https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=Debate:Creationist&feed=atom&action=historyDebate:Creationist - Revision history2024-03-28T14:40:06ZRevision history for this page on the wikiMediaWiki 1.24.2https://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=Debate:Creationist&diff=1506821&oldid=prevDavidB4-bot: /* Jzyehoshua's Arguments for Creationism */HTTP --> HTTPS, replaced: http://www.thedailybeast.com → https://www.thedailybeast.com2019-04-02T06:57:20Z<p><span dir="auto"><span class="autocomment">Jzyehoshua's Arguments for Creationism: </span>HTTP --> HTTPS, replaced: http://www.thedailybeast.com → https://www.thedailybeast.com</span></p>
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<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* 1. The fossil record is entirely contrary to the theory of evolution, as shown by the development of Punctuated Equilibrium. The famous paper by Gould and Eldredge on Punctuated Equilibrium acknowledges that, "Under the influence of phyletic gradualism, the rarity of transitional series remains as our persistent bugbear. From the reputable claims of a Cuvier or Agassiz to the jibes of modern cranks and fundamentalists, it has stood as the bulwark of anti-evolution arguments: 'For evolution to be true there had to be thousands, millions of transitional forms making an unbroken chain' (Anon., 1967-From a Jehovah's Witnesses pamphlet)."<ref>http://www.blackwellpublishing.com/ridley/classictexts/eldredge.asp</ref> Evolutionary theory, in short, is unable to explain the complete lack of transitional forms. Rather than showing constant, gradual transitions between species, instead it shows only microevolution but not macro, with very minimal evolution within species where they do not change controversially at the Genus level, and then suddenly, poof - whole new complexity in the fossil record. Punctuated Equilibrium sought to explain away the evidence of the fossil record by suggesting evolution went too rapidly during short periods (punctuated) and very slowly the rest of the time (equilibrium).<ref>http://evolution.berkeley.edu/evosite/evo101/VIIA1bPunctuated.shtml</ref>  </div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* 1. The fossil record is entirely contrary to the theory of evolution, as shown by the development of Punctuated Equilibrium. The famous paper by Gould and Eldredge on Punctuated Equilibrium acknowledges that, "Under the influence of phyletic gradualism, the rarity of transitional series remains as our persistent bugbear. From the reputable claims of a Cuvier or Agassiz to the jibes of modern cranks and fundamentalists, it has stood as the bulwark of anti-evolution arguments: 'For evolution to be true there had to be thousands, millions of transitional forms making an unbroken chain' (Anon., 1967-From a Jehovah's Witnesses pamphlet)."<ref>http://www.blackwellpublishing.com/ridley/classictexts/eldredge.asp</ref> Evolutionary theory, in short, is unable to explain the complete lack of transitional forms. Rather than showing constant, gradual transitions between species, instead it shows only microevolution but not macro, with very minimal evolution within species where they do not change controversially at the Genus level, and then suddenly, poof - whole new complexity in the fossil record. Punctuated Equilibrium sought to explain away the evidence of the fossil record by suggesting evolution went too rapidly during short periods (punctuated) and very slowly the rest of the time (equilibrium).<ref>http://evolution.berkeley.edu/evosite/evo101/VIIA1bPunctuated.shtml</ref>  </div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* 2. Numerous fossils discovered in recent years are contrary to conventional evolutionary theory, showing unusual complexity or that previously supposed descendants coexisted and thus could not be evolved from one another. E.g., Ardi, Sahelanthropus, and Orrorin Tungenensis show signs of bipedality and complexity, even though they are dated radiometrically as millions of years older than the alleged human-ape split around 3-4 million years ago. Erectus and Habilis coexisted. Ramidus and Afarensis (Lucy) coexisted. I wrote the page, "Recent Controversy in Hominid Ancestry" providing numerous sources regarding these finds.<ref>http://creationwiki.org/Recent_controversy_in_hominid_ancestry</ref> As a result of them, the human evolutionary tree is now being called a "messy bush".