Conservapedia - User contributions [en]

User talk:TonyPark

2012-01-14T02:02:10Z

SammyP: /* Um... */

{{welcome|sig=--[[User:JamesWilson|James Wilson]] 12:19, 7 January 2012 (EST)}}

==Block of Adambro==
Have you used the checkuser tool for that ?--[[User:PhilipN|PhilipN]] 16:22, 11 January 2012 (EST)

:No, I don't believe I have access to the CheckUser tool. It's under Special Pages, right? I wasn't able to find it. My decision to block Adambro came from analyzing his contributions. He has a large number of very minor edits and talk page posts, mostly pushing liberal POV. He also seemed to clean up the vandalism within a minute of each attack happening, as though he were trying to "build cred" with the site. Mostly, he was an argumentative liberal nitpicker who didn't feel the need to contribute anything to the site. [[User:TonyPark|TonyPark]] 16:34, 11 January 2012 (EST)

::By the way, I just check your contributions and I wonder how fast you got your block rights: 1st article on the 6th, then mostly contributions in [[Debate: 15 questions for evolutionists.]] that shows how much you love your [[pseudo-science]] of [[Evolution]], then you got your block rights on the 9th ! I unblocked Adambro‎, feel free to discuss the matter with me. Reverting vandalism in less than 2 minutes does not prove anything. --[[User:PhilipN|PhilipN]] 16:35, 11 January 2012 (EST)

:::I'm not interested in a blocking war with you. I blocked Adambro out of a genuine concern that he is a deep-cover parodist. My belief in evolution is irrelevant. I think it is very curious that he was able to revert long stretches of vandalism by two vandals with very similar names almost immediately after they happened. If you could do me a favor, run CheckUser on Adambro, BL4NK3R, and BU99ERY and make sure that they don't have similar IPs. Thanks. [[User:TonyPark|TonyPark]] 16:53, 11 January 2012 (EST)

::::I'm not interested neither in a blocking war. I just feel we shouldn't block users without valid accusations. You made a good case and Adambro should be warned and monitored but I don't feel he deserved an infinite block (except if he really is a sockpuppet). Twice he reverted vandalism really quick but this does not prove anything, I have done that before. I do not have the rights to use the checkuser, you may want to check this [http://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=Special%3AListUsers&username=&group=checkuser&limit=50 list]. --[[User:PhilipN|PhilipN]] 17:02, 11 January 2012 (EST)

:::::Thank you for the help and information. I will be more cautious from now on. [[User:TonyPark|TonyPark]] 17:18, 11 January 2012 (EST)

::::::You are welcome but be careful, I haven't seen a lot of people win an edit war against a senior admin, however legitimate it may be.--[[User:PhilipN|PhilipN]] 17:42, 11 January 2012 (EST)

== Um... ==

How can you block people who don't have a first name and last initial username when you yourself don't follow the policy? You're banning innocent users that want to join. [[User:DynaboyJ|DynaboyJ]] 17:54, 13 January 2012 (EST)

My real name is Anthony Parker, so TonyPark is a perfectly acceptable name under the policy, the point of which is to keep frivolous, anti-intellectual usernames out. Besides, its not like I permanently banned them, they can just go and make a new account with an acceptable user name. [[User:TonyPark|TonyPark]] 19:55, 13 January 2012 (EST)

:Actually, he can, and will, unblock himself. [[User:Ayzmo|Ayzmo :)]] 20:26, 13 January 2012 (EST)

::Then he'll come after you. [[User:SammyP|SammyP]] 20:27, 13 January 2012 (EST)

::Yeah, but he knows he has lost the respect of this site, blocking me is irrelevant.[[User:TonyPark|TonyPark]] 20:33, 13 January 2012 (EST)

:::From what I see, he has no right to take any action against you. If he were to take action, it would do little more than further reveal his questionable tactics on this site. However, I can't help but feel that blocking him was an act of provocation. If he decides to block you, it would be your own doing, even if it isn't deserved. --[[User:RedGoliath|RedGoliath]] 01:36, 14 January 2012 (GMT)

:::Conservative's grasp on reality is erratic. He divides the world into two categories; good moral Christians who naturally support his crusading efforts, and liberal atheists who hate him because they are perverse, he relishes their disapproval and their attention. [http://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=Special:Log&type=block&page=User%3AConservative Check his block log], your message isn't going to sink in, after all your obviously a liberal atheist and probably gay. He will find a way to accommodate the facts to his worldview. Conservative should be sympathized with not disliked, remember that he truly believes everything he says. His articles are an expression of what is going on in his mind. Can you imagine living in that world? [[User:SammyP|SammyP]] 20:45, 13 January 2012 (EST)

:::Conservative is not my concern. I want the site to see how ridiculous he is. He has a vested interest in keeping his fingers lodged firmly in his ears.[[User:TonyPark|TonyPark]] 20:52, 13 January 2012 (EST)

:::Oh, everyone already sees that. But Conservative writes materiel that generates a lot of page views, and he contributes massively to the site, he contribute something like a quarter of the edits. And as long as Conservative keeps pumping out content Andy will give him free a hand; despite whatever impact editing might be having on Conservatives mental health and whatever impact his behavior has on the overall community. Notice how often Andy keeps crowing over vague increases in site traffic. He doesn't seem to care whether people are coming here to laugh at us. It's the ratings that matter and Conservative is great for ratings. [[User:SammyP|SammyP]] 21:02, 13 January 2012 (EST)

== Awesome ==

That was a very good block. Thanks! [[User:ThankYouTonyPark|ThankYouTonyPark]] 20:28, 13 January 2012 (EST)

User talk:TonyPark

2012-01-14T01:47:18Z

SammyP: /* Um... */

{{welcome|sig=--[[User:JamesWilson|James Wilson]] 12:19, 7 January 2012 (EST)}}

==Block of Adambro==
Have you used the checkuser tool for that ?--[[User:PhilipN|PhilipN]] 16:22, 11 January 2012 (EST)

:No, I don't believe I have access to the CheckUser tool. It's under Special Pages, right? I wasn't able to find it. My decision to block Adambro came from analyzing his contributions. He has a large number of very minor edits and talk page posts, mostly pushing liberal POV. He also seemed to clean up the vandalism within a minute of each attack happening, as though he were trying to "build cred" with the site. Mostly, he was an argumentative liberal nitpicker who didn't feel the need to contribute anything to the site. [[User:TonyPark|TonyPark]] 16:34, 11 January 2012 (EST)

::By the way, I just check your contributions and I wonder how fast you got your block rights: 1st article on the 6th, then mostly contributions in [[Debate: 15 questions for evolutionists.]] that shows how much you love your [[pseudo-science]] of [[Evolution]], then you got your block rights on the 9th ! I unblocked Adambro‎, feel free to discuss the matter with me. Reverting vandalism in less than 2 minutes does not prove anything. --[[User:PhilipN|PhilipN]] 16:35, 11 January 2012 (EST)

:::I'm not interested in a blocking war with you. I blocked Adambro out of a genuine concern that he is a deep-cover parodist. My belief in evolution is irrelevant. I think it is very curious that he was able to revert long stretches of vandalism by two vandals with very similar names almost immediately after they happened. If you could do me a favor, run CheckUser on Adambro, BL4NK3R, and BU99ERY and make sure that they don't have similar IPs. Thanks. [[User:TonyPark|TonyPark]] 16:53, 11 January 2012 (EST)

::::I'm not interested neither in a blocking war. I just feel we shouldn't block users without valid accusations. You made a good case and Adambro should be warned and monitored but I don't feel he deserved an infinite block (except if he really is a sockpuppet). Twice he reverted vandalism really quick but this does not prove anything, I have done that before. I do not have the rights to use the checkuser, you may want to check this [http://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=Special%3AListUsers&username=&group=checkuser&limit=50 list]. --[[User:PhilipN|PhilipN]] 17:02, 11 January 2012 (EST)

:::::Thank you for the help and information. I will be more cautious from now on. [[User:TonyPark|TonyPark]] 17:18, 11 January 2012 (EST)

::::::You are welcome but be careful, I haven't seen a lot of people win an edit war against a senior admin, however legitimate it may be.--[[User:PhilipN|PhilipN]] 17:42, 11 January 2012 (EST)

== Um... ==

How can you block people who don't have a first name and last initial username when you yourself don't follow the policy? You're banning innocent users that want to join. [[User:DynaboyJ|DynaboyJ]] 17:54, 13 January 2012 (EST)

My real name is Anthony Parker, so TonyPark is a perfectly acceptable name under the policy, the point of which is to keep frivolous, anti-intellectual usernames out. Besides, its not like I permanently banned them, they can just go and make a new account with an acceptable user name. [[User:TonyPark|TonyPark]] 19:55, 13 January 2012 (EST)

:Actually, he can, and will, unblock himself. [[User:Ayzmo|Ayzmo :)]] 20:26, 13 January 2012 (EST)

::Then he'll come after you. [[User:SammyP|SammyP]] 20:27, 13 January 2012 (EST)

::Yeah, but he knows he has lost the respect of this site, blocking me is irrelevant.[[User:TonyPark|TonyPark]] 20:33, 13 January 2012 (EST)

:::From what I see, he has no right to take any action against you. If he were to take action, it would do little more than further reveal his questionable tactics on this site. However, I can't help but feel that blocking him was an act of provocation. If he decides to block you, it would be your own doing, even if it isn't deserved. --[[User:RedGoliath|RedGoliath]] 01:36, 14 January 2012 (GMT)

:::Conservative's grasp on reality is erratic. He divides the world into two categories; good moral Christians who naturally support his crusading efforts, and liberal atheists who hate him because they are perverse, he relishes their disapproval and their attention. [http://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=Special:Log&type=block&page=User%3AConservative Check his block log], your message isn't going to sink in, after all your obviously a liberal atheist and probably gay. He will find a way to accommodate the facts to his worldview. Conservative should be sympathized with not disliked, remember that he truly believes everything he says. His articles are an expression of what is going on in his mind. Can you imagine living in that world? [[User:SammyP|SammyP]] 20:45, 13 January 2012 (EST)

== Awesome ==

That was a very good block. Thanks! [[User:ThankYouTonyPark|ThankYouTonyPark]] 20:28, 13 January 2012 (EST)

User talk:TonyPark

2012-01-14T01:45:56Z

SammyP: /* Um... */

{{welcome|sig=--[[User:JamesWilson|James Wilson]] 12:19, 7 January 2012 (EST)}}

==Block of Adambro==
Have you used the checkuser tool for that ?--[[User:PhilipN|PhilipN]] 16:22, 11 January 2012 (EST)

:No, I don't believe I have access to the CheckUser tool. It's under Special Pages, right? I wasn't able to find it. My decision to block Adambro came from analyzing his contributions. He has a large number of very minor edits and talk page posts, mostly pushing liberal POV. He also seemed to clean up the vandalism within a minute of each attack happening, as though he were trying to "build cred" with the site. Mostly, he was an argumentative liberal nitpicker who didn't feel the need to contribute anything to the site. [[User:TonyPark|TonyPark]] 16:34, 11 January 2012 (EST)

::By the way, I just check your contributions and I wonder how fast you got your block rights: 1st article on the 6th, then mostly contributions in [[Debate: 15 questions for evolutionists.]] that shows how much you love your [[pseudo-science]] of [[Evolution]], then you got your block rights on the 9th ! I unblocked Adambro‎, feel free to discuss the matter with me. Reverting vandalism in less than 2 minutes does not prove anything. --[[User:PhilipN|PhilipN]] 16:35, 11 January 2012 (EST)

:::I'm not interested in a blocking war with you. I blocked Adambro out of a genuine concern that he is a deep-cover parodist. My belief in evolution is irrelevant. I think it is very curious that he was able to revert long stretches of vandalism by two vandals with very similar names almost immediately after they happened. If you could do me a favor, run CheckUser on Adambro, BL4NK3R, and BU99ERY and make sure that they don't have similar IPs. Thanks. [[User:TonyPark|TonyPark]] 16:53, 11 January 2012 (EST)

::::I'm not interested neither in a blocking war. I just feel we shouldn't block users without valid accusations. You made a good case and Adambro should be warned and monitored but I don't feel he deserved an infinite block (except if he really is a sockpuppet). Twice he reverted vandalism really quick but this does not prove anything, I have done that before. I do not have the rights to use the checkuser, you may want to check this [http://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=Special%3AListUsers&username=&group=checkuser&limit=50 list]. --[[User:PhilipN|PhilipN]] 17:02, 11 January 2012 (EST)

:::::Thank you for the help and information. I will be more cautious from now on. [[User:TonyPark|TonyPark]] 17:18, 11 January 2012 (EST)

::::::You are welcome but be careful, I haven't seen a lot of people win an edit war against a senior admin, however legitimate it may be.--[[User:PhilipN|PhilipN]] 17:42, 11 January 2012 (EST)

== Um... ==

How can you block people who don't have a first name and last initial username when you yourself don't follow the policy? You're banning innocent users that want to join. [[User:DynaboyJ|DynaboyJ]] 17:54, 13 January 2012 (EST)

My real name is Anthony Parker, so TonyPark is a perfectly acceptable name under the policy, the point of which is to keep frivolous, anti-intellectual usernames out. Besides, its not like I permanently banned them, they can just go and make a new account with an acceptable user name. [[User:TonyPark|TonyPark]] 19:55, 13 January 2012 (EST)

:Actually, he can, and will, unblock himself. [[User:Ayzmo|Ayzmo :)]] 20:26, 13 January 2012 (EST)

::Then he'll come after you. [[User:SammyP|SammyP]] 20:27, 13 January 2012 (EST)

::Yeah, but he knows he has lost the respect of this site, blocking me is irrelevant.[[User:TonyPark|TonyPark]] 20:33, 13 January 2012 (EST)

:::From what I see, he has no right to take any action against you. If he were to take action, it would do little more than further reveal his questionable tactics on this site. However, I can't help but feel that blocking him was an act of provocation. If he decides to block you, it would be your own doing, even if it isn't deserved. --[[User:RedGoliath|RedGoliath]] 01:36, 14 January 2012 (GMT)

:::Conservative's grasp on reality is erratic. He divides the world into two categories; good moral Christians who naturally support his crusading efforts, and liberal atheists who hate him because they are perverse, he relishes their disapproval and their attention. [http://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=Special:Log&type=block&page=User%3AConservative Check his block log], your message isn't going to sink in. He will find a way to accommodate the facts to his worldview. Conservative should be sympathized with not disliked, remember that he truly believes everything he says. His articles are an expression of what is going on in his mind. Can you imagine living in that world? [[User:SammyP|SammyP]] 20:45, 13 January 2012 (EST)

== Awesome ==

That was a very good block. Thanks! [[User:ThankYouTonyPark|ThankYouTonyPark]] 20:28, 13 January 2012 (EST)

User talk:TonyPark

2012-01-14T01:45:20Z

SammyP: /* Um... */

{{welcome|sig=--[[User:JamesWilson|James Wilson]] 12:19, 7 January 2012 (EST)}}

==Block of Adambro==
Have you used the checkuser tool for that ?--[[User:PhilipN|PhilipN]] 16:22, 11 January 2012 (EST)

:No, I don't believe I have access to the CheckUser tool. It's under Special Pages, right? I wasn't able to find it. My decision to block Adambro came from analyzing his contributions. He has a large number of very minor edits and talk page posts, mostly pushing liberal POV. He also seemed to clean up the vandalism within a minute of each attack happening, as though he were trying to "build cred" with the site. Mostly, he was an argumentative liberal nitpicker who didn't feel the need to contribute anything to the site. [[User:TonyPark|TonyPark]] 16:34, 11 January 2012 (EST)

::By the way, I just check your contributions and I wonder how fast you got your block rights: 1st article on the 6th, then mostly contributions in [[Debate: 15 questions for evolutionists.]] that shows how much you love your [[pseudo-science]] of [[Evolution]], then you got your block rights on the 9th ! I unblocked Adambro‎, feel free to discuss the matter with me. Reverting vandalism in less than 2 minutes does not prove anything. --[[User:PhilipN|PhilipN]] 16:35, 11 January 2012 (EST)

:::I'm not interested in a blocking war with you. I blocked Adambro out of a genuine concern that he is a deep-cover parodist. My belief in evolution is irrelevant. I think it is very curious that he was able to revert long stretches of vandalism by two vandals with very similar names almost immediately after they happened. If you could do me a favor, run CheckUser on Adambro, BL4NK3R, and BU99ERY and make sure that they don't have similar IPs. Thanks. [[User:TonyPark|TonyPark]] 16:53, 11 January 2012 (EST)

::::I'm not interested neither in a blocking war. I just feel we shouldn't block users without valid accusations. You made a good case and Adambro should be warned and monitored but I don't feel he deserved an infinite block (except if he really is a sockpuppet). Twice he reverted vandalism really quick but this does not prove anything, I have done that before. I do not have the rights to use the checkuser, you may want to check this [http://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=Special%3AListUsers&username=&group=checkuser&limit=50 list]. --[[User:PhilipN|PhilipN]] 17:02, 11 January 2012 (EST)

:::::Thank you for the help and information. I will be more cautious from now on. [[User:TonyPark|TonyPark]] 17:18, 11 January 2012 (EST)

::::::You are welcome but be careful, I haven't seen a lot of people win an edit war against a senior admin, however legitimate it may be.--[[User:PhilipN|PhilipN]] 17:42, 11 January 2012 (EST)

== Um... ==

How can you block people who don't have a first name and last initial username when you yourself don't follow the policy? You're banning innocent users that want to join. [[User:DynaboyJ|DynaboyJ]] 17:54, 13 January 2012 (EST)

My real name is Anthony Parker, so TonyPark is a perfectly acceptable name under the policy, the point of which is to keep frivolous, anti-intellectual usernames out. Besides, its not like I permanently banned them, they can just go and make a new account with an acceptable user name. [[User:TonyPark|TonyPark]] 19:55, 13 January 2012 (EST)

:Actually, he can, and will, unblock himself. [[User:Ayzmo|Ayzmo :)]] 20:26, 13 January 2012 (EST)

::Then he'll come after you. [[User:SammyP|SammyP]] 20:27, 13 January 2012 (EST)

::Yeah, but he knows he has lost the respect of this site, blocking me is irrelevant.[[User:TonyPark|TonyPark]] 20:33, 13 January 2012 (EST)

:::From what I see, he has no right to take any action against you. If he were to take action, it would do little more than further reveal his questionable tactics on this site. However, I can't help but feel that blocking him was an act of provocation. If he decides to block you, it would be your own doing, even if it isn't deserved. --[[User:RedGoliath|RedGoliath]] 01:36, 14 January 2012 (GMT)

:::Conservative's grasp on reality is erratic. He divides the world into two categories; good moral Christians who naturally support his crusading efforts, and liberal atheists who hate him because they are perverse, he relishes their disapproval and their attention. [http://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=Special:Log&type=block&page=User%3AConservative Check his block log], your message isn't going to sink in. He will find a way to accommodate the facts to his worldview. Conservative should be sympathized with not disliked, remember that he truly believes everything he says. His articles are an expression of what is going on in his mind. Can you imagine living in that world? [[User:SammyP|SammyP]] 20:45, 13 January 2012 (EST)

== Awesome ==

That was a very good block. Thanks! [[User:ThankYouTonyPark|ThankYouTonyPark]] 20:28, 13 January 2012 (EST)

User talk:TonyPark

2012-01-14T01:28:07Z

SammyP: /* Um... */

User talk:TonyPark

2012-01-14T01:27:55Z

SammyP: /* Um... */

Talk:Essay:Greatest Conservative Songs

2012-01-05T06:25:24Z

SammyP: /* This page is full of parodies ! */

See [http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=NzZkNDU5MmViNzVjNzkzMDE3NzNlN2MyZjRjYTk4YjE= this]. [[User:Stryker|Stryker]] 10:04, 17 July 2007 (EDT)

: The [[neoconservative]] ''National Review'' list is 95% garbage, not [[conservative]] at all. I only found one tune on the list that should be added ours ("Stand by your man"), and National Review had it at #50.

: The contrast here with ''National Review'' illustrates the need for ''Conservapedia''. But thanks for your link.--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 11:31, 17 July 2007 (EDT)

Oops... it seems that I added a bunch of songs from that list. Several of mine (Brick, Red Barchetta, I Can't Drive 55, Sweet Home Alabama, and Revolution 1) were on there. That's interesting, though... the NR person and I thought alike on this one. [[User:DanH|DanH]] 17:16, 17 July 2007 (EDT)

Sweet Home Alabama? I love that song (and I'm a liberal)! Revolution's great, too.--[[User:Autofire|Autofire]] 18:29, 17 July 2007 (EDT)

Sorry? Why was my entry for The Fall's Pseud Mag Ed removed? They have always been the great deflators of liberal complacency. What is going on?

: Post a link to the lyrics of the song here and we'll see. Also, please sign your entries by using the signature button in the row above the edit box. Thanks.--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 11:16, 18 July 2007 (EDT)

Can a song possibly be just a song, rather than a political statement? - BornAgainBrit

: Uh, sure, there are songs that lack any meaning at all. "I wanna hold your hand," for example, is a pleasant jingle from your homeland. I trust we'd agree that it is not the most meaningful song in the world. That tune is fun for reminiscing.

: But surely you don't deny that many songs do have political meaning. [[Liberal]] attempts to deny political bias are familiar to us and no one here is fooled. Godspeed.--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 13:37, 18 July 2007 (EDT)

The deletion of Bob Dylan's song was not properly explained. Observing that people serve either the devil or the Lord is a conservative observation, and of course Bob Dylan was a born-again Christian who expressed his faith in song (but don't expect [[liberals]] to tell you that).--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 00:03, 21 July 2007 (EDT)

:I didn't mean to step on any toes, but apathy towards devil worship doesn't seem to me like a very conservative trait. Unfortunately, the verses of the songs don't give us ''any'' meaning whatsoever, so the only meaning we can glean from the song are the four lines of the chorus, three of which are essentially the same :/ [[User:Jazzman831|Jazzman831]] 14:06, 21 July 2007 (EDT)

::Paradise by the Dashboard light? I know its a song about having pre-marital sex, but the end is about how it screwed up his life.--[[User:Elamdri|Elamdri]] 04:45, 23 July 2007 (EDT)

After reading this list, I've gotta ask, just how do you define a 'conservative' song?--[[User:Offeep|Offeep]] 15:27, 26 July 2007 (EDT)

: [[Conservative]] is a term that is well-understood. A "conservative song" reflects some of those values without diluting them with a [[liberal]] message.--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 15:42, 26 July 2007 (EDT)

I can't believe Okie from Muskogie isn't on here. [[User:Maestro|Maestro]] 23:23, 27 July 2007 (EDT)

I know this is being nitpicky, but I don't like the message of Last Kiss because it seems to suggest a works salvation, that one gets to heaven by doing good rather than accepting Jesus. [[User:DanH|DanH]] 23:30, 27 July 2007 (EDT)

:... and on that note, let's open up a can of [[Mountain Dew]] and get ready to [[Debate:Are we saved by faith or works?]] --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 17:16, 3 August 2007 (EDT)

==Last Kiss==
Somebody just put up "Last Kiss;" actually I recall when it was a hit circa 1964 many adults, parents, teachers and ministers where horrified that a song about death was considered appropriate for young people. My my, how things had changed by 1967.... [[User:RobS|RobS]] 18:08, 28 July 2007 (EDT)

Just like 'Teen Angel,' 'Leader of the Pack,' 'Dead Man's Curve,' and 'Tell Laura I Love Her.' [[User:Maestro|Maestro]] 00:35, 29 July 2007 (EDT)

==Possible Addition==

Ok, I have a suggestion, but I want some feedback before putting it on the page. I was listening to the radio today, and Another Brick in the Wall by Pink Floyd came on. I was thinking that the song talks about the way that public schools brainwash children and turn them into "bricks" in the wall that is liberal society. In a way, the song is pro-homeschooling, because it's teachers that need to leave the kids alone so that parents can instruct their children correctly. Maybe I'm reaching a bit here, but I wanted to see what you all thought. [[User:SSchultz|SSchultz]] 00:23, 2 August 2007 (EDT)

: I'm open to comments and suggestions about this, but I've never viewed the famous song "another brick in the wall" as conservative. You may be right that the song properly complains about the effect of schooling, but the song doesn't offer any conservative solution that I can see.--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 01:10, 2 August 2007 (EDT)

::"Another Brick In The Wall" is more of a neutral song. Its part of a concept album in which the main character slowly seperates himself from society. Most Pink Floyd songs are about madness, due to their original lead singer going insane. [[User:TobyKeet|TobyKeet]] 05:32, 24 November 2010 (EST)

==Love Me, I'm a Liberal==

:I'm glad the commies were thrown out
:Of the A.F.L. C.I.O. board

Hardly sounds like a Communist critique. Have you read all the lyrics of the song? [http://web.cecs.pdx.edu/~trent/ochs/lyrics/liberal.html] It's twitting liberals for their supposed concern for others, which is actually sorely lacking. --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 17:14, 3 August 2007 (EDT)

:That song is pure sarcasm and Ochs assumes the role of a 1960s-era (Cold War era) "liberal" to attack them from the extreme left in a sarcastic way. Read the lyrics again, he is attacking the AFL-CIO for throwing out the commies. He is saying liberals aren't far left ''enough''. It's not a conservative song, it's an extreme leftist one. [[User:Parrothead|Parrothead]] 17:22, 3 August 2007 (EDT)

So there's a song on this list about breaking the law 'I can't Drive 55,' and one about obeying the law 'I fought the law.' Which is the conservative value? And the Bobby Fuller Four's version of the latter was the superior version, BTW. [[User:Maestro|Maestro]] 10:40, 10 September 2007 (EDT)
I hope I did not misunderstand. Do these songs have to be OK'd before posting?

There are several on this list that really do not belong on a Conservative music list. Really, REO Keep on loving you?
I got the message and now know I should not add foot notes regarding my thoughts on songs I don't believe belong.
I have been sharing Conservapedia with many of my Conservative FB friends. Many on't know about it.
Several have said the list was not really Conservative.
I know some popular, Conservative musicians and they write nothing but Conservative music.
I hope it was OK that I added some educational songs to the list.
I love Conservapedia! Wikipedia is so liberal. When you read about Van Jones there, he's a great guy!
Thank God for Conservapedia.

== Are these truly conservative? ==

While I understand completely some of these songs being on here, I don't really understand the why Bob Dylan, The Beatles, or Ben Folds (Five) would be on this list. These individual songs may be able to be warped into our mindset, but if one truly looks at these, they become overwhelmingly liberal.

For example: The Beatles - Revolution
While this song does indeed talk about how "Carrying pictures of Chairman Mao" will do no good, it also talks about how war and money can't solve problems. In addition, if a child is to read tis and decide to find out more about The Beatles, they will undoubtedly find some intensely liberal themes. The same idea goes for Bob Dylan. Look at any of his other songs. At the same time, Ben Folds does exactly the same thing.

I cannot argue with the songs and parts on this list, but I wonder if this is a slippery slope?
::It's possible that many of these songs were adopted by conservatives, such as Mike Huckabee playing John Cougar Mellencamp's hits. [[User:Karajou|Karajou]] 14:48, 18 February 2008 (EST)

: Many of the songs here have a powerful [[conservative]] message, and demonstrate that the music industry does not have to be [[liberal]].--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 15:00, 18 February 2008 (EST)

: P.S. [[Liberals]] do say [[conservative]] things from time to time. We're listing songs here, not artists.--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 15:01, 18 February 2008 (EST)

I would just like add that Revolution 1 was written as a reaction against the protesters against the Vietnam War who were getting violent. All Revolution is saying is for the protesters to protest, but not violently, which is still liberal, but a message than other liberal songs. However, for other Beatles songs, they range from being liberal (Why Don't We Do It in the Road?) to be being kind of conservative (Let It Be). Most however, are pretty much neutral. You usually kind Paul McCartney as being more concervative, and Lennon as liberal. [[User:TobyKeet|TobyKeet]] 05:28, 24 November 2010 (EST)

:One problem with the above analysis: Why Don't We Do It In the Road was McCartney's; Lennon was rather famously not involved at all. Personally I've always thought of it as a kind of parody of the free love movement, though apparently that wasn't McCartney's intention. [[User:Ptorquemada|Ptorquemada]] 17:25, 4 April 2011 (EDT)

== In Your Eyes ==

Okay, the song can be considered to be about God, but that alone does not make it conservative. I think Peter Gabriel himself would object to the song's inclusion in this list. --[[User:MakeTomorrow|MakeTomorrow]] 15:23, 18 February 2008 (EST)

: Peter Gabriel can object all he likes. "In Your Eyes" appeals to conservative values, as in "a thousand churches." Do you think we should object when a liberal says something conservative???--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 15:27, 18 February 2008 (EST)
::Religion is not conservative. Fundamentalism is, but not religion. The presence of religion in a song does not make it conservative, even as adherence to religion does not make a person conservative. Look at me, I'm a Christian, but I'm also a communist. Obviously the two are not mutually exclusive. One's personal merely interpersonally-social morals under religion might be more "conservative", in the loosest sense of the term — not conservative, simply somewhat more so — than they would be otherwise; however, that does not automatically make one politically conservative.--[[User:MakeTomorrow|MakeTomorrow]] 15:50, 18 February 2008 (EST)

::: The single best predictor of how conservative someone votes is how often he attends a place of worship of God. Your argument suggesting that you are a counterexample to that correlation means nothing. See point #2 in [[liberal logic]].--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 16:04, 18 February 2008 (EST)

::::That wasn't irrelevant at all. Correlation != causation. --[[User:MakeTomorrow|MakeTomorrow]] 16:08, 18 February 2008 (EST)
::::Sorry, my edit summary should have been "basic statistical interpretation". --[[User:MakeTomorrow|MakeTomorrow]] 16:09, 18 February 2008 (EST)

::::: Why did you cite your counterexample, if it wasn't an example of the logical fallacy #2 in [[liberal logic]]? Do you really think a counterexample disproves causation?

==Land of Confusion==
Does Genesis' ''Land of Confusion'' belong on the list? I remember the music video portraying Ronald Reagan (in puppet form) as inept, and it parodies several conservative leaders, including Margaret Thatcher, et. al. [[User:WesleyS|WesleyS]][[User Talk:WesleyS|Hello!]] 13:58, 5 March 2009 (EST)

: It's liberal lyric of "too many people" is enough reason to bounce it from the list. Thanks for catching this.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 18:53, 5 March 2009 (EST)

==Should Fortunate Son really be on this list?==

It's vehemently anti-war. Please correct if I'm wrong, but I don't think that's a very conservative belief. [[User:JRobbe|JRobbe]]

:I just looked the lyrics. Pretty confused stuff. I'd agree it's not conservative. Would you like to toss it from the list? Please feel free to do so.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 20:26, 7 January 2010 (EST)

:Done. [[User:JRobbe|JRobbe]]

== Long Black Train by Josh Turner? ==

To me, this song seems like a good candidate for this list. --[[User:Dfrischknecht|Dfrischknecht]] 07:14, 22 July 2010 (EDT)

== The Decision by Ricky Van Shelton ==

I think this is another good candidate for this list. It's a song about a teenage girl who gives in to peer pressure and gets pregnant and the consequences of that action. --[[User:Dfrischknecht|Dfrischknecht]] 09:02, 22 July 2010 (EDT)

== New Agey ==

I removed the new agey phrase of "the cycle of life, death and rebirth," for the "Lightning Crashes," by Live, but feel free to discuss here.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 15:23, 22 September 2010 (EDT)

: That wasn't meant to seem "new agey" in the least, but I do understand what you're saying. The song presents a view of life as being cyclical, as the baby is being born an old woman dies, and "The confusion that was hers belongs now to the baby down the hall." I think the lyrics really speak to the significance of life (not just at childbirth), but as a whole. I don't think the song is necessarily about the old woman being reincarnated as the newborn child, but it definitely seems to speak of the circle of life.[[User:JaneX|JaneX]] 15:56, 22 September 2010 (EDT)

:: Perhaps a rewording would work then? How about replacing "the cycle of life, death and rebirth" with "the joy of childbirth in contrast with the end of life"?--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 18:59, 22 September 2010 (EDT)

::: I agree that a rewording would work, thank you for working with me. Perhaps we could just say that the song celebrates the significance of life from birth until death, almost in an as one door closes another opens kind of way? [[User:JaneX|JaneX]] 20:00, 22 September 2010 (EDT)

== Song idea ==

"One Man, One Woman" sung by ABBA. Indirectly a tribute to traditional marriage and monogamy.--[[User:TedM|TedM]] 12:14, 12 January 2011 (EST)

: Sounds good by the title, so how about adding it where you think it would be appropriate in the list? Thanks for your insight.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 12:17, 12 January 2011 (EST)

== Takin' Care of Business ==

This song by BTO is on the list for supporting "Hard work ethic", but its not. The refrain is jokingly ironic. "I love to work at nothing all day; and I've been taking care of business"

The body of the song describes a more easy going life just making music rather than waking up early, catching trains for work, etc.

