Conservapedia - User contributions [en]

User talk:DavidB4

2019-01-02T08:20:48Z

WisdomTooth3: recreated page

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Archives: [[User talk:DavidB4/Archive 1|1]], [[User talk:DavidB4/Archive 2|2]], [[User talk:DavidB4/Archive 3|3]]
 Last change made by {{REVISIONUSER}} on {{REVISIONMONTH}}/{{REVISIONDAY}}/{{REVISIONYEAR}} 
'''Feel free to post any questions or comments here. If you don't hear back from me, try e-mailing me also.'''
 
__TOC__

== Move request ==

Hallo. I need your help to move two pages as I made errors in their titles.

One of them is "Sarah Brown Liberal Democrat".
It has been suggested I change this to "Sarah Brown (UK Politician)" as most readers are American. I just need to figure out how to do this.

The second is "Jane Samantha Fae alias John Ozimek" which should read Jane Francesca Fae. I would be very grateful if you could please shift those for me. [[User:GraceDalrymple|GraceDalrymple]]

:Yes, I saw the discussion. I have moved those two pages, as requested. Moving pages is restricted to administrators and SysOps, so it is not your fault, as if you just can't figure out how to move pages...the wiki will not let you. No need to feel bad about it!
:I am happy to help, so just let me know if/when you need further assistance. It's no trouble! --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 14:41, 27 September 2018 (EDT)

Would you please move [[Qanon]] to [[QAnon]]? --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 09:37, 3 November 2018 (EDT)
:In addition to the above, would you please move [[:Category:Christian social reformers]] for capitalization. --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 15:58, 4 November 2018 (EST)
::Both done --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 18:00, 6 November 2018 (EST)

Another move request: would you please fix the spelling error in this image title (the word "official" specifically)? [[:File:Enrique Peña Nieto oficial pic.jpg]] --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 15:15, 1 December 2018 (EST)

:I think that actually may be deliberate (see: https://www.facebook.com/Enrique-Peña-Nieto-Oficial-1708563375863631). I don't mind moving it if you still think that is needed, but it is protected so someone will need to unlock it first. --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 17:28, 1 December 2018 (EST)

::Good point -- it's probably Spanish. However, we are an English-language encyclopedia, so it might still be good to change it. --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 08:38, 3 December 2018 (EST)

:::My Spanish is very rusty, but that was my assumption. I'm fine with moving it though. Want me to ask Andy to unlock it? --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 22:30, 3 December 2018 (EST)

::::I would appreciate that. Thanks! --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 23:10, 3 December 2018 (EST)

:::::Done! [[:File:Enrique Peña Nieto oficial pic.jpg]] --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 22:05, 4 December 2018 (EST)

::::::Would you please move this page to capitalize the "M": [[Javier milei]]? Also, please watch your email. --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 17:03, 6 December 2018 (EST)

:::::::Moved. I just thinking about email... --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 17:05, 6 December 2018 (EST)

::::::::Would you please move [[Ilana mercer]] to [[Ilana Mercer]] and delete the new redirect? --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 08:48, 11 December 2018 (EST)

Done. I have been sometimes leaving the redirects (for a while) so that new editors who don't know how to use RC can still find their pages. However, that may be unnecessary, and since I see you usually delete the redirect anyway, I will plan on just deleting the redirect in the future. --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 17:29, 11 December 2018 (EST)
:Thanks! Regarding redirects, I guess it depends on the specific article. I'm fine deciding case-by-case, since redirects might be more necessary for some articles over others. --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 17:36, 11 December 2018 (EST)
::Hello DavidB4, would you please move [[Eastern Empires vs Western Empires]] to be an essay? I would rather delete it, but it just seems like a low-quality opinion article that could just be reformatted as such. --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 15:13, 20 December 2018 (EST)

:::Done. I was tempted to delete it also, especially considering that it seems to have been made by a disposable account. However, I was waiting to see what others thought. --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 17:02, 20 December 2018 (EST)

While I'm reluctant to rename my "Donald Trump achievements" articles so long after creation, it probably would be a good idea to move [[Donald Trump achievements: Immigration, illegal immigration, and border security]] to [[Donald Trump achievements: Immigration and border security]]. If you agree this is a good idea, would you please do it, and would you then delete the redirect and change every link where I (or someone else) has linked it? Then, I will begin doing the 2-3 article splits I told you about. --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 08:35, 31 December 2018 (EST)

:I agree--that is a repetitive name, so a move makes sense. I have moved the page, and clean up most of the links to the old name. However, I have a little bit of a time crunch right now, so I'm going to need to leave one thing undone: [[Donald Trump]] needs to be unlocked so the link can be updated. I can ask for the unlock later, or you can if you get there first. --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 17:02, 31 December 2018 (EST)

==Hi==
hi and thank you for move sugguestion to sting. [[User:Massaq25|Massaq25]] ([[User talk:Massaq25|talk]]) 18:23, 29 September 2018 (EDT)
:Hello, and you're welcome! Do you agree? I'm open to other suggestions, I just don't think that "sting" is a sufficiently descriptive title. --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 18:27, 29 September 2018 (EDT)
::DavidB4, I would appreciate it if you would move the page now. No need for a move tag (nobody's going to comment there anyway). --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 23:29, 29 September 2018 (EDT)
:::Moved to [[Steve Borden]] with a redirect from "Sting (wrestler)" --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 01:09, 30 September 2018 (EDT)

== Quotes ==
Those quotes weren't my own, you should know that, they're from actual people. Also, if it's debatable, then please by all means...refute me. --[[User:Makuta Makaveli|Makuta Makaveli]] ([[User talk:Makuta Makaveli|talk]]) 02:48, 1 December 2018 (EST)
:I'm obviously not DavidB4, but I will still point out that a simple Google search shows it's very debatable: [https://health.usnews.com/health-news/health-wellness/articles/2014/07/07/is-abstinence-unhealthy 1],[http://www.nbcnews.com/id/36084314/ns/health-sexual_health/t/no-sex-may-be-no-fun-it-unhealthy/#.XAKfVmhKhPY 2],[https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/jun/09/sex-celibacy-friendships-women 3],[https://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-1077378/I-gave-sex-years-ago--best-thing-I-did.html 4] -- the info you added was undue weight, considering the overall size of the article, and it falsely implied that abstinence is a bad thing for your health. It appears that it is only when you really want to have sex and you don't. --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 09:58, 1 December 2018 (EST)
::Yes, it was a very one-sided argument, which is factually questionable. Without getting unnecessarily descriptive, the body does have ways of dealing with some of the stated issues. Research is sketchy if even existent on several of the things you mentioned. Additionally, the first paragraph was written as your own, mot a quote, even though is was a direct copy-and-paste from another source. (That is by definition plagiarism--taking credit for someone else's work.) --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 13:03, 1 December 2018 (EST)
::: ''So what are the health benefits of sex, besides relieving stress and helping you fall asleep? Studies have shown that regular sex has a protective effect on the heart, lowering the risk of heart attack in men. For both men and women, “It increases blood flow to the genitals and probably helps the immune system,” Herbenick says. “All things being equal, it’s also fun when things are going well [in your relationship.]”
''So abstaining – especially long-term – can carry some physical consequences. In women, it can cause the atrophying of underused vaginal or hip muscles, Lindau says. Vaginismus is a common condition characterized by hypersensitivity of the muscles around the opening of the vagina, she adds. Those muscles – along with the pelvic floor muscles – are important for controlling penetration, and they need to be in a relaxed state during sexual intercourse. If they are hyper-contracted – not necessarily from abstinence itself, but accumulated fear or anticipation of the first sexual experience – sex can be very painful. “They say it feels like he’s hit a wall,” Lindausays, adding that vaginismus can be treated.''

I said refute me, but instead you give me extra arguments. Thank you so much. --[[User:Makuta Makaveli|Makuta Makaveli]] ([[User talk:Makuta Makaveli|talk]]) 14:20, 1 December 2018 (EST)
:Neither of us are arguing that sex is bad or harmful -- all of the articles I cited said that sex can be good, but abstinence can also be good. You're committing a fallacy by assuming that just because sex is good means that abstinence is bad.
:Unless you get STDs or anything like that from sex, it is just as good as abstinence. The articles made it clear that abstinence does not have harmful side-effects. You need to read the cited articles better. --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 14:30, 1 December 2018 (EST)
::: I guess the only real way to settle this is to get actual data from the field. [[User:Makuta Makaveli|Makuta Makaveli]] ([[User talk:Makuta Makaveli|talk]]) 15:18, 1 December 2018 (EST)
::::Makuta, are you pushing sex outside of marriage between husband and wife in this website? [[User:Karajou|Karajou]] ([[User talk:Karajou|talk]]) 15:37, 1 December 2018 (EST)
:::::No, I'm pushing for knowledge of the dangers of lifelong abstinence. But even if I was, then there's nothing you can do about it so why are you asking? --[[User:Makuta Makaveli|Makuta Makaveli]] ([[User talk:Makuta Makaveli|talk]]) 20:22, 1 December 2018 (EST)
::::::"''dangers of lifelong abstinence''" -- That's ridiculous, and choosing not to have sex (especially outside of heterosexual marriage) is normal, and sex outside of marriage can actually be dangerous (if there are STDs involved). Many people have been abstinent and turned out just fine. You're distorting the facts to make it seem like it's a necessity to have sex in order to be healthy, and if you don't there's a medical problem, when in reality neither option is inherently harmful.
::::::"''But even if I was, then there's nothing you can do about it''" If I'm understanding you correctly, as admins, we can do something about it. --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 20:44, 1 December 2018 (EST)

:::::::"''If I'm understanding you correctly, as admins, we can do something about it.''"