<ref><del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">http</del>://www.thedailybeast.com/newsweek/2007/08/07/the-human-family-shrub.html<br>https://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/26/science/26ance.html?pagewanted=all<br>http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2009/10/091001-oldest-human-skeleton-ardi-missing-link-chimps-ardipithecus-ramidus.html<br>http://discovermagazine.com/2011/may/25-homo-sapiens-meet-new-astounding-family/article_view?b_start:int=3&-C=<br>http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2001-03-22/news/0103220207_1_early-species-direct-human-ancestor-human-ancestry<br>https://www.nytimes.com/2007/08/09/science/09fossil.html</ref> According to Encyclopaedia Britannica's current dating of Australopiths, Ar. kaddaba and Ar. ramidus coexisted; A. afarensis, K. platyops, A. bahrelgazali, and A. africanus all coexisted; P. aethiopicus, A. africanus, A. garhi, H. habilis, and H. rudolfensis all coexisted; and A. sediba, P. boisei, H. rudolfensis, and H. habilis all coexisted as well.<ref>https://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/44115/Australopithecus</ref></div></td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* 2. Numerous fossils discovered in recent years are contrary to conventional evolutionary theory, showing unusual complexity or that previously supposed descendants coexisted and thus could not be evolved from one another. E.g., Ardi, Sahelanthropus, and Orrorin Tungenensis show signs of bipedality and complexity, even though they are dated radiometrically as millions of years older than the alleged human-ape split around 3-4 million years ago. Erectus and Habilis coexisted. Ramidus and Afarensis (Lucy) coexisted. I wrote the page, "Recent Controversy in Hominid Ancestry" providing numerous sources regarding these finds.<ref>http://creationwiki.org/Recent_controversy_in_hominid_ancestry</ref> As a result of them, the human evolutionary tree is now being called a "messy bush".<ref><ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">https</ins>://www.thedailybeast.com/newsweek/2007/08/07/the-human-family-shrub.html<br>https://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/26/science/26ance.html?pagewanted=all<br>http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2009/10/091001-oldest-human-skeleton-ardi-missing-link-chimps-ardipithecus-ramidus.html<br>http://discovermagazine.com/2011/may/25-homo-sapiens-meet-new-astounding-family/article_view?b_start:int=3&-C=<br>http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2001-03-22/news/0103220207_1_early-species-direct-human-ancestor-human-ancestry<br>https://www.nytimes.com/2007/08/09/science/09fossil.html</ref> According to Encyclopaedia Britannica's current dating of Australopiths, Ar. kaddaba and Ar. ramidus coexisted; A. afarensis, K. platyops, A. bahrelgazali, and A. africanus all coexisted; P. aethiopicus, A. africanus, A. garhi, H. habilis, and H. rudolfensis all coexisted; and A. sediba, P. boisei, H. rudolfensis, and H. habilis all coexisted as well.<ref>https://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/44115/Australopithecus</ref></div></td></tr>
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<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>--[[User:Jzyehoshua|Jzyehoshua]] 20:17, 20 July 2012 (EDT)</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>--[[User:Jzyehoshua|Jzyehoshua]] 20:17, 20 July 2012 (EDT)</div></td></tr>
</table>DavidB4-bothttps://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=Debate:Creationist&diff=1456665&oldid=prevDavidB4-bot: HTTP --> HTTPS [#1], replaced: http://www.nytimes.com → https://www.nytimes.com (2), http://en.wikipedia.org → https://en.wikipedia.org, http://www.britannica.com → https://www.britannica.com2018-09-27T02:11:40Z<p>HTTP --> HTTPS [#1], replaced: http://www.nytimes.com → https://www.nytimes.com (2), http://en.wikipedia.org → https://en.wikipedia.org, http://www.britannica.com → https://www.britannica.com</p>
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<td colspan='2' style="background-color: white; color:black; text-align: center;">← Older revision</td>
<td colspan='2' style="background-color: white; color:black; text-align: center;">Revision as of 02:11, September 27, 2018</td>
</tr><tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno">Line 40:</td>
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<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>::(As an aside: While I'm not an expert, it appears to me as if a partial shift to a more precise term has already happened: I saw the term "Creation Scientist" more often lately, but that (obviously) only applies to, you know, scientists and not the average John Doe. It also doesn't solve the potential confusion about "a creation".)</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>::(As an aside: While I'm not an expert, it appears to me as if a partial shift to a more precise term has already happened: I saw the term "Creation Scientist" more often lately, but that (obviously) only applies to, you know, scientists and not the average John Doe. It also doesn't solve the potential confusion about "a creation".)</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>::Fact is that the opposition has to call them ''something''. "Creationism" and "Creationist" seem to be the most widely recognized terms, officially used (for example) by the Northwest Creation Network.