment|Philip J. Rayment]] 22:33, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> :: Conservative said that he would send me an e-mail about this, so I'll wait a little bit for that. [[User:Philip J. Rayment|Philip J. Rayment]] 22:38, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> :::Right. I have plenty of time. Thanks again.--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 22:39, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> :I am going to log off now, Philip, and I won't be responding until probably tomorrow afternoon. By the way, while I do not agree with many of your views, you seem to be one of the most reasonable people here, and you never resort to bashing other people or name-calling of any kind (something that Conservapedia needs a lot less of, on all sides).--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 23:23, 29 March 2008 (EDT)</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User_talk:Phillipps&diff=417060 2008-03-30T03:23:57Z

<p>Phillipps: /* re: Copying the conservapedia atheism article at this website */</p> <hr /> <div>'''Atheism Article'''<br /> <br /> Please do not recreate articles at atheism but rather use the talk pages. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 18:26, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> Sorry, I thought that it would be better to see it.--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 18:28, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> <br /> New Criticisms of Atheism Article.<br /> :Please note that everything below is both a work in progress and not an actual Conservapedia article. It is designed to be the complimentary article for my alternative article on atheism. Please don't edit or vandalize this, it is a personal project. I would like to thank all those that contributed to the original article: much of the wording below is that of others. (I'll get started on this later).<br /> <br /> == re: Copying the conservapedia atheism article at this website==<br /> <br /> Dear Phillipps,<br /> <br /> Please do not copy the conservapedia atheism article elsewhere on this website. Thank you. I erased your copying and will block you if you continue to persist. Thank you. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 22:28, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> : There's nothing wrong with him working on a draft of a new article (other than the possibility that he'll be wasting his time). That's precisely what's being done with the Intelligent Design article.<br /> : Phillipps, please hang fire for a little while while I continue to sort things out. I moved your draft to the wrong place and am having trouble fixing it.<br /> : [[User:Philip J. Rayment|Philip J. Rayment]] 22:33, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> :: Conservative said that he would send me an e-mail about this, so I'll wait a little bit for that. [[User:Philip J. Rayment|Philip J. Rayment]] 22:38, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> :::Right. I have plenty of time. Thanks again.--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 22:39, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> :I am going to log off now. Philip, I won't be responding until probably tomorrow afternoon. By the way, while I do not agree with many of your views, you seem to be one of the most reasonable people here, and you never resort to bashing other people or name-calling of any kind (something that Conservapedia needs a lot less of, on all sides).--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 23:23, 29 March 2008 (EDT)</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User:Phillipps&diff=417058 2008-03-30T03:20:44Z

<p>Phillipps: </p> <hr /> <div>{{User Evo}}<br /> <br /> {{User evolutionScience}}<br /> <br /> {{User Political Compass|-3.00|-4.56}}<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> I am Canadian (and proud of it). I love classical music and sushi (and cheesecake for that matter). Nothing is better than a good book. I am extremely interested in history and science.<br /> I have been to:<br /> :The United States (Florida, Washington D.C., Boston)<br /> :Canada (born there)<br /> :England (lived there)<br /> :France<br /> :Belguim<br /> :Italy<br /> :The Cayman Islands (lived there)<br /> :Egypt<br /> :The Bahamas<br /> :The Dominican Republic<br /> <br /> I have always wanted to visit Germany (beautiful country) and Poland which has the last old growth forest (over several thousand years old, and funnily enough protected by Hermann Göring) left on the Eurasian plain.<br /> <br /> I am an Atheist (I suppose technically an Agnostic). The burden of proof is on the one who asserts that something exists (ie Russel's Teapot), and yes, it is possible (since we cannot prove a universal negative) that somewhere in the universe there might be a god. For grades 4-7 (I skipped grade 5) I went to a private Christian school (First Baptist Christian School, in the Cayman Islands).<br /> <br /> I also happen to think that citations '''must''' be included with articles. Don't write whatever you would like and find citations in a few weeks (or expect other people to do it), or even worse, not citing it all (even after criticism).<br /> <br /> Phillipps is not my real name. He was a 19th century bibliomaniac (person who obsessively collects books) who amassed the largest private collection of manuscripts, as well as English legal books, and pretty much any other kind of book. Unfortunately he bankrupted his company doing it. It took over a century to auction off all of his books (which he endowed to the British Library, although they didn't want them)<br /> <br /> I think that the Atheism article should be balanced and ordered. I have been observing the various talk pages around Conservapedia, and I have noticed the same pattern: User suggests reform, initial acceptance by a few users, reform dies. Because of this I will attempt to reformat the &quot;Atheism&quot; article and show everyone a better alternative.</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User:Phillipps&diff=417042 2008-03-30T03:00:51Z

<p>Phillipps: </p> <hr /> <div>{{User Evo}}<br /> <br /> {{User evolutionScience}}<br /> <br /> {{User Political Compass|-3.00|-4.56}}<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> I am Canadian (and proud of it). I love classical music and sushi (and cheesecake for that matter). Nothing is better than a good book.<br /> I have been to:<br /> :The United States (Florida, Washington D.C., Boston)<br /> :Canada (born there)<br /> :England (lived there)<br /> :France<br /> :Belguim<br /> :Italy<br /> :The Cayman Islands (lived there)<br /> :Egypt<br /> :The Bahamas<br /> :The Dominican Republic<br /> <br /> I have always wanted to visit Germany (beautiful country) and Poland which has the last old growth forest (over several thousand years old, and funnily enough protected by Hermann Göring) left on the Eurasian plain.<br /> <br /> I am an Atheist (I suppose technically an Agnostic). The burden of proof is on the one who asserts that something exists (ie Russel's Teapot), and yes, it is possible (since we cannot prove a universal negative) that somewhere in the universe there might be a god. For grades 4-7 (I skipped grade 5) I went to a private Christian school (First Baptist Christian School, in the Cayman Islands).<br /> <br /> I also happen to think that citations '''must''' be included with articles. Don't write whatever you would like and find citations in a few weeks (or expect other people to do it), or even worse, not citing it all (even after criticism).<br /> <br /> Phillipps is not my real name. He was a 19th century bibliomaniac (person who obsessively collects books) who amassed the largest private collection of manuscripts, as well as English legal books, and pretty much any other kind of book. Unfortunately he bankrupted his company doing it. It took over a century to auction off all of his books (which he endowed to the British Library, although they didn't want them)<br /> <br /> I think that the Atheism article should be balanced and ordered. I have been observing the various talk pages around Conservapedia, and I have noticed the same pattern: User suggests reform, initial acceptance by a few users, reform dies. Because of this I will attempt to reformat the &quot;Atheism&quot; article and show everyone a better alternative.</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User:Phillipps&diff=417035 2008-03-30T02:48:24Z

<p>Phillipps: </p> <hr /> <div>{{User Evo}}<br /> <br /> {{User evolutionScience}}<br /> <br /> {{User Political Compass|-3.00|-4.56}}<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> I am Canadian (and proud of it). I love classical music and sushi (and cheesecake for that matter). Nothing is better than a good book.<br /> I have been to:<br /> :The United States (Florida, Washington D.C., Boston)<br /> :Canada (born there)<br /> :England (lived there)<br /> :France<br /> :Belguim<br /> :Italy<br /> :The Cayman Islands (lived there)<br /> :Egypt<br /> :The Bahamas<br /> :The Dominican Republic<br /> <br /> I have always wanted to visit Germany (beautiful country) and Poland which has the last old growth forest (over several thousand years old, and funnily enough protected by Hermann Göring) left on the Eurasian plain.<br /> <br /> I am an Atheist (I suppose technically an Agnostic). The burden of proof is on the one who asserts that something exists (ie Russel's Teapot), and yes, it is possible (since we cannot prove a universal negative) that somewhere in the universe there might be a god. For grades 4-7 (I skipped grade 5) I went to a private Christian school (First Baptist Christian School, in the Cayman Islands).<br /> <br /> I also happen to think that citations '''must''' be included with articles. Don't write whatever you would like and find citations in a few weeks (or expect other people to do it), or even worse, not citing it all (even after criticism).<br /> <br /> I think that the Atheism article should be balanced and ordered. I have been observing the various talk pages around Conservapedia, and I have noticed the same pattern: User suggests reform, initial acceptance by a few users, reform dies. Because of this I will attempt to reformat the &quot;Atheism&quot; article and show everyone a better alternative.</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User_talk:Phillipps&diff=417031 2008-03-30T02:39:07Z

<p>Phillipps: /* re: Copying the conservapedia atheism article at this website */</p> <hr /> <div>'''Atheism Article'''<br /> <br /> Please do not recreate articles at atheism but rather use the talk pages. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 18:26, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> Sorry, I thought that it would be better to see it.--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 18:28, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> <br /> New Criticisms of Atheism Article.<br /> :Please note that everything below is both a work in progress and not an actual Conservapedia article. It is designed to be the complimentary article for my alternative article on atheism. Please don't edit or vandalize this, it is a personal project. I would like to thank all those that contributed to the original article: much of the wording below is that of others. (I'll get started on this later).<br /> <br /> == re: Copying the conservapedia atheism article at this website==<br /> <br /> Dear Phillipps,<br /> <br /> Please do not copy the conservapedia atheism article elsewhere on this website. Thank you. I erased your copying and will block you if you continue to persist. Thank you. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 22:28, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> : There's nothing wrong with him working on a draft of a new article (other than the possibility that he'll be wasting his time). That's precisely what's being done with the Intelligent Design article.<br /> : Phillipps, please hang fire for a little while while I continue to sort things out. I moved your draft to the wrong place and am having trouble fixing it.<br /> : [[User:Philip J. Rayment|Philip J. Rayment]] 22:33, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> :: Conservative said that he would send me an e-mail about this, so I'll wait a little bit for that. [[User:Philip J. Rayment|Philip J. Rayment]] 22:38, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> :::Right. I have plenty of time. Thanks again.--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 22:39, 29 March 2008 (EDT)</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User_talk:Phillipps&diff=417007 2008-03-30T02:22:41Z

<p>Phillipps: </p> <hr /> <div>'''Atheism Article'''<br /> <br /> Please do not recreate articles at atheism but rather use the talk pages. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 18:26, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> Sorry, I thought that it would be better to see it.--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 18:28, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> <br /> New Criticisms of Atheism Article.<br /> :Please note that everything below is both a work in progress and not an actual Conservapedia article. It is designed to be the complimentary article for my alternative article on atheism. Please don't edit or vandalize this, it is a personal project. I would like to thank all those that contributed to the original article: much of the wording below is that of others. (I'll get started on this later).</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User_talk:Phillipps&diff=417005 2008-03-30T02:22:09Z

<p>Phillipps: </p> <hr /> <div>'''Atheism Article'''<br /> <br /> Please do not recreate articles at atheism but rather use the talk pages. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 18:26, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> Sorry, I thought that it would be better to see it.--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 18:28, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> <br /> New Criticisms of Atheism Article.<br /> :Please note that everything below is both a work in progress and not an actual Conservapedia article. It is designed to be the complimentary article for my alternative article on atheism. Please don't edit or vandalize this, it is a personal project. I would like to thank all those that contributed to the original article: much of the wording below is that of others.</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User_talk:Phillipps&diff=416999 2008-03-30T02:16:37Z

<p>Phillipps: /* External links */</p> <hr /> <div>'''Atheism Article'''<br /> <br /> Please do not recreate articles at atheism but rather use the talk pages. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 18:26, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> Sorry, I thought that it would be better to see it.--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 18:28, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> <br /> New Atheism Article.<br /> :Please note that everything below is both a work in progress and not the actual Conservapedia article on atheism (just a hypothetical alternative). Please don't edit or vandalize this, it is a personal project. I would like to thank all those that contributed to the original article: much of the wording below is that of others.<br /> <br /> [[Image:Atheist-symbol.png‎|right|thumbnail|right|250px|An Atheist Symbol &lt;ref&gt;http://www.cem.va.gov/cem/hm/hmemb.asp&lt;/ref&gt;]]<br /> ''For criticisms of Atheism, see [[Criticisms of Atheism]]''<br /> <br /> '''Atheism''', as defined by the ''Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy'' and the ''Routledge Encyclopedia of Philosophy'', is the denial of the existence of any [[God]] or gods.&lt;ref&gt;http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/atheism-agnosticism/&lt;/ref&gt;&lt;ref&gt;http://www.creationontheweb.com/content/view/1998&lt;/ref&gt; <br /> <br /> <br /> == Which God or gods? ==<br /> [[Image:Socrates.jpg|thumb|right|150px|The [[Greece|Greek]] philosopher [[Socrates]]]]<br /> Since atheism is denial of the existence of God or gods, it is important first to identify in which God and/or gods the atheist denies. In ancient times, for example, Christians were accused of being atheists because of their denial of the pagan gods, even though they believed in the ''Christian'' God.&lt;ref&gt;Athenagoras, ''A Plea for the Christians, 2d century A.D.[http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/athenagoras-plea.html]&lt;/ref&gt; [[Socrates]] was also accused of Atheism, although references to God run throughout his recorded statements.&lt;ref&gt;Plato, Apol., 26,c.&lt;/ref&gt; Also, [[Albert Einstein]] and [[Baruch Spinoza]] professed belief in &quot;God,&quot; but they defined &quot;God&quot; as the cosmos as a whole, and without personality.<br /> <br /> == Why do atheists state they disbelieve?==<br /> Atheists claim there are two main reasons for their denial of the existence of God and/or disbelief in God: the conviction that there is positive evidence or argument that God does not exist ([[Strong atheism]] which is also sometimes called positive atheism), and their claim that theists bear the burden of proof to show that God exists, that they have failed to do so, and that belief is therefore unwarranted ([[Weak atheism]]).<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> ==Atheist Groups and Organizations==<br /> ===Brights Movement===<br /> [[Image:Richard_Dawkins.jpg‎|thumbnail|200px|right|[[Richard Dawkins]] is listed as an enthusiastic bright by the [[Brights Movement]] website.]]<br /> The [[Brights Movement]] was started in 2003 by [[Paul Geisert]] and [[Mynga Futrell]] in 2003 in order to assist in the advocacy of a [[Naturalism|naturalistic worldview]].&lt;ref&gt;http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2843/is_2_28/ai_114090211/pg_1&lt;/ref&gt;&lt;ref&gt;http://www.the-brights.net/vision/faq.html#1&lt;/ref&gt; The Brights movement had a media campaign and was announced in [[Wired (magazine)|Wired]] magazine (by evolutionary biologist [[Richard Dawkins]]), ''[[Free Inquiry]]'' (by Richard Dawkins), and on the ''[[New York Times]]'' op-ed page (by the philosopher and atheist [[Daniel Dennett]]).&lt;ref&gt;http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2843/is_2_28/ai_114090211/pg_1&lt;/ref&gt; However, according to a 2004 ''[[Skeptical Enquirer]]'' article the movement the &quot;Brights label reinforced a longstanding stereotype. Atheists already have a terrible rap for being coldhearted [[Rationalism|rationalists]] who attend [[Mensa]] gatherings and dismiss religious believers as simple-minded fools.&quot;&lt;ref&gt;http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2843/is_2_28/ai_114090211/pg_3&lt;/ref&gt; In October of 2003 in a article in the ''[[Guardian]]'' Dawkins associated being a &quot;bright&quot; with being an intellectual.&lt;ref&gt;http://books.guardian.co.uk/review/story/0,12084,981412,00.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> ===Internet Infidels===<br /> [[Internet Infidels]] (also known as the Secular Web) is one of the principle websites for those who advocate atheism, [[agnosticism|agnostics]] and [[Philosophical skepticism|skeptics]] on the internet. Member's of the Internet Infidels website include:<br /> <br /> *[[Earl Doherty]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-D.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Richard Carrier]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-C.html&lt;/ref&gt; <br /> *[[Dan Barker]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-B.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Stephen Carr]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-C.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Jeffery Jay Lowder]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-L.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Acharya S]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-A.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Kyle Gerkin]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-G.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *Farrell Till &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-T.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ===American Atheists===<br /> American Atheists is an atheistic organization dedicated to securing freedom from religion, labour for separation of church and state, and defend the civil rights of atheists.&lt;ref&gt;http://www.atheists.org/visitors.center/intro.html#primary&lt;/ref&gt; American Atheists was founded by Madalyn Murray O'Hair, winner of the lawsuit that removed prayer and bible recitations from schools.&lt;ref&gt;http://www.atheists.org/visitors.center/about.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ===Carvaka school===<br /> An atheistic and materialistic offshoot of [[Hinduism]] in the 6th century B.C.<br /> <br /> ===Samkhya school===<br /> An atheistic school of classical Indian philosophy, originating in the 6th century B.C.<br /> == Well Known Proponents of Atheism ==<br /> [[Image:Ncvjgfu.jpg|right|thumbnail|150px|[[Mao Zedong]]]]Prominent atheists include, or have thought to have include:<br /> * [[Diagoras]]: Greek philosopher who denied the existence of the Greek pantheon<br /> * [[Lucretius]]: Greek philosopher espousing materialism, and stated that man should not believe in the gods because their ideas about the gods and their fear of death made men unhappy<br /> * [[Friedrich Nietzsche]]: Prominent 19th century atheist philosopher<br /> [[Image:nietzsche2.jpg|right|200px|thumbnail|[[Friedrich Nietzsche]]]]<br /> * [[Mao Zedong]]<br /> * [[Benito Mussolini]]<br /> * [[Paul Kurtz]]: founder of the Council of [[Secular Humanism]]<br /> * [[Bertrand Russell]]<br /> * [[Ayn Rand]]<br /> * [[Isaac Asimov]]<br /> * [[John Dewey]]<br /> * [[Douglas Adams]]<br /> * [[Ernest Hemingway]]<br /> *Richard Dawkins<br /> *Baron d'Holbach<br /> == Views on Atheists ==<br /> <br /> In regards to various [[Views on Atheists|views on atheists]], research in the American Sociological Review finds that among several groups listed, those who hold the position of atheism are the group that Americans relate least to in terms of their vision of American society and are the group most likely to be mentioned as one that Americans would not want to have marry into their family.<br /> &lt;ref&gt;Edgell, Gerteis &amp; Hartmann 2006&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> {| class=&quot;wikitable&quot;<br /> |-<br /> ! Position:<br /> ! This group does not at all agree with&lt;br&gt; my vision of American society:<br /> ! I would disapprove if my child wanted&lt;br&gt; to marry a member of this group:<br /> |-<br /> | Atheist<br /> | 39.6%<br /> | 47.6%<br /> |-<br /> | Muslim<br /> | 26.3%<br /> | 33.5%<br /> |-<br /> | Homosexual<br /> | 22.6%<br /> | NA<br /> |-<br /> |Conservative Christian<br /> | 13.5%<br /> | 6.9%<br /> |-<br /> | Recent Immigrant<br /> | 12.5%<br /> | Not Asked<br /> |-<br /> | Hispanic<br /> | 7.6%<br /> | 18.5%<br /> |-<br /> | Jew<br /> | 7.4%<br /> | 11.8%<br /> |-<br /> | Asian American<br /> | 7.0%<br /> | 18.5%<br /> |-<br /> |African American<br /> | 4.6%<br /> | 27.2%<br /> |-<br /> | White American<br /> | 2.2%<br /> | 2.3%<br /> |}<br /> <br /> == Atheist Population==<br /> <br /> In regards to the [[Atheist Population|atheist population]] as a percentage of various countries' populations, specific research on atheists conducted in 2006 [http://www.harrisinteractive.com/news/allnewsbydate.asp?NewsID=1131 suggests] that the true proportion of atheists is 4% in the United States, 17% in Great Britain and 32% in France. A survey published in the 2005 ''[[Encyclopedia Britannica]]'' stated that 2.3% of the world's population consists of individuals who profess &quot;atheism, skepticism, disbelief, or irreligion, including the militantly antireligious.&quot;&lt;ref&gt;http://search.eb.com/eb/article-9432620&lt;/ref&gt; In regards to the 2.3% figure just mentioned, the 2005 survey cited by ''Encyclopedia Britannica'' survey did not include [[Buddhism|Buddhist]] in regards to the 2.3% figure and Buddhism can be [[Theism|theistic]] or atheistic.&lt;ref&gt;http://www.religionfacts.com/buddhism/beliefs/atheism.htm&lt;/ref&gt;&lt;ref&gt;http://search.eb.com/eb/article-9432620&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> ==Atheism Quotes==<br /> <br /> ===For Atheism===<br /> <br /> *&quot;Isn't it enough to see that a garden is beautiful without having to believe that there are fairies at the bottom of it too?&quot; -Douglas Adams, from ''Last Chance to See''&lt;ref&gt;http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/quotes/douglas.htm&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;In Christianity neither morality nor religion come into contact with reality at any point.&quot;-Friedrich Nietzche &lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=13&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;Which is it, is man one of God's blunders or is God one of man's?&quot;-Friedrich Nietzche&lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=13&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;If God did not exist, it would be necessary to invent him.&quot;-Voltaire &lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=29&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;Faith is the great cop-out, the great excuse to evade the need to think and evaluate evidence. Faith is belief in spite of, even perhaps because of, the lack of evidence.&quot;-Richard Dawkins&lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=41&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;Tolerance and freedom of thought are the veritable antidotes to religious fanaticism.&quot;-Baron d'Holbach &lt;ref&gt;http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/quotes/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;If the ignorance of nature gave birth to gods, the knowledge of nature is calculated to destroy them.&quot;-Baron d'Holbach&lt;ref&gt;http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/quotes/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ===Against Atheism===<br /> <br /> [[Image:Raphael.jpg|right|thumbnail|175px|[[Plato]]]]<br /> *&quot;Atheism is a disease of the soul before it becomes an error of understanding.&quot; - [[Plato]]&lt;ref&gt;http://en.thinkexist.com/quotation/atheism_is_a_disease_of_the_soul-before_it/166811.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *Maybe the atheist cannot find God for the same reason a thief cannot find a policeman.&quot; - [[Francis Thomson]]&lt;ref&gt;http://www.afcministry.com/Atheism_Examined.htm&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;The atheists are for the most part imprudent and misguided scholars who reason badly who, not being able to understand the Creation, the origin of evil, and other difficulties, have recourse to the hypothesis the eternity of things and of inevitability.&quot; - [[Voltaire]]&lt;ref&gt;http://history.hanover.edu/texts/voltaire/volathe2.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;Atheists put on false courage and alcacrity in the midst of their darkness and aprehensions, like children who, when they fear to go in the dark, will sing for fear.&quot; - [[Alexander Pope]] &lt;ref&gt;http://books.google.com/books?id=cs4eAAAAMAAJ&amp;pg=PA383&amp;lpg=PA383&amp;dq=atheists+and+%22alexander+pope%22+and+%22false+courage%22&amp;source=web&amp;ots=Fx7SL7Z7UB&amp;sig=mYdRm6hkdBkmsF_uJW9mPv3JRhE&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;An atheist’s most embarrassing moment is when he feels profoundly thankful for something,but can’t think of anyone to thank for it&quot; - [[Mary Anne Vincent]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.weeks-g.dircon.co.uk/quotes_by_author_uv.htm&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *If there were no God there would be no atheists. - [[G. K. Chesterton]] (1874 - 1936) &lt;ref&gt;http://www.quotationspage.com/subjects/atheism/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *Nobody talks so constantly about God as those who insist there is no God. - [[Heywood Broun]]<br /> <br /> <br /> * Atheism is a crutch for those who cannot bear the reality of God. - [[Tom Stoppard]]&lt;ref&gt;http://www.tentmaker.org/Quotes/atheismquotes.htm&lt;/ref&gt; <br /> <br /> <br /> *I gave in, and admitted that God was God. - ex-atheist [[C.S. Lewis]], On relinquishing atheism at age 31 in 1929&lt;ref&gt;http://www.bartleby.com/63/95/4195.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *A little philosophy inclineth man's mind to atheism, but depth in philosophy bringeth men's minds about to religion. - Sir [[Francis Bacon]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.notable-quotes.com/a/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *An atheist is a man who believes himself an accident. — [[Francis Thompson]]&lt;ref&gt;http://forthardknox.com/2007/06/02/the-10-best-quotes-to-counter-an-atheist/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> [[Image:Joseph-addison-3-sized.jpg‎|right|thumbnail|175px|[[Joseph Addison]]]]<br /> *To be an atheist requires an indefinitely greater measure of faith than to recieve all the great truths which atheism would deny. - [[Joseph Addison]], The Spectator, Mar. 8, 1711 &lt;ref&gt;http://www.notable-quotes.com/a/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *It is hard to see how a great man can be an atheist. Without the sustaining influence of faith in a divine power we could have little faith in ourselves. We need to feel that behind us is intelligence and love. Doubters do not achieve; skeptics do not contribute; cynics do not create. Faith is the great motive power, and no man realizes his full possibilities unless he has the deep conviction that life is eternally important, and that his work, well done, is a part of an unending plan. - [[Calvin Coolidge]], speech, Jul. 25, 1924 &lt;ref&gt;http://www.notable-quotes.com/a/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *Among the repulsions of atheism for me has been its drastic un-interestingness as an intellectual position. Where was the ingenuity, the ambiguity, the humanity of saying that the universe just happened to happen and that when we're dead we're dead? - [[John Updike]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.just-quotes.com/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *God never wrought miracles to convince atheism, because his ordinary works convince it. - Sir [[Francis Bacon]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.just-quotes.com/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *The habit of arguing in support of atheism, whether it be done from conviction or in pretense, is a wicked and impious practice. - Marcus Tullius [[Cicero]] (106–43 B.C.), Roman orator, philosopher, statesman&lt;ref&gt;http://www.bartleby.com/66/50/12450.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *How to trap an atheist: Serve him a fine meal, then ask him if he believes there is a cook. — Source Unknown &lt;ref&gt;http://forthardknox.com/2007/06/02/the-10-best-quotes-to-counter-an-atheist/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *I once wanted to become an atheist but I gave up . . . they have no holidays. - [[Henny Youngman]]&lt;ref&gt;http://www.bartleby.com/63/79/4779.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ==See Also==<br /> *[[Agnosticism]]<br /> *[[History of Atheism]]<br /> *[[Criticism of Atheism]]<br /> <br /> ==External links==<br /> *[http://www.infidels.org/ Internet Infidels Website] <br /> *[http://www.atheists.org/ American Atheists Website]<br /> *[http://www.carm.org/atheism.htm Atheism] by [[Christian Apologetics and Research Ministry]]<br /> *[http://creationwiki.org/Decline_of_atheism Decline of Atheism -CreationWiki]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zaKryi3605g&amp;NR=1 Richard Dawkins Being Stumped By a Creationists' Question - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VyNqw6umRq8&amp;feature=related Atheist's Nightmare - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hnCBwGJHZQg Atheism: Rational and Objective? Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v0fImg64yok&amp;feature=related Ravi Zacharias on Atheistic Evolution - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uQAYXlSDvlY Koukl: Greatest murders? - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L3r_SbmLQu0&amp;feature=related Koukl: Why Atheistic Fundamentalism ? - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZP8zI8JT-rk Psychology of Atheism part 1 of 2 - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E2Re56A9syg&amp;feature=related Psychology of Atheism part 2 of 2 - Video Clip]<br /> <br /> == Notes ==<br /> {{reflist|2}}<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> [[Category:Atheism]]<br /> [[Category:Religion]]<br /> [[Category:Philosophy]]</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=Talk:Atheism/archive6&diff=416985 2008-03-30T02:04:38Z