:::::::Haha! '''Can'''... --[[User:Makuta Makaveli|Makuta Makaveli]] ([[User talk:Makuta Makaveli|talk]]) 21:34, 1 December 2018 (EST)

::::::::Want me to turn it into a "'''Will'''"? --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 21:54, 1 December 2018 (EST)

:::::::::Action without cause. To pardon is true power but you have nothing to pardon, I'm giving you no trouble. --[[User:Makuta Makaveli|Makuta Makaveli]] ([[User talk:Makuta Makaveli|talk]]) 22:01, 1 December 2018 (EST)

Makuta Makaveli either has an agenda, or gets his/her information from people who have an agenda to promote casual sex by making abstinence look like a "health hazard." The Atheist YouTuber "MrRepzion" also claimed that one needed to have "trial sex" to see if the two are "sexually compatible." It would help CP if the articles had information debunking these claims [[User:Shobson20|Shobson20]] ([[User talk:Shobson20|talk]]) 12:08, 2 December 2018 (EST)

:Most people argue that there is "no harm" in casual sex--that has become a common claim (although some say is is risky due to STDs). Because of this, there are plentiful materials arguing that claim. However, it is much harder to find support for this claim that is is actually unhealthy to abstain by choice. I've seen a few unscientific blog posts, etc. about it, but nothing verifiable. That doesn't mean it doesn't exist (there is always someone willing to write a paper on some fringe belief which people want to hear--just look at chocolate, for example, where they like to disregard the health costs of sugar and just look at the pure chocolate, which by the way tastes pretty bad on its own) but I'm not finding proof.
:Shobson20, the "try it before you buy it" idea is certainly nothing new in personal relationships. I suspect you are correct in linking these two, as people who would like to engage in this practice would like to have something like this to point to as a defense for their actions. --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 00:54, 3 December 2018 (EST)

== Why did I get blocked by "Minuteman?" ==

I was fixing the damage that "My password is green" was doing. I sometimes notice vandals before CP's admins do, and sometimes I try to help. [[User:Shobson20|Shobson20]] ([[User talk:Shobson20|talk]]) 19:23, 15 December 2018 (EST)

:I replied to your email. You did nothing wrong. Thank you for your vigilance, and I apologize for the this! --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 19:30, 15 December 2018 (EST)

::What are the qualifications for becoming a sysop on this site? I would like to be able to help by stopping the trolls and vandals who frequently attack this site. [[User:Shobson20|Shobson20]] ([[User talk:Shobson20|talk]]) 19:38, 15 December 2018 (EST)

:::As best I can tell, there is no official criteria. However, this page might be useful to answer some basic questions: [[Conservapedia:User_rights]]. Typically, SysOp rights are given to users who have been editing for some time, and proven themselves trustworthy. I don't think there is a specific checklist that you can do, to get these rights. However, the one responsible for promotions is [[User:Aschlafly]], so you might be able to get a better idea from him as to what he specifically looks for. --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 20:59, 15 December 2018 (EST)

I too have just been blocked by {{user|Minuteman}}. I copied over the WP article for [[anarcho-conservatism]], which the WP zealots are about to delete. The text there is mine, though most of the article is still in quotes from references, as more text is needed (hence why I brought it here). — [[User:WisdomTooth3|WisdomTooth3]] ([[User talk:WisdomTooth3|talk]]) 00:17, 1 January 2019 (EST)

:You were blocked for one hour so we could review what you were doing, because you were importing a page from WP which looked a bit like plagiarism. Since it is your own writing, then you may recreate that page, but it could use some improvements. Namely, the quotes themselves can use work, as they do not provide context. If you intend to make further improvements to the page, then we welcome our efforts! --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 16:29, 1 January 2019 (EST)
::Per [[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]]'s suggestion, recreated it [https://www.conservapedia.com/User:WisdomTooth3/Sandbox/Anarcho-conservatism here]. Not sure when I'll be able to improve it. Please feel free to chip in. — [[User:WisdomTooth3|WisdomTooth3]] ([[User talk:WisdomTooth3|talk]]) 03:20, 2 January 2019 (EST)

== Merge proposal ==

What do you think about this merge request: [[Talk:Carbon cycle (astronomy)]]? I am inclined to support it, but it's probably a good idea to get more than one opinion on it. --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 11:32, 29 December 2018 (EST)

:I've never really studies that specific topic, but the proposal sounds fine to me. I looked up "carbon cycle" and found a great deal of information, but on the wrong topic. From my limited understanding, a merge sounds like a good idea. --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 14:30, 29 December 2018 (EST)
== tag at bottom of pages "quotation templates" ==

Many of the content pages I create use quotes of other web content. At the bottom of the articles I created using quotes, there is a tag at the bottom of the pages indicating "quotation templates". This is a new and unwanted development.

For example, please look at the bottom of this web page: [[Atheism and mental illness]].

Can we get the "quotation templates" tag to not be there. Before they never used to be there. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 21:37, 29 December 2018 (EST)

:I made a small mistake, but cannot fix it until [[:template:cquote]] is unlocked again. I'm sorry about that--I should have noticed sooner. Someone needs to add the "noinclude" tags to the category link. If someone unlocks the page, I will fix the issue. Again, sorry about that! --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 23:23, 29 December 2018 (EST)
::I unlocked the page.[[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 23:25, 29 December 2018 (EST)

:::Thanks, I believe I fixed it. You can lock it again. --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 23:36, 29 December 2018 (EST)
::::Thanks for fixing the issue. I appreciate it.[[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 23:37, 29 December 2018 (EST)

:::::Any time! Thanks for pointing it out! --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 23:46, 29 December 2018 (EST)

== Request ==

Would you please check [[Alejandro Garcia Padilla]] for originality? It could be, but many of the refs are formatted like on Wikipedia. --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 19:34, 30 December 2018 (EST)

:Of course! It definitely originated from WP. Slightly edited, but still copied. See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alejandro_García_Padilla --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 20:12, 30 December 2018 (EST)

::You beat me to it. Obvious copy from WP, with slight alterations. You don't need to check reference format; just check the text. [[User:SamHB|SamHB]] ([[User talk:SamHB|talk]]) 20:19, 30 December 2018 (EST)

:::Would you please delete all the portions that are copied? --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 20:42, 30 December 2018 (EST)

::::I'll take another look, but I think the whole thing needs to go. Also, this is not the first time. See: [[User_talk:HectorCruz66#Originality]] --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 20:45, 30 December 2018 (EST)
:::::Oh, and I didn't mean to ignore you, Sam. Thanks for checking also! You're right--just looking at the pages shows all you need to know. --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 20:54, 30 December 2018 (EST)
::::::Deleting it, then, is the best option. Would you please do that? --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 21:22, 30 December 2018 (EST)

:::::::Sure. I'm still looking at it, but sure, I'll delete it unless I find a reason not to. --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 21:37, 30 December 2018 (EST)

User talk:WisdomTooth3

2019-01-02T08:18:47Z

WisdomTooth3: reply to 1990'sguy

Your page has been deleted, because it appears to have been copied from wikipedia. Additionally, quotes were without context, and int clearly needed some work in other ways. You are welcome to recreate the page, but only with original text written by you. --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 00:02, 1 January 2019 (EST)

Minuteman is a bot, so its block of you was unintentional.

I recommend re-creating the page in your userspace (user page, sandbox, etc.) and improving it until it is appropriate to become a CP article. I voted "keep" on the WP AfD as the topic seems inherently notable, as you saw, but I think the actual page still needs improvement. I recommend focusing on the sources that explicitly mention and define anarcho-conservatism, rather than quotes which don't actually mention it. --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 07:55, 1 January 2019 (EST)
:Thanks, [[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]]. Recreated it [https://www.conservapedia.com/User:WisdomTooth3/Sandbox/Anarcho-conservatism here]. Not sure when I'll be able to improve it. Please feel free to chip in. — [[User:WisdomTooth3|WisdomTooth3]] ([[User talk:WisdomTooth3|talk]]) 03:18, 2 January 2019 (EST)

User:WisdomTooth3/Sandbox/Anarcho-conservatism

2019-01-02T08:12:31Z

WisdomTooth3: Migrated from https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Anarcho-conservatism&oldid=876131061

[[Anarcho-conservatism]] or [[Anarcho-conservatism|conservative anarchism]] or [[Anarcho-conservatism|tory anarchism]] is a [[political philosophy]] and [[ideology]] that combines [[Anarchism|anarchist]] [[politics]] and [[Conservatism|conservative values]]. [[Anarcho-conservatism]] opposes the state and all government control, while supporting social conservative policies. [[Anarcho-conservatism|Anarcho-conservatives]] advocate the abolition of the state and the wholesale replacement of state law by moral laws. Differently from [[Social anarchism|social anarchists]] and [[Individualist anarchism|individualist anarchists]], [[Anarcho-conservatism|anarcho-conservatives]] don't oppose all authority, but in consonance with them, they oppose the authority of the modern nation state, which they deem artificial.<ref>{{Cite news|url=https://www.lewrockwell.com/2001/07/daniel-mccarthy/anarcho-conservatism/|title=Anarcho-Conservatism - LewRockwell LewRockwell.com|work=LewRockwell.com|access-date=2018-11-28|language=en}}</ref> Anarcho-conservatives include from the [[Agrarianism|Agrarians]] to [[Edmund Burke]].<ref>{{cite book |last1=Stephen R L Clark |title=The Political Animal: Biology, Ethics and Politics |date=4 January 2002 |publisher=Routledge |isbn=1134658605 |page=89 |edition=2002 |url=https://books.google.es/books?id=HF6FAgAAQBAJ&pg=PA200&lpg=PA200&dq=anarcho-conservatism&source=bl&ots=JiPDiMz8A-&sig=OjWSFfDItSmLU4oIxDXrJszUmBk&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiV79a7wa_fAhVCxYUKHQwGCKQ4HhDoATAHegQIAxAB#v=onepage&q=anarcho-conservatism&f=false |accessdate=20 December 2018 |quote=The fault of anarchy-conservatives, from Burke to the Agrarians, is...}}</ref>

For instance, [[Anarcho-conservatism|conservative anarchists]] might oppose abortion, drug use and pornography, on moral grounds, while at the same time opposing their prohibition through government. This absolute rejection of the state legislation is what differentiates [[anarcho-conservatism]] from [[Libertarian conservatism|libertarianism conservatism]]. As [[Conservatism|conservatives]] typically do, [[Anarcho-conservatism|conservative anarchists]] support traditional family structures and, much like all [[Right-libertarianism|right-libertarian]] orientations, support gun and property rights. These however take a backseat to traditional and religious morality, if a conflict between them arises. In particular, this differentiates [[anarcho-conservatism]] from [[anarcho-capitalism]].<ref>{{Cite web|url=https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=conservative%20anarchist|title=Urban Dictionary: conservative anarchist|website=Urban Dictionary|language=en-US|access-date=2018-11-28}}</ref>

Like all [[Libertarianism|libertarians]], [[Anarcho-conservatism|conservative anarchists]] oppose state coercion, and like all [[Right-libertarianism|right-libertarians]], they don't oppose natural, traditional or socioeconomic hierarchies. In fact, they typically welcome them. [[Anarcho-conservatism]] has much in common with [[paleolibertarianism]], except for the support of right wing populists in political elections.<ref>{{Cite news|url=https://libertarianuniverse.com/2015/08/20/anarcho-conservatism-explained-by-vincent-john/|title=Anarcho-Conservatism Explained|date=2015-08-20|work=LibertarianUniverse: A Right-Libertarian Blog|access-date=2018-11-28|language=en-US}}</ref> [[Christian anarchism|Christian anarchists]], [[Anarchism and Orthodox Judaism|Orthodox Jewish anarchists]] and [[Anarchism and Islam|religious Muslim anarchists]] are [[Anarcho-conservatism|anarcho-conservatives]]. Like all [[Anarchism|anarchists]], they may recognise them, and live under their rule, but reject and resist their authority in every instance they can.

[[Anarcho-conservatism]] is closely associated with [[libertarian conservatism]] and [[anarcho-capitalism]].<ref>{{Cite web | url=https://www.theburkean.co.uk/anarcho-conservatism-even-thing/ | title=Anarcho-conservatism – is that even a thing?| date=October 2017}}</ref> Writing in the [[World Policy Journal]], [[New York University|NYU]] professor James Nolt<ref>{{Cite web | url=https://as.nyu.edu/content/nyu-as/as/faculty/james-nolt.html | title=James Nolt}}</ref> noted that [[anarcho-conservatism]] is becoming "increasingly fashionable."<ref>{{cite news |last1=James H. Nolt |title=TRUMP’S INEFFECTIVE PROTECTIONISM |url=https://worldpolicy.org/2017/05/04/trumps-ineffective-protectionism/ |accessdate=20 December 2018 |work=[[World Policy Journal]] |date=4 May 2017 |quote=the ideology of increasingly fashionable anarcho-conservatism,}}</ref>

== History ==

=== Old Testament ===
[[Jacques Ellul]], a French philosopher and [[Christian anarchism|Christian anarchist]], notes that the final verse of the [[Book of Judges]] (Judges 21:25) states that there was no king in Israel and that "everyone did as they saw fit".<ref>
{{cite book |title=Christian Anarchism: A Political Commentary on the Gospel |last=Christoyannopoulos |first=Alexandre |authorlink=Alexandre Christoyannopoulos |year=2010 |publisher=Imprint Academic |location=Exeter |isbn= |pages=84–88 |url= |accessdate= |quote=Old Testament}}
</ref><ref name=ellul1>
{{cite book |title=Anarchy and Christianity |last=Ellul |first=Jacques |authorlink=Jacques Ellul |year=1988 |publisher=[[William B. Eerdmans Publishing Co.]] |location=Michigan |isbn= 9780802804952|pages=47–48
|url=https://books.google.com/books?id=55_Oa12YTt0C
|accessdate= 2014-05-11
}}
</ref><ref>
[http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Judges%2021:25&version=NIV BibleGateway.com - Passage Lookup: Judges 21:25]: "In those days there was no king in Israel: every man did that which was right in his own eyes."
</ref> Subsequently, as recorded in the first [[Books of Samuel|Book of Samuel]] (1 Samuel 8) the [[Israelites|people of Israel]] wanted a king "so as to be like other nations".<ref name=":0">
{{cite book |title=Anarchy and Christianity |last=Ellul |first=Jacques
|authorlink=Jacques Ellul |year=1988 |publisher=Wm. B. Eerdmans
|location=Michigan |isbn= 9780802804952
|page =48
|url=https://books.google.com/books?id=55_Oa12YTt0C
|accessdate= 2014-05-11
}}
</ref><ref>
{{cite web
| url = http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1%20Samuel%208&version=NIV
| title = 1 Samuel 8 (New International Version)
| website = Bible Gateway
| publisher = HarperCollins Christian Publishing
| accessdate = 2014-05-12
}}
</ref> God declared that the people had rejected him as their king. He warned that a human king would lead to [[militarism]], [[conscription]] and [[Tax#History|taxation]], and that their pleas for mercy from the king's demands would go unanswered. [[Samuel]] passed on God's warning to the Israelites but they still demanded a king, and [[Saul]] became their ruler.<ref>
{{cite web
| url = http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1%20Samuel%209&version=NIV
| title = 1 Samuel 9 (New International Version)
| website = Bible Gateway
| publisher = HarperCollins Christian Publishing
| accessdate = 2014-05-11}}
</ref><ref name=":0" /> Much of the subsequent [[Old Testament]] chronicles the Israelites trying to live with this decision.<ref>
{{cite book|title=Christian Anarchy: Jesus' Primacy Over the Powers|author=Vernard Eller
|publisher=Wm. B. Eerdmans|year=1987|url=http://www.hccentral.com/eller12/part8.html}}
</ref>

=== Modern age ===
<blockquote>Anarchists will often be against the revolution precisely because they distrust political or military means, because they see the possibility of organising through the civil or economic means, and gradually letting the state wither. The subjugated English did not need to rebel against their Norman despots: they outlasted them, living in ways the Normans could not be bothered with, of trade and and the common tongue. Perhaps it was a device the English had borrowed from the Welsh, the older British: why isn't Welsh a Romance language, like French or Spanish? Is it that the British were too deeply enslaved even to learn the Roman tongue, or is it that they waited the Romans out, and thereafter remembered only as a distant Emperor whom the British, in fantasy, defeated? The British do like to fantasise about empire, but the great mass of them are very ill-disposed to bother about running such a thing. The betrayed and dispossessed inhabitants of the American continent could similarly make no serious fight of it against a tyrant state, and had better keep their customs quietly and engage in private, economic means. All such anarchistically inclined peoples, in fact, are best called [[Anarcho-conservatism|anarcho-conservatives]].<ref>{{Cite book|url=https://books.google.com.au/books?id=HF6FAgAAQBAJ&lpg=PA90|title=The Political Animal: Biology, Ethics and Politics|last=Clark|first=Stephen R. L.|last2=Clark|first2=Stephen R. L.|date=2002-01-04|publisher=Routledge|isbn=9781134658602|language=en}}</ref></blockquote>

<blockquote>The Young England movement of the 1830s and ‘40s argued that the more feudal models of traditional aristocracy and land ownership within the framework of communities which are self-policing (i.e. each community is autonomous rather than imposed by the state) was the best path to liberty, rather than mainstream liberal models. In short, [[Anarcho-conservatism|tory anarchists]] might have defended traditional and hereditary institutions like monarchy and aristocracy, but they had anarchist sympathies in the sense that they did not believe in a centralised, unitary government, and sometimes saw a reactionary counterrevolution as the only path to political success.<ref>{{Cite news|url=https://www.theburkean.co.uk/anarcho-conservatism-even-thing/|title=Anarcho-conservatism – Is that even a thing?|date=2017-10-01|work=The Burkean|access-date=2018-11-28|language=en-GB}}</ref></blockquote>

<blockquote>The idea of a [[Anarcho-conservatism|tory anarchist]] was first coined by [[George Orwell|Orwell]] to describe both [[Jonathan Swift]] and himself, and at its broadest it describes someone who is both a radical and a traditionalist. To be a Tory anarchist, then, is to embrace all manner of contradictions. It is a defence of good manners, good grammar, local customs and practices, respect for the individual and for privacy and an overwhelming hostility to the expanding power of the modern state. … Orwell saw Tory anarchism as a part of Britain's, mainly England's, rich social history, manifesting itself in particular figures at different times and places. These figures include not only Swift but Parson Bull, [[William Cobbett]], [[Henry Phillpotts|Bishop Phillpotts]] and [[Richard Oastler]].<ref>{{Cite book|title=The strange case of Tory anarchism|last=1963-|first=Wilkin, Peter|date=2010|publisher=Libri Pub|isbn=9781907471100|location=Faringdon, Oxfordshire|oclc=662410383}}</ref></blockquote>

<blockquote>There’s not a [[Anarcho-conservatism|tory anarchist]] tradition exactly, but the label has been applied, with good reason, to writers like [[Albert Jay Nock]], [[Evelyn Waugh|Evelyn]] and [[Auberon Waugh]], [[H. L. Mencken|Mencken]], [[Florence King]], [[Dwight Macdonald]], even [[George Orwell|Orwell]] and [[Max Beerbohm]].<ref name="auto">{{Cite news|url=https://ordinary-times.com/2011/01/03/tory-anarchism-in-america-an-interview-with-daniel-mccarthy/|title=Tory Anarchism in America: An Interview with Daniel McCarthy - Ordinary Times|last=Kain|first=Erik|date=2011-01-03|work=Ordinary Times|access-date=2018-11-28|language=en-US}}</ref></blockquote>

<blockquote>[[Albert Jay Nock|Nock]]’s short-lived but provocative monthly provided perhaps the only intelligent and consistent critique of Fascism from the American Right. Unlike so many champions of “American individualism,” [[Albert Jay Nock|Nock]] was one of the few to see that Fascism posed a threat to free enterprise as great as that of Communism. Watching the Fascists maneuver to change Italy's electoral system, he observed that replacing majoritarian for plurality representation would only return the country to the authoritarianism of the Bourbon age. “The Fascisti are right, of course, when they say that democracy will not work in a great centralized State,” declared one of the last sincere [[Jeffersonian democracy|Jeffersonians]] in America; “but does it follow of necessity that democracy must be sacrificed, in order that the State may survive? There is an alternative possibility which promises something better than a return to the tyranny of the past.” In another instance, when Judge Elbert Gary was quoted as having asked “whether we don’t think we need a man like Mussolini” in America, Nock concluded that businessmen secretly lusted after a powerful state in order to crush organized labor. “In Italy today political government fulfills its natural coercive function more frankly and directly than under the old fashioned parliamentary forms; and to Americans of a certain type the system may seem well worthy of emulation." Unfortunately other spokesmen for the intellectual Right lacked [[Albert Jay Nock|Nock]]'s [[Anarcho-conservatism|anarcho-conservative]] suspicion of the centralized state.<ref>{{Cite book|url=https://books.google.com/?id=sWB9BgAAQBAJ&lpg=PA209&dq=%22anarcho-conservative%22&pg=PA209#v=onepage&q=%22anarcho-conservative%22&f=false|title=Mussolini and Fascism: The View from America|last=Diggins|first=John Patrick|date=2015-03-08|publisher=Princeton University Press|isbn=9781400868063|language=en}}</ref></blockquote>

<blockquote>[[Hans-Hermann Hoppe|Hoppe]] generally describes himself as libertarian or [[Anarcho-capitalism|anarcho-capitalist]], but I cannot see that he would reject the ultra-conservative label, or I certainly do not see how can do so consistently, since he prefers [[monarchy]] to [[democracy]]. That is he prefers rule by one hereditary individual to rule by a representative assembly, or by [[direct democracy]], and clearly regards the global move from monarchy to democracy as regrettable. His explanation is that a hereditary ruler has a great interest in maintaining the state since it belongs to that ruler and the descendants of that ruler in perpetuity. The hereditary ruler’s interest in maintaining the state is certainly greater than that of elected politicians, as these politicians are temporary and have a greater interest in extracting resources from the state than in maintaining it’s long term existence.<ref>{{Cite news|url=http://www.stephankinsella.com/2009/09/hoppe-habermas%E2%80%99s-anarcho-conservative-student/|title=Hoppe: Habermas’s Anarcho-Conservative Student|work=StephanKinsella.com|access-date=2018-11-28|language=en-us}}</ref></blockquote>

<blockquote>Let us explain what we mean by the term [[anarcho-conservatism]]. Readers familiar with [[Friedrich Hayek|Hayek]]'s ''[[The Constitution of Liberty]]'' probably remember that [[Friedrich Hayek|Hayek]] discusses in his book two distinct types of liberalism: there is a continental brand of liberalism, which is concerned with positive freedoms; and there is an Anglo-saxon stream of liberalism, which is concerned with negative freedoms. [https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gottfried_Dietze Dietze's] liberalism, like [[Friedrich Hayek|Hayek]]'s liberalism, was concerned with negative freedom, which is the freedom from coercion, the freedom to say no. The anarchic component of [https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gottfried_Dietze Dietze's] [[anarcho-conservatism]] derived from his commitment to negative freedom.<ref>{{cite news |last1=Riccardo Pelizzo |title=Who Was Gottfried Dietze? |url=https://mises.org/library/who-was-gottfried-dietze |accessdate=20 December 2018 |work=Mises Institute |date=11 August 2006}}</ref></blockquote>

== Anarcho-conservative quotes from notable authors ==

=== Shmaayah (c. 100 BCE) ===
[[Shmaya (tanna)|Shmaayah]] was a [[Rabbi|rabbinic]] sage in the early [[Mishnah|pre-Mishnaic]] era.<blockquote>Love work, loath mastery over others, and avoid intimacy with the government.<ref>{{Cite web|url=https://www.chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/2165/jewish/Chapter-One.htm|title=Ethics of the Fathers: Chapter One|website=www.chabad.org|language=en|access-date=2018-12-08}}</ref> ([[Pirkei Avot|Avot]] 1:10)</blockquote>

=== Gamliel III (c. 177 – 225) ===
[[Gamliel III]], son of [[Judah ha-Nasi]] the redactor of the [[Mishnah]], and his successor as Nasi (patriarch).<blockquote>Be careful with the government, for they befriend a person only for their own needs. They appear to be friends when it is beneficial to them, but they do not stand by a person at the time of ''his'' distress.<ref>{{Cite web|url=https://www.chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/2011/jewish/Chapter-Two.htm|title=Ethics of the Fathers: Chapter Two|website=www.chabad.org|language=en|access-date=2018-12-08}}</ref> ([[Pirkei Avot|Avot]] 2:3)</blockquote>

=== Petr Chelčický (c. 1390 – c. 1460) ===
[[Petr Chelčický]] was a Christian and political author in 15th century Bohemia (now the Czech Republic).<blockquote>He who obeys God needs no other authority.<ref>{{Cite book|url=https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/The_Net_of_Faith|title=Net of Faith|last=Chelčický|first=Petr}}</ref></blockquote>

=== Leo Tolstoy (1828 – 1910) ===
[[Leo Tolstoy]] was a Russian writer regarded as one of the greatest authors of all time, best known for his novels ''[[War and Peace]]'' (1869) and ''[[Anna Karenina]]'' (1877), often cited as pinnacles of [[Literary realism|realist]] fiction.

<blockquote>Government is violence, Christianity is meekness, non-resistance, love. And, therefore, government cannot be Christian, and a man who wishes to be a Christian must not serve government.<ref>{{Cite book|url=https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Letter_to_Dr._Eugen_Heinrich_Schmitt|title=Letter to Dr. Eugen Heinrich Schmitt|last=Tolstoy|first=Leo}}</ref>

For a Christian the oath of allegiance to any government whatever — the very act which is regarded as the foundation of the existence of a state — is a direct renunciation of Christianity. For the man who promises unconditional obedience in the future to laws, made or to be made, by that very promise is in the most, positive manner renouncing Christianity, which means obeying in every circumstance of life only the divine law of love he recognizes within him.<ref>{{Cite book|url=https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/The_Kingdom_of_God_Is_Within_You|title=The Kingdom of God is within you|last=Tolstoy|first=Leo}}</ref>

Christianity in its true sense puts an end to government. So it was understood at its very commencement; it was for that cause that Christ was crucified. So it has always been understood by people who were not under the necessity of justifying a Christian government. Only from the time that the heads of government assumed an external and nominal Christianity, men began to invent all the impossible, cunningly devised theories by means of which Christianity can be reconciled with government. But no honest and serious-minded man of our day can help seeing the incompatibility of true Christianity — the doctrine of meekness, forgiveness of injuries, and love — with government, with its pomp, acts of violence, executions, and wars. The profession of true Christianity not only excludes the possibility of recognizing government, but even destroys its very foundations.<ref>{{Cite book|url=https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/The_Kingdom_of_God_Is_Within_You|title=The Kingdom of God is within you|last=Tolstoy|first=Leo}}</ref>

Christ says, "Do not resist evil." The sole object of courts of law is – to resist evil. Christ enjoins us to return good for evil. Courts of law return evil for evil. Christ says, "Make no distinction between the just and the unjust." Courts of law do nothing else. Christ says, "Forgive all. Forgive not once, not seven times, but forgive without end." "Love your enemies." "Do good to those who hate you." Courts of law do not forgive, but they punish; they do not do good, but evil, to those whom they call the enemies of society. So, the true sense of the doctrine is that Christ forbids all courts of law.<ref>{{Cite book|url=https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/What_I_Believe_(Tolstoy)|title=What I Believe|last=Tolstoy|first=Leo}}</ref>

It would seem inevitable that we must repudiate one of the two, either Christianity with its love of God and one's neighbor, or the State with its armies and wars. Perhaps Christianity may be obsolete, and when choosing between the two — Christianity and love of the State and murder — the people of our time will conclude that the existence of the State and murder is more important than Christianity. Perhaps we must forgo Christianity and retain only what is important: the State and murder. That may be so — at least people may think and feel so. But in that case they should say so! They should openly admit that people in our time have ceased to believe in what the collective wisdom of mankind has said, and what is said by the Law of God they profess: have ceased to believe in what is written indelibly on the heart of each man, and must now believe only in what is ordered by various people who by accident or birth have happened to become emperors and kings, or by various intrigues and elections have become presidents or members of senates and parliaments — even if those orders include murder. That is what they ought to say! But it is impossible to say it; and yet one of these two things has to be said. If it is admitted that Christianity forbids murder, both armies and governments become impossible. And if it is admitted that government acknowledges the lawfulness of murder and denies Christianity, no one will wish to obey a government that exists merely by its power to kill.<ref>{{Cite book|url=https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Last_Message_to_Mankind|title=Last Message to Mankind|last=Tolstoy|first=Leo}}</ref></blockquote>

=== David Lipscomb (1831–1917) ===
[[David Lipscomb]] was a religious minister, [[Christian pacifism|Christian pacifist]], author and leader in the American [[Restoration Movement]].<blockquote>All the wars and strifes between tribes, races, nations, from the beginning until now, have been the result of man's effort to govern himself and the world, rather than to submit to the government of God. … God has always kept on earth a government of his own. … In Eden the government was direct, individual and personal. God spoke directly to man and gave specific commands to be obeyed. … Every one who honors and serves the human government and relies upon it, for good, more than he does upon the Divine government, worships and serves the creature more than he does the Creator. … Human government, the embodied effort of man to rule the world without God, ruled over by "the prince of this world," the devil. Its mission is to execute wrath and vengeance here on earth. Human government bears the same relation to hell as the church bears to heaven. … It is the duty of the Christian to submit to the human government in its office and work and to seek its destruction only by spreading the religion of Christ and so converting men from service to the earthly government to service to the heavenly one, and so, too, by removing the necessity for its existence and work. No violence, no sword, no bitterness or wrath can he use. The spread of the peaceful principles of the Savior, will draw men out of the kingdoms of earth into the kingdom of God.<ref>{{Cite book|url=http://archive.org/details/CivilGovernment|title=Civil Government: Its Origin, Mission and Destiny, and the Christian's Relation to It|last=David Lipscomb|date=1913|publisher=McQuiddy Printing, Nashville|others=Memorial University of Newfoundland Dr. Hans Rollmann|language=English}}</ref></blockquote>

=== Heber Newton (1840 – 1914) ===
[[R. Heber Newton]] was a prominent American [[Episcopal Church (United States)|Episcopalian]] priest and writer.<blockquote>Anarchism is in reality the ideal of political and social science, and also the ideal of religion. It is the ideal to which Jesus Christ looked forward. Christ founded no church, established no state, gave practically no laws, organized no government and set up no external authority, but he did seek to write on the hearts of men God's law and make them self-legislating.<ref>{{Cite book|url=https://books.google.com/books/about/Free_Speech_for_Radicals.html?id=K6SFAAAAMAAJ|title=Free Speech for Radicals|last=Schroeder|first=Theodore|date=1916|publisher=Free Speech League|language=en}}</ref></blockquote>

=== Albert Jay Nock (1870 – 1945) ===
[[Albert Jay Nock]] was the editor of ''[[The Freeman]]'' and ''[[The Nation]]''.<blockquote>Everyone knows that the State claims and exercises the monopoly of crime that I spoke of a moment ago, and that it makes this monopoly as strict as it can. It forbids private murder, but itself organizes murder on a colossal scale. It punishes private theft, but itself lays unscrupulous hands on anything it wants, whether the property of citizen or alien. There is, for example, no human right, natural or Constitutional, that we have not seen nullified by the United States Government. Of all the crimes that are committed for gain or revenge, there is not one that we have not seen it commit — murder, mayhem, arson, robbery, fraud, criminal collusion and connivance.<ref>{{Cite book|url=https://books.google.com.au/books?id=Sosy1SDXYNUC|title=On Doing the Right Thing|last=Nock|first=Albert Jay|date=1956|publisher=Ludwig von Mises Institute|isbn=9781610163781|language=en}}</ref></blockquote>

=== J.R.R. Tolkien (1892 – 1973) ===
[[J. R. R. Tolkien]] was [[Merton Professors|Professor of English Language and Literature]] at [[University of Oxford|Oxford University]], and the author of ''[[The Hobbit]]'', ''[[The Lord of the Rings]]'', and ''[[The Silmarillion]]''.<blockquote>My political opinions lean more and more to Anarchy (philosophically understood, meaning the abolition of control not whiskered men with bombs) — or to ‘unconstitutional’ Monarchy. I would arrest anybody who uses the word State (in any sense other than the inanimate real of England and its inhabitants, a thing that has neither power, rights nor mind); and after a chance of recantation, execute them if they remained obstinate! … Government is an abstract noun meaning the art and process of governing and it should be an offence to write it with a capital G or so to refer to people … The most improper job of any many, even saints (who at any rate were at least unwilling to take it on), is bossing other men. Not one in a million is fit for it, and least of all those who seek the opportunity … There is only one bright spot and that is the growing habit of disgruntled men of dynamating factories and power-stations; I hope that, encouraged now as ‘patriotism’, may remain a habit! But it won’t do any good, if it is not universal.<ref>{{Cite book|url=https://books.google.com/?id=9eLCAgAAQBAJ&printsec=frontcover&dq=The+Letters+of+J.R.R.+Tolkien|title=The Letters of J.R.R. Tolkien|last=Tolkien|first=J. R. R.|date=2014-02-21|publisher=Houghton Mifflin Harcourt|isbn=9780544363793|language=en}}</ref></blockquote>