</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>::Fact is that the opposition has to call them ''something''. "Creationism" and "Creationist" seem to be the most widely recognized terms, officially used (for example) by the Northwest Creation Network.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>::Speaking from personal experience, nobody in these parts of the world thinks that a "Creationist" believes in the Flying Spaghetti Monster or [<del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">http</del>://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Origin_belief some other] story. However, if you want to be precise, then those articles could be edited to specify "Young Earth Creationist" (or "Old Earth Creationist") where applicable. It would be more precise, but on this site, it would strike me as somewhat redundant. --[[User:JakeC|JakeC]] 14:47, 26 December 2007 (EST)</div></td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>::Speaking from personal experience, nobody in these parts of the world thinks that a "Creationist" believes in the Flying Spaghetti Monster or [<ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">https</ins>://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Origin_belief some other] story. However, if you want to be precise, then those articles could be edited to specify "Young Earth Creationist" (or "Old Earth Creationist") where applicable. It would be more precise, but on this site, it would strike me as somewhat redundant. --[[User:JakeC|JakeC]] 14:47, 26 December 2007 (EST)</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>I can fully appreciate your concern over the pejorative connotation that the term has acquired since it is looked on with disdain by many in the intelligentsia. I guess I prefer to continue to use the term in its denotative sense, and on the occasions when it is used in a pejorative connotation, show that that usage is unreasonable and uncharitable.  [[User:Qwestor|Qwestor]] 08:01, 27 December 2007 (EST)</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>I can fully appreciate your concern over the pejorative connotation that the term has acquired since it is looked on with disdain by many in the intelligentsia. I guess I prefer to continue to use the term in its denotative sense, and on the occasions when it is used in a pejorative connotation, show that that usage is unreasonable and uncharitable.  [[User:Qwestor|Qwestor]] 08:01, 27 December 2007 (EST)</div></td></tr>
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<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* 1. The fossil record is entirely contrary to the theory of evolution, as shown by the development of Punctuated Equilibrium. The famous paper by Gould and Eldredge on Punctuated Equilibrium acknowledges that, "Under the influence of phyletic gradualism, the rarity of transitional series remains as our persistent bugbear. From the reputable claims of a Cuvier or Agassiz to the jibes of modern cranks and fundamentalists, it has stood as the bulwark of anti-evolution arguments: 'For evolution to be true there had to be thousands, millions of transitional forms making an unbroken chain' (Anon., 1967-From a Jehovah's Witnesses pamphlet)."<ref>http://www.blackwellpublishing.com/ridley/classictexts/eldredge.asp</ref> Evolutionary theory, in short, is unable to explain the complete lack of transitional forms. Rather than showing constant, gradual transitions between species, instead it shows only microevolution but not macro, with very minimal evolution within species where they do not change controversially at the Genus level, and then suddenly, poof - whole new complexity in the fossil record. Punctuated Equilibrium sought to explain away the evidence of the fossil record by suggesting evolution went too rapidly during short periods (punctuated) and very slowly the rest of the time (equilibrium).<ref>http://evolution.berkeley.edu/evosite/evo101/VIIA1bPunctuated.shtml</ref>  </div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* 1. The fossil record is entirely contrary to the theory of evolution, as shown by the development of Punctuated Equilibrium. The famous paper by Gould and Eldredge on Punctuated Equilibrium acknowledges that, "Under the influence of phyletic gradualism, the rarity of transitional series remains as our persistent bugbear. From the reputable claims of a Cuvier or Agassiz to the jibes of modern cranks and fundamentalists, it has stood as the bulwark of anti-evolution arguments: 'For evolution to be true there had to be thousands, millions of transitional forms making an unbroken chain' (Anon., 1967-From a Jehovah's Witnesses pamphlet)."