<p>Phillipps: New page: ==Congratulations Conservapedia!== Truly in my life have I ever read such an unfounded, biased article. Well done. I love the subtle hints about the ties between communism and atheism, ver...</p> <hr /> <div>==Congratulations Conservapedia!==<br /> Truly in my life have I ever read such an unfounded, biased article. Well done. I love the subtle hints about the ties between communism and atheism, very unbiased! Of course, countries like Australia and Germany have high atheist populations and are completely democratic, but of course that doesn't tie in with your own ideas and therefore is omitted. Just so you know, communist regimes like Stalin's repress religion as a means to suppress any ideas that differ from the state. And now that you mention regimes, wasn't Adolf Hitler a Roman Catholic? You know, the guy that started a war that caused over 50 million deaths? The guy that started a religious genocide? Yeah, thats the guy, I'm sure of it! Oh but wait, he had a bad relationship with his father, so of course he must have been...an atheist! It all makes so much sense now.<br /> <br /> Another thing, I love the fact that the arguments you have put forward as atheists arguments are actually what ''you'' think atheist arguments are, and no doubt the weaker arguments at that are the ones that are included. Not that you know, science actually explains to us what lightning and thunder is, as opposed to the theist argument: &quot;Oh no, gods angry!!!&quot; Nah, thats a strong argument, can't include that can we! <br /> <br /> &quot;Moral depravity: Moral depravity has been demonstrated in the atheist community through history and through various studies&quot;. Sorry but that just made me sick to the stomach. Do you, in all honestly, ''seriously'' think that if there was no Christianity, no religion, that everybody would go around murdering, raping, pillaging? Do you ''really''? If so, then sorry, but you're a clot. All that train of thought shows is your brains inability to comprehend situations other than the ones you have been spoon-fed since a child. I'm an atheist, have I killed anyone? Have I taken drugs, or committed racial crimes? Of course not! I'll have you know I donate regularly to charity, and am a blood and organ donor. And don't rebut with that argument that high moral standards and charity within atheism has a low occurrence, because you are just plain, undeniably wrong. If you think about it actually, religion is, intentionally or unintentionally, a scapegoat to remove ones own responsibilities: rather than take responsibility for race-related murder, a Christian could merely say 'but my religion taught me so!' Ah yes, such a peaceful lot you are.<br /> <br /> &quot;As noted earlier, a majority of the most prominent and vocal defenders of the naturalistic evolutionary position since World War II have been atheists.[108][109] Creation scientists tend to win the Creation-Evolution debates and many debates have been held since the 1970's particularly in the United States.&quot; And an example of said won debate is? I really do love it, Conservapedia, how you unashamedly provide examples of Christian superiority in an argument vs atheism, but don't bother to back it up. Seems to be a recurring thing really; &quot;And so Moses split the great sea&quot; 'How do you know?' &quot;Shut up! I'm right and you're wrong!&quot; Ah yes, masters of debate they are, the Christian faith.<br /> <br /> Oh and just returning to the moral thing: I think atheists have higher morals and ethics than Christians. You know why? We are able to figure out for ourselves, using our brains, that it's bad to steal or to hurt. ''Christians'' on the other hand, need a ''BOOK'' to tell them how to think and how to act. Can you see now, why I think Christians are a dim-witted community?<br /> <br /> Oh and, haha! I love the bit about different faiths position on marrying into the family. Such great scientific evidence, asking questions that benefit Christianity in a predominantly Christian country. Phwoar, you really showed us dumb atheists didn't ya!<br /> <br /> Once again, thank you Conservapedia, for dumbing down the general population, spreading bias through the universe, and ensuring your children aren't allowed to make up their own minds. <br /> <br /> Peace (to the censors!).<br /> <br /> <br /> == Atheism Quotes ==<br /> <br /> All the quotes are just atheist-bashing. What purpose does that section serve?<br /> <br /> == An argument against the existence of God ==<br /> <br /> Why doesn't God heal amputees?<br /> --[[Moderatedemocrat]]<br /> <br /> :You just took that from the name of a semi-popular site, correct? -_- [[User:Kektklik|Fuzzy]] 14:01, 19 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> :It is a widely-asked question (on many popular or semi-popular sites as well as outside of the internet community) that deserves a decent answer. So, I ask you: Why doesn't the Almighty heal amputees? Surely you have an answer.<br /> <br /> --[[Moderatedemocrat]]<br /> <br /> Here is a summary of your argument:<br /> #If God existed, He would heal amputees.<br /> #God does not heal amputees.<br /> #Therefore, God does not exist.<br /> <br /> This is a [[valid argument]]; i.e., the conclusion follows from the premises. But in order for this to be a [[sound argument]], both the premises would have to be true. I disagree with the first premise entirely, and I also question the second one a bit. --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] &lt;sup&gt;[[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]]&lt;/sup&gt; 14:21, 19 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> ::I am not knowledgeable enough in my faith to answer that question. I'm still a &quot;child of faith&quot; (like a Padowan learner).. almost a &quot;teen of faith&quot; (on ''fire'' for God). I do not have liberty to speak for God. (sorry). Not all Christians are uber close to God; I know very few my age (18-21) who are.<br /> <br /> And Ed, I think MD is more trying to disprove God's power or saying God is biased against amputees. [http://whywontgodhealamputees.com/god5.htm] -_- [[User:Kektklik|Fuzzy]] 14:24, 19 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> :Could be. Theology is a vast subject. What are the limits of [[God's power]]? If there are any limits, are they intrinsic limits like He can't make 2+2=5? Or might these be self-imposed limits (see [[free will]])? <br /> <br /> :I wonder how much of atheism derives from the belief that God has &quot;biases&quot; against various persons. &quot;I won't believe in God, because I enjoy [[gay sex]] and He refuses to give his approval.&quot; --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] &lt;sup&gt;[[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]]&lt;/sup&gt; 14:41, 19 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> == &quot;Reasons for Atheism&quot; ==<br /> <br /> I sort of resent the fact that this article implies that there needs to be a reason for someone to be an atheist. I don't think a Christian would like an article that says one of the reasons they are a theist is because they had a poor relationship with his/her father.<br /> <br /> Can we maybe remove that section or add &quot;Belief that there is not a God&quot;?<br /> <br /> I agree with this. Perhaps we should ask why one is not an Athiest. [[User:Monkey998|Monkey998]] 23:00, 9 December 2007 (EST)<br /> <br /> <br /> The entry omits one possible reason for atheism: God does not exist.<br /> <br /> == Definition of Atheism ==<br /> <br /> The definition of atheism in the article seemed a bit odd. So I contacted the author of the article in the Stanford Encyclopedia. The correspondence is given below. If you have any doubts about the genuineness of this, please contact the Professor yourself.<br /> <br /> Dear Prof. Smart,<br /> <br /> I read with interest your thorough and detailed review of atheism and agnosticism (http://setis.library.usyd.edu.au/stanford/entries/atheism-agnosticism/). I am curious about the definition you have provided at the beginning of the article which reads &quot; denial of existence of god&quot;. Does it not imply that atheists are in a state of denial of some thing that really exists? I have always believed atheism is a lack of belief in a god.<br /> <br /> Please let me know.<br /> <br /> <br /> Answer:<br /> <br /> Dear XXXXX, You are quite right. I should have said 'denial of the proposition that God exists' But a sympathetic reader would understand it this way. Best wishes Jack Smart<br /> <br /> So can we change that accordingly ? --[[User:JBuscombe|JBuscombe]] 17:58, 25 October 2007 (EDT)<br /> <br /> ==Picking Nits==<br /> Great article, a seriously nice piece of work, but the following errors jumped out at me (and I, of course, cannot change these myself):<br /> *Something's missing in the second sentence of the article (&quot;There different types of atheism...&quot;).<br /> *&quot;A.D.&quot; comes before the date, not after.<br /> *&quot;b.c.&quot; should be capitalized.<br /> --[[User:PeteVan|PeteVan]] 22:55, 27 September 2007 (EDT)<br /> :::What sections of the article do they occur. I don't know as I did not put those in. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 22:57, 27 September 2007 (EDT)<br /> ::::[[Atheism#Types_of_Atheism|Here]], [[Atheism#Atheism_and_the_Foundation_of_Modern_Science|here]] and [[Atheism#Well_Known_Proponents_of_Atheism|here]]. [[User:Feebasfactor|Feebasfactor]] 23:00, 27 September 2007 (EDT)<br /> :Actually, I did put the A.D. one in but I just found out that either convention is acceptable. However, I just fixed the b.c. problem thanks to your input. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 23:02, 27 September 2007 (EDT)<br /> ::So another 300 edits later.....[[User:MattM|MattM]] 22:18, 1 October 2007 (EDT)<br /> <br /> == Madalyn Murray O'Hair Murder ==<br /> <br /> Madalyn Murray O'Hair Murder plus son claims the organization American Atheists lied over and over again: see: http://www.rfcnet.org/news/default.asp?action=detail&amp;article=144<br /> <br /> Lots of people lie. You lie. I lie. Your father, your mom, your sister lie.<br /> The mailman lies.<br /> The football announcer lies.<br /> The priest lies. Albiet a little more than the others.<br /> Hell, even the president lies.<br /> :And you were removed for lying, by your own admition. [[User:Karajou|Karajou]] 08:06, 22 October 2007 (EDT)<br /> <br /> == supposed tax returns of American Atheist ==<br /> <br /> supposed tax returns of American Atheist plus WHO SPEAKS FOR ATHEISM? The Problem of American Atheists, Inc. - see N.J Atheist website at: http://www.njatheist.org:81/makedifferencetakeaction.html<br /> <br /> WHO SPEAKS FOR ATHEISM? The Problem of American Atheists, Inc. at: http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Forum/8666/ht-whospeaks.html<br /> <br /> Supposed 2002 tax return of American Atheist at: http://tfcny.fdncenter.org/990_pdf_archive/742/742466507/742466507_200212_990.pdf<br /> <br /> <br /> Supposed 2003 tax return of American Atheist at: http://tfcny.fdncenter.org/990_pdf_archive/742/742466507/742466507_200312_990.pdf<br /> <br /> ==Disappearance Madalyn Murray O'Hair ==<br /> <br /> NY Times, December 22, 1996 by SAM HOWE VERHOVEK - Months After Disappearance of Leading Atheist, Group says $600,000 Is Missing, Too at: http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9403EED81231F931A15751C1A960958260&amp;sec=&amp;spon=&amp;pagewanted=print<br /> <br /> == American Atheists and Frank Zindler/William Lane Craig debate ==<br /> <br /> From TrueOrigin.org: &quot;Frank Zindler - A leading light in the American Atheists. Isn’t it amazing how so many atheists love evolution and appear to be threatened by the massive scientific evidence for creation? Zindler took the atheism side in an Atheism v. Christianity debate in front of 7,500 people at Willow Creek Community Church, USA. His opponent, Dr William Lane Craig, tore his ignorant arguments to shreds so effectively that many atheists in the audience realised that Zindler had lost the debate. It was presumably to this debate that John Snowden was alluding when he wrote that a representative of the American Atheists, whom he used to support, lost a public debate to a “fundamentalist” (Skeptic 18(3), 1998).&quot;[http://www.trueorigin.org/noaig.asp] [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 05:54, 2 October 2007 (EDT)<br /> <br /> ==Atheism in America is poorly defined...==<br /> <br /> The book Saints and Sinners by Lawrence Wright published by Vintage Books in 1993 states on page 114 cites a number of '''2,400''' members for the organization American Atheists.[http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Forum/8666/ht-whospeaks.html] The book Atheist Cult by Fred Woodworth in the 1997 edition on page 11 stated a membership of '''2,000''' members and dropping for the organization American Atheists.[http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Forum/8666/ht-whospeaks.html] Madalyn Murray O'Hair disappeared in late August of 1995.[http://www.atheists.org/visitors.center/OHairFamily/disappearance.html] <br /> <br /> &quot;Atheism in America is poorly defined with little organization&quot; said a editor of the Texas Atheist Newsletter.[http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Forum/8666/ht-whospeaks.html] Freedom From Religion Foundation claims to have '''over''' '''10,000''' members and also claims to be the largest group of atheists and agnostics in America [http://ffrf.org/index2.php] [[User:Conservative/atheistswebtraffic|and its web traffic is about the same as the organization American Atheists according to Alexa]]. <br /> <br /> The son of Madalyn Murray O'Hair, William J. Murray, first released his letter in 1999 in which he claimed the American Atheists repeatedly lied about a matter plus he stated the following regarding his mother:&quot;My mother delighted in hiring unrepentant criminals to work in her atheist office. She particularly enjoyed hiring convicted murderers who had served their time but were unrepentant about what they had done. She got a sense of power out of having men in her employ who had taken human life. It was love of power over people that finally caused not only her death, but the deaths of my brother and my daughter....No ... She was just evil. She stole huge amounts of money. She misused the trust of people. She cheated children out of their parents’ inheritance. She cheated on her taxes and even stole from her own organizations. She once printed up phony stock certificates on her own printing press to try to take over another atheist publishing company. I could go on but I won’t. All the money my mother made in this manner stayed behind. It did not go with her....During Easter, what is left of my mother’s American Atheist organization held a convention in New Jersey. My ministry placed an advertisement in the newspaper there to tell them about Jesus. The new atheist leader, Ellen Johnson, ranted and raved against me, against Christ and against the Holy Spirit. Johnson told the media that the whole idea of my mother being murdered was a fabrication. She told the newspapers that I had &quot;manufactured&quot; the story using my connections to Congress to trick the FBI into getting involved. Why does this woman protest so much? Why does she not even shed a tear for her departed leader?&quot;[http://www.rfcnet.org/news/default.asp?action=detail&amp;article=144]<br /> <br /> Supposed 2002 tax return of American Atheist at: http://tfcny.fdncenter.org/990_pdf_archive/742/742466507/742466507_200212_990.pdf<br /> <br /> <br /> Supposed 2003 tax return of American Atheist at: http://tfcny.fdncenter.org/990_pdf_archive/742/742466507/742466507_200312_990.pdf<br /> <br /> <br /> Does anyone if the recent tax records of Freedom From Religion Foundation and American Atheists are a matter of public record rather than rely on those two web links above in regards to the organization American Atheists? [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 08:18, 2 October 2007 (EDT)<br /> :::I have 3 questions for people. 1) How many members do you think the Freedom From Religion Foundation has? 2)How many members do you think the organization American Atheists has? 3)Why do you think the web traffic as given by Alexa is about the same for Freedom From Religion Foundation as it is for the organization American Atheists? [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 21:08, 2 October 2007 (EDT)<br /> <br /> ==Confused==<br /> I'm new here and not quite sure what to make of this. Maybe this has been brought up, but there seems to be just to much to go through to check. My concern is that this article ought to be something else. It doesn't exacly read like an Atheism article. It's more like &quot;Reasons not to be an Atheist&quot; or something. I came to look at this article because, while I might be very conservative on fiscal, immigration, national security, etc. issues, I'm by no mean a religious person. I'm not an atheist, I'm just not very religious. [[User:SigmaEtaIotaTau|&lt;big&gt;&lt;i&gt;&lt;font face=&quot;Symbol&quot; color=&quot;Red&quot;&gt;SigmaHtaIotaTau&lt;/font&gt;&lt;/i&gt;&lt;/big&gt;]][[User_Talk:SigmaEtaIotaTau|&lt;font color=&quot;green&quot; face=&quot;Comic Sans MS&quot;&gt;&lt;b&gt;&lt;i&gt;&lt;sup&gt; is on me&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/i&gt;&lt;/b&gt;&lt;/font&gt;]] 11:07, 2 October 2007 (EDT)<br /> :::In the see also section, there is a [[History of Atheism]] article that needs to be created and it might be a good idea to merge this article into the present atheism article. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 21:10, 2 October 2007 (EDT)<br /> <br /> ::::Yeah, that'll really sort out the problem that has been noted above for the umpteenth time. *slaps forehead* [[User:Ferret|-- Ferret]] [[User talk:Ferret|&lt;sub&gt;Nice old chat&lt;/sub&gt;]] 06:48, 4 October 2007 (EDT)<br /> <br /> == &quot;Reasonable Explanations of Atheism&quot; and everything else ==<br /> <br /> I've been both an atheist and conservative for quite a few years, and I can attest that I am not rebelling against God, a lover of moral depravity, and I even happen to have an excellent relationship with my father. Simply put, this article is embarrassing. It appears to be a composite of anti-atheist rants rather than a reasoned description of a position that quite a few conservatives hold. In short, this mess needs to be cleaned up. --[[User:Diagoras|Diagoras]] 10:06, 18 October 2007 (EDT)<br /> <br /> :Actually, I'm rather interested this; Conservative, how ''would'' you explain Diagoras' atheism? Which category would of &quot;reasonable explanation&quot; would he fall into? I'm aware that the article is indisputable, but I'd like to know what you personally think on this matter. [[User:Feebasfactor|Feebasfactor]] 16:53, 18 October 2007 (EDT)<br /> ::Diagoras, you said you an atheist and you are not rebelling against God. It is nice to see an atheist recognize there is a God. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 23:51, 20 October 2007 (EDT)<br /> :::That's a contradiction in terms, I am not rebelling against God because none exists. But that is irrelevant, the blatant bigotry and stereotypes in the article are the issue. Many atheists are kind, moral, conservative individuals and this article does not do justice to us. --[[User:Diagoras|Diagoras]] 00:12, 21 October 2007 (EDT)<br /> ::::::Diagoras, please cite some studies or some substantial historical support regarding your position. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 20:41, 21 October 2007 (EDT)<br /> :::::::Evidence that there are kind atheist in the world? Well, up to 14% of Americans are secular, 5% atheist, many of whom lead productive, peaceful lives.<br /> :::::::http://www.holysmoke.org/icr-pri.htm - Atheist are a minority of the prison population proportionally.<br /> :::::::http://www.gallup.com/poll/3979/Americans-Today-Much-More-Accepting-Woman-Black-Catholic.aspx - Being an atheist is reason enough to not be president.<br /> :::::::http://www.nobeliefs.com/jefferson.htm - Jefferson, anti-federalist, states rights activist, founder of many of the precepts of modern conservatism, was an atheist.<br /> <br /> :::::::This is just off the top of my head, let me know if there is a specific field you want me to provide data for.<br /> :::::::--[[User:Diagoras|Diagoras]] 10:09, 22 October 2007 (EDT)<br /> <br /> :::Diagoras, the gruel you dished off the top of your head was so exceedingly thin that even Oliver Twist would not ask for more. For example, your own footnote states that Thomas Jefferson was a [[deism|deist]]. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 22:55, 25 October 2007 (EDT)<br /> <br /> ::::Conservative, emotionalisms are childish and the mark of the enraged liberal (ie. You're a racist!), please refrain from them. Deist, atheist, and agnostics are generally grouped into &quot;freethinkers.&quot; This is the word I meant to use, thank you for pointing out my error. Anyway, please explain how the caricature of atheist in this article is accurate and how my evidence fails to show how some atheist are moral. --[[User:Diagoras|Diagoras]] 13:54, 27 October 2007 (EDT)<br /> <br /> :''&quot;Many atheists are kind, moral, conservative individuals and this article does not do justice to us.&quot;'' I'm confused, Conservative. Do you mean to say that without &quot;some studies or some substantial historical support&quot;, you do not find this claim to be at all believable? (Note he did not say &quot;most&quot;, just &quot;many&quot;.) [[User:Feebasfactor|Feebasfactor]] 23:12, 25 October 2007 (EDT)<br /> :::Feesbasfactor, the irony is delicious. It appears as if I am more of a skeptic than the so called &quot;freethinkers&quot; who often call themselves skeptics. In short, offer some real evidence or quit complaining. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 14:10, 27 October 2007 (EDT)<br /> <br /> ::::Ah, then. So you do not find the claim that &quot;Many atheists are kind, moral, conservative individuals&quot; to be at all believable. That is '''many''', not &quot;most&quot; (as I pointed out). By definition, then, your opposing position must be that '''very few''' or '''no''' atheists are kind, moral, conservative individuals. Correct? I might be skeptical of such a position, particularly as it has been applied to this article - but then again I don't have the sort of ''real evidence'' you demand for skepticism. However, I do find your position very interesting; not wishing to run too far off on a tangent here, perhaps I'll just ask you about it later and elsewhere. [[User:Feebasfactor|Feebasfactor]] 22:52, 27 October 2007 (EDT)<br /> <br /> *Praise the Lord it will not be here! :P --&lt;font color=&quot;#1E90FF&quot; face=&quot;Comic Sans MS&quot;&gt;[[User:TK|şŷŝoρ-₮K]]&lt;/font&gt;&lt;sup&gt;&lt;font color=&quot;DC143C&quot;&gt;[[User_Talk:TK|/Ṣρёаќǃ]]&lt;/font&gt;&lt;/sup&gt; 23:15, 27 October 2007 (EDT)<br /> <br /> Actually the burden of proof exists on you to prove that atheists are worse then everyone else. Fortunately I have an ace up my sleave... The Department of Corrections. Turns out theists commit more of the crimes or that atheists are smart enough not to be caught. The other possibility is that atheists are better educated and thus less likely to commit crimes. Interestingly this holds true for countries to, with the most faithful having the most crime. It is because the are poor that they are faithful or are they faithful and so become poor? {{unsigned|SDSkinner}}<br /> <br /> == Bible regarding Athiesm ==<br /> <br /> Isn't this section by nature completely bias against the subject of the article? Correct me if I am wrong, but wouldn't the opinion of a Christian on whether or whether not God exists be completely irrelevant to an Athiest? It is like a Vegan criticizing someone who happens to be alergic to vegetables, over the fact that they do not eat vegetables. I'm supprised at the amount of bias and bigotry and zealousy steaming from this place. It really sickens me that some people think the Bible belongs everywhere, and that everything must be &quot;approved&quot; biblcy, like it is a mandate from God that you should outlaw Gay-marriage, outlaw love, outlaw athiests from holding office, outlaw athiests from testifying in a court of law, essentially taking away their rights because they do not believe in fairy tales and myths. If you delete this, you are a traitor and a bigot and a zealot and a conservative power hungry monster, keeping the human race from progression towards peace and acceptence and are supporting unadulterated stupidity in worship of something we don't even know exists, and obviously doesn't even care about us enough to keep us from killing eachother in his name. Don't you love freedom of speech? I sure do. --[[User:Niffed|Niffed]] 23:52, 21 October 2007 (EDT)<br /> <br /> <br /> :Such harsh words from someone trying to say that *we* are the evil ones. If you've come to find a neutral encyclopedia you have come to the wrong place. If you want an encyclopedia that doesn't use the Bible as an answer, kindly go somewhere else. (You might like to look up the definition of [[faith]] before you go; not everything is what you can see, feel, hear, taste, touch, and smell.) If you have only come here to argue you will be blocked. [[User:HelpJazz|Help]][[User talk:HelpJazz|Jazz]] 00:05, 22 October 2007 (EDT)<br /> <br /> <br /> ::Harsh words? Conservapedia's &quot;Purpose&quot; statement claims to &quot;strive to be accurate and fair and allow other points of view&quot;. Like many, this article fails miserably in terms of fairness or allowance of other points of view. Are you defending that failure? As an educational resource, such articles are a disinformative embarrasment and these shortcomings do a serious injustice to any would-be students that rely on them for educational benefit. Conservapedia has done some growing-up since its earliest days of unintentionally-hilarious articles about tree-octopuses and giant, virile koala bears migrating to Australia in the pouches of kangaroos, but it's got a very long way to go if this promise of 'striv(ing) to be accurate and fair and allow(ing) other points of view' has any sincerity to it. --[[User:DougM|DougM]] 16:16, 25 October (EDT)<br /> <br /> :::Should we at Conservapedia allow other points of view that are destructive to this website? Other points of view that are destructive to Judeo/Christianity? Other points of view that are destructive to traditional family values? The answer is NO. [[User:Karajou|Karajou]] 16:30, 25 October 2007 (EDT)<br /> <br /> ::::Karajou, that's the idea behind freedom of speech. You do not suppress your opponents, you welcome their criticism for it makes your ideas stronger. --[[User:Diagoras|Diagoras]] 13:50, 27 October 2007 (EDT)<br /> <br /> :::::Exactly! If everyone was forced to think alike, worship (or not worship) the same religion, join the same political party and all ignore the works of Nietzche (joke, everyone, a joke), we'd have something similar to a communist state. Thomas Jefferson, a deist, once said &quot;The only security of all is in a free press. The force of public opinion cannot be resisted when permitted freely to be expressed. The agitation it produces must be submitted to. It is necessary, to keep the waters pure.&quot; If the opposition is suppressed, than the your very own ideas you try to protect become corrupted. [[User:Probus1|Probus1]] 16:55, 30 October 2007 (EDT) <br /> <br /> '''&quot;Liberals claim to be terrified that the Religious Right is going to take over the culture in a country where more than a million babies are exterminated every year, kindergarteners can be expelled from school for mentioning God, and Islamic fascists are welcomed on college campuses while speakers opposed to Islamic fascism are met with angry protests.&quot;'''<br /> <br /> '''&quot;If liberals want to face real fascism, try showing up on a college campus and denouncing fascism.&quot; -- &lt;small&gt;Ann Coulter&lt;/small&gt;'''<br /> --&lt;font color=&quot;#1E90FF&quot; face=&quot;Comic Sans MS&quot;&gt;[[User:TK|şŷŝoρ-₮K]]&lt;/font&gt;&lt;sup&gt;&lt;font color=&quot;DC143C&quot;&gt;[[User_Talk:TK|/Ṣρёаќǃ]]&lt;/font&gt;&lt;/sup&gt; 16:43, 25 October 2007 (EDT)<br /> <br /> Political Correctness isn't facism; it is simply the rufusal to take off blinders... Much like what you are doing.<br /> On another note truth is resistant to everything and if you have to protect this site from &quot;destructive&quot; and &quot;contrary&quot; source then it ain't true. {{unsigned|SDSkinner}}<br /> <br /> :Perhaps that shoud be denouncing political correctness. I'm sure most campus would love you if you denounced fascism. [[User:Monkey998|Monkey998]] 23:02, 9 December 2007 (EST)<br /> <br /> At first I thought Karajou's statement was a joke, but then I realized what he is: A guy who uses this definition of Liberal (someone who wants to love the terrorists, give Iran a bomb, kill us with taxes, kill all of our babies, and make us get gay-married). Sounds like he is the average, poorly educated, bible-beater...<br /> <br /> == Crime Rates in USA compared with UK, France &amp; Germany ==<br /> <br /> Shouldn't it be noted that the murder, rape and drug offense rates in the USA is much higher than in the less religious countries of the UK France and Germany where church attendance is much lower. [[User:whitenoise|whitenoise]]<br /> <br /> *Your supposition is not correct. When one uses [[deceit]] to make the statement you did, everything the user says is suspect. Differences in how those statistics are gathered and calculated make appple to apple comparisons next to impossible. --&lt;font color=&quot;#1E90FF&quot; face=&quot;Comic Sans MS&quot;&gt;[[User:TK|şŷŝoρ-₮K]]&lt;/font&gt;&lt;sup&gt;&lt;font color=&quot;DC143C&quot;&gt;[[User_Talk:TK|/Ṣρёаќǃ]]&lt;/font&gt;&lt;/sup&gt; 23:14, 27 October 2007 (EDT)<br /> <br /> Next up- how words are not comparable because people use then differently. In the above passage we see someone say I am an idiot using 38 words to say I am an idiot. That is a waste of 34 words. The correct question would be is the methodology used by the religious countries, which appear to have higher crime rates, different from those used by secular ones? (The answer for murders at least is no. Come on it isn't to hard to figure out the method for that is consistant worldwide; you count corpses... unless all the European murders are smart and use Lye, acid and fire). {{unsigned|SDSkinner}}<br /> <br /> == Atheism and (Im)moral views ==<br /> <br /> In the article, gambling and [[homosexuality]] are implied to be immoral. I don't understand how they are. --[[User:Blinkadyblink|Blinkadyblink]] 23:12, 5 November 2007 (EST)<br /> <br /> Because the stance can only be defended on religious grounds. Since atheists aren't religious they can't critize those activities and are thus considered immoral. {{unsigned|SDSkinner}}<br /> <br /> :Which stance do you refer to when you say &quot;can only be defended on religious grounds&quot;?, your ambiguity unfortunately undermines your argument. Also, you are implying that morals can only be found through religions - this is a point of debate and as such should not be used as evidence for a 'concrete' argument. You should at least consider the alternate viewpoint. --[[User:Vincentvincent|Vincentvincent]] 06:56, 4 March 2008 (EST)<br /> <br /> When you say &quot;religious grounds&quot;, which religions do you mean? Judaism? Islam? Ancient Greek? Ancient Egyptian? Mayan? Hindu?<br /> If Christianity, which testament? and, furthermore, which branch? Mormanism? Baptist? Lutheran? --[[User:Democritus|Democritus]] 20:27, 23 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> == Hmm ==<br /> <br /> So, from this article, I'm getting &quot;Athiest = evil and embarrassing&quot;. Why are there no notations of positive and productive athiests? <br /> <br /> Being athiest is a lot like being homosexual. There may be more around you than they might think. They just don't go around screaming &quot;I'M AN ATHIEST!!!!&quot;<br /> <br /> There's no need for documented evidence to know that not all athiests are drug-abusing, lying, thieving, philandering scoundrels. <br /> <br /> Unfortantely since you are all so close-minded in your ideal Conservative world where everyone ''should'' believe what you believe, the fact that ''some'' athiests might actually be, *gasp*, ''good'', eludes your mind. [[User:Ugyuer|Ugyuer]] 10:17, 8 November 2007 (EST)<br /> :First of all, just to let you know: it's spelled atheist. E before i. Secondly, as stated in the 10 commandments this is a site with a Christian perspective, and therefore the site's position on atheism is quite undebatable - so why you choose to argue is beyond me. However, beyond that, your posting is one that is not meant to convince us that we are wrong - it is merely a series of low-key insults - and I'm not sure what reward you expect from that. Perhaps if you spent a little less time trolling, and a little more time reading - you would be able to spell atheist right. (Oh and thirdly, it's spelled unfortunately)--&lt;small&gt;[[User:Iduan|&lt;span style=&quot;color: #FFCCCC; background: #660000&quot;&gt;I]][[User_talk:Iduan|&lt;span style=&quot;color:#CCCCFF; background:#000033&quot;&gt;Duan]]&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/small&gt; 00:13, 11 November 2007 (EST)<br /> ::Great spelling Iduan. That really proved the point. Those silly atheists just can't spell. No wonder they're evil. --[[User:Horace23|Horace23]] 00:21, 11 November 2007 (EST)<br /> :::I'm glad that you can really pick up on my primary point there Horace - great comprehension.--&lt;small&gt;[[User:Iduan|&lt;span style=&quot;color: #FFCCCC; background: #660000&quot;&gt;I]][[User_talk:Iduan|&lt;span style=&quot;color:#CCCCFF; background:#000033&quot;&gt;Duan]]&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/small&gt; 00:24, 11 November 2007 (EST)<br /> ::::Hey, nice move Iduan. First you block me THEN you post the come-back. Guess you wanted the last word. Brave.<br /> <br /> ::::I would have thought that I was entitled to comment on any aspect of your post. Silly me.<br /> <br /> ::::Let me address your main assertion now:<br /> <br /> ::::The proposition that because Conservapedia is a Christian site it’s position on atheism is not up for debate is patently muddleheaded. The atheism page is a disgrace that would embarrass most intelligent Christians. Why would they not be permitted to point out the page’s myriad failings?<br /> ::::[[Horace23A]]<br /> <br /> Fools! That is because atheism is kryptonite to all Christian! They can't stand the sight of happy, sinful, decent people... it sears their soul! How dare they question and think critically with their science and reason! Plus as atheists we have cookies. And pie. You should add that it under positives. {{unsigned|SDSkinner}}<br /> <br /> == Major logical problem ==<br /> <br /> In the which god or gods section, there's a sentence that reads: &quot;...one can be considered an atheist with respect to one god, but a theist with respect to another, and it is important to understand first in what God the atheist denies.&quot;<br /> <br /> If one follows this through, everyone is an atheist - I believe in capital-G God, but I don't &quot;believe in&quot; say, Baal, or Ra, or Zeus, or Tiki gods or the Great Cosmic Muffin. By this article's definition, that makes me an atheist, and a theist. <br /> <br /> Is there a better way to work around this? [[User:Dewey|Dewey]] 17:41, 11 November 2007 (EST)<br /> <br /> : Seems to me that an atheist denies the existence of ''any'' God.--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 17:44, 11 November 2007 (EST)<br /> :::Dewey and Aschafly, I read your comments and made two changes based on your comments. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 19:26, 11 November 2007 (EST)<br /> <br /> <br /> Thanks, Conservative - looks better! [[User:Dewey|Dewey]] 19:36, 11 November 2007 (EST)<br /> <br /> <br /> &quot;I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one fewer god than you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours.&quot; <br /> -- Stephen Roberts ---[[User:LouisSaint|LouisSaint]] 20:06, 3 December 2007 (EST)<br /> <br /> If there is a major logical problem with not believing in a guy in the sky, than how can you believe in that guy without a shred of evidence?<br /> [[Moderate|Moderate]] 17:53, 16 December 2007 (EST)<br /> <br /> == Quotes Regarding Atheism ==<br /> <br /> It doesn't seem fair to only include negative quotes in the Quotes Regarding Atheism section, so I think the section should include at least one positive one. I suggest Francis Bacon's quote, &quot;Atheism leaves a man to sense, to philosophy, to natural piety, to laws, to reputation; all of which may be guides to an outward moral virtue&quot;[http://www.wisdomquotes.com/cat_agnosticismatheism.html].--[[User:Blinkadyblink|Blinkadyblink]] 18:57, 12 November 2007 (EST)<br /> <br /> Isn't Plato the man who thought Epic poety is immoral and the first person to publically endorse a Stalinist Police State aka the Republic? {{unsigned|SDSkinner}}<br /> <br /> ==References==<br /> &lt;small&gt;&lt;references/&gt;&lt;/small&gt;<br /> <br /> == &quot;Homosexuality and Immoral Activites&quot; ==<br /> <br /> I think there's a problem with this list - drug use, for instance is not &quot;immoral&quot; in the same way that abortion may be - consider the fact that it can be considered a victimless crime, and that most of the societal costs (crime, etc) are associated to illegality driving drugs underground more than the drugs themselves. Furthermore, the slippery nature of the law means that, for example, alcohol was an &quot;illegal drug&quot; - and by this article's logic immoral - during Prohibition, but is now not. What about dry counties? Alcohol is illegal and immoral there, but not in the county next door. Am I behaving &quot;immorally&quot; if I consume marijuana in the US, but not if I consume it in the Netherlands? Also, is excessive drinking really &quot;immoral?&quot; It's not a good thing, I'll admit - but immoral in and of itself? Why not excessive eating in that case? Gambling - again, a vice whose social costs are amplified by its legal status - never mind the fact that the state lotto and church bingo are clearly sanctioned and arguably &quot;moral&quot; forms of what this article's author sees as an &quot;immoral activity.&quot; [[User:PaulH|PaulH]] 16:28, 29 November 2007 (EST)<br /> <br /> :In relation to morals and religion, or lack of, we need to take into account what is a moral based on an indivdual religion. If something is only immoral because of a religious belief then is it truley immoral? For example the sex before marrage part. If someone can show why this is immoral outside a religious context then I can accept that inclusion.<br /> :However there are some religions that have worse morals than athiests. Saitanists for one. Also I would suggest that pagans do more on this list than the average athiest. There are some religions where taking of some drugs is mandatory. If the religion wasn't reconised then that would be an iligal drug use. However as it is reconised it is fine. [[User:Monkey998|Monkey998]] 22:50, 9 December 2007 (EST)<br /> :Whoops forgot a bit. Also homosexuallity is only immoral in regards to some religions. Once again show me that it is immorral outside a religious context. [[User:Monkey998|Monkey998]] 22:52, 9 December 2007 (EST)<br /> <br /> == Atheist Symbol ==<br /> <br /> Please do not take this the wrong way but I was wondering where the atheist symbol came from. I was an atheist for many years until I realized that it required as much faith as any other religion (I now consider myself an agnostic) and I had no idea there was an official symbol, in fact I had no idea they were organized enough to have an official anything. As I said just curious here and have no object to the symbol just wondering where it came from. [[User:Pibu|Pibu]] 20:57, 29 November 2007 (EST)<br /> <br /> : You're right, there is no symbol for Atheism. For goodness sake, Atheism is NOT a religion or a cult. [[User:Ichiro|Ichiro]] 11:01, 1 December 2007 (EST)<br /> :::I do know the govt uses them on gravestones. I have seen them elsewhere as well. See here for some of the places they are used: http://images.google.com/images?hl=en&amp;q=atheist+symbol&amp;um=1&amp;ie=UTF-8&amp;sa=N&amp;tab=wi [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 13:15, 1 December 2007 (EST)<br /> ::Here is another place: http://www.atheists.org/ [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 13:19, 1 December 2007 (EST)<br /> :Where does it say that the government uses them on gravestones? I remember there was a huge battle as to whether or not the government would put Wiccan symbols on gravestones. I hardly think they'd allow atheist signs on gravestones lightly, as a result.-[[User:MexMax|MexMax]] 11:20, 3 December 2007 (EST)<br /> <br /> That symbol is not a universal symbol for atheists but is in fact the logo of the civil liberties group &quot;American Atheists&quot; The &quot;A&quot; in the center actually stands for &quot;America&quot;. This is not a &quot;universal&quot; symbol for atheists as a cross my be for Christians. Indeed many atheists do not symbols and those that do use anything from the atom to the invisible pink unicorn. --[[User:Rainedaye|Rainedaye]] 14:11, 7 December 2007 (EST)<br /> :I agree with Rainedaye. The symbol used is a logo of an internet site, not a recognized image that would define an atheist in the same way a cross would define a christian. Implicating that there is a universal symbol for use would implicate that we are a united group with a united cause. We are simply people who see no evidence of a diety and choose to to believe in one. A symbol for an atheist &quot;religion&quot; would be the same a flag for an anarchist &quot;government&quot;; it is a contradiction by the very definition of the term to suggest there is a symbol that represents people who only share a like-minded ideology. --[[User:Atheist89|Atheist89]] 15:36, 7 December 2007 (EST)<br /> :::Here is the United States Government using the atheist symbol that is located in the beginning of the article in respect to gravestones: http://www.cem.va.gov/cem/hm/hmemb.asp [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 21:42, 11 December 2007 (EST)<br /> ::::The link you have provided does indeed show the symbol being used as definition for an atheist but you may also notice that the page gives a different symbol for humanists, who are also atheist. I think the point of contention here is that although the American Atheist symbol is indeed used as a symbol for members of that particular organisation it is not representative of all atheists. As such the symbol should either be removed or clarification should be added to the caption to inform people which organisation it represents. --[[User:Vincentvincent|Vincentvincent]] 07:02, 4 March 2008 (EST)<br /> <br /> :Here is the United States Government using the atheist symbol that is located in the beginning of the article in respect to gravestones: http://www.cem.va.gov/cem/hm/hmemb.asp [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 04:13, 13 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> ==Bias==<br /> This article is excessively bias and hostile. Do you guys hate atheists? OK I'll admit it. I'm an atheist. [[User:Yg|Yg]] 11:15, 3 December 2007 (EST)<br /> :We do not hate atheists, but we do not like the pushing of atheism on us or the rest of society. [[User:Karajou|Karajou]] 11:44, 3 December 2007 (EST)<br /> :so its ok for you to push christianity on to everyone else? o_0 {{unsigned|Thegovernator}}<br /> ::Yes it is for several reasons. First, it is protected by the First Amendment; we can preach the Gospel any time and anywhere by any means. Second, preaching the Gospel also serves as a warning to those who choose to do wrong. Yes, it is their choice to do wrong, but we liken it to someone driving over a bridge when we're warning them that the bridge is out. It's up to them whether or not to listen. Third, you came in to this site freely, but since this is not your site you have to abide by the rules of the site...and if that means your removal if you try to tell us we cannot preach the Gospel, so be it. It is your choice to accept Christ or reject Christ; it is not your choice to stop us from speaking of Christ. [[User:Karajou|Karajou]] 08:24, 21 December 2007 (EST)<br /> :::I am not trying to break any rules here, I just was wondering what you meant by that staement. Because I do agree that anyone of any faith can preach thier values, with the exeption of it scalling the wall of seperation of church and state. (but that is an enite different subject) What I meant by &quot;push&quot; is someone using ''force'' to make someone believe the same thing they do. But I am not trying to stop you from speaking about your faith. I am sorry if you took my statement the wrong way Karajou. [[user:thegovernator|thegovernator]]<br /> <br /> Who is pushing Atheism on you? As your own article states, Theists are in the clear majority in this country. Are you so utterly insecure in your own belief system that you will allow yourself to be threatened by a mere 5% of the population (at best)? Your article, on Atheism, is an abomination and insulting to anyone who may be unfortunate enough to read it. If you are indeed billing your organization as &quot;The Trustworthy Encyclopedia,&quot; then you should actually make an effort to gain our trust. You can start by completely reworking this article into something balanced - and for 'God's' sake, run it through spell-check before you post it. [[User:LouisSaint|LouisSaint]] 20:06, 3 December 2007 (EST)<br /> :You are pushing atheism on us. It is you who are afraid of us, our beliefs, and God; it is you and your kind that forced your own religious beliefs on this society, as in no prayer in schools, the removal of symbols from publi land, the curtailment of the preaching of the gospel in public, and lately there's a push by an atheist to remove &quot;In God We Trust&quot; from the money he himself enjoys in his own pocket. Here's what's going to happen on this website: we are going to promote Judeo/Christian values and we are going to continue to tell the world exactly what is wrong with atheism. Have a nice day! [[User:Karajou|Karajou]] 16:01, 5 December 2007 (EST)<br /> :This is not evidence of us &quot;pushing&quot; our religion on you, this is an example of us trying to uphold the constitution which states there is to be a separation of church and state. These symbols and comments on public land and currency show a predilection towards one religion. This goes against what this country was founded on, so what we are moving for in this aspect is not only legal, its the American way, unless you would like to implicate that the American Constitution is an affront to God? As for preaching in public, are you implying that christians have never done this, or are you merely upset because there has never been another voice in conflict to your own?[[User:Atheist89|Atheist89]] 15:50, 7 December 2007 (EST)<br /> ::It is evidence of atheists pushing their religious beliefs on the rest of society. According to John Adams, this country and our constitution were made for a moral and religious people. Are you implying that you and your kind are better than one of the founders of this country? Show me in the Constitution where there is to be a separation of church and state. I want to see the exact words. [[User:Karajou|Karajou]] 16:00, 7 December 2007 (EST)<br /> <br /> ::: From the First Amendment, Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof. [[User:Probus1|Probus1]]<br /> This artical is obviously biased unlessed I missed the section &quot;Christans and mass-murder&quot;on other pages. [[User:Monkey998|Monkey998]] 23:04, 9 December 2007 (EST)<br /> <br /> Oh, its really not suprising; look what happened to the &quot;[[Christian Terrorism]]&quot; page http://www.conservapedia.com/Conservapedia:Deletedpage. Then compare that to the Terrorism page. --[[User:Democritus|Democritus]] 20:35, 23 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> ==funny article==<br /> <br /> This article is really funny. It is so bias, that it is funny. I have told most of my friends to read it because it is so funny. Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha. [[User:Balloga|Balloga]] 11:12, 5 December 2007 (EST)<br /> <br /> :This article is beyond bias, I think we should put forward a motion to make it more even, post here if you agree --[[User:Athiest101|Athiest101]] 15:44, 5 December 2007 (EST)<br /> <br /> :Presenting two sides to any arguement does help to make something at least seem like it has less bias. I wouldn't mind seeing a good word for us on a christian site. --[[User:Athiest89|Athiest89]] 15:36, 7 December 2007 (EST)<br /> <br /> ==You too are an athiest==<br /> <br /> Even the most devout christian is still an atheist, in relation to Mithras, Thor, The flying spagetti monster, and almost every other god ever created by the imagination of man. We only go one god further.<br /> <br /> Also, by the way your point on intellegent designers is misguided. In most debates, you only think you have won becuase u see and hear only what u want to hear.--[[User:Athiest101|Athiest101]] 15:41, 5 December 2007 (EST)<br /> <br /> :Is your argument that since man can devise phony gods, that therefore there is no god? Is that truly what you are trying to use as logic? [[User:Learn together|Learn together]] 15:33, 5 December 2007 (EST)<br /> <br /> ::No my arguement is simply that you define atheists as mainly evil, yet in many ways you are an atheist, and what makes you think that their gods are 'phoney'. Dont they regard your God as the same? --[[User:Athiest101|Athiest101]] 15:45, 5 December 2007 (EST)<br /> <br /> :::To answer you above, in many cases the answer is no. There are many forms of theism that are not exclusive to a single diety. For polytheism this should be obvious, but even within Christianity, Judaism would be seen in a positive light even though they are separate relgions. From the perspective of Christianity an adherent of Zoraster may be wrong, but he is not an atheist. An atheist is one who believes there is no God -- period. Trying to muddle it with anyone who does not believe in the same God you do is an atheist, is a line of reasoning that does not work in theism by definition. [[User:Learn together|Learn together]] 02:59, 12 December 2007 (EST)<br /> <br /> == Atheist Quotes ==<br /> <br /> Seems a little light, maybe it should be turned into a separate section? That and more quotes need to be added showing a larger selection. For instance: <br /> *&quot;If I were not an atheist, I would believe in a God who would choose to save people on the basis of the totality of their lives and not the pattern of their words. I think he would prefer an honest and righteous atheist to a TV preacher whose every word is God, God, God, and whose every deed is foul, foul, foul.&quot; - [[Isaac Asimov]]<br /> Is a quite famous quote and would round out the section a bit.<br /> --[[User:Rainedaye|Rainedaye]] 14:17, 7 December 2007 (EST)<br /> :I agree, also I think these two quotes capture the spirit of atheism better than the current selection: <br /> :&quot;I believe in God, only I spell it N-a-t-u-r-e.&quot; — Frank Lloyd Wright<br /> :&quot;I don’t believe in God. My god is patriotism. Teach a man to be a good citizen and you have solved the problem of life.&quot; — Andrew Carnegie. [[User:GodWarrior|GodWarrior]] 18:34, 8 December 2007 (EST)<br /> <br /> :The Frank Lloyd Wright quote misses the mark. That's paganism. [[User:Monkey998|Monkey998]] 22:44, 9 December 2007 (EST)<br /> ::Pantheism. [[User:Order|Order]] 01:48, 10 December 2007 (EST)<br /> <br /> &quot;If God is neither willing nor able, then why call him God?&quot; -Democritus, Greek philosopher.<br /> Order, a-theist is without-god. If F.L.W. believes in nature rather than a deity, then he would have an atheistic belief system. Furthermore, atheism is not a cult or religion; for example, buddhists are atheistic, yet follow a set of philosophical guidelines. As this article hints towards(albeit poorly), there is no one atheist group that sets down rules of living an &quot;atheist lifestyle&quot;. I myself ground my reality in evidence and facts, rather than faith alone. When I have a question, I don't leave it to faith or assume that it is not meant to be known. I ask the question. If one does not ask questions, then how can they be confident in their beliefs? Time alone does not suggest something's validity. Having survived challenges over time does. --[[User:Democritus|Democritus]] 21:01, 23 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> == Darwin didn't start off as an Athiest ==<br /> <br /> Under the section &quot;Tenuousness of Atheists&quot; it says that Darwin was a type of Atheist. He started off as a protestant and his earlier works were more like intelligent design. He actually refused to publish his work till his child died and he renounced God. Before that he refused to go against the church.<br /> <br /> My point it that you should include his path to Atheism as that is far more relevant in an article about Atheists. <br /> <br /> Ironically he married his cousin and his kids ended up with genetic disorders but that’s a story for another page.<br /> [[User:Monkey998|Monkey998]] 23:10, 9 December 2007 (EST)<br /> <br /> <br /> == Wow! ==<br /> <br /> I must say, this is a extremely useful and long article. I have not seen an article as long as this one in years! --[[User:Mssb57|Mssb57]] 17:02, 14 December 2007 (EST)<br /> <br /> &quot;extremely useful&quot;? Are you joking? It may express Christian views on atheism, but it takes a fool to think it's not completely biased. This article teaches nothing about atheism. It only explains Christians' position on atheism. As someone else in this page said, it is literally being used as a joke. It's simply ridiculous. [[User:CappyR|CappyR]] 22:46, 6 January 2008 (EST)<br /> <br /> == Mussolini was an Atheist ==<br /> <br /> Benito Mussolini--mass murderer, founder of Fascism, and Nazi collaborator--was a militant atheist. He definitely needs to be included in the article. Here's documentation from Denis Mack Smith, Oxford University historian and author, and one of the world's leading authorities on the life of Mussolini:<br /> <br /> &quot;From his father he [Mussolini] had learnt to be a thoroughgoing anti-clerical. He proclaimed himself to be an atheist and several times tried to shock an audience by calling on God to strike him dead. He forcibly denounced those socialists who thought religion a matter for individual conscience or had their children baptised. [In Mussolini's opinion] Science had proved that God did not exist and the Jesus of history was an ignorant Jew whose family thought him mad, and who was a pigmy compared to the Buddha. Religion, he said, was a disease of the psyche, an epidemic to be cured by psychiatrists, and Christianity in particular was vitiated by preaching the senseless virtues of resignation and cowardice, whereas the new socialist morality should celebrate violence and rebellion.&quot;<br /> <br /> &quot;Mussolini&quot;, by Denis Mack Smith, Vintage Books, 1983, page 8. <br /> <br /> [[User:ConChris|CC]] 22:07, 25 December 2007 (EST)<br /> <br /> <br /> :Are you also going to mention his fruitful cooperation with the Catholic Church, that Mussolini defined Italy as a throughly Catholic country, in which catechism should be taught to kids, that the pope in return said that Mussolini was sent by providence, and that Mussolini was baptized in 1927? [[User:Order|Order]] 08:19, 26 December 2007 (EST)<br /> <br /> <br /> Your knowledge and understanding of Mussolini is remarkably poor. Mussolini's alleged &quot;cooperation&quot; and supposed &quot;baptism&quot; were merely acts of sheer political opportunism, as world renown Mussolini scholar Denis Mack Smith explains in his book that I previously cited:<br /> <br /> &quot;But he [Mussolini] was quickly learning about the deviousness that a policy of opportunism required. One of the valuable lessons he had learnt as a journalist was that the public was easily deceived and an editor could change his views without most readers worrying or even noticing. For example, a few months earlier he had condemned Christianity as 'detestable' and called on the Pope to leave Rome for good, but at once changed when he realized that there would be advantages in an alliance with the [Catholic] Church. He began to advocate that the government should subsidise churches and religious schools, hoping that in return the Vatican -- which had already condemned liberalism and socialism -- would take a further step of discountenancing the Catholic popolari as being too far to the left. This would weaken his opponents and assist him by further undermining the free operation of the government.&quot;<br /> <br /> &quot;Mussolini&quot;, by Denis Mack Smith, Vintage Books, 1983, pages 44-45.<br /> <br /> [[User:ConChris|CC]] 10:05, 26 December 2007 (EST)<br /> <br /> <br /> :It is always best to start an argument with an ad-hominem attack, blaming someone of of ignorance, and then hide behind the back of a book to in an attempt to have a slice of the authority of the author. The book by Denis Mack Smith has apparently between 429 and 512 pages depending on the edition, and I see that you already got up to page 13. Anyway, I assume that you do not want to mention his baptism, and his cooperation with the Vatican, and the cooperation of the Vatican with him. Why do you think that this isn't worth mentioning? All you offer is interpretation, but shouldn't you mention the facts first. [[User:Order|Order]] 18:20, 26 December 2007 (EST)<br /> <br /> <br /> I clearly mentioned his &quot;alleged &quot;cooperation&quot; and supposed &quot;baptism&quot;&quot; in the second sentence of my previous response, which you obviously failed to comprehend. I then documented the ulterior motives of his &quot;cooperation&quot; and &quot;baptism&quot;, which were done for sheer political expediency. So your points have already been addressed and refuted. You're also the pot calling the kettle black, since you are merely giving us your own deeply biased personal interpretation of Mussolini's actions, whereas I am directly quoting a recognized authority on the life of Mussolini.<br /> <br /> [[User:ConChris|CC]] 23:31, 26 December 2007 (EST)<br /> <br /> <br /> &quot;Another continuing constituent of his [Mussolini] creed was manifested in his vitriolic attacks against the Church, which he accompanied with provocative and blasphemous remarks about the consecrated host and about a love affair between Christ and Mary Magdalen. According to him, priests were 'black microbes', servants of capitalism, persecutors of Jews, and poisoners of young minds. Socialists who believed in Christianity or accepted religious marriage should be expelled from the party. The Church was reproached for its authoritarianism and refusal to allow freedom of thought&quot;<br /> <br /> &quot;Mussolini&quot;, by Denis Mack Smith, Vintage Books, 1983, page 15.<br /> <br /> [[User:ConChris|CC]] 23:45, 26 December 2007 (EST)<br /> <br /> : Good, that you are at page 15 of the book already. As you read on you might find out that the Vatican and the fascists had a close but complicated relation. Regardless of how you interpret the facts, we still got the facts by themselves. And rather than guessing what Mussolini might have thought, and what his motives might have been, we can look at what he (and the Vatican) did in practice. And there are many events that show that the Church and Mussolini could get along quite well. One such fact is that Mussolini baptized his kids in 1923, and got batized himself a few years later. What do you hope to gain by not mentioning any of this? [[User:Order|Order]] 01:00, 27 December 2007 (EST)<br /> <br /> That means that every evil Christian needs to be brought to light in the Christianity article. Hitler (who was by far a worse man than Mussolini), Vlad Dracula the impaler, Pope Urban II, Jerry Falwell (a bad representative of good Christians everywhere), the list goes on. Attacking a belief system based on who was part of the system is unscrupulous and disgusting. It shows the immaturity and fear that any religious group fears towards any other group. I don't get how most religions preach (at a very basic level) the same message, yet hate and attack each other. Some atheists are moral and good people, while some are like Mussolini. Some Muslims are good people, and some terrorize the world. Some Christians are generous people, while others persecute and wreak havoc and destruction upon non-believers, just like any other main religion. We need to remember that no race of man is the sole children of God; we are all humans and we should love each other. We should not attack someone else's beliefs if it makes the other person a happy person without harming other people. Just because someone has found love with a person of the same sex or someone does not want to worship the same god does not mean they are less of a person or immoral. Hating that person will simply make you worse than the person you hate. This article illustrates all that is wrong with this world and this country, these problems need to stop. We are humans, and we must strive to be good. How does not matter - it's the &quot;why&quot; that counts. [[User:Probus1|Probus1]]<br /> <br /> ::::Thanks, I am just about to include Benito Mussolini. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]]<br /> <br /> == Please remove category ==<br /> <br /> Please remove category:religion, as it is a supercategory of category:atheism. [[User:TheEvilSpartan|TheEvilSpartan]] 12:57, 8 January 2008 (EST)<br /> <br /> == Two &quot;Atheism and the Bible&quot; sections ==<br /> <br /> As more and more bias was simply posted without a thought on to the bottom of the page, no one has noticed that that there are now two &quot;Atheism and the Bible&quot; sections. Can we at least have one clean, concise pile of insults instead of a hodgepodge? [[User:Paragon12321|Paragon12321]] 23:39, 11 January 2008 (EST)<br /> <br /> : Two for the price of one. What's the harm?--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 23:51, 11 January 2008 (EST)<br /> <br /> ::It's not the harm that's the problem (that's for a whole other argument). However, this is, first and foremost, an encyclopedia and should be at least formatted well. [[User:Paragon12321|Paragon12321]] 00:01, 12 January 2008 (EST)<br /> <br /> ::: Are you saying there is repetition within the [[atheism]] entry in this respect, or that the [[atheism]] entry is repetitive with another entry, [[atheism and the Bible]]?--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 00:06, 12 January 2008 (EST)<br /> <br /> ::::I just think that having &quot;Biblical Statements Regarding Atheism&quot; and &quot;Atheism and the Bible&quot; is a little redundant. [[User:Paragon12321|Paragon12321]] 00:12, 12 January 2008 (EST)<br /> <br /> ::::Have I gone past everyone's attention span, or is everyone just refusing to listen? [[User:Paragon12321|Paragon12321]] 20:35, 15 January 2008 (EST)<br /> <br /> ==Attempts to Dilute the Definition of Atheism==<br /> Proving a negative is impossible, though... [[User:Barikada|Barikada]] 19:46, 15 January 2008 (EST)<br /> <br /> ==New Format for Article?==<br /> I know this has been said many, many times (and can be applied to all sorts of other articles in Conservapedia) but this article is incredibly massive and it is mostly filled with criticisms. Things could be done to remedy this, such as splitting this article up into multiple articles. One could be atheism and possibly history (with views and definitions, maybe the odd quote from prominent atheists, living and dead, like Dawkins, Nietzche, d'Holbach, etc.), with links to a newly created page &quot;Criticism of Atheism.&quot; The criticism page would certainly have enough material (ha, ha). One wouldn't even need to do this much work. The page could be split so that the introduction and Section 1 (Types of Atheism) would become the new Atheism article and everything else could make up the new &quot;Criticisms&quot; page. I would just like to put that idea out there and not change anything (although I don't actually know how to do this; the creating of the pages, etc.) without some type of consensus. Once again, I know that this has been said many times, but every time that it has there is the odd post in favour, and then the idea shrivels and dies a sad little death. --[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 23:12, 15 January 2008 (EST)<br /> <br /> :I agree that this article needs a major revision. Also, I think a lot of the &quot;sources&quot; need to be gone over and checked for validity. For instance the statistics in &quot;Atheists and Immoral Views&quot; (reference 52) leads to a site that not only does not give any detailed information on how they obtained the statistics, but also only referenced only a little over 1000 people! This is honestly not a large enough sample to allow anyone to make the claim that atheists tend to be more immoral on average. Also, the site is a Christian based business which makes me question the bias of those collecting the statistics. Remember hearing &quot;There are three types of lies: lies, d*** lies, and statistics&quot;, or that &quot;correlation does not equal causation&quot;? I believe the section should be removed until a better source is found, preferably from independent researchers who have statistic experience and who not only publish all their results but how the data was obtained as well.<br /> [[User:Rainedaye|Rainedaye]] 13:13, 16 January 2008 (EST)<br /> <br /> == &quot;Atheism symbol&quot; ==<br /> <br /> I can't say I've ever seen this symbol before, what atheist group associates themselves with it exactly? The only connection I see to atheism is the 'A' in the middle and that is rather vague to be honest.--[[User:Falcifer|Falcifer]] 17:10, 16 January 2008 (EST)<br /> <br /> :I've seen it once or twice, although it is by no means a universally adopted symbol.<br /> <br /> :Also, it's meant to look like a stylized atom with an A in the center. [[User:Barikada|Barikada]] 19:15, 16 January 2008 (EST)<br /> <br /> :Because everyone knows that atoms are liberal commie atheists. I guess... [[User:Paragon12321|Paragon12321]] 22:59, 17 January 2008 (EST)<br /> <br /> See the &quot;Atheist Symbol&quot; section at the top of the page. As I stated earlier that symbol is from the American Atheists logo. They use the atom to symbolize science, they leave one orbital open to symbolize that knowledge is still incomplete, and the &quot;A&quot; stands for &quot;American&quot;. This article mistakingly attributes this symbol to atheists in general, which of course is the same as saying a flag for one specific regiment represents the entire army... --[[User:Rainedaye|Rainedaye]] 13:45, 18 January 2008 (EST)<br /> :Then shouldn't the caption be changed to &quot;American Atheism Symbol&quot; for the sake of avoiding confusion? keeping the same simile, a page on the US army with a flag for a certain regiment being captioned as &quot;United States Army flag&quot; would just be crazy. ~ [[User:Khan|Khan]] 22:23, 25 February 2008 (EST)<br /> <br /> ==&quot;Atheism and the Bible&quot;==<br /> After reading the posting about redundancy in the Atheism article I read the link &quot;Atheism and the Bible.&quot; After reading this I found that this is exactly the same as the &quot;Atheism and the Bible&quot; section in the main Atheism article. Can't we just delete the article? Why read another page that has the same content as a section that the viewer would presumably have already read? Also, no one (except for Rainedaye) has responded to my previous suggestions of re-formatting (although this redundancy problem does fit nicely into it).--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 15:37, 17 January 2008 (EST)<br /> :::Also, the Atheism and the Bible article copies the main Atheism article's section: &quot;Biblical statements regarding Atheism.&quot; I would also like to add that if there is any new information in the article &quot;Atheism and the Bible&quot; that I missed, it could be easily amalgamated into the main article.--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 15:41, 17 January 2008 (EST)<br /> <br /> :::Was anyone listening to my discussion like three sections up??? [[User:Paragon12321|Paragon12321]] 23:00, 17 January 2008 (EST)<br /> <br /> :::::Sorry, I thought you were talking about duplications within the main article.--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 15:21, 18 January 2008 (EST)<br /> <br /> ==Length==<br /> <br /> Am I the only one who thinks this page should be waaaaaaaay shorter?<br /> <br /> --[[User:BenjaminS|Ben]] &lt;sub&gt;[[User Talk:BenjaminS|Talk]]&lt;/sub&gt; 18:30, 17 January 2008 (EST)<br /> <br /> : It probably should be, but like many of the articles on Conservapedia it seems like an unorganised collection of arguments. --[[User:Vincentvincent|Vincentvincent]] 07:04, 4 March 2008 (EST)<br /> <br /> == Waaaay one-sided, like everything else on this site ==<br /> <br /> So why are there 7 sections of criticism of atheism and only a couple sentences about the reasons for being an atheist when this is an article about atheism, not 'why we should all hate atheists'? According to this article there are only two reasons to be an atheist when I can think of many. Christianity has just as much evidence to support it as Islam or Hinduism or even the Flying Spaghetti Monster, so why should I believe in your God? This is the only life we can be certain of having, so why waste it waiting for an afterlife that we don't know will come? I barely understand a fraction of what's going on in this Universe, how can I presume to understand the afterlife? The list goes on and on... This is exactly the reason I hate debating with Christians, most of them know absolutely nothing about atheism because they only read Christian-approved definitions like this one and when I present them with reasonable arguments stick their fingers in their ears and sing 'falalala'. If anything, atheism is one of the most positive approaches to life: it promotes living this life to the fullest and a morality that doesn't rely on a reward/punishment system. My morality is based on what's right -- I know killing someone is wrong, I don't need my invisible friend to tell me that and I don't need the threat of eternity in a lake of fire to stop me from killing.<br /> <br /> Conservapedia: The Trustworthy Encyclopedia, where one-sided bigotry trumps logic EVERY TIME!<br /> <br /> : The truth cannot be biased or &quot;one-sided&quot; as you put it. [[User:CPWebmaster|CPWebmaster]] 23:06, 29 January 2008 (EST)<br /> <br /> :: How do you know it's the truth? [[User:Trogdorina|Trogdorina]] 23:22, 29 January 2008 (EST) trogdorina<br /> <br /> ::: How do you know 2+2=4? [[User:CPWebmaster|CPWebmaster]] 23:26, 29 January 2008 (EST)<br /> <br /> :::: The article is absurd and was largely written by one of the worst editors to ever contribute to this site. It is offensive and indicative of the poor quality of the controversial articles on the site (most of which are either locked or closely guarded). Why don't you allow some editing by some educated people who have a clue? --[[User:ThomasGerbil|ThomasGerbil]] 23:42, 29 January 2008 (EST)<br /> <br /> :::: Thank you Thomas Gerbil. I know 2+2=4 because if I take two rocks and add two more I get four rocks. That's math. Religion is a completely different concept altogether. The only thing telling you that God exists is a book, written by people. Just people. Saying that the Bible proves God's existence is like saying Harry Potter proves the existence of wizards. Please. [[User:Trogdorina|Trogdorina]] 23:51, 29 January 2008 (EST)trogdorina<br /> <br /> ::::: Maybe in 2000 years.... --[[User:Jiblet|Jiblet]] 12:18, 31 January 2008 (EST)<br /> <br /> There are different religious views about the afterlife and its relationship to earthly conduct. Not all religious beliefs posit a punishment of &quot;[[eternal fire]]&quot; for capital crimes. I think that is largely a fundamentalist belief. Many atheists are unaware of the variety of theological opinion about how God responds to human conduct. --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] &lt;sup&gt;[[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]]&lt;/sup&gt; 09:37, 16 February 2008 (EST)<br /> <br /> :&quot;Many atheists are unaware of the variety of theological opinion about how God responds to human conduct.&quot; -EdPoor 02/16/08<br /> :Your sources for that statement? Or should it be &quot;'''I think that''' many atheists are unaware of the variety of theological opinion about how God responds to human conduct.&quot;<br /> :--[[User:Rainedaye|Rainedaye]] 10:31, 21 February 2008 (EST)<br /> <br /> Well, he does have a partially valid point. of course, he should have noticed the &quot;Conserv-&quot; prefix on the name of the bloody site... it says &quot;Conservative point of view&quot; all over it. ~ [[User:Khan|Khan]] 22:24, 25 February 2008 (EST)<br /> <br /> in response to the title of this comment: Its called &quot;Conservapedia&quot; and their reasoning for making the site is that they don't think encylopedias can be unbiased. --[[User:Democritus|Democritus]] 20:41, 23 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> ==Clarity of definition==<br /> <br /> We still need to clarify the definition of '''the word &quot;atheism&quot;'''. This is important because:<br /> *Atheism takes two main forms:<br /> *#The general '''lack of belief''' in God (or gods)<br /> *#The active '''denial''' that [[God]] exists<br /> *One of the main defenses used in debates about atheism is the tactic of &quot;muddying the waters&quot;. That is, debaters will try to change the subject from the validity of atheism to a series of quibbles about what atheism really means, who is or is not an atheist, how mean you are to persecute innocent, public-minded men like Socrates, etc. <br /> <br /> We need to stick to the point here and describe what atheism is before addressing anything else. --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] &lt;sup&gt;[[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]]&lt;/sup&gt; 09:33, 16 February 2008 (EST)<br /> <br /> == &quot;Humorless bunch, aren't they?&quot; ==<br /> <br /> Are atheists the only ones who take their &quot;religion&quot; seriously? Wouldn't a Christian (rightly) be offended by a similar joke aimed at him? [[User:HelpJazz|Help]][[User talk:HelpJazz|Jazz]] 10:51, 16 February 2008 (EST)<br /> <br /> <br /> Atheism isn't a religion.([[User:Dirian|Dirian]] 15:19, 21 March 2008 (EDT))<br /> <br /> == A Refutation of &quot;Arguments Against Atheism and For Theism&quot; ==<br /> <br /> <br /> * Teleological argument: The universe exhibits overwhelming evidence of deliberate, intelligent, purposeful design, which implies an intelligent designer.<br /> <br /> <br /> From an objective perspective, the arrangement of atoms in our universe is no more spectacular than any other arrangement. Even if it could be somehow objectively proven that the universe was designed for a specific purpose, that does not imply an omnipotent being. It would be far more rational in that instance to believe that, for instance, the universe is a computer simulation, according to Occam's razor.<br /> <br /> * Cosmological argument: Every event in our universe necessarily has a cause. However, it is impossible that there should be an unending chain of causes going back. Therefore, there necessarily must be a cause distinct from the universe as we know it which is capable of causing all things and is itself uncaused. Atheism denies that that First Cause is God.<br /> <br /> <br /> We simply can't extrapolate our laws of physics to the beginning of time; causality may well have not existed. Even assuming that causality did exist, Occam's razor states that a cyclical universe, computer simulation or similar explanation is infinitely more rational than an omnipotent being.<br /> <br /> * Ontological argument: Since existence is inherent to the definition of God, it is impossible to conceive of God without conceiving of Him as existing;<br /> <br /> <br /> This also applies to anything that I define as existing. If I imagine in my mind a 'heffalump-that-exists' it must exist, according to this argument.<br /> <br /> * Historical arguments for the existence of God. For example, arguments stemming from historical accounts such as Christian historical apologetics and archaeological evidence such as Bible archaeology;<br /> <br /> <br /> If we are to use this proof, we must treat every one of the other myriad messianic figures in history in the same way. Seen this way, Jesus is not a particularly special case. The only reason his particular religion is so popular is because of the Roman Empire. <br /> <br /> * Experiential arguments for the existence of God: Arguments based on personal experience and human intuition. According to <br /> philosopher Alvin Plantinga belief in the existence of God exists is a &quot;properly basic&quot; belief and not based on inference from other <br /> beliefs but is rationally justified due to one's circumstances of immediate experience of God.[41]<br /> <br /> <br /> These are better explained with neurology. When we experience a Deja vu, we don't immediately infer that we have foresight. We use the more rational explanation that there is a minor fault in our minds. When we 'see a UFO', we should first be perfectly sure it is not a weather balloon. God is an option of absolute last resort, and should be treated as such.<br /> <br /> [[User:Snypylo|Snypylo]] 14:22, 9 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> == Bohr Model ==<br /> <br /> Atheism does not associate itself with the Bohr model of the atom. Please remove the symbol or replace it with a more accurate &quot;electron cloud&quot; model.<br /> :Here is the United States Government using the atheist symbol that is located in the beginning of the article in respect to gravestones: http://www.cem.va.gov/cem/hm/hmemb.asp [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 04:14, 13 March 2008 (EDT)</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User_talk:Phillipps&diff=416982 2008-03-30T02:00:21Z