I'm not saying it makes the song liberal, and not sure why its even necessary to classify songs along political lines, but it sure as heck ain't about working hard.
I'd suggest if someone wants to keep it here because its a good song, and if people can only enjoy it because it conforms to their political views, than change the reason to "Mike Huckabee performed the song" [comment by AndrewJackson]

:You left out how the song praises the self-employed, which is a very conservative, hard-working group of people.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:55, 21 March 2011 (EDT)

::Fair enough, but the praise you speak of is "If you ever get annoyed [with, based on earlier lyrics, either your traditional job or the unpleasant commute involved], look at me, I'm self-employed; I love to work at nothing all day." That could be taken as either "I made so much money as an entepreneur that I no longer need to work" or "My official job title is 'Bum'." Neither one of them really expresses admiration for "hard work" in its own right, though the former is certainly a more positive role model than the latter. I do ''like'' the song, but I'm not entirely sanguine about considering it "conservative." [[User:Ptorquemada|Ptorquemada]] 17:36, 4 April 2011 (EDT)

== Adonai My Lord ==

I'm going to delete this song from the list, as it is from the atheistic industrial metal genre. The lyrics reflect a sort of militant Christianity that does not reflect well on the religion as a whole. For example, this group has a song called "Christf---"...obviously they are not conservative. [[User:DennyW66|DennyW66]] 01:14, 23 March 2011 (EDT)

==No U2?==

Surely -- despite the band's liberal leanings -- one of U2's unashamedly Christian songs should make it in. Gloria seems the obvious choice. The chorus, you may remember, goes: "Gloria, in te domine/ Gloria, exultate/ Gloria, Gloria/ Oh Lord, loosen my lips." --[[User:Jdixon|Jdixon]] 12:34, 28 March 2011 (EDT)
:Agreed. Gloria is definitely a good choice. Perhaps "40"; its lyrics are directly lifted from Psalm 40. [[User:DennyW66|DennyW66]] 12:43, 28 March 2011 (EDT)
::You're kidding right? [http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/world-news/us-election/u2-honoured-to-be-involved-with-obama-celebrations-14145757.html Conservative indeed..] [[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 22:06, 28 March 2011 (EDT)
:::Bono has had a relationship with every President since Clinton; for instance, he worked with Bush on issues relating to Africa and AIDS awareness. The band is very Christian and in no way ashamed of their Christianity. And, rare for rock stars, three of the four members of the band are married family men. They are known for their charitableness and philanthropy, which are of course [[conservative]] traits. Without a doubt, U2 is a conservative, Christian band and they should have representation on this list. [[User:DennyW66|DennyW66]] 22:21, 28 March 2011 (EDT)

::::''Gloria'''s a good choice, please add it if you agree. But U2 became increasingly liberal the more media attention it obtained.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 10:07, 29 March 2011 (EDT)

:::::Maybe it's possible to be Christian and pro-family, and yet left-leaning politically. Anyway, I vote for "Beautiful Day" ... The heart is a bloom / Shoots up through the stony ground / But there's no room / No space to rent in this town

:::::Reminds me of how inhospitable this fallen world can be to the spirits of believers trying to lead a godly life in the midst of a secular world which often seems to be ruled by the devil (John 12:31). Yet God's love is there, like sunshine! --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 14:53, 29 March 2011 (EDT)

== Brothers in Arms - Dure Straits ==

I would like to suggest Brothers in Arms by Dire Straits. It's about war and having ones "brother's in arms" in support. [[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 17:32, 4 April 2011 (EDT)
:If there is no argument to it's inclusion I'll add it soon. Let me know your thoughts though...[[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 17:42, 5 April 2011 (EDT)

== YMCA? ==

I'd always heard that the Village People's YMCA was about [[homosexual]] men seducing other men? That doesn't sound very [[conservative]] to me. Is this just a rumor? --[[User:JustinD|JustinD]] 12:45, 12 May 2011 (EDT)
:This was obviously added as a joke, and no one else seems to have realized it! [[User:TriciaS|TriciaS]] 12:25, 18 June 2011 (EDT)

::Nope - the song is a legitimate tribute to the Young Men's Christian Association.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 13:19, 18 June 2011 (EDT)
:::Right. And Antony came to bury Caesar, not to praise him. "It's fun to stay at the Y-M-C-A. / They have everything that you need to enjoy, / You can hang out with all the boys..." [[User:TriciaS|TriciaS]] 13:32, 18 June 2011 (EDT)
::::It was probably written about more savory activities at the Y but later became identified as a gay anthem. I don't think it's a "conservative song" if it's overwhelmingly associated with homosexuality. [[User:NKeaton|Nate]] 13:43, 18 June 2011 (EDT)

:::::The song is a good faith tribute and attempts to redefine it are not factual.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 15:10, 18 June 2011 (EDT)

:::::: Does anyone have any solid sources one way or the other as to what this song means? I tried some brief googling, but didn't turn up anything at all trustworthy. --[[User:JustinD|JustinD]] 22:35, 28 June 2011 (EDT)

::::::: The band leader said it was a legitimate tribute to the Young Men's Christian Association, and we respect original meaning at ''Conservapedia''.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:40, 28 June 2011 (EDT)

::::::::Awesome. Do you have a source for that I can add?--[[User:JustinD|JustinD]] 21:28, 29 June 2011 (EDT)

== Really? Have You Looked Into These Songs? ==

I'd just like to say that I think it's really jacked that you're going around and trying to SAY what these songs mean. For example, Metallica is NOT a conservative band. James Hetfield was a heavy drinker until he went to rehab, Kirk Hammett suffered from drug addiction during his teen years, and if you listen to any other song you hear that they are NOT a conservative band.

Furthermore, Journey is NOT a conservative band. Steve Perry openly voted for Obama in 2008. --[[User:Beanna|Beanna]] 20:04, 24 May 2011 (EDT)

: This isn't a list of conservative bands. It's a list of conservative ''songs''. Even liberals are capable of occasionally singing a conservative song.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 21:19, 24 May 2011 (EDT)

== An idea... ==

I was looking at this list and realised that most of the songs listed here are big hit numbers. I was thinking that it might be interesting to look at whether the more conservative a song is the better it does on the charts. Even though the artist might be liberal it seems there bigger hits are in fact conservative songs! Maybe by charting something like this we could prove that people respond better to the conservative message and perhaps change the minds of some liberal singers. Just an idea. [[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 20:31, 27 May 2011 (EDT)
:We could add the respective chart ranking to this page and then collate the results by rank and date. Perhaps, like the conservative words, we might even see the same pattern repeated here! [[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 20:48, 27 May 2011 (EDT)

::Great idea!--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:01, 27 May 2011 (EDT)
:::It'll be a big project though so it'll be awhile for me to collate the results but I fear that we'll find that the majority of new hits are liberal in nature (particulalry coming from M&M and Usher etc) but I think that is because of the "hollywood" influence. Interestingly artists distanced from "fame" have better messages and ''still'' produce amazing hits. [[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 23:11, 27 May 2011 (EDT)

== From a youngin' ==

Citizen/Soldier by 3 Doors Down. I don't know about the band themselves, but any song that supports the National Guard should be listed here, in my honest option. If no one minds, I'll add it.

== Wish you were here ==

This is a good list of songs, but as far as I know, ''Wish you were here'' (the title track, along with the entire eponymous album) was not dedicated to a conservative president, but rather to ex-Pink Floyd member Syd Barrett. --[[User:LeonardO|Leo-from-UK]] 19:19, 16 June 2011 (EDT)

: I agree that this needs a citation, given that it is so contrary to the conventional story. I've looked for one, but every indication points to it being inspired by Syd Barrett, not a conservative leader (indeed; one would think, Pink Floyd being made up of Englishmen, that it would be a conservative PM, not President.). --[[User:Monty]]

== Two song suggestions ==

Hallowed Be Thy Name - Iron Maiden

1) Like Welcome to the Family, it's about death row, but not anti-death penalty.

2) Multiple references to an afterlife. "Tears they flow but why am I crying?/After all I am not afraid of dying/Don't I believe that there never is an end?" and later in the song: Mark my words believe my soul lives on/Don't worry now that I have gone/I've gone beyond to seek the truth".

3) The very title of the song is derived from the Lord's Prayer, which is also implied to be the protagonist (in the song)'s final words.

Declaration Day - Iced Earth

The whole thing is about the American war for independence, so it's probably a good choice for the list.

I'll add them for the time being, but if most of you think they don't go, I'll take them down.

: Thanks for suggesting them, but I don't see much that is conservative in your first suggestion other than acceptance of an afterlife (or judgment). That's an important message, but some of the religious references seem to be simply an attempt to give the song gravitas. Perhaps others have some insights about this.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:54, 15 July 2011 (EDT)

::Perhaps it's time to branch out and create a category or essay on "Songs of interest to conservatives" or [[Songs that Conservatives like]].

::I like a lot of songs, even if I would be hard pressed to say why they are "conservative songs". Not every song or book or movie I like is [[Conservative]], and I think it's important to be broad-minded enough not to condemn everything that isn't 100% in line with my beliefs and values.

::In fact, I go even further and say that one of the main differences between liberals and conservatives is that liberals are supremely narrow-minded. All the talk about "tolerance" is a one way street with them. They want us to tolerate their radical notions, but they are ready at the drop of a hat to kick us out of their cushy little world any time we offer a different idea.

::You would never hear of a Bible-belt Christian walking up to a famous liberal author and kicking his wine glass over at a picnic, saying, "We don't allow liberals here." (see [[Glen Beck in NYC]]). --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 23:35, 15 July 2011 (EDT)

== I don't think Lola qualifies ==

IIRC, it ends with a complete lack of repentance -- "I'm glad I'm a man, and so is Lola". I don't think that this song qualifies as conservative if it celebrates that which we abhor.

:Our sister project, Wikipedia, says the song "details a romantic encounter between a young man and a transvestite" (hardly a conservative theme). --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 12:09, 25 July 2011 (EDT)

== Overhaul the "Greatest Conservative Songs" ==

I think this is something that needs to happen before this Essay begins to get out of control. GCSs Essay needs to reorganized into some sort of categorical order—be it alphabetical or otherwise—in order to clean up the Essay and to provide clarity to avoid double posting. I will be happy to categorize it alphabetically by either the artist or song. -- [[User:Austenbosten|Austenbosten]] 13:00, 26 July 2011 (EDT)
:I've just rewritten most of the page. Everything is nearly exactly the same, except for a small amount of rephrasing to keep things grammatically correct. I've added peak chart position for every song, but in the interest of making that data comparable, I've limited it to US chart positions. There are some songs (like Brothers In Arms) which charted well in other countries, but didn't chart at all in the US. I eliminated two duplicate entries - Ballad of the Green Berets, and God's Gonna Cut You Down. Enjoy. [[user:CGoodwin|CGoodwin]]
::Good work CGoodwin. Maybe we can have the same revision for [[Essay:Greatest Conservative Movies]]. [[User:KBarnett|KBarnett]] 15:47, 29 July 2011 (EDT)

:::CGoodwin, your tabular format and ranking information is interesting. Well done. But surely ''Amazing Grace'' has been more popular than just about every other song on the list. How should the table reflect that?--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 20:05, 29 July 2011 (EDT)
::::Billboard popularity only measures against how everything else is selling at the same time. If an song sold 100 copies a week for 20 years, it would never crack the charts. The other thing is that there are over 3000 recorded versions of the song. The highest charting individual version I've found is Elvis's, which reached #79. If you want to reflect a broader historical sense of popularity, I'd suggest doing a personal ranking. [[user:CGoodwin|CGoodwin]]

:::::Great Job CGoodwin! Very clean and will definatly help those looking to post songs to check to see if they are or are not already posted. -- [[User:Austenbosten|Austenbosten]] 16:32, 30 July 2011 (EDT)

== Particle man? Really? ==

I think someone must be sabotaging this page. I fail to see how "Particle man" qualifies as an allegory, rather than fun wordplay around a tune not entirely unlike the Spiderman theme song.

:I have to agree on this one, I looked up what people think is the meaning, and seems its more likely an atheist song then a conservative one. [[User:KenN|KenN]]

== No Johnny Cash? ==

Have there really been no suggestions for Johnny Cash songs here? So many of his works discuss the importance of faith, of accepting Jesus, or praise the values of small town country life over the extravagant lifestyles many liberals seem to push for.--[[User:MorrisF|MorrisF]] 12:54, 18 August 2011 (EDT)
::I put in a traditional song and gave the Johnny Cash version: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IStlBOX9F4o [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 20:24, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
:::I think Man in Black should make the list as well.--[[User:JamesWilson|JamesWilson]] 20:43, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
::::You could make a good argument for a good percentage of his work. I added Country Trash, mostly because it's a fun favorite of mine, and I'm sure a bunch more of his would fit too.--[[User:MorrisF|MorrisF]] 00:40, 1 September 2011 (EDT)

==YMCA==
"YMCA", "In the Navy", "San Francisco", and "Macho Man" are NOT conservative songs. They're celebrations of the gay lifestyle. They never did any conservative songs. Have you actually listened to the words
:This point has already been discussed above. Also, please sign your posts. [[User:Jcw|Jcw]] 21:12, 19 August 2011 (EDT)
::Sorry, this is my first post here. Seem to have omitted a heading as well. [[User:Nealstar|Nealstar]] 19:22, 19 August 2011 (MST)

== Tenacious D ==

I would like to put Tribute by Tenacious D forward. I know it's a comedy single, but it's also a very popular song about overcoming Satan and alludes to many other Christian themes such as heaven and hell.[[User:GMilhouse|GMilhouse]] 14:00, 28 August 2011 (BST)

== Deep sixed YMCA by Village People, keep it buried ==

These are not conservative lyrics in the song YMCA: "You can get yourself clean, you can have a good meal, '''You can do whatever you feel'''" [http://www.sing365.com/music/lyric.nsf/y-m-c-a-lyrics-village-people/33e3d31bddce747748256df20009b2a5] This is not a conservative video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CS9OO0S5w2k

I think a lot of the songs listed should be scrapped. This was the most egregious case. For example, how conservative are songs written by long haired guy rockers or homosexual rockers? Shouldn't the authors of the songs have any bearing? [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 20:19, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
:I withhold judgment on how conservative the song is. As Andy said, further up this page '''"This isn't a list of conservative bands. It's a list of conservative songs. Even liberals are capable of occasionally singing a conservative song."''' [[user:CGoodwin|CGoodwin]]
::Andy did not realize the song had the verse: '''"You can do whatever you feel"''' [http://www.sing365.com/music/lyric.nsf/y-m-c-a-lyrics-village-people/33e3d31bddce747748256df20009b2a5] Definitely not conservative. And please tell me why you think this video is conservative: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CS9OO0S5w2k Again, not conservative. Staying buried - no resurrection here folks, move on. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 22:16, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
:::So, a young man getting in touch with his emotions, crying because he's down in the world, and being hugged by another sympathetic boy is wrong? Duly noted. [[User:JonG|~ ]][[User_talk:JonG|JonG]][[Special:Contributions/JonG| ~]] 22:17, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
::::Why don't we wait until Andy has commented as he wanted to keep it in and we should defer to him. [[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 22:21, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
:::::Does this mean we should go back and analyze ever music video too? In "Alive" by POD, the person is violating the law by not wearing a seatbealt.
:::::And for a song suggestion, "[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LsWr6mHRqgI Hands Held High]" by Linkin Park. [[User:JonG|~ ]][[User_talk:JonG|JonG]][[Special:Contributions/JonG| ~]] 22:44, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
::::::Victor Willis, the ''heterosexual'' ex-lead singer of the Village People and writer of "Y.M.C.A." actually did intend the song to be a legitimate tribute to the Young Men's Christian Association, according to an interview from [http://www.ctv.ca/CTVNews/Entertainment/20070802/village_people_070802/ this article]. He "never intended the homosexual innuendo that many fans read into the song," and really the only thing gay about the video posted by User:Conservative is the fact that some of the people in it actually are gay. Did you know that Victor Willis left the band because he was frustrated with the flamboyancy of some of his gay band-mates and with the band's gay image? --[[User:Toadaron|AaronT]] 19:01, 1 September 2011 (EDT)

:::::::Your comment is misleading and (perhaps deliberately) ignores the writer's well-known liking for double entendre; the reference in the group's name ("Village People") the gay lifestyle of [[Greenwich Village]], and that (as even Wikipedia concedes) the group was "Originally created to target disco's gay audience". [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Village_People]

:::::::I think you need to find another project to join. You're not helping us provide trustworthy information. --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 14:07, 10 September 2011 (EDT)

== ''This Land Is Your Land'' (Woody Guthrie) ==

The removal makes sense. The song seems to be an ode against private property.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 00:19, 10 September 2011 (EDT)

:It's hard to say. Guthrie took the side of the laboring man against the (perceived) indifference of the wealthy, at a time when unions had only recently appeared on the scene to provide [[collective bargaining]] power and relieve the masses from exploitation on the heels of the Industrial Revolution. But the line, "This land was made for you and me" could refer either to the [[abolition of private property]] (as advocated by [[Karl Marx]] and the [[Communists]]), or to God's bountiful blessing upon the settlers of the [[New World]].

:Like all great art, this song contains some ambiguity and requires the listener's interpretation. Like "Consider Yourself" (from [[Oliver!]]), there's a mixture of idealistic brotherhood with hint of the sort of knavery we associate with [[Robin Hood]]. --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 13:58, 10 September 2011 (EDT)
::There is an alternate version that's something like "''This land is my land, '''it isn't your land''''' involving guns and shooting trespassers.--[[User:CamilleT|CamilleT]] 14:59, 20 September 2011 (EDT)

:::"An" alternate version? There are dozens of extra verses beyond the 3 we use at Bible camp. --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 22:39, 20 September 2011 (EDT)
::::I had a friend that used to sing it. I thought it relevant to the discussion. But you're right, a catchy tune is a catchy tune--[[User:CamilleT|CamilleT]] 02:43, 21 September 2011 (EDT)

== "Jerusalem" ==

: I don't think that Jerusalem is a conservative song. We were taught at school that it was a call to arms against industrialization and hence is it is also anti-capitalist, also I don't think that any song Billy Bragg has recorded can be called conservative.--14:20, 20 September 2011 (EDT)[[User:Jloveday|Jloveday]]

== You have got to be kidding me ==

Seven Nation Army is not about conservatives and if you knew anything about The White Stripes you would know that they are NOT conservative in the least (I believe Jack White had his wedding conducted by a shaman). Also, in the description of Sympathy for the Devil, I've yet to meet a perfect person, so I would remove that part of the description. Finally, Wouldn't It Be Nice isn't about marriage, it's just about idyllic teenage love, marriage is just incidental. [[User:GiveMeLiberty|GiveMeLiberty]] 09:21, 3 October 2011 (EDT)

:Thanks for noticing the error. It may have been added by a liberal hoaxer. You removed other items such as Fox News contributions to Hussein Obama. I am curious as to why you wouldn't remove it? You've got to be kidding me skit is a little dramatic.--[[User:Jpatt|Jpatt]] 11:15, 3 October 2011 (EDT)
::I removed the items form FNC b/c I felt they were unimportant to the network in the grand scheme of things and didn't belong in the lead. And yeah, You have got to be kidding me is probably a bit dramatic. As for not editing, I though I couldn't edit, as it was unavailable to me when I posted here. [[User:GiveMeLiberty|GiveMeLiberty]] 18:25, 3 October 2011 (EDT)

== The River? ==

Bruce Springsteen's The River doesn't belong here, in my opinion. Springsteen is liberal and pro-union, and the only reference to unions in the song I could find is where the singer got a union card and a wedding coat. Naturally, pre-marital relations are a big part of the song, but the singer never explicitly (or really implicitly) regrets them.--[[User:JamesWilson|James Wilson]] 09:00, 22 October 2011 (EDT)

: Great points. Feel free to delete that song.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 11:18, 22 October 2011 (EDT)

== wish you were here ==
can someone explain how this song belongs here? I mean, yeah, its a great song, but it seems pretty...well it certainly doesn't even get close to implying that it is about wanting a conservative president....the lryics seem to be written about a romantic interest. I would advise removing it from the list
--[[User:AlexanderSz|AlexanderSz]] 17:04, 25 October 2011 (EDT)
:Yeah, that was added by a liberal troll. Thanks--[[User:Jpatt|Jpatt]] 17:14, 25 October 2011 (EDT)
:I believe the song was about their original band member Syd.--[[User:Jpatt|Jpatt]] 17:17, 25 October 2011 (EDT)

== Thank you for giving me another chance ==

I was briefly banned here for tampering. I really did not tamper
with anyone's entries.
I have not been here 24 hours yet.
However, I am going to be afraid to post now because I was so quickly banned.
I have nothing but the utmost respect for this site. I am so sick of Wikipedia and it's liberal bias.
I often come here when I look up something there and realize I am just reading spin.

I do have a couple of concerns with this song list.
I realize we have more important things to be concerned with right now.
Truth is, a famous musician asked me not to post his song on the list because
of the liberal activists on the list.

I do not want to step on anyone's toes.
I like Pearl Jam and Tracy Chapman too; I bought their albums.
Both are liberal activists and both have raised money for Obama.
Can a song truly be Conservative if the artists are liberal activists?

Pearl Jam even wrote a bad song for Obama. [http://www.starpulse.com/news/index.php/2008/02/06/pearl_jam_tape_song_for_barack_obama Obama Song]
They have even performed at rallies to raise money for him. [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RD2xQmB0GQA Obama Rally]

Tracy Chapman has also raised money for liberal causes, but not specifically for Barack Obama.
Her song, "Fast Car" is about a woman who lives in the ghetto, falls in love with an alcoholic, dreams of changing him and realizes she cannot. She leaves him.
I am not convinced that is a Conservative song.
I am not concerned with the liberal artists on the list...just the liberal activists.
They raise money to fight against the Conservative cause.

Liberal musicians have saturated the market for decades. Many songs are written to indoctrinate our youth. Conservative artists are not easily accepted
by the mainstream industry. There is liberal peer pressure. And if a song is pro-Conservative, forget it.

Just my opinion.
Please contact me with any concerns. I love this site and want to be part of it.
I am working on more serious entries, but I have to get the feel of the way the site works.
I would appreciate a warning before you block me. I will eagerly correct anything in order to stay here.
I was so hurt when I was blocked.

Thanks for reading.
SusanF

== re: Organizing the list ==

I would be happy to volunteer to alphabetize the list.
I think putting the songs in categories would be difficult because some songs
can belong in more than one category.

I don't want to do anything like that without permission from administrators.
I would be happy to do it though. It's confusing the way it is.

:You're welcome to organize it as you think best ... as long as its conciseness, most-important-songs-first presentation is not diluted. The Wikipedia-style of up-front tables of contents and sometimes obscure-information-first is disfavored here.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 13:22, 27 November 2011 (EST)

I was just going to put all of it in alphabetical order. I am not familiar with Wiki-style as I never spend much time on there.
I get annoyed at the liberal bias.
I better bow out of this project because what is "most important" to some will not be for others.
I thought having the songs in alphabetical order would make them easy to locate.

:Improvements are welcome, but I doubt alphabetizing the list, so that obscure titles end up near the top, would improve it. When visitors look at the page, they'd probably like to see some popular songs first.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 23:35, 27 November 2011 (EST)

:I decided I would take on the task of organizing the list. I will categorize the songs, separate them and put them in alphabetical order per category.
Does that sound alright with everyone?
I will not remove any songs.
If there is something you do not like, tell me. Please just don't block me without telling me to change something back.
This is going to take some time. "Most important songs" is a matter of opinion so I have to try to figure out what is "most important" to Conservapedia.
Thank you [[User:SusanF|Susan F.]] 23:55, 27 November 2011 (EST)

:Categorizing sounds like a good idea. Let me know if you need help. --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 00:05, 28 November 2011 (EST)

:Thank you. I am sure I will take you up on that offer of help.
[[User:SusanF|Susan F.]] 00:24, 28 November 2011 (EST)

== Karajou let me know... ==

That I need to supply an article when I post a song and an artist.
I did not know that.
I am working on that right now.

It's odd that I cannot reply to messages I get.
I wanted to contact Karajou myself, but I could not find a way to do that.
I consider myself computer savvy, but this site is a little confusing.

Thanks.

== Please be patient ==

I've spent a lot of time categorizing the songs, careful not to step on anyone's toes.
I am not finished yet. I am working the on the "Spiritual" section and more.

==This page is full of parodies !==
I remove the following, feel free to contest my decisions
*Don't Tread On Me (Metallica) - Absolutely nothing to do with Conservative (or maybe: ''To secure peace is to prepare for war'' ??)
*Hypnotize (System of a Down ) - You must be kidding here, SOAD is one of the most left-winged band in the US. And Hypnotize say nothing about liberals !
*Walking Contradiction / Warning / Boulevard of Broken Dreams (Green Day) - Mostly anti-Bush (good job, vandals !)
*When We Stand Together (Nickelback) - How is it Conservative ?
*A Better Tomorrow (Wu-Tang Clan) - Fail to see any conservative value here.
*The Beautiful People (Marylin Manson) - OMG, is Marylin Manson a conservative symbol now ? (''Hate every motherf*****'' + anti-capitalist)
*Me Against The World (Simple Plan) - If you accept this explanation, you might accept any song
*Pray (Justin Bieber) - A song about supporting your country, really ?

And I believe there is a lot more !
--[[User:PhilipN|PhilipN]] 00:01, 5 January 2012 (EST)

::Speaking of "Pray", do you think MC Hammer's song of the same name could be included? It's a little self-indulgent, but it's mostly about hard work and giving thanks. I'll stick it in, but feel free to remove it if you disagree [[User:WilcoxD|WilcoxD]] 00:08, 5 January 2012 (EST)

:::Of course, this one looks to be about praying and working hard. --[[User:PhilipN|PhilipN]] 00:11, 5 January 2012 (EST)

::::Not Justin Bieber, lolol. I've removed a handful prior. Good work.--[[User:Jpatt|Jpatt]] 00:13, 5 January 2012 (EST)

::::But in the very first example above, the phrase "to secure peace is to prepare for war" is [[conservative]] -- it wouldn't surprise me if Reagan said something similar.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 00:17, 5 January 2012 (EST)

:::::I am not sure but it does not seem really conservative to me, I let you judge: [http://www.lyricsfreak.com/m/metallica/dont+tread+on+me_20092086.html] --[[User:PhilipN|PhilipN]] 00:20, 5 January 2012 (EST)

::::::As to your second example, the politics of the band itself is often irrelevant, as I've had to say repeatedly here. Liberals are capable of saying conservative things, and there are circumstances when a liberal may be in the best position to criticize something about other liberals.

::::::Sometime you might listen carefully to the lyrics of Elton John's ''Goodbye Yellow Brick Road''.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 00:26, 5 January 2012 (EST)

:::::::I think the same is often true for conservatives as well. It is why Reagan was in such a good position to raise taxes for instance. [[User:SammyP|SammyP]] 00:43, 5 January 2012 (EST)

::::::::Hardly. Reagan cut tax rates more than anyone else in his position.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 00:46, 5 January 2012 (EST)

:::::::::[http://money.cnn.com/2010/09/08/news/economy/reagan_years_taxes/index.htm This article] has a good description of taxes under Reagan. In short, when Reagan entered office he enacted a large tax cut, but the deficit grew too large and he had to enact the largest ever peace time tax increase. It would have been easy for a liberal to cut taxes like Reagan did, but as you pointed out above, someone of the opposite party might have had difficulty in enacted the tax increases he pushed through. [[User:SammyP|SammyP]] 00:59, 5 January 2012 (EST)

::::::::::The article obscures rather than illuminates. Reagan's tax-cutting record is far better than any other modern president, despite inheriting an awful economic climate.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 01:14, 5 January 2012 (EST)

:::::::::::I'm sorry, I'm unsure how this assertion squares with the facts. Could you explain what you mean given the changes in tax policy that occurred during the Reagan presidency? [[User:SammyP|SammyP]] 01:23, 5 January 2012 (EST)

Talk:Essay:Greatest Conservative Songs

2012-01-05T06:24:58Z

SammyP: /* This page is full of parodies ! */

See [http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=NzZkNDU5MmViNzVjNzkzMDE3NzNlN2MyZjRjYTk4YjE= this]. [[User:Stryker|Stryker]] 10:04, 17 July 2007 (EDT)

: The [[neoconservative]] ''National Review'' list is 95% garbage, not [[conservative]] at all. I only found one tune on the list that should be added ours ("Stand by your man"), and National Review had it at #50.

: The contrast here with ''National Review'' illustrates the need for ''Conservapedia''. But thanks for your link.--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 11:31, 17 July 2007 (EDT)

Oops... it seems that I added a bunch of songs from that list. Several of mine (Brick, Red Barchetta, I Can't Drive 55, Sweet Home Alabama, and Revolution 1) were on there. That's interesting, though... the NR person and I thought alike on this one. [[User:DanH|DanH]] 17:16, 17 July 2007 (EDT)

Sweet Home Alabama? I love that song (and I'm a liberal)! Revolution's great, too.--[[User:Autofire|Autofire]] 18:29, 17 July 2007 (EDT)

Sorry? Why was my entry for The Fall's Pseud Mag Ed removed? They have always been the great deflators of liberal complacency. What is going on?

: Post a link to the lyrics of the song here and we'll see. Also, please sign your entries by using the signature button in the row above the edit box. Thanks.--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 11:16, 18 July 2007 (EDT)

Can a song possibly be just a song, rather than a political statement? - BornAgainBrit

: Uh, sure, there are songs that lack any meaning at all. "I wanna hold your hand," for example, is a pleasant jingle from your homeland. I trust we'd agree that it is not the most meaningful song in the world. That tune is fun for reminiscing.