=== Martin Niemöller (1892 – 1984) ===
[[Martin Niemöller]] was a German anti-Nazi theologian and Lutheran pastor, best known for his widely-paraphrased statement [[First they came ...|"First they came…"]].<blockquote>I began my political responsibility as an ultra-conservative. I wanted the Kaiser to come back; and now I am a revolutionary. I really mean that. If I live to be a hundred I shall maybe be an anarchist, for an anarchist wants to do without all government.<ref>{{Cite book|url=https://books.google.com/books/about/Martin_Niem%C3%B6ller_1892_1984.html?id=FHodAAAAIAAJ|title=Martin Niemöller, 1892-1984|last=Bentley|first=James|date=1984|publisher=Free Press|isbn=9780029027301|language=en}}</ref></blockquote>

=== Sayyid Qutb (1906 – 1966) ===
[[Sayyid Qutb]] was an [[Islam|Islamic]] theorist and leading member of the [[Muslim Brotherhood]].<blockquote>This religion is really a universal declaration of the freedom of man from servitude to other men and from servitude to his own desires, which is also a form of human servitude; it is a declaration that sovereignty belongs to God alone and that He is the Lord of all the worlds. It means a challenge to all kinds and forms of systems which are based on the concept of the sovereignty of man; in other words, where man has usurped the Divine attribute. Any system in which the final decisions are referred to human beings, and in which the sources of all authority are human, deifies human beings by designating others than God as lords over men. … The way to establish God's rule on earth is not that some consecrated people - the priests - be given the authority to rule, as was the case with the rule of the Church, nor that some spokesmen of God become rulers, as is the case in a 'theocracy'. To establish God's rule means that His laws be enforced and that the final decision in all affairs be according to these laws. … This universal declaration of the freedom of man on the earth from every authority except that of God, and the declaration that sovereignty is God's alone and that He is the Lord of the universe, is not merely a theoretical, philosophical and passive proclamation. It is a positive, practical and dynamic message with a view to bringing about the implementation of the Shari'ah of God and actually freeing people from their servitude to other men to bring them into the service of God, the One without associates.<ref>{{Cite book|url=https://books.google.com.au/books?id=r-NmjgEACAAJ|title=Milestones|last=Quṭb|first=Sayyid|date=2010|publisher=Kazi Publications Incorporated|isbn=9780934905145|language=en}}</ref></blockquote>

=== Ivan Illich (1926 – 2002) ===
[[Ivan Illich]] was a [[Roman Catholic]] priest, and critic of the institutions of modern [[Western culture]], particularly compulsory [[mass education]] as in his 1971 groundbreaking book ''[[Deschooling Society]]''.<blockquote>Jesus was an anarchist savior. That's what the Gospels tell us.<ref>{{Cite web|url=http://www.davidtinapple.com/illich/1988_Educational.html|title=1988 The Educational enterprise in the Light of the Gospel|website=www.davidtinapple.com|access-date=2018-12-20}}</ref></blockquote>

=== Paul Weyrich (1942 – 2008) ===
[[Paul Weyrich]] was the co-founder of [[The Heritage Foundation]], [[The Free Congress Foundation]], and the [[American Legislative Exchange Council]].<blockquote>I believe that we probably have lost the culture war. That doesn’t mean the war is not going to continue, and that it isn’t going to be fought on other fronts. But in terms of society in general, we have lost. This is why, even when we win in politics, our victories fail to translate into the kind of policies we believe are important. Therefore, what seems to me a legitimate strategy for us to follow is to look at ways to separate ourselves from the institutions that have been captured by the ideology of Political Correctness, or by other enemies of our traditional culture. I would point out to you that the word "holy" means "set apart", and that it is not against our tradition to be, in fact, "set apart". You can look in the Old Testament, you can look at Christian history. You will see that there were times when those who had our beliefs were definitely in the minority and it was a band of hardy monks who preserved the culture while the surrounding society disintegrated.<ref>{{Cite web|url=https://web.archive.org/web/20000815232714/http://www.freecongress.org:80/fcf/specials/weyrichopenltr.htm|title=Free Congress Foundation Online ---|date=2000-08-15|access-date=2018-11-28}}</ref></blockquote>

=== Hans-Hermann Hoppe (b. 1949) ===
[[Hans-Hermann Hoppe]] is Professor Emeritus of Economics at the [[University of Nevada, Las Vegas]], Senior Fellow of the [[Ludwig von Mises Institute]], and founder and president of the [[Property and Freedom Society]].<blockquote>Many libertarians hold the view that all that is needed to maintain a libertarian social order is the strict enforcement of the non-aggression principle (NAP). Otherwise, as long as one abstains from aggression, according to their view, the principle of “live and let live” should hold. Yet surely, while this “live and let live” sounds appealing to adolescents in rebellion against parental authority and all social convention and control (and many youngsters have been initially attracted to libertarianism believing that this “live and let live” is the essence of libertarianism), and while the principle does indeed hold and apply for people living far apart and dealing with each other only indirectly and from afar, it does ''not'' hold and apply, or rather it is ''insufficient'', when it comes to people living in close proximity to each other, as neighbors and cohabitants of the same community.</blockquote><blockquote>A simple example suffices to make the point. Assume a new next-door neighbor. This neighbor does not aggress against you or your property in any way, but he is a “bad” neighbor. He is littering on his own neighboring property, turning it into a garbage heap; in the open, for you to see, he engages in ritual animal slaughter, he turns his house into a “Freudenhaus,” a bordello, with clients coming and going all day and all night long; he never offers a helping hand and never keeps any promise that he has made; or he cannot or else he refuses to speak to you in your own language. Etc., etc.. Your life is turned into a nightmare. Yet you may not use violence against him, because he has not aggressed against you. What can you do? You can shun and ostracize him. But your neighbor does not care, and in any case you alone thus ‘punishing’ him makes little if any difference to him. You have to have the communal respect and authority, or you must turn to someone who does, to persuade and convince everyone or at least most of the members of your community to do likewise and make the bad neighbor a social outcast, so as to exert enough pressure on him to sell his property and leave. …</blockquote><blockquote>The lesson? The peaceful cohabitation of neighbors and of people in regular direct contact with each other on some territory – a tranquil, convivial social order – requires also a commonality of culture: of language, religion, custom and convention. There can be peaceful co-existence of different cultures on distant, physically separated territories, but multi-culturalism, cultural heterogeneity, cannot exist in one and the same place and territory without leading to diminishing social trust, increased tension, and ultimately the call for a “strong man” and the destruction of anything resembling a libertarian social order.<ref>{{Cite news|url=https://misesuk.org/2017/10/20/libertarianism-and-the-alt-right-hoppe-speech-2017/|title=Libertarianism and the Alt-Right (Hoppe Speech, 2017)|date=2017-10-19|work=The Ludwig von Mises Centre|access-date=2018-11-28|language=en-US}}</ref></blockquote>

=== Daniel McCarthy ===
Daniel McCarthy is the editor of ''[[Modern Age (periodical)|Modern Age]],'' director of the Robert Novak Journalism Fellowship Program at [[The Fund for American Studies]], and former editor of ''[[The American Conservative]]'' (2010 – 2016).<blockquote>Conservatism and anarchism share some historical background, as reactions against liberalism, and they share some critiques of liberalism.  It’s not that liberalism — broadly construed to include the “classical” variety in practice as well as the modern version — is the worst socio-political system imaginable.  The various totalitarianisms of the 20th century were far worse, and anarchists and conservatives alike have to be careful that in making a deep critique of liberalism they’re not opening the door to something far deadlier. But liberalism is not the end of history, and it’s not the final picture of justice. Under the guise of democracy and markets, and human rights, various kinds of powers and interests are able to run quite unchecked.<ref name="auto"/></blockquote>

=== Alexander Salter ===
Alexander Salter is Assistant Professor of Economics in the [[Rawls College of Business]], and the Comparative Economics Research Fellow at [[Texas Tech University]]'s Free Market Institute.<blockquote>Embracing anarchy does not require conservatives to embrace violent revolution, or even civil disobedience. But for their own sake, as well as the sake of the civilization which they love, conservatives can and should deny the state’s legitimacy, on the grounds that it is destructive of the true, the good, and the beautiful. Affirming sovereignty in the hopes it may someday fall within conservative hands is a siren song that must be resisted.<ref>{{Cite news|url=https://theimaginativeconservative.org/2017/10/conservatism-seek-destroy-state-alexander-salter.html|title=Should Conservatism Seek to Destroy the State? ~ The Imaginative Conservative|date=2017-10-17|work=The Imaginative Conservative|access-date=2018-11-28|language=en-US}}</ref></blockquote>

=== Tripp York ===
[[Tripp York]] is a [[Mennonites|Mennonite]] writer who teaches religious studies at Virginia Wesleyan College in Norfolk, VA.<blockquote>[[Christian anarchism]] is not a revolutionary politic for it denies the legitimacy of revolution. This is a call for something far more subversive than the replacing of one regime with another. Regime change has been the model of worldly power since its inception. Instead, [[Christian anarchism]] rejects the very presuppositions that make the idea of revolution, and, perhaps, even liberation itself, intelligible. Jesus is neither exemplified in [[Che Guevara]] or [[Simon the Zealot]]. He had no desire to destroy or replace the kingdoms that surrounded him with a different ruler; instead, he established a community of believers who developed and reside in the ''altera civitas'' on earth: the church.<ref>{{Cite book|url=https://books.google.com/books/about/Living_on_Hope_While_Living_in_Babylon.html?id=bdjPDAAAQBAJ|title=Living on Hope While Living in Babylon: The Christian Anarchists of the 20th Century|last=York|first=Tripp|date=2009-04-23|publisher=Wipf and Stock Publishers|isbn=9781498275040|language=en}}</ref></blockquote>

== References ==
{{Reflist}}


[[Category:Philosophical movements]]
[[Category:Politics]]
[[Category:Libertarianism]]
[[Category:Libertarianism in the United States]]
[[Category:Conservatism in the United States]]
[[Category:Anarchism]]
[[Category:Political philosophy]]
[[Category:Libertarianism| Form]]
[[Category:Libertarianism by form]]
[[Category:Libertarian Party (United States)|Libertarian Party]]
[[Category:Political systems]]
[[Category:Right-libertarianism]]

User talk:DavidB4

2019-01-01T05:18:03Z

WisdomTooth3: template typo

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Archives: [[User talk:DavidB4/Archive 1|1]], [[User talk:DavidB4/Archive 2|2]], [[User talk:DavidB4/Archive 3|3]]
 Last change made by {{REVISIONUSER}} on {{REVISIONMONTH}}/{{REVISIONDAY}}/{{REVISIONYEAR}} 
'''Feel free to post any questions or comments here. If you don't hear back from me, try e-mailing me also.'''
 
__TOC__

== Move request ==

Hallo. I need your help to move two pages as I made errors in their titles.

One of them is "Sarah Brown Liberal Democrat".
It has been suggested I change this to "Sarah Brown (UK Politician)" as most readers are American. I just need to figure out how to do this.

The second is "Jane Samantha Fae alias John Ozimek" which should read Jane Francesca Fae. I would be very grateful if you could please shift those for me. [[User:GraceDalrymple|GraceDalrymple]]

:Yes, I saw the discussion. I have moved those two pages, as requested. Moving pages is restricted to administrators and SysOps, so it is not your fault, as if you just can't figure out how to move pages...the wiki will not let you. No need to feel bad about it!
:I am happy to help, so just let me know if/when you need further assistance. It's no trouble! --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 14:41, 27 September 2018 (EDT)

Would you please move [[Qanon]] to [[QAnon]]? --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 09:37, 3 November 2018 (EDT)
:In addition to the above, would you please move [[:Category:Christian social reformers]] for capitalization. --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 15:58, 4 November 2018 (EST)
::Both done --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 18:00, 6 November 2018 (EST)

Another move request: would you please fix the spelling error in this image title (the word "official" specifically)? [[:File:Enrique Peña Nieto oficial pic.jpg]] --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 15:15, 1 December 2018 (EST)

:I think that actually may be deliberate (see: https://www.facebook.com/Enrique-Peña-Nieto-Oficial-1708563375863631). I don't mind moving it if you still think that is needed, but it is protected so someone will need to unlock it first. --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 17:28, 1 December 2018 (EST)

::Good point -- it's probably Spanish. However, we are an English-language encyclopedia, so it might still be good to change it. --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 08:38, 3 December 2018 (EST)

:::My Spanish is very rusty, but that was my assumption. I'm fine with moving it though. Want me to ask Andy to unlock it? --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 22:30, 3 December 2018 (EST)

::::I would appreciate that. Thanks! --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 23:10, 3 December 2018 (EST)

:::::Done! [[:File:Enrique Peña Nieto oficial pic.jpg]] --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 22:05, 4 December 2018 (EST)

::::::Would you please move this page to capitalize the "M": [[Javier milei]]? Also, please watch your email. --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 17:03, 6 December 2018 (EST)

:::::::Moved. I just thinking about email... --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 17:05, 6 December 2018 (EST)

::::::::Would you please move [[Ilana mercer]] to [[Ilana Mercer]] and delete the new redirect? --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 08:48, 11 December 2018 (EST)

Done. I have been sometimes leaving the redirects (for a while) so that new editors who don't know how to use RC can still find their pages. However, that may be unnecessary, and since I see you usually delete the redirect anyway, I will plan on just deleting the redirect in the future. --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 17:29, 11 December 2018 (EST)
:Thanks! Regarding redirects, I guess it depends on the specific article. I'm fine deciding case-by-case, since redirects might be more necessary for some articles over others. --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 17:36, 11 December 2018 (EST)
::Hello DavidB4, would you please move [[Eastern Empires vs Western Empires]] to be an essay? I would rather delete it, but it just seems like a low-quality opinion article that could just be reformatted as such. --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 15:13, 20 December 2018 (EST)

:::Done. I was tempted to delete it also, especially considering that it seems to have been made by a disposable account. However, I was waiting to see what others thought. --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 17:02, 20 December 2018 (EST)

While I'm reluctant to rename my "Donald Trump achievements" articles so long after creation, it probably would be a good idea to move [[Donald Trump achievements: Immigration, illegal immigration, and border security]] to [[Donald Trump achievements: Immigration and border security]]. If you agree this is a good idea, would you please do it, and would you then delete the redirect and change every link where I (or someone else) has linked it? Then, I will begin doing the 2-3 article splits I told you about. --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 08:35, 31 December 2018 (EST)

:I agree--that is a repetitive name, so a move makes sense. I have moved the page, and clean up most of the links to the old name. However, I have a little bit of a time crunch right now, so I'm going to need to leave one thing undone: [[Donald Trump]] needs to be unlocked so the link can be updated. I can ask for the unlock later, or you can if you get there first. --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 17:02, 31 December 2018 (EST)

==Hi==
hi and thank you for move sugguestion to sting. [[User:Massaq25|Massaq25]] ([[User talk:Massaq25|talk]]) 18:23, 29 September 2018 (EDT)
:Hello, and you're welcome! Do you agree? I'm open to other suggestions, I just don't think that "sting" is a sufficiently descriptive title. --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 18:27, 29 September 2018 (EDT)
::DavidB4, I would appreciate it if you would move the page now. No need for a move tag (nobody's going to comment there anyway). --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 23:29, 29 September 2018 (EDT)
:::Moved to [[Steve Borden]] with a redirect from "Sting (wrestler)" --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 01:09, 30 September 2018 (EDT)

== Quotes ==
Those quotes weren't my own, you should know that, they're from actual people. Also, if it's debatable, then please by all means...refute me. --[[User:Makuta Makaveli|Makuta Makaveli]] ([[User talk:Makuta Makaveli|talk]]) 02:48, 1 December 2018 (EST)
:I'm obviously not DavidB4, but I will still point out that a simple Google search shows it's very debatable: [https://health.usnews.com/health-news/health-wellness/articles/2014/07/07/is-abstinence-unhealthy 1],[http://www.nbcnews.com/id/36084314/ns/health-sexual_health/t/no-sex-may-be-no-fun-it-unhealthy/#.XAKfVmhKhPY 2],[https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/jun/09/sex-celibacy-friendships-women 3],[https://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-1077378/I-gave-sex-years-ago--best-thing-I-did.html 4] -- the info you added was undue weight, considering the overall size of the article, and it falsely implied that abstinence is a bad thing for your health. It appears that it is only when you really want to have sex and you don't. --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 09:58, 1 December 2018 (EST)
::Yes, it was a very one-sided argument, which is factually questionable. Without getting unnecessarily descriptive, the body does have ways of dealing with some of the stated issues. Research is sketchy if even existent on several of the things you mentioned. Additionally, the first paragraph was written as your own, mot a quote, even though is was a direct copy-and-paste from another source. (That is by definition plagiarism--taking credit for someone else's work.) --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 13:03, 1 December 2018 (EST)
::: ''So what are the health benefits of sex, besides relieving stress and helping you fall asleep? Studies have shown that regular sex has a protective effect on the heart, lowering the risk of heart attack in men. For both men and women, “It increases blood flow to the genitals and probably helps the immune system,” Herbenick says. “All things being equal, it’s also fun when things are going well [in your relationship.]”
''So abstaining – especially long-term – can carry some physical consequences. In women, it can cause the atrophying of underused vaginal or hip muscles, Lindau says. Vaginismus is a common condition characterized by hypersensitivity of the muscles around the opening of the vagina, she adds. Those muscles – along with the pelvic floor muscles – are important for controlling penetration, and they need to be in a relaxed state during sexual intercourse. If they are hyper-contracted – not necessarily from abstinence itself, but accumulated fear or anticipation of the first sexual experience – sex can be very painful. “They say it feels like he’s hit a wall,” Lindausays, adding that vaginismus can be treated.''

I said refute me, but instead you give me extra arguments. Thank you so much. --[[User:Makuta Makaveli|Makuta Makaveli]] ([[User talk:Makuta Makaveli|talk]]) 14:20, 1 December 2018 (EST)
:Neither of us are arguing that sex is bad or harmful -- all of the articles I cited said that sex can be good, but abstinence can also be good. You're committing a fallacy by assuming that just because sex is good means that abstinence is bad.
:Unless you get STDs or anything like that from sex, it is just as good as abstinence. The articles made it clear that abstinence does not have harmful side-effects. You need to read the cited articles better. --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 14:30, 1 December 2018 (EST)
::: I guess the only real way to settle this is to get actual data from the field. [[User:Makuta Makaveli|Makuta Makaveli]] ([[User talk:Makuta Makaveli|talk]]) 15:18, 1 December 2018 (EST)
::::Makuta, are you pushing sex outside of marriage between husband and wife in this website? [[User:Karajou|Karajou]] ([[User talk:Karajou|talk]]) 15:37, 1 December 2018 (EST)
:::::No, I'm pushing for knowledge of the dangers of lifelong abstinence. But even if I was, then there's nothing you can do about it so why are you asking? --[[User:Makuta Makaveli|Makuta Makaveli]] ([[User talk:Makuta Makaveli|talk]]) 20:22, 1 December 2018 (EST)
::::::"''dangers of lifelong abstinence''" -- That's ridiculous, and choosing not to have sex (especially outside of heterosexual marriage) is normal, and sex outside of marriage can actually be dangerous (if there are STDs involved). Many people have been abstinent and turned out just fine. You're distorting the facts to make it seem like it's a necessity to have sex in order to be healthy, and if you don't there's a medical problem, when in reality neither option is inherently harmful.
::::::"''But even if I was, then there's nothing you can do about it''" If I'm understanding you correctly, as admins, we can do something about it. --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 20:44, 1 December 2018 (EST)

:::::::"''If I'm understanding you correctly, as admins, we can do something about it.''"