<p>Phillipps: /* Two alternative types of Atheism */</p> <hr /> <div>'''Atheism Article'''<br /> <br /> Please do not recreate articles at atheism but rather use the talk pages. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 18:26, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> Sorry, I thought that it would be better to see it.--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 18:28, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> <br /> New Atheism Article.<br /> :Please note that everything below is both a work in progress and not the actual Conservapedia article on atheism (just a hypothetical alternative). Please don't edit or vandalize this, it is a personal project. I would like to thank all those that contributed to the original article: much of the wording below is that of others.<br /> <br /> [[Image:Atheist-symbol.png‎|right|thumbnail|right|250px|An Atheist Symbol &lt;ref&gt;http://www.cem.va.gov/cem/hm/hmemb.asp&lt;/ref&gt;]]<br /> ''For criticisms of Atheism, see [[Criticisms of Atheism]]''<br /> <br /> '''Atheism''', as defined by the ''Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy'' and the ''Routledge Encyclopedia of Philosophy'', is the denial of the existence of any [[God]] or gods.&lt;ref&gt;http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/atheism-agnosticism/&lt;/ref&gt;&lt;ref&gt;http://www.creationontheweb.com/content/view/1998&lt;/ref&gt; <br /> <br /> <br /> == Which God or gods? ==<br /> [[Image:Socrates.jpg|thumb|right|150px|The [[Greece|Greek]] philosopher [[Socrates]]]]<br /> Since atheism is denial of the existence of God or gods, it is important first to identify in which God and/or gods the atheist denies. In ancient times, for example, Christians were accused of being atheists because of their denial of the pagan gods, even though they believed in the ''Christian'' God.&lt;ref&gt;Athenagoras, ''A Plea for the Christians, 2d century A.D.[http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/athenagoras-plea.html]&lt;/ref&gt; [[Socrates]] was also accused of Atheism, although references to God run throughout his recorded statements.&lt;ref&gt;Plato, Apol., 26,c.&lt;/ref&gt; Also, [[Albert Einstein]] and [[Baruch Spinoza]] professed belief in &quot;God,&quot; but they defined &quot;God&quot; as the cosmos as a whole, and without personality.<br /> <br /> == Why do atheists state they disbelieve?==<br /> Atheists claim there are two main reasons for their denial of the existence of God and/or disbelief in God: the conviction that there is positive evidence or argument that God does not exist ([[Strong atheism]] which is also sometimes called positive atheism), and their claim that theists bear the burden of proof to show that God exists, that they have failed to do so, and that belief is therefore unwarranted ([[Weak atheism]]).<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> ==Atheist Groups and Organizations==<br /> ===Brights Movement===<br /> [[Image:Richard_Dawkins.jpg‎|thumbnail|200px|right|[[Richard Dawkins]] is listed as an enthusiastic bright by the [[Brights Movement]] website.]]<br /> The [[Brights Movement]] was started in 2003 by [[Paul Geisert]] and [[Mynga Futrell]] in 2003 in order to assist in the advocacy of a [[Naturalism|naturalistic worldview]].&lt;ref&gt;http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2843/is_2_28/ai_114090211/pg_1&lt;/ref&gt;&lt;ref&gt;http://www.the-brights.net/vision/faq.html#1&lt;/ref&gt; The Brights movement had a media campaign and was announced in [[Wired (magazine)|Wired]] magazine (by evolutionary biologist [[Richard Dawkins]]), ''[[Free Inquiry]]'' (by Richard Dawkins), and on the ''[[New York Times]]'' op-ed page (by the philosopher and atheist [[Daniel Dennett]]).&lt;ref&gt;http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2843/is_2_28/ai_114090211/pg_1&lt;/ref&gt; However, according to a 2004 ''[[Skeptical Enquirer]]'' article the movement the &quot;Brights label reinforced a longstanding stereotype. Atheists already have a terrible rap for being coldhearted [[Rationalism|rationalists]] who attend [[Mensa]] gatherings and dismiss religious believers as simple-minded fools.&quot;&lt;ref&gt;http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2843/is_2_28/ai_114090211/pg_3&lt;/ref&gt; In October of 2003 in a article in the ''[[Guardian]]'' Dawkins associated being a &quot;bright&quot; with being an intellectual.&lt;ref&gt;http://books.guardian.co.uk/review/story/0,12084,981412,00.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> ===Internet Infidels===<br /> [[Internet Infidels]] (also known as the Secular Web) is one of the principle websites for those who advocate atheism, [[agnosticism|agnostics]] and [[Philosophical skepticism|skeptics]] on the internet. Member's of the Internet Infidels website include:<br /> <br /> *[[Earl Doherty]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-D.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Richard Carrier]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-C.html&lt;/ref&gt; <br /> *[[Dan Barker]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-B.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Stephen Carr]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-C.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Jeffery Jay Lowder]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-L.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Acharya S]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-A.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Kyle Gerkin]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-G.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *Farrell Till &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-T.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ===American Atheists===<br /> American Atheists is an atheistic organization dedicated to securing freedom from religion, labour for separation of church and state, and defend the civil rights of atheists.&lt;ref&gt;http://www.atheists.org/visitors.center/intro.html#primary&lt;/ref&gt; American Atheists was founded by Madalyn Murray O'Hair, winner of the lawsuit that removed prayer and bible recitations from schools.&lt;ref&gt;http://www.atheists.org/visitors.center/about.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ===Carvaka school===<br /> An atheistic and materialistic offshoot of [[Hinduism]] in the 6th century B.C.<br /> <br /> ===Samkhya school===<br /> An atheistic school of classical Indian philosophy, originating in the 6th century B.C.<br /> == Well Known Proponents of Atheism ==<br /> [[Image:Ncvjgfu.jpg|right|thumbnail|150px|[[Mao Zedong]]]]Prominent atheists include, or have thought to have include:<br /> * [[Diagoras]]: Greek philosopher who denied the existence of the Greek pantheon<br /> * [[Lucretius]]: Greek philosopher espousing materialism, and stated that man should not believe in the gods because their ideas about the gods and their fear of death made men unhappy<br /> * [[Friedrich Nietzsche]]: Prominent 19th century atheist philosopher<br /> [[Image:nietzsche2.jpg|right|200px|thumbnail|[[Friedrich Nietzsche]]]]<br /> * [[Mao Zedong]]<br /> * [[Benito Mussolini]]<br /> * [[Paul Kurtz]]: founder of the Council of [[Secular Humanism]]<br /> * [[Bertrand Russell]]<br /> * [[Ayn Rand]]<br /> * [[Isaac Asimov]]<br /> * [[John Dewey]]<br /> * [[Douglas Adams]]<br /> * [[Ernest Hemingway]]<br /> *Richard Dawkins<br /> *Baron d'Holbach<br /> == Views on Atheists ==<br /> <br /> In regards to various [[Views on Atheists|views on atheists]], research in the American Sociological Review finds that among several groups listed, those who hold the position of atheism are the group that Americans relate least to in terms of their vision of American society and are the group most likely to be mentioned as one that Americans would not want to have marry into their family.<br /> &lt;ref&gt;Edgell, Gerteis &amp; Hartmann 2006&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> {| class=&quot;wikitable&quot;<br /> |-<br /> ! Position:<br /> ! This group does not at all agree with&lt;br&gt; my vision of American society:<br /> ! I would disapprove if my child wanted&lt;br&gt; to marry a member of this group:<br /> |-<br /> | Atheist<br /> | 39.6%<br /> | 47.6%<br /> |-<br /> | Muslim<br /> | 26.3%<br /> | 33.5%<br /> |-<br /> | Homosexual<br /> | 22.6%<br /> | NA<br /> |-<br /> |Conservative Christian<br /> | 13.5%<br /> | 6.9%<br /> |-<br /> | Recent Immigrant<br /> | 12.5%<br /> | Not Asked<br /> |-<br /> | Hispanic<br /> | 7.6%<br /> | 18.5%<br /> |-<br /> | Jew<br /> | 7.4%<br /> | 11.8%<br /> |-<br /> | Asian American<br /> | 7.0%<br /> | 18.5%<br /> |-<br /> |African American<br /> | 4.6%<br /> | 27.2%<br /> |-<br /> | White American<br /> | 2.2%<br /> | 2.3%<br /> |}<br /> <br /> == Atheist Population==<br /> <br /> In regards to the [[Atheist Population|atheist population]] as a percentage of various countries' populations, specific research on atheists conducted in 2006 [http://www.harrisinteractive.com/news/allnewsbydate.asp?NewsID=1131 suggests] that the true proportion of atheists is 4% in the United States, 17% in Great Britain and 32% in France. A survey published in the 2005 ''[[Encyclopedia Britannica]]'' stated that 2.3% of the world's population consists of individuals who profess &quot;atheism, skepticism, disbelief, or irreligion, including the militantly antireligious.&quot;&lt;ref&gt;http://search.eb.com/eb/article-9432620&lt;/ref&gt; In regards to the 2.3% figure just mentioned, the 2005 survey cited by ''Encyclopedia Britannica'' survey did not include [[Buddhism|Buddhist]] in regards to the 2.3% figure and Buddhism can be [[Theism|theistic]] or atheistic.&lt;ref&gt;http://www.religionfacts.com/buddhism/beliefs/atheism.htm&lt;/ref&gt;&lt;ref&gt;http://search.eb.com/eb/article-9432620&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> ==Atheism Quotes==<br /> <br /> ===For Atheism===<br /> <br /> *&quot;Isn't it enough to see that a garden is beautiful without having to believe that there are fairies at the bottom of it too?&quot; -Douglas Adams, from ''Last Chance to See''&lt;ref&gt;http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/quotes/douglas.htm&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;In Christianity neither morality nor religion come into contact with reality at any point.&quot;-Friedrich Nietzche &lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=13&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;Which is it, is man one of God's blunders or is God one of man's?&quot;-Friedrich Nietzche&lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=13&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;If God did not exist, it would be necessary to invent him.&quot;-Voltaire &lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=29&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;Faith is the great cop-out, the great excuse to evade the need to think and evaluate evidence. Faith is belief in spite of, even perhaps because of, the lack of evidence.&quot;-Richard Dawkins&lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=41&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;Tolerance and freedom of thought are the veritable antidotes to religious fanaticism.&quot;-Baron d'Holbach &lt;ref&gt;http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/quotes/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;If the ignorance of nature gave birth to gods, the knowledge of nature is calculated to destroy them.&quot;-Baron d'Holbach&lt;ref&gt;http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/quotes/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ===Against Atheism===<br /> <br /> [[Image:Raphael.jpg|right|thumbnail|175px|[[Plato]]]]<br /> *&quot;Atheism is a disease of the soul before it becomes an error of understanding.&quot; - [[Plato]]&lt;ref&gt;http://en.thinkexist.com/quotation/atheism_is_a_disease_of_the_soul-before_it/166811.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *Maybe the atheist cannot find God for the same reason a thief cannot find a policeman.&quot; - [[Francis Thomson]]&lt;ref&gt;http://www.afcministry.com/Atheism_Examined.htm&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;The atheists are for the most part imprudent and misguided scholars who reason badly who, not being able to understand the Creation, the origin of evil, and other difficulties, have recourse to the hypothesis the eternity of things and of inevitability.&quot; - [[Voltaire]]&lt;ref&gt;http://history.hanover.edu/texts/voltaire/volathe2.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;Atheists put on false courage and alcacrity in the midst of their darkness and aprehensions, like children who, when they fear to go in the dark, will sing for fear.&quot; - [[Alexander Pope]] &lt;ref&gt;http://books.google.com/books?id=cs4eAAAAMAAJ&amp;pg=PA383&amp;lpg=PA383&amp;dq=atheists+and+%22alexander+pope%22+and+%22false+courage%22&amp;source=web&amp;ots=Fx7SL7Z7UB&amp;sig=mYdRm6hkdBkmsF_uJW9mPv3JRhE&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;An atheist’s most embarrassing moment is when he feels profoundly thankful for something,but can’t think of anyone to thank for it&quot; - [[Mary Anne Vincent]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.weeks-g.dircon.co.uk/quotes_by_author_uv.htm&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *If there were no God there would be no atheists. - [[G. K. Chesterton]] (1874 - 1936) &lt;ref&gt;http://www.quotationspage.com/subjects/atheism/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *Nobody talks so constantly about God as those who insist there is no God. - [[Heywood Broun]]<br /> <br /> <br /> * Atheism is a crutch for those who cannot bear the reality of God. - [[Tom Stoppard]]&lt;ref&gt;http://www.tentmaker.org/Quotes/atheismquotes.htm&lt;/ref&gt; <br /> <br /> <br /> *I gave in, and admitted that God was God. - ex-atheist [[C.S. Lewis]], On relinquishing atheism at age 31 in 1929&lt;ref&gt;http://www.bartleby.com/63/95/4195.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *A little philosophy inclineth man's mind to atheism, but depth in philosophy bringeth men's minds about to religion. - Sir [[Francis Bacon]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.notable-quotes.com/a/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *An atheist is a man who believes himself an accident. — [[Francis Thompson]]&lt;ref&gt;http://forthardknox.com/2007/06/02/the-10-best-quotes-to-counter-an-atheist/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> [[Image:Joseph-addison-3-sized.jpg‎|right|thumbnail|175px|[[Joseph Addison]]]]<br /> *To be an atheist requires an indefinitely greater measure of faith than to recieve all the great truths which atheism would deny. - [[Joseph Addison]], The Spectator, Mar. 8, 1711 &lt;ref&gt;http://www.notable-quotes.com/a/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *It is hard to see how a great man can be an atheist. Without the sustaining influence of faith in a divine power we could have little faith in ourselves. We need to feel that behind us is intelligence and love. Doubters do not achieve; skeptics do not contribute; cynics do not create. Faith is the great motive power, and no man realizes his full possibilities unless he has the deep conviction that life is eternally important, and that his work, well done, is a part of an unending plan. - [[Calvin Coolidge]], speech, Jul. 25, 1924 &lt;ref&gt;http://www.notable-quotes.com/a/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *Among the repulsions of atheism for me has been its drastic un-interestingness as an intellectual position. Where was the ingenuity, the ambiguity, the humanity of saying that the universe just happened to happen and that when we're dead we're dead? - [[John Updike]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.just-quotes.com/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *God never wrought miracles to convince atheism, because his ordinary works convince it. - Sir [[Francis Bacon]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.just-quotes.com/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *The habit of arguing in support of atheism, whether it be done from conviction or in pretense, is a wicked and impious practice. - Marcus Tullius [[Cicero]] (106–43 B.C.), Roman orator, philosopher, statesman&lt;ref&gt;http://www.bartleby.com/66/50/12450.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *How to trap an atheist: Serve him a fine meal, then ask him if he believes there is a cook. — Source Unknown &lt;ref&gt;http://forthardknox.com/2007/06/02/the-10-best-quotes-to-counter-an-atheist/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *I once wanted to become an atheist but I gave up . . . they have no holidays. - [[Henny Youngman]]&lt;ref&gt;http://www.bartleby.com/63/79/4779.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ==See Also==<br /> *[[Agnosticism]]<br /> *[[History of Atheism]]<br /> *[[Criticism of Atheism]]<br /> <br /> ==External links==<br /> *[http://www.carm.org/atheism.htm Atheism] by [[Christian Apologetics and Research Ministry]]<br /> *[http://creationwiki.org/Decline_of_atheism Decline of Atheism -CreationWiki]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zaKryi3605g&amp;NR=1 Richard Dawkins Being Stumped By a Creationists' Question - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VyNqw6umRq8&amp;feature=related Atheist's Nightmare - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hnCBwGJHZQg Atheism: Rational and Objective? Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v0fImg64yok&amp;feature=related Ravi Zacharias on Atheistic Evolution - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uQAYXlSDvlY Koukl: Greatest murders? - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L3r_SbmLQu0&amp;feature=related Koukl: Why Atheistic Fundamentalism ? - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZP8zI8JT-rk Psychology of Atheism part 1 of 2 - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E2Re56A9syg&amp;feature=related Psychology of Atheism part 2 of 2 - Video Clip]<br /> <br /> == Notes ==<br /> {{reflist|2}}<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> [[Category:Atheism]]<br /> [[Category:Religion]]<br /> [[Category:Philosophy]]</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User_talk:Phillipps&diff=416980 2008-03-30T01:59:16Z