: But surely you don't deny that many songs do have political meaning. [[Liberal]] attempts to deny political bias are familiar to us and no one here is fooled. Godspeed.--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 13:37, 18 July 2007 (EDT)

The deletion of Bob Dylan's song was not properly explained. Observing that people serve either the devil or the Lord is a conservative observation, and of course Bob Dylan was a born-again Christian who expressed his faith in song (but don't expect [[liberals]] to tell you that).--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 00:03, 21 July 2007 (EDT)

:I didn't mean to step on any toes, but apathy towards devil worship doesn't seem to me like a very conservative trait. Unfortunately, the verses of the songs don't give us ''any'' meaning whatsoever, so the only meaning we can glean from the song are the four lines of the chorus, three of which are essentially the same :/ [[User:Jazzman831|Jazzman831]] 14:06, 21 July 2007 (EDT)

::Paradise by the Dashboard light? I know its a song about having pre-marital sex, but the end is about how it screwed up his life.--[[User:Elamdri|Elamdri]] 04:45, 23 July 2007 (EDT)

After reading this list, I've gotta ask, just how do you define a 'conservative' song?--[[User:Offeep|Offeep]] 15:27, 26 July 2007 (EDT)

: [[Conservative]] is a term that is well-understood. A "conservative song" reflects some of those values without diluting them with a [[liberal]] message.--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 15:42, 26 July 2007 (EDT)

I can't believe Okie from Muskogie isn't on here. [[User:Maestro|Maestro]] 23:23, 27 July 2007 (EDT)

I know this is being nitpicky, but I don't like the message of Last Kiss because it seems to suggest a works salvation, that one gets to heaven by doing good rather than accepting Jesus. [[User:DanH|DanH]] 23:30, 27 July 2007 (EDT)

:... and on that note, let's open up a can of [[Mountain Dew]] and get ready to [[Debate:Are we saved by faith or works?]] --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 17:16, 3 August 2007 (EDT)

==Last Kiss==
Somebody just put up "Last Kiss;" actually I recall when it was a hit circa 1964 many adults, parents, teachers and ministers where horrified that a song about death was considered appropriate for young people. My my, how things had changed by 1967.... [[User:RobS|RobS]] 18:08, 28 July 2007 (EDT)

Just like 'Teen Angel,' 'Leader of the Pack,' 'Dead Man's Curve,' and 'Tell Laura I Love Her.' [[User:Maestro|Maestro]] 00:35, 29 July 2007 (EDT)

==Possible Addition==

Ok, I have a suggestion, but I want some feedback before putting it on the page. I was listening to the radio today, and Another Brick in the Wall by Pink Floyd came on. I was thinking that the song talks about the way that public schools brainwash children and turn them into "bricks" in the wall that is liberal society. In a way, the song is pro-homeschooling, because it's teachers that need to leave the kids alone so that parents can instruct their children correctly. Maybe I'm reaching a bit here, but I wanted to see what you all thought. [[User:SSchultz|SSchultz]] 00:23, 2 August 2007 (EDT)

: I'm open to comments and suggestions about this, but I've never viewed the famous song "another brick in the wall" as conservative. You may be right that the song properly complains about the effect of schooling, but the song doesn't offer any conservative solution that I can see.--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 01:10, 2 August 2007 (EDT)

::"Another Brick In The Wall" is more of a neutral song. Its part of a concept album in which the main character slowly seperates himself from society. Most Pink Floyd songs are about madness, due to their original lead singer going insane. [[User:TobyKeet|TobyKeet]] 05:32, 24 November 2010 (EST)

==Love Me, I'm a Liberal==

:I'm glad the commies were thrown out
:Of the A.F.L. C.I.O. board

Hardly sounds like a Communist critique. Have you read all the lyrics of the song? [http://web.cecs.pdx.edu/~trent/ochs/lyrics/liberal.html] It's twitting liberals for their supposed concern for others, which is actually sorely lacking. --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 17:14, 3 August 2007 (EDT)

:That song is pure sarcasm and Ochs assumes the role of a 1960s-era (Cold War era) "liberal" to attack them from the extreme left in a sarcastic way. Read the lyrics again, he is attacking the AFL-CIO for throwing out the commies. He is saying liberals aren't far left ''enough''. It's not a conservative song, it's an extreme leftist one. [[User:Parrothead|Parrothead]] 17:22, 3 August 2007 (EDT)

So there's a song on this list about breaking the law 'I can't Drive 55,' and one about obeying the law 'I fought the law.' Which is the conservative value? And the Bobby Fuller Four's version of the latter was the superior version, BTW. [[User:Maestro|Maestro]] 10:40, 10 September 2007 (EDT)
I hope I did not misunderstand. Do these songs have to be OK'd before posting?

There are several on this list that really do not belong on a Conservative music list. Really, REO Keep on loving you?
I got the message and now know I should not add foot notes regarding my thoughts on songs I don't believe belong.
I have been sharing Conservapedia with many of my Conservative FB friends. Many on't know about it.
Several have said the list was not really Conservative.
I know some popular, Conservative musicians and they write nothing but Conservative music.
I hope it was OK that I added some educational songs to the list.
I love Conservapedia! Wikipedia is so liberal. When you read about Van Jones there, he's a great guy!
Thank God for Conservapedia.

== Are these truly conservative? ==

While I understand completely some of these songs being on here, I don't really understand the why Bob Dylan, The Beatles, or Ben Folds (Five) would be on this list. These individual songs may be able to be warped into our mindset, but if one truly looks at these, they become overwhelmingly liberal.

For example: The Beatles - Revolution
While this song does indeed talk about how "Carrying pictures of Chairman Mao" will do no good, it also talks about how war and money can't solve problems. In addition, if a child is to read tis and decide to find out more about The Beatles, they will undoubtedly find some intensely liberal themes. The same idea goes for Bob Dylan. Look at any of his other songs. At the same time, Ben Folds does exactly the same thing.

I cannot argue with the songs and parts on this list, but I wonder if this is a slippery slope?
::It's possible that many of these songs were adopted by conservatives, such as Mike Huckabee playing John Cougar Mellencamp's hits. [[User:Karajou|Karajou]] 14:48, 18 February 2008 (EST)

: Many of the songs here have a powerful [[conservative]] message, and demonstrate that the music industry does not have to be [[liberal]].--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 15:00, 18 February 2008 (EST)

: P.S. [[Liberals]] do say [[conservative]] things from time to time. We're listing songs here, not artists.--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 15:01, 18 February 2008 (EST)

I would just like add that Revolution 1 was written as a reaction against the protesters against the Vietnam War who were getting violent. All Revolution is saying is for the protesters to protest, but not violently, which is still liberal, but a message than other liberal songs. However, for other Beatles songs, they range from being liberal (Why Don't We Do It in the Road?) to be being kind of conservative (Let It Be). Most however, are pretty much neutral. You usually kind Paul McCartney as being more concervative, and Lennon as liberal. [[User:TobyKeet|TobyKeet]] 05:28, 24 November 2010 (EST)

:One problem with the above analysis: Why Don't We Do It In the Road was McCartney's; Lennon was rather famously not involved at all. Personally I've always thought of it as a kind of parody of the free love movement, though apparently that wasn't McCartney's intention. [[User:Ptorquemada|Ptorquemada]] 17:25, 4 April 2011 (EDT)

== In Your Eyes ==

Okay, the song can be considered to be about God, but that alone does not make it conservative. I think Peter Gabriel himself would object to the song's inclusion in this list. --[[User:MakeTomorrow|MakeTomorrow]] 15:23, 18 February 2008 (EST)

: Peter Gabriel can object all he likes. "In Your Eyes" appeals to conservative values, as in "a thousand churches." Do you think we should object when a liberal says something conservative???--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 15:27, 18 February 2008 (EST)
::Religion is not conservative. Fundamentalism is, but not religion. The presence of religion in a song does not make it conservative, even as adherence to religion does not make a person conservative. Look at me, I'm a Christian, but I'm also a communist. Obviously the two are not mutually exclusive. One's personal merely interpersonally-social morals under religion might be more "conservative", in the loosest sense of the term — not conservative, simply somewhat more so — than they would be otherwise; however, that does not automatically make one politically conservative.--[[User:MakeTomorrow|MakeTomorrow]] 15:50, 18 February 2008 (EST)

::: The single best predictor of how conservative someone votes is how often he attends a place of worship of God. Your argument suggesting that you are a counterexample to that correlation means nothing. See point #2 in [[liberal logic]].--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 16:04, 18 February 2008 (EST)

::::That wasn't irrelevant at all. Correlation != causation. --[[User:MakeTomorrow|MakeTomorrow]] 16:08, 18 February 2008 (EST)
::::Sorry, my edit summary should have been "basic statistical interpretation". --[[User:MakeTomorrow|MakeTomorrow]] 16:09, 18 February 2008 (EST)

::::: Why did you cite your counterexample, if it wasn't an example of the logical fallacy #2 in [[liberal logic]]? Do you really think a counterexample disproves causation?

==Land of Confusion==
Does Genesis' ''Land of Confusion'' belong on the list? I remember the music video portraying Ronald Reagan (in puppet form) as inept, and it parodies several conservative leaders, including Margaret Thatcher, et. al. [[User:WesleyS|WesleyS]][[User Talk:WesleyS|Hello!]] 13:58, 5 March 2009 (EST)

: It's liberal lyric of "too many people" is enough reason to bounce it from the list. Thanks for catching this.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 18:53, 5 March 2009 (EST)

==Should Fortunate Son really be on this list?==

It's vehemently anti-war. Please correct if I'm wrong, but I don't think that's a very conservative belief. [[User:JRobbe|JRobbe]]

:I just looked the lyrics. Pretty confused stuff. I'd agree it's not conservative. Would you like to toss it from the list? Please feel free to do so.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 20:26, 7 January 2010 (EST)

:Done. [[User:JRobbe|JRobbe]]

== Long Black Train by Josh Turner? ==

To me, this song seems like a good candidate for this list. --[[User:Dfrischknecht|Dfrischknecht]] 07:14, 22 July 2010 (EDT)

== The Decision by Ricky Van Shelton ==

I think this is another good candidate for this list. It's a song about a teenage girl who gives in to peer pressure and gets pregnant and the consequences of that action. --[[User:Dfrischknecht|Dfrischknecht]] 09:02, 22 July 2010 (EDT)

== New Agey ==

I removed the new agey phrase of "the cycle of life, death and rebirth," for the "Lightning Crashes," by Live, but feel free to discuss here.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 15:23, 22 September 2010 (EDT)

: That wasn't meant to seem "new agey" in the least, but I do understand what you're saying. The song presents a view of life as being cyclical, as the baby is being born an old woman dies, and "The confusion that was hers belongs now to the baby down the hall." I think the lyrics really speak to the significance of life (not just at childbirth), but as a whole. I don't think the song is necessarily about the old woman being reincarnated as the newborn child, but it definitely seems to speak of the circle of life.[[User:JaneX|JaneX]] 15:56, 22 September 2010 (EDT)

:: Perhaps a rewording would work then? How about replacing "the cycle of life, death and rebirth" with "the joy of childbirth in contrast with the end of life"?--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 18:59, 22 September 2010 (EDT)

::: I agree that a rewording would work, thank you for working with me. Perhaps we could just say that the song celebrates the significance of life from birth until death, almost in an as one door closes another opens kind of way? [[User:JaneX|JaneX]] 20:00, 22 September 2010 (EDT)

== Song idea ==

"One Man, One Woman" sung by ABBA. Indirectly a tribute to traditional marriage and monogamy.--[[User:TedM|TedM]] 12:14, 12 January 2011 (EST)

: Sounds good by the title, so how about adding it where you think it would be appropriate in the list? Thanks for your insight.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 12:17, 12 January 2011 (EST)

== Takin' Care of Business ==

This song by BTO is on the list for supporting "Hard work ethic", but its not. The refrain is jokingly ironic. "I love to work at nothing all day; and I've been taking care of business"

The body of the song describes a more easy going life just making music rather than waking up early, catching trains for work, etc.

I'm not saying it makes the song liberal, and not sure why its even necessary to classify songs along political lines, but it sure as heck ain't about working hard.
I'd suggest if someone wants to keep it here because its a good song, and if people can only enjoy it because it conforms to their political views, than change the reason to "Mike Huckabee performed the song" [comment by AndrewJackson]

:You left out how the song praises the self-employed, which is a very conservative, hard-working group of people.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:55, 21 March 2011 (EDT)

::Fair enough, but the praise you speak of is "If you ever get annoyed [with, based on earlier lyrics, either your traditional job or the unpleasant commute involved], look at me, I'm self-employed; I love to work at nothing all day." That could be taken as either "I made so much money as an entepreneur that I no longer need to work" or "My official job title is 'Bum'." Neither one of them really expresses admiration for "hard work" in its own right, though the former is certainly a more positive role model than the latter. I do ''like'' the song, but I'm not entirely sanguine about considering it "conservative." [[User:Ptorquemada|Ptorquemada]] 17:36, 4 April 2011 (EDT)

== Adonai My Lord ==

I'm going to delete this song from the list, as it is from the atheistic industrial metal genre. The lyrics reflect a sort of militant Christianity that does not reflect well on the religion as a whole. For example, this group has a song called "Christf---"...obviously they are not conservative. [[User:DennyW66|DennyW66]] 01:14, 23 March 2011 (EDT)

==No U2?==

Surely -- despite the band's liberal leanings -- one of U2's unashamedly Christian songs should make it in. Gloria seems the obvious choice. The chorus, you may remember, goes: "Gloria, in te domine/ Gloria, exultate/ Gloria, Gloria/ Oh Lord, loosen my lips." --[[User:Jdixon|Jdixon]] 12:34, 28 March 2011 (EDT)
:Agreed. Gloria is definitely a good choice. Perhaps "40"; its lyrics are directly lifted from Psalm 40. [[User:DennyW66|DennyW66]] 12:43, 28 March 2011 (EDT)
::You're kidding right? [http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/world-news/us-election/u2-honoured-to-be-involved-with-obama-celebrations-14145757.html Conservative indeed..] [[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 22:06, 28 March 2011 (EDT)
:::Bono has had a relationship with every President since Clinton; for instance, he worked with Bush on issues relating to Africa and AIDS awareness. The band is very Christian and in no way ashamed of their Christianity. And, rare for rock stars, three of the four members of the band are married family men. They are known for their charitableness and philanthropy, which are of course [[conservative]] traits. Without a doubt, U2 is a conservative, Christian band and they should have representation on this list. [[User:DennyW66|DennyW66]] 22:21, 28 March 2011 (EDT)

::::''Gloria'''s a good choice, please add it if you agree. But U2 became increasingly liberal the more media attention it obtained.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 10:07, 29 March 2011 (EDT)

:::::Maybe it's possible to be Christian and pro-family, and yet left-leaning politically. Anyway, I vote for "Beautiful Day" ... The heart is a bloom / Shoots up through the stony ground / But there's no room / No space to rent in this town

:::::Reminds me of how inhospitable this fallen world can be to the spirits of believers trying to lead a godly life in the midst of a secular world which often seems to be ruled by the devil (John 12:31). Yet God's love is there, like sunshine! --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 14:53, 29 March 2011 (EDT)

== Brothers in Arms - Dure Straits ==

I would like to suggest Brothers in Arms by Dire Straits. It's about war and having ones "brother's in arms" in support. [[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 17:32, 4 April 2011 (EDT)
:If there is no argument to it's inclusion I'll add it soon. Let me know your thoughts though...[[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 17:42, 5 April 2011 (EDT)

== YMCA? ==

I'd always heard that the Village People's YMCA was about [[homosexual]] men seducing other men? That doesn't sound very [[conservative]] to me. Is this just a rumor? --[[User:JustinD|JustinD]] 12:45, 12 May 2011 (EDT)
:This was obviously added as a joke, and no one else seems to have realized it! [[User:TriciaS|TriciaS]] 12:25, 18 June 2011 (EDT)

::Nope - the song is a legitimate tribute to the Young Men's Christian Association.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 13:19, 18 June 2011 (EDT)
:::Right. And Antony came to bury Caesar, not to praise him. "It's fun to stay at the Y-M-C-A. / They have everything that you need to enjoy, / You can hang out with all the boys..." [[User:TriciaS|TriciaS]] 13:32, 18 June 2011 (EDT)
::::It was probably written about more savory activities at the Y but later became identified as a gay anthem. I don't think it's a "conservative song" if it's overwhelmingly associated with homosexuality. [[User:NKeaton|Nate]] 13:43, 18 June 2011 (EDT)

:::::The song is a good faith tribute and attempts to redefine it are not factual.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 15:10, 18 June 2011 (EDT)

:::::: Does anyone have any solid sources one way or the other as to what this song means? I tried some brief googling, but didn't turn up anything at all trustworthy. --[[User:JustinD|JustinD]] 22:35, 28 June 2011 (EDT)

::::::: The band leader said it was a legitimate tribute to the Young Men's Christian Association, and we respect original meaning at ''Conservapedia''.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:40, 28 June 2011 (EDT)

::::::::Awesome. Do you have a source for that I can add?--[[User:JustinD|JustinD]] 21:28, 29 June 2011 (EDT)

== Really? Have You Looked Into These Songs? ==

I'd just like to say that I think it's really jacked that you're going around and trying to SAY what these songs mean. For example, Metallica is NOT a conservative band. James Hetfield was a heavy drinker until he went to rehab, Kirk Hammett suffered from drug addiction during his teen years, and if you listen to any other song you hear that they are NOT a conservative band.

Furthermore, Journey is NOT a conservative band. Steve Perry openly voted for Obama in 2008. --[[User:Beanna|Beanna]] 20:04, 24 May 2011 (EDT)

: This isn't a list of conservative bands. It's a list of conservative ''songs''. Even liberals are capable of occasionally singing a conservative song.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 21:19, 24 May 2011 (EDT)

== An idea... ==

I was looking at this list and realised that most of the songs listed here are big hit numbers. I was thinking that it might be interesting to look at whether the more conservative a song is the better it does on the charts. Even though the artist might be liberal it seems there bigger hits are in fact conservative songs! Maybe by charting something like this we could prove that people respond better to the conservative message and perhaps change the minds of some liberal singers. Just an idea. [[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 20:31, 27 May 2011 (EDT)
:We could add the respective chart ranking to this page and then collate the results by rank and date. Perhaps, like the conservative words, we might even see the same pattern repeated here! [[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 20:48, 27 May 2011 (EDT)

::Great idea!--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:01, 27 May 2011 (EDT)
:::It'll be a big project though so it'll be awhile for me to collate the results but I fear that we'll find that the majority of new hits are liberal in nature (particulalry coming from M&M and Usher etc) but I think that is because of the "hollywood" influence. Interestingly artists distanced from "fame" have better messages and ''still'' produce amazing hits. [[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 23:11, 27 May 2011 (EDT)

== From a youngin' ==

Citizen/Soldier by 3 Doors Down. I don't know about the band themselves, but any song that supports the National Guard should be listed here, in my honest option. If no one minds, I'll add it.

== Wish you were here ==

This is a good list of songs, but as far as I know, ''Wish you were here'' (the title track, along with the entire eponymous album) was not dedicated to a conservative president, but rather to ex-Pink Floyd member Syd Barrett. --[[User:LeonardO|Leo-from-UK]] 19:19, 16 June 2011 (EDT)

: I agree that this needs a citation, given that it is so contrary to the conventional story. I've looked for one, but every indication points to it being inspired by Syd Barrett, not a conservative leader (indeed; one would think, Pink Floyd being made up of Englishmen, that it would be a conservative PM, not President.). --[[User:Monty]]

== Two song suggestions ==

Hallowed Be Thy Name - Iron Maiden

1) Like Welcome to the Family, it's about death row, but not anti-death penalty.

2) Multiple references to an afterlife. "Tears they flow but why am I crying?/After all I am not afraid of dying/Don't I believe that there never is an end?" and later in the song: Mark my words believe my soul lives on/Don't worry now that I have gone/I've gone beyond to seek the truth".

3) The very title of the song is derived from the Lord's Prayer, which is also implied to be the protagonist (in the song)'s final words.

Declaration Day - Iced Earth

The whole thing is about the American war for independence, so it's probably a good choice for the list.

I'll add them for the time being, but if most of you think they don't go, I'll take them down.

: Thanks for suggesting them, but I don't see much that is conservative in your first suggestion other than acceptance of an afterlife (or judgment). That's an important message, but some of the religious references seem to be simply an attempt to give the song gravitas. Perhaps others have some insights about this.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:54, 15 July 2011 (EDT)

::Perhaps it's time to branch out and create a category or essay on "Songs of interest to conservatives" or [[Songs that Conservatives like]].

::I like a lot of songs, even if I would be hard pressed to say why they are "conservative songs". Not every song or book or movie I like is [[Conservative]], and I think it's important to be broad-minded enough not to condemn everything that isn't 100% in line with my beliefs and values.

::In fact, I go even further and say that one of the main differences between liberals and conservatives is that liberals are supremely narrow-minded. All the talk about "tolerance" is a one way street with them. They want us to tolerate their radical notions, but they are ready at the drop of a hat to kick us out of their cushy little world any time we offer a different idea.

::You would never hear of a Bible-belt Christian walking up to a famous liberal author and kicking his wine glass over at a picnic, saying, "We don't allow liberals here." (see [[Glen Beck in NYC]]). --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 23:35, 15 July 2011 (EDT)

== I don't think Lola qualifies ==

IIRC, it ends with a complete lack of repentance -- "I'm glad I'm a man, and so is Lola". I don't think that this song qualifies as conservative if it celebrates that which we abhor.

:Our sister project, Wikipedia, says the song "details a romantic encounter between a young man and a transvestite" (hardly a conservative theme). --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 12:09, 25 July 2011 (EDT)

== Overhaul the "Greatest Conservative Songs" ==

I think this is something that needs to happen before this Essay begins to get out of control. GCSs Essay needs to reorganized into some sort of categorical order—be it alphabetical or otherwise—in order to clean up the Essay and to provide clarity to avoid double posting. I will be happy to categorize it alphabetically by either the artist or song. -- [[User:Austenbosten|Austenbosten]] 13:00, 26 July 2011 (EDT)
:I've just rewritten most of the page. Everything is nearly exactly the same, except for a small amount of rephrasing to keep things grammatically correct. I've added peak chart position for every song, but in the interest of making that data comparable, I've limited it to US chart positions. There are some songs (like Brothers In Arms) which charted well in other countries, but didn't chart at all in the US. I eliminated two duplicate entries - Ballad of the Green Berets, and God's Gonna Cut You Down. Enjoy. [[user:CGoodwin|CGoodwin]]
::Good work CGoodwin. Maybe we can have the same revision for [[Essay:Greatest Conservative Movies]]. [[User:KBarnett|KBarnett]] 15:47, 29 July 2011 (EDT)

:::CGoodwin, your tabular format and ranking information is interesting. Well done. But surely ''Amazing Grace'' has been more popular than just about every other song on the list. How should the table reflect that?--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 20:05, 29 July 2011 (EDT)
::::Billboard popularity only measures against how everything else is selling at the same time. If an song sold 100 copies a week for 20 years, it would never crack the charts. The other thing is that there are over 3000 recorded versions of the song. The highest charting individual version I've found is Elvis's, which reached #79. If you want to reflect a broader historical sense of popularity, I'd suggest doing a personal ranking. [[user:CGoodwin|CGoodwin]]

:::::Great Job CGoodwin! Very clean and will definatly help those looking to post songs to check to see if they are or are not already posted. -- [[User:Austenbosten|Austenbosten]] 16:32, 30 July 2011 (EDT)

== Particle man? Really? ==

I think someone must be sabotaging this page. I fail to see how "Particle man" qualifies as an allegory, rather than fun wordplay around a tune not entirely unlike the Spiderman theme song.

:I have to agree on this one, I looked up what people think is the meaning, and seems its more likely an atheist song then a conservative one. [[User:KenN|KenN]]

== No Johnny Cash? ==

Have there really been no suggestions for Johnny Cash songs here? So many of his works discuss the importance of faith, of accepting Jesus, or praise the values of small town country life over the extravagant lifestyles many liberals seem to push for.--[[User:MorrisF|MorrisF]] 12:54, 18 August 2011 (EDT)
::I put in a traditional song and gave the Johnny Cash version: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IStlBOX9F4o [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 20:24, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
:::I think Man in Black should make the list as well.--[[User:JamesWilson|JamesWilson]] 20:43, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
::::You could make a good argument for a good percentage of his work. I added Country Trash, mostly because it's a fun favorite of mine, and I'm sure a bunch more of his would fit too.--[[User:MorrisF|MorrisF]] 00:40, 1 September 2011 (EDT)

==YMCA==
"YMCA", "In the Navy", "San Francisco", and "Macho Man" are NOT conservative songs. They're celebrations of the gay lifestyle. They never did any conservative songs. Have you actually listened to the words
:This point has already been discussed above. Also, please sign your posts. [[User:Jcw|Jcw]] 21:12, 19 August 2011 (EDT)
::Sorry, this is my first post here. Seem to have omitted a heading as well. [[User:Nealstar|Nealstar]] 19:22, 19 August 2011 (MST)

== Tenacious D ==

I would like to put Tribute by Tenacious D forward. I know it's a comedy single, but it's also a very popular song about overcoming Satan and alludes to many other Christian themes such as heaven and hell.[[User:GMilhouse|GMilhouse]] 14:00, 28 August 2011 (BST)

== Deep sixed YMCA by Village People, keep it buried ==

These are not conservative lyrics in the song YMCA: "You can get yourself clean, you can have a good meal, '''You can do whatever you feel'''" [http://www.sing365.com/music/lyric.nsf/y-m-c-a-lyrics-village-people/33e3d31bddce747748256df20009b2a5] This is not a conservative video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CS9OO0S5w2k

I think a lot of the songs listed should be scrapped. This was the most egregious case. For example, how conservative are songs written by long haired guy rockers or homosexual rockers? Shouldn't the authors of the songs have any bearing? [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 20:19, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
:I withhold judgment on how conservative the song is. As Andy said, further up this page '''"This isn't a list of conservative bands. It's a list of conservative songs. Even liberals are capable of occasionally singing a conservative song."''' [[user:CGoodwin|CGoodwin]]
::Andy did not realize the song had the verse: '''"You can do whatever you feel"''' [http://www.sing365.com/music/lyric.nsf/y-m-c-a-lyrics-village-people/33e3d31bddce747748256df20009b2a5] Definitely not conservative. And please tell me why you think this video is conservative: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CS9OO0S5w2k Again, not conservative. Staying buried - no resurrection here folks, move on. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 22:16, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
:::So, a young man getting in touch with his emotions, crying because he's down in the world, and being hugged by another sympathetic boy is wrong? Duly noted. [[User:JonG|~ ]][[User_talk:JonG|JonG]][[Special:Contributions/JonG| ~]] 22:17, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
::::Why don't we wait until Andy has commented as he wanted to keep it in and we should defer to him. [[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 22:21, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
:::::Does this mean we should go back and analyze ever music video too? In "Alive" by POD, the person is violating the law by not wearing a seatbealt.
:::::And for a song suggestion, "[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LsWr6mHRqgI Hands Held High]" by Linkin Park. [[User:JonG|~ ]][[User_talk:JonG|JonG]][[Special:Contributions/JonG| ~]] 22:44, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
::::::Victor Willis, the ''heterosexual'' ex-lead singer of the Village People and writer of "Y.M.C.A." actually did intend the song to be a legitimate tribute to the Young Men's Christian Association, according to an interview from [http://www.ctv.ca/CTVNews/Entertainment/20070802/village_people_070802/ this article]. He "never intended the homosexual innuendo that many fans read into the song," and really the only thing gay about the video posted by User:Conservative is the fact that some of the people in it actually are gay. Did you know that Victor Willis left the band because he was frustrated with the flamboyancy of some of his gay band-mates and with the band's gay image? --[[User:Toadaron|AaronT]] 19:01, 1 September 2011 (EDT)

:::::::Your comment is misleading and (perhaps deliberately) ignores the writer's well-known liking for double entendre; the reference in the group's name ("Village People") the gay lifestyle of [[Greenwich Village]], and that (as even Wikipedia concedes) the group was "Originally created to target disco's gay audience". [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Village_People]

:::::::I think you need to find another project to join. You're not helping us provide trustworthy information. --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 14:07, 10 September 2011 (EDT)

== ''This Land Is Your Land'' (Woody Guthrie) ==

The removal makes sense. The song seems to be an ode against private property.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 00:19, 10 September 2011 (EDT)

:It's hard to say. Guthrie took the side of the laboring man against the (perceived) indifference of the wealthy, at a time when unions had only recently appeared on the scene to provide [[collective bargaining]] power and relieve the masses from exploitation on the heels of the Industrial Revolution. But the line, "This land was made for you and me" could refer either to the [[abolition of private property]] (as advocated by [[Karl Marx]] and the [[Communists]]), or to God's bountiful blessing upon the settlers of the [[New World]].

:Like all great art, this song contains some ambiguity and requires the listener's interpretation. Like "Consider Yourself" (from [[Oliver!]]), there's a mixture of idealistic brotherhood with hint of the sort of knavery we associate with [[Robin Hood]]. --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 13:58, 10 September 2011 (EDT)
::There is an alternate version that's something like "''This land is my land, '''it isn't your land''''' involving guns and shooting trespassers.--[[User:CamilleT|CamilleT]] 14:59, 20 September 2011 (EDT)

:::"An" alternate version? There are dozens of extra verses beyond the 3 we use at Bible camp. --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 22:39, 20 September 2011 (EDT)
::::I had a friend that used to sing it. I thought it relevant to the discussion. But you're right, a catchy tune is a catchy tune--[[User:CamilleT|CamilleT]] 02:43, 21 September 2011 (EDT)

== "Jerusalem" ==

: I don't think that Jerusalem is a conservative song. We were taught at school that it was a call to arms against industrialization and hence is it is also anti-capitalist, also I don't think that any song Billy Bragg has recorded can be called conservative.--14:20, 20 September 2011 (EDT)[[User:Jloveday|Jloveday]]

== You have got to be kidding me ==

Seven Nation Army is not about conservatives and if you knew anything about The White Stripes you would know that they are NOT conservative in the least (I believe Jack White had his wedding conducted by a shaman). Also, in the description of Sympathy for the Devil, I've yet to meet a perfect person, so I would remove that part of the description. Finally, Wouldn't It Be Nice isn't about marriage, it's just about idyllic teenage love, marriage is just incidental. [[User:GiveMeLiberty|GiveMeLiberty]] 09:21, 3 October 2011 (EDT)

:Thanks for noticing the error. It may have been added by a liberal hoaxer. You removed other items such as Fox News contributions to Hussein Obama. I am curious as to why you wouldn't remove it? You've got to be kidding me skit is a little dramatic.--[[User:Jpatt|Jpatt]] 11:15, 3 October 2011 (EDT)
::I removed the items form FNC b/c I felt they were unimportant to the network in the grand scheme of things and didn't belong in the lead. And yeah, You have got to be kidding me is probably a bit dramatic. As for not editing, I though I couldn't edit, as it was unavailable to me when I posted here. [[User:GiveMeLiberty|GiveMeLiberty]] 18:25, 3 October 2011 (EDT)

== The River? ==

Bruce Springsteen's The River doesn't belong here, in my opinion. Springsteen is liberal and pro-union, and the only reference to unions in the song I could find is where the singer got a union card and a wedding coat. Naturally, pre-marital relations are a big part of the song, but the singer never explicitly (or really implicitly) regrets them.--[[User:JamesWilson|James Wilson]] 09:00, 22 October 2011 (EDT)

: Great points. Feel free to delete that song.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 11:18, 22 October 2011 (EDT)

== wish you were here ==
can someone explain how this song belongs here? I mean, yeah, its a great song, but it seems pretty...well it certainly doesn't even get close to implying that it is about wanting a conservative president....the lryics seem to be written about a romantic interest. I would advise removing it from the list
--[[User:AlexanderSz|AlexanderSz]] 17:04, 25 October 2011 (EDT)
:Yeah, that was added by a liberal troll. Thanks--[[User:Jpatt|Jpatt]] 17:14, 25 October 2011 (EDT)
:I believe the song was about their original band member Syd.--[[User:Jpatt|Jpatt]] 17:17, 25 October 2011 (EDT)

== Thank you for giving me another chance ==

I was briefly banned here for tampering. I really did not tamper
with anyone's entries.
I have not been here 24 hours yet.
However, I am going to be afraid to post now because I was so quickly banned.
I have nothing but the utmost respect for this site. I am so sick of Wikipedia and it's liberal bias.
I often come here when I look up something there and realize I am just reading spin.

I do have a couple of concerns with this song list.
I realize we have more important things to be concerned with right now.
Truth is, a famous musician asked me not to post his song on the list because
of the liberal activists on the list.

I do not want to step on anyone's toes.
I like Pearl Jam and Tracy Chapman too; I bought their albums.
Both are liberal activists and both have raised money for Obama.
Can a song truly be Conservative if the artists are liberal activists?

Pearl Jam even wrote a bad song for Obama. [http://www.starpulse.com/news/index.php/2008/02/06/pearl_jam_tape_song_for_barack_obama Obama Song]
They have even performed at rallies to raise money for him. [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RD2xQmB0GQA Obama Rally]

Tracy Chapman has also raised money for liberal causes, but not specifically for Barack Obama.
Her song, "Fast Car" is about a woman who lives in the ghetto, falls in love with an alcoholic, dreams of changing him and realizes she cannot. She leaves him.
I am not convinced that is a Conservative song.
I am not concerned with the liberal artists on the list...just the liberal activists.
They raise money to fight against the Conservative cause.

Liberal musicians have saturated the market for decades. Many songs are written to indoctrinate our youth. Conservative artists are not easily accepted
by the mainstream industry. There is liberal peer pressure. And if a song is pro-Conservative, forget it.

Just my opinion.
Please contact me with any concerns. I love this site and want to be part of it.
I am working on more serious entries, but I have to get the feel of the way the site works.
I would appreciate a warning before you block me. I will eagerly correct anything in order to stay here.
I was so hurt when I was blocked.

Thanks for reading.
SusanF

== re: Organizing the list ==

I would be happy to volunteer to alphabetize the list.
I think putting the songs in categories would be difficult because some songs
can belong in more than one category.