:::::::Haha! '''Can'''... --[[User:Makuta Makaveli|Makuta Makaveli]] ([[User talk:Makuta Makaveli|talk]]) 21:34, 1 December 2018 (EST)

::::::::Want me to turn it into a "'''Will'''"? --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 21:54, 1 December 2018 (EST)

:::::::::Action without cause. To pardon is true power but you have nothing to pardon, I'm giving you no trouble. --[[User:Makuta Makaveli|Makuta Makaveli]] ([[User talk:Makuta Makaveli|talk]]) 22:01, 1 December 2018 (EST)

Makuta Makaveli either has an agenda, or gets his/her information from people who have an agenda to promote casual sex by making abstinence look like a "health hazard." The Atheist YouTuber "MrRepzion" also claimed that one needed to have "trial sex" to see if the two are "sexually compatible." It would help CP if the articles had information debunking these claims [[User:Shobson20|Shobson20]] ([[User talk:Shobson20|talk]]) 12:08, 2 December 2018 (EST)

:Most people argue that there is "no harm" in casual sex--that has become a common claim (although some say is is risky due to STDs). Because of this, there are plentiful materials arguing that claim. However, it is much harder to find support for this claim that is is actually unhealthy to abstain by choice. I've seen a few unscientific blog posts, etc. about it, but nothing verifiable. That doesn't mean it doesn't exist (there is always someone willing to write a paper on some fringe belief which people want to hear--just look at chocolate, for example, where they like to disregard the health costs of sugar and just look at the pure chocolate, which by the way tastes pretty bad on its own) but I'm not finding proof.
:Shobson20, the "try it before you buy it" idea is certainly nothing new in personal relationships. I suspect you are correct in linking these two, as people who would like to engage in this practice would like to have something like this to point to as a defense for their actions. --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 00:54, 3 December 2018 (EST)

== Why did I get blocked by "Minuteman?" ==

I was fixing the damage that "My password is green" was doing. I sometimes notice vandals before CP's admins do, and sometimes I try to help. [[User:Shobson20|Shobson20]] ([[User talk:Shobson20|talk]]) 19:23, 15 December 2018 (EST)

:I replied to your email. You did nothing wrong. Thank you for your vigilance, and I apologize for the this! --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 19:30, 15 December 2018 (EST)

::What are the qualifications for becoming a sysop on this site? I would like to be able to help by stopping the trolls and vandals who frequently attack this site. [[User:Shobson20|Shobson20]] ([[User talk:Shobson20|talk]]) 19:38, 15 December 2018 (EST)

:::As best I can tell, there is no official criteria. However, this page might be useful to answer some basic questions: [[Conservapedia:User_rights]]. Typically, SysOp rights are given to users who have been editing for some time, and proven themselves trustworthy. I don't think there is a specific checklist that you can do, to get these rights. However, the one responsible for promotions is [[User:Aschlafly]], so you might be able to get a better idea from him as to what he specifically looks for. --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 20:59, 15 December 2018 (EST)

I too have just been blocked by {{user|Minuteman}}. I copied over the WP article for [[anarcho-conservatism]], which the WP zealots are about to delete. The text there is mine, though most of the article is still in quotes from references, as more text is needed (hence why I brought it here). — [[User:WisdomTooth3|WisdomTooth3]] ([[User talk:WisdomTooth3|talk]]) 00:17, 1 January 2019 (EST)

== Merge proposal ==

What do you think about this merge request: [[Talk:Carbon cycle (astronomy)]]? I am inclined to support it, but it's probably a good idea to get more than one opinion on it. --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 11:32, 29 December 2018 (EST)

:I've never really studies that specific topic, but the proposal sounds fine to me. I looked up "carbon cycle" and found a great deal of information, but on the wrong topic. From my limited understanding, a merge sounds like a good idea. --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 14:30, 29 December 2018 (EST)
== tag at bottom of pages "quotation templates" ==

Many of the content pages I create use quotes of other web content. At the bottom of the articles I created using quotes, there is a tag at the bottom of the pages indicating "quotation templates". This is a new and unwanted development.

For example, please look at the bottom of this web page: [[Atheism and mental illness]].

Can we get the "quotation templates" tag to not be there. Before they never used to be there. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 21:37, 29 December 2018 (EST)

:I made a small mistake, but cannot fix it until [[:template:cquote]] is unlocked again. I'm sorry about that--I should have noticed sooner. Someone needs to add the "noinclude" tags to the category link. If someone unlocks the page, I will fix the issue. Again, sorry about that! --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 23:23, 29 December 2018 (EST)
::I unlocked the page.[[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 23:25, 29 December 2018 (EST)

:::Thanks, I believe I fixed it. You can lock it again. --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 23:36, 29 December 2018 (EST)
::::Thanks for fixing the issue. I appreciate it.[[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 23:37, 29 December 2018 (EST)

:::::Any time! Thanks for pointing it out! --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 23:46, 29 December 2018 (EST)

== Request ==

Would you please check [[Alejandro Garcia Padilla]] for originality? It could be, but many of the refs are formatted like on Wikipedia. --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 19:34, 30 December 2018 (EST)

:Of course! It definitely originated from WP. Slightly edited, but still copied. See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alejandro_García_Padilla --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 20:12, 30 December 2018 (EST)

::You beat me to it. Obvious copy from WP, with slight alterations. You don't need to check reference format; just check the text. [[User:SamHB|SamHB]] ([[User talk:SamHB|talk]]) 20:19, 30 December 2018 (EST)

:::Would you please delete all the portions that are copied? --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 20:42, 30 December 2018 (EST)

::::I'll take another look, but I think the whole thing needs to go. Also, this is not the first time. See: [[User_talk:HectorCruz66#Originality]] --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 20:45, 30 December 2018 (EST)
:::::Oh, and I didn't mean to ignore you, Sam. Thanks for checking also! You're right--just looking at the pages shows all you need to know. --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 20:54, 30 December 2018 (EST)
::::::Deleting it, then, is the best option. Would you please do that? --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 21:22, 30 December 2018 (EST)

:::::::Sure. I'm still looking at it, but sure, I'll delete it unless I find a reason not to. --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 21:37, 30 December 2018 (EST)

User talk:DavidB4

2019-01-01T05:17:00Z

WisdomTooth3: I too was blocked

<big>'''<big><center>[http://www.conservapedia.com/index.php?title=User_talk:DavidB4&action=edit&section=new Post a new message]</center></big>'''</big>
Archives: [[User talk:DavidB4/Archive 1|1]], [[User talk:DavidB4/Archive 2|2]], [[User talk:DavidB4/Archive 3|3]]
 Last change made by {{REVISIONUSER}} on {{REVISIONMONTH}}/{{REVISIONDAY}}/{{REVISIONYEAR}} 
'''Feel free to post any questions or comments here. If you don't hear back from me, try e-mailing me also.'''
 
__TOC__

== Move request ==

Hallo. I need your help to move two pages as I made errors in their titles.

One of them is "Sarah Brown Liberal Democrat".
It has been suggested I change this to "Sarah Brown (UK Politician)" as most readers are American. I just need to figure out how to do this.

The second is "Jane Samantha Fae alias John Ozimek" which should read Jane Francesca Fae. I would be very grateful if you could please shift those for me. [[User:GraceDalrymple|GraceDalrymple]]

:Yes, I saw the discussion. I have moved those two pages, as requested. Moving pages is restricted to administrators and SysOps, so it is not your fault, as if you just can't figure out how to move pages...the wiki will not let you. No need to feel bad about it!
:I am happy to help, so just let me know if/when you need further assistance. It's no trouble! --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 14:41, 27 September 2018 (EDT)

Would you please move [[Qanon]] to [[QAnon]]? --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 09:37, 3 November 2018 (EDT)
:In addition to the above, would you please move [[:Category:Christian social reformers]] for capitalization. --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 15:58, 4 November 2018 (EST)
::Both done --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 18:00, 6 November 2018 (EST)

Another move request: would you please fix the spelling error in this image title (the word "official" specifically)? [[:File:Enrique Peña Nieto oficial pic.jpg]] --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 15:15, 1 December 2018 (EST)

:I think that actually may be deliberate (see: https://www.facebook.com/Enrique-Peña-Nieto-Oficial-1708563375863631). I don't mind moving it if you still think that is needed, but it is protected so someone will need to unlock it first. --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 17:28, 1 December 2018 (EST)

::Good point -- it's probably Spanish. However, we are an English-language encyclopedia, so it might still be good to change it. --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 08:38, 3 December 2018 (EST)

:::My Spanish is very rusty, but that was my assumption. I'm fine with moving it though. Want me to ask Andy to unlock it? --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 22:30, 3 December 2018 (EST)

::::I would appreciate that. Thanks! --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 23:10, 3 December 2018 (EST)

:::::Done! [[:File:Enrique Peña Nieto oficial pic.jpg]] --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 22:05, 4 December 2018 (EST)

::::::Would you please move this page to capitalize the "M": [[Javier milei]]? Also, please watch your email. --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 17:03, 6 December 2018 (EST)

:::::::Moved. I just thinking about email... --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 17:05, 6 December 2018 (EST)

::::::::Would you please move [[Ilana mercer]] to [[Ilana Mercer]] and delete the new redirect? --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 08:48, 11 December 2018 (EST)

Done. I have been sometimes leaving the redirects (for a while) so that new editors who don't know how to use RC can still find their pages. However, that may be unnecessary, and since I see you usually delete the redirect anyway, I will plan on just deleting the redirect in the future. --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 17:29, 11 December 2018 (EST)
:Thanks! Regarding redirects, I guess it depends on the specific article. I'm fine deciding case-by-case, since redirects might be more necessary for some articles over others. --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 17:36, 11 December 2018 (EST)
::Hello DavidB4, would you please move [[Eastern Empires vs Western Empires]] to be an essay? I would rather delete it, but it just seems like a low-quality opinion article that could just be reformatted as such. --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 15:13, 20 December 2018 (EST)

:::Done. I was tempted to delete it also, especially considering that it seems to have been made by a disposable account. However, I was waiting to see what others thought. --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 17:02, 20 December 2018 (EST)

While I'm reluctant to rename my "Donald Trump achievements" articles so long after creation, it probably would be a good idea to move [[Donald Trump achievements: Immigration, illegal immigration, and border security]] to [[Donald Trump achievements: Immigration and border security]]. If you agree this is a good idea, would you please do it, and would you then delete the redirect and change every link where I (or someone else) has linked it? Then, I will begin doing the 2-3 article splits I told you about. --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 08:35, 31 December 2018 (EST)

:I agree--that is a repetitive name, so a move makes sense. I have moved the page, and clean up most of the links to the old name. However, I have a little bit of a time crunch right now, so I'm going to need to leave one thing undone: [[Donald Trump]] needs to be unlocked so the link can be updated. I can ask for the unlock later, or you can if you get there first. --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 17:02, 31 December 2018 (EST)

==Hi==
hi and thank you for move sugguestion to sting. [[User:Massaq25|Massaq25]] ([[User talk:Massaq25|talk]]) 18:23, 29 September 2018 (EDT)
:Hello, and you're welcome! Do you agree? I'm open to other suggestions, I just don't think that "sting" is a sufficiently descriptive title. --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 18:27, 29 September 2018 (EDT)
::DavidB4, I would appreciate it if you would move the page now. No need for a move tag (nobody's going to comment there anyway). --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 23:29, 29 September 2018 (EDT)
:::Moved to [[Steve Borden]] with a redirect from "Sting (wrestler)" --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 01:09, 30 September 2018 (EDT)

== Quotes ==
Those quotes weren't my own, you should know that, they're from actual people. Also, if it's debatable, then please by all means...refute me. --[[User:Makuta Makaveli|Makuta Makaveli]] ([[User talk:Makuta Makaveli|talk]]) 02:48, 1 December 2018 (EST)
:I'm obviously not DavidB4, but I will still point out that a simple Google search shows it's very debatable: [https://health.usnews.com/health-news/health-wellness/articles/2014/07/07/is-abstinence-unhealthy 1],[http://www.nbcnews.com/id/36084314/ns/health-sexual_health/t/no-sex-may-be-no-fun-it-unhealthy/#.XAKfVmhKhPY 2],[https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/jun/09/sex-celibacy-friendships-women 3],[https://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-1077378/I-gave-sex-years-ago--best-thing-I-did.html 4] -- the info you added was undue weight, considering the overall size of the article, and it falsely implied that abstinence is a bad thing for your health. It appears that it is only when you really want to have sex and you don't. --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 09:58, 1 December 2018 (EST)
::Yes, it was a very one-sided argument, which is factually questionable. Without getting unnecessarily descriptive, the body does have ways of dealing with some of the stated issues. Research is sketchy if even existent on several of the things you mentioned. Additionally, the first paragraph was written as your own, mot a quote, even though is was a direct copy-and-paste from another source. (That is by definition plagiarism--taking credit for someone else's work.) --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 13:03, 1 December 2018 (EST)
::: ''So what are the health benefits of sex, besides relieving stress and helping you fall asleep? Studies have shown that regular sex has a protective effect on the heart, lowering the risk of heart attack in men. For both men and women, “It increases blood flow to the genitals and probably helps the immune system,” Herbenick says. “All things being equal, it’s also fun when things are going well [in your relationship.]”
''So abstaining – especially long-term – can carry some physical consequences. In women, it can cause the atrophying of underused vaginal or hip muscles, Lindau says. Vaginismus is a common condition characterized by hypersensitivity of the muscles around the opening of the vagina, she adds. Those muscles – along with the pelvic floor muscles – are important for controlling penetration, and they need to be in a relaxed state during sexual intercourse. If they are hyper-contracted – not necessarily from abstinence itself, but accumulated fear or anticipation of the first sexual experience – sex can be very painful. “They say it feels like he’s hit a wall,” Lindausays, adding that vaginismus can be treated.''

I said refute me, but instead you give me extra arguments. Thank you so much. --[[User:Makuta Makaveli|Makuta Makaveli]] ([[User talk:Makuta Makaveli|talk]]) 14:20, 1 December 2018 (EST)
:Neither of us are arguing that sex is bad or harmful -- all of the articles I cited said that sex can be good, but abstinence can also be good. You're committing a fallacy by assuming that just because sex is good means that abstinence is bad.
:Unless you get STDs or anything like that from sex, it is just as good as abstinence. The articles made it clear that abstinence does not have harmful side-effects. You need to read the cited articles better. --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 14:30, 1 December 2018 (EST)
::: I guess the only real way to settle this is to get actual data from the field. [[User:Makuta Makaveli|Makuta Makaveli]] ([[User talk:Makuta Makaveli|talk]]) 15:18, 1 December 2018 (EST)
::::Makuta, are you pushing sex outside of marriage between husband and wife in this website? [[User:Karajou|Karajou]] ([[User talk:Karajou|talk]]) 15:37, 1 December 2018 (EST)
:::::No, I'm pushing for knowledge of the dangers of lifelong abstinence. But even if I was, then there's nothing you can do about it so why are you asking? --[[User:Makuta Makaveli|Makuta Makaveli]] ([[User talk:Makuta Makaveli|talk]]) 20:22, 1 December 2018 (EST)
::::::"''dangers of lifelong abstinence''" -- That's ridiculous, and choosing not to have sex (especially outside of heterosexual marriage) is normal, and sex outside of marriage can actually be dangerous (if there are STDs involved). Many people have been abstinent and turned out just fine. You're distorting the facts to make it seem like it's a necessity to have sex in order to be healthy, and if you don't there's a medical problem, when in reality neither option is inherently harmful.
::::::"''But even if I was, then there's nothing you can do about it''" If I'm understanding you correctly, as admins, we can do something about it. --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 20:44, 1 December 2018 (EST)

:::::::"''If I'm understanding you correctly, as admins, we can do something about it.''"

:::::::Haha! '''Can'''... --[[User:Makuta Makaveli|Makuta Makaveli]] ([[User talk:Makuta Makaveli|talk]]) 21:34, 1 December 2018 (EST)

::::::::Want me to turn it into a "'''Will'''"? --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 21:54, 1 December 2018 (EST)

:::::::::Action without cause. To pardon is true power but you have nothing to pardon, I'm giving you no trouble. --[[User:Makuta Makaveli|Makuta Makaveli]] ([[User talk:Makuta Makaveli|talk]]) 22:01, 1 December 2018 (EST)

Makuta Makaveli either has an agenda, or gets his/her information from people who have an agenda to promote casual sex by making abstinence look like a "health hazard." The Atheist YouTuber "MrRepzion" also claimed that one needed to have "trial sex" to see if the two are "sexually compatible." It would help CP if the articles had information debunking these claims [[User:Shobson20|Shobson20]] ([[User talk:Shobson20|talk]]) 12:08, 2 December 2018 (EST)

:Most people argue that there is "no harm" in casual sex--that has become a common claim (although some say is is risky due to STDs). Because of this, there are plentiful materials arguing that claim. However, it is much harder to find support for this claim that is is actually unhealthy to abstain by choice. I've seen a few unscientific blog posts, etc. about it, but nothing verifiable. That doesn't mean it doesn't exist (there is always someone willing to write a paper on some fringe belief which people want to hear--just look at chocolate, for example, where they like to disregard the health costs of sugar and just look at the pure chocolate, which by the way tastes pretty bad on its own) but I'm not finding proof.
:Shobson20, the "try it before you buy it" idea is certainly nothing new in personal relationships. I suspect you are correct in linking these two, as people who would like to engage in this practice would like to have something like this to point to as a defense for their actions. --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 00:54, 3 December 2018 (EST)

== Why did I get blocked by "Minuteman?" ==

I was fixing the damage that "My password is green" was doing. I sometimes notice vandals before CP's admins do, and sometimes I try to help. [[User:Shobson20|Shobson20]] ([[User talk:Shobson20|talk]]) 19:23, 15 December 2018 (EST)

:I replied to your email. You did nothing wrong. Thank you for your vigilance, and I apologize for the this! --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 19:30, 15 December 2018 (EST)

::What are the qualifications for becoming a sysop on this site? I would like to be able to help by stopping the trolls and vandals who frequently attack this site. [[User:Shobson20|Shobson20]] ([[User talk:Shobson20|talk]]) 19:38, 15 December 2018 (EST)

:::As best I can tell, there is no official criteria. However, this page might be useful to answer some basic questions: [[Conservapedia:User_rights]]. Typically, SysOp rights are given to users who have been editing for some time, and proven themselves trustworthy. I don't think there is a specific checklist that you can do, to get these rights. However, the one responsible for promotions is [[User:Aschlafly]], so you might be able to get a better idea from him as to what he specifically looks for. --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 20:59, 15 December 2018 (EST)

I too have just been blocked by {{u|Minuteman}}. I copied over the WP article for [[anarcho-conservatism]], which the WP zealots are about to delete. The text there is mine, though most of the article is still in quotes from references, as more text is needed (hence why I brought it here). — [[User:WisdomTooth3|WisdomTooth3]] ([[User talk:WisdomTooth3|talk]]) 00:17, 1 January 2019 (EST)

== Merge proposal ==

What do you think about this merge request: [[Talk:Carbon cycle (astronomy)]]? I am inclined to support it, but it's probably a good idea to get more than one opinion on it. --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 11:32, 29 December 2018 (EST)

:I've never really studies that specific topic, but the proposal sounds fine to me. I looked up "carbon cycle" and found a great deal of information, but on the wrong topic. From my limited understanding, a merge sounds like a good idea. --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 14:30, 29 December 2018 (EST)
== tag at bottom of pages "quotation templates" ==

Many of the content pages I create use quotes of other web content. At the bottom of the articles I created using quotes, there is a tag at the bottom of the pages indicating "quotation templates". This is a new and unwanted development.

For example, please look at the bottom of this web page: [[Atheism and mental illness]].

Can we get the "quotation templates" tag to not be there. Before they never used to be there. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 21:37, 29 December 2018 (EST)

:I made a small mistake, but cannot fix it until [[:template:cquote]] is unlocked again. I'm sorry about that--I should have noticed sooner. Someone needs to add the "noinclude" tags to the category link. If someone unlocks the page, I will fix the issue. Again, sorry about that! --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 23:23, 29 December 2018 (EST)
::I unlocked the page.[[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 23:25, 29 December 2018 (EST)

:::Thanks, I believe I fixed it. You can lock it again. --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 23:36, 29 December 2018 (EST)
::::Thanks for fixing the issue. I appreciate it.[[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 23:37, 29 December 2018 (EST)

:::::Any time! Thanks for pointing it out! --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 23:46, 29 December 2018 (EST)

== Request ==

Would you please check [[Alejandro Garcia Padilla]] for originality? It could be, but many of the refs are formatted like on Wikipedia. --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 19:34, 30 December 2018 (EST)

:Of course! It definitely originated from WP. Slightly edited, but still copied. See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alejandro_García_Padilla --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 20:12, 30 December 2018 (EST)

::You beat me to it. Obvious copy from WP, with slight alterations. You don't need to check reference format; just check the text. [[User:SamHB|SamHB]] ([[User talk:SamHB|talk]]) 20:19, 30 December 2018 (EST)

:::Would you please delete all the portions that are copied? --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 20:42, 30 December 2018 (EST)

::::I'll take another look, but I think the whole thing needs to go. Also, this is not the first time. See: [[User_talk:HectorCruz66#Originality]] --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 20:45, 30 December 2018 (EST)
:::::Oh, and I didn't mean to ignore you, Sam. Thanks for checking also! You're right--just looking at the pages shows all you need to know. --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 20:54, 30 December 2018 (EST)
::::::Deleting it, then, is the best option. Would you please do that? --[[User:1990'sguy|1990'sguy]] ([[User talk:1990'sguy|talk]]) 21:22, 30 December 2018 (EST)

:::::::Sure. I'm still looking at it, but sure, I'll delete it unless I find a reason not to. --[[User:DavidB4|David B]] ([[User talk:DavidB4|TALK]]) 21:37, 30 December 2018 (EST)