<p>Phillipps: </p> <hr /> <div>'''Atheism Article'''<br /> <br /> Please do not recreate articles at atheism but rather use the talk pages. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 18:26, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> Sorry, I thought that it would be better to see it.--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 18:28, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> <br /> New Atheism Article.<br /> :Please note that everything below is both a work in progress and not the actual Conservapedia article on atheism (just a hypothetical alternative). Please don't edit or vandalize this, it is a personal project. I would like to thank all those that contributed to the original article: much of the wording below is that of others.<br /> <br /> [[Image:Atheist-symbol.png‎|right|thumbnail|right|250px|An Atheist Symbol &lt;ref&gt;http://www.cem.va.gov/cem/hm/hmemb.asp&lt;/ref&gt;]]<br /> ''For criticisms of Atheism, see [[Criticisms of Atheism]]''<br /> <br /> '''Atheism''', as defined by the ''Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy'' and the ''Routledge Encyclopedia of Philosophy'', is the denial of the existence of any [[God]] or gods.&lt;ref&gt;http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/atheism-agnosticism/&lt;/ref&gt;&lt;ref&gt;http://www.creationontheweb.com/content/view/1998&lt;/ref&gt; <br /> <br /> <br /> == Which God or gods? ==<br /> [[Image:Socrates.jpg|thumb|right|150px|The [[Greece|Greek]] philosopher [[Socrates]]]]<br /> Since atheism is denial of the existence of God or gods, it is important first to identify in which God and/or gods the atheist denies. In ancient times, for example, Christians were accused of being atheists because of their denial of the pagan gods, even though they believed in the ''Christian'' God.&lt;ref&gt;Athenagoras, ''A Plea for the Christians, 2d century A.D.[http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/athenagoras-plea.html]&lt;/ref&gt; [[Socrates]] was also accused of Atheism, although references to God run throughout his recorded statements.&lt;ref&gt;Plato, Apol., 26,c.&lt;/ref&gt; Also, [[Albert Einstein]] and [[Baruch Spinoza]] professed belief in &quot;God,&quot; but they defined &quot;God&quot; as the cosmos as a whole, and without personality.<br /> <br /> == Why do atheists state they disbelieve?==<br /> Atheists claim there are two main reasons for their denial of the existence of God and/or disbelief in God: the conviction that there is positive evidence or argument that God does not exist ([[Strong atheism]] which is also sometimes called positive atheism), and their claim that theists bear the burden of proof to show that God exists, that they have failed to do so, and that belief is therefore unwarranted ([[Weak atheism]]).<br /> <br /> == Two alternative types of Atheism ==<br /> * Theoretical atheism: atheism of the mind -- that is, ''believing'' that God does not exist.<br /> * Practical atheism: atheism of the life - that is, ''living'' as though God does not exist. &lt;ref&gt;Dr. [[Martin Luther King]] in his sermon ''A letter to American Christians'' spoke of &quot;practical atheism&quot;.[http://www.christianitytoday.com/leaders/newsletter/2001/cln10117.html]&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ==Atheist Groups and Organizations==<br /> ===Brights Movement===<br /> [[Image:Richard_Dawkins.jpg‎|thumbnail|200px|right|[[Richard Dawkins]] is listed as an enthusiastic bright by the [[Brights Movement]] website.]]<br /> The [[Brights Movement]] was started in 2003 by [[Paul Geisert]] and [[Mynga Futrell]] in 2003 in order to assist in the advocacy of a [[Naturalism|naturalistic worldview]].&lt;ref&gt;http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2843/is_2_28/ai_114090211/pg_1&lt;/ref&gt;&lt;ref&gt;http://www.the-brights.net/vision/faq.html#1&lt;/ref&gt; The Brights movement had a media campaign and was announced in [[Wired (magazine)|Wired]] magazine (by evolutionary biologist [[Richard Dawkins]]), ''[[Free Inquiry]]'' (by Richard Dawkins), and on the ''[[New York Times]]'' op-ed page (by the philosopher and atheist [[Daniel Dennett]]).&lt;ref&gt;http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2843/is_2_28/ai_114090211/pg_1&lt;/ref&gt; However, according to a 2004 ''[[Skeptical Enquirer]]'' article the movement the &quot;Brights label reinforced a longstanding stereotype. Atheists already have a terrible rap for being coldhearted [[Rationalism|rationalists]] who attend [[Mensa]] gatherings and dismiss religious believers as simple-minded fools.&quot;&lt;ref&gt;http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2843/is_2_28/ai_114090211/pg_3&lt;/ref&gt; In October of 2003 in a article in the ''[[Guardian]]'' Dawkins associated being a &quot;bright&quot; with being an intellectual.&lt;ref&gt;http://books.guardian.co.uk/review/story/0,12084,981412,00.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> ===Internet Infidels===<br /> [[Internet Infidels]] (also known as the Secular Web) is one of the principle websites for those who advocate atheism, [[agnosticism|agnostics]] and [[Philosophical skepticism|skeptics]] on the internet. Member's of the Internet Infidels website include:<br /> <br /> *[[Earl Doherty]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-D.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Richard Carrier]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-C.html&lt;/ref&gt; <br /> *[[Dan Barker]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-B.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Stephen Carr]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-C.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Jeffery Jay Lowder]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-L.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Acharya S]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-A.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Kyle Gerkin]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-G.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *Farrell Till &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-T.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ===American Atheists===<br /> American Atheists is an atheistic organization dedicated to securing freedom from religion, labour for separation of church and state, and defend the civil rights of atheists.&lt;ref&gt;http://www.atheists.org/visitors.center/intro.html#primary&lt;/ref&gt; American Atheists was founded by Madalyn Murray O'Hair, winner of the lawsuit that removed prayer and bible recitations from schools.&lt;ref&gt;http://www.atheists.org/visitors.center/about.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ===Carvaka school===<br /> An atheistic and materialistic offshoot of [[Hinduism]] in the 6th century B.C.<br /> <br /> ===Samkhya school===<br /> An atheistic school of classical Indian philosophy, originating in the 6th century B.C.<br /> == Well Known Proponents of Atheism ==<br /> [[Image:Ncvjgfu.jpg|right|thumbnail|150px|[[Mao Zedong]]]]Prominent atheists include, or have thought to have include:<br /> * [[Diagoras]]: Greek philosopher who denied the existence of the Greek pantheon<br /> * [[Lucretius]]: Greek philosopher espousing materialism, and stated that man should not believe in the gods because their ideas about the gods and their fear of death made men unhappy<br /> * [[Friedrich Nietzsche]]: Prominent 19th century atheist philosopher<br /> [[Image:nietzsche2.jpg|right|200px|thumbnail|[[Friedrich Nietzsche]]]]<br /> * [[Mao Zedong]]<br /> * [[Benito Mussolini]]<br /> * [[Paul Kurtz]]: founder of the Council of [[Secular Humanism]]<br /> * [[Bertrand Russell]]<br /> * [[Ayn Rand]]<br /> * [[Isaac Asimov]]<br /> * [[John Dewey]]<br /> * [[Douglas Adams]]<br /> * [[Ernest Hemingway]]<br /> *Richard Dawkins<br /> *Baron d'Holbach<br /> == Views on Atheists ==<br /> <br /> In regards to various [[Views on Atheists|views on atheists]], research in the American Sociological Review finds that among several groups listed, those who hold the position of atheism are the group that Americans relate least to in terms of their vision of American society and are the group most likely to be mentioned as one that Americans would not want to have marry into their family.<br /> &lt;ref&gt;Edgell, Gerteis &amp; Hartmann 2006&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> {| class=&quot;wikitable&quot;<br /> |-<br /> ! Position:<br /> ! This group does not at all agree with&lt;br&gt; my vision of American society:<br /> ! I would disapprove if my child wanted&lt;br&gt; to marry a member of this group:<br /> |-<br /> | Atheist<br /> | 39.6%<br /> | 47.6%<br /> |-<br /> | Muslim<br /> | 26.3%<br /> | 33.5%<br /> |-<br /> | Homosexual<br /> | 22.6%<br /> | NA<br /> |-<br /> |Conservative Christian<br /> | 13.5%<br /> | 6.9%<br /> |-<br /> | Recent Immigrant<br /> | 12.5%<br /> | Not Asked<br /> |-<br /> | Hispanic<br /> | 7.6%<br /> | 18.5%<br /> |-<br /> | Jew<br /> | 7.4%<br /> | 11.8%<br /> |-<br /> | Asian American<br /> | 7.0%<br /> | 18.5%<br /> |-<br /> |African American<br /> | 4.6%<br /> | 27.2%<br /> |-<br /> | White American<br /> | 2.2%<br /> | 2.3%<br /> |}<br /> <br /> == Atheist Population==<br /> <br /> In regards to the [[Atheist Population|atheist population]] as a percentage of various countries' populations, specific research on atheists conducted in 2006 [http://www.harrisinteractive.com/news/allnewsbydate.asp?NewsID=1131 suggests] that the true proportion of atheists is 4% in the United States, 17% in Great Britain and 32% in France. A survey published in the 2005 ''[[Encyclopedia Britannica]]'' stated that 2.3% of the world's population consists of individuals who profess &quot;atheism, skepticism, disbelief, or irreligion, including the militantly antireligious.&quot;&lt;ref&gt;http://search.eb.com/eb/article-9432620&lt;/ref&gt; In regards to the 2.3% figure just mentioned, the 2005 survey cited by ''Encyclopedia Britannica'' survey did not include [[Buddhism|Buddhist]] in regards to the 2.3% figure and Buddhism can be [[Theism|theistic]] or atheistic.&lt;ref&gt;http://www.religionfacts.com/buddhism/beliefs/atheism.htm&lt;/ref&gt;&lt;ref&gt;http://search.eb.com/eb/article-9432620&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> ==Atheism Quotes==<br /> <br /> ===For Atheism===<br /> <br /> *&quot;Isn't it enough to see that a garden is beautiful without having to believe that there are fairies at the bottom of it too?&quot; -Douglas Adams, from ''Last Chance to See''&lt;ref&gt;http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/quotes/douglas.htm&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;In Christianity neither morality nor religion come into contact with reality at any point.&quot;-Friedrich Nietzche &lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=13&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;Which is it, is man one of God's blunders or is God one of man's?&quot;-Friedrich Nietzche&lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=13&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;If God did not exist, it would be necessary to invent him.&quot;-Voltaire &lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=29&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;Faith is the great cop-out, the great excuse to evade the need to think and evaluate evidence. Faith is belief in spite of, even perhaps because of, the lack of evidence.&quot;-Richard Dawkins&lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=41&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;Tolerance and freedom of thought are the veritable antidotes to religious fanaticism.&quot;-Baron d'Holbach &lt;ref&gt;http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/quotes/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;If the ignorance of nature gave birth to gods, the knowledge of nature is calculated to destroy them.&quot;-Baron d'Holbach&lt;ref&gt;http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/quotes/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ===Against Atheism===<br /> <br /> [[Image:Raphael.jpg|right|thumbnail|175px|[[Plato]]]]<br /> *&quot;Atheism is a disease of the soul before it becomes an error of understanding.&quot; - [[Plato]]&lt;ref&gt;http://en.thinkexist.com/quotation/atheism_is_a_disease_of_the_soul-before_it/166811.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *Maybe the atheist cannot find God for the same reason a thief cannot find a policeman.&quot; - [[Francis Thomson]]&lt;ref&gt;http://www.afcministry.com/Atheism_Examined.htm&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;The atheists are for the most part imprudent and misguided scholars who reason badly who, not being able to understand the Creation, the origin of evil, and other difficulties, have recourse to the hypothesis the eternity of things and of inevitability.&quot; - [[Voltaire]]&lt;ref&gt;http://history.hanover.edu/texts/voltaire/volathe2.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;Atheists put on false courage and alcacrity in the midst of their darkness and aprehensions, like children who, when they fear to go in the dark, will sing for fear.&quot; - [[Alexander Pope]] &lt;ref&gt;http://books.google.com/books?id=cs4eAAAAMAAJ&amp;pg=PA383&amp;lpg=PA383&amp;dq=atheists+and+%22alexander+pope%22+and+%22false+courage%22&amp;source=web&amp;ots=Fx7SL7Z7UB&amp;sig=mYdRm6hkdBkmsF_uJW9mPv3JRhE&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;An atheist’s most embarrassing moment is when he feels profoundly thankful for something,but can’t think of anyone to thank for it&quot; - [[Mary Anne Vincent]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.weeks-g.dircon.co.uk/quotes_by_author_uv.htm&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *If there were no God there would be no atheists. - [[G. K. Chesterton]] (1874 - 1936) &lt;ref&gt;http://www.quotationspage.com/subjects/atheism/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *Nobody talks so constantly about God as those who insist there is no God. - [[Heywood Broun]]<br /> <br /> <br /> * Atheism is a crutch for those who cannot bear the reality of God. - [[Tom Stoppard]]&lt;ref&gt;http://www.tentmaker.org/Quotes/atheismquotes.htm&lt;/ref&gt; <br /> <br /> <br /> *I gave in, and admitted that God was God. - ex-atheist [[C.S. Lewis]], On relinquishing atheism at age 31 in 1929&lt;ref&gt;http://www.bartleby.com/63/95/4195.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *A little philosophy inclineth man's mind to atheism, but depth in philosophy bringeth men's minds about to religion. - Sir [[Francis Bacon]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.notable-quotes.com/a/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *An atheist is a man who believes himself an accident. — [[Francis Thompson]]&lt;ref&gt;http://forthardknox.com/2007/06/02/the-10-best-quotes-to-counter-an-atheist/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> [[Image:Joseph-addison-3-sized.jpg‎|right|thumbnail|175px|[[Joseph Addison]]]]<br /> *To be an atheist requires an indefinitely greater measure of faith than to recieve all the great truths which atheism would deny. - [[Joseph Addison]], The Spectator, Mar. 8, 1711 &lt;ref&gt;http://www.notable-quotes.com/a/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *It is hard to see how a great man can be an atheist. Without the sustaining influence of faith in a divine power we could have little faith in ourselves. We need to feel that behind us is intelligence and love. Doubters do not achieve; skeptics do not contribute; cynics do not create. Faith is the great motive power, and no man realizes his full possibilities unless he has the deep conviction that life is eternally important, and that his work, well done, is a part of an unending plan. - [[Calvin Coolidge]], speech, Jul. 25, 1924 &lt;ref&gt;http://www.notable-quotes.com/a/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *Among the repulsions of atheism for me has been its drastic un-interestingness as an intellectual position. Where was the ingenuity, the ambiguity, the humanity of saying that the universe just happened to happen and that when we're dead we're dead? - [[John Updike]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.just-quotes.com/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *God never wrought miracles to convince atheism, because his ordinary works convince it. - Sir [[Francis Bacon]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.just-quotes.com/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *The habit of arguing in support of atheism, whether it be done from conviction or in pretense, is a wicked and impious practice. - Marcus Tullius [[Cicero]] (106–43 B.C.), Roman orator, philosopher, statesman&lt;ref&gt;http://www.bartleby.com/66/50/12450.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *How to trap an atheist: Serve him a fine meal, then ask him if he believes there is a cook. — Source Unknown &lt;ref&gt;http://forthardknox.com/2007/06/02/the-10-best-quotes-to-counter-an-atheist/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *I once wanted to become an atheist but I gave up . . . they have no holidays. - [[Henny Youngman]]&lt;ref&gt;http://www.bartleby.com/63/79/4779.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ==See Also==<br /> *[[Agnosticism]]<br /> *[[History of Atheism]]<br /> *[[Criticism of Atheism]]<br /> <br /> ==External links==<br /> *[http://www.carm.org/atheism.htm Atheism] by [[Christian Apologetics and Research Ministry]]<br /> *[http://creationwiki.org/Decline_of_atheism Decline of Atheism -CreationWiki]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zaKryi3605g&amp;NR=1 Richard Dawkins Being Stumped By a Creationists' Question - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VyNqw6umRq8&amp;feature=related Atheist's Nightmare - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hnCBwGJHZQg Atheism: Rational and Objective? Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v0fImg64yok&amp;feature=related Ravi Zacharias on Atheistic Evolution - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uQAYXlSDvlY Koukl: Greatest murders? - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L3r_SbmLQu0&amp;feature=related Koukl: Why Atheistic Fundamentalism ? - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZP8zI8JT-rk Psychology of Atheism part 1 of 2 - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E2Re56A9syg&amp;feature=related Psychology of Atheism part 2 of 2 - Video Clip]<br /> <br /> == Notes ==<br /> {{reflist|2}}<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> [[Category:Atheism]]<br /> [[Category:Religion]]<br /> [[Category:Philosophy]]</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User_talk:Phillipps&diff=416976 2008-03-30T01:57:17Z

<p>Phillipps: </p> <hr /> <div>'''Atheism Article'''<br /> <br /> Please do not recreate articles at atheism but rather use the talk pages. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 18:26, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> Sorry, I thought that it would be better to see it.--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 18:28, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> <br /> New Atheism Article.<br /> :Please note that everything below is both a work in progress and not the actual Conservapedia article on atheism (just a hypothetical alternative). Please don't edit or vandalize this, it is a personal project. I would like to thank all those that contributed to the original article: much of the wording below is that of others.<br /> <br /> [[Image:Atheist-symbol.png‎|right|thumbnail|right|250px|An Atheist Symbol &lt;ref&gt;http://www.cem.va.gov/cem/hm/hmemb.asp&lt;/ref&gt;]]<br /> *''For criticisms of Atheism, see [[Criticisms of Atheism]]]'' <br /> '''Atheism''', as defined by the ''Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy'' and the ''Routledge Encyclopedia of Philosophy'', is the denial of the existence of any [[God]] or gods.&lt;ref&gt;http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/atheism-agnosticism/&lt;/ref&gt;&lt;ref&gt;http://www.creationontheweb.com/content/view/1998&lt;/ref&gt; <br /> <br /> <br /> == Which God or gods? ==<br /> [[Image:Socrates.jpg|thumb|right|150px|The [[Greece|Greek]] philosopher [[Socrates]]]]<br /> Since atheism is denial of the existence of God or gods, it is important first to identify in which God and/or gods the atheist denies. In ancient times, for example, Christians were accused of being atheists because of their denial of the pagan gods, even though they believed in the ''Christian'' God.&lt;ref&gt;Athenagoras, ''A Plea for the Christians, 2d century A.D.[http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/athenagoras-plea.html]&lt;/ref&gt; [[Socrates]] was also accused of Atheism, although references to God run throughout his recorded statements.&lt;ref&gt;Plato, Apol., 26,c.&lt;/ref&gt; Also, [[Albert Einstein]] and [[Baruch Spinoza]] professed belief in &quot;God,&quot; but they defined &quot;God&quot; as the cosmos as a whole, and without personality.<br /> <br /> == Why do atheists state they disbelieve?==<br /> Atheists claim there are two main reasons for their denial of the existence of God and/or disbelief in God: the conviction that there is positive evidence or argument that God does not exist ([[Strong atheism]] which is also sometimes called positive atheism), and their claim that theists bear the burden of proof to show that God exists, that they have failed to do so, and that belief is therefore unwarranted ([[Weak atheism]]).<br /> <br /> == Two alternative types of Atheism ==<br /> * Theoretical atheism: atheism of the mind -- that is, ''believing'' that God does not exist.<br /> * Practical atheism: atheism of the life - that is, ''living'' as though God does not exist. &lt;ref&gt;Dr. [[Martin Luther King]] in his sermon ''A letter to American Christians'' spoke of &quot;practical atheism&quot;.[http://www.christianitytoday.com/leaders/newsletter/2001/cln10117.html]&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ==Atheist Groups and Organizations==<br /> ===Brights Movement===<br /> [[Image:Richard_Dawkins.jpg‎|thumbnail|200px|right|[[Richard Dawkins]] is listed as an enthusiastic bright by the [[Brights Movement]] website.]]<br /> The [[Brights Movement]] was started in 2003 by [[Paul Geisert]] and [[Mynga Futrell]] in 2003 in order to assist in the advocacy of a [[Naturalism|naturalistic worldview]].&lt;ref&gt;http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2843/is_2_28/ai_114090211/pg_1&lt;/ref&gt;&lt;ref&gt;http://www.the-brights.net/vision/faq.html#1&lt;/ref&gt; The Brights movement had a media campaign and was announced in [[Wired (magazine)|Wired]] magazine (by evolutionary biologist [[Richard Dawkins]]), ''[[Free Inquiry]]'' (by Richard Dawkins), and on the ''[[New York Times]]'' op-ed page (by the philosopher and atheist [[Daniel Dennett]]).&lt;ref&gt;http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2843/is_2_28/ai_114090211/pg_1&lt;/ref&gt; However, according to a 2004 ''[[Skeptical Enquirer]]'' article the movement the &quot;Brights label reinforced a longstanding stereotype. Atheists already have a terrible rap for being coldhearted [[Rationalism|rationalists]] who attend [[Mensa]] gatherings and dismiss religious believers as simple-minded fools.&quot;&lt;ref&gt;http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2843/is_2_28/ai_114090211/pg_3&lt;/ref&gt; In October of 2003 in a article in the ''[[Guardian]]'' Dawkins associated being a &quot;bright&quot; with being an intellectual.&lt;ref&gt;http://books.guardian.co.uk/review/story/0,12084,981412,00.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> ===Internet Infidels===<br /> [[Internet Infidels]] (also known as the Secular Web) is one of the principle websites for those who advocate atheism, [[agnosticism|agnostics]] and [[Philosophical skepticism|skeptics]] on the internet. Member's of the Internet Infidels website include:<br /> <br /> *[[Earl Doherty]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-D.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Richard Carrier]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-C.html&lt;/ref&gt; <br /> *[[Dan Barker]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-B.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Stephen Carr]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-C.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Jeffery Jay Lowder]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-L.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Acharya S]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-A.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Kyle Gerkin]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-G.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *Farrell Till &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-T.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ===American Atheists===<br /> American Atheists is an atheistic organization dedicated to securing freedom from religion, labour for separation of church and state, and defend the civil rights of atheists.&lt;ref&gt;http://www.atheists.org/visitors.center/intro.html#primary&lt;/ref&gt; American Atheists was founded by Madalyn Murray O'Hair, winner of the lawsuit that removed prayer and bible recitations from schools.&lt;ref&gt;http://www.atheists.org/visitors.center/about.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ===Carvaka school===<br /> An atheistic and materialistic offshoot of [[Hinduism]] in the 6th century B.C.<br /> <br /> ===Samkhya school===<br /> An atheistic school of classical Indian philosophy, originating in the 6th century B.C.<br /> == Well Known Proponents of Atheism ==<br /> [[Image:Ncvjgfu.jpg|right|thumbnail|150px|[[Mao Zedong]]]]Prominent atheists include, or have thought to have include:<br /> * [[Diagoras]]: Greek philosopher who denied the existence of the Greek pantheon<br /> * [[Lucretius]]: Greek philosopher espousing materialism, and stated that man should not believe in the gods because their ideas about the gods and their fear of death made men unhappy<br /> * [[Friedrich Nietzsche]]: Prominent 19th century atheist philosopher<br /> [[Image:nietzsche2.jpg|right|200px|thumbnail|[[Friedrich Nietzsche]]]]<br /> * [[Mao Zedong]]<br /> * [[Benito Mussolini]]<br /> * [[Paul Kurtz]]: founder of the Council of [[Secular Humanism]]<br /> * [[Bertrand Russell]]<br /> * [[Ayn Rand]]<br /> * [[Isaac Asimov]]<br /> * [[John Dewey]]<br /> * [[Douglas Adams]]<br /> * [[Ernest Hemingway]]<br /> *Richard Dawkins<br /> *Baron d'Holbach<br /> == Views on Atheists ==<br /> <br /> In regards to various [[Views on Atheists|views on atheists]], research in the American Sociological Review finds that among several groups listed, those who hold the position of atheism are the group that Americans relate least to in terms of their vision of American society and are the group most likely to be mentioned as one that Americans would not want to have marry into their family.<br /> &lt;ref&gt;Edgell, Gerteis &amp; Hartmann 2006&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> {| class=&quot;wikitable&quot;<br /> |-<br /> ! Position:<br /> ! This group does not at all agree with&lt;br&gt; my vision of American society:<br /> ! I would disapprove if my child wanted&lt;br&gt; to marry a member of this group:<br /> |-<br /> | Atheist<br /> | 39.6%<br /> | 47.6%<br /> |-<br /> | Muslim<br /> | 26.3%<br /> | 33.5%<br /> |-<br /> | Homosexual<br /> | 22.6%<br /> | NA<br /> |-<br /> |Conservative Christian<br /> | 13.5%<br /> | 6.9%<br /> |-<br /> | Recent Immigrant<br /> | 12.5%<br /> | Not Asked<br /> |-<br /> | Hispanic<br /> | 7.6%<br /> | 18.5%<br /> |-<br /> | Jew<br /> | 7.4%<br /> | 11.8%<br /> |-<br /> | Asian American<br /> | 7.0%<br /> | 18.5%<br /> |-<br /> |African American<br /> | 4.6%<br /> | 27.2%<br /> |-<br /> | White American<br /> | 2.2%<br /> | 2.3%<br /> |}<br /> <br /> == Atheist Population==<br /> <br /> In regards to the [[Atheist Population|atheist population]] as a percentage of various countries' populations, specific research on atheists conducted in 2006 [http://www.harrisinteractive.com/news/allnewsbydate.asp?NewsID=1131 suggests] that the true proportion of atheists is 4% in the United States, 17% in Great Britain and 32% in France. A survey published in the 2005 ''[[Encyclopedia Britannica]]'' stated that 2.3% of the world's population consists of individuals who profess &quot;atheism, skepticism, disbelief, or irreligion, including the militantly antireligious.&quot;&lt;ref&gt;http://search.eb.com/eb/article-9432620&lt;/ref&gt; In regards to the 2.3% figure just mentioned, the 2005 survey cited by ''Encyclopedia Britannica'' survey did not include [[Buddhism|Buddhist]] in regards to the 2.3% figure and Buddhism can be [[Theism|theistic]] or atheistic.&lt;ref&gt;http://www.religionfacts.com/buddhism/beliefs/atheism.htm&lt;/ref&gt;&lt;ref&gt;http://search.eb.com/eb/article-9432620&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> ==Atheism Quotes==<br /> <br /> ===For Atheism===<br /> <br /> *&quot;Isn't it enough to see that a garden is beautiful without having to believe that there are fairies at the bottom of it too?&quot; -Douglas Adams, from ''Last Chance to See''&lt;ref&gt;http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/quotes/douglas.htm&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;In Christianity neither morality nor religion come into contact with reality at any point.&quot;-Friedrich Nietzche &lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=13&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;Which is it, is man one of God's blunders or is God one of man's?&quot;-Friedrich Nietzche&lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=13&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;If God did not exist, it would be necessary to invent him.&quot;-Voltaire &lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=29&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;Faith is the great cop-out, the great excuse to evade the need to think and evaluate evidence. Faith is belief in spite of, even perhaps because of, the lack of evidence.&quot;-Richard Dawkins&lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=41&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;Tolerance and freedom of thought are the veritable antidotes to religious fanaticism.&quot;-Baron d'Holbach &lt;ref&gt;http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/quotes/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;If the ignorance of nature gave birth to gods, the knowledge of nature is calculated to destroy them.&quot;-Baron d'Holbach&lt;ref&gt;http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/quotes/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ===Against Atheism===<br /> <br /> [[Image:Raphael.jpg|right|thumbnail|175px|[[Plato]]]]<br /> *&quot;Atheism is a disease of the soul before it becomes an error of understanding.&quot; - [[Plato]]&lt;ref&gt;http://en.thinkexist.com/quotation/atheism_is_a_disease_of_the_soul-before_it/166811.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *Maybe the atheist cannot find God for the same reason a thief cannot find a policeman.&quot; - [[Francis Thomson]]&lt;ref&gt;http://www.afcministry.com/Atheism_Examined.htm&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;The atheists are for the most part imprudent and misguided scholars who reason badly who, not being able to understand the Creation, the origin of evil, and other difficulties, have recourse to the hypothesis the eternity of things and of inevitability.&quot; - [[Voltaire]]&lt;ref&gt;http://history.hanover.edu/texts/voltaire/volathe2.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;Atheists put on false courage and alcacrity in the midst of their darkness and aprehensions, like children who, when they fear to go in the dark, will sing for fear.&quot; - [[Alexander Pope]] &lt;ref&gt;http://books.google.com/books?id=cs4eAAAAMAAJ&amp;pg=PA383&amp;lpg=PA383&amp;dq=atheists+and+%22alexander+pope%22+and+%22false+courage%22&amp;source=web&amp;ots=Fx7SL7Z7UB&amp;sig=mYdRm6hkdBkmsF_uJW9mPv3JRhE&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;An atheist’s most embarrassing moment is when he feels profoundly thankful for something,but can’t think of anyone to thank for it&quot; - [[Mary Anne Vincent]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.weeks-g.dircon.co.uk/quotes_by_author_uv.htm&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *If there were no God there would be no atheists. - [[G. K. Chesterton]] (1874 - 1936) &lt;ref&gt;http://www.quotationspage.com/subjects/atheism/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *Nobody talks so constantly about God as those who insist there is no God. - [[Heywood Broun]]<br /> <br /> <br /> * Atheism is a crutch for those who cannot bear the reality of God. - [[Tom Stoppard]]&lt;ref&gt;http://www.tentmaker.org/Quotes/atheismquotes.htm&lt;/ref&gt; <br /> <br /> <br /> *I gave in, and admitted that God was God. - ex-atheist [[C.S. Lewis]], On relinquishing atheism at age 31 in 1929&lt;ref&gt;http://www.bartleby.com/63/95/4195.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *A little philosophy inclineth man's mind to atheism, but depth in philosophy bringeth men's minds about to religion. - Sir [[Francis Bacon]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.notable-quotes.com/a/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *An atheist is a man who believes himself an accident. — [[Francis Thompson]]&lt;ref&gt;http://forthardknox.com/2007/06/02/the-10-best-quotes-to-counter-an-atheist/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> [[Image:Joseph-addison-3-sized.jpg‎|right|thumbnail|175px|[[Joseph Addison]]]]<br /> *To be an atheist requires an indefinitely greater measure of faith than to recieve all the great truths which atheism would deny. - [[Joseph Addison]], The Spectator, Mar. 8, 1711 &lt;ref&gt;http://www.notable-quotes.com/a/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *It is hard to see how a great man can be an atheist. Without the sustaining influence of faith in a divine power we could have little faith in ourselves. We need to feel that behind us is intelligence and love. Doubters do not achieve; skeptics do not contribute; cynics do not create. Faith is the great motive power, and no man realizes his full possibilities unless he has the deep conviction that life is eternally important, and that his work, well done, is a part of an unending plan. - [[Calvin Coolidge]], speech, Jul. 25, 1924 &lt;ref&gt;http://www.notable-quotes.com/a/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *Among the repulsions of atheism for me has been its drastic un-interestingness as an intellectual position. Where was the ingenuity, the ambiguity, the humanity of saying that the universe just happened to happen and that when we're dead we're dead? - [[John Updike]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.just-quotes.com/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *God never wrought miracles to convince atheism, because his ordinary works convince it. - Sir [[Francis Bacon]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.just-quotes.com/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *The habit of arguing in support of atheism, whether it be done from conviction or in pretense, is a wicked and impious practice. - Marcus Tullius [[Cicero]] (106–43 B.C.), Roman orator, philosopher, statesman&lt;ref&gt;http://www.bartleby.com/66/50/12450.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *How to trap an atheist: Serve him a fine meal, then ask him if he believes there is a cook. — Source Unknown &lt;ref&gt;http://forthardknox.com/2007/06/02/the-10-best-quotes-to-counter-an-atheist/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *I once wanted to become an atheist but I gave up . . . they have no holidays. - [[Henny Youngman]]&lt;ref&gt;http://www.bartleby.com/63/79/4779.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ==See Also==<br /> *[[Agnosticism]]<br /> *[[History of Atheism]]<br /> *[[Criticism of Atheism]]<br /> <br /> ==External links==<br /> *[http://www.carm.org/atheism.htm Atheism] by [[Christian Apologetics and Research Ministry]]<br /> *[http://creationwiki.org/Decline_of_atheism Decline of Atheism -CreationWiki]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zaKryi3605g&amp;NR=1 Richard Dawkins Being Stumped By a Creationists' Question - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VyNqw6umRq8&amp;feature=related Atheist's Nightmare - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hnCBwGJHZQg Atheism: Rational and Objective? Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v0fImg64yok&amp;feature=related Ravi Zacharias on Atheistic Evolution - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uQAYXlSDvlY Koukl: Greatest murders? - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L3r_SbmLQu0&amp;feature=related Koukl: Why Atheistic Fundamentalism ? - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZP8zI8JT-rk Psychology of Atheism part 1 of 2 - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E2Re56A9syg&amp;feature=related Psychology of Atheism part 2 of 2 - Video Clip]<br /> <br /> == Notes ==<br /> {{reflist|2}}<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> [[Category:Atheism]]<br /> [[Category:Religion]]<br /> [[Category:Philosophy]]</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User_talk:Phillipps&diff=416975 2008-03-30T01:56:54Z

<p>Phillipps: </p> <hr /> <div>'''Atheism Article'''<br /> <br /> Please do not recreate articles at atheism but rather use the talk pages. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 18:26, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> Sorry, I thought that it would be better to see it.--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 18:28, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> <br /> New Atheism Article.<br /> :Please note that everything below is both a work in progress and not the actual Conservapedia article on atheism (just a hypothetical alternative). Please don't edit or vandalize this, it is a personal project. I would like to thank all those that contributed to the original article: much of the wording below is that of others.<br /> <br /> [[Image:Atheist-symbol.png‎|right|thumbnail|right|250px|An Atheist Symbol &lt;ref&gt;http://www.cem.va.gov/cem/hm/hmemb.asp&lt;/ref&gt;]]<br /> ''For criticisms of Atheism, see [[Criticisms of Atheism'' <br /> '''Atheism''', as defined by the ''Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy'' and the ''Routledge Encyclopedia of Philosophy'', is the denial of the existence of any [[God]] or gods.&lt;ref&gt;http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/atheism-agnosticism/&lt;/ref&gt;&lt;ref&gt;http://www.creationontheweb.com/content/view/1998&lt;/ref&gt; <br /> <br /> <br /> == Which God or gods? ==<br /> [[Image:Socrates.jpg|thumb|right|150px|The [[Greece|Greek]] philosopher [[Socrates]]]]<br /> Since atheism is denial of the existence of God or gods, it is important first to identify in which God and/or gods the atheist denies. In ancient times, for example, Christians were accused of being atheists because of their denial of the pagan gods, even though they believed in the ''Christian'' God.&lt;ref&gt;Athenagoras, ''A Plea for the Christians, 2d century A.D.[http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/athenagoras-plea.html]&lt;/ref&gt; [[Socrates]] was also accused of Atheism, although references to God run throughout his recorded statements.&lt;ref&gt;Plato, Apol., 26,c.&lt;/ref&gt; Also, [[Albert Einstein]] and [[Baruch Spinoza]] professed belief in &quot;God,&quot; but they defined &quot;God&quot; as the cosmos as a whole, and without personality.<br /> <br /> == Why do atheists state they disbelieve?==<br /> Atheists claim there are two main reasons for their denial of the existence of God and/or disbelief in God: the conviction that there is positive evidence or argument that God does not exist ([[Strong atheism]] which is also sometimes called positive atheism), and their claim that theists bear the burden of proof to show that God exists, that they have failed to do so, and that belief is therefore unwarranted ([[Weak atheism]]).<br /> <br /> == Two alternative types of Atheism ==<br /> * Theoretical atheism: atheism of the mind -- that is, ''believing'' that God does not exist.<br /> * Practical atheism: atheism of the life - that is, ''living'' as though God does not exist. &lt;ref&gt;Dr. [[Martin Luther King]] in his sermon ''A letter to American Christians'' spoke of &quot;practical atheism&quot;.[http://www.christianitytoday.com/leaders/newsletter/2001/cln10117.html]&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ==Atheist Groups and Organizations==<br /> ===Brights Movement===<br /> [[Image:Richard_Dawkins.jpg‎|thumbnail|200px|right|[[Richard Dawkins]] is listed as an enthusiastic bright by the [[Brights Movement]] website.]]<br /> The [[Brights Movement]] was started in 2003 by [[Paul Geisert]] and [[Mynga Futrell]] in 2003 in order to assist in the advocacy of a [[Naturalism|naturalistic worldview]].&lt;ref&gt;http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2843/is_2_28/ai_114090211/pg_1&lt;/ref&gt;&lt;ref&gt;http://www.the-brights.net/vision/faq.html#1&lt;/ref&gt; The Brights movement had a media campaign and was announced in [[Wired (magazine)|Wired]] magazine (by evolutionary biologist [[Richard Dawkins]]), ''[[Free Inquiry]]'' (by Richard Dawkins), and on the ''[[New York Times]]'' op-ed page (by the philosopher and atheist [[Daniel Dennett]]).&lt;ref&gt;http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2843/is_2_28/ai_114090211/pg_1&lt;/ref&gt; However, according to a 2004 ''[[Skeptical Enquirer]]'' article the movement the &quot;Brights label reinforced a longstanding stereotype. Atheists already have a terrible rap for being coldhearted [[Rationalism|rationalists]] who attend [[Mensa]] gatherings and dismiss religious believers as simple-minded fools.&quot;&lt;ref&gt;http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2843/is_2_28/ai_114090211/pg_3&lt;/ref&gt; In October of 2003 in a article in the ''[[Guardian]]'' Dawkins associated being a &quot;bright&quot; with being an intellectual.&lt;ref&gt;http://books.guardian.co.uk/review/story/0,12084,981412,00.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> ===Internet Infidels===<br /> [[Internet Infidels]] (also known as the Secular Web) is one of the principle websites for those who advocate atheism, [[agnosticism|agnostics]] and [[Philosophical skepticism|skeptics]] on the internet. Member's of the Internet Infidels website include:<br /> <br /> *[[Earl Doherty]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-D.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Richard Carrier]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-C.html&lt;/ref&gt; <br /> *[[Dan Barker]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-B.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Stephen Carr]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-C.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Jeffery Jay Lowder]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-L.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Acharya S]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-A.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Kyle Gerkin]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-G.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *Farrell Till &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-T.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ===American Atheists===<br /> American Atheists is an atheistic organization dedicated to securing freedom from religion, labour for separation of church and state, and defend the civil rights of atheists.&lt;ref&gt;http://www.atheists.org/visitors.center/intro.html#primary&lt;/ref&gt; American Atheists was founded by Madalyn Murray O'Hair, winner of the lawsuit that removed prayer and bible recitations from schools.&lt;ref&gt;http://www.atheists.org/visitors.center/about.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ===Carvaka school===<br /> An atheistic and materialistic offshoot of [[Hinduism]] in the 6th century B.C.<br /> <br /> ===Samkhya school===<br /> An atheistic school of classical Indian philosophy, originating in the 6th century B.C.<br /> == Well Known Proponents of Atheism ==<br /> [[Image:Ncvjgfu.jpg|right|thumbnail|150px|[[Mao Zedong]]]]Prominent atheists include, or have thought to have include:<br /> * [[Diagoras]]: Greek philosopher who denied the existence of the Greek pantheon<br /> * [[Lucretius]]: Greek philosopher espousing materialism, and stated that man should not believe in the gods because their ideas about the gods and their fear of death made men unhappy<br /> * [[Friedrich Nietzsche]]: Prominent 19th century atheist philosopher<br /> [[Image:nietzsche2.jpg|right|200px|thumbnail|[[Friedrich Nietzsche]]]]<br /> * [[Mao Zedong]]<br /> * [[Benito Mussolini]]<br /> * [[Paul Kurtz]]: founder of the Council of [[Secular Humanism]]<br /> * [[Bertrand Russell]]<br /> * [[Ayn Rand]]<br /> * [[Isaac Asimov]]<br /> * [[John Dewey]]<br /> * [[Douglas Adams]]<br /> * [[Ernest Hemingway]]<br /> *Richard Dawkins<br /> *Baron d'Holbach<br /> == Views on Atheists ==<br /> <br /> In regards to various [[Views on Atheists|views on atheists]], research in the American Sociological Review finds that among several groups listed, those who hold the position of atheism are the group that Americans relate least to in terms of their vision of American society and are the group most likely to be mentioned as one that Americans would not want to have marry into their family.<br /> &lt;ref&gt;Edgell, Gerteis &amp; Hartmann 2006&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> {| class=&quot;wikitable&quot;<br /> |-<br /> ! Position:<br /> ! This group does not at all agree with&lt;br&gt; my vision of American society:<br /> ! I would disapprove if my child wanted&lt;br&gt; to marry a member of this group:<br /> |-<br /> | Atheist<br /> | 39.6%<br /> | 47.6%<br /> |-<br /> | Muslim<br /> | 26.3%<br /> | 33.5%<br /> |-<br /> | Homosexual<br /> | 22.6%<br /> | NA<br /> |-<br /> |Conservative Christian<br /> | 13.5%<br /> | 6.9%<br /> |-<br /> | Recent Immigrant<br /> | 12.5%<br /> | Not Asked<br /> |-<br /> | Hispanic<br /> | 7.6%<br /> | 18.5%<br /> |-<br /> | Jew<br /> | 7.4%<br /> | 11.8%<br /> |-<br /> | Asian American<br /> | 7.0%<br /> | 18.5%<br /> |-<br /> |African American<br /> | 4.6%<br /> | 27.2%<br /> |-<br /> | White American<br /> | 2.2%<br /> | 2.3%<br /> |}<br /> <br /> == Atheist Population==<br /> <br /> In regards to the [[Atheist Population|atheist population]] as a percentage of various countries' populations, specific research on atheists conducted in 2006 [http://www.harrisinteractive.com/news/allnewsbydate.asp?NewsID=1131 suggests] that the true proportion of atheists is 4% in the United States, 17% in Great Britain and 32% in France. A survey published in the 2005 ''[[Encyclopedia Britannica]]'' stated that 2.3% of the world's population consists of individuals who profess &quot;atheism, skepticism, disbelief, or irreligion, including the militantly antireligious.&quot;&lt;ref&gt;http://search.eb.com/eb/article-9432620&lt;/ref&gt; In regards to the 2.3% figure just mentioned, the 2005 survey cited by ''Encyclopedia Britannica'' survey did not include [[Buddhism|Buddhist]] in regards to the 2.3% figure and Buddhism can be [[Theism|theistic]] or atheistic.&lt;ref&gt;http://www.religionfacts.com/buddhism/beliefs/atheism.htm&lt;/ref&gt;&lt;ref&gt;http://search.eb.com/eb/article-9432620&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> ==Atheism Quotes==<br /> <br /> ===For Atheism===<br /> <br /> *&quot;Isn't it enough to see that a garden is beautiful without having to believe that there are fairies at the bottom of it too?&quot; -Douglas Adams, from ''Last Chance to See''&lt;ref&gt;http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/quotes/douglas.htm&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;In Christianity neither morality nor religion come into contact with reality at any point.&quot;-Friedrich Nietzche &lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=13&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;Which is it, is man one of God's blunders or is God one of man's?&quot;-Friedrich Nietzche&lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=13&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;If God did not exist, it would be necessary to invent him.&quot;-Voltaire &lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=29&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;Faith is the great cop-out, the great excuse to evade the need to think and evaluate evidence. Faith is belief in spite of, even perhaps because of, the lack of evidence.&quot;-Richard Dawkins&lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=41&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;Tolerance and freedom of thought are the veritable antidotes to religious fanaticism.&quot;-Baron d'Holbach &lt;ref&gt;http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/quotes/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;If the ignorance of nature gave birth to gods, the knowledge of nature is calculated to destroy them.&quot;-Baron d'Holbach&lt;ref&gt;http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/quotes/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ===Against Atheism===<br /> <br /> [[Image:Raphael.jpg|right|thumbnail|175px|[[Plato]]]]<br /> *&quot;Atheism is a disease of the soul before it becomes an error of understanding.&quot; - [[Plato]]&lt;ref&gt;http://en.thinkexist.com/quotation/atheism_is_a_disease_of_the_soul-before_it/166811.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *Maybe the atheist cannot find God for the same reason a thief cannot find a policeman.&quot; - [[Francis Thomson]]&lt;ref&gt;http://www.afcministry.com/Atheism_Examined.htm&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;The atheists are for the most part imprudent and misguided scholars who reason badly who, not being able to understand the Creation, the origin of evil, and other difficulties, have recourse to the hypothesis the eternity of things and of inevitability.&quot; - [[Voltaire]]&lt;ref&gt;http://history.hanover.edu/texts/voltaire/volathe2.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;Atheists put on false courage and alcacrity in the midst of their darkness and aprehensions, like children who, when they fear to go in the dark, will sing for fear.&quot; - [[Alexander Pope]] &lt;ref&gt;http://books.google.com/books?id=cs4eAAAAMAAJ&amp;pg=PA383&amp;lpg=PA383&amp;dq=atheists+and+%22alexander+pope%22+and+%22false+courage%22&amp;source=web&amp;ots=Fx7SL7Z7UB&amp;sig=mYdRm6hkdBkmsF_uJW9mPv3JRhE&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;An atheist’s most embarrassing moment is when he feels profoundly thankful for something,but can’t think of anyone to thank for it&quot; - [[Mary Anne Vincent]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.weeks-g.dircon.co.uk/quotes_by_author_uv.htm&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *If there were no God there would be no atheists. - [[G. K. Chesterton]] (1874 - 1936) &lt;ref&gt;http://www.quotationspage.com/subjects/atheism/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *Nobody talks so constantly about God as those who insist there is no God. - [[Heywood Broun]]<br /> <br /> <br /> * Atheism is a crutch for those who cannot bear the reality of God. - [[Tom Stoppard]]&lt;ref&gt;http://www.tentmaker.org/Quotes/atheismquotes.htm&lt;/ref&gt; <br /> <br /> <br /> *I gave in, and admitted that God was God. - ex-atheist [[C.S. Lewis]], On relinquishing atheism at age 31 in 1929&lt;ref&gt;http://www.bartleby.com/63/95/4195.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *A little philosophy inclineth man's mind to atheism, but depth in philosophy bringeth men's minds about to religion. - Sir [[Francis Bacon]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.notable-quotes.com/a/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *An atheist is a man who believes himself an accident. — [[Francis Thompson]]&lt;ref&gt;http://forthardknox.com/2007/06/02/the-10-best-quotes-to-counter-an-atheist/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> [[Image:Joseph-addison-3-sized.jpg‎|right|thumbnail|175px|[[Joseph Addison]]]]<br /> *To be an atheist requires an indefinitely greater measure of faith than to recieve all the great truths which atheism would deny. - [[Joseph Addison]], The Spectator, Mar. 8, 1711 &lt;ref&gt;http://www.notable-quotes.com/a/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *It is hard to see how a great man can be an atheist. Without the sustaining influence of faith in a divine power we could have little faith in ourselves. We need to feel that behind us is intelligence and love. Doubters do not achieve; skeptics do not contribute; cynics do not create. Faith is the great motive power, and no man realizes his full possibilities unless he has the deep conviction that life is eternally important, and that his work, well done, is a part of an unending plan. - [[Calvin Coolidge]], speech, Jul. 25, 1924 &lt;ref&gt;http://www.notable-quotes.com/a/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *Among the repulsions of atheism for me has been its drastic un-interestingness as an intellectual position. Where was the ingenuity, the ambiguity, the humanity of saying that the universe just happened to happen and that when we're dead we're dead? - [[John Updike]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.just-quotes.com/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *God never wrought miracles to convince atheism, because his ordinary works convince it. - Sir [[Francis Bacon]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.just-quotes.com/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *The habit of arguing in support of atheism, whether it be done from conviction or in pretense, is a wicked and impious practice. - Marcus Tullius [[Cicero]] (106–43 B.C.), Roman orator, philosopher, statesman&lt;ref&gt;http://www.bartleby.com/66/50/12450.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *How to trap an atheist: Serve him a fine meal, then ask him if he believes there is a cook. — Source Unknown &lt;ref&gt;http://forthardknox.com/2007/06/02/the-10-best-quotes-to-counter-an-atheist/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *I once wanted to become an atheist but I gave up . . . they have no holidays. - [[Henny Youngman]]&lt;ref&gt;http://www.bartleby.com/63/79/4779.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ==See Also==<br /> *[[Agnosticism]]<br /> *[[History of Atheism]]<br /> *[[Criticism of Atheism]]<br /> <br /> ==External links==<br /> *[http://www.carm.org/atheism.htm Atheism] by [[Christian Apologetics and Research Ministry]]<br /> *[http://creationwiki.org/Decline_of_atheism Decline of Atheism -CreationWiki]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zaKryi3605g&amp;NR=1 Richard Dawkins Being Stumped By a Creationists' Question - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VyNqw6umRq8&amp;feature=related Atheist's Nightmare - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hnCBwGJHZQg Atheism: Rational and Objective? Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v0fImg64yok&amp;feature=related Ravi Zacharias on Atheistic Evolution - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uQAYXlSDvlY Koukl: Greatest murders? - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L3r_SbmLQu0&amp;feature=related Koukl: Why Atheistic Fundamentalism ? - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZP8zI8JT-rk Psychology of Atheism part 1 of 2 - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E2Re56A9syg&amp;feature=related Psychology of Atheism part 2 of 2 - Video Clip]<br /> <br /> == Notes ==<br /> {{reflist|2}}<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> [[Category:Atheism]]<br /> [[Category:Religion]]<br /> [[Category:Philosophy]]</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User_talk:Phillipps&diff=416972 2008-03-30T01:55:20Z

<p>Phillipps: </p> <hr /> <div>'''Atheism Article'''<br /> <br /> Please do not recreate articles at atheism but rather use the talk pages. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 18:26, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> Sorry, I thought that it would be better to see it.--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 18:28, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> <br /> New Atheism Article.<br /> :Please note that everything below is both a work in progress and not the actual Conservapedia article on atheism (just a hypothetical alternative). Please don't edit or vandalize this, it is a personal project. I would like to thank all those that contributed to the original article: much of the wording below is that of others.<br /> <br /> [[Image:Atheist-symbol.png‎|right|thumbnail|right|250px|An Atheist Symbol &lt;ref&gt;http://www.cem.va.gov/cem/hm/hmemb.asp&lt;/ref&gt;]] <br /> '''Atheism''', as defined by the ''Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy'' and the ''Routledge Encyclopedia of Philosophy'', is the denial of the existence of any [[God]] or gods.&lt;ref&gt;http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/atheism-agnosticism/&lt;/ref&gt;&lt;ref&gt;http://www.creationontheweb.com/content/view/1998&lt;/ref&gt; <br /> <br /> <br /> == Which God or gods? ==<br /> [[Image:Socrates.jpg|thumb|right|150px|The [[Greece|Greek]] philosopher [[Socrates]]]]<br /> Since atheism is denial of the existence of God or gods, it is important first to identify in which God and/or gods the atheist denies. In ancient times, for example, Christians were accused of being atheists because of their denial of the pagan gods, even though they believed in the ''Christian'' God.&lt;ref&gt;Athenagoras, ''A Plea for the Christians, 2d century A.D.[http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/athenagoras-plea.html]&lt;/ref&gt; [[Socrates]] was also accused of Atheism, although references to God run throughout his recorded statements.&lt;ref&gt;Plato, Apol., 26,c.&lt;/ref&gt; Also, [[Albert Einstein]] and [[Baruch Spinoza]] professed belief in &quot;God,&quot; but they defined &quot;God&quot; as the cosmos as a whole, and without personality.<br /> <br /> == Why do atheists state they disbelieve?==<br /> Atheists claim there are two main reasons for their denial of the existence of God and/or disbelief in God: the conviction that there is positive evidence or argument that God does not exist ([[Strong atheism]] which is also sometimes called positive atheism), and their claim that theists bear the burden of proof to show that God exists, that they have failed to do so, and that belief is therefore unwarranted ([[Weak atheism]]).<br /> <br /> == Two alternative types of Atheism ==<br /> * Theoretical atheism: atheism of the mind -- that is, ''believing'' that God does not exist.<br /> * Practical atheism: atheism of the life - that is, ''living'' as though God does not exist. &lt;ref&gt;Dr. [[Martin Luther King]] in his sermon ''A letter to American Christians'' spoke of &quot;practical atheism&quot;.[http://www.christianitytoday.com/leaders/newsletter/2001/cln10117.html]&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ==Atheist Groups and Organizations==<br /> ===Brights Movement===<br /> [[Image:Richard_Dawkins.jpg‎|thumbnail|200px|right|[[Richard Dawkins]] is listed as an enthusiastic bright by the [[Brights Movement]] website.]]<br /> The [[Brights Movement]] was started in 2003 by [[Paul Geisert]] and [[Mynga Futrell]] in 2003 in order to assist in the advocacy of a [[Naturalism|naturalistic worldview]].&lt;ref&gt;http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2843/is_2_28/ai_114090211/pg_1&lt;/ref&gt;&lt;ref&gt;http://www.the-brights.net/vision/faq.html#1&lt;/ref&gt; The Brights movement had a media campaign and was announced in [[Wired (magazine)|Wired]] magazine (by evolutionary biologist [[Richard Dawkins]]), ''[[Free Inquiry]]'' (by Richard Dawkins), and on the ''[[New York Times]]'' op-ed page (by the philosopher and atheist [[Daniel Dennett]]).&lt;ref&gt;http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2843/is_2_28/ai_114090211/pg_1&lt;/ref&gt; However, according to a 2004 ''[[Skeptical Enquirer]]'' article the movement the &quot;Brights label reinforced a longstanding stereotype. Atheists already have a terrible rap for being coldhearted [[Rationalism|rationalists]] who attend [[Mensa]] gatherings and dismiss religious believers as simple-minded fools.&quot;&lt;ref&gt;http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2843/is_2_28/ai_114090211/pg_3&lt;/ref&gt; In October of 2003 in a article in the ''[[Guardian]]'' Dawkins associated being a &quot;bright&quot; with being an intellectual.&lt;ref&gt;http://books.guardian.co.uk/review/story/0,12084,981412,00.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> ===Internet Infidels===<br /> [[Internet Infidels]] (also known as the Secular Web) is one of the principle websites for those who advocate atheism, [[agnosticism|agnostics]] and [[Philosophical skepticism|skeptics]] on the internet. Member's of the Internet Infidels website include:<br /> <br /> *[[Earl Doherty]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-D.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Richard Carrier]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-C.html&lt;/ref&gt; <br /> *[[Dan Barker]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-B.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Stephen Carr]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-C.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Jeffery Jay Lowder]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-L.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Acharya S]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-A.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Kyle Gerkin]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-G.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *Farrell Till &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-T.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ===American Atheists===<br /> American Atheists is an atheistic organization dedicated to securing freedom from religion, labour for separation of church and state, and defend the civil rights of atheists.&lt;ref&gt;http://www.atheists.org/visitors.center/intro.html#primary&lt;/ref&gt; American Atheists was founded by Madalyn Murray O'Hair, winner of the lawsuit that removed prayer and bible recitations from schools.&lt;ref&gt;http://www.atheists.org/visitors.center/about.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ===Carvaka school===<br /> An atheistic and materialistic offshoot of [[Hinduism]] in the 6th century B.C.<br /> <br /> ===Samkhya school===<br /> An atheistic school of classical Indian philosophy, originating in the 6th century B.C.<br /> == Well Known Proponents of Atheism ==<br /> [[Image:Ncvjgfu.jpg|right|thumbnail|150px|[[Mao Zedong]]]]Prominent atheists include, or have thought to have include:<br /> * [[Diagoras]]: Greek philosopher who denied the existence of the Greek pantheon<br /> * [[Lucretius]]: Greek philosopher espousing materialism, and stated that man should not believe in the gods because their ideas about the gods and their fear of death made men unhappy<br /> * [[Friedrich Nietzsche]]: Prominent 19th century atheist philosopher<br /> [[Image:nietzsche2.jpg|right|200px|thumbnail|[[Friedrich Nietzsche]]]]<br /> * [[Mao Zedong]]<br /> * [[Benito Mussolini]]<br /> * [[Paul Kurtz]]: founder of the Council of [[Secular Humanism]]<br /> * [[Bertrand Russell]]<br /> * [[Ayn Rand]]<br /> * [[Isaac Asimov]]<br /> * [[John Dewey]]<br /> * [[Douglas Adams]]<br /> * [[Ernest Hemingway]]<br /> *Richard Dawkins<br /> *Baron d'Holbach<br /> == Views on Atheists ==<br /> <br /> In regards to various [[Views on Atheists|views on atheists]], research in the American Sociological Review finds that among several groups listed, those who hold the position of atheism are the group that Americans relate least to in terms of their vision of American society and are the group most likely to be mentioned as one that Americans would not want to have marry into their family.<br /> &lt;ref&gt;Edgell, Gerteis &amp; Hartmann 2006&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> {| class=&quot;wikitable&quot;<br /> |-<br /> ! Position:<br /> ! This group does not at all agree with&lt;br&gt; my vision of American society:<br /> ! I would disapprove if my child wanted&lt;br&gt; to marry a member of this group:<br /> |-<br /> | Atheist<br /> | 39.6%<br /> | 47.6%<br /> |-<br /> | Muslim<br /> | 26.3%<br /> | 33.5%<br /> |-<br /> | Homosexual<br /> | 22.6%<br /> | NA<br /> |-<br /> |Conservative Christian<br /> | 13.5%<br /> | 6.9%<br /> |-<br /> | Recent Immigrant<br /> | 12.5%<br /> | Not Asked<br /> |-<br /> | Hispanic<br /> | 7.6%<br /> | 18.5%<br /> |-<br /> | Jew<br /> | 7.4%<br /> | 11.8%<br /> |-<br /> | Asian American<br /> | 7.0%<br /> | 18.5%<br /> |-<br /> |African American<br /> | 4.6%<br /> | 27.2%<br /> |-<br /> | White American<br /> | 2.2%<br /> | 2.3%<br /> |}<br /> <br /> == Atheist Population==<br /> <br /> In regards to the [[Atheist Population|atheist population]] as a percentage of various countries' populations, specific research on atheists conducted in 2006 [http://www.harrisinteractive.com/news/allnewsbydate.asp?NewsID=1131 suggests] that the true proportion of atheists is 4% in the United States, 17% in Great Britain and 32% in France. A survey published in the 2005 ''[[Encyclopedia Britannica]]'' stated that 2.3% of the world's population consists of individuals who profess &quot;atheism, skepticism, disbelief, or irreligion, including the militantly antireligious.&quot;&lt;ref&gt;http://search.eb.com/eb/article-9432620&lt;/ref&gt; In regards to the 2.3% figure just mentioned, the 2005 survey cited by ''Encyclopedia Britannica'' survey did not include [[Buddhism|Buddhist]] in regards to the 2.3% figure and Buddhism can be [[Theism|theistic]] or atheistic.&lt;ref&gt;http://www.religionfacts.com/buddhism/beliefs/atheism.htm&lt;/ref&gt;&lt;ref&gt;http://search.eb.com/eb/article-9432620&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> ==Atheism Quotes==<br /> <br /> ===For Atheism===<br /> <br /> *&quot;Isn't it enough to see that a garden is beautiful without having to believe that there are fairies at the bottom of it too?&quot; -Douglas Adams, from ''Last Chance to See''&lt;ref&gt;http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/quotes/douglas.htm&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;In Christianity neither morality nor religion come into contact with reality at any point.&quot;-Friedrich Nietzche &lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=13&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;Which is it, is man one of God's blunders or is God one of man's?&quot;-Friedrich Nietzche&lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=13&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;If God did not exist, it would be necessary to invent him.&quot;-Voltaire &lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=29&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;Faith is the great cop-out, the great excuse to evade the need to think and evaluate evidence. Faith is belief in spite of, even perhaps because of, the lack of evidence.&quot;-Richard Dawkins&lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=41&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;Tolerance and freedom of thought are the veritable antidotes to religious fanaticism.&quot;-Baron d'Holbach &lt;ref&gt;http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/quotes/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;If the ignorance of nature gave birth to gods, the knowledge of nature is calculated to destroy them.&quot;-Baron d'Holbach&lt;ref&gt;http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/quotes/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ===Against Atheism===<br /> <br /> [[Image:Raphael.jpg|right|thumbnail|175px|[[Plato]]]]<br /> *&quot;Atheism is a disease of the soul before it becomes an error of understanding.&quot; - [[Plato]]&lt;ref&gt;http://en.thinkexist.com/quotation/atheism_is_a_disease_of_the_soul-before_it/166811.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *Maybe the atheist cannot find God for the same reason a thief cannot find a policeman.&quot; - [[Francis Thomson]]&lt;ref&gt;http://www.afcministry.com/Atheism_Examined.htm&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;The atheists are for the most part imprudent and misguided scholars who reason badly who, not being able to understand the Creation, the origin of evil, and other difficulties, have recourse to the hypothesis the eternity of things and of inevitability.&quot; - [[Voltaire]]&lt;ref&gt;http://history.hanover.edu/texts/voltaire/volathe2.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;Atheists put on false courage and alcacrity in the midst of their darkness and aprehensions, like children who, when they fear to go in the dark, will sing for fear.&quot; - [[Alexander Pope]] &lt;ref&gt;http://books.google.com/books?id=cs4eAAAAMAAJ&amp;pg=PA383&amp;lpg=PA383&amp;dq=atheists+and+%22alexander+pope%22+and+%22false+courage%22&amp;source=web&amp;ots=Fx7SL7Z7UB&amp;sig=mYdRm6hkdBkmsF_uJW9mPv3JRhE&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;An atheist’s most embarrassing moment is when he feels profoundly thankful for something,but can’t think of anyone to thank for it&quot; - [[Mary Anne Vincent]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.weeks-g.dircon.co.uk/quotes_by_author_uv.htm&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *If there were no God there would be no atheists. - [[G. K. Chesterton]] (1874 - 1936) &lt;ref&gt;http://www.quotationspage.com/subjects/atheism/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *Nobody talks so constantly about God as those who insist there is no God. - [[Heywood Broun]]<br /> <br /> <br /> * Atheism is a crutch for those who cannot bear the reality of God. - [[Tom Stoppard]]&lt;ref&gt;http://www.tentmaker.org/Quotes/atheismquotes.htm&lt;/ref&gt; <br /> <br /> <br /> *I gave in, and admitted that God was God. - ex-atheist [[C.S. Lewis]], On relinquishing atheism at age 31 in 1929&lt;ref&gt;http://www.bartleby.com/63/95/4195.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *A little philosophy inclineth man's mind to atheism, but depth in philosophy bringeth men's minds about to religion. - Sir [[Francis Bacon]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.notable-quotes.com/a/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *An atheist is a man who believes himself an accident. — [[Francis Thompson]]&lt;ref&gt;http://forthardknox.com/2007/06/02/the-10-best-quotes-to-counter-an-atheist/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> [[Image:Joseph-addison-3-sized.jpg‎|right|thumbnail|175px|[[Joseph Addison]]]]<br /> *To be an atheist requires an indefinitely greater measure of faith than to recieve all the great truths which atheism would deny. - [[Joseph Addison]], The Spectator, Mar. 8, 1711 &lt;ref&gt;http://www.notable-quotes.com/a/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *It is hard to see how a great man can be an atheist. Without the sustaining influence of faith in a divine power we could have little faith in ourselves. We need to feel that behind us is intelligence and love. Doubters do not achieve; skeptics do not contribute; cynics do not create. Faith is the great motive power, and no man realizes his full possibilities unless he has the deep conviction that life is eternally important, and that his work, well done, is a part of an unending plan. - [[Calvin Coolidge]], speech, Jul. 25, 1924 &lt;ref&gt;http://www.notable-quotes.com/a/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *Among the repulsions of atheism for me has been its drastic un-interestingness as an intellectual position. Where was the ingenuity, the ambiguity, the humanity of saying that the universe just happened to happen and that when we're dead we're dead? - [[John Updike]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.just-quotes.com/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *God never wrought miracles to convince atheism, because his ordinary works convince it. - Sir [[Francis Bacon]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.just-quotes.com/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *The habit of arguing in support of atheism, whether it be done from conviction or in pretense, is a wicked and impious practice. - Marcus Tullius [[Cicero]] (106–43 B.C.), Roman orator, philosopher, statesman&lt;ref&gt;http://www.bartleby.com/66/50/12450.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *How to trap an atheist: Serve him a fine meal, then ask him if he believes there is a cook. — Source Unknown &lt;ref&gt;http://forthardknox.com/2007/06/02/the-10-best-quotes-to-counter-an-atheist/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *I once wanted to become an atheist but I gave up . . . they have no holidays. - [[Henny Youngman]]&lt;ref&gt;http://www.bartleby.com/63/79/4779.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ==See Also==<br /> *[[Agnosticism]]<br /> *[[History of Atheism]]<br /> *[[Criticism of Atheism]]<br /> <br /> ==External links==<br /> *[http://www.carm.org/atheism.htm Atheism] by [[Christian Apologetics and Research Ministry]]<br /> *[http://creationwiki.org/Decline_of_atheism Decline of Atheism -CreationWiki]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zaKryi3605g&amp;NR=1 Richard Dawkins Being Stumped By a Creationists' Question - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VyNqw6umRq8&amp;feature=related Atheist's Nightmare - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hnCBwGJHZQg Atheism: Rational and Objective? Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v0fImg64yok&amp;feature=related Ravi Zacharias on Atheistic Evolution - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uQAYXlSDvlY Koukl: Greatest murders? - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L3r_SbmLQu0&amp;feature=related Koukl: Why Atheistic Fundamentalism ? - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZP8zI8JT-rk Psychology of Atheism part 1 of 2 - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E2Re56A9syg&amp;feature=related Psychology of Atheism part 2 of 2 - Video Clip]<br /> <br /> == Notes ==<br /> {{reflist|2}}<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> [[Category:Atheism]]<br /> [[Category:Religion]]<br /> [[Category:Philosophy]]</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User:Phillipps&diff=416969 2008-03-30T01:52:56Z

<p>Phillipps: </p> <hr /> <div>{{User Evo}}<br /> <br /> {{User evolutionScience}}<br /> <br /> {{User Political Compass|-3.00|-4.56}}<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> I am Canadian (and proud of it). I love classical music and sushi (and cheesecake for that matter). Nothing is better than a good book.<br /> I have been to:<br /> :The United States (Florida, Washington D.C., Boston)<br /> :Canada (born there)<br /> :England (lived there)<br /> :France<br /> :Belguim<br /> :Italy<br /> :The Cayman Islands (lived there)<br /> :Egypt<br /> :The Bahamas<br /> :The Dominican Republic<br /> <br /> I have always wanted to visit Germany (beautiful country) and Poland which has the last old growth forest (over several thousand years old, and funnily enough protected by Hermann Göring) left on the Eurasian plain.<br /> <br /> I am an Atheist (I suppose technically an Agnostic). The burden of proof is on the one who asserts that something exists (ie Russel's Teapot), and yes, it is possible (since we cannot prove a universal negative) that somewhere in the universe there might be a god. For grades 4-7 (I skipped grade 5) I went to a private Christian school (First Baptist Christian School, in the Cayman Islands).<br /> <br /> I also happen to think that citations '''must''' be included with articles. Don't write whatever you would like and find citations in a few weeks (or expect other people to do it), or even worse, not citing it all (even after criticism).<br /> <br /> I think that the Atheism article should be balanced and ordered, so I will attempt to re-arrange it on my talk page.</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User_talk:Phillipps&diff=416968 2008-03-30T01:51:02Z

<p>Phillipps: /* Atheism Quotes */</p> <hr /> <div>'''Atheism Article'''<br /> <br /> Please do not recreate articles at atheism but rather use the talk pages. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 18:26, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> Sorry, I thought that it would be better to see it.--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 18:28, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> <br /> New Atheism Article.<br /> :Please note that everything below is both a work in progress and not the actual Conservapedia article on atheism (just a hypothetical alternative). Please don't edit or vandalize this, it is a personal project. I would like to thank all those that contributed to the original article: much of the wording below is that of others.<br /> <br /> [[Image:Atheist-symbol.png‎|right|thumbnail|right|250px|An Atheist Symbol &lt;ref&gt;http://www.cem.va.gov/cem/hm/hmemb.asp&lt;/ref&gt;]] <br /> '''Atheism''', as defined by the ''Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy'' and the ''Routledge Encyclopedia of Philosophy'', is the denial of the existence of any [[God]] or gods.&lt;ref&gt;http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/atheism-agnosticism/&lt;/ref&gt;&lt;ref&gt;http://www.creationontheweb.com/content/view/1998&lt;/ref&gt; <br /> <br /> <br /> == Which God or gods? ==<br /> [[Image:Socrates.jpg|thumb|right|150px|The [[Greece|Greek]] philosopher [[Socrates]]]]<br /> Since atheism is denial of the existence of God or gods, it is important first to identify in which God and/or gods the atheist denies. In ancient times, for example, Christians were accused of being atheists because of their denial of the pagan gods, even though they believed in the ''Christian'' God.&lt;ref&gt;Athenagoras, ''A Plea for the Christians, 2d century A.D.[http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/athenagoras-plea.html]&lt;/ref&gt; [[Socrates]] was also accused of Atheism, although references to God run throughout his recorded statements.&lt;ref&gt;Plato, Apol., 26,c.&lt;/ref&gt; Also, [[Albert Einstein]] and [[Baruch Spinoza]] professed belief in &quot;God,&quot; but they defined &quot;God&quot; as the cosmos as a whole, and without personality.<br /> <br /> == Why do atheists state they disbelieve?==<br /> Atheists claim there are two main reasons for their denial of the existence of God and/or disbelief in God: the conviction that there is positive evidence or argument that God does not exist ([[Strong atheism]] which is also sometimes called positive atheism), and their claim that theists bear the burden of proof to show that God exists, that they have failed to do so, and that belief is therefore unwarranted ([[Weak atheism]]).<br /> <br /> == Two alternative types of Atheism ==<br /> * Theoretical atheism: atheism of the mind -- that is, ''believing'' that God does not exist.<br /> * Practical atheism: atheism of the life - that is, ''living'' as though God does not exist. &lt;ref&gt;Dr. [[Martin Luther King]] in his sermon ''A letter to American Christians'' spoke of &quot;practical atheism&quot;.[http://www.christianitytoday.com/leaders/newsletter/2001/cln10117.html]&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ==Atheist Groups and Organizations==<br /> ===Brights Movement===<br /> [[Image:Richard_Dawkins.jpg‎|thumbnail|200px|right|[[Richard Dawkins]] is listed as an enthusiastic bright by the [[Brights Movement]] website.]]<br /> The [[Brights Movement]] was started in 2003 by [[Paul Geisert]] and [[Mynga Futrell]] in 2003 in order to assist in the advocacy of a [[Naturalism|naturalistic worldview]].&lt;ref&gt;http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2843/is_2_28/ai_114090211/pg_1&lt;/ref&gt;&lt;ref&gt;http://www.the-brights.net/vision/faq.html#1&lt;/ref&gt; The Brights movement had a media campaign and was announced in [[Wired (magazine)|Wired]] magazine (by evolutionary biologist [[Richard Dawkins]]), ''[[Free Inquiry]]'' (by Richard Dawkins), and on the ''[[New York Times]]'' op-ed page (by the philosopher and atheist [[Daniel Dennett]]).&lt;ref&gt;http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2843/is_2_28/ai_114090211/pg_1&lt;/ref&gt; However, according to a 2004 ''[[Skeptical Enquirer]]'' article the movement the &quot;Brights label reinforced a longstanding stereotype. Atheists already have a terrible rap for being coldhearted [[Rationalism|rationalists]] who attend [[Mensa]] gatherings and dismiss religious believers as simple-minded fools.&quot;&lt;ref&gt;http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2843/is_2_28/ai_114090211/pg_3&lt;/ref&gt; In October of 2003 in a article in the ''[[Guardian]]'' Dawkins associated being a &quot;bright&quot; with being an intellectual.&lt;ref&gt;http://books.guardian.co.uk/review/story/0,12084,981412,00.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> ===Internet Infidels===<br /> [[Image:nietzsche2.jpg|right|200px|thumbnail|[[Friedrich Nietzsche]]]]<br /> As mentioned previously [[Internet Infidels]] (also known as the Secular Web) is one of the principle websites for those who advocate atheism, [[agnosticism|agnostics]] and [[Philosophical skepticism|skeptics]] on the internet. Member's of the Internet Infidels website include:<br /> <br /> *[[Earl Doherty]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-D.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Richard Carrier]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-C.html&lt;/ref&gt; <br /> *[[Dan Barker]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-B.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Stephen Carr]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-C.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Jeffery Jay Lowder]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-L.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Acharya S]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-A.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Kyle Gerkin]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-G.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *Farrell Till &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-T.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ===American Atheists===<br /> American Atheists is an atheistic organization dedicated to securing freedom from religion, labour for separation of church and state, and defend the civil rights of atheists.&lt;ref&gt;http://www.atheists.org/visitors.center/intro.html#primary&lt;/ref&gt; American Atheists was founded by Madalyn Murray O'Hair, winner of the lawsuit that removed prayer and bible recitations from schools.&lt;ref&gt;http://www.atheists.org/visitors.center/about.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ===Carvaka school===<br /> An atheistic and materialistic offshoot of [[Hinduism]] in the 6th century B.C.<br /> <br /> ===Samkhya school===<br /> An atheistic school of classical Indian philosophy, originating in the 6th century B.C.<br /> == Well Known Proponents of Atheism ==<br /> [[Image:Ncvjgfu.jpg|right|thumbnail|150px|[[Mao Zedong]]]]Prominent atheists include, or have thought to have include:<br /> * [[Diagoras]]: Greek philosopher who denied the existence of the Greek pantheon<br /> * [[Lucretius]]: Greek philosopher espousing materialism, and stated that man should not believe in the gods because their ideas about the gods and their fear of death made men unhappy<br /> * [[Friedrich Nietzsche]]: Prominent 19th century atheist philosopher<br /> * [[Mao Zedong]]<br /> * [[Benito Mussolini]]<br /> * [[Paul Kurtz]]: founder of the Council of [[Secular Humanism]]<br /> * [[Bertrand Russell]]<br /> * [[Ayn Rand]]<br /> * [[Isaac Asimov]]<br /> * [[John Dewey]]<br /> * [[Douglas Adams]]<br /> * [[Ernest Hemingway]]<br /> *Richard Dawkins<br /> *Baron d'Holbach<br /> == Views on Atheists ==<br /> <br /> In regards to various [[Views on Atheists|views on atheists]], research in the American Sociological Review finds that among several groups listed, those who hold the position of atheism are the group that Americans relate least to in terms of their vision of American society and are the group most likely to be mentioned as one that Americans would not want to have marry into their family.<br /> &lt;ref&gt;Edgell, Gerteis &amp; Hartmann 2006&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> {| class=&quot;wikitable&quot;<br /> |-<br /> ! Position:<br /> ! This group does not at all agree with&lt;br&gt; my vision of American society:<br /> ! I would disapprove if my child wanted&lt;br&gt; to marry a member of this group:<br /> |-<br /> | Atheist<br /> | 39.6%<br /> | 47.6%<br /> |-<br /> | Muslim<br /> | 26.3%<br /> | 33.5%<br /> |-<br /> | Homosexual<br /> | 22.6%<br /> | NA<br /> |-<br /> |Conservative Christian<br /> | 13.5%<br /> | 6.9%<br /> |-<br /> | Recent Immigrant<br /> | 12.5%<br /> | Not Asked<br /> |-<br /> | Hispanic<br /> | 7.6%<br /> | 18.5%<br /> |-<br /> | Jew<br /> | 7.4%<br /> | 11.8%<br /> |-<br /> | Asian American<br /> | 7.0%<br /> | 18.5%<br /> |-<br /> |African American<br /> | 4.6%<br /> | 27.2%<br /> |-<br /> | White American<br /> | 2.2%<br /> | 2.3%<br /> |}<br /> <br /> == Atheist Population==<br /> <br /> In regards to the [[Atheist Population|atheist population]] as a percentage of various countries' populations, specific research on atheists conducted in 2006 [http://www.harrisinteractive.com/news/allnewsbydate.asp?NewsID=1131 suggests] that the true proportion of atheists is 4% in the United States, 17% in Great Britain and 32% in France. A survey published in the 2005 ''[[Encyclopedia Britannica]]'' stated that 2.3% of the world's population consists of individuals who profess &quot;atheism, skepticism, disbelief, or irreligion, including the militantly antireligious.&quot;&lt;ref&gt;http://search.eb.com/eb/article-9432620&lt;/ref&gt; In regards to the 2.3% figure just mentioned, the 2005 survey cited by ''Encyclopedia Britannica'' survey did not include [[Buddhism|Buddhist]] in regards to the 2.3% figure and Buddhism can be [[Theism|theistic]] or atheistic.&lt;ref&gt;http://www.religionfacts.com/buddhism/beliefs/atheism.htm&lt;/ref&gt;&lt;ref&gt;http://search.eb.com/eb/article-9432620&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> ==Atheism Quotes==<br /> <br /> ===For Atheism===<br /> <br /> *&quot;Isn't it enough to see that a garden is beautiful without having to believe that there are fairies at the bottom of it too?&quot; -Douglas Adams, from ''Last Chance to See''&lt;ref&gt;http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/quotes/douglas.htm&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;In Christianity neither morality nor religion come into contact with reality at any point.&quot;-Friedrich Nietzche &lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=13&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;Which is it, is man one of God's blunders or is God one of man's?&quot;-Friedrich Nietzche&lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=13&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;If God did not exist, it would be necessary to invent him.&quot;-Voltaire &lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=29&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;Faith is the great cop-out, the great excuse to evade the need to think and evaluate evidence. Faith is belief in spite of, even perhaps because of, the lack of evidence.&quot;-Richard Dawkins&lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=41&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;Tolerance and freedom of thought are the veritable antidotes to religious fanaticism.&quot;-Baron d'Holbach &lt;ref&gt;http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/quotes/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;If the ignorance of nature gave birth to gods, the knowledge of nature is calculated to destroy them.&quot;-Baron d'Holbach&lt;ref&gt;http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/quotes/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ===Against Atheism===<br /> <br /> [[Image:Raphael.jpg|right|thumbnail|175px|[[Plato]]]]<br /> *&quot;Atheism is a disease of the soul before it becomes an error of understanding.&quot; - [[Plato]]&lt;ref&gt;http://en.thinkexist.com/quotation/atheism_is_a_disease_of_the_soul-before_it/166811.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *Maybe the atheist cannot find God for the same reason a thief cannot find a policeman.&quot; - [[Francis Thomson]]&lt;ref&gt;http://www.afcministry.com/Atheism_Examined.htm&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;The atheists are for the most part imprudent and misguided scholars who reason badly who, not being able to understand the Creation, the origin of evil, and other difficulties, have recourse to the hypothesis the eternity of things and of inevitability.&quot; - [[Voltaire]]&lt;ref&gt;http://history.hanover.edu/texts/voltaire/volathe2.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;Atheists put on false courage and alcacrity in the midst of their darkness and aprehensions, like children who, when they fear to go in the dark, will sing for fear.&quot; - [[Alexander Pope]] &lt;ref&gt;http://books.google.com/books?id=cs4eAAAAMAAJ&amp;pg=PA383&amp;lpg=PA383&amp;dq=atheists+and+%22alexander+pope%22+and+%22false+courage%22&amp;source=web&amp;ots=Fx7SL7Z7UB&amp;sig=mYdRm6hkdBkmsF_uJW9mPv3JRhE&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;An atheist’s most embarrassing moment is when he feels profoundly thankful for something,but can’t think of anyone to thank for it&quot; - [[Mary Anne Vincent]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.weeks-g.dircon.co.uk/quotes_by_author_uv.htm&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *If there were no God there would be no atheists. - [[G. K. Chesterton]] (1874 - 1936) &lt;ref&gt;http://www.quotationspage.com/subjects/atheism/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *Nobody talks so constantly about God as those who insist there is no God. - [[Heywood Broun]]<br /> <br /> <br /> * Atheism is a crutch for those who cannot bear the reality of God. - [[Tom Stoppard]]&lt;ref&gt;http://www.tentmaker.org/Quotes/atheismquotes.htm&lt;/ref&gt; <br /> <br /> <br /> *I gave in, and admitted that God was God. - ex-atheist [[C.S. Lewis]], On relinquishing atheism at age 31 in 1929&lt;ref&gt;http://www.bartleby.com/63/95/4195.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *A little philosophy inclineth man's mind to atheism, but depth in philosophy bringeth men's minds about to religion. - Sir [[Francis Bacon]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.notable-quotes.com/a/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *An atheist is a man who believes himself an accident. — [[Francis Thompson]]&lt;ref&gt;http://forthardknox.com/2007/06/02/the-10-best-quotes-to-counter-an-atheist/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> [[Image:Joseph-addison-3-sized.jpg‎|right|thumbnail|175px|[[Joseph Addison]]]]<br /> *To be an atheist requires an indefinitely greater measure of faith than to recieve all the great truths which atheism would deny. - [[Joseph Addison]], The Spectator, Mar. 8, 1711 &lt;ref&gt;http://www.notable-quotes.com/a/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *It is hard to see how a great man can be an atheist. Without the sustaining influence of faith in a divine power we could have little faith in ourselves. We need to feel that behind us is intelligence and love. Doubters do not achieve; skeptics do not contribute; cynics do not create. Faith is the great motive power, and no man realizes his full possibilities unless he has the deep conviction that life is eternally important, and that his work, well done, is a part of an unending plan. - [[Calvin Coolidge]], speech, Jul. 25, 1924 &lt;ref&gt;http://www.notable-quotes.com/a/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *Among the repulsions of atheism for me has been its drastic un-interestingness as an intellectual position. Where was the ingenuity, the ambiguity, the humanity of saying that the universe just happened to happen and that when we're dead we're dead? - [[John Updike]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.just-quotes.com/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *God never wrought miracles to convince atheism, because his ordinary works convince it. - Sir [[Francis Bacon]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.just-quotes.com/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *The habit of arguing in support of atheism, whether it be done from conviction or in pretense, is a wicked and impious practice. - Marcus Tullius [[Cicero]] (106–43 B.C.), Roman orator, philosopher, statesman&lt;ref&gt;http://www.bartleby.com/66/50/12450.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *How to trap an atheist: Serve him a fine meal, then ask him if he believes there is a cook. — Source Unknown &lt;ref&gt;http://forthardknox.com/2007/06/02/the-10-best-quotes-to-counter-an-atheist/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *I once wanted to become an atheist but I gave up . . . they have no holidays. - [[Henny Youngman]]&lt;ref&gt;http://www.bartleby.com/63/79/4779.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ==See Also==<br /> *[[Agnosticism]]<br /> *[[History of Atheism]]<br /> *[[Criticism of Atheism]]<br /> <br /> ==External links==<br /> *[http://www.carm.org/atheism.htm Atheism] by [[Christian Apologetics and Research Ministry]]<br /> *[http://creationwiki.org/Decline_of_atheism Decline of Atheism -CreationWiki]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zaKryi3605g&amp;NR=1 Richard Dawkins Being Stumped By a Creationists' Question - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VyNqw6umRq8&amp;feature=related Atheist's Nightmare - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hnCBwGJHZQg Atheism: Rational and Objective? Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v0fImg64yok&amp;feature=related Ravi Zacharias on Atheistic Evolution - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uQAYXlSDvlY Koukl: Greatest murders? - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L3r_SbmLQu0&amp;feature=related Koukl: Why Atheistic Fundamentalism ? - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZP8zI8JT-rk Psychology of Atheism part 1 of 2 - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E2Re56A9syg&amp;feature=related Psychology of Atheism part 2 of 2 - Video Clip]<br /> <br /> == Notes ==<br /> {{reflist|2}}<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> [[Category:Atheism]]<br /> [[Category:Religion]]<br /> [[Category:Philosophy]]</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User_talk:Phillipps&diff=416967 2008-03-30T01:50:04Z

<p>Phillipps: /* See Also */</p> <hr /> <div>'''Atheism Article'''<br /> <br /> Please do not recreate articles at atheism but rather use the talk pages. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 18:26, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> Sorry, I thought that it would be better to see it.--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 18:28, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> <br /> New Atheism Article.<br /> :Please note that everything below is both a work in progress and not the actual Conservapedia article on atheism (just a hypothetical alternative). Please don't edit or vandalize this, it is a personal project. I would like to thank all those that contributed to the original article: much of the wording below is that of others.<br /> <br /> [[Image:Atheist-symbol.png‎|right|thumbnail|right|250px|An Atheist Symbol &lt;ref&gt;http://www.cem.va.gov/cem/hm/hmemb.asp&lt;/ref&gt;]] <br /> '''Atheism''', as defined by the ''Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy'' and the ''Routledge Encyclopedia of Philosophy'', is the denial of the existence of any [[God]] or gods.&lt;ref&gt;http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/atheism-agnosticism/&lt;/ref&gt;&lt;ref&gt;http://www.creationontheweb.com/content/view/1998&lt;/ref&gt; <br /> <br /> <br /> == Which God or gods? ==<br /> [[Image:Socrates.jpg|thumb|right|150px|The [[Greece|Greek]] philosopher [[Socrates]]]]<br /> Since atheism is denial of the existence of God or gods, it is important first to identify in which God and/or gods the atheist denies. In ancient times, for example, Christians were accused of being atheists because of their denial of the pagan gods, even though they believed in the ''Christian'' God.&lt;ref&gt;Athenagoras, ''A Plea for the Christians, 2d century A.D.[http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/athenagoras-plea.html]&lt;/ref&gt; [[Socrates]] was also accused of Atheism, although references to God run throughout his recorded statements.&lt;ref&gt;Plato, Apol., 26,c.&lt;/ref&gt; Also, [[Albert Einstein]] and [[Baruch Spinoza]] professed belief in &quot;God,&quot; but they defined &quot;God&quot; as the cosmos as a whole, and without personality.<br /> <br /> == Why do atheists state they disbelieve?==<br /> Atheists claim there are two main reasons for their denial of the existence of God and/or disbelief in God: the conviction that there is positive evidence or argument that God does not exist ([[Strong atheism]] which is also sometimes called positive atheism), and their claim that theists bear the burden of proof to show that God exists, that they have failed to do so, and that belief is therefore unwarranted ([[Weak atheism]]).<br /> <br /> == Two alternative types of Atheism ==<br /> * Theoretical atheism: atheism of the mind -- that is, ''believing'' that God does not exist.<br /> * Practical atheism: atheism of the life - that is, ''living'' as though God does not exist. &lt;ref&gt;Dr. [[Martin Luther King]] in his sermon ''A letter to American Christians'' spoke of &quot;practical atheism&quot;.[http://www.christianitytoday.com/leaders/newsletter/2001/cln10117.html]&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ==Atheist Groups and Organizations==<br /> ===Brights Movement===<br /> [[Image:Richard_Dawkins.jpg‎|thumbnail|200px|right|[[Richard Dawkins]] is listed as an enthusiastic bright by the [[Brights Movement]] website.]]<br /> The [[Brights Movement]] was started in 2003 by [[Paul Geisert]] and [[Mynga Futrell]] in 2003 in order to assist in the advocacy of a [[Naturalism|naturalistic worldview]].&lt;ref&gt;http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2843/is_2_28/ai_114090211/pg_1&lt;/ref&gt;&lt;ref&gt;http://www.the-brights.net/vision/faq.html#1&lt;/ref&gt; The Brights movement had a media campaign and was announced in [[Wired (magazine)|Wired]] magazine (by evolutionary biologist [[Richard Dawkins]]), ''[[Free Inquiry]]'' (by Richard Dawkins), and on the ''[[New York Times]]'' op-ed page (by the philosopher and atheist [[Daniel Dennett]]).&lt;ref&gt;http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2843/is_2_28/ai_114090211/pg_1&lt;/ref&gt; However, according to a 2004 ''[[Skeptical Enquirer]]'' article the movement the &quot;Brights label reinforced a longstanding stereotype. Atheists already have a terrible rap for being coldhearted [[Rationalism|rationalists]] who attend [[Mensa]] gatherings and dismiss religious believers as simple-minded fools.&quot;&lt;ref&gt;http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2843/is_2_28/ai_114090211/pg_3&lt;/ref&gt; In October of 2003 in a article in the ''[[Guardian]]'' Dawkins associated being a &quot;bright&quot; with being an intellectual.&lt;ref&gt;http://books.guardian.co.uk/review/story/0,12084,981412,00.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> ===Internet Infidels===<br /> [[Image:nietzsche2.jpg|right|200px|thumbnail|[[Friedrich Nietzsche]]]]<br /> As mentioned previously [[Internet Infidels]] (also known as the Secular Web) is one of the principle websites for those who advocate atheism, [[agnosticism|agnostics]] and [[Philosophical skepticism|skeptics]] on the internet. Member's of the Internet Infidels website include:<br /> <br /> *[[Earl Doherty]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-D.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Richard Carrier]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-C.html&lt;/ref&gt; <br /> *[[Dan Barker]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-B.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Stephen Carr]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-C.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Jeffery Jay Lowder]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-L.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Acharya S]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-A.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Kyle Gerkin]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-G.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *Farrell Till &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-T.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ===American Atheists===<br /> American Atheists is an atheistic organization dedicated to securing freedom from religion, labour for separation of church and state, and defend the civil rights of atheists.&lt;ref&gt;http://www.atheists.org/visitors.center/intro.html#primary&lt;/ref&gt; American Atheists was founded by Madalyn Murray O'Hair, winner of the lawsuit that removed prayer and bible recitations from schools.&lt;ref&gt;http://www.atheists.org/visitors.center/about.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ===Carvaka school===<br /> An atheistic and materialistic offshoot of [[Hinduism]] in the 6th century B.C.<br /> <br /> ===Samkhya school===<br /> An atheistic school of classical Indian philosophy, originating in the 6th century B.C.<br /> == Well Known Proponents of Atheism ==<br /> [[Image:Ncvjgfu.jpg|right|thumbnail|150px|[[Mao Zedong]]]]Prominent atheists include, or have thought to have include:<br /> * [[Diagoras]]: Greek philosopher who denied the existence of the Greek pantheon<br /> * [[Lucretius]]: Greek philosopher espousing materialism, and stated that man should not believe in the gods because their ideas about the gods and their fear of death made men unhappy<br /> * [[Friedrich Nietzsche]]: Prominent 19th century atheist philosopher<br /> * [[Mao Zedong]]<br /> * [[Benito Mussolini]]<br /> * [[Paul Kurtz]]: founder of the Council of [[Secular Humanism]]<br /> * [[Bertrand Russell]]<br /> * [[Ayn Rand]]<br /> * [[Isaac Asimov]]<br /> * [[John Dewey]]<br /> * [[Douglas Adams]]<br /> * [[Ernest Hemingway]]<br /> *Richard Dawkins<br /> *Baron d'Holbach<br /> == Views on Atheists ==<br /> <br /> In regards to various [[Views on Atheists|views on atheists]], research in the American Sociological Review finds that among several groups listed, those who hold the position of atheism are the group that Americans relate least to in terms of their vision of American society and are the group most likely to be mentioned as one that Americans would not want to have marry into their family.<br /> &lt;ref&gt;Edgell, Gerteis &amp; Hartmann 2006&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> {| class=&quot;wikitable&quot;<br /> |-<br /> ! Position:<br /> ! This group does not at all agree with&lt;br&gt; my vision of American society:<br /> ! I would disapprove if my child wanted&lt;br&gt; to marry a member of this group:<br /> |-<br /> | Atheist<br /> | 39.6%<br /> | 47.6%<br /> |-<br /> | Muslim<br /> | 26.3%<br /> | 33.5%<br /> |-<br /> | Homosexual<br /> | 22.6%<br /> | NA<br /> |-<br /> |Conservative Christian<br /> | 13.5%<br /> | 6.9%<br /> |-<br /> | Recent Immigrant<br /> | 12.5%<br /> | Not Asked<br /> |-<br /> | Hispanic<br /> | 7.6%<br /> | 18.5%<br /> |-<br /> | Jew<br /> | 7.4%<br /> | 11.8%<br /> |-<br /> | Asian American<br /> | 7.0%<br /> | 18.5%<br /> |-<br /> |African American<br /> | 4.6%<br /> | 27.2%<br /> |-<br /> | White American<br /> | 2.2%<br /> | 2.3%<br /> |}<br /> <br /> == Atheist Population==<br /> <br /> In regards to the [[Atheist Population|atheist population]] as a percentage of various countries' populations, specific research on atheists conducted in 2006 [http://www.harrisinteractive.com/news/allnewsbydate.asp?NewsID=1131 suggests] that the true proportion of atheists is 4% in the United States, 17% in Great Britain and 32% in France. A survey published in the 2005 ''[[Encyclopedia Britannica]]'' stated that 2.3% of the world's population consists of individuals who profess &quot;atheism, skepticism, disbelief, or irreligion, including the militantly antireligious.&quot;&lt;ref&gt;http://search.eb.com/eb/article-9432620&lt;/ref&gt; In regards to the 2.3% figure just mentioned, the 2005 survey cited by ''Encyclopedia Britannica'' survey did not include [[Buddhism|Buddhist]] in regards to the 2.3% figure and Buddhism can be [[Theism|theistic]] or atheistic.&lt;ref&gt;http://www.religionfacts.com/buddhism/beliefs/atheism.htm&lt;/ref&gt;&lt;ref&gt;http://search.eb.com/eb/article-9432620&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> ==Atheism Quotes==<br /> <br /> ===For Atheism===<br /> <br /> Isn't it enough to see that a garden is beautiful without having to believe that there are fairies at the bottom of it too? -Douglas Adams, from ''Last Chance to See''&lt;ref&gt;http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/quotes/douglas.htm&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> &quot;In Christianity neither morality nor religion come into contact with reality at any point.&quot;-Friedrich Nietzche &lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=13&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> &quot;Which is it, is man one of God's blunders or is God one of man's?&quot;-Friedrich Nietzche&lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=13&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> &quot;If God did not exist, it would be necessary to invent him.&quot;-Voltaire &lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=29&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> &quot;Faith is the great cop-out, the great excuse to evade the need to think and evaluate evidence. Faith is belief in spite of, even perhaps because of, the lack of evidence.&quot;-Richard Dawkins&lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=41&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> &quot;Tolerance and freedom of thought are the veritable antidotes to religious fanaticism.&quot;-Baron d'Holbach &lt;ref&gt;http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/quotes/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> &quot;If the ignorance of nature gave birth to gods, the knowledge of nature is calculated to destroy them.&quot;-Baron d'Holbach&lt;ref&gt;http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/quotes/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> ===Against Atheism===<br /> <br /> [[Image:Raphael.jpg|right|thumbnail|175px|[[Plato]]]]<br /> *&quot;Atheism is a disease of the soul before it becomes an error of understanding.&quot; - [[Plato]]&lt;ref&gt;http://en.thinkexist.com/quotation/atheism_is_a_disease_of_the_soul-before_it/166811.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *Maybe the atheist cannot find God for the same reason a thief cannot find a policeman.&quot; - [[Francis Thomson]]&lt;ref&gt;http://www.afcministry.com/Atheism_Examined.htm&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;The atheists are for the most part imprudent and misguided scholars who reason badly who, not being able to understand the Creation, the origin of evil, and other difficulties, have recourse to the hypothesis the eternity of things and of inevitability.&quot; - [[Voltaire]]&lt;ref&gt;http://history.hanover.edu/texts/voltaire/volathe2.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;Atheists put on false courage and alcacrity in the midst of their darkness and aprehensions, like children who, when they fear to go in the dark, will sing for fear.&quot; - [[Alexander Pope]] &lt;ref&gt;http://books.google.com/books?id=cs4eAAAAMAAJ&amp;pg=PA383&amp;lpg=PA383&amp;dq=atheists+and+%22alexander+pope%22+and+%22false+courage%22&amp;source=web&amp;ots=Fx7SL7Z7UB&amp;sig=mYdRm6hkdBkmsF_uJW9mPv3JRhE&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;An atheist’s most embarrassing moment is when he feels profoundly thankful for something,but can’t think of anyone to thank for it&quot; - [[Mary Anne Vincent]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.weeks-g.dircon.co.uk/quotes_by_author_uv.htm&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *If there were no God there would be no atheists. - [[G. K. Chesterton]] (1874 - 1936) &lt;ref&gt;http://www.quotationspage.com/subjects/atheism/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *Nobody talks so constantly about God as those who insist there is no God. - [[Heywood Broun]]<br /> <br /> <br /> * Atheism is a crutch for those who cannot bear the reality of God. - [[Tom Stoppard]]&lt;ref&gt;http://www.tentmaker.org/Quotes/atheismquotes.htm&lt;/ref&gt; <br /> <br /> <br /> *I gave in, and admitted that God was God. - ex-atheist [[C.S. Lewis]], On relinquishing atheism at age 31 in 1929&lt;ref&gt;http://www.bartleby.com/63/95/4195.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *A little philosophy inclineth man's mind to atheism, but depth in philosophy bringeth men's minds about to religion. - Sir [[Francis Bacon]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.notable-quotes.com/a/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *An atheist is a man who believes himself an accident. — [[Francis Thompson]]&lt;ref&gt;http://forthardknox.com/2007/06/02/the-10-best-quotes-to-counter-an-atheist/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> [[Image:Joseph-addison-3-sized.jpg‎|right|thumbnail|175px|[[Joseph Addison]]]]<br /> *To be an atheist requires an indefinitely greater measure of faith than to recieve all the great truths which atheism would deny. - [[Joseph Addison]], The Spectator, Mar. 8, 1711 &lt;ref&gt;http://www.notable-quotes.com/a/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *It is hard to see how a great man can be an atheist. Without the sustaining influence of faith in a divine power we could have little faith in ourselves. We need to feel that behind us is intelligence and love. Doubters do not achieve; skeptics do not contribute; cynics do not create. Faith is the great motive power, and no man realizes his full possibilities unless he has the deep conviction that life is eternally important, and that his work, well done, is a part of an unending plan. - [[Calvin Coolidge]], speech, Jul. 25, 1924 &lt;ref&gt;http://www.notable-quotes.com/a/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *Among the repulsions of atheism for me has been its drastic un-interestingness as an intellectual position. Where was the ingenuity, the ambiguity, the humanity of saying that the universe just happened to happen and that when we're dead we're dead? - [[John Updike]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.just-quotes.com/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *God never wrought miracles to convince atheism, because his ordinary works convince it. - Sir [[Francis Bacon]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.just-quotes.com/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *The habit of arguing in support of atheism, whether it be done from conviction or in pretense, is a wicked and impious practice. - Marcus Tullius [[Cicero]] (106–43 B.C.), Roman orator, philosopher, statesman&lt;ref&gt;http://www.bartleby.com/66/50/12450.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *How to trap an atheist: Serve him a fine meal, then ask him if he believes there is a cook. — Source Unknown &lt;ref&gt;http://forthardknox.com/2007/06/02/the-10-best-quotes-to-counter-an-atheist/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *I once wanted to become an atheist but I gave up . . . they have no holidays. - [[Henny Youngman]]&lt;ref&gt;http://www.bartleby.com/63/79/4779.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ==See Also==<br /> *[[Agnosticism]]<br /> *[[History of Atheism]]<br /> *[[Criticism of Atheism]]<br /> <br /> ==External links==<br /> *[http://www.carm.org/atheism.htm Atheism] by [[Christian Apologetics and Research Ministry]]<br /> *[http://creationwiki.org/Decline_of_atheism Decline of Atheism -CreationWiki]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zaKryi3605g&amp;NR=1 Richard Dawkins Being Stumped By a Creationists' Question - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VyNqw6umRq8&amp;feature=related Atheist's Nightmare - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hnCBwGJHZQg Atheism: Rational and Objective? Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v0fImg64yok&amp;feature=related Ravi Zacharias on Atheistic Evolution - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uQAYXlSDvlY Koukl: Greatest murders? - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L3r_SbmLQu0&amp;feature=related Koukl: Why Atheistic Fundamentalism ? - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZP8zI8JT-rk Psychology of Atheism part 1 of 2 - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E2Re56A9syg&amp;feature=related Psychology of Atheism part 2 of 2 - Video Clip]<br /> <br /> == Notes ==<br /> {{reflist|2}}<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> [[Category:Atheism]]<br /> [[Category:Religion]]<br /> [[Category:Philosophy]]</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User_talk:Phillipps&diff=416966 2008-03-30T01:49:34Z

<p>Phillipps: </p> <hr /> <div>'''Atheism Article'''<br /> <br /> Please do not recreate articles at atheism but rather use the talk pages. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 18:26, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> Sorry, I thought that it would be better to see it.--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 18:28, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> <br /> New Atheism Article.<br /> :Please note that everything below is both a work in progress and not the actual Conservapedia article on atheism (just a hypothetical alternative). Please don't edit or vandalize this, it is a personal project. I would like to thank all those that contributed to the original article: much of the wording below is that of others.<br /> <br /> [[Image:Atheist-symbol.png‎|right|thumbnail|right|250px|An Atheist Symbol &lt;ref&gt;http://www.cem.va.gov/cem/hm/hmemb.asp&lt;/ref&gt;]] <br /> '''Atheism''', as defined by the ''Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy'' and the ''Routledge Encyclopedia of Philosophy'', is the denial of the existence of any [[God]] or gods.&lt;ref&gt;http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/atheism-agnosticism/&lt;/ref&gt;&lt;ref&gt;http://www.creationontheweb.com/content/view/1998&lt;/ref&gt; <br /> <br /> <br /> == Which God or gods? ==<br /> [[Image:Socrates.jpg|thumb|right|150px|The [[Greece|Greek]] philosopher [[Socrates]]]]<br /> Since atheism is denial of the existence of God or gods, it is important first to identify in which God and/or gods the atheist denies. In ancient times, for example, Christians were accused of being atheists because of their denial of the pagan gods, even though they believed in the ''Christian'' God.&lt;ref&gt;Athenagoras, ''A Plea for the Christians, 2d century A.D.[http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/athenagoras-plea.html]&lt;/ref&gt; [[Socrates]] was also accused of Atheism, although references to God run throughout his recorded statements.&lt;ref&gt;Plato, Apol., 26,c.&lt;/ref&gt; Also, [[Albert Einstein]] and [[Baruch Spinoza]] professed belief in &quot;God,&quot; but they defined &quot;God&quot; as the cosmos as a whole, and without personality.<br /> <br /> == Why do atheists state they disbelieve?==<br /> Atheists claim there are two main reasons for their denial of the existence of God and/or disbelief in God: the conviction that there is positive evidence or argument that God does not exist ([[Strong atheism]] which is also sometimes called positive atheism), and their claim that theists bear the burden of proof to show that God exists, that they have failed to do so, and that belief is therefore unwarranted ([[Weak atheism]]).<br /> <br /> == Two alternative types of Atheism ==<br /> * Theoretical atheism: atheism of the mind -- that is, ''believing'' that God does not exist.<br /> * Practical atheism: atheism of the life - that is, ''living'' as though God does not exist. &lt;ref&gt;Dr. [[Martin Luther King]] in his sermon ''A letter to American Christians'' spoke of &quot;practical atheism&quot;.[http://www.christianitytoday.com/leaders/newsletter/2001/cln10117.html]&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ==Atheist Groups and Organizations==<br /> ===Brights Movement===<br /> [[Image:Richard_Dawkins.jpg‎|thumbnail|200px|right|[[Richard Dawkins]] is listed as an enthusiastic bright by the [[Brights Movement]] website.]]<br /> The [[Brights Movement]] was started in 2003 by [[Paul Geisert]] and [[Mynga Futrell]] in 2003 in order to assist in the advocacy of a [[Naturalism|naturalistic worldview]].&lt;ref&gt;http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2843/is_2_28/ai_114090211/pg_1&lt;/ref&gt;&lt;ref&gt;http://www.the-brights.net/vision/faq.html#1&lt;/ref&gt; The Brights movement had a media campaign and was announced in [[Wired (magazine)|Wired]] magazine (by evolutionary biologist [[Richard Dawkins]]), ''[[Free Inquiry]]'' (by Richard Dawkins), and on the ''[[New York Times]]'' op-ed page (by the philosopher and atheist [[Daniel Dennett]]).&lt;ref&gt;http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2843/is_2_28/ai_114090211/pg_1&lt;/ref&gt; However, according to a 2004 ''[[Skeptical Enquirer]]'' article the movement the &quot;Brights label reinforced a longstanding stereotype. Atheists already have a terrible rap for being coldhearted [[Rationalism|rationalists]] who attend [[Mensa]] gatherings and dismiss religious believers as simple-minded fools.&quot;&lt;ref&gt;http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2843/is_2_28/ai_114090211/pg_3&lt;/ref&gt; In October of 2003 in a article in the ''[[Guardian]]'' Dawkins associated being a &quot;bright&quot; with being an intellectual.&lt;ref&gt;http://books.guardian.co.uk/review/story/0,12084,981412,00.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> ===Internet Infidels===<br /> [[Image:nietzsche2.jpg|right|200px|thumbnail|[[Friedrich Nietzsche]]]]<br /> As mentioned previously [[Internet Infidels]] (also known as the Secular Web) is one of the principle websites for those who advocate atheism, [[agnosticism|agnostics]] and [[Philosophical skepticism|skeptics]] on the internet. Member's of the Internet Infidels website include:<br /> <br /> *[[Earl Doherty]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-D.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Richard Carrier]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-C.html&lt;/ref&gt; <br /> *[[Dan Barker]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-B.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Stephen Carr]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-C.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Jeffery Jay Lowder]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-L.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Acharya S]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-A.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Kyle Gerkin]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-G.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *Farrell Till &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-T.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ===American Atheists===<br /> American Atheists is an atheistic organization dedicated to securing freedom from religion, labour for separation of church and state, and defend the civil rights of atheists.&lt;ref&gt;http://www.atheists.org/visitors.center/intro.html#primary&lt;/ref&gt; American Atheists was founded by Madalyn Murray O'Hair, winner of the lawsuit that removed prayer and bible recitations from schools.&lt;ref&gt;http://www.atheists.org/visitors.center/about.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ===Carvaka school===<br /> An atheistic and materialistic offshoot of [[Hinduism]] in the 6th century B.C.<br /> <br /> ===Samkhya school===<br /> An atheistic school of classical Indian philosophy, originating in the 6th century B.C.<br /> == Well Known Proponents of Atheism ==<br /> [[Image:Ncvjgfu.jpg|right|thumbnail|150px|[[Mao Zedong]]]]Prominent atheists include, or have thought to have include:<br /> * [[Diagoras]]: Greek philosopher who denied the existence of the Greek pantheon<br /> * [[Lucretius]]: Greek philosopher espousing materialism, and stated that man should not believe in the gods because their ideas about the gods and their fear of death made men unhappy<br /> * [[Friedrich Nietzsche]]: Prominent 19th century atheist philosopher<br /> * [[Mao Zedong]]<br /> * [[Benito Mussolini]]<br /> * [[Paul Kurtz]]: founder of the Council of [[Secular Humanism]]<br /> * [[Bertrand Russell]]<br /> * [[Ayn Rand]]<br /> * [[Isaac Asimov]]<br /> * [[John Dewey]]<br /> * [[Douglas Adams]]<br /> * [[Ernest Hemingway]]<br /> *Richard Dawkins<br /> *Baron d'Holbach<br /> == Views on Atheists ==<br /> <br /> In regards to various [[Views on Atheists|views on atheists]], research in the American Sociological Review finds that among several groups listed, those who hold the position of atheism are the group that Americans relate least to in terms of their vision of American society and are the group most likely to be mentioned as one that Americans would not want to have marry into their family.<br /> &lt;ref&gt;Edgell, Gerteis &amp; Hartmann 2006&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> {| class=&quot;wikitable&quot;<br /> |-<br /> ! Position:<br /> ! This group does not at all agree with&lt;br&gt; my vision of American society:<br /> ! I would disapprove if my child wanted&lt;br&gt; to marry a member of this group:<br /> |-<br /> | Atheist<br /> | 39.6%<br /> | 47.6%<br /> |-<br /> | Muslim<br /> | 26.3%<br /> | 33.5%<br /> |-<br /> | Homosexual<br /> | 22.6%<br /> | NA<br /> |-<br /> |Conservative Christian<br /> | 13.5%<br /> | 6.9%<br /> |-<br /> | Recent Immigrant<br /> | 12.5%<br /> | Not Asked<br /> |-<br /> | Hispanic<br /> | 7.6%<br /> | 18.5%<br /> |-<br /> | Jew<br /> | 7.4%<br /> | 11.8%<br /> |-<br /> | Asian American<br /> | 7.0%<br /> | 18.5%<br /> |-<br /> |African American<br /> | 4.6%<br /> | 27.2%<br /> |-<br /> | White American<br /> | 2.2%<br /> | 2.3%<br /> |}<br /> <br /> == Atheist Population==<br /> <br /> In regards to the [[Atheist Population|atheist population]] as a percentage of various countries' populations, specific research on atheists conducted in 2006 [http://www.harrisinteractive.com/news/allnewsbydate.asp?NewsID=1131 suggests] that the true proportion of atheists is 4% in the United States, 17% in Great Britain and 32% in France. A survey published in the 2005 ''[[Encyclopedia Britannica]]'' stated that 2.3% of the world's population consists of individuals who profess &quot;atheism, skepticism, disbelief, or irreligion, including the militantly antireligious.&quot;&lt;ref&gt;http://search.eb.com/eb/article-9432620&lt;/ref&gt; In regards to the 2.3% figure just mentioned, the 2005 survey cited by ''Encyclopedia Britannica'' survey did not include [[Buddhism|Buddhist]] in regards to the 2.3% figure and Buddhism can be [[Theism|theistic]] or atheistic.&lt;ref&gt;http://www.religionfacts.com/buddhism/beliefs/atheism.htm&lt;/ref&gt;&lt;ref&gt;http://search.eb.com/eb/article-9432620&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> ==Atheism Quotes==<br /> <br /> ===For Atheism===<br /> <br /> Isn't it enough to see that a garden is beautiful without having to believe that there are fairies at the bottom of it too? -Douglas Adams, from ''Last Chance to See''&lt;ref&gt;http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/quotes/douglas.htm&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> &quot;In Christianity neither morality nor religion come into contact with reality at any point.&quot;-Friedrich Nietzche &lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=13&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> &quot;Which is it, is man one of God's blunders or is God one of man's?&quot;-Friedrich Nietzche&lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=13&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> &quot;If God did not exist, it would be necessary to invent him.&quot;-Voltaire &lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=29&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> &quot;Faith is the great cop-out, the great excuse to evade the need to think and evaluate evidence. Faith is belief in spite of, even perhaps because of, the lack of evidence.&quot;-Richard Dawkins&lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=41&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> &quot;Tolerance and freedom of thought are the veritable antidotes to religious fanaticism.&quot;-Baron d'Holbach &lt;ref&gt;http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/quotes/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> &quot;If the ignorance of nature gave birth to gods, the knowledge of nature is calculated to destroy them.&quot;-Baron d'Holbach&lt;ref&gt;http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/quotes/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> ===Against Atheism===<br /> <br /> [[Image:Raphael.jpg|right|thumbnail|175px|[[Plato]]]]<br /> *&quot;Atheism is a disease of the soul before it becomes an error of understanding.&quot; - [[Plato]]&lt;ref&gt;http://en.thinkexist.com/quotation/atheism_is_a_disease_of_the_soul-before_it/166811.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *Maybe the atheist cannot find God for the same reason a thief cannot find a policeman.&quot; - [[Francis Thomson]]&lt;ref&gt;http://www.afcministry.com/Atheism_Examined.htm&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;The atheists are for the most part imprudent and misguided scholars who reason badly who, not being able to understand the Creation, the origin of evil, and other difficulties, have recourse to the hypothesis the eternity of things and of inevitability.&quot; - [[Voltaire]]&lt;ref&gt;http://history.hanover.edu/texts/voltaire/volathe2.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;Atheists put on false courage and alcacrity in the midst of their darkness and aprehensions, like children who, when they fear to go in the dark, will sing for fear.&quot; - [[Alexander Pope]] &lt;ref&gt;http://books.google.com/books?id=cs4eAAAAMAAJ&amp;pg=PA383&amp;lpg=PA383&amp;dq=atheists+and+%22alexander+pope%22+and+%22false+courage%22&amp;source=web&amp;ots=Fx7SL7Z7UB&amp;sig=mYdRm6hkdBkmsF_uJW9mPv3JRhE&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;An atheist’s most embarrassing moment is when he feels profoundly thankful for something,but can’t think of anyone to thank for it&quot; - [[Mary Anne Vincent]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.weeks-g.dircon.co.uk/quotes_by_author_uv.htm&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *If there were no God there would be no atheists. - [[G. K. Chesterton]] (1874 - 1936) &lt;ref&gt;http://www.quotationspage.com/subjects/atheism/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *Nobody talks so constantly about God as those who insist there is no God. - [[Heywood Broun]]<br /> <br /> <br /> * Atheism is a crutch for those who cannot bear the reality of God. - [[Tom Stoppard]]&lt;ref&gt;http://www.tentmaker.org/Quotes/atheismquotes.htm&lt;/ref&gt; <br /> <br /> <br /> *I gave in, and admitted that God was God. - ex-atheist [[C.S. Lewis]], On relinquishing atheism at age 31 in 1929&lt;ref&gt;http://www.bartleby.com/63/95/4195.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *A little philosophy inclineth man's mind to atheism, but depth in philosophy bringeth men's minds about to religion. - Sir [[Francis Bacon]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.notable-quotes.com/a/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *An atheist is a man who believes himself an accident. — [[Francis Thompson]]&lt;ref&gt;http://forthardknox.com/2007/06/02/the-10-best-quotes-to-counter-an-atheist/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> [[Image:Joseph-addison-3-sized.jpg‎|right|thumbnail|175px|[[Joseph Addison]]]]<br /> *To be an atheist requires an indefinitely greater measure of faith than to recieve all the great truths which atheism would deny. - [[Joseph Addison]], The Spectator, Mar. 8, 1711 &lt;ref&gt;http://www.notable-quotes.com/a/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *It is hard to see how a great man can be an atheist. Without the sustaining influence of faith in a divine power we could have little faith in ourselves. We need to feel that behind us is intelligence and love. Doubters do not achieve; skeptics do not contribute; cynics do not create. Faith is the great motive power, and no man realizes his full possibilities unless he has the deep conviction that life is eternally important, and that his work, well done, is a part of an unending plan. - [[Calvin Coolidge]], speech, Jul. 25, 1924 &lt;ref&gt;http://www.notable-quotes.com/a/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *Among the repulsions of atheism for me has been its drastic un-interestingness as an intellectual position. Where was the ingenuity, the ambiguity, the humanity of saying that the universe just happened to happen and that when we're dead we're dead? - [[John Updike]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.just-quotes.com/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *God never wrought miracles to convince atheism, because his ordinary works convince it. - Sir [[Francis Bacon]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.just-quotes.com/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *The habit of arguing in support of atheism, whether it be done from conviction or in pretense, is a wicked and impious practice. - Marcus Tullius [[Cicero]] (106–43 B.C.), Roman orator, philosopher, statesman&lt;ref&gt;http://www.bartleby.com/66/50/12450.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *How to trap an atheist: Serve him a fine meal, then ask him if he believes there is a cook. — Source Unknown &lt;ref&gt;http://forthardknox.com/2007/06/02/the-10-best-quotes-to-counter-an-atheist/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *I once wanted to become an atheist but I gave up . . . they have no holidays. - [[Henny Youngman]]&lt;ref&gt;http://www.bartleby.com/63/79/4779.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ==See Also==<br /> *[[Agnosticism]]<br /> *[[History of Atheism]]<br /> *[[Second generation atheist]]<br /> ==External links==<br /> *[http://www.carm.org/atheism.htm Atheism] by [[Christian Apologetics and Research Ministry]]<br /> *[http://creationwiki.org/Decline_of_atheism Decline of Atheism -CreationWiki]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zaKryi3605g&amp;NR=1 Richard Dawkins Being Stumped By a Creationists' Question - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VyNqw6umRq8&amp;feature=related Atheist's Nightmare - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hnCBwGJHZQg Atheism: Rational and Objective? Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v0fImg64yok&amp;feature=related Ravi Zacharias on Atheistic Evolution - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uQAYXlSDvlY Koukl: Greatest murders? - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L3r_SbmLQu0&amp;feature=related Koukl: Why Atheistic Fundamentalism ? - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZP8zI8JT-rk Psychology of Atheism part 1 of 2 - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E2Re56A9syg&amp;feature=related Psychology of Atheism part 2 of 2 - Video Clip]<br /> <br /> == Notes ==<br /> {{reflist|2}}<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> [[Category:Atheism]]<br /> [[Category:Religion]]<br /> [[Category:Philosophy]]</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User_talk:Phillipps&diff=416964 2008-03-30T01:48:15Z

<p>Phillipps: </p> <hr /> <div>'''Atheism Article'''<br /> <br /> Please do not recreate articles at atheism but rather use the talk pages. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 18:26, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> Sorry, I thought that it would be better to see it.--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 18:28, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> <br /> New Atheism Article.<br /> :Please note that everything below is both a work in progress and not the actual Conservapedia article on atheism (just a hypothetical alternative). Please don't edit or vandalize this, it is a personal project. I would like to thank all those that contributed to the original article: much of the wording below is that of others.<br /> <br /> [[Image:Atheist-symbol.png‎|right|thumbnail|right|250px|An Atheist Symbol &lt;ref&gt;http://www.cem.va.gov/cem/hm/hmemb.asp&lt;/ref&gt;]] <br /> '''Atheism''', as defined by the ''Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy'' and the ''Routledge Encyclopedia of Philosophy'', is the denial of the existence of any [[God]] or gods.&lt;ref&gt;http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/atheism-agnosticism/&lt;/ref&gt;&lt;ref&gt;http://www.creationontheweb.com/content/view/1998&lt;/ref&gt; <br /> <br /> <br /> == Which God or gods? ==<br /> [[Image:Socrates.jpg|thumb|right|150px|The [[Greece|Greek]] philosopher [[Socrates]]]]<br /> Since atheism is denial of the existence of God or gods, it is important first to identify in which God and/or gods the atheist denies. In ancient times, for example, Christians were accused of being atheists because of their denial of the pagan gods, even though they believed in the ''Christian'' God.&lt;ref&gt;Athenagoras, ''A Plea for the Christians, 2d century A.D.[http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/text/athenagoras-plea.html]&lt;/ref&gt; [[Socrates]] was also accused of Atheism, although references to God run throughout his recorded statements.&lt;ref&gt;Plato, Apol., 26,c.&lt;/ref&gt; Also, [[Albert Einstein]] and [[Baruch Spinoza]] professed belief in &quot;God,&quot; but they defined &quot;God&quot; as the cosmos as a whole, and without personality.<br /> <br /> == Why do atheists state they disbelieve?==<br /> Atheists claim there are two main reasons for their denial of the existence of God and/or disbelief in God: the conviction that there is positive evidence or argument that God does not exist ([[Strong atheism]] which is also sometimes called positive atheism), and their claim that theists bear the burden of proof to show that God exists, that they have failed to do so, and that belief is therefore unwarranted ([[Weak atheism]]).<br /> <br /> == Two alternative types of Atheism ==<br /> * Theoretical atheism: atheism of the mind -- that is, ''believing'' that God does not exist.<br /> * Practical atheism: atheism of the life - that is, ''living'' as though God does not exist. &lt;ref&gt;Dr. [[Martin Luther King]] in his sermon ''A letter to American Christians'' spoke of &quot;practical atheism&quot;.[http://www.christianitytoday.com/leaders/newsletter/2001/cln10117.html]&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ==Atheist Groups and Organizations==<br /> ===Brights Movement===<br /> [[Image:Richard_Dawkins.jpg‎|thumbnail|200px|right|[[Richard Dawkins]] is listed as an enthusiastic bright by the [[Brights Movement]] website.]]<br /> The [[Brights Movement]] was started in 2003 by [[Paul Geisert]] and [[Mynga Futrell]] in 2003 in order to assist in the advocacy of a [[Naturalism|naturalistic worldview]].&lt;ref&gt;http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2843/is_2_28/ai_114090211/pg_1&lt;/ref&gt;&lt;ref&gt;http://www.the-brights.net/vision/faq.html#1&lt;/ref&gt; The Brights movement had a media campaign and was announced in [[Wired (magazine)|Wired]] magazine (by evolutionary biologist [[Richard Dawkins]]), ''[[Free Inquiry]]'' (by Richard Dawkins), and on the ''[[New York Times]]'' op-ed page (by the philosopher and atheist [[Daniel Dennett]]).&lt;ref&gt;http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2843/is_2_28/ai_114090211/pg_1&lt;/ref&gt; However, according to a 2004 ''[[Skeptical Enquirer]]'' article the movement the &quot;Brights label reinforced a longstanding stereotype. Atheists already have a terrible rap for being coldhearted [[Rationalism|rationalists]] who attend [[Mensa]] gatherings and dismiss religious believers as simple-minded fools.&quot;&lt;ref&gt;http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2843/is_2_28/ai_114090211/pg_3&lt;/ref&gt; In October of 2003 in a article in the ''[[Guardian]]'' Dawkins associated being a &quot;bright&quot; with being an intellectual.&lt;ref&gt;http://books.guardian.co.uk/review/story/0,12084,981412,00.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> ===Internet Infidels===<br /> [[Image:nietzsche2.jpg|right|200px|thumbnail|[[Friedrich Nietzsche]]]]<br /> As mentioned previously [[Internet Infidels]] (also known as the Secular Web) is one of the principle websites for those who advocate atheism, [[agnosticism|agnostics]] and [[Philosophical skepticism|skeptics]] on the internet. Member's of the Internet Infidels website include:<br /> <br /> *[[Earl Doherty]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-D.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Richard Carrier]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-C.html&lt;/ref&gt; <br /> *[[Dan Barker]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-B.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Stephen Carr]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-C.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Jeffery Jay Lowder]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-L.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Acharya S]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-A.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *[[Kyle Gerkin]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-G.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> *Farrell Till &lt;ref&gt;http://www.tektonics.org/TK-T.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ===American Atheists===<br /> American Atheists is an atheistic organization dedicated to securing freedom from religion, labour for separation of church and state, and defend the civil rights of atheists.&lt;ref&gt;http://www.atheists.org/visitors.center/intro.html#primary&lt;/ref&gt; American Atheists was founded by Madalyn Murray O'Hair, winner of the lawsuit that removed prayer and bible recitations from schools.&lt;ref&gt;http://www.atheists.org/visitors.center/about.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ===Carvaka school===<br /> An atheistic and materialistic offshoot of [[Hinduism]] in the 6th century B.C.<br /> <br /> ===Samkhya school===<br /> An atheistic school of classical Indian philosophy, originating in the 6th century B.C.<br /> == Well Known Proponents of Atheism ==<br /> [[Image:Ncvjgfu.jpg|right|thumbnail|150px|[[Mao Zedong]]]]Prominent holders of the position of atheism and atheist schools of thought have been or include:<br /> * [[Diagoras]]: Greek philosopher who denied the existence of the Greek pantheon<br /> * [[Lucretius]]: Greek philosopher espousing materialism, and stated that man should not believe in the gods because their ideas about the gods and their fear of death made men unhappy<br /> * [[Friedrich Nietzsche]]: Prominent 19th century atheist philosopher<br /> * [[Mao Zedong]]<br /> * [[Benito Mussolini]]<br /> * [[Paul Kurtz]]: founder of the Council of [[Secular Humanism]]<br /> * [[Bertrand Russell]]<br /> * [[Ayn Rand]]<br /> * [[Isaac Asimov]]<br /> * [[John Dewey]]<br /> * [[Douglas Adams]]<br /> * [[Ernest Hemingway]]<br /> *Richard Dawkins<br /> *Baron d'Holbach<br /> == Views on Atheists ==<br /> <br /> In regards to various [[Views on Atheists|views on atheists]], research in the American Sociological Review finds that among several groups listed, those who hold the position of atheism are the group that Americans relate least to in terms of their vision of American society and are the group most likely to be mentioned as one that Americans would not want to have marry into their family.<br /> &lt;ref&gt;Edgell, Gerteis &amp; Hartmann 2006&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> {| class=&quot;wikitable&quot;<br /> |-<br /> ! Position:<br /> ! This group does not at all agree with&lt;br&gt; my vision of American society:<br /> ! I would disapprove if my child wanted&lt;br&gt; to marry a member of this group:<br /> |-<br /> | Atheist<br /> | 39.6%<br /> | 47.6%<br /> |-<br /> | Muslim<br /> | 26.3%<br /> | 33.5%<br /> |-<br /> | Homosexual<br /> | 22.6%<br /> | NA<br /> |-<br /> |Conservative Christian<br /> | 13.5%<br /> | 6.9%<br /> |-<br /> | Recent Immigrant<br /> | 12.5%<br /> | Not Asked<br /> |-<br /> | Hispanic<br /> | 7.6%<br /> | 18.5%<br /> |-<br /> | Jew<br /> | 7.4%<br /> | 11.8%<br /> |-<br /> | Asian American<br /> | 7.0%<br /> | 18.5%<br /> |-<br /> |African American<br /> | 4.6%<br /> | 27.2%<br /> |-<br /> | White American<br /> | 2.2%<br /> | 2.3%<br /> |}<br /> <br /> == Atheist Population==<br /> <br /> In regards to the [[Atheist Population|atheist population]] as a percentage of various countries' populations, specific research on atheists conducted in 2006 [http://www.harrisinteractive.com/news/allnewsbydate.asp?NewsID=1131 suggests] that the true proportion of atheists is 4% in the United States, 17% in Great Britain and 32% in France. A survey published in the 2005 ''[[Encyclopedia Britannica]]'' stated that 2.3% of the world's population consists of individuals who profess &quot;atheism, skepticism, disbelief, or irreligion, including the militantly antireligious.&quot;&lt;ref&gt;http://search.eb.com/eb/article-9432620&lt;/ref&gt; In regards to the 2.3% figure just mentioned, the 2005 survey cited by ''Encyclopedia Britannica'' survey did not include [[Buddhism|Buddhist]] in regards to the 2.3% figure and Buddhism can be [[Theism|theistic]] or atheistic.&lt;ref&gt;http://www.religionfacts.com/buddhism/beliefs/atheism.htm&lt;/ref&gt;&lt;ref&gt;http://search.eb.com/eb/article-9432620&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> ==Atheism Quotes==<br /> <br /> ===For Atheism===<br /> <br /> Isn't it enough to see that a garden is beautiful without having to believe that there are fairies at the bottom of it too? -Douglas Adams, from ''Last Chance to See''&lt;ref&gt;http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/quotes/douglas.htm&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> &quot;In Christianity neither morality nor religion come into contact with reality at any point.&quot;-Friedrich Nietzche &lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=13&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> &quot;Which is it, is man one of God's blunders or is God one of man's?&quot;-Friedrich Nietzche&lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=13&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> &quot;If God did not exist, it would be necessary to invent him.&quot;-Voltaire &lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=29&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> &quot;Faith is the great cop-out, the great excuse to evade the need to think and evaluate evidence. Faith is belief in spite of, even perhaps because of, the lack of evidence.&quot;-Richard Dawkins&lt;ref&gt;http://atheistempire.com/greatminds/quotes.php?author=41&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> &quot;Tolerance and freedom of thought are the veritable antidotes to religious fanaticism.&quot;-Baron d'Holbach &lt;ref&gt;http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/quotes/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> &quot;If the ignorance of nature gave birth to gods, the knowledge of nature is calculated to destroy them.&quot;-Baron d'Holbach&lt;ref&gt;http://www.positiveatheism.org/hist/quotes/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> ===Against Atheism===<br /> <br /> [[Image:Raphael.jpg|right|thumbnail|175px|[[Plato]]]]<br /> *&quot;Atheism is a disease of the soul before it becomes an error of understanding.&quot; - [[Plato]]&lt;ref&gt;http://en.thinkexist.com/quotation/atheism_is_a_disease_of_the_soul-before_it/166811.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *Maybe the atheist cannot find God for the same reason a thief cannot find a policeman.&quot; - [[Francis Thomson]]&lt;ref&gt;http://www.afcministry.com/Atheism_Examined.htm&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;The atheists are for the most part imprudent and misguided scholars who reason badly who, not being able to understand the Creation, the origin of evil, and other difficulties, have recourse to the hypothesis the eternity of things and of inevitability.&quot; - [[Voltaire]]&lt;ref&gt;http://history.hanover.edu/texts/voltaire/volathe2.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;Atheists put on false courage and alcacrity in the midst of their darkness and aprehensions, like children who, when they fear to go in the dark, will sing for fear.&quot; - [[Alexander Pope]] &lt;ref&gt;http://books.google.com/books?id=cs4eAAAAMAAJ&amp;pg=PA383&amp;lpg=PA383&amp;dq=atheists+and+%22alexander+pope%22+and+%22false+courage%22&amp;source=web&amp;ots=Fx7SL7Z7UB&amp;sig=mYdRm6hkdBkmsF_uJW9mPv3JRhE&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *&quot;An atheist’s most embarrassing moment is when he feels profoundly thankful for something,but can’t think of anyone to thank for it&quot; - [[Mary Anne Vincent]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.weeks-g.dircon.co.uk/quotes_by_author_uv.htm&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *If there were no God there would be no atheists. - [[G. K. Chesterton]] (1874 - 1936) &lt;ref&gt;http://www.quotationspage.com/subjects/atheism/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *Nobody talks so constantly about God as those who insist there is no God. - [[Heywood Broun]]<br /> <br /> <br /> * Atheism is a crutch for those who cannot bear the reality of God. - [[Tom Stoppard]]&lt;ref&gt;http://www.tentmaker.org/Quotes/atheismquotes.htm&lt;/ref&gt; <br /> <br /> <br /> *I gave in, and admitted that God was God. - ex-atheist [[C.S. Lewis]], On relinquishing atheism at age 31 in 1929&lt;ref&gt;http://www.bartleby.com/63/95/4195.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *A little philosophy inclineth man's mind to atheism, but depth in philosophy bringeth men's minds about to religion. - Sir [[Francis Bacon]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.notable-quotes.com/a/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *An atheist is a man who believes himself an accident. — [[Francis Thompson]]&lt;ref&gt;http://forthardknox.com/2007/06/02/the-10-best-quotes-to-counter-an-atheist/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> [[Image:Joseph-addison-3-sized.jpg‎|right|thumbnail|175px|[[Joseph Addison]]]]<br /> *To be an atheist requires an indefinitely greater measure of faith than to recieve all the great truths which atheism would deny. - [[Joseph Addison]], The Spectator, Mar. 8, 1711 &lt;ref&gt;http://www.notable-quotes.com/a/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *It is hard to see how a great man can be an atheist. Without the sustaining influence of faith in a divine power we could have little faith in ourselves. We need to feel that behind us is intelligence and love. Doubters do not achieve; skeptics do not contribute; cynics do not create. Faith is the great motive power, and no man realizes his full possibilities unless he has the deep conviction that life is eternally important, and that his work, well done, is a part of an unending plan. - [[Calvin Coolidge]], speech, Jul. 25, 1924 &lt;ref&gt;http://www.notable-quotes.com/a/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *Among the repulsions of atheism for me has been its drastic un-interestingness as an intellectual position. Where was the ingenuity, the ambiguity, the humanity of saying that the universe just happened to happen and that when we're dead we're dead? - [[John Updike]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.just-quotes.com/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *God never wrought miracles to convince atheism, because his ordinary works convince it. - Sir [[Francis Bacon]] &lt;ref&gt;http://www.just-quotes.com/atheism_quotes.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *The habit of arguing in support of atheism, whether it be done from conviction or in pretense, is a wicked and impious practice. - Marcus Tullius [[Cicero]] (106–43 B.C.), Roman orator, philosopher, statesman&lt;ref&gt;http://www.bartleby.com/66/50/12450.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *How to trap an atheist: Serve him a fine meal, then ask him if he believes there is a cook. — Source Unknown &lt;ref&gt;http://forthardknox.com/2007/06/02/the-10-best-quotes-to-counter-an-atheist/&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> <br /> *I once wanted to become an atheist but I gave up . . . they have no holidays. - [[Henny Youngman]]&lt;ref&gt;http://www.bartleby.com/63/79/4779.html&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> ==See Also==<br /> *[[Agnosticism]]<br /> *[[History of Atheism]]<br /> *[[Second generation atheist]]<br /> ==External links==<br /> *[http://www.carm.org/atheism.htm Atheism] by [[Christian Apologetics and Research Ministry]]<br /> *[http://creationwiki.org/Decline_of_atheism Decline of Atheism -CreationWiki]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zaKryi3605g&amp;NR=1 Richard Dawkins Being Stumped By a Creationists' Question - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VyNqw6umRq8&amp;feature=related Atheist's Nightmare - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hnCBwGJHZQg Atheism: Rational and Objective? Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v0fImg64yok&amp;feature=related Ravi Zacharias on Atheistic Evolution - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uQAYXlSDvlY Koukl: Greatest murders? - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L3r_SbmLQu0&amp;feature=related Koukl: Why Atheistic Fundamentalism ? - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZP8zI8JT-rk Psychology of Atheism part 1 of 2 - Video Clip]<br /> *[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E2Re56A9syg&amp;feature=related Psychology of Atheism part 2 of 2 - Video Clip]<br /> <br /> == Notes ==<br /> {{reflist|2}}<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> [[Category:Atheism]]<br /> [[Category:Religion]]<br /> [[Category:Philosophy]]</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User:Phillipps&diff=416897 2008-03-30T00:32:12Z

<p>Phillipps: </p> <hr /> <div>{{User Evo}}<br /> <br /> {{User evolutionScience}}<br /> <br /> {{User Political Compass|-3.00|-4.56}}<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> I am Canadian (and proud of it). I love classical music and sushi (and cheesecake for that matter). Nothing is better than a good book.<br /> I have been to:<br /> :The United States (Florida, Washington D.C., Boston)<br /> :Canada (born there)<br /> :England (lived there)<br /> :France<br /> :Belguim<br /> :Italy<br /> :The Cayman Islands (lived there)<br /> :Egypt<br /> :The Bahamas<br /> :The Dominican Republic<br /> <br /> I have always wanted to visit Germany (beautiful country) and Poland which has the last old growth forest (over several thousand years old, and funnily enough protected by Hermann Göring) left on the Eurasian plain.<br /> <br /> I am an Atheist (I suppose technically an Agnostic). The burden of proof is on the one who asserts that something exists (ie Russel's Teapot), and yes, it is possible (since we cannot prove a universal negative) that somewhere in the universe there might be a god. For grades 4-7 (I skipped grade 5) I went to a private Christian school (First Baptist Christian School, in the Cayman Islands).<br /> <br /> I also happen to think that citations '''must''' be included with articles. Don't write whatever you would like and find citations in a few weeks (or expect other people to do it), or even worse, not citing it all (even after criticism).</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User:Phillipps&diff=416818 2008-03-29T23:22:22Z

<p>Phillipps: </p> <hr /> <div>{{User Evo}}<br /> <br /> {{User evolutionScience}}<br /> <br /> {{User Political Compass|-3.00|-4.56}}<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> I am Canadian (and proud of it). I love classical music and sushi (and cheesecake for that matter). Nothing is better than a good book.<br /> I have been to:<br /> :The United States (Florida, Washington D.C., Boston)<br /> :Canada (born there)<br /> :England (lived there)<br /> :France<br /> :Belguim<br /> :Italy<br /> :The Cayman Islands (lived there)<br /> :Egypt<br /> :The Bahamas<br /> :The Dominican Republic<br /> <br /> I have always wanted to visit Germany (beautiful country) and Poland which has the last old growth forest (over several thousand years old, and funnily enough protected by Hermann Göring) left on the Eurasian plain.<br /> <br /> I am an Atheist (I suppose technically an Agnostic). The burden of proof is on the one who asserts that something exists (ie Russel's Teapot), and yes, it is possible (since we cannot prove a universal negative) that somewhere in the universe there might be a god. For grades 4-7 (I skipped grade 5) I went to a private Christian school (First Baptist Christian School, in the Cayman Islands).</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User:Phillipps&diff=416813 2008-03-29T23:17:51Z

<p>Phillipps: </p> <hr /> <div>{{User Evo}}<br /> <br /> {{User evolutionScience}}<br /> <br /> {{User Political Compass|-3.00|-4.56}}<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> I am Canadian (and proud of it). I love classical music and sushi (and cheesecake for that matter). Nothing is better than a good book.<br /> I have been to:<br /> :The United States (Florida, Washington D.C., Boston)<br /> :Canada (born there)<br /> :England (lived there)<br /> :France<br /> :Belguim<br /> :Italy<br /> :The Cayman Islands (lived there)<br /> :Egypt<br /> :The Bahamas<br /> :The Dominican Republic<br /> <br /> I have always wanted to visit Germany (beautiful country) and Poland which has the last old growth forest (over several thousand years old, and funnily enough protected by Hermann Göring) left on the Eurasian plain.<br /> <br /> I am an Atheist (I suppose technically an Agnostic). The burden of proof is on the one who asserts that something exists (ie Russel's Teapot), and yes, it is possible (since we cannot prove a universal negative) that somewhere in the universe there might be a god.</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User:Phillipps&diff=416812 2008-03-29T23:17:38Z

<p>Phillipps: </p> <hr /> <div>{{User Evo}}<br /> <br /> {{User evolutionScience}}<br /> <br /> {{User Political Compass|-3.00|-4.56}}<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> I am Canadian (and proud of it). I love classical music and sushi (and cheesecake for that matter). Nothing is better than a good book.<br /> I have been to:<br /> :The United States (Florida, Washington D.C., Boston)<br /> :Canada (born there)<br /> :England (lived there)<br /> :France<br /> :Belguim<br /> :Italy<br /> :The Cayman Islands (lived there)<br /> :Egypt<br /> :The Bahamas<br /> :The Dominican Republic<br /> <br /> I have always wanted to visit Germany (beautiful country) and Poland which has the last old growth forest (over several thousand years old, and funnily enough protected by Hermann Göring) left on the Eurasian plain.<br /> <br /> I am an Atheist (I suppose technically an Agnostic). The burden of proof is on the one who asserts that something exists (ie Russel's Teapot), and yes, it is possible (since we cannot prove a universal negative) that somewhere in the universe there might be a god.--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 19:17, 29 March 2008 (EDT)</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User_talk:Phillipps&diff=416761 2008-03-29T22:28:00Z

<p>Phillipps: /* atheism article */</p> <hr /> <div>{{welcome|sig=&lt;font color=&quot;#1E90FF&quot; face=&quot;Comic Sans MS&quot;&gt;[[User:TK|şyŝoρ-₮K]]&lt;/font&gt;&lt;sup&gt;&lt;font color=&quot;DC143C&quot;&gt;[[User_Talk:TK|/Ṣρёаќǃ]]&lt;/font&gt;&lt;/sup&gt; 13:39, 17 November 2007 (EST)}}<br /> <br /> == atheism article ==<br /> <br /> Please do not recreate articles at atheism but rather use the talk pages. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 18:26, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> Sorry, I thought that it would be better to see it.--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 18:28, 29 March 2008 (EDT)</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User_talk:Phillipps/Atheism1&diff=416751 2008-03-29T22:10:28Z

<p>Phillipps: </p> <hr /> <div>What's with all the bracketed numbers? --[[User:Gulik5|Gulik5]] 13:24, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> Sorry, I chopped up the previous atheism article and forgot to re-format the citations. I have gone back and (hopefully) hit them all.--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 17:40, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> :Also, I know that the &quot;how an atheist acts on this&quot; header is awkward, but &quot;manifestations&quot; was a bit negative (makes Atheism sound like a disease)--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 17:44, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> ::I also fixed the &quot;Mensa&quot; link in the Brights movement section (created Mensa article, as the link was to an article that had no info on it).--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 18:10, 29 March 2008 (EDT)</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=Mensa&diff=416749 2008-03-29T22:08:36Z

<p>Phillipps: </p> <hr /> <div>A '''mensa''' is the flat top of a [[Christian]] [[altar]]. <br /> <br /> '''Mensa''' can also refer to the portion of [[church]] property set aside for the benefit of the [[clergy]] rather than the [[congregation]].<br /> <br /> For the high-intelligence society, see [[Mensa (organization)]]<br /> [[category:Christianity]]</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=Mensa_(organization)&diff=416745 2008-03-29T22:04:12Z

<p>Phillipps: New page: '''Mensa''' is a prominent high-intelligence organization. Its only entry requirement is an IQ in the top 2% of the population.&lt;ref&gt;http://www.mensa.org/index0.php?page=10&lt;/ref&gt;</p> <hr /> <div>'''Mensa''' is a prominent high-intelligence organization. Its only entry requirement is an IQ in the top 2% of the population.&lt;ref&gt;http://www.mensa.org/index0.php?page=10&lt;/ref&gt;</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User_talk:Phillipps/Atheism1&diff=416725 2008-03-29T21:44:23Z

<p>Phillipps: </p> <hr /> <div>What's with all the bracketed numbers? --[[User:Gulik5|Gulik5]] 13:24, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> Sorry, I chopped up the previous atheism article and forgot to re-format the citations. I have gone back and (hopefully) hit them all.--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 17:40, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> :Also, I know that the &quot;how an atheist acts on this&quot; header is awkward, but &quot;manifestations&quot; was a bit negative (makes Atheism sound like a disease)--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 17:44, 29 March 2008 (EDT)</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User_talk:Phillipps/Atheism1&diff=416723 2008-03-29T21:40:49Z

<p>Phillipps: </p> <hr /> <div>What's with all the bracketed numbers? --[[User:Gulik5|Gulik5]] 13:24, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> Sorry, I chopped up the previous atheism article and forgot to re-format the citations. I have gone back and (hopefully) hit them all.--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 17:40, 29 March 2008 (EDT)</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User:Phillipps&diff=416601 2008-03-29T15:58:05Z

<p>Phillipps: </p> <hr /> <div>{{User Evo}}<br /> <br /> {{User evolutionScience}}<br /> <br /> {{User Political Compass|-3.00|-4.56}}<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> I am Canadian (and proud of it). I love classical music and sushi (and cheesecake for that matter). Nothing is better than a good book.<br /> I have been to:<br /> :The United States (Florida, Washington D.C., Boston)<br /> :Canada (born there)<br /> :England (lived there)<br /> :France<br /> :Belguim<br /> :Italy<br /> :The Cayman Islands (lived there)<br /> :Egypt<br /> :The Bahamas<br /> :The Dominican Republic<br /> <br /> I have always wanted to visit Germany (beautiful country) and Poland which has the last old growth forest (over several thousand years old, and funnily enough protected by Hermann Göring) left on the Eurasian plain.</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User:Phillipps&diff=416598 2008-03-29T15:49:50Z

<p>Phillipps: </p> <hr /> <div>{{User Evo}}<br /> <br /> {{User evolutionScience}}<br /> <br /> {{User Political Compass|-3.00|-4.56}}<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> I am Canadian (and proud of it). I love classical music and sushi (and cheesecake for that matter).</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User:Phillipps&diff=416597 2008-03-29T15:49:33Z

<p>Phillipps: </p> <hr /> <div>{{User Evo}}<br /> <br /> {{User evolutionScience}}<br /> <br /> {{User Political Compass|-3.00|-4.56}}<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> I am Canadian (and proud of it). I love classical music and sushi.</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User:Phillipps&diff=416593 2008-03-29T15:40:10Z

<p>Phillipps: </p> <hr /> <div>{{User Evo}}<br /> <br /> {{User evolutionScience}}<br /> <br /> {{User Political Compass|-3.00|-4.56}}<br /> <br /> <br /> I am Canadian (and proud of it). I love classical music and sushi.</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=Talk:Unseen&diff=416581 2008-03-29T15:32:21Z

<p>Phillipps: </p> <hr /> <div>Some of these examples seem like they are actually observable: <br /> *the medical harm from gambling and pornography (if by &quot;medical&quot; it is meant either &quot;psychological&quot; or &quot;physical&quot;, these are both observable)<br /> *the invisible hand (this one's borderline -- the &quot;invisible hand&quot; itself can't be seen (because it doesn't exist), but its effects can be seen)<br /> *prayer and its effects (definitely prayer, but not necessarility its effects)<br /> *migration patterns of butterflies and birds (definitely observable -- perhaps it is meant the inherent nature of these migrations?)<br /> *deterrence of crime by self-defense (this can be seen both in person and as a whole)<br /> [[User:HelpJazz|Help]][[User talk:HelpJazz|Jazz]] 19:59, 24 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> <br /> I am deleting the line at the bottom of this article. It is a bit silly. They wouldn't be able to interact (and know about) the outside world. Being deaf this person couldn't learn to speak. As he is blind, he couldn't learn sign language. Because he has no sense of touch, he couldn't even learn sign language like Helen Keller, or learn through a bizarre smell or taste related system. Funnily enough, this person wouldn't know about God (no communication). He might be visited by God in his mind, but we couldn't know that (no communication, and brain scans wouldn't tell us is God is in his mind, only something is going on). Of course there is the unlikely chance that a sign from God (a clear one) would let us know that our disabled friend knew about the outside world.--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 11:17, 29 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> :Sorry, I forgot to add my other point. Are encyclopedias supposed to give hypothetical situations?--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 11:32, 29 March 2008 (EDT)</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=Unseen&diff=416575 2008-03-29T15:17:32Z

<p>Phillipps: </p> <hr /> <div>The '''unseen''' refers to what is not subject to direct observation by any of the five senses.&lt;ref&gt;''See, e.g.'', 2 Corinthians 4:18 (NIV) (&quot;So we fix our eyes not on what is seen, but on what is unseen. For what is seen is temporary, but what is unseen is eternal.&quot;)&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> <br /> [[Love]] is an example of something important that is unseen. [[Intelligence]] is another example. Additional examples include:<br /> <br /> * [[opportunity cost]]<br /> * ideas<br /> * the medical harm from [[gambling]] and [[pornography]]<br /> * [[Newtonian]] action-at-a-distance<br /> * the [[invisible hand]]<br /> * Atomic [[Radiation]]<br /> * [[prayer]] and its effects<br /> * [[migration]] patterns of butterflies and birds<br /> * the nature of [[homing]] powers of fowl<br /> * deterrence of crime by self-defense&lt;ref&gt;See [[gun control]].&lt;/ref&gt;<br /> * [[Evil]]<br /> <br /> [[Materialists]], by focusing on only what is material, generally deny the existence of the unseen.<br /> <br /> == References ==<br /> &lt;references/&gt;<br /> <br /> [[category:philosophy]]</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=Talk:Unseen&diff=416573 2008-03-29T15:17:10Z

<p>Phillipps: </p> <hr /> <div>Some of these examples seem like they are actually observable: <br /> *the medical harm from gambling and pornography (if by &quot;medical&quot; it is meant either &quot;psychological&quot; or &quot;physical&quot;, these are both observable)<br /> *the invisible hand (this one's borderline -- the &quot;invisible hand&quot; itself can't be seen (because it doesn't exist), but its effects can be seen)<br /> *prayer and its effects (definitely prayer, but not necessarility its effects)<br /> *migration patterns of butterflies and birds (definitely observable -- perhaps it is meant the inherent nature of these migrations?)<br /> *deterrence of crime by self-defense (this can be seen both in person and as a whole)<br /> [[User:HelpJazz|Help]][[User talk:HelpJazz|Jazz]] 19:59, 24 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> <br /> I am deleting the line at the bottom of this article. It is a bit silly. They wouldn't be able to interact (and know about) the outside world. Being deaf this person couldn't learn to speak. As he is blind, he couldn't learn sign language. Because he has no sense of touch, he couldn't even learn sign language like Helen Keller, or learn through a bizarre smell or taste related system. Funnily enough, this person wouldn't know about God (no communication). He might be visited by God in his mind, but we couldn't know that (no communication, and brain scans wouldn't tell us is God is in his mind, only something is going on). Of course there is the unlikely chance that a sign from God (a clear one) would let us know that our disabled friend knew about the outside world.--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 11:17, 29 March 2008 (EDT)</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=Talk:Radiometric_dating&diff=415127 2008-03-27T20:33:43Z

<p>Phillipps: /* Uranium-Lead Dating */</p> <hr /> <div>== On my rewrite ==<br /> <br /> Major diffs include<br /> * change of ref to printed text &quot;Wile, Dr. Jay L. ''Exploring Creation With General Science''. Anderson: Apologia Educational Ministries, Inc. 2000&quot; to http://pubs.usgs.gov/gip/geotime/radiometric.html<br /> * removal of section on accelerated decay - pure conjecture without citation. Reference was link to another wiki.<br /> * expanded assumptions<br /> * Added C14 creation rate at flood and creation (probably still needs a reasonable citation that is more than conjecture)<br /> * expanded outside influences, show where metamorphic rock is incorrect and RATE using this infomration to improperly date Grand Canyon. Included refutation of RATE data at answers in creation<br /> <br /> If there are any questions, I spent some time back in college writing software for a radiocarbon laboratory and have more than passing knowledge of the material that is written about. Feel free to ask any questions here. --[[User:Mtur|Mtur]] 00:55, 10 April 2007 (EDT)<br /> <br /> ==Philip's edits==<br /> <br /> Philip, I have to point this out to everyone. You are a rare person who has placed productive information in an article that you obviously disagree with and also removed information that would have supported you position on the topic, but you removed it anyway because you had identified it as a bigoted reference. I can not express the level of gratitude towards you for doing this. Thank you.--[[User:Tims|TimS]] 09:01, 30 April 2007 (EDT)<br /> <br /> :Err, thanks. Maybe. The bit I removed claimed that the (YEC) RATE project got it wrong. There were two references, one to an ICR article about the RATE project, and the other to an anti-YEC site claiming that the RATE project got it wrong. It was this second reference that I was referring to as bigoted, because it's first criticism was that creationist peer-review is by other creationists. As evolutionist peer-review is by other evolutionists, the only rationale here must be that creationary ''scientists'' are invalidated as peer-reviewers simply because they are creationists.<br /> :I've probably just destroyed your reason for thinking that I've done good, but like you presumed, I do want the truth, and the truth is not what I think you were thinking.<br /> :[[User:Philip J. Rayment|Philip J. Rayment]] 09:27, 30 April 2007 (EDT)<br /> <br /> == Principles ==<br /> <br /> The whole bit about the candles and what not seems a bit pedestrian. I say remove it entirely. Readers understand how to measure time, they don't need to be spoon fed a quasi-example such as this one --[[User:Pastafarian|Pastafarian]]<br /> :On the contrary, most people don't understand the basic principles of how radiometric dating works; this explains it with objects that are quite familiar. [[User:Philip J. Rayment|Philip J. Rayment]] 04:49, 30 June 2007 (EDT)<br /> <br /> == Removal of calibration section points ==<br /> <br /> I've just removed the bits about methods by which radiometric methods can be &quot;cross-verified&quot;. The first example, which seemed a bit convenient anyway, seems at the very least to be disputed and at worst to be simply wrong. See [http://johnhawks.net/weblog/reviews/archaeology/middle/petraglia_toba_india_continuity_2007.html here]. The second is not a method of calibration with independently-''known'' dates, but with other dates that have also not been calibrated. And this is mentioned further down in the article. [[User:Philip J. Rayment|Philip J. Rayment]] 03:41, 24 November 2007 (EST)<br /> <br /> == Reversion to earlier version ==<br /> <br /> I just reverted two paragraphs to an earlier version. Feebasfactor had edited the two paragraphs, and in so doing incorrectly claimed that the problem that YECs have with radiometric dating is the size of the margin of error. This is not the issue. He also changed &quot;Young-Earth creationists therefore claim ...&quot; to &quot;However, [[young earth creationist]]s claim...&quot;. This was fair enough, as the sentence did not logically flow from the previous sentence. However, this was because of a previous edit[http://www.conservapedia.com/index.php?title=Radiometric_dating&amp;diff=next&amp;oldid=213492] that changed the flow of the previous sentence, and which introduced a contrary thought which was unsupported by a valid reference. It had been there plenty long enough for a reference, but none was forthcoming, so I've reverted those paragraphs to prior to that edit, with the result that the &quot;Young-Earth creationists therefore claim ...&quot; is again valid, and the incorrect claim about the size of the margin of error is gone. [[User:Philip J. Rayment|Philip J. Rayment]] 04:59, 31 January 2008 (EST)<br /> <br /> :Sorry about that, I was trying to resolve the flow - the previous version seemed a little conflicted. Modification to the sentence was perhaps overly drastic, though. [[User:Feebasfactor|Feebasfactor]] 19:38, 31 January 2008 (EST)<br /> <br /> ==Uranium-Lead Dating==<br /> In your article, you do mention uranium-lead decay, and that lead in the sample originally would skew the resulting age. Zircon, which is often used in dating, has the the property that, when crystallizing, it will exclude all lead and will trap surrounding uranium. The lead that is found in zircon, then, can only have been the product of uranium decay.[http://www.astronomy.ohio-state.edu/~pogge/Ast161/Unit5/deeptime.html] [http://www.geology.wisc.edu/zircon/zircon_home.html] Also, one can calculate the amount of contamination. Any process that allows one isotope of will let in the others found on Earth. By measuring the amount of lead 204 (which is non-radiogenic and therefore could not have been produced by the decay of the uranium), we would know the amounts of the other isotopes (through the relative amounts on Earth, which are nearly uniform) that contaminated the sample.[http://mightylib.mit.edu/Course%20Materials/22.01/Fall%202001/radiometric%20dating.pdf] (page 8 by the way). From this, the age could be calculated. --[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 12:53, 8 March 2008 (EST)<br /> <br /> : This uses the same faulty circular reasoning the decay-based approaches. You're assuming something about aging to prove aging. It's like using a political poll today to predict the outcome of an election in a few months. For obvious reasons, that approach is often wrong.--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 13:43, 8 March 2008 (EST)<br /> <br /> I'm sorry, but the reasons aren't obvious. What am I assuming?--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 17:25, 10 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> ::For clarification, I know why political polls can't be used to predict election results, but you still haven't responded to my question.--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 11:28, 12 March 2008 (EDT)<br /> <br /> Shall you be responding?--[[User:Phillipps|Phillipps]] 16:33, 27 March 2008 (EDT)</div>

Phillipps https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User:Phillipps&diff=413178 2008-03-25T22:26:19Z

<p>Phillipps: New page: {{User Evo}} {{User evolutionScience}} {{User Political Compass|-3.00|-4.56}}</p> <hr /> <div>{{User Evo}}<br /> <br /> {{User evolutionScience}}<br /> <br /> {{User Political Compass|-3.00|-4.56}}</div>

Phillipps