I don't want to do anything like that without permission from administrators.
I would be happy to do it though. It's confusing the way it is.

:You're welcome to organize it as you think best ... as long as its conciseness, most-important-songs-first presentation is not diluted. The Wikipedia-style of up-front tables of contents and sometimes obscure-information-first is disfavored here.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 13:22, 27 November 2011 (EST)

I was just going to put all of it in alphabetical order. I am not familiar with Wiki-style as I never spend much time on there.
I get annoyed at the liberal bias.
I better bow out of this project because what is "most important" to some will not be for others.
I thought having the songs in alphabetical order would make them easy to locate.

:Improvements are welcome, but I doubt alphabetizing the list, so that obscure titles end up near the top, would improve it. When visitors look at the page, they'd probably like to see some popular songs first.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 23:35, 27 November 2011 (EST)

:I decided I would take on the task of organizing the list. I will categorize the songs, separate them and put them in alphabetical order per category.
Does that sound alright with everyone?
I will not remove any songs.
If there is something you do not like, tell me. Please just don't block me without telling me to change something back.
This is going to take some time. "Most important songs" is a matter of opinion so I have to try to figure out what is "most important" to Conservapedia.
Thank you [[User:SusanF|Susan F.]] 23:55, 27 November 2011 (EST)

:Categorizing sounds like a good idea. Let me know if you need help. --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 00:05, 28 November 2011 (EST)

:Thank you. I am sure I will take you up on that offer of help.
[[User:SusanF|Susan F.]] 00:24, 28 November 2011 (EST)

== Karajou let me know... ==

That I need to supply an article when I post a song and an artist.
I did not know that.
I am working on that right now.

It's odd that I cannot reply to messages I get.
I wanted to contact Karajou myself, but I could not find a way to do that.
I consider myself computer savvy, but this site is a little confusing.

Thanks.

== Please be patient ==

I've spent a lot of time categorizing the songs, careful not to step on anyone's toes.
I am not finished yet. I am working the on the "Spiritual" section and more.

==This page is full of parodies !==
I remove the following, feel free to contest my decisions
*Don't Tread On Me (Metallica) - Absolutely nothing to do with Conservative (or maybe: ''To secure peace is to prepare for war'' ??)
*Hypnotize (System of a Down ) - You must be kidding here, SOAD is one of the most left-winged band in the US. And Hypnotize say nothing about liberals !
*Walking Contradiction / Warning / Boulevard of Broken Dreams (Green Day) - Mostly anti-Bush (good job, vandals !)
*When We Stand Together (Nickelback) - How is it Conservative ?
*A Better Tomorrow (Wu-Tang Clan) - Fail to see any conservative value here.
*The Beautiful People (Marylin Manson) - OMG, is Marylin Manson a conservative symbol now ? (''Hate every motherf*****'' + anti-capitalist)
*Me Against The World (Simple Plan) - If you accept this explanation, you might accept any song
*Pray (Justin Bieber) - A song about supporting your country, really ?

And I believe there is a lot more !
--[[User:PhilipN|PhilipN]] 00:01, 5 January 2012 (EST)

::Speaking of "Pray", do you think MC Hammer's song of the same name could be included? It's a little self-indulgent, but it's mostly about hard work and giving thanks. I'll stick it in, but feel free to remove it if you disagree [[User:WilcoxD|WilcoxD]] 00:08, 5 January 2012 (EST)

:::Of course, this one looks to be about praying and working hard. --[[User:PhilipN|PhilipN]] 00:11, 5 January 2012 (EST)

::::Not Justin Bieber, lolol. I've removed a handful prior. Good work.--[[User:Jpatt|Jpatt]] 00:13, 5 January 2012 (EST)

::::But in the very first example above, the phrase "to secure peace is to prepare for war" is [[conservative]] -- it wouldn't surprise me if Reagan said something similar.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 00:17, 5 January 2012 (EST)

:::::I am not sure but it does not seem really conservative to me, I let you judge: [http://www.lyricsfreak.com/m/metallica/dont+tread+on+me_20092086.html] --[[User:PhilipN|PhilipN]] 00:20, 5 January 2012 (EST)

::::::As to your second example, the politics of the band itself is often irrelevant, as I've had to say repeatedly here. Liberals are capable of saying conservative things, and there are circumstances when a liberal may be in the best position to criticize something about other liberals.

::::::Sometime you might listen carefully to the lyrics of Elton John's ''Goodbye Yellow Brick Road''.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 00:26, 5 January 2012 (EST)

:::::::I think the same is often true for conservatives as well. It is why Reagan was in such a good position to raise taxes for instance. [[User:SammyP|SammyP]] 00:43, 5 January 2012 (EST)

::::::::Hardly. Reagan cut tax rates more than anyone else in his position.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 00:46, 5 January 2012 (EST)

:::::::::[http://money.cnn.com/2010/09/08/news/economy/reagan_years_taxes/index.htm This article] has a good description of taxes under Reagan. In short, when Reagan entered office he enacted a large tax cut, but the deficit grew too large and he had to enact the largest ever peace time tax increase. It would have been easy for a liberal to cut taxes like Reagan did, but as you pointed out above, someone of the opposite party might have had difficulty in enacted the tax increases he pushed through. [[User:SammyP|SammyP]] 00:59, 5 January 2012 (EST)

::::::::::The article obscures rather than illuminates. Reagan's tax-cutting record is far better than any other modern president, despite inheriting an awful economic climate.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 01:14, 5 January 2012 (EST)

:::::::::::I'm sorry, I'm unsure how this assertion squares with the facts. Could you explain what you mean given the changes in tax policy that occurred during the Reagan presidency. [[User:SammyP|SammyP]] 01:23, 5 January 2012 (EST)

Talk:Essay:Greatest Conservative Songs

2012-01-05T06:24:31Z

SammyP: /* This page is full of parodies ! */

See [http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=NzZkNDU5MmViNzVjNzkzMDE3NzNlN2MyZjRjYTk4YjE= this]. [[User:Stryker|Stryker]] 10:04, 17 July 2007 (EDT)

: The [[neoconservative]] ''National Review'' list is 95% garbage, not [[conservative]] at all. I only found one tune on the list that should be added ours ("Stand by your man"), and National Review had it at #50.

: The contrast here with ''National Review'' illustrates the need for ''Conservapedia''. But thanks for your link.--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 11:31, 17 July 2007 (EDT)

Oops... it seems that I added a bunch of songs from that list. Several of mine (Brick, Red Barchetta, I Can't Drive 55, Sweet Home Alabama, and Revolution 1) were on there. That's interesting, though... the NR person and I thought alike on this one. [[User:DanH|DanH]] 17:16, 17 July 2007 (EDT)

Sweet Home Alabama? I love that song (and I'm a liberal)! Revolution's great, too.--[[User:Autofire|Autofire]] 18:29, 17 July 2007 (EDT)

Sorry? Why was my entry for The Fall's Pseud Mag Ed removed? They have always been the great deflators of liberal complacency. What is going on?

: Post a link to the lyrics of the song here and we'll see. Also, please sign your entries by using the signature button in the row above the edit box. Thanks.--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 11:16, 18 July 2007 (EDT)

Can a song possibly be just a song, rather than a political statement? - BornAgainBrit

: Uh, sure, there are songs that lack any meaning at all. "I wanna hold your hand," for example, is a pleasant jingle from your homeland. I trust we'd agree that it is not the most meaningful song in the world. That tune is fun for reminiscing.

: But surely you don't deny that many songs do have political meaning. [[Liberal]] attempts to deny political bias are familiar to us and no one here is fooled. Godspeed.--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 13:37, 18 July 2007 (EDT)

The deletion of Bob Dylan's song was not properly explained. Observing that people serve either the devil or the Lord is a conservative observation, and of course Bob Dylan was a born-again Christian who expressed his faith in song (but don't expect [[liberals]] to tell you that).--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 00:03, 21 July 2007 (EDT)

:I didn't mean to step on any toes, but apathy towards devil worship doesn't seem to me like a very conservative trait. Unfortunately, the verses of the songs don't give us ''any'' meaning whatsoever, so the only meaning we can glean from the song are the four lines of the chorus, three of which are essentially the same :/ [[User:Jazzman831|Jazzman831]] 14:06, 21 July 2007 (EDT)

::Paradise by the Dashboard light? I know its a song about having pre-marital sex, but the end is about how it screwed up his life.--[[User:Elamdri|Elamdri]] 04:45, 23 July 2007 (EDT)

After reading this list, I've gotta ask, just how do you define a 'conservative' song?--[[User:Offeep|Offeep]] 15:27, 26 July 2007 (EDT)

: [[Conservative]] is a term that is well-understood. A "conservative song" reflects some of those values without diluting them with a [[liberal]] message.--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 15:42, 26 July 2007 (EDT)

I can't believe Okie from Muskogie isn't on here. [[User:Maestro|Maestro]] 23:23, 27 July 2007 (EDT)

I know this is being nitpicky, but I don't like the message of Last Kiss because it seems to suggest a works salvation, that one gets to heaven by doing good rather than accepting Jesus. [[User:DanH|DanH]] 23:30, 27 July 2007 (EDT)

:... and on that note, let's open up a can of [[Mountain Dew]] and get ready to [[Debate:Are we saved by faith or works?]] --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 17:16, 3 August 2007 (EDT)

==Last Kiss==
Somebody just put up "Last Kiss;" actually I recall when it was a hit circa 1964 many adults, parents, teachers and ministers where horrified that a song about death was considered appropriate for young people. My my, how things had changed by 1967.... [[User:RobS|RobS]] 18:08, 28 July 2007 (EDT)

Just like 'Teen Angel,' 'Leader of the Pack,' 'Dead Man's Curve,' and 'Tell Laura I Love Her.' [[User:Maestro|Maestro]] 00:35, 29 July 2007 (EDT)

==Possible Addition==

Ok, I have a suggestion, but I want some feedback before putting it on the page. I was listening to the radio today, and Another Brick in the Wall by Pink Floyd came on. I was thinking that the song talks about the way that public schools brainwash children and turn them into "bricks" in the wall that is liberal society. In a way, the song is pro-homeschooling, because it's teachers that need to leave the kids alone so that parents can instruct their children correctly. Maybe I'm reaching a bit here, but I wanted to see what you all thought. [[User:SSchultz|SSchultz]] 00:23, 2 August 2007 (EDT)

: I'm open to comments and suggestions about this, but I've never viewed the famous song "another brick in the wall" as conservative. You may be right that the song properly complains about the effect of schooling, but the song doesn't offer any conservative solution that I can see.--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 01:10, 2 August 2007 (EDT)

::"Another Brick In The Wall" is more of a neutral song. Its part of a concept album in which the main character slowly seperates himself from society. Most Pink Floyd songs are about madness, due to their original lead singer going insane. [[User:TobyKeet|TobyKeet]] 05:32, 24 November 2010 (EST)

==Love Me, I'm a Liberal==

:I'm glad the commies were thrown out
:Of the A.F.L. C.I.O. board

Hardly sounds like a Communist critique. Have you read all the lyrics of the song? [http://web.cecs.pdx.edu/~trent/ochs/lyrics/liberal.html] It's twitting liberals for their supposed concern for others, which is actually sorely lacking. --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 17:14, 3 August 2007 (EDT)

:That song is pure sarcasm and Ochs assumes the role of a 1960s-era (Cold War era) "liberal" to attack them from the extreme left in a sarcastic way. Read the lyrics again, he is attacking the AFL-CIO for throwing out the commies. He is saying liberals aren't far left ''enough''. It's not a conservative song, it's an extreme leftist one. [[User:Parrothead|Parrothead]] 17:22, 3 August 2007 (EDT)

So there's a song on this list about breaking the law 'I can't Drive 55,' and one about obeying the law 'I fought the law.' Which is the conservative value? And the Bobby Fuller Four's version of the latter was the superior version, BTW. [[User:Maestro|Maestro]] 10:40, 10 September 2007 (EDT)
I hope I did not misunderstand. Do these songs have to be OK'd before posting?

There are several on this list that really do not belong on a Conservative music list. Really, REO Keep on loving you?
I got the message and now know I should not add foot notes regarding my thoughts on songs I don't believe belong.
I have been sharing Conservapedia with many of my Conservative FB friends. Many on't know about it.
Several have said the list was not really Conservative.
I know some popular, Conservative musicians and they write nothing but Conservative music.
I hope it was OK that I added some educational songs to the list.
I love Conservapedia! Wikipedia is so liberal. When you read about Van Jones there, he's a great guy!
Thank God for Conservapedia.

== Are these truly conservative? ==

While I understand completely some of these songs being on here, I don't really understand the why Bob Dylan, The Beatles, or Ben Folds (Five) would be on this list. These individual songs may be able to be warped into our mindset, but if one truly looks at these, they become overwhelmingly liberal.

For example: The Beatles - Revolution
While this song does indeed talk about how "Carrying pictures of Chairman Mao" will do no good, it also talks about how war and money can't solve problems. In addition, if a child is to read tis and decide to find out more about The Beatles, they will undoubtedly find some intensely liberal themes. The same idea goes for Bob Dylan. Look at any of his other songs. At the same time, Ben Folds does exactly the same thing.

I cannot argue with the songs and parts on this list, but I wonder if this is a slippery slope?
::It's possible that many of these songs were adopted by conservatives, such as Mike Huckabee playing John Cougar Mellencamp's hits. [[User:Karajou|Karajou]] 14:48, 18 February 2008 (EST)

: Many of the songs here have a powerful [[conservative]] message, and demonstrate that the music industry does not have to be [[liberal]].--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 15:00, 18 February 2008 (EST)

: P.S. [[Liberals]] do say [[conservative]] things from time to time. We're listing songs here, not artists.--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 15:01, 18 February 2008 (EST)

I would just like add that Revolution 1 was written as a reaction against the protesters against the Vietnam War who were getting violent. All Revolution is saying is for the protesters to protest, but not violently, which is still liberal, but a message than other liberal songs. However, for other Beatles songs, they range from being liberal (Why Don't We Do It in the Road?) to be being kind of conservative (Let It Be). Most however, are pretty much neutral. You usually kind Paul McCartney as being more concervative, and Lennon as liberal. [[User:TobyKeet|TobyKeet]] 05:28, 24 November 2010 (EST)

:One problem with the above analysis: Why Don't We Do It In the Road was McCartney's; Lennon was rather famously not involved at all. Personally I've always thought of it as a kind of parody of the free love movement, though apparently that wasn't McCartney's intention. [[User:Ptorquemada|Ptorquemada]] 17:25, 4 April 2011 (EDT)

== In Your Eyes ==

Okay, the song can be considered to be about God, but that alone does not make it conservative. I think Peter Gabriel himself would object to the song's inclusion in this list. --[[User:MakeTomorrow|MakeTomorrow]] 15:23, 18 February 2008 (EST)

: Peter Gabriel can object all he likes. "In Your Eyes" appeals to conservative values, as in "a thousand churches." Do you think we should object when a liberal says something conservative???--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 15:27, 18 February 2008 (EST)
::Religion is not conservative. Fundamentalism is, but not religion. The presence of religion in a song does not make it conservative, even as adherence to religion does not make a person conservative. Look at me, I'm a Christian, but I'm also a communist. Obviously the two are not mutually exclusive. One's personal merely interpersonally-social morals under religion might be more "conservative", in the loosest sense of the term — not conservative, simply somewhat more so — than they would be otherwise; however, that does not automatically make one politically conservative.--[[User:MakeTomorrow|MakeTomorrow]] 15:50, 18 February 2008 (EST)

::: The single best predictor of how conservative someone votes is how often he attends a place of worship of God. Your argument suggesting that you are a counterexample to that correlation means nothing. See point #2 in [[liberal logic]].--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 16:04, 18 February 2008 (EST)

::::That wasn't irrelevant at all. Correlation != causation. --[[User:MakeTomorrow|MakeTomorrow]] 16:08, 18 February 2008 (EST)
::::Sorry, my edit summary should have been "basic statistical interpretation". --[[User:MakeTomorrow|MakeTomorrow]] 16:09, 18 February 2008 (EST)

::::: Why did you cite your counterexample, if it wasn't an example of the logical fallacy #2 in [[liberal logic]]? Do you really think a counterexample disproves causation?

==Land of Confusion==
Does Genesis' ''Land of Confusion'' belong on the list? I remember the music video portraying Ronald Reagan (in puppet form) as inept, and it parodies several conservative leaders, including Margaret Thatcher, et. al. [[User:WesleyS|WesleyS]][[User Talk:WesleyS|Hello!]] 13:58, 5 March 2009 (EST)

: It's liberal lyric of "too many people" is enough reason to bounce it from the list. Thanks for catching this.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 18:53, 5 March 2009 (EST)

==Should Fortunate Son really be on this list?==

It's vehemently anti-war. Please correct if I'm wrong, but I don't think that's a very conservative belief. [[User:JRobbe|JRobbe]]

:I just looked the lyrics. Pretty confused stuff. I'd agree it's not conservative. Would you like to toss it from the list? Please feel free to do so.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 20:26, 7 January 2010 (EST)

:Done. [[User:JRobbe|JRobbe]]

== Long Black Train by Josh Turner? ==

To me, this song seems like a good candidate for this list. --[[User:Dfrischknecht|Dfrischknecht]] 07:14, 22 July 2010 (EDT)

== The Decision by Ricky Van Shelton ==

I think this is another good candidate for this list. It's a song about a teenage girl who gives in to peer pressure and gets pregnant and the consequences of that action. --[[User:Dfrischknecht|Dfrischknecht]] 09:02, 22 July 2010 (EDT)

== New Agey ==

I removed the new agey phrase of "the cycle of life, death and rebirth," for the "Lightning Crashes," by Live, but feel free to discuss here.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 15:23, 22 September 2010 (EDT)

: That wasn't meant to seem "new agey" in the least, but I do understand what you're saying. The song presents a view of life as being cyclical, as the baby is being born an old woman dies, and "The confusion that was hers belongs now to the baby down the hall." I think the lyrics really speak to the significance of life (not just at childbirth), but as a whole. I don't think the song is necessarily about the old woman being reincarnated as the newborn child, but it definitely seems to speak of the circle of life.[[User:JaneX|JaneX]] 15:56, 22 September 2010 (EDT)

:: Perhaps a rewording would work then? How about replacing "the cycle of life, death and rebirth" with "the joy of childbirth in contrast with the end of life"?--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 18:59, 22 September 2010 (EDT)

::: I agree that a rewording would work, thank you for working with me. Perhaps we could just say that the song celebrates the significance of life from birth until death, almost in an as one door closes another opens kind of way? [[User:JaneX|JaneX]] 20:00, 22 September 2010 (EDT)

== Song idea ==

"One Man, One Woman" sung by ABBA. Indirectly a tribute to traditional marriage and monogamy.--[[User:TedM|TedM]] 12:14, 12 January 2011 (EST)

: Sounds good by the title, so how about adding it where you think it would be appropriate in the list? Thanks for your insight.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 12:17, 12 January 2011 (EST)

== Takin' Care of Business ==

This song by BTO is on the list for supporting "Hard work ethic", but its not. The refrain is jokingly ironic. "I love to work at nothing all day; and I've been taking care of business"

The body of the song describes a more easy going life just making music rather than waking up early, catching trains for work, etc.

I'm not saying it makes the song liberal, and not sure why its even necessary to classify songs along political lines, but it sure as heck ain't about working hard.
I'd suggest if someone wants to keep it here because its a good song, and if people can only enjoy it because it conforms to their political views, than change the reason to "Mike Huckabee performed the song" [comment by AndrewJackson]

:You left out how the song praises the self-employed, which is a very conservative, hard-working group of people.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:55, 21 March 2011 (EDT)

::Fair enough, but the praise you speak of is "If you ever get annoyed [with, based on earlier lyrics, either your traditional job or the unpleasant commute involved], look at me, I'm self-employed; I love to work at nothing all day." That could be taken as either "I made so much money as an entepreneur that I no longer need to work" or "My official job title is 'Bum'." Neither one of them really expresses admiration for "hard work" in its own right, though the former is certainly a more positive role model than the latter. I do ''like'' the song, but I'm not entirely sanguine about considering it "conservative." [[User:Ptorquemada|Ptorquemada]] 17:36, 4 April 2011 (EDT)

== Adonai My Lord ==

I'm going to delete this song from the list, as it is from the atheistic industrial metal genre. The lyrics reflect a sort of militant Christianity that does not reflect well on the religion as a whole. For example, this group has a song called "Christf---"...obviously they are not conservative. [[User:DennyW66|DennyW66]] 01:14, 23 March 2011 (EDT)

==No U2?==

Surely -- despite the band's liberal leanings -- one of U2's unashamedly Christian songs should make it in. Gloria seems the obvious choice. The chorus, you may remember, goes: "Gloria, in te domine/ Gloria, exultate/ Gloria, Gloria/ Oh Lord, loosen my lips." --[[User:Jdixon|Jdixon]] 12:34, 28 March 2011 (EDT)
:Agreed. Gloria is definitely a good choice. Perhaps "40"; its lyrics are directly lifted from Psalm 40. [[User:DennyW66|DennyW66]] 12:43, 28 March 2011 (EDT)
::You're kidding right? [http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/world-news/us-election/u2-honoured-to-be-involved-with-obama-celebrations-14145757.html Conservative indeed..] [[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 22:06, 28 March 2011 (EDT)
:::Bono has had a relationship with every President since Clinton; for instance, he worked with Bush on issues relating to Africa and AIDS awareness. The band is very Christian and in no way ashamed of their Christianity. And, rare for rock stars, three of the four members of the band are married family men. They are known for their charitableness and philanthropy, which are of course [[conservative]] traits. Without a doubt, U2 is a conservative, Christian band and they should have representation on this list. [[User:DennyW66|DennyW66]] 22:21, 28 March 2011 (EDT)

::::''Gloria'''s a good choice, please add it if you agree. But U2 became increasingly liberal the more media attention it obtained.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 10:07, 29 March 2011 (EDT)

:::::Maybe it's possible to be Christian and pro-family, and yet left-leaning politically. Anyway, I vote for "Beautiful Day" ... The heart is a bloom / Shoots up through the stony ground / But there's no room / No space to rent in this town

:::::Reminds me of how inhospitable this fallen world can be to the spirits of believers trying to lead a godly life in the midst of a secular world which often seems to be ruled by the devil (John 12:31). Yet God's love is there, like sunshine! --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 14:53, 29 March 2011 (EDT)

== Brothers in Arms - Dure Straits ==

I would like to suggest Brothers in Arms by Dire Straits. It's about war and having ones "brother's in arms" in support. [[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 17:32, 4 April 2011 (EDT)
:If there is no argument to it's inclusion I'll add it soon. Let me know your thoughts though...[[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 17:42, 5 April 2011 (EDT)

== YMCA? ==

I'd always heard that the Village People's YMCA was about [[homosexual]] men seducing other men? That doesn't sound very [[conservative]] to me. Is this just a rumor? --[[User:JustinD|JustinD]] 12:45, 12 May 2011 (EDT)
:This was obviously added as a joke, and no one else seems to have realized it! [[User:TriciaS|TriciaS]] 12:25, 18 June 2011 (EDT)

::Nope - the song is a legitimate tribute to the Young Men's Christian Association.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 13:19, 18 June 2011 (EDT)
:::Right. And Antony came to bury Caesar, not to praise him. "It's fun to stay at the Y-M-C-A. / They have everything that you need to enjoy, / You can hang out with all the boys..." [[User:TriciaS|TriciaS]] 13:32, 18 June 2011 (EDT)
::::It was probably written about more savory activities at the Y but later became identified as a gay anthem. I don't think it's a "conservative song" if it's overwhelmingly associated with homosexuality. [[User:NKeaton|Nate]] 13:43, 18 June 2011 (EDT)

:::::The song is a good faith tribute and attempts to redefine it are not factual.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 15:10, 18 June 2011 (EDT)

:::::: Does anyone have any solid sources one way or the other as to what this song means? I tried some brief googling, but didn't turn up anything at all trustworthy. --[[User:JustinD|JustinD]] 22:35, 28 June 2011 (EDT)

::::::: The band leader said it was a legitimate tribute to the Young Men's Christian Association, and we respect original meaning at ''Conservapedia''.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:40, 28 June 2011 (EDT)

::::::::Awesome. Do you have a source for that I can add?--[[User:JustinD|JustinD]] 21:28, 29 June 2011 (EDT)

== Really? Have You Looked Into These Songs? ==

I'd just like to say that I think it's really jacked that you're going around and trying to SAY what these songs mean. For example, Metallica is NOT a conservative band. James Hetfield was a heavy drinker until he went to rehab, Kirk Hammett suffered from drug addiction during his teen years, and if you listen to any other song you hear that they are NOT a conservative band.

Furthermore, Journey is NOT a conservative band. Steve Perry openly voted for Obama in 2008. --[[User:Beanna|Beanna]] 20:04, 24 May 2011 (EDT)

: This isn't a list of conservative bands. It's a list of conservative ''songs''. Even liberals are capable of occasionally singing a conservative song.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 21:19, 24 May 2011 (EDT)

== An idea... ==

I was looking at this list and realised that most of the songs listed here are big hit numbers. I was thinking that it might be interesting to look at whether the more conservative a song is the better it does on the charts. Even though the artist might be liberal it seems there bigger hits are in fact conservative songs! Maybe by charting something like this we could prove that people respond better to the conservative message and perhaps change the minds of some liberal singers. Just an idea. [[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 20:31, 27 May 2011 (EDT)
:We could add the respective chart ranking to this page and then collate the results by rank and date. Perhaps, like the conservative words, we might even see the same pattern repeated here! [[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 20:48, 27 May 2011 (EDT)

::Great idea!--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:01, 27 May 2011 (EDT)
:::It'll be a big project though so it'll be awhile for me to collate the results but I fear that we'll find that the majority of new hits are liberal in nature (particulalry coming from M&M and Usher etc) but I think that is because of the "hollywood" influence. Interestingly artists distanced from "fame" have better messages and ''still'' produce amazing hits. [[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 23:11, 27 May 2011 (EDT)

== From a youngin' ==

Citizen/Soldier by 3 Doors Down. I don't know about the band themselves, but any song that supports the National Guard should be listed here, in my honest option. If no one minds, I'll add it.

== Wish you were here ==

This is a good list of songs, but as far as I know, ''Wish you were here'' (the title track, along with the entire eponymous album) was not dedicated to a conservative president, but rather to ex-Pink Floyd member Syd Barrett. --[[User:LeonardO|Leo-from-UK]] 19:19, 16 June 2011 (EDT)

: I agree that this needs a citation, given that it is so contrary to the conventional story. I've looked for one, but every indication points to it being inspired by Syd Barrett, not a conservative leader (indeed; one would think, Pink Floyd being made up of Englishmen, that it would be a conservative PM, not President.). --[[User:Monty]]

== Two song suggestions ==

Hallowed Be Thy Name - Iron Maiden

1) Like Welcome to the Family, it's about death row, but not anti-death penalty.

2) Multiple references to an afterlife. "Tears they flow but why am I crying?/After all I am not afraid of dying/Don't I believe that there never is an end?" and later in the song: Mark my words believe my soul lives on/Don't worry now that I have gone/I've gone beyond to seek the truth".

3) The very title of the song is derived from the Lord's Prayer, which is also implied to be the protagonist (in the song)'s final words.

Declaration Day - Iced Earth

The whole thing is about the American war for independence, so it's probably a good choice for the list.

I'll add them for the time being, but if most of you think they don't go, I'll take them down.

: Thanks for suggesting them, but I don't see much that is conservative in your first suggestion other than acceptance of an afterlife (or judgment). That's an important message, but some of the religious references seem to be simply an attempt to give the song gravitas. Perhaps others have some insights about this.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:54, 15 July 2011 (EDT)

::Perhaps it's time to branch out and create a category or essay on "Songs of interest to conservatives" or [[Songs that Conservatives like]].

::I like a lot of songs, even if I would be hard pressed to say why they are "conservative songs". Not every song or book or movie I like is [[Conservative]], and I think it's important to be broad-minded enough not to condemn everything that isn't 100% in line with my beliefs and values.

::In fact, I go even further and say that one of the main differences between liberals and conservatives is that liberals are supremely narrow-minded. All the talk about "tolerance" is a one way street with them. They want us to tolerate their radical notions, but they are ready at the drop of a hat to kick us out of their cushy little world any time we offer a different idea.

::You would never hear of a Bible-belt Christian walking up to a famous liberal author and kicking his wine glass over at a picnic, saying, "We don't allow liberals here." (see [[Glen Beck in NYC]]). --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 23:35, 15 July 2011 (EDT)

== I don't think Lola qualifies ==

IIRC, it ends with a complete lack of repentance -- "I'm glad I'm a man, and so is Lola". I don't think that this song qualifies as conservative if it celebrates that which we abhor.

:Our sister project, Wikipedia, says the song "details a romantic encounter between a young man and a transvestite" (hardly a conservative theme). --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 12:09, 25 July 2011 (EDT)

== Overhaul the "Greatest Conservative Songs" ==

I think this is something that needs to happen before this Essay begins to get out of control. GCSs Essay needs to reorganized into some sort of categorical order—be it alphabetical or otherwise—in order to clean up the Essay and to provide clarity to avoid double posting. I will be happy to categorize it alphabetically by either the artist or song. -- [[User:Austenbosten|Austenbosten]] 13:00, 26 July 2011 (EDT)
:I've just rewritten most of the page. Everything is nearly exactly the same, except for a small amount of rephrasing to keep things grammatically correct. I've added peak chart position for every song, but in the interest of making that data comparable, I've limited it to US chart positions. There are some songs (like Brothers In Arms) which charted well in other countries, but didn't chart at all in the US. I eliminated two duplicate entries - Ballad of the Green Berets, and God's Gonna Cut You Down. Enjoy. [[user:CGoodwin|CGoodwin]]
::Good work CGoodwin. Maybe we can have the same revision for [[Essay:Greatest Conservative Movies]]. [[User:KBarnett|KBarnett]] 15:47, 29 July 2011 (EDT)

:::CGoodwin, your tabular format and ranking information is interesting. Well done. But surely ''Amazing Grace'' has been more popular than just about every other song on the list. How should the table reflect that?--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 20:05, 29 July 2011 (EDT)
::::Billboard popularity only measures against how everything else is selling at the same time. If an song sold 100 copies a week for 20 years, it would never crack the charts. The other thing is that there are over 3000 recorded versions of the song. The highest charting individual version I've found is Elvis's, which reached #79. If you want to reflect a broader historical sense of popularity, I'd suggest doing a personal ranking. [[user:CGoodwin|CGoodwin]]

:::::Great Job CGoodwin! Very clean and will definatly help those looking to post songs to check to see if they are or are not already posted. -- [[User:Austenbosten|Austenbosten]] 16:32, 30 July 2011 (EDT)

== Particle man? Really? ==

I think someone must be sabotaging this page. I fail to see how "Particle man" qualifies as an allegory, rather than fun wordplay around a tune not entirely unlike the Spiderman theme song.

:I have to agree on this one, I looked up what people think is the meaning, and seems its more likely an atheist song then a conservative one. [[User:KenN|KenN]]

== No Johnny Cash? ==

Have there really been no suggestions for Johnny Cash songs here? So many of his works discuss the importance of faith, of accepting Jesus, or praise the values of small town country life over the extravagant lifestyles many liberals seem to push for.--[[User:MorrisF|MorrisF]] 12:54, 18 August 2011 (EDT)
::I put in a traditional song and gave the Johnny Cash version: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IStlBOX9F4o [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 20:24, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
:::I think Man in Black should make the list as well.--[[User:JamesWilson|JamesWilson]] 20:43, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
::::You could make a good argument for a good percentage of his work. I added Country Trash, mostly because it's a fun favorite of mine, and I'm sure a bunch more of his would fit too.--[[User:MorrisF|MorrisF]] 00:40, 1 September 2011 (EDT)

==YMCA==
"YMCA", "In the Navy", "San Francisco", and "Macho Man" are NOT conservative songs. They're celebrations of the gay lifestyle. They never did any conservative songs. Have you actually listened to the words
:This point has already been discussed above. Also, please sign your posts. [[User:Jcw|Jcw]] 21:12, 19 August 2011 (EDT)
::Sorry, this is my first post here. Seem to have omitted a heading as well. [[User:Nealstar|Nealstar]] 19:22, 19 August 2011 (MST)

== Tenacious D ==

I would like to put Tribute by Tenacious D forward. I know it's a comedy single, but it's also a very popular song about overcoming Satan and alludes to many other Christian themes such as heaven and hell.[[User:GMilhouse|GMilhouse]] 14:00, 28 August 2011 (BST)

== Deep sixed YMCA by Village People, keep it buried ==

These are not conservative lyrics in the song YMCA: "You can get yourself clean, you can have a good meal, '''You can do whatever you feel'''" [http://www.sing365.com/music/lyric.nsf/y-m-c-a-lyrics-village-people/33e3d31bddce747748256df20009b2a5] This is not a conservative video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CS9OO0S5w2k

I think a lot of the songs listed should be scrapped. This was the most egregious case. For example, how conservative are songs written by long haired guy rockers or homosexual rockers? Shouldn't the authors of the songs have any bearing? [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 20:19, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
:I withhold judgment on how conservative the song is. As Andy said, further up this page '''"This isn't a list of conservative bands. It's a list of conservative songs. Even liberals are capable of occasionally singing a conservative song."''' [[user:CGoodwin|CGoodwin]]
::Andy did not realize the song had the verse: '''"You can do whatever you feel"''' [http://www.sing365.com/music/lyric.nsf/y-m-c-a-lyrics-village-people/33e3d31bddce747748256df20009b2a5] Definitely not conservative. And please tell me why you think this video is conservative: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CS9OO0S5w2k Again, not conservative. Staying buried - no resurrection here folks, move on. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 22:16, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
:::So, a young man getting in touch with his emotions, crying because he's down in the world, and being hugged by another sympathetic boy is wrong? Duly noted. [[User:JonG|~ ]][[User_talk:JonG|JonG]][[Special:Contributions/JonG| ~]] 22:17, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
::::Why don't we wait until Andy has commented as he wanted to keep it in and we should defer to him. [[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 22:21, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
:::::Does this mean we should go back and analyze ever music video too? In "Alive" by POD, the person is violating the law by not wearing a seatbealt.
:::::And for a song suggestion, "[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LsWr6mHRqgI Hands Held High]" by Linkin Park. [[User:JonG|~ ]][[User_talk:JonG|JonG]][[Special:Contributions/JonG| ~]] 22:44, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
::::::Victor Willis, the ''heterosexual'' ex-lead singer of the Village People and writer of "Y.M.C.A." actually did intend the song to be a legitimate tribute to the Young Men's Christian Association, according to an interview from [http://www.ctv.ca/CTVNews/Entertainment/20070802/village_people_070802/ this article]. He "never intended the homosexual innuendo that many fans read into the song," and really the only thing gay about the video posted by User:Conservative is the fact that some of the people in it actually are gay. Did you know that Victor Willis left the band because he was frustrated with the flamboyancy of some of his gay band-mates and with the band's gay image? --[[User:Toadaron|AaronT]] 19:01, 1 September 2011 (EDT)

:::::::Your comment is misleading and (perhaps deliberately) ignores the writer's well-known liking for double entendre; the reference in the group's name ("Village People") the gay lifestyle of [[Greenwich Village]], and that (as even Wikipedia concedes) the group was "Originally created to target disco's gay audience". [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Village_People]

:::::::I think you need to find another project to join. You're not helping us provide trustworthy information. --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 14:07, 10 September 2011 (EDT)

== ''This Land Is Your Land'' (Woody Guthrie) ==

The removal makes sense. The song seems to be an ode against private property.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 00:19, 10 September 2011 (EDT)

:It's hard to say. Guthrie took the side of the laboring man against the (perceived) indifference of the wealthy, at a time when unions had only recently appeared on the scene to provide [[collective bargaining]] power and relieve the masses from exploitation on the heels of the Industrial Revolution. But the line, "This land was made for you and me" could refer either to the [[abolition of private property]] (as advocated by [[Karl Marx]] and the [[Communists]]), or to God's bountiful blessing upon the settlers of the [[New World]].

:Like all great art, this song contains some ambiguity and requires the listener's interpretation. Like "Consider Yourself" (from [[Oliver!]]), there's a mixture of idealistic brotherhood with hint of the sort of knavery we associate with [[Robin Hood]]. --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 13:58, 10 September 2011 (EDT)
::There is an alternate version that's something like "''This land is my land, '''it isn't your land''''' involving guns and shooting trespassers.--[[User:CamilleT|CamilleT]] 14:59, 20 September 2011 (EDT)

:::"An" alternate version? There are dozens of extra verses beyond the 3 we use at Bible camp. --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 22:39, 20 September 2011 (EDT)
::::I had a friend that used to sing it. I thought it relevant to the discussion. But you're right, a catchy tune is a catchy tune--[[User:CamilleT|CamilleT]] 02:43, 21 September 2011 (EDT)

== "Jerusalem" ==

: I don't think that Jerusalem is a conservative song. We were taught at school that it was a call to arms against industrialization and hence is it is also anti-capitalist, also I don't think that any song Billy Bragg has recorded can be called conservative.--14:20, 20 September 2011 (EDT)[[User:Jloveday|Jloveday]]

== You have got to be kidding me ==

Seven Nation Army is not about conservatives and if you knew anything about The White Stripes you would know that they are NOT conservative in the least (I believe Jack White had his wedding conducted by a shaman). Also, in the description of Sympathy for the Devil, I've yet to meet a perfect person, so I would remove that part of the description. Finally, Wouldn't It Be Nice isn't about marriage, it's just about idyllic teenage love, marriage is just incidental. [[User:GiveMeLiberty|GiveMeLiberty]] 09:21, 3 October 2011 (EDT)

:Thanks for noticing the error. It may have been added by a liberal hoaxer. You removed other items such as Fox News contributions to Hussein Obama. I am curious as to why you wouldn't remove it? You've got to be kidding me skit is a little dramatic.--[[User:Jpatt|Jpatt]] 11:15, 3 October 2011 (EDT)
::I removed the items form FNC b/c I felt they were unimportant to the network in the grand scheme of things and didn't belong in the lead. And yeah, You have got to be kidding me is probably a bit dramatic. As for not editing, I though I couldn't edit, as it was unavailable to me when I posted here. [[User:GiveMeLiberty|GiveMeLiberty]] 18:25, 3 October 2011 (EDT)

== The River? ==

Bruce Springsteen's The River doesn't belong here, in my opinion. Springsteen is liberal and pro-union, and the only reference to unions in the song I could find is where the singer got a union card and a wedding coat. Naturally, pre-marital relations are a big part of the song, but the singer never explicitly (or really implicitly) regrets them.--[[User:JamesWilson|James Wilson]] 09:00, 22 October 2011 (EDT)

: Great points. Feel free to delete that song.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 11:18, 22 October 2011 (EDT)

== wish you were here ==
can someone explain how this song belongs here? I mean, yeah, its a great song, but it seems pretty...well it certainly doesn't even get close to implying that it is about wanting a conservative president....the lryics seem to be written about a romantic interest. I would advise removing it from the list
--[[User:AlexanderSz|AlexanderSz]] 17:04, 25 October 2011 (EDT)
:Yeah, that was added by a liberal troll. Thanks--[[User:Jpatt|Jpatt]] 17:14, 25 October 2011 (EDT)
:I believe the song was about their original band member Syd.--[[User:Jpatt|Jpatt]] 17:17, 25 October 2011 (EDT)

== Thank you for giving me another chance ==

I was briefly banned here for tampering. I really did not tamper
with anyone's entries.
I have not been here 24 hours yet.
However, I am going to be afraid to post now because I was so quickly banned.
I have nothing but the utmost respect for this site. I am so sick of Wikipedia and it's liberal bias.
I often come here when I look up something there and realize I am just reading spin.

I do have a couple of concerns with this song list.
I realize we have more important things to be concerned with right now.
Truth is, a famous musician asked me not to post his song on the list because
of the liberal activists on the list.

I do not want to step on anyone's toes.
I like Pearl Jam and Tracy Chapman too; I bought their albums.
Both are liberal activists and both have raised money for Obama.
Can a song truly be Conservative if the artists are liberal activists?

Pearl Jam even wrote a bad song for Obama. [http://www.starpulse.com/news/index.php/2008/02/06/pearl_jam_tape_song_for_barack_obama Obama Song]
They have even performed at rallies to raise money for him. [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RD2xQmB0GQA Obama Rally]

Tracy Chapman has also raised money for liberal causes, but not specifically for Barack Obama.
Her song, "Fast Car" is about a woman who lives in the ghetto, falls in love with an alcoholic, dreams of changing him and realizes she cannot. She leaves him.
I am not convinced that is a Conservative song.
I am not concerned with the liberal artists on the list...just the liberal activists.
They raise money to fight against the Conservative cause.

Liberal musicians have saturated the market for decades. Many songs are written to indoctrinate our youth. Conservative artists are not easily accepted
by the mainstream industry. There is liberal peer pressure. And if a song is pro-Conservative, forget it.

Just my opinion.
Please contact me with any concerns. I love this site and want to be part of it.
I am working on more serious entries, but I have to get the feel of the way the site works.
I would appreciate a warning before you block me. I will eagerly correct anything in order to stay here.
I was so hurt when I was blocked.

Thanks for reading.
SusanF

== re: Organizing the list ==

I would be happy to volunteer to alphabetize the list.
I think putting the songs in categories would be difficult because some songs
can belong in more than one category.

I don't want to do anything like that without permission from administrators.
I would be happy to do it though. It's confusing the way it is.

:You're welcome to organize it as you think best ... as long as its conciseness, most-important-songs-first presentation is not diluted. The Wikipedia-style of up-front tables of contents and sometimes obscure-information-first is disfavored here.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 13:22, 27 November 2011 (EST)

I was just going to put all of it in alphabetical order. I am not familiar with Wiki-style as I never spend much time on there.
I get annoyed at the liberal bias.
I better bow out of this project because what is "most important" to some will not be for others.
I thought having the songs in alphabetical order would make them easy to locate.

:Improvements are welcome, but I doubt alphabetizing the list, so that obscure titles end up near the top, would improve it. When visitors look at the page, they'd probably like to see some popular songs first.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 23:35, 27 November 2011 (EST)

:I decided I would take on the task of organizing the list. I will categorize the songs, separate them and put them in alphabetical order per category.
Does that sound alright with everyone?
I will not remove any songs.
If there is something you do not like, tell me. Please just don't block me without telling me to change something back.
This is going to take some time. "Most important songs" is a matter of opinion so I have to try to figure out what is "most important" to Conservapedia.
Thank you [[User:SusanF|Susan F.]] 23:55, 27 November 2011 (EST)

:Categorizing sounds like a good idea. Let me know if you need help. --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 00:05, 28 November 2011 (EST)

:Thank you. I am sure I will take you up on that offer of help.
[[User:SusanF|Susan F.]] 00:24, 28 November 2011 (EST)

== Karajou let me know... ==

That I need to supply an article when I post a song and an artist.
I did not know that.
I am working on that right now.

It's odd that I cannot reply to messages I get.
I wanted to contact Karajou myself, but I could not find a way to do that.
I consider myself computer savvy, but this site is a little confusing.

Thanks.

== Please be patient ==

I've spent a lot of time categorizing the songs, careful not to step on anyone's toes.
I am not finished yet. I am working the on the "Spiritual" section and more.

==This page is full of parodies !==
I remove the following, feel free to contest my decisions
*Don't Tread On Me (Metallica) - Absolutely nothing to do with Conservative (or maybe: ''To secure peace is to prepare for war'' ??)
*Hypnotize (System of a Down ) - You must be kidding here, SOAD is one of the most left-winged band in the US. And Hypnotize say nothing about liberals !
*Walking Contradiction / Warning / Boulevard of Broken Dreams (Green Day) - Mostly anti-Bush (good job, vandals !)
*When We Stand Together (Nickelback) - How is it Conservative ?
*A Better Tomorrow (Wu-Tang Clan) - Fail to see any conservative value here.
*The Beautiful People (Marylin Manson) - OMG, is Marylin Manson a conservative symbol now ? (''Hate every motherf*****'' + anti-capitalist)
*Me Against The World (Simple Plan) - If you accept this explanation, you might accept any song
*Pray (Justin Bieber) - A song about supporting your country, really ?

And I believe there is a lot more !
--[[User:PhilipN|PhilipN]] 00:01, 5 January 2012 (EST)

::Speaking of "Pray", do you think MC Hammer's song of the same name could be included? It's a little self-indulgent, but it's mostly about hard work and giving thanks. I'll stick it in, but feel free to remove it if you disagree [[User:WilcoxD|WilcoxD]] 00:08, 5 January 2012 (EST)

:::Of course, this one looks to be about praying and working hard. --[[User:PhilipN|PhilipN]] 00:11, 5 January 2012 (EST)

::::Not Justin Bieber, lolol. I've removed a handful prior. Good work.--[[User:Jpatt|Jpatt]] 00:13, 5 January 2012 (EST)

::::But in the very first example above, the phrase "to secure peace is to prepare for war" is [[conservative]] -- it wouldn't surprise me if Reagan said something similar.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 00:17, 5 January 2012 (EST)

:::::I am not sure but it does not seem really conservative to me, I let you judge: [http://www.lyricsfreak.com/m/metallica/dont+tread+on+me_20092086.html] --[[User:PhilipN|PhilipN]] 00:20, 5 January 2012 (EST)

::::::As to your second example, the politics of the band itself is often irrelevant, as I've had to say repeatedly here. Liberals are capable of saying conservative things, and there are circumstances when a liberal may be in the best position to criticize something about other liberals.

::::::Sometime you might listen carefully to the lyrics of Elton John's ''Goodbye Yellow Brick Road''.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 00:26, 5 January 2012 (EST)

:::::::I think the same is often true for conservatives as well. It is why Reagan was in such a good position to raise taxes for instance. [[User:SammyP|SammyP]] 00:43, 5 January 2012 (EST)

::::::::Hardly. Reagan cut tax rates more than anyone else in his position.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 00:46, 5 January 2012 (EST)

:::::::::[http://money.cnn.com/2010/09/08/news/economy/reagan_years_taxes/index.htm This article] has a good description of taxes under Reagan. In short, when Reagan entered office he enacted a large tax cut, but the deficit grew too large and he had to enact the largest ever peace time tax increase. It would have been easy for a liberal to cut taxes like Reagan did, but as you pointed out above, someone of the opposite party might have had difficulty in enacted the tax increases he pushed through. [[User:SammyP|SammyP]] 00:59, 5 January 2012 (EST)

::::::::::The article obscures rather than illuminates. Reagan's tax-cutting record is far better than any other modern president, despite inheriting an awful economic climate.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 01:14, 5 January 2012 (EST)

:::::::::::I'm sorry, I'm unsure how this assertion squares with the fact. Could you explain what you mean given the changes in tax policy that occurred during the Reagan presidency. [[User:SammyP|SammyP]] 01:23, 5 January 2012 (EST)

Talk:Essay:Greatest Conservative Songs

2012-01-05T06:23:57Z

SammyP: /* This page is full of parodies ! */

See [http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=NzZkNDU5MmViNzVjNzkzMDE3NzNlN2MyZjRjYTk4YjE= this]. [[User:Stryker|Stryker]] 10:04, 17 July 2007 (EDT)

: The [[neoconservative]] ''National Review'' list is 95% garbage, not [[conservative]] at all. I only found one tune on the list that should be added ours ("Stand by your man"), and National Review had it at #50.

: The contrast here with ''National Review'' illustrates the need for ''Conservapedia''. But thanks for your link.--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 11:31, 17 July 2007 (EDT)

Oops... it seems that I added a bunch of songs from that list. Several of mine (Brick, Red Barchetta, I Can't Drive 55, Sweet Home Alabama, and Revolution 1) were on there. That's interesting, though... the NR person and I thought alike on this one. [[User:DanH|DanH]] 17:16, 17 July 2007 (EDT)

Sweet Home Alabama? I love that song (and I'm a liberal)! Revolution's great, too.--[[User:Autofire|Autofire]] 18:29, 17 July 2007 (EDT)

Sorry? Why was my entry for The Fall's Pseud Mag Ed removed? They have always been the great deflators of liberal complacency. What is going on?

: Post a link to the lyrics of the song here and we'll see. Also, please sign your entries by using the signature button in the row above the edit box. Thanks.--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 11:16, 18 July 2007 (EDT)

Can a song possibly be just a song, rather than a political statement? - BornAgainBrit

: Uh, sure, there are songs that lack any meaning at all. "I wanna hold your hand," for example, is a pleasant jingle from your homeland. I trust we'd agree that it is not the most meaningful song in the world. That tune is fun for reminiscing.

: But surely you don't deny that many songs do have political meaning. [[Liberal]] attempts to deny political bias are familiar to us and no one here is fooled. Godspeed.--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 13:37, 18 July 2007 (EDT)

The deletion of Bob Dylan's song was not properly explained. Observing that people serve either the devil or the Lord is a conservative observation, and of course Bob Dylan was a born-again Christian who expressed his faith in song (but don't expect [[liberals]] to tell you that).--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 00:03, 21 July 2007 (EDT)

:I didn't mean to step on any toes, but apathy towards devil worship doesn't seem to me like a very conservative trait. Unfortunately, the verses of the songs don't give us ''any'' meaning whatsoever, so the only meaning we can glean from the song are the four lines of the chorus, three of which are essentially the same :/ [[User:Jazzman831|Jazzman831]] 14:06, 21 July 2007 (EDT)

::Paradise by the Dashboard light? I know its a song about having pre-marital sex, but the end is about how it screwed up his life.--[[User:Elamdri|Elamdri]] 04:45, 23 July 2007 (EDT)

After reading this list, I've gotta ask, just how do you define a 'conservative' song?--[[User:Offeep|Offeep]] 15:27, 26 July 2007 (EDT)

: [[Conservative]] is a term that is well-understood. A "conservative song" reflects some of those values without diluting them with a [[liberal]] message.--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 15:42, 26 July 2007 (EDT)

I can't believe Okie from Muskogie isn't on here. [[User:Maestro|Maestro]] 23:23, 27 July 2007 (EDT)

I know this is being nitpicky, but I don't like the message of Last Kiss because it seems to suggest a works salvation, that one gets to heaven by doing good rather than accepting Jesus. [[User:DanH|DanH]] 23:30, 27 July 2007 (EDT)

:... and on that note, let's open up a can of [[Mountain Dew]] and get ready to [[Debate:Are we saved by faith or works?]] --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 17:16, 3 August 2007 (EDT)

==Last Kiss==
Somebody just put up "Last Kiss;" actually I recall when it was a hit circa 1964 many adults, parents, teachers and ministers where horrified that a song about death was considered appropriate for young people. My my, how things had changed by 1967.... [[User:RobS|RobS]] 18:08, 28 July 2007 (EDT)

Just like 'Teen Angel,' 'Leader of the Pack,' 'Dead Man's Curve,' and 'Tell Laura I Love Her.' [[User:Maestro|Maestro]] 00:35, 29 July 2007 (EDT)

==Possible Addition==

Ok, I have a suggestion, but I want some feedback before putting it on the page. I was listening to the radio today, and Another Brick in the Wall by Pink Floyd came on. I was thinking that the song talks about the way that public schools brainwash children and turn them into "bricks" in the wall that is liberal society. In a way, the song is pro-homeschooling, because it's teachers that need to leave the kids alone so that parents can instruct their children correctly. Maybe I'm reaching a bit here, but I wanted to see what you all thought. [[User:SSchultz|SSchultz]] 00:23, 2 August 2007 (EDT)

: I'm open to comments and suggestions about this, but I've never viewed the famous song "another brick in the wall" as conservative. You may be right that the song properly complains about the effect of schooling, but the song doesn't offer any conservative solution that I can see.--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 01:10, 2 August 2007 (EDT)

::"Another Brick In The Wall" is more of a neutral song. Its part of a concept album in which the main character slowly seperates himself from society. Most Pink Floyd songs are about madness, due to their original lead singer going insane. [[User:TobyKeet|TobyKeet]] 05:32, 24 November 2010 (EST)

==Love Me, I'm a Liberal==

:I'm glad the commies were thrown out
:Of the A.F.L. C.I.O. board

Hardly sounds like a Communist critique. Have you read all the lyrics of the song? [http://web.cecs.pdx.edu/~trent/ochs/lyrics/liberal.html] It's twitting liberals for their supposed concern for others, which is actually sorely lacking. --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 17:14, 3 August 2007 (EDT)

:That song is pure sarcasm and Ochs assumes the role of a 1960s-era (Cold War era) "liberal" to attack them from the extreme left in a sarcastic way. Read the lyrics again, he is attacking the AFL-CIO for throwing out the commies. He is saying liberals aren't far left ''enough''. It's not a conservative song, it's an extreme leftist one. [[User:Parrothead|Parrothead]] 17:22, 3 August 2007 (EDT)

So there's a song on this list about breaking the law 'I can't Drive 55,' and one about obeying the law 'I fought the law.' Which is the conservative value? And the Bobby Fuller Four's version of the latter was the superior version, BTW. [[User:Maestro|Maestro]] 10:40, 10 September 2007 (EDT)
I hope I did not misunderstand. Do these songs have to be OK'd before posting?

There are several on this list that really do not belong on a Conservative music list. Really, REO Keep on loving you?
I got the message and now know I should not add foot notes regarding my thoughts on songs I don't believe belong.
I have been sharing Conservapedia with many of my Conservative FB friends. Many on't know about it.
Several have said the list was not really Conservative.
I know some popular, Conservative musicians and they write nothing but Conservative music.
I hope it was OK that I added some educational songs to the list.
I love Conservapedia! Wikipedia is so liberal. When you read about Van Jones there, he's a great guy!
Thank God for Conservapedia.

== Are these truly conservative? ==

While I understand completely some of these songs being on here, I don't really understand the why Bob Dylan, The Beatles, or Ben Folds (Five) would be on this list. These individual songs may be able to be warped into our mindset, but if one truly looks at these, they become overwhelmingly liberal.

For example: The Beatles - Revolution
While this song does indeed talk about how "Carrying pictures of Chairman Mao" will do no good, it also talks about how war and money can't solve problems. In addition, if a child is to read tis and decide to find out more about The Beatles, they will undoubtedly find some intensely liberal themes. The same idea goes for Bob Dylan. Look at any of his other songs. At the same time, Ben Folds does exactly the same thing.

I cannot argue with the songs and parts on this list, but I wonder if this is a slippery slope?
::It's possible that many of these songs were adopted by conservatives, such as Mike Huckabee playing John Cougar Mellencamp's hits. [[User:Karajou|Karajou]] 14:48, 18 February 2008 (EST)

: Many of the songs here have a powerful [[conservative]] message, and demonstrate that the music industry does not have to be [[liberal]].--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 15:00, 18 February 2008 (EST)

: P.S. [[Liberals]] do say [[conservative]] things from time to time. We're listing songs here, not artists.--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 15:01, 18 February 2008 (EST)

I would just like add that Revolution 1 was written as a reaction against the protesters against the Vietnam War who were getting violent. All Revolution is saying is for the protesters to protest, but not violently, which is still liberal, but a message than other liberal songs. However, for other Beatles songs, they range from being liberal (Why Don't We Do It in the Road?) to be being kind of conservative (Let It Be). Most however, are pretty much neutral. You usually kind Paul McCartney as being more concervative, and Lennon as liberal. [[User:TobyKeet|TobyKeet]] 05:28, 24 November 2010 (EST)

:One problem with the above analysis: Why Don't We Do It In the Road was McCartney's; Lennon was rather famously not involved at all. Personally I've always thought of it as a kind of parody of the free love movement, though apparently that wasn't McCartney's intention. [[User:Ptorquemada|Ptorquemada]] 17:25, 4 April 2011 (EDT)

== In Your Eyes ==

Okay, the song can be considered to be about God, but that alone does not make it conservative. I think Peter Gabriel himself would object to the song's inclusion in this list. --[[User:MakeTomorrow|MakeTomorrow]] 15:23, 18 February 2008 (EST)

: Peter Gabriel can object all he likes. "In Your Eyes" appeals to conservative values, as in "a thousand churches." Do you think we should object when a liberal says something conservative???--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 15:27, 18 February 2008 (EST)
::Religion is not conservative. Fundamentalism is, but not religion. The presence of religion in a song does not make it conservative, even as adherence to religion does not make a person conservative. Look at me, I'm a Christian, but I'm also a communist. Obviously the two are not mutually exclusive. One's personal merely interpersonally-social morals under religion might be more "conservative", in the loosest sense of the term — not conservative, simply somewhat more so — than they would be otherwise; however, that does not automatically make one politically conservative.--[[User:MakeTomorrow|MakeTomorrow]] 15:50, 18 February 2008 (EST)

::: The single best predictor of how conservative someone votes is how often he attends a place of worship of God. Your argument suggesting that you are a counterexample to that correlation means nothing. See point #2 in [[liberal logic]].--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 16:04, 18 February 2008 (EST)

::::That wasn't irrelevant at all. Correlation != causation. --[[User:MakeTomorrow|MakeTomorrow]] 16:08, 18 February 2008 (EST)
::::Sorry, my edit summary should have been "basic statistical interpretation". --[[User:MakeTomorrow|MakeTomorrow]] 16:09, 18 February 2008 (EST)

::::: Why did you cite your counterexample, if it wasn't an example of the logical fallacy #2 in [[liberal logic]]? Do you really think a counterexample disproves causation?

==Land of Confusion==
Does Genesis' ''Land of Confusion'' belong on the list? I remember the music video portraying Ronald Reagan (in puppet form) as inept, and it parodies several conservative leaders, including Margaret Thatcher, et. al. [[User:WesleyS|WesleyS]][[User Talk:WesleyS|Hello!]] 13:58, 5 March 2009 (EST)

: It's liberal lyric of "too many people" is enough reason to bounce it from the list. Thanks for catching this.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 18:53, 5 March 2009 (EST)

==Should Fortunate Son really be on this list?==

It's vehemently anti-war. Please correct if I'm wrong, but I don't think that's a very conservative belief. [[User:JRobbe|JRobbe]]

:I just looked the lyrics. Pretty confused stuff. I'd agree it's not conservative. Would you like to toss it from the list? Please feel free to do so.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 20:26, 7 January 2010 (EST)

:Done. [[User:JRobbe|JRobbe]]

== Long Black Train by Josh Turner? ==

To me, this song seems like a good candidate for this list. --[[User:Dfrischknecht|Dfrischknecht]] 07:14, 22 July 2010 (EDT)

== The Decision by Ricky Van Shelton ==

I think this is another good candidate for this list. It's a song about a teenage girl who gives in to peer pressure and gets pregnant and the consequences of that action. --[[User:Dfrischknecht|Dfrischknecht]] 09:02, 22 July 2010 (EDT)

== New Agey ==

I removed the new agey phrase of "the cycle of life, death and rebirth," for the "Lightning Crashes," by Live, but feel free to discuss here.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 15:23, 22 September 2010 (EDT)

: That wasn't meant to seem "new agey" in the least, but I do understand what you're saying. The song presents a view of life as being cyclical, as the baby is being born an old woman dies, and "The confusion that was hers belongs now to the baby down the hall." I think the lyrics really speak to the significance of life (not just at childbirth), but as a whole. I don't think the song is necessarily about the old woman being reincarnated as the newborn child, but it definitely seems to speak of the circle of life.[[User:JaneX|JaneX]] 15:56, 22 September 2010 (EDT)

:: Perhaps a rewording would work then? How about replacing "the cycle of life, death and rebirth" with "the joy of childbirth in contrast with the end of life"?--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 18:59, 22 September 2010 (EDT)

::: I agree that a rewording would work, thank you for working with me. Perhaps we could just say that the song celebrates the significance of life from birth until death, almost in an as one door closes another opens kind of way? [[User:JaneX|JaneX]] 20:00, 22 September 2010 (EDT)

== Song idea ==

"One Man, One Woman" sung by ABBA. Indirectly a tribute to traditional marriage and monogamy.--[[User:TedM|TedM]] 12:14, 12 January 2011 (EST)

: Sounds good by the title, so how about adding it where you think it would be appropriate in the list? Thanks for your insight.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 12:17, 12 January 2011 (EST)

== Takin' Care of Business ==

This song by BTO is on the list for supporting "Hard work ethic", but its not. The refrain is jokingly ironic. "I love to work at nothing all day; and I've been taking care of business"

The body of the song describes a more easy going life just making music rather than waking up early, catching trains for work, etc.

I'm not saying it makes the song liberal, and not sure why its even necessary to classify songs along political lines, but it sure as heck ain't about working hard.
I'd suggest if someone wants to keep it here because its a good song, and if people can only enjoy it because it conforms to their political views, than change the reason to "Mike Huckabee performed the song" [comment by AndrewJackson]

:You left out how the song praises the self-employed, which is a very conservative, hard-working group of people.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:55, 21 March 2011 (EDT)

::Fair enough, but the praise you speak of is "If you ever get annoyed [with, based on earlier lyrics, either your traditional job or the unpleasant commute involved], look at me, I'm self-employed; I love to work at nothing all day." That could be taken as either "I made so much money as an entepreneur that I no longer need to work" or "My official job title is 'Bum'." Neither one of them really expresses admiration for "hard work" in its own right, though the former is certainly a more positive role model than the latter. I do ''like'' the song, but I'm not entirely sanguine about considering it "conservative." [[User:Ptorquemada|Ptorquemada]] 17:36, 4 April 2011 (EDT)

== Adonai My Lord ==

I'm going to delete this song from the list, as it is from the atheistic industrial metal genre. The lyrics reflect a sort of militant Christianity that does not reflect well on the religion as a whole. For example, this group has a song called "Christf---"...obviously they are not conservative. [[User:DennyW66|DennyW66]] 01:14, 23 March 2011 (EDT)

==No U2?==

Surely -- despite the band's liberal leanings -- one of U2's unashamedly Christian songs should make it in. Gloria seems the obvious choice. The chorus, you may remember, goes: "Gloria, in te domine/ Gloria, exultate/ Gloria, Gloria/ Oh Lord, loosen my lips." --[[User:Jdixon|Jdixon]] 12:34, 28 March 2011 (EDT)
:Agreed. Gloria is definitely a good choice. Perhaps "40"; its lyrics are directly lifted from Psalm 40. [[User:DennyW66|DennyW66]] 12:43, 28 March 2011 (EDT)
::You're kidding right? [http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/world-news/us-election/u2-honoured-to-be-involved-with-obama-celebrations-14145757.html Conservative indeed..] [[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 22:06, 28 March 2011 (EDT)
:::Bono has had a relationship with every President since Clinton; for instance, he worked with Bush on issues relating to Africa and AIDS awareness. The band is very Christian and in no way ashamed of their Christianity. And, rare for rock stars, three of the four members of the band are married family men. They are known for their charitableness and philanthropy, which are of course [[conservative]] traits. Without a doubt, U2 is a conservative, Christian band and they should have representation on this list. [[User:DennyW66|DennyW66]] 22:21, 28 March 2011 (EDT)

::::''Gloria'''s a good choice, please add it if you agree. But U2 became increasingly liberal the more media attention it obtained.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 10:07, 29 March 2011 (EDT)

:::::Maybe it's possible to be Christian and pro-family, and yet left-leaning politically. Anyway, I vote for "Beautiful Day" ... The heart is a bloom / Shoots up through the stony ground / But there's no room / No space to rent in this town

:::::Reminds me of how inhospitable this fallen world can be to the spirits of believers trying to lead a godly life in the midst of a secular world which often seems to be ruled by the devil (John 12:31). Yet God's love is there, like sunshine! --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 14:53, 29 March 2011 (EDT)

== Brothers in Arms - Dure Straits ==

I would like to suggest Brothers in Arms by Dire Straits. It's about war and having ones "brother's in arms" in support. [[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 17:32, 4 April 2011 (EDT)
:If there is no argument to it's inclusion I'll add it soon. Let me know your thoughts though...[[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 17:42, 5 April 2011 (EDT)

== YMCA? ==

I'd always heard that the Village People's YMCA was about [[homosexual]] men seducing other men? That doesn't sound very [[conservative]] to me. Is this just a rumor? --[[User:JustinD|JustinD]] 12:45, 12 May 2011 (EDT)
:This was obviously added as a joke, and no one else seems to have realized it! [[User:TriciaS|TriciaS]] 12:25, 18 June 2011 (EDT)

::Nope - the song is a legitimate tribute to the Young Men's Christian Association.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 13:19, 18 June 2011 (EDT)
:::Right. And Antony came to bury Caesar, not to praise him. "It's fun to stay at the Y-M-C-A. / They have everything that you need to enjoy, / You can hang out with all the boys..." [[User:TriciaS|TriciaS]] 13:32, 18 June 2011 (EDT)
::::It was probably written about more savory activities at the Y but later became identified as a gay anthem. I don't think it's a "conservative song" if it's overwhelmingly associated with homosexuality. [[User:NKeaton|Nate]] 13:43, 18 June 2011 (EDT)

:::::The song is a good faith tribute and attempts to redefine it are not factual.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 15:10, 18 June 2011 (EDT)

:::::: Does anyone have any solid sources one way or the other as to what this song means? I tried some brief googling, but didn't turn up anything at all trustworthy. --[[User:JustinD|JustinD]] 22:35, 28 June 2011 (EDT)

::::::: The band leader said it was a legitimate tribute to the Young Men's Christian Association, and we respect original meaning at ''Conservapedia''.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:40, 28 June 2011 (EDT)

::::::::Awesome. Do you have a source for that I can add?--[[User:JustinD|JustinD]] 21:28, 29 June 2011 (EDT)

== Really? Have You Looked Into These Songs? ==

I'd just like to say that I think it's really jacked that you're going around and trying to SAY what these songs mean. For example, Metallica is NOT a conservative band. James Hetfield was a heavy drinker until he went to rehab, Kirk Hammett suffered from drug addiction during his teen years, and if you listen to any other song you hear that they are NOT a conservative band.

Furthermore, Journey is NOT a conservative band. Steve Perry openly voted for Obama in 2008. --[[User:Beanna|Beanna]] 20:04, 24 May 2011 (EDT)

: This isn't a list of conservative bands. It's a list of conservative ''songs''. Even liberals are capable of occasionally singing a conservative song.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 21:19, 24 May 2011 (EDT)

== An idea... ==

I was looking at this list and realised that most of the songs listed here are big hit numbers. I was thinking that it might be interesting to look at whether the more conservative a song is the better it does on the charts. Even though the artist might be liberal it seems there bigger hits are in fact conservative songs! Maybe by charting something like this we could prove that people respond better to the conservative message and perhaps change the minds of some liberal singers. Just an idea. [[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 20:31, 27 May 2011 (EDT)
:We could add the respective chart ranking to this page and then collate the results by rank and date. Perhaps, like the conservative words, we might even see the same pattern repeated here! [[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 20:48, 27 May 2011 (EDT)

::Great idea!--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:01, 27 May 2011 (EDT)
:::It'll be a big project though so it'll be awhile for me to collate the results but I fear that we'll find that the majority of new hits are liberal in nature (particulalry coming from M&M and Usher etc) but I think that is because of the "hollywood" influence. Interestingly artists distanced from "fame" have better messages and ''still'' produce amazing hits. [[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 23:11, 27 May 2011 (EDT)

== From a youngin' ==

Citizen/Soldier by 3 Doors Down. I don't know about the band themselves, but any song that supports the National Guard should be listed here, in my honest option. If no one minds, I'll add it.

== Wish you were here ==

This is a good list of songs, but as far as I know, ''Wish you were here'' (the title track, along with the entire eponymous album) was not dedicated to a conservative president, but rather to ex-Pink Floyd member Syd Barrett. --[[User:LeonardO|Leo-from-UK]] 19:19, 16 June 2011 (EDT)

: I agree that this needs a citation, given that it is so contrary to the conventional story. I've looked for one, but every indication points to it being inspired by Syd Barrett, not a conservative leader (indeed; one would think, Pink Floyd being made up of Englishmen, that it would be a conservative PM, not President.). --[[User:Monty]]

== Two song suggestions ==

Hallowed Be Thy Name - Iron Maiden

1) Like Welcome to the Family, it's about death row, but not anti-death penalty.

2) Multiple references to an afterlife. "Tears they flow but why am I crying?/After all I am not afraid of dying/Don't I believe that there never is an end?" and later in the song: Mark my words believe my soul lives on/Don't worry now that I have gone/I've gone beyond to seek the truth".

3) The very title of the song is derived from the Lord's Prayer, which is also implied to be the protagonist (in the song)'s final words.

Declaration Day - Iced Earth

The whole thing is about the American war for independence, so it's probably a good choice for the list.

I'll add them for the time being, but if most of you think they don't go, I'll take them down.

: Thanks for suggesting them, but I don't see much that is conservative in your first suggestion other than acceptance of an afterlife (or judgment). That's an important message, but some of the religious references seem to be simply an attempt to give the song gravitas. Perhaps others have some insights about this.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:54, 15 July 2011 (EDT)

::Perhaps it's time to branch out and create a category or essay on "Songs of interest to conservatives" or [[Songs that Conservatives like]].

::I like a lot of songs, even if I would be hard pressed to say why they are "conservative songs". Not every song or book or movie I like is [[Conservative]], and I think it's important to be broad-minded enough not to condemn everything that isn't 100% in line with my beliefs and values.

::In fact, I go even further and say that one of the main differences between liberals and conservatives is that liberals are supremely narrow-minded. All the talk about "tolerance" is a one way street with them. They want us to tolerate their radical notions, but they are ready at the drop of a hat to kick us out of their cushy little world any time we offer a different idea.

::You would never hear of a Bible-belt Christian walking up to a famous liberal author and kicking his wine glass over at a picnic, saying, "We don't allow liberals here." (see [[Glen Beck in NYC]]). --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 23:35, 15 July 2011 (EDT)

== I don't think Lola qualifies ==

IIRC, it ends with a complete lack of repentance -- "I'm glad I'm a man, and so is Lola". I don't think that this song qualifies as conservative if it celebrates that which we abhor.

:Our sister project, Wikipedia, says the song "details a romantic encounter between a young man and a transvestite" (hardly a conservative theme). --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 12:09, 25 July 2011 (EDT)

== Overhaul the "Greatest Conservative Songs" ==

I think this is something that needs to happen before this Essay begins to get out of control. GCSs Essay needs to reorganized into some sort of categorical order—be it alphabetical or otherwise—in order to clean up the Essay and to provide clarity to avoid double posting. I will be happy to categorize it alphabetically by either the artist or song. -- [[User:Austenbosten|Austenbosten]] 13:00, 26 July 2011 (EDT)
:I've just rewritten most of the page. Everything is nearly exactly the same, except for a small amount of rephrasing to keep things grammatically correct. I've added peak chart position for every song, but in the interest of making that data comparable, I've limited it to US chart positions. There are some songs (like Brothers In Arms) which charted well in other countries, but didn't chart at all in the US. I eliminated two duplicate entries - Ballad of the Green Berets, and God's Gonna Cut You Down. Enjoy. [[user:CGoodwin|CGoodwin]]
::Good work CGoodwin. Maybe we can have the same revision for [[Essay:Greatest Conservative Movies]]. [[User:KBarnett|KBarnett]] 15:47, 29 July 2011 (EDT)

:::CGoodwin, your tabular format and ranking information is interesting. Well done. But surely ''Amazing Grace'' has been more popular than just about every other song on the list. How should the table reflect that?--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 20:05, 29 July 2011 (EDT)
::::Billboard popularity only measures against how everything else is selling at the same time. If an song sold 100 copies a week for 20 years, it would never crack the charts. The other thing is that there are over 3000 recorded versions of the song. The highest charting individual version I've found is Elvis's, which reached #79. If you want to reflect a broader historical sense of popularity, I'd suggest doing a personal ranking. [[user:CGoodwin|CGoodwin]]

:::::Great Job CGoodwin! Very clean and will definatly help those looking to post songs to check to see if they are or are not already posted. -- [[User:Austenbosten|Austenbosten]] 16:32, 30 July 2011 (EDT)

== Particle man? Really? ==

I think someone must be sabotaging this page. I fail to see how "Particle man" qualifies as an allegory, rather than fun wordplay around a tune not entirely unlike the Spiderman theme song.

:I have to agree on this one, I looked up what people think is the meaning, and seems its more likely an atheist song then a conservative one. [[User:KenN|KenN]]

== No Johnny Cash? ==

Have there really been no suggestions for Johnny Cash songs here? So many of his works discuss the importance of faith, of accepting Jesus, or praise the values of small town country life over the extravagant lifestyles many liberals seem to push for.--[[User:MorrisF|MorrisF]] 12:54, 18 August 2011 (EDT)
::I put in a traditional song and gave the Johnny Cash version: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IStlBOX9F4o [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 20:24, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
:::I think Man in Black should make the list as well.--[[User:JamesWilson|JamesWilson]] 20:43, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
::::You could make a good argument for a good percentage of his work. I added Country Trash, mostly because it's a fun favorite of mine, and I'm sure a bunch more of his would fit too.--[[User:MorrisF|MorrisF]] 00:40, 1 September 2011 (EDT)

==YMCA==
"YMCA", "In the Navy", "San Francisco", and "Macho Man" are NOT conservative songs. They're celebrations of the gay lifestyle. They never did any conservative songs. Have you actually listened to the words
:This point has already been discussed above. Also, please sign your posts. [[User:Jcw|Jcw]] 21:12, 19 August 2011 (EDT)
::Sorry, this is my first post here. Seem to have omitted a heading as well. [[User:Nealstar|Nealstar]] 19:22, 19 August 2011 (MST)

== Tenacious D ==

I would like to put Tribute by Tenacious D forward. I know it's a comedy single, but it's also a very popular song about overcoming Satan and alludes to many other Christian themes such as heaven and hell.[[User:GMilhouse|GMilhouse]] 14:00, 28 August 2011 (BST)

== Deep sixed YMCA by Village People, keep it buried ==

These are not conservative lyrics in the song YMCA: "You can get yourself clean, you can have a good meal, '''You can do whatever you feel'''" [http://www.sing365.com/music/lyric.nsf/y-m-c-a-lyrics-village-people/33e3d31bddce747748256df20009b2a5] This is not a conservative video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CS9OO0S5w2k

I think a lot of the songs listed should be scrapped. This was the most egregious case. For example, how conservative are songs written by long haired guy rockers or homosexual rockers? Shouldn't the authors of the songs have any bearing? [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 20:19, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
:I withhold judgment on how conservative the song is. As Andy said, further up this page '''"This isn't a list of conservative bands. It's a list of conservative songs. Even liberals are capable of occasionally singing a conservative song."''' [[user:CGoodwin|CGoodwin]]
::Andy did not realize the song had the verse: '''"You can do whatever you feel"''' [http://www.sing365.com/music/lyric.nsf/y-m-c-a-lyrics-village-people/33e3d31bddce747748256df20009b2a5] Definitely not conservative. And please tell me why you think this video is conservative: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CS9OO0S5w2k Again, not conservative. Staying buried - no resurrection here folks, move on. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 22:16, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
:::So, a young man getting in touch with his emotions, crying because he's down in the world, and being hugged by another sympathetic boy is wrong? Duly noted. [[User:JonG|~ ]][[User_talk:JonG|JonG]][[Special:Contributions/JonG| ~]] 22:17, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
::::Why don't we wait until Andy has commented as he wanted to keep it in and we should defer to him. [[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 22:21, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
:::::Does this mean we should go back and analyze ever music video too? In "Alive" by POD, the person is violating the law by not wearing a seatbealt.
:::::And for a song suggestion, "[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LsWr6mHRqgI Hands Held High]" by Linkin Park. [[User:JonG|~ ]][[User_talk:JonG|JonG]][[Special:Contributions/JonG| ~]] 22:44, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
::::::Victor Willis, the ''heterosexual'' ex-lead singer of the Village People and writer of "Y.M.C.A." actually did intend the song to be a legitimate tribute to the Young Men's Christian Association, according to an interview from [http://www.ctv.ca/CTVNews/Entertainment/20070802/village_people_070802/ this article]. He "never intended the homosexual innuendo that many fans read into the song," and really the only thing gay about the video posted by User:Conservative is the fact that some of the people in it actually are gay. Did you know that Victor Willis left the band because he was frustrated with the flamboyancy of some of his gay band-mates and with the band's gay image? --[[User:Toadaron|AaronT]] 19:01, 1 September 2011 (EDT)

:::::::Your comment is misleading and (perhaps deliberately) ignores the writer's well-known liking for double entendre; the reference in the group's name ("Village People") the gay lifestyle of [[Greenwich Village]], and that (as even Wikipedia concedes) the group was "Originally created to target disco's gay audience". [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Village_People]

:::::::I think you need to find another project to join. You're not helping us provide trustworthy information. --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 14:07, 10 September 2011 (EDT)

== ''This Land Is Your Land'' (Woody Guthrie) ==

The removal makes sense. The song seems to be an ode against private property.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 00:19, 10 September 2011 (EDT)

:It's hard to say. Guthrie took the side of the laboring man against the (perceived) indifference of the wealthy, at a time when unions had only recently appeared on the scene to provide [[collective bargaining]] power and relieve the masses from exploitation on the heels of the Industrial Revolution. But the line, "This land was made for you and me" could refer either to the [[abolition of private property]] (as advocated by [[Karl Marx]] and the [[Communists]]), or to God's bountiful blessing upon the settlers of the [[New World]].

:Like all great art, this song contains some ambiguity and requires the listener's interpretation. Like "Consider Yourself" (from [[Oliver!]]), there's a mixture of idealistic brotherhood with hint of the sort of knavery we associate with [[Robin Hood]]. --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 13:58, 10 September 2011 (EDT)
::There is an alternate version that's something like "''This land is my land, '''it isn't your land''''' involving guns and shooting trespassers.--[[User:CamilleT|CamilleT]] 14:59, 20 September 2011 (EDT)

:::"An" alternate version? There are dozens of extra verses beyond the 3 we use at Bible camp. --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 22:39, 20 September 2011 (EDT)
::::I had a friend that used to sing it. I thought it relevant to the discussion. But you're right, a catchy tune is a catchy tune--[[User:CamilleT|CamilleT]] 02:43, 21 September 2011 (EDT)

== "Jerusalem" ==

: I don't think that Jerusalem is a conservative song. We were taught at school that it was a call to arms against industrialization and hence is it is also anti-capitalist, also I don't think that any song Billy Bragg has recorded can be called conservative.--14:20, 20 September 2011 (EDT)[[User:Jloveday|Jloveday]]

== You have got to be kidding me ==

Seven Nation Army is not about conservatives and if you knew anything about The White Stripes you would know that they are NOT conservative in the least (I believe Jack White had his wedding conducted by a shaman). Also, in the description of Sympathy for the Devil, I've yet to meet a perfect person, so I would remove that part of the description. Finally, Wouldn't It Be Nice isn't about marriage, it's just about idyllic teenage love, marriage is just incidental. [[User:GiveMeLiberty|GiveMeLiberty]] 09:21, 3 October 2011 (EDT)

:Thanks for noticing the error. It may have been added by a liberal hoaxer. You removed other items such as Fox News contributions to Hussein Obama. I am curious as to why you wouldn't remove it? You've got to be kidding me skit is a little dramatic.--[[User:Jpatt|Jpatt]] 11:15, 3 October 2011 (EDT)
::I removed the items form FNC b/c I felt they were unimportant to the network in the grand scheme of things and didn't belong in the lead. And yeah, You have got to be kidding me is probably a bit dramatic. As for not editing, I though I couldn't edit, as it was unavailable to me when I posted here. [[User:GiveMeLiberty|GiveMeLiberty]] 18:25, 3 October 2011 (EDT)

== The River? ==

Bruce Springsteen's The River doesn't belong here, in my opinion. Springsteen is liberal and pro-union, and the only reference to unions in the song I could find is where the singer got a union card and a wedding coat. Naturally, pre-marital relations are a big part of the song, but the singer never explicitly (or really implicitly) regrets them.--[[User:JamesWilson|James Wilson]] 09:00, 22 October 2011 (EDT)

: Great points. Feel free to delete that song.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 11:18, 22 October 2011 (EDT)

== wish you were here ==
can someone explain how this song belongs here? I mean, yeah, its a great song, but it seems pretty...well it certainly doesn't even get close to implying that it is about wanting a conservative president....the lryics seem to be written about a romantic interest. I would advise removing it from the list
--[[User:AlexanderSz|AlexanderSz]] 17:04, 25 October 2011 (EDT)
:Yeah, that was added by a liberal troll. Thanks--[[User:Jpatt|Jpatt]] 17:14, 25 October 2011 (EDT)
:I believe the song was about their original band member Syd.--[[User:Jpatt|Jpatt]] 17:17, 25 October 2011 (EDT)

== Thank you for giving me another chance ==

I was briefly banned here for tampering. I really did not tamper
with anyone's entries.
I have not been here 24 hours yet.
However, I am going to be afraid to post now because I was so quickly banned.
I have nothing but the utmost respect for this site. I am so sick of Wikipedia and it's liberal bias.
I often come here when I look up something there and realize I am just reading spin.

I do have a couple of concerns with this song list.
I realize we have more important things to be concerned with right now.
Truth is, a famous musician asked me not to post his song on the list because
of the liberal activists on the list.

I do not want to step on anyone's toes.
I like Pearl Jam and Tracy Chapman too; I bought their albums.
Both are liberal activists and both have raised money for Obama.
Can a song truly be Conservative if the artists are liberal activists?

Pearl Jam even wrote a bad song for Obama. [http://www.starpulse.com/news/index.php/2008/02/06/pearl_jam_tape_song_for_barack_obama Obama Song]
They have even performed at rallies to raise money for him. [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RD2xQmB0GQA Obama Rally]

Tracy Chapman has also raised money for liberal causes, but not specifically for Barack Obama.
Her song, "Fast Car" is about a woman who lives in the ghetto, falls in love with an alcoholic, dreams of changing him and realizes she cannot. She leaves him.
I am not convinced that is a Conservative song.
I am not concerned with the liberal artists on the list...just the liberal activists.
They raise money to fight against the Conservative cause.

Liberal musicians have saturated the market for decades. Many songs are written to indoctrinate our youth. Conservative artists are not easily accepted
by the mainstream industry. There is liberal peer pressure. And if a song is pro-Conservative, forget it.

Just my opinion.
Please contact me with any concerns. I love this site and want to be part of it.
I am working on more serious entries, but I have to get the feel of the way the site works.
I would appreciate a warning before you block me. I will eagerly correct anything in order to stay here.
I was so hurt when I was blocked.

Thanks for reading.
SusanF

== re: Organizing the list ==

I would be happy to volunteer to alphabetize the list.
I think putting the songs in categories would be difficult because some songs
can belong in more than one category.

I don't want to do anything like that without permission from administrators.
I would be happy to do it though. It's confusing the way it is.

:You're welcome to organize it as you think best ... as long as its conciseness, most-important-songs-first presentation is not diluted. The Wikipedia-style of up-front tables of contents and sometimes obscure-information-first is disfavored here.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 13:22, 27 November 2011 (EST)

I was just going to put all of it in alphabetical order. I am not familiar with Wiki-style as I never spend much time on there.
I get annoyed at the liberal bias.
I better bow out of this project because what is "most important" to some will not be for others.
I thought having the songs in alphabetical order would make them easy to locate.

:Improvements are welcome, but I doubt alphabetizing the list, so that obscure titles end up near the top, would improve it. When visitors look at the page, they'd probably like to see some popular songs first.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 23:35, 27 November 2011 (EST)

:I decided I would take on the task of organizing the list. I will categorize the songs, separate them and put them in alphabetical order per category.
Does that sound alright with everyone?
I will not remove any songs.
If there is something you do not like, tell me. Please just don't block me without telling me to change something back.
This is going to take some time. "Most important songs" is a matter of opinion so I have to try to figure out what is "most important" to Conservapedia.
Thank you [[User:SusanF|Susan F.]] 23:55, 27 November 2011 (EST)

:Categorizing sounds like a good idea. Let me know if you need help. --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 00:05, 28 November 2011 (EST)

:Thank you. I am sure I will take you up on that offer of help.
[[User:SusanF|Susan F.]] 00:24, 28 November 2011 (EST)

== Karajou let me know... ==

That I need to supply an article when I post a song and an artist.
I did not know that.
I am working on that right now.

It's odd that I cannot reply to messages I get.
I wanted to contact Karajou myself, but I could not find a way to do that.
I consider myself computer savvy, but this site is a little confusing.

Thanks.

== Please be patient ==

I've spent a lot of time categorizing the songs, careful not to step on anyone's toes.
I am not finished yet. I am working the on the "Spiritual" section and more.

==This page is full of parodies !==
I remove the following, feel free to contest my decisions
*Don't Tread On Me (Metallica) - Absolutely nothing to do with Conservative (or maybe: ''To secure peace is to prepare for war'' ??)
*Hypnotize (System of a Down ) - You must be kidding here, SOAD is one of the most left-winged band in the US. And Hypnotize say nothing about liberals !
*Walking Contradiction / Warning / Boulevard of Broken Dreams (Green Day) - Mostly anti-Bush (good job, vandals !)
*When We Stand Together (Nickelback) - How is it Conservative ?
*A Better Tomorrow (Wu-Tang Clan) - Fail to see any conservative value here.
*The Beautiful People (Marylin Manson) - OMG, is Marylin Manson a conservative symbol now ? (''Hate every motherf*****'' + anti-capitalist)
*Me Against The World (Simple Plan) - If you accept this explanation, you might accept any song
*Pray (Justin Bieber) - A song about supporting your country, really ?

And I believe there is a lot more !
--[[User:PhilipN|PhilipN]] 00:01, 5 January 2012 (EST)

::Speaking of "Pray", do you think MC Hammer's song of the same name could be included? It's a little self-indulgent, but it's mostly about hard work and giving thanks. I'll stick it in, but feel free to remove it if you disagree [[User:WilcoxD|WilcoxD]] 00:08, 5 January 2012 (EST)

:::Of course, this one looks to be about praying and working hard. --[[User:PhilipN|PhilipN]] 00:11, 5 January 2012 (EST)

::::Not Justin Bieber, lolol. I've removed a handful prior. Good work.--[[User:Jpatt|Jpatt]] 00:13, 5 January 2012 (EST)

::::But in the very first example above, the phrase "to secure peace is to prepare for war" is [[conservative]] -- it wouldn't surprise me if Reagan said something similar.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 00:17, 5 January 2012 (EST)

:::::I am not sure but it does not seem really conservative to me, I let you judge: [http://www.lyricsfreak.com/m/metallica/dont+tread+on+me_20092086.html] --[[User:PhilipN|PhilipN]] 00:20, 5 January 2012 (EST)

::::::As to your second example, the politics of the band itself is often irrelevant, as I've had to say repeatedly here. Liberals are capable of saying conservative things, and there are circumstances when a liberal may be in the best position to criticize something about other liberals.

::::::Sometime you might listen carefully to the lyrics of Elton John's ''Goodbye Yellow Brick Road''.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 00:26, 5 January 2012 (EST)

:::::::I think the same is often true for conservatives as well. It is why Reagan was in such a good position to raise taxes for instance. [[User:SammyP|SammyP]] 00:43, 5 January 2012 (EST)

::::::::Hardly. Reagan cut tax rates more than anyone else in his position.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 00:46, 5 January 2012 (EST)

:::::::::[http://money.cnn.com/2010/09/08/news/economy/reagan_years_taxes/index.htm This article] has a good description of taxes under Reagan. In short, when Reagan entered office he enacted a large tax cut, but the deficit grew too large and he had to enact the largest ever peace time tax increase. It would have been easy for a liberal to cut taxes like Reagan did, but as you pointed out above, someone of the opposite party might have had difficulty in enacted the tax increases he pushed through. [[User:SammyP|SammyP]] 00:59, 5 January 2012 (EST)

::::::::::The article obscures rather than illuminates. Reagan's tax-cutting record is far better than any other modern president, despite inheriting an awful economic climate.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 01:14, 5 January 2012 (EST)

:::::::::::I'm sorry I'm unsure how this assertion squares with the fact. Could you explain what you mean given the changes in tax policy that occurred during the Reagan presidency. [[User:SammyP|SammyP]] 01:23, 5 January 2012 (EST)

Talk:Essay:Greatest Conservative Songs

2012-01-05T05:59:28Z

SammyP: /* This page is full of parodies ! */

Talk:Essay:Greatest Conservative Songs

2012-01-05T05:59:02Z

SammyP: /* This page is full of parodies ! */

See [http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=NzZkNDU5MmViNzVjNzkzMDE3NzNlN2MyZjRjYTk4YjE= this]. [[User:Stryker|Stryker]] 10:04, 17 July 2007 (EDT)

: The [[neoconservative]] ''National Review'' list is 95% garbage, not [[conservative]] at all. I only found one tune on the list that should be added ours ("Stand by your man"), and National Review had it at #50.

: The contrast here with ''National Review'' illustrates the need for ''Conservapedia''. But thanks for your link.--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 11:31, 17 July 2007 (EDT)

Oops... it seems that I added a bunch of songs from that list. Several of mine (Brick, Red Barchetta, I Can't Drive 55, Sweet Home Alabama, and Revolution 1) were on there. That's interesting, though... the NR person and I thought alike on this one. [[User:DanH|DanH]] 17:16, 17 July 2007 (EDT)

Sweet Home Alabama? I love that song (and I'm a liberal)! Revolution's great, too.--[[User:Autofire|Autofire]] 18:29, 17 July 2007 (EDT)

Sorry? Why was my entry for The Fall's Pseud Mag Ed removed? They have always been the great deflators of liberal complacency. What is going on?

: Post a link to the lyrics of the song here and we'll see. Also, please sign your entries by using the signature button in the row above the edit box. Thanks.--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 11:16, 18 July 2007 (EDT)

Can a song possibly be just a song, rather than a political statement? - BornAgainBrit

: Uh, sure, there are songs that lack any meaning at all. "I wanna hold your hand," for example, is a pleasant jingle from your homeland. I trust we'd agree that it is not the most meaningful song in the world. That tune is fun for reminiscing.

: But surely you don't deny that many songs do have political meaning. [[Liberal]] attempts to deny political bias are familiar to us and no one here is fooled. Godspeed.--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 13:37, 18 July 2007 (EDT)

The deletion of Bob Dylan's song was not properly explained. Observing that people serve either the devil or the Lord is a conservative observation, and of course Bob Dylan was a born-again Christian who expressed his faith in song (but don't expect [[liberals]] to tell you that).--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 00:03, 21 July 2007 (EDT)

:I didn't mean to step on any toes, but apathy towards devil worship doesn't seem to me like a very conservative trait. Unfortunately, the verses of the songs don't give us ''any'' meaning whatsoever, so the only meaning we can glean from the song are the four lines of the chorus, three of which are essentially the same :/ [[User:Jazzman831|Jazzman831]] 14:06, 21 July 2007 (EDT)

::Paradise by the Dashboard light? I know its a song about having pre-marital sex, but the end is about how it screwed up his life.--[[User:Elamdri|Elamdri]] 04:45, 23 July 2007 (EDT)

After reading this list, I've gotta ask, just how do you define a 'conservative' song?--[[User:Offeep|Offeep]] 15:27, 26 July 2007 (EDT)

: [[Conservative]] is a term that is well-understood. A "conservative song" reflects some of those values without diluting them with a [[liberal]] message.--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 15:42, 26 July 2007 (EDT)

I can't believe Okie from Muskogie isn't on here. [[User:Maestro|Maestro]] 23:23, 27 July 2007 (EDT)

I know this is being nitpicky, but I don't like the message of Last Kiss because it seems to suggest a works salvation, that one gets to heaven by doing good rather than accepting Jesus. [[User:DanH|DanH]] 23:30, 27 July 2007 (EDT)

:... and on that note, let's open up a can of [[Mountain Dew]] and get ready to [[Debate:Are we saved by faith or works?]] --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 17:16, 3 August 2007 (EDT)

==Last Kiss==
Somebody just put up "Last Kiss;" actually I recall when it was a hit circa 1964 many adults, parents, teachers and ministers where horrified that a song about death was considered appropriate for young people. My my, how things had changed by 1967.... [[User:RobS|RobS]] 18:08, 28 July 2007 (EDT)

Just like 'Teen Angel,' 'Leader of the Pack,' 'Dead Man's Curve,' and 'Tell Laura I Love Her.' [[User:Maestro|Maestro]] 00:35, 29 July 2007 (EDT)

==Possible Addition==

Ok, I have a suggestion, but I want some feedback before putting it on the page. I was listening to the radio today, and Another Brick in the Wall by Pink Floyd came on. I was thinking that the song talks about the way that public schools brainwash children and turn them into "bricks" in the wall that is liberal society. In a way, the song is pro-homeschooling, because it's teachers that need to leave the kids alone so that parents can instruct their children correctly. Maybe I'm reaching a bit here, but I wanted to see what you all thought. [[User:SSchultz|SSchultz]] 00:23, 2 August 2007 (EDT)

: I'm open to comments and suggestions about this, but I've never viewed the famous song "another brick in the wall" as conservative. You may be right that the song properly complains about the effect of schooling, but the song doesn't offer any conservative solution that I can see.--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 01:10, 2 August 2007 (EDT)

::"Another Brick In The Wall" is more of a neutral song. Its part of a concept album in which the main character slowly seperates himself from society. Most Pink Floyd songs are about madness, due to their original lead singer going insane. [[User:TobyKeet|TobyKeet]] 05:32, 24 November 2010 (EST)

==Love Me, I'm a Liberal==

:I'm glad the commies were thrown out
:Of the A.F.L. C.I.O. board

Hardly sounds like a Communist critique. Have you read all the lyrics of the song? [http://web.cecs.pdx.edu/~trent/ochs/lyrics/liberal.html] It's twitting liberals for their supposed concern for others, which is actually sorely lacking. --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 17:14, 3 August 2007 (EDT)

:That song is pure sarcasm and Ochs assumes the role of a 1960s-era (Cold War era) "liberal" to attack them from the extreme left in a sarcastic way. Read the lyrics again, he is attacking the AFL-CIO for throwing out the commies. He is saying liberals aren't far left ''enough''. It's not a conservative song, it's an extreme leftist one. [[User:Parrothead|Parrothead]] 17:22, 3 August 2007 (EDT)

So there's a song on this list about breaking the law 'I can't Drive 55,' and one about obeying the law 'I fought the law.' Which is the conservative value? And the Bobby Fuller Four's version of the latter was the superior version, BTW. [[User:Maestro|Maestro]] 10:40, 10 September 2007 (EDT)
I hope I did not misunderstand. Do these songs have to be OK'd before posting?

There are several on this list that really do not belong on a Conservative music list. Really, REO Keep on loving you?
I got the message and now know I should not add foot notes regarding my thoughts on songs I don't believe belong.
I have been sharing Conservapedia with many of my Conservative FB friends. Many on't know about it.
Several have said the list was not really Conservative.
I know some popular, Conservative musicians and they write nothing but Conservative music.
I hope it was OK that I added some educational songs to the list.
I love Conservapedia! Wikipedia is so liberal. When you read about Van Jones there, he's a great guy!
Thank God for Conservapedia.

== Are these truly conservative? ==

While I understand completely some of these songs being on here, I don't really understand the why Bob Dylan, The Beatles, or Ben Folds (Five) would be on this list. These individual songs may be able to be warped into our mindset, but if one truly looks at these, they become overwhelmingly liberal.

For example: The Beatles - Revolution
While this song does indeed talk about how "Carrying pictures of Chairman Mao" will do no good, it also talks about how war and money can't solve problems. In addition, if a child is to read tis and decide to find out more about The Beatles, they will undoubtedly find some intensely liberal themes. The same idea goes for Bob Dylan. Look at any of his other songs. At the same time, Ben Folds does exactly the same thing.

I cannot argue with the songs and parts on this list, but I wonder if this is a slippery slope?
::It's possible that many of these songs were adopted by conservatives, such as Mike Huckabee playing John Cougar Mellencamp's hits. [[User:Karajou|Karajou]] 14:48, 18 February 2008 (EST)

: Many of the songs here have a powerful [[conservative]] message, and demonstrate that the music industry does not have to be [[liberal]].--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 15:00, 18 February 2008 (EST)

: P.S. [[Liberals]] do say [[conservative]] things from time to time. We're listing songs here, not artists.--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 15:01, 18 February 2008 (EST)

I would just like add that Revolution 1 was written as a reaction against the protesters against the Vietnam War who were getting violent. All Revolution is saying is for the protesters to protest, but not violently, which is still liberal, but a message than other liberal songs. However, for other Beatles songs, they range from being liberal (Why Don't We Do It in the Road?) to be being kind of conservative (Let It Be). Most however, are pretty much neutral. You usually kind Paul McCartney as being more concervative, and Lennon as liberal. [[User:TobyKeet|TobyKeet]] 05:28, 24 November 2010 (EST)

:One problem with the above analysis: Why Don't We Do It In the Road was McCartney's; Lennon was rather famously not involved at all. Personally I've always thought of it as a kind of parody of the free love movement, though apparently that wasn't McCartney's intention. [[User:Ptorquemada|Ptorquemada]] 17:25, 4 April 2011 (EDT)

== In Your Eyes ==

Okay, the song can be considered to be about God, but that alone does not make it conservative. I think Peter Gabriel himself would object to the song's inclusion in this list. --[[User:MakeTomorrow|MakeTomorrow]] 15:23, 18 February 2008 (EST)

: Peter Gabriel can object all he likes. "In Your Eyes" appeals to conservative values, as in "a thousand churches." Do you think we should object when a liberal says something conservative???--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 15:27, 18 February 2008 (EST)
::Religion is not conservative. Fundamentalism is, but not religion. The presence of religion in a song does not make it conservative, even as adherence to religion does not make a person conservative. Look at me, I'm a Christian, but I'm also a communist. Obviously the two are not mutually exclusive. One's personal merely interpersonally-social morals under religion might be more "conservative", in the loosest sense of the term — not conservative, simply somewhat more so — than they would be otherwise; however, that does not automatically make one politically conservative.--[[User:MakeTomorrow|MakeTomorrow]] 15:50, 18 February 2008 (EST)

::: The single best predictor of how conservative someone votes is how often he attends a place of worship of God. Your argument suggesting that you are a counterexample to that correlation means nothing. See point #2 in [[liberal logic]].--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 16:04, 18 February 2008 (EST)

::::That wasn't irrelevant at all. Correlation != causation. --[[User:MakeTomorrow|MakeTomorrow]] 16:08, 18 February 2008 (EST)
::::Sorry, my edit summary should have been "basic statistical interpretation". --[[User:MakeTomorrow|MakeTomorrow]] 16:09, 18 February 2008 (EST)

::::: Why did you cite your counterexample, if it wasn't an example of the logical fallacy #2 in [[liberal logic]]? Do you really think a counterexample disproves causation?

==Land of Confusion==
Does Genesis' ''Land of Confusion'' belong on the list? I remember the music video portraying Ronald Reagan (in puppet form) as inept, and it parodies several conservative leaders, including Margaret Thatcher, et. al. [[User:WesleyS|WesleyS]][[User Talk:WesleyS|Hello!]] 13:58, 5 March 2009 (EST)

: It's liberal lyric of "too many people" is enough reason to bounce it from the list. Thanks for catching this.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 18:53, 5 March 2009 (EST)

==Should Fortunate Son really be on this list?==

It's vehemently anti-war. Please correct if I'm wrong, but I don't think that's a very conservative belief. [[User:JRobbe|JRobbe]]

:I just looked the lyrics. Pretty confused stuff. I'd agree it's not conservative. Would you like to toss it from the list? Please feel free to do so.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 20:26, 7 January 2010 (EST)

:Done. [[User:JRobbe|JRobbe]]

== Long Black Train by Josh Turner? ==

To me, this song seems like a good candidate for this list. --[[User:Dfrischknecht|Dfrischknecht]] 07:14, 22 July 2010 (EDT)

== The Decision by Ricky Van Shelton ==

I think this is another good candidate for this list. It's a song about a teenage girl who gives in to peer pressure and gets pregnant and the consequences of that action. --[[User:Dfrischknecht|Dfrischknecht]] 09:02, 22 July 2010 (EDT)

== New Agey ==

I removed the new agey phrase of "the cycle of life, death and rebirth," for the "Lightning Crashes," by Live, but feel free to discuss here.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 15:23, 22 September 2010 (EDT)

: That wasn't meant to seem "new agey" in the least, but I do understand what you're saying. The song presents a view of life as being cyclical, as the baby is being born an old woman dies, and "The confusion that was hers belongs now to the baby down the hall." I think the lyrics really speak to the significance of life (not just at childbirth), but as a whole. I don't think the song is necessarily about the old woman being reincarnated as the newborn child, but it definitely seems to speak of the circle of life.[[User:JaneX|JaneX]] 15:56, 22 September 2010 (EDT)

:: Perhaps a rewording would work then? How about replacing "the cycle of life, death and rebirth" with "the joy of childbirth in contrast with the end of life"?--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 18:59, 22 September 2010 (EDT)

::: I agree that a rewording would work, thank you for working with me. Perhaps we could just say that the song celebrates the significance of life from birth until death, almost in an as one door closes another opens kind of way? [[User:JaneX|JaneX]] 20:00, 22 September 2010 (EDT)

== Song idea ==

"One Man, One Woman" sung by ABBA. Indirectly a tribute to traditional marriage and monogamy.--[[User:TedM|TedM]] 12:14, 12 January 2011 (EST)

: Sounds good by the title, so how about adding it where you think it would be appropriate in the list? Thanks for your insight.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 12:17, 12 January 2011 (EST)

== Takin' Care of Business ==

This song by BTO is on the list for supporting "Hard work ethic", but its not. The refrain is jokingly ironic. "I love to work at nothing all day; and I've been taking care of business"

The body of the song describes a more easy going life just making music rather than waking up early, catching trains for work, etc.

I'm not saying it makes the song liberal, and not sure why its even necessary to classify songs along political lines, but it sure as heck ain't about working hard.
I'd suggest if someone wants to keep it here because its a good song, and if people can only enjoy it because it conforms to their political views, than change the reason to "Mike Huckabee performed the song" [comment by AndrewJackson]

:You left out how the song praises the self-employed, which is a very conservative, hard-working group of people.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:55, 21 March 2011 (EDT)

::Fair enough, but the praise you speak of is "If you ever get annoyed [with, based on earlier lyrics, either your traditional job or the unpleasant commute involved], look at me, I'm self-employed; I love to work at nothing all day." That could be taken as either "I made so much money as an entepreneur that I no longer need to work" or "My official job title is 'Bum'." Neither one of them really expresses admiration for "hard work" in its own right, though the former is certainly a more positive role model than the latter. I do ''like'' the song, but I'm not entirely sanguine about considering it "conservative." [[User:Ptorquemada|Ptorquemada]] 17:36, 4 April 2011 (EDT)

== Adonai My Lord ==

I'm going to delete this song from the list, as it is from the atheistic industrial metal genre. The lyrics reflect a sort of militant Christianity that does not reflect well on the religion as a whole. For example, this group has a song called "Christf---"...obviously they are not conservative. [[User:DennyW66|DennyW66]] 01:14, 23 March 2011 (EDT)

==No U2?==

Surely -- despite the band's liberal leanings -- one of U2's unashamedly Christian songs should make it in. Gloria seems the obvious choice. The chorus, you may remember, goes: "Gloria, in te domine/ Gloria, exultate/ Gloria, Gloria/ Oh Lord, loosen my lips." --[[User:Jdixon|Jdixon]] 12:34, 28 March 2011 (EDT)
:Agreed. Gloria is definitely a good choice. Perhaps "40"; its lyrics are directly lifted from Psalm 40. [[User:DennyW66|DennyW66]] 12:43, 28 March 2011 (EDT)
::You're kidding right? [http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/world-news/us-election/u2-honoured-to-be-involved-with-obama-celebrations-14145757.html Conservative indeed..] [[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 22:06, 28 March 2011 (EDT)
:::Bono has had a relationship with every President since Clinton; for instance, he worked with Bush on issues relating to Africa and AIDS awareness. The band is very Christian and in no way ashamed of their Christianity. And, rare for rock stars, three of the four members of the band are married family men. They are known for their charitableness and philanthropy, which are of course [[conservative]] traits. Without a doubt, U2 is a conservative, Christian band and they should have representation on this list. [[User:DennyW66|DennyW66]] 22:21, 28 March 2011 (EDT)

::::''Gloria'''s a good choice, please add it if you agree. But U2 became increasingly liberal the more media attention it obtained.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 10:07, 29 March 2011 (EDT)

:::::Maybe it's possible to be Christian and pro-family, and yet left-leaning politically. Anyway, I vote for "Beautiful Day" ... The heart is a bloom / Shoots up through the stony ground / But there's no room / No space to rent in this town

:::::Reminds me of how inhospitable this fallen world can be to the spirits of believers trying to lead a godly life in the midst of a secular world which often seems to be ruled by the devil (John 12:31). Yet God's love is there, like sunshine! --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 14:53, 29 March 2011 (EDT)

== Brothers in Arms - Dure Straits ==

I would like to suggest Brothers in Arms by Dire Straits. It's about war and having ones "brother's in arms" in support. [[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 17:32, 4 April 2011 (EDT)
:If there is no argument to it's inclusion I'll add it soon. Let me know your thoughts though...[[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 17:42, 5 April 2011 (EDT)

== YMCA? ==

I'd always heard that the Village People's YMCA was about [[homosexual]] men seducing other men? That doesn't sound very [[conservative]] to me. Is this just a rumor? --[[User:JustinD|JustinD]] 12:45, 12 May 2011 (EDT)
:This was obviously added as a joke, and no one else seems to have realized it! [[User:TriciaS|TriciaS]] 12:25, 18 June 2011 (EDT)

::Nope - the song is a legitimate tribute to the Young Men's Christian Association.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 13:19, 18 June 2011 (EDT)
:::Right. And Antony came to bury Caesar, not to praise him. "It's fun to stay at the Y-M-C-A. / They have everything that you need to enjoy, / You can hang out with all the boys..." [[User:TriciaS|TriciaS]] 13:32, 18 June 2011 (EDT)
::::It was probably written about more savory activities at the Y but later became identified as a gay anthem. I don't think it's a "conservative song" if it's overwhelmingly associated with homosexuality. [[User:NKeaton|Nate]] 13:43, 18 June 2011 (EDT)

:::::The song is a good faith tribute and attempts to redefine it are not factual.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 15:10, 18 June 2011 (EDT)

:::::: Does anyone have any solid sources one way or the other as to what this song means? I tried some brief googling, but didn't turn up anything at all trustworthy. --[[User:JustinD|JustinD]] 22:35, 28 June 2011 (EDT)

::::::: The band leader said it was a legitimate tribute to the Young Men's Christian Association, and we respect original meaning at ''Conservapedia''.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:40, 28 June 2011 (EDT)

::::::::Awesome. Do you have a source for that I can add?--[[User:JustinD|JustinD]] 21:28, 29 June 2011 (EDT)

== Really? Have You Looked Into These Songs? ==

I'd just like to say that I think it's really jacked that you're going around and trying to SAY what these songs mean. For example, Metallica is NOT a conservative band. James Hetfield was a heavy drinker until he went to rehab, Kirk Hammett suffered from drug addiction during his teen years, and if you listen to any other song you hear that they are NOT a conservative band.

Furthermore, Journey is NOT a conservative band. Steve Perry openly voted for Obama in 2008. --[[User:Beanna|Beanna]] 20:04, 24 May 2011 (EDT)

: This isn't a list of conservative bands. It's a list of conservative ''songs''. Even liberals are capable of occasionally singing a conservative song.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 21:19, 24 May 2011 (EDT)

== An idea... ==

I was looking at this list and realised that most of the songs listed here are big hit numbers. I was thinking that it might be interesting to look at whether the more conservative a song is the better it does on the charts. Even though the artist might be liberal it seems there bigger hits are in fact conservative songs! Maybe by charting something like this we could prove that people respond better to the conservative message and perhaps change the minds of some liberal singers. Just an idea. [[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 20:31, 27 May 2011 (EDT)
:We could add the respective chart ranking to this page and then collate the results by rank and date. Perhaps, like the conservative words, we might even see the same pattern repeated here! [[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 20:48, 27 May 2011 (EDT)

::Great idea!--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:01, 27 May 2011 (EDT)
:::It'll be a big project though so it'll be awhile for me to collate the results but I fear that we'll find that the majority of new hits are liberal in nature (particulalry coming from M&M and Usher etc) but I think that is because of the "hollywood" influence. Interestingly artists distanced from "fame" have better messages and ''still'' produce amazing hits. [[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 23:11, 27 May 2011 (EDT)

== From a youngin' ==

Citizen/Soldier by 3 Doors Down. I don't know about the band themselves, but any song that supports the National Guard should be listed here, in my honest option. If no one minds, I'll add it.

== Wish you were here ==

This is a good list of songs, but as far as I know, ''Wish you were here'' (the title track, along with the entire eponymous album) was not dedicated to a conservative president, but rather to ex-Pink Floyd member Syd Barrett. --[[User:LeonardO|Leo-from-UK]] 19:19, 16 June 2011 (EDT)

: I agree that this needs a citation, given that it is so contrary to the conventional story. I've looked for one, but every indication points to it being inspired by Syd Barrett, not a conservative leader (indeed; one would think, Pink Floyd being made up of Englishmen, that it would be a conservative PM, not President.). --[[User:Monty]]

== Two song suggestions ==

Hallowed Be Thy Name - Iron Maiden

1) Like Welcome to the Family, it's about death row, but not anti-death penalty.

2) Multiple references to an afterlife. "Tears they flow but why am I crying?/After all I am not afraid of dying/Don't I believe that there never is an end?" and later in the song: Mark my words believe my soul lives on/Don't worry now that I have gone/I've gone beyond to seek the truth".

3) The very title of the song is derived from the Lord's Prayer, which is also implied to be the protagonist (in the song)'s final words.

Declaration Day - Iced Earth

The whole thing is about the American war for independence, so it's probably a good choice for the list.

I'll add them for the time being, but if most of you think they don't go, I'll take them down.

: Thanks for suggesting them, but I don't see much that is conservative in your first suggestion other than acceptance of an afterlife (or judgment). That's an important message, but some of the religious references seem to be simply an attempt to give the song gravitas. Perhaps others have some insights about this.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 22:54, 15 July 2011 (EDT)

::Perhaps it's time to branch out and create a category or essay on "Songs of interest to conservatives" or [[Songs that Conservatives like]].

::I like a lot of songs, even if I would be hard pressed to say why they are "conservative songs". Not every song or book or movie I like is [[Conservative]], and I think it's important to be broad-minded enough not to condemn everything that isn't 100% in line with my beliefs and values.

::In fact, I go even further and say that one of the main differences between liberals and conservatives is that liberals are supremely narrow-minded. All the talk about "tolerance" is a one way street with them. They want us to tolerate their radical notions, but they are ready at the drop of a hat to kick us out of their cushy little world any time we offer a different idea.

::You would never hear of a Bible-belt Christian walking up to a famous liberal author and kicking his wine glass over at a picnic, saying, "We don't allow liberals here." (see [[Glen Beck in NYC]]). --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 23:35, 15 July 2011 (EDT)

== I don't think Lola qualifies ==

IIRC, it ends with a complete lack of repentance -- "I'm glad I'm a man, and so is Lola". I don't think that this song qualifies as conservative if it celebrates that which we abhor.

:Our sister project, Wikipedia, says the song "details a romantic encounter between a young man and a transvestite" (hardly a conservative theme). --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 12:09, 25 July 2011 (EDT)

== Overhaul the "Greatest Conservative Songs" ==

I think this is something that needs to happen before this Essay begins to get out of control. GCSs Essay needs to reorganized into some sort of categorical order—be it alphabetical or otherwise—in order to clean up the Essay and to provide clarity to avoid double posting. I will be happy to categorize it alphabetically by either the artist or song. -- [[User:Austenbosten|Austenbosten]] 13:00, 26 July 2011 (EDT)
:I've just rewritten most of the page. Everything is nearly exactly the same, except for a small amount of rephrasing to keep things grammatically correct. I've added peak chart position for every song, but in the interest of making that data comparable, I've limited it to US chart positions. There are some songs (like Brothers In Arms) which charted well in other countries, but didn't chart at all in the US. I eliminated two duplicate entries - Ballad of the Green Berets, and God's Gonna Cut You Down. Enjoy. [[user:CGoodwin|CGoodwin]]
::Good work CGoodwin. Maybe we can have the same revision for [[Essay:Greatest Conservative Movies]]. [[User:KBarnett|KBarnett]] 15:47, 29 July 2011 (EDT)

:::CGoodwin, your tabular format and ranking information is interesting. Well done. But surely ''Amazing Grace'' has been more popular than just about every other song on the list. How should the table reflect that?--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 20:05, 29 July 2011 (EDT)
::::Billboard popularity only measures against how everything else is selling at the same time. If an song sold 100 copies a week for 20 years, it would never crack the charts. The other thing is that there are over 3000 recorded versions of the song. The highest charting individual version I've found is Elvis's, which reached #79. If you want to reflect a broader historical sense of popularity, I'd suggest doing a personal ranking. [[user:CGoodwin|CGoodwin]]

:::::Great Job CGoodwin! Very clean and will definatly help those looking to post songs to check to see if they are or are not already posted. -- [[User:Austenbosten|Austenbosten]] 16:32, 30 July 2011 (EDT)

== Particle man? Really? ==

I think someone must be sabotaging this page. I fail to see how "Particle man" qualifies as an allegory, rather than fun wordplay around a tune not entirely unlike the Spiderman theme song.

:I have to agree on this one, I looked up what people think is the meaning, and seems its more likely an atheist song then a conservative one. [[User:KenN|KenN]]

== No Johnny Cash? ==

Have there really been no suggestions for Johnny Cash songs here? So many of his works discuss the importance of faith, of accepting Jesus, or praise the values of small town country life over the extravagant lifestyles many liberals seem to push for.--[[User:MorrisF|MorrisF]] 12:54, 18 August 2011 (EDT)
::I put in a traditional song and gave the Johnny Cash version: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IStlBOX9F4o [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 20:24, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
:::I think Man in Black should make the list as well.--[[User:JamesWilson|JamesWilson]] 20:43, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
::::You could make a good argument for a good percentage of his work. I added Country Trash, mostly because it's a fun favorite of mine, and I'm sure a bunch more of his would fit too.--[[User:MorrisF|MorrisF]] 00:40, 1 September 2011 (EDT)

==YMCA==
"YMCA", "In the Navy", "San Francisco", and "Macho Man" are NOT conservative songs. They're celebrations of the gay lifestyle. They never did any conservative songs. Have you actually listened to the words
:This point has already been discussed above. Also, please sign your posts. [[User:Jcw|Jcw]] 21:12, 19 August 2011 (EDT)
::Sorry, this is my first post here. Seem to have omitted a heading as well. [[User:Nealstar|Nealstar]] 19:22, 19 August 2011 (MST)

== Tenacious D ==

I would like to put Tribute by Tenacious D forward. I know it's a comedy single, but it's also a very popular song about overcoming Satan and alludes to many other Christian themes such as heaven and hell.[[User:GMilhouse|GMilhouse]] 14:00, 28 August 2011 (BST)

== Deep sixed YMCA by Village People, keep it buried ==

These are not conservative lyrics in the song YMCA: "You can get yourself clean, you can have a good meal, '''You can do whatever you feel'''" [http://www.sing365.com/music/lyric.nsf/y-m-c-a-lyrics-village-people/33e3d31bddce747748256df20009b2a5] This is not a conservative video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CS9OO0S5w2k

I think a lot of the songs listed should be scrapped. This was the most egregious case. For example, how conservative are songs written by long haired guy rockers or homosexual rockers? Shouldn't the authors of the songs have any bearing? [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 20:19, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
:I withhold judgment on how conservative the song is. As Andy said, further up this page '''"This isn't a list of conservative bands. It's a list of conservative songs. Even liberals are capable of occasionally singing a conservative song."''' [[user:CGoodwin|CGoodwin]]
::Andy did not realize the song had the verse: '''"You can do whatever you feel"''' [http://www.sing365.com/music/lyric.nsf/y-m-c-a-lyrics-village-people/33e3d31bddce747748256df20009b2a5] Definitely not conservative. And please tell me why you think this video is conservative: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CS9OO0S5w2k Again, not conservative. Staying buried - no resurrection here folks, move on. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] 22:16, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
:::So, a young man getting in touch with his emotions, crying because he's down in the world, and being hugged by another sympathetic boy is wrong? Duly noted. [[User:JonG|~ ]][[User_talk:JonG|JonG]][[Special:Contributions/JonG| ~]] 22:17, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
::::Why don't we wait until Andy has commented as he wanted to keep it in and we should defer to him. [[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 22:21, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
:::::Does this mean we should go back and analyze ever music video too? In "Alive" by POD, the person is violating the law by not wearing a seatbealt.
:::::And for a song suggestion, "[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LsWr6mHRqgI Hands Held High]" by Linkin Park. [[User:JonG|~ ]][[User_talk:JonG|JonG]][[Special:Contributions/JonG| ~]] 22:44, 31 August 2011 (EDT)
::::::Victor Willis, the ''heterosexual'' ex-lead singer of the Village People and writer of "Y.M.C.A." actually did intend the song to be a legitimate tribute to the Young Men's Christian Association, according to an interview from [http://www.ctv.ca/CTVNews/Entertainment/20070802/village_people_070802/ this article]. He "never intended the homosexual innuendo that many fans read into the song," and really the only thing gay about the video posted by User:Conservative is the fact that some of the people in it actually are gay. Did you know that Victor Willis left the band because he was frustrated with the flamboyancy of some of his gay band-mates and with the band's gay image? --[[User:Toadaron|AaronT]] 19:01, 1 September 2011 (EDT)

:::::::Your comment is misleading and (perhaps deliberately) ignores the writer's well-known liking for double entendre; the reference in the group's name ("Village People") the gay lifestyle of [[Greenwich Village]], and that (as even Wikipedia concedes) the group was "Originally created to target disco's gay audience". [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Village_People]

:::::::I think you need to find another project to join. You're not helping us provide trustworthy information. --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 14:07, 10 September 2011 (EDT)

== ''This Land Is Your Land'' (Woody Guthrie) ==

The removal makes sense. The song seems to be an ode against private property.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 00:19, 10 September 2011 (EDT)

:It's hard to say. Guthrie took the side of the laboring man against the (perceived) indifference of the wealthy, at a time when unions had only recently appeared on the scene to provide [[collective bargaining]] power and relieve the masses from exploitation on the heels of the Industrial Revolution. But the line, "This land was made for you and me" could refer either to the [[abolition of private property]] (as advocated by [[Karl Marx]] and the [[Communists]]), or to God's bountiful blessing upon the settlers of the [[New World]].

:Like all great art, this song contains some ambiguity and requires the listener's interpretation. Like "Consider Yourself" (from [[Oliver!]]), there's a mixture of idealistic brotherhood with hint of the sort of knavery we associate with [[Robin Hood]]. --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 13:58, 10 September 2011 (EDT)
::There is an alternate version that's something like "''This land is my land, '''it isn't your land''''' involving guns and shooting trespassers.--[[User:CamilleT|CamilleT]] 14:59, 20 September 2011 (EDT)

:::"An" alternate version? There are dozens of extra verses beyond the 3 we use at Bible camp. --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 22:39, 20 September 2011 (EDT)
::::I had a friend that used to sing it. I thought it relevant to the discussion. But you're right, a catchy tune is a catchy tune--[[User:CamilleT|CamilleT]] 02:43, 21 September 2011 (EDT)

== "Jerusalem" ==

: I don't think that Jerusalem is a conservative song. We were taught at school that it was a call to arms against industrialization and hence is it is also anti-capitalist, also I don't think that any song Billy Bragg has recorded can be called conservative.--14:20, 20 September 2011 (EDT)[[User:Jloveday|Jloveday]]

== You have got to be kidding me ==

Seven Nation Army is not about conservatives and if you knew anything about The White Stripes you would know that they are NOT conservative in the least (I believe Jack White had his wedding conducted by a shaman). Also, in the description of Sympathy for the Devil, I've yet to meet a perfect person, so I would remove that part of the description. Finally, Wouldn't It Be Nice isn't about marriage, it's just about idyllic teenage love, marriage is just incidental. [[User:GiveMeLiberty|GiveMeLiberty]] 09:21, 3 October 2011 (EDT)

:Thanks for noticing the error. It may have been added by a liberal hoaxer. You removed other items such as Fox News contributions to Hussein Obama. I am curious as to why you wouldn't remove it? You've got to be kidding me skit is a little dramatic.--[[User:Jpatt|Jpatt]] 11:15, 3 October 2011 (EDT)
::I removed the items form FNC b/c I felt they were unimportant to the network in the grand scheme of things and didn't belong in the lead. And yeah, You have got to be kidding me is probably a bit dramatic. As for not editing, I though I couldn't edit, as it was unavailable to me when I posted here. [[User:GiveMeLiberty|GiveMeLiberty]] 18:25, 3 October 2011 (EDT)

== The River? ==

Bruce Springsteen's The River doesn't belong here, in my opinion. Springsteen is liberal and pro-union, and the only reference to unions in the song I could find is where the singer got a union card and a wedding coat. Naturally, pre-marital relations are a big part of the song, but the singer never explicitly (or really implicitly) regrets them.--[[User:JamesWilson|James Wilson]] 09:00, 22 October 2011 (EDT)

: Great points. Feel free to delete that song.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 11:18, 22 October 2011 (EDT)

== wish you were here ==
can someone explain how this song belongs here? I mean, yeah, its a great song, but it seems pretty...well it certainly doesn't even get close to implying that it is about wanting a conservative president....the lryics seem to be written about a romantic interest. I would advise removing it from the list
--[[User:AlexanderSz|AlexanderSz]] 17:04, 25 October 2011 (EDT)
:Yeah, that was added by a liberal troll. Thanks--[[User:Jpatt|Jpatt]] 17:14, 25 October 2011 (EDT)
:I believe the song was about their original band member Syd.--[[User:Jpatt|Jpatt]] 17:17, 25 October 2011 (EDT)

== Thank you for giving me another chance ==

I was briefly banned here for tampering. I really did not tamper
with anyone's entries.
I have not been here 24 hours yet.
However, I am going to be afraid to post now because I was so quickly banned.
I have nothing but the utmost respect for this site. I am so sick of Wikipedia and it's liberal bias.
I often come here when I look up something there and realize I am just reading spin.

I do have a couple of concerns with this song list.
I realize we have more important things to be concerned with right now.
Truth is, a famous musician asked me not to post his song on the list because
of the liberal activists on the list.

I do not want to step on anyone's toes.
I like Pearl Jam and Tracy Chapman too; I bought their albums.
Both are liberal activists and both have raised money for Obama.
Can a song truly be Conservative if the artists are liberal activists?

Pearl Jam even wrote a bad song for Obama. [http://www.starpulse.com/news/index.php/2008/02/06/pearl_jam_tape_song_for_barack_obama Obama Song]
They have even performed at rallies to raise money for him. [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RD2xQmB0GQA Obama Rally]

Tracy Chapman has also raised money for liberal causes, but not specifically for Barack Obama.
Her song, "Fast Car" is about a woman who lives in the ghetto, falls in love with an alcoholic, dreams of changing him and realizes she cannot. She leaves him.
I am not convinced that is a Conservative song.
I am not concerned with the liberal artists on the list...just the liberal activists.
They raise money to fight against the Conservative cause.

Liberal musicians have saturated the market for decades. Many songs are written to indoctrinate our youth. Conservative artists are not easily accepted
by the mainstream industry. There is liberal peer pressure. And if a song is pro-Conservative, forget it.

Just my opinion.
Please contact me with any concerns. I love this site and want to be part of it.
I am working on more serious entries, but I have to get the feel of the way the site works.
I would appreciate a warning before you block me. I will eagerly correct anything in order to stay here.
I was so hurt when I was blocked.

Thanks for reading.
SusanF

== re: Organizing the list ==

I would be happy to volunteer to alphabetize the list.
I think putting the songs in categories would be difficult because some songs
can belong in more than one category.

I don't want to do anything like that without permission from administrators.
I would be happy to do it though. It's confusing the way it is.

:You're welcome to organize it as you think best ... as long as its conciseness, most-important-songs-first presentation is not diluted. The Wikipedia-style of up-front tables of contents and sometimes obscure-information-first is disfavored here.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 13:22, 27 November 2011 (EST)

I was just going to put all of it in alphabetical order. I am not familiar with Wiki-style as I never spend much time on there.
I get annoyed at the liberal bias.
I better bow out of this project because what is "most important" to some will not be for others.
I thought having the songs in alphabetical order would make them easy to locate.

:Improvements are welcome, but I doubt alphabetizing the list, so that obscure titles end up near the top, would improve it. When visitors look at the page, they'd probably like to see some popular songs first.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 23:35, 27 November 2011 (EST)

:I decided I would take on the task of organizing the list. I will categorize the songs, separate them and put them in alphabetical order per category.
Does that sound alright with everyone?
I will not remove any songs.
If there is something you do not like, tell me. Please just don't block me without telling me to change something back.
This is going to take some time. "Most important songs" is a matter of opinion so I have to try to figure out what is "most important" to Conservapedia.
Thank you [[User:SusanF|Susan F.]] 23:55, 27 November 2011 (EST)

:Categorizing sounds like a good idea. Let me know if you need help. --[[User:Ed Poor|Ed Poor]] [[User talk:Ed Poor|Talk]] 00:05, 28 November 2011 (EST)

:Thank you. I am sure I will take you up on that offer of help.
[[User:SusanF|Susan F.]] 00:24, 28 November 2011 (EST)

== Karajou let me know... ==

That I need to supply an article when I post a song and an artist.
I did not know that.
I am working on that right now.

It's odd that I cannot reply to messages I get.
I wanted to contact Karajou myself, but I could not find a way to do that.
I consider myself computer savvy, but this site is a little confusing.

Thanks.

== Please be patient ==

I've spent a lot of time categorizing the songs, careful not to step on anyone's toes.
I am not finished yet. I am working the on the "Spiritual" section and more.

==This page is full of parodies !==
I remove the following, feel free to contest my decisions
*Don't Tread On Me (Metallica) - Absolutely nothing to do with Conservative (or maybe: ''To secure peace is to prepare for war'' ??)
*Hypnotize (System of a Down ) - You must be kidding here, SOAD is one of the most left-winged band in the US. And Hypnotize say nothing about liberals !
*Walking Contradiction / Warning / Boulevard of Broken Dreams (Green Day) - Mostly anti-Bush (good job, vandals !)
*When We Stand Together (Nickelback) - How is it Conservative ?
*A Better Tomorrow (Wu-Tang Clan) - Fail to see any conservative value here.
*The Beautiful People (Marylin Manson) - OMG, is Marylin Manson a conservative symbol now ? (''Hate every motherf*****'' + anti-capitalist)
*Me Against The World (Simple Plan) - If you accept this explanation, you might accept any song
*Pray (Justin Bieber) - A song about supporting your country, really ?

And I believe there is a lot more !
--[[User:PhilipN|PhilipN]] 00:01, 5 January 2012 (EST)

::Speaking of "Pray", do you think MC Hammer's song of the same name could be included? It's a little self-indulgent, but it's mostly about hard work and giving thanks. I'll stick it in, but feel free to remove it if you disagree [[User:WilcoxD|WilcoxD]] 00:08, 5 January 2012 (EST)

:::Of course, this one looks to be about praying and working hard. --[[User:PhilipN|PhilipN]] 00:11, 5 January 2012 (EST)

::::Not Justin Bieber, lolol. I've removed a handful prior. Good work.--[[User:Jpatt|Jpatt]] 00:13, 5 January 2012 (EST)

::::But in the very first example above, the phrase "to secure peace is to prepare for war" is [[conservative]] -- it wouldn't surprise me if Reagan said something similar.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 00:17, 5 January 2012 (EST)

:::::I am not sure but it does not seem really conservative to me, I let you judge: [http://www.lyricsfreak.com/m/metallica/dont+tread+on+me_20092086.html] --[[User:PhilipN|PhilipN]] 00:20, 5 January 2012 (EST)

::::::As to your second example, the politics of the band itself is often irrelevant, as I've had to say repeatedly here. Liberals are capable of saying conservative things, and there are circumstances when a liberal may be in the best position to criticize something about other liberals.

::::::Sometime you might listen carefully to the lyrics of Elton John's ''Goodbye Yellow Brick Road''.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 00:26, 5 January 2012 (EST)

:::::::I think the same is often true for conservatives as well. It is why Reagan was in such a good position to raise taxes for instance. [[User:SammyP|SammyP]] 00:43, 5 January 2012 (EST)

::::::::Hardly. Reagan cut tax rates more than anyone else in his position.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 00:46, 5 January 2012 (EST)

:::::::::[[http://money.cnn.com/2010/09/08/news/economy/reagan_years_taxes/index.htm This article]] has a good description of taxes under Reagan. In short, when Reagan entered office he enacted a large tax cut, but the deficit grew too large and he had to enact the largest ever peace time tax increase. It would have been easy for a liberal to cut taxes like Reagan did, but as you pointed out above, someone of the opposite party might have had difficulty in enacted the tax increases he pushed through. [[User:SammyP|SammyP]] 00:59, 5 January 2012 (EST)

Talk:Essay:Greatest Conservative Songs

2012-01-05T05:43:47Z

SammyP: /* This page is full of parodies ! */

Mitt Romney

2012-01-05T05:34:04Z

SammyP:

{{Officeholder
|name=Mitt Romney
|image=MittPortrait.jpg‎
|party=[[Republican]]
|spouse=[[Ann Romney]]
|religion=The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints
|offices=

{{Officeholder/governor
|state=Massachusetts
|terms=January 2, 2003 – January 4, 2007
|preceded=[[Jane Swift]]
|former=n
|succeeded=[[Deval Patrick]]
}}
}}

'''Willard Mitt Romney''' (born March 12, 1947), former Republican governor of Massachusetts and wealthy U.S. businessman, is best-known for his run as a serious contender during the [[2008 Presidential Election]]. He lost the nomination but if he had been elected, he would have become the first [[Mormon]] president. His father [[George Romney]], a governor of Michigan, was a candidate in the 1960s. On June 2nd, 2011, Romney announced that he would again run for the Republican nomination for the 2012 US Presidential election.<ref>http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/mitt-romney-announces-2012-presidential-bid/2011/06/02/AG05iJHH_story.html?hpid=z1</ref>

Before entering politics Romney was an established businessman in Boston, having served as CEO of Bain & Company, a management consulting firm. His political start began during the financially unsteady 2002 Winter Olympics. Romney became President and CEO of the Salt Lake Organizing Committee and quickly made the games a huge success. He gained popularity in Massachusetts, a state known for its tepid [[Republican]] support, and was elected governor in 2002. His record as governor demonstrated his financial skill, but often was at odds with the state's voters on social issues. He declined to run for reelection and announced his candidacy for President.

During his campaign for the Republican nomination in 2008, Romney was widely supported as a staunch conservative and ran on his business experience in the private sector. Romney fought a rough battle against Senator [[John McCain]] in Florida, Michigan, and other key states, but large losses on the Super Tuesday primaries ended his campaign. Romney dropped out of the race and endorsed Senator John McCain on February 14, 2008. His name was circulated as a potential running mate for McCain as their relationship improved.

Romeney is often described as an excellent conservative candidate that independents can also get around.

== Personal Life ==
[[Image:MittRomneyYouth05.jpg|thumb|Ann Lois Davies and Willard Mitt Romney]]
Romney is the scion of an old Mormon family. His grandparents were polygamists who fled the United States in the early 20th century when the Mormon Church repudiated polygamy; his father was born in Mexico. The Romneys returned to the U.S. in 1911 when a violent civil war broke out in Mexico.

Mitt Romney is a devout member of the Mormon Church (the Church of Jesus Christ and Latter-Day Saints) and spent time during his youth converting Catholics and Agnostics to Mormonism in France. In fact, his time as a student and missionary helped defer him from military service during the Vietnam draft,<ref>Michael Kranish, "The Making of Mitt Romney: Mormon church obtained Vietnam draft deferrals for Romney, other missionaries" June 24, 2007. The Boston Globe. http://www.boston.com/news/politics/2008/specials/romney/articles/part1_side_2/?page=1 </ref> but he stated during interviews that "he had longed to join the soldiers in Vietnam and support the war effort." His father had stated in 1967 that he felt "brainwashed" by U.S. officials over the justification of the prolonged Vietnam war. This statement had been very costly in George Romney's 1968 campaign for President against Richard Nixon.

Romney maintains a stable marriage with his wife Ann, with whom he has five children. Conservatives applaud him for being such a devoted husband and family man. Conservatives also disliked his Presidential competitors, namely John McCain, Rudy Giuliani, and Fred Thompson, for their divorces.<ref>http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/06/08/AR2007060802781_pf.html</ref>

Romney is the son of former [[Michigan]] Governor and presidential candidate George Romney, a "Rockefeller Republican,"<ref>Lisa McGirr, ''Suburban Warriors''(2001) pp. 141, 222.</ref> who amassed a large fortune as an automobile industry magnate during World War II.  George Romney was popular among moderates during his Presidential run and was well-equipped for victory; many of his political advisors had come from Nelson Rockefeller's 1964 campaign.

==Business Career==
From 1978 to 1984, Romney was a vice president of Bain & Company, Inc. a worldwide management consulting firm, and in 1984, Romney co-founded a spin-off called Bain & Company. He invested in or bought many well-known companies such as Staples, Brookstone, Domino's, Sealy Corporation and Sports Authority. Critics say he advised corporations to cut their U.S. taxes by reincorporating in Caribbean tax havens such as the Caymen Islands, while maintaining their operations in the U.S.

==Record as Governor==
Romney served as governor of Massachusetts (2003-2007), with a generally [[conservative]] record that included economic expansion. He balanced the budget every year of his administration with out increasing taxes or increasing state dept. Romney turned a $3 billion budget deficit into a $500 million surplus by reducing government spending and added 80,000 new jobs by the end of his term. In 2004, 2005, and 2006 Governor Romney proposed cutting the state income tax from 5.3% to 5.0% <ref>http://www.clubforgrowth.org/2007/08/mitt_romneys_record_on_economi.php</ref>. Although the Democratic super majority in the state legislator refused to budge. Romney vetoed 844 pieces of legislation, with over 700 overridden. <ref>http://www.ontheissues.org/Governor/Mitt_Romney_Government_Reform.htm</ref> He vetoed an increase in the minimum wage, saying "there's no question raising the minimum wage excessively causes a loss of jobs." <ref>Telegram & Gazette, 08/01/06</ref> Under Governor Romney the state abolished a retroactive capital gains tax that would have forced nearly 50,000 taxpayers to pay additional taxes and fees. <ref>http://www.americansformitt.com/</ref> Massachusetts Citizens For Limited Taxation Executive Director Barbara Anderson praised Romney, saying "There was no one else out on the horizon and with the legislature almost entirely Democratic, we felt it was necessary to have a grown-up in the corner office. … And we were right to back him. He's been a really good friend to the taxpayers."

However, some of the actions Governor Romney took received criticisms from conservatives, such as supporting moderate fee increases and creating and the nation's first universal [[health care]] program. During his 2002 gubernatorial campaign Romney supported [[abortion]], his views evolved and would later take [[pro-life]] positions such as vetoing emergency contraception and vetoing [[stem-cell research]] that would allow cloning of human embryos. In 2006, Governor Romney testified before the [[United States]] [[Senate]] to support the Federal Marriage Amendment, which would limit marriage to one man and one woman. Additionally, Romney filed legislation to reinstate [[capital punishment]], but was defeated in the Massachusetts House of Representatives on a 99-53 vote.

Mitt Romney made no pardons as governor, "My conclusion was, if somebody has been convicted by a jury of their peers, and they’ve been prosecuted and the police were able to get the evidence necessary to put them behind bars, why in the world would I step in and reverse that sentence?" <ref>http://hotair.com/archives/2009/12/04/romney-on-huckabee-unlike-some-people-i-never-pardoned-anyone/</ref>

On [[Education]] Romney called for the privatization of the University of Massachusetts medical school<ref>Telegram & Gazette, 02/27/03</ref>. In 2004, he established the John and Abigail Adams Scholarship Program, which rewarded the top 25 percent of Massachusetts high school students with tuition-free scholarship to any Massachusetts public [[university]] or [[college]]. In August 2006, Governor Romney refused to allow former Iranian President Mohammed Khatami, an outspoken opponent of the [[United States]] and [[Israel]], state police escorts during his speech at [[Harvard University]]. <ref>http://www.nysun.com/editorials/khatemi-at-harvard/38903/</ref>

In December 2006, Romney signed a memorandum of agreement with the federal government that would allow state troopers to enforce federal immigration laws <ref>http://www.iowapolitics.com/index.iml?Article=96543</ref>, however was revoked when Democrat Deval Patrict took office as Governor in January 2007.

== Political Views ==

===Abortion===
"I am [[pro-life]]. I believe that [[abortion]] is the wrong choice except in cases of incest, rape, and to save the life of the mother. I wish the people of America agreed, and that the laws of our nation could reflect that view. But while the nation remains so divided over abortion, I believe that the states, through the democratic process, should determine their own abortion laws and not have them dictated by [[judicial mandate]]." ([[Boston]] Globe, Mitt Romney Editorial, July 26, 2005)
<ref>[http://www.mittromney.com/Issue-Watch/Values America's Culture and Values] mittromney.com</ref> 

Despite having a largely pro-life record as governor, in a 1994 debate with Senator [[Edward Kennedy]], Romney said that abortion should be legal, declaring that "regardless of one's beliefs about choice, you would hope it would be safe and legal." "Many years ago, I had a dear, close family relative that was very close to me who passed away from an illegal abortion", Romney said. "It is since that time my mother and my family have been committed to the belief that we can believe as we want, but we will not force our beliefs on others on that matter. And you will not see me wavering on that."<ref>http://www.boston.com/news/local/articles/2005/07/03/clarity_sought_on_romneys_abortion_stance/?page=2</ref>

In his campaign literature for the 2002 Massachusetts gubernatorial election, Romney expressed a willingness to defend that State's pro-choice status quo.<ref>http://web.archive.org/web/20021218005104/www.romneyhealey.com/issues/4</ref>

===Civil Unions===
Romney is opposed to the idea of [[gay marriage]], however he has voiced support for domestic partnership benefits and equal rights for [[homosexuals]].<ref>http://web.archive.org/web/20021218005104/www.romneyhealey.com/issues/3</ref>

===Economic Agenda===
As President, Romney promised to pursue a conservative, pro-growth economic agenda. His number one economic priority would be to grow the economy — helping to create good jobs, raise incomes and preserve American strength. He says he would work to rein in excessive government spending and reform entitlements. To ensure America's continued economic growth, he promises to cut taxes — such as the Death Tax, savings taxes, corporate taxes and marginal tax rates.

Romney says he would also promote trade, bring market forces to bear in health care, pursue national tort and liability reform, eliminate excessive regulations that put a burden on our economy and strengthen American families.

===Immigration===

<blockquote>Immigration has been an important part of our nation's success. The current system, however, puts up a concrete wall to the best and brightest, yet those without skill or education are able to walk across the border. We must reform the current immigration laws so we can secure our borders, implement a mandatory biometrically enabled, tamper proof documentation and employment verification system, and increase legal immigration into America.<ref>http://www.mittromney.com/Issue-Watch/Immigration</ref></blockquote>

Romney supports a strong stance on illegal immigration.<ref>[http://www.iowapolitics.com/index.iml?Article=91722 IowaPolitics.com: Romney Touts Strong Stance On Illegal Immigration]</ref> On 5/24/07, Romney spoke about how he was tolerant about gays and then he discussed the current illegal immigration bill before Congress:
<blockquote>He expressed less tolerance for illegal immigrants, and said he and President Bush have a difference of opinions on a bill that would provide a path toward legalization for an estimated 12 million people unlawfully in the country.

"He has his view, and other people have their views and I have my own," Romney said. "This is for all intents and purposes a form of amnesty in that everyone who is here illegally today will be able to stay under this bill."

The bill is unfair to people who are trying to come to the country legally, he said. People here illegally should be able to apply to come to the United States, but under the same terms as everyone else and behind those who have already applied.

"I don't think that we're going to round up 11 or 12 or however many million people and bus them out of the country. That's not what I'm talking about," Romney said. "Those who committed felonies, of course, would be deported. Those who require government assistance to stay here would surely need to get off government assistance and ultimately could not remain here on government assistance."<ref>http://www.foxnews.com/wires/2007May24/0,4670,RomneyGays,00.html</ref></blockquote>

===Stem Cell Research===
Mitt Romney supports the right of scientists to research on embryos created during fertility treatments.<ref>http://www.boston.com/yourlife/health/diseases/articles/2007/02/11/romneys_stem_cell_view_may_upset_the_right/</ref>

==2008 Presidential Campaign==
''Main Article: [[Mitt Romney 2008 Presidential Campaign]]''

[[Image:Dude and mitt romney.jpg|right|180px]] As chairman of the [[Republican Governors Association]], Romney campaigned nationwide for GOP gubernatorial candidates in 2006, building up a network of allies and supporters. While he did not run for reelection as governor, in 2004 Romney set up a federal political action committee (PAC) called the Commonwealth PAC, which raised $2.71 million during the 2006 election cycle. On January 3, 2007, his next-to-last day in office as governor of Massachusetts, Romney filed to form a presidential exploratory committee with the Federal Election Commission. He officially announced his candidacy for President a month later. Romney was the first candidate in either party to start running television and radio ads. The ads focused mainly on his record as governor, running the 2002 Salt Lake Olympics, and his work as a very successful businessman. Romney's five sons had been actively campaigning for their father, traveling around in a campaign bus called the "Mitt Mobile, A Five Brothers Bus."

As a presidential candidate Romney sought the support of the business community and social conservatives. He reversed moderate positions on abortion and gay rights to take a hardline conservative position on them, and on opposition to illegal immigrants. Opponents charged he changed too often. Romney was a leader in fund-raising, augmented by over $35 million from his own fortune. However he was little known outside of Massachusetts, so his strategy was to play for early wins in Iowa and New Hampshire, then "sling-shot" the momentum into national visibility. Romney won the Michigan primary on January 16th, 2008, with 39% of the vote, edging out McCain with 30% and Huckabee with 16%. Romney was favored to win in the state of his birth, where his father, [[George Romney]] was governor from 1963-1969. After losing both the Iowa caucus and the New Hampshire primary (to Huckabee and McCain, respectively), Romney won a low-publicized Wyoming caucus. On January 19, Romney easily won the [[Nevada]] caucuses by 37 percentage points when there were seven candidates on the ballot, however, on that same day he placed a distant fourth in the [[South Carolina]] primary. After a disappointing performance on Super Tuesday, Romney announced the suspension of his campaign on Thursday 7th February. He expressed his wishes not to divide the Republican party and later endorsed Senator [[John McCain]] of [[Arizona]]. Commentators speculated on his chances for a return effort in 2012.

===Fundraising===
Mitt Romney had done well in fund raising. During his first fund raiser as a presidential candidate, he raised $6.5 million dollars compared to an original goal of only $1 million. During the first quarter Romney raised more money then any other Republican presidential candidate with $23 million. However, a substantial portion of his funds ($17 million) came from his own personal wealth. [http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2007/10/16/top_spender_romney_could_soon_run_short/]

==Endorsements==
===Congressional===
* Former [[Speaker of the House]] [[J. Dennis Hastert|Dennis Hastert]]
* Senator [[Bob Bennett]] of [[Utah]]
* Senator [[Orrin Hatch]] of [[Utah]]
* Senator [[Larry Craig]] of [[Idaho]]
* Senator [[Jim DeMint]] of [[South Carolina]]
* Senator [[Wayne Allard]] of [[Colorado]]
* Senator [[Judd Gregg]] of [[New Hampshire]]
* Former Sen. [[Jim Talent]] of [[Missouri]]
* Former Sen. [[Rick Santorum]] of [[Pennsylvania]]
* Representative [[Tom Tancredo]] of [[Colorado]]
* Representative [[Marsha Blackburn]] of [[Tennessee]]

===Governors===
* Missouri Governor [[Matt Blunt]]
* Former Colorado Governor [[Bill Owens]]
* [[Rhode Island]] Governor [[Donald Carcieri]]
* Former South Carolina Governor James B. Edwards
* Former Massachusetts Governor Bill Weld
* Former Montana Governor Tim Babcock

===Talk Radio===
* [[Rush Limbaugh]] <ref>[http://www.cnsnews.com/ThisHour.asp#Limbaugh Endorses Romney Limbaugh Endorses Romney], [[Melanie Hunter]], ''[[CNSNews]]'', February 05, 2008</ref>

==References==
{{reflist|2}}

==External links==
*[http://www.mittromney.com Mitt Romney for President 2008]
*[http://www.ldslivingonline.com/article.php?articleId=17633 Mitt Romney: proudly, quietly Mormon]
*[http://www.evangelicalsformitt.org/ Evangelicals for Mitt]
*[http://sparklepony.blogspot.com/2007/03/fresh-mitt-romney-juvenalia-hot-off.html Fresh Mitt Romney Juvenalia] Pics - Comments.
*[http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=YjE4MmMyMzVkZjlhZGQzNzlhZjdmMDEzNjI3MzM4ZTA= Mitt Romney: “I Changed My View. Is that So Difficult to Understand?”] The candidate talks about his efforts to convince voters that his pro-life conversion is real. Byron York, National Review Online, November 20, 2007
*[http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=Y2ZkMWNkZDkzOTk1YTM0NTNkNmJlZThmYjJmM2ZmOGE= Did Mitt Romney Push Poll Himself?] Mark Hemingway, National Review Online, November 19, 2007
*[http://corner.nationalreview.com/post/?q=Y2EzODZjY2UxZTRhMWE2ZDk1ZWE5MGI0ZmRjMDViZTI= Team Romney on Push-Poll Connections] After reading the Hemingway piece, Kevin Madden, Romney for President campaign spokesman replies. Kathryn Jean Lopez, National Review Online, November 19, 2007
*[http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=MzliMDgzOWVlOGEwYThlMzc5ZDVlNzM2YjA4M2ZkYTg= Romney Stands for Faith] The candidate pushes back against push-poll attacks. Larry Kudlow, National Review Online, November 16, 2007
*[http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=MGQ4YmM4Y2U3Yjc3MzYzNDQwYzk3YTVjMTI5YTkwNzg= Romney’s Religion], The Editors, National Review Online, November 16, 2007

==Blogs==
*[http://www.mymanmitt.com/mitt-romney/ My Man Mitt]
*[http://libertariansformitt.wordpress.com/ Libertarians for Romney]

{{DEFAULTSORT:Romney, Mitt}}
[[Category:Massachusetts Governors]]
[[Category:Republican Governors]]
[[Category:2008 Presidential Candidates]]
[[Category:Business People]]
[[Category:Featured articles]]
[[Category:The 100 Americans The Left Hates Most]]
[[Category:Mormons]]
[[Category:2012 Presidential Candidates]]

Homosexual rights advocacy

2012-01-05T05:33:58Z

SammyP: edited to remove objectionable assertions

{{Homosexuality}}
The '''gay rights''' movement seeks to elevate [[homosexuality]] to the same level of social and political respectability as heterosexual relationships.

The gay rights movement seeks to remove the stigma of homosexuality by arguing that either,
# Homosexuality is an immutable trait, and discriminating against immutable traits is wrong (cf. race discrimination), or,
# Homosexuality, if not immutable, is highly correlated with personality, and discriminating against such deeply rooted notions of self is wrong, as well (cf. religious intolerance).
# Homosexuality is perfectly normal and should be respected, despite God's laws against it in the Bible.

Gay rights are a favored topic of [[liberals]], and are based on [[moral relativity]], the idea that there is no absolute Right or Wrong.

==Ludicrous arguments==

Homosexuality advocates claim that desire for same-sex fornication is innate. Furthermore, two prominent scientists (both homosexual men, so unlikely to be biased against the cause) both cite '''factors other than genetics''' in the development of homosexual desires.{{citation needed}}

==History==
[[Harry Hay]] is regarded as the father of the modern gay liberation movement. As a [[Communist Party of the United States]] (CPUSA) organizer, he turned out "essays, position papers, critical studies, and manifestos concerning what it means to be gay in the world." <ref> [http://www.aim.org/media_monitor/A269_0_2_0_C/ Red Roots Of Gay Movement], Cliff Kincaid, Accuracy in Media, September 10, 2003. </ref>

The first step Hay took in organizing the gay rights movement was to recommend to the CPUSA that he be expelled. In
light of his 18 years of service to the party <ref>[http://www.sojournertruth.net/ipp.html#i In Partial Payment Class Struggle, Sexuality and Gay Liberation (1978)], by A. Rausch. Retrieved from ''Urgent Tasks: [[Leftist|Journal of the Revolutionary Left]]'', Sojourner Truth Organization Digital Archive , 10 May 2007. </ref> they released him as “a security risk but a life-long friend of the people.” The early leadership of the Foundation shaped the organization to reflect the cell structure of the Communist Party, in which "secrecy, hierarchical structures, and centralized leadership predominated." <ref>John D'Emilio, ''Sexual Politics, Sexual Communities: The Making of a Homosexual Minority in the United States'' (Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 1983), quoted in Martin Meeker, Behind the Mask of Respectability, ''Journal of the History of Sexuality'', (2001) 78-116. </ref>
Hay and his fellow gay rights activists began circulating the [[USSR]] and the East European Communist parties sponsored anti-war [[Stockholm Peace petition]] against the [[Korean War]] <ref>[http://www.kimsoft.com/2000/germberia.htm New Russian Evidence on the Korean War Biological Warfare Allegations: Background and Analysis,]Milton Leitenberg, Cold War International History Project, Woodrow Wilson International Center for Scholars. </ref> at a gay beach in Los Angeles. The first months produced hundreds of members.

Amid growing public focus on gays and lesbians, 91 homosexuals were found to be employed in the [[U.S. State Department]]. Congressional investigators discovered homosexuals employed in 36 of 53 branches of Government, as well as in the armed forces. Between Jan. 1, 1947 and April 1950, 4,954 cases had come to light among some three and a half million people in Government service. Most were in the armed services. 574 cases were found involving civilian Government employees; in all the other cases the accused had either quit, been cleared or fired. The investigators found the greatest batch of civilian cases—143—in the U.S. State Department. State had cleared or gotten rid of all but a dozen whose cases were still pending. The Veterans Administration was found to have 101 cases. Others included the Atomic Energy Commission, 8; EGA, 27; Congress' legislative agencies (Library of Congress, congressional employees, etc.), 19. One Senator remarked, "It follows that if blackmailers can extort money from a homosexual under threat of disclosure, [[espionage]] agents can use the same type of pressure to extort confidential information." <ref>[http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,859060,00.html Object Lesson], ''TIME magazine'', Dec. 25, 1950.</ref>

The [[Human Rights Campaign]] referred to Hay as "founder and architect of the modern movement for gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgender rights" and "Harry was one of the first to realize that the dream of equality for our community could be attained through visibility and activism". <ref>[http://www.hrc.org/Content/ContentGroups/News_Releases/20021/HRC_Mourns_the_Death_of_Gay_Rights_Pioneer_Harry_Hay.htm Human Rights Campaign Mourns the Death of Gay Rights Pioneer Harry Hay], Press Release, Oct. 24, 2002.</ref> Hay not only promoted homosexual rights, he actively campaigned for the "rights" of pedophiles. ''The Boston Phoenix'' noted that nowhere was this more evident than in Hay's persistent support of the right of the North American Man-Boy Love Association, [[NAMBLA]], to march in gay-pride parades. <ref>''The Boston Phoenix'', [http://bostonphoenix.com/boston/news_features/other_stories/documents/02511115.htm The real Harry Hay], Michael Bronski, October 31 - November 7, 2002. </ref> NAMBLA maintains a website with a body of Hay's work and a tribute to Harry Hay on its homepage. The Human Rights Campaign and other gay rights organizations, while revering Hay for his contributions to gay rights, do not support NAMBLA or communism.

== Homosexual Rights Timeline ==

* Henry Gerber starts Society for Human Rights under a State of Illinois charter for a non-profit organization for people with "mental abnormalities" on December 25, 1924. Several issues of ''Friendship and Freedom'', the first American publication for homosexuals were printed but the organization was shut down by Chicago police. Gerber was arrested but not convicted of any crime. As a result of his efforts, Gerber lost his job as a post office clerk, his life savings, and found himself abandoned by his friends. <ref> http://www.gayhistory.com/rev2/factfiles/ff1924.htm </ref>

* [[Alfred Kinsey]] publishes ''Sexual Behavior in the Human Male'' in 1948, allegedly the first scientific body of work that examined the subject of homosexuality. Mainstream publications started printing their opinions about this formerly taboo subject. <ref> http://www.indiana.edu/~kinsey/library/mediaresponses.html </ref> <ref> http://www.indiana.edu/~kinsey/library/kinsey.html </ref>

* Rev. Elder Troy Perry founded the Universal Fellowship of Metropolitan Community Churches in 1968 which served as a specific outreach to lesbian, gay, bisexual, and transgender communities. <ref>http://www.mcccharleston.org/about/troyperry.htm</ref>

*[[Stonewall Riots]] of 1969 marked a turning point within the Civil Rights Era of the United States. New York City police raided the Stonewall Inn and for the first time the gay patrons fought back which started several days of rioting.<ref>http://www.columbia.edu/cu/lweb/eresources/exhibitions/sw25/case1.html </ref> This bar had been operating illegally by bribing the police and was owned by the [[mafia]]. The riots occurred when the police finally came to shut down the illegal activities occurring at the site.

* American Psychiatric Association removed homosexuality from its list of mental illnesses in 1973. <ref> http://archive.psych.org/edu/other_res/lib_archives/archives/197308.pdf </ref>

* 'Don't ask, don't tell' policy as crafted by Gen. Colin Powell and approved by Pres. Clinton takes affect in 1993. This measure allows homosexuals to serve in the US military. Sexual orientation will not prohibit anyone from serving though they must not engage in homosexual conduct or openly say they are gay. <ref>http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9F0CE5D81F30F933A15754C0A965958260</ref>

* Gay marriage became legal in Massachusetts on May 17, 2004 when homosexual couples were granted the same right as heterosexual couples. This right was preceded by years of legal wrangling in the state courts. <ref> http://www.hrc.org/issues/5489.htm </ref>

== Legal Success ==
Courts, including the Supreme Court, have accepted either one or both of these rationales. In ''[[Romer v. Evans]]'', the Court found that discriminating against homosexuals could only be explained by a rational of animus laid bare, which was not enough even to allow state condemnation of homosexuality under the [[rational basis review]] test. ''Romer'', then, protects the status of homosexuality from undue discrimination that occurs without a rational basis.<ref>Romer v. Evans, 517 U.S. 620</ref>

Homosexual conduct was formerly illegal in many states.<ref>See generally ''Bowers v. Hardwick'', 478 U.S. 186</ref> In the last decade of the twentieth century, although these laws existed, they were rarely (if ever) enforced.<ref>''Lawrence v. Texas,'' 539 U.S. 558, Justice Anthony Kennedy, in the Opinion of the Court, found this in his historical analysis.</ref> Without disclosing whether it saw homosexuality as a status protected from discrimination at as high of a level as gender and race, the Court struck down bans on homosexual conduct, framing it as an expansion of its privacy jurisprudence.<ref>''Lawrence v. Texas'', 539 U.S. 558</ref>

The status of homosexuality before the law, then, is in some degree of flux. While bare discrimination against homosexual status is facially unconstitutional lacking a rational basis, and while preventing homosexual conduct is similarly unconstitutional, the Supreme Court has held in these landmark cases that the state may discriminate against homosexuals to preserve an "institution that the law protects" - namely, [[marriage]].<ref>''Lawrence v. Texas''; Kennedy & O'Connor both reached this conclusion explicitly.</ref> As such, the standard to be applied in deciding if discrimination against homosexuals is wrong is somewhere in between [[rational basis review]] and [[strict scrutiny review]]. Justice [[Antonin Scalia]] thinks that this uncertainty will surely be resolved in the favor of gay rights, and he warns that such a legal erosion will result in the downfall of the law's moral authority.<ref>''Lawrence v. Texas'', Scalia, J., dissenting.</ref>

In 2006, [[Catholic Charities]] of Boston closed their adoption program after more than a century of finding homes for [[orphans]] and [[unwanted children]] when it was reported by the ''Boston Globe'' that gay couples had received children placed from the agency.<ref>[http://www.boston.com/news/local/articles/2006/03/11/catholic_charities_stuns_state_ends_adoptions/ Catholic Charities stuns state, ends adoptions], By Patricia Wen, ''The Boston Globe'', March 11, 2006.</ref> Massachusetts law, barring "orientation discrimination", prohibited one of the nations oldest adoption agencies from refusing service to gay activists, and a mass resignation of the agency's Board in protest followed. <ref>[http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/012/191kgwgh.asp Banned in Boston], by Maggie Gallagher, ''The Weekly Standard'', 05/15/2006, Volume 011, Issue 33.</ref>

== Opposition to Gay Rights ==
A poll reveals that a majority of US citizens<ref>[http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/03/18/AR2007031800484.html | Clinton, Obama Slow to Respond to Questions on Homosexuality] Washington Post, March 18, 2007</ref> disapprove of homosexuality, or at least consider it less than ideal, and prefer that public policy does not encourage it. They also believe that accepting homosexuality would require the loss of rights to free speech, freedom of religion, freedom of association, and traditional [[marriage]].<ref>Traditional Values Coalition - [http://www.traditional values.org/modules.php?sid=2963 Homosexual Marriage In Canada Killing Free Speech]</ref>
Conservatives criticize attempts by gay rights activists to prohibit any statements which are critical of homosexuality, such as the idea that it is "unnatural" or "sinful", using [[hate crime]]s statutes and anti-[[discrimination]] laws. These laws violate the rights of those against homosexuality to continue trying to restrict the rights of homosexuals.

Conservatives also oppose attempts by homosexual activists to indoctrinate children by using liberal tactics such as ''tolerance'' or forcing ''diversity'' programs onto children in schools which strongly encourage the acceptance of homosexual behavior. Notable figures including [[Tony Perkins]] have expressed concerns. As any logical examination of the world would have one conclude, tolerance is an insidious construct which breeds relativism and lack of judgment.

*The EU parliament called on Polish authorities to publicly condemn and take measures against declarations by officials "inciting discrimination and hatred based on sexual orientation." [http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D8OOFTCO5&show_article=1]

== Support for Gay Rights ==
An April 2009 CNN poll showed the public evenly divided over the US military's Don't Ask Don't Tell policy, with 48% in favor and 47% opposed.<ref>Polling Report http://www.pollingreport.com/civil.htm</ref> Polls consistently show that most people are opposed to same-sex marriage. Thirty states have had a public referendum on same-sex marriage, and all thirty have voted against it.

==Tactics==

*Kirk and Madsen predicted a mass public change of heart would follow, even among opponents, "if we can actually make them like us." <ref>[http://www.leaderu.com/jhs/socarides.html How America Went Gay], by Charles W. Socarides, M.D., ''America'', November 18, 1995.</ref>

Advocates routinely use [[deceit]], notably pursuing various goal while pretending not to. For example, some advocates will claim:
*The movement does not seek to convince others that homosexuality is ''right''

Yet clearly the drive for "[[tolerance]]" is only one step toward the ultimate goal of "[[approval]]".

Blurring distinctions: Advocates routinely fail to distinguish between [[homosexual behavior]] and homosexuality as an "identity".

===Presenting outstanding homosexuals as contributors to society===



Turing was arrested in 1952 for [[homosexuality|homosexual acts]] and subsequently lost his security clearance. He was allowed to stay out of prison by agreeing to be injected with female hormones (which would supposedly decrease his sex drive). He later confided to a friend that the hormones caused him to grow breasts.<ref>''Oddballs and Eccentrics''. Shaw, Karl. Edison, New Jersey: Castle Books, 2004</ref> This may have contributed to his suicide by [[cyanide]] poisoning in 1954.<ref>http://www.turing.org.uk/turing/index.html</ref> The British Government issued a formal, official apology for the way Alan Turing and other homosexuals were treated in the past.<ref>http://www.number10.gov.uk/Page20571</ref>

==See also==
*[[ACT-UP]]
*[[Anti-Defamation League]]
*[[H.R. 1592: Local Law Enforcement Hate Crimes Prevention Act of 2007]]
*[[Intimate Partner Violence]]
*[[Human Rights Watch]]

== References ==
{{reflist|2}}

==External Links==
*[http://www.city-journal.org/html/13_2_queering_the_schools.html Queering the Schools]

[[Category:Homosexual Agenda]]
[[Category:Homosexuality]]