<ref>http://www.blackwellpublishing.com/ridley/classictexts/eldredge.asp</ref> Evolutionary theory, in short, is unable to explain the complete lack of transitional forms. Rather than showing constant, gradual transitions between species, instead it shows only microevolution but not macro, with very minimal evolution within species where they do not change controversially at the Genus level, and then suddenly, poof - whole new complexity in the fossil record. Punctuated Equilibrium sought to explain away the evidence of the fossil record by suggesting evolution went too rapidly during short periods (punctuated) and very slowly the rest of the time (equilibrium).<ref>http://evolution.berkeley.edu/evosite/evo101/VIIA1bPunctuated.shtml</ref>  </div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* 2. Numerous fossils discovered in recent years are contrary to conventional evolutionary theory, showing unusual complexity or that previously supposed descendants coexisted and thus could not be evolved from one another. E.g., Ardi, Sahelanthropus, and Orrorin Tungenensis show signs of bipedality and complexity, even though they are dated radiometrically as millions of years older than the alleged human-ape split around 3-4 million years ago. Erectus and Habilis coexisted. Ramidus and Afarensis (Lucy) coexisted. I wrote the page, "Recent Controversy in Hominid Ancestry" providing numerous sources regarding these finds.<ref>http://creationwiki.org/Recent_controversy_in_hominid_ancestry</ref> As a result of them, the human evolutionary tree is now being called a "messy bush".<ref>http://www.thedailybeast.com/newsweek/2007/08/07/the-human-family-shrub.html<br><del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">http</del>://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/26/science/26ance.html?pagewanted=all<br>http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2009/10/091001-oldest-human-skeleton-ardi-missing-link-chimps-ardipithecus-ramidus.html<br>http://discovermagazine.com/2011/may/25-homo-sapiens-meet-new-astounding-family/article_view?b_start:int=3&-C=<br>http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2001-03-22/news/0103220207_1_early-species-direct-human-ancestor-human-ancestry<br><del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">http</del>://www.nytimes.com/2007/08/09/science/09fossil.html</ref> According to Encyclopaedia Britannica's current dating of Australopiths, Ar. kaddaba and Ar. ramidus coexisted; A. afarensis, K. platyops, A. bahrelgazali, and A. africanus all coexisted; P. aethiopicus, A. africanus, A. garhi, H. habilis, and H. rudolfensis all coexisted; and A. sediba, P. boisei, H. rudolfensis, and H. habilis all coexisted as well.<ref><del class="diffchange diffchange-inline">http</del>://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/44115/Australopithecus</ref></div></td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* 2. Numerous fossils discovered in recent years are contrary to conventional evolutionary theory, showing unusual complexity or that previously supposed descendants coexisted and thus could not be evolved from one another. E.g., Ardi, Sahelanthropus, and Orrorin Tungenensis show signs of bipedality and complexity, even though they are dated radiometrically as millions of years older than the alleged human-ape split around 3-4 million years ago. Erectus and Habilis coexisted. Ramidus and Afarensis (Lucy) coexisted. I wrote the page, "Recent Controversy in Hominid Ancestry" providing numerous sources regarding these finds.<ref>http://creationwiki.org/Recent_controversy_in_hominid_ancestry</ref> As a result of them, the human evolutionary tree is now being called a "messy bush".<ref>http://www.thedailybeast.com/newsweek/2007/08/07/the-human-family-shrub.html<br><ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">https</ins>://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/26/science/26ance.html?pagewanted=all<br>http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2009/10/091001-oldest-human-skeleton-ardi-missing-link-chimps-ardipithecus-ramidus.html<br>http://discovermagazine.com/2011/may/25-homo-sapiens-meet-new-astounding-family/article_view?b_start:int=3&-C=<br>http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2001-03-22/news/0103220207_1_early-species-direct-human-ancestor-human-ancestry<br><ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">https</ins>://www.nytimes.com/2007/08/09/science/09fossil.html</ref> According to Encyclopaedia Britannica's current dating of Australopiths, Ar. kaddaba and Ar. ramidus coexisted; A. afarensis, K. platyops, A. bahrelgazali, and A. africanus all coexisted; P. aethiopicus, A. africanus, A. garhi, H. habilis, and H. rudolfensis all coexisted; and A. sediba, P. boisei, H. rudolfensis, and H. habilis all coexisted as well.<ref><ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">https</ins>://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/44115/Australopithecus</ref></div></td></tr>
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<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>--[[User:Jzyehoshua|Jzyehoshua]] 20:17, 20 July 2012 (EDT)</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>--[[User:Jzyehoshua|Jzyehoshua]] 20:17, 20 July 2012 (EDT)</div></td></tr>
</table>DavidB4-bothttps://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=Debate:Creationist&diff=994880&oldid=prevJZambrano: /* Jzyehoshua's Arguments for Creationism */2012-07-21T00:45:17Z<p><span dir="auto"><span class="autocomment">Jzyehoshua's Arguments for Creationism</span></span></p>
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<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* 1. The fossil record is entirely contrary to the theory of evolution, as shown by the development of Punctuated Equilibrium. The famous paper by Gould and Eldredge on Punctuated Equilibrium acknowledges that, "Under the influence of phyletic gradualism, the rarity of transitional series remains as our persistent bugbear. From the reputable claims of a Cuvier or Agassiz to the jibes of modern cranks and fundamentalists, it has stood as the bulwark of anti-evolution arguments: 'For evolution to be true there had to be thousands, millions of transitional forms making an unbroken chain' (Anon., 1967-From a Jehovah's Witnesses pamphlet)."<ref>http://www.blackwellpublishing.com/ridley/classictexts/eldredge.asp</ref> Evolutionary theory, in short, is unable to explain the complete lack of transitional forms. Rather than showing constant, gradual transitions between species, instead it shows only microevolution but not macro, with very minimal evolution within species where they do not change controversially at the Genus level, and then suddenly, poof - whole new complexity in the fossil record. Punctuated Equilibrium sought to explain away the evidence of the fossil record by suggesting evolution went too rapidly during short periods (punctuated) and very slowly the rest of the time (equilibrium).<ref>http://evolution.berkeley.edu/evosite/evo101/VIIA1bPunctuated.shtml</ref>  </div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* 1. The fossil record is entirely contrary to the theory of evolution, as shown by the development of Punctuated Equilibrium. The famous paper by Gould and Eldredge on Punctuated Equilibrium acknowledges that, "Under the influence of phyletic gradualism, the rarity of transitional series remains as our persistent bugbear. From the reputable claims of a Cuvier or Agassiz to the jibes of modern cranks and fundamentalists, it has stood as the bulwark of anti-evolution arguments: 'For evolution to be true there had to be thousands, millions of transitional forms making an unbroken chain' (Anon., 1967-From a Jehovah's Witnesses pamphlet)."<ref>http://www.blackwellpublishing.com/ridley/classictexts/eldredge.asp</ref> Evolutionary theory, in short, is unable to explain the complete lack of transitional forms. Rather than showing constant, gradual transitions between species, instead it shows only microevolution but not macro, with very minimal evolution within species where they do not change controversially at the Genus level, and then suddenly, poof - whole new complexity in the fossil record. Punctuated Equilibrium sought to explain away the evidence of the fossil record by suggesting evolution went too rapidly during short periods (punctuated) and very slowly the rest of the time (equilibrium).<ref>http://evolution.berkeley.edu/evosite/evo101/VIIA1bPunctuated.shtml</ref>  </div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* 2. Numerous fossils discovered in recent years are contrary to conventional evolutionary theory, showing unusual complexity or that previously supposed descendants coexisted and thus could not be evolved from one another. E.g., Ardi, Sahelanthropus, and Orrorin Tungenensis show signs of bipedality and complexity, even though they are dated radiometrically as millions of years older than the alleged human-ape split around 3-4 million years ago. Erectus and Habilis coexisted. Ramidus and Afarensis (Lucy) coexisted. I wrote the page, "Recent Controversy in Hominid Ancestry" providing numerous sources regarding these finds.<ref>http://creationwiki.org/Recent_controversy_in_hominid_ancestry</ref> As a result of them, the human evolutionary tree is now being called a "messy bush".<ref>http://www.thedailybeast.com/newsweek/2007/08/07/the-human-family-shrub.html<br>http://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/26/science/26ance.html?pagewanted=all<br>http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2009/10/091001-oldest-human-skeleton-ardi-missing-link-chimps-ardipithecus-ramidus.html<br>http://discovermagazine.com/2011/may/25-homo-sapiens-meet-new-astounding-family/article_view?b_start:int=3&-C=<br>http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2001-03-22/news/0103220207_1_early-species-direct-human-ancestor-human-ancestry<br>http://www.nytimes.com/2007/08/09/science/09fossil.html</ref></div></td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>* 2. Numerous fossils discovered in recent years are contrary to conventional evolutionary theory, showing unusual complexity or that previously supposed descendants coexisted and thus could not be evolved from one another. E.g., Ardi, Sahelanthropus, and Orrorin Tungenensis show signs of bipedality and complexity, even though they are dated radiometrically as millions of years older than the alleged human-ape split around 3-4 million years ago. Erectus and Habilis coexisted. Ramidus and Afarensis (Lucy) coexisted. I wrote the page, "Recent Controversy in Hominid Ancestry" providing numerous sources regarding these finds.<ref>http://creationwiki.org/Recent_controversy_in_hominid_ancestry</ref> As a result of them, the human evolutionary tree is now being called a "messy bush".<ref>http://www.thedailybeast.com/newsweek/2007/08/07/the-human-family-shrub.html<br>http://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/26/science/26ance.html?pagewanted=all<br>http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2009/10/091001-oldest-human-skeleton-ardi-missing-link-chimps-ardipithecus-ramidus.html<br>http://discovermagazine.com/2011/may/25-homo-sapiens-meet-new-astounding-family/article_view?b_start:int=3&-C=<br>http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2001-03-22/news/0103220207_1_early-species-direct-human-ancestor-human-ancestry<br>http://www.nytimes.com/2007/08/09/science/09fossil.html<ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline"></ref> According to Encyclopaedia Britannica's current dating of Australopiths, Ar. kaddaba and Ar. ramidus coexisted; A. afarensis, K. platyops, A. bahrelgazali, and A. africanus all coexisted; P. aethiopicus, A. africanus, A. garhi, H. habilis, and H. rudolfensis all coexisted; and A. sediba, P. boisei, H. rudolfensis, and H. habilis all coexisted as well.<ref>http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/44115/Australopithecus</ins></ref></div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>--[[User:Jzyehoshua|Jzyehoshua]] 20:17, 20 July 2012 (EDT)</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>--[[User:Jzyehoshua|Jzyehoshua]] 20:17, 20 July 2012 (EDT)</div></td></tr>
</table>JZambranohttps://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=Debate:Creationist&diff=994879&oldid=prevJZambrano: /* Jzyehoshua's Arguments for Creationism */2012-07-21T00:31:42Z<p><span dir="auto"><span class="autocomment">Jzyehoshua's Arguments for Creationism</span></span></p>
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<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>The following are two  of the key arguments I make at CreationWiki for Creationism:</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>The following are two  of the key arguments I make at CreationWiki for Creationism:</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>1. The fossil record is entirely contrary to the theory of evolution, as shown by the development of Punctuated Equilibrium. The famous paper by Gould and Eldredge on Punctuated Equilibrium acknowledges that, "Under the influence of phyletic gradualism, the rarity of transitional series remains as our persistent bugbear. From the reputable claims of a Cuvier or Agassiz to the jibes of modern cranks and fundamentalists, it has stood as the bulwark of anti-evolution arguments: 'For evolution to be true there had to be thousands, millions of transitional forms making an unbroken chain' (Anon., 1967-From a Jehovah's Witnesses pamphlet)."<ref>http://www.blackwellpublishing.com/ridley/classictexts/eldredge.asp</ref> Evolutionary theory, in short, is unable to explain the complete lack of transitional forms. Rather than showing constant, gradual transitions between species, instead it shows only microevolution but not macro, with very minimal evolution within species where they do not change controversially at the Genus level, and then suddenly, poof - whole new complexity in the fossil record. Punctuated Equilibrium sought to explain away the evidence of the fossil record by suggesting evolution went too rapidly during short periods (punctuated) and very slowly the rest of the time (equilibrium).<ref>http://evolution.berkeley.edu/evosite/evo101/VIIA1bPunctuated.shtml</ref>  </div></td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">* </ins>1. The fossil record is entirely contrary to the theory of evolution, as shown by the development of Punctuated Equilibrium. The famous paper by Gould and Eldredge on Punctuated Equilibrium acknowledges that, "Under the influence of phyletic gradualism, the rarity of transitional series remains as our persistent bugbear. From the reputable claims of a Cuvier or Agassiz to the jibes of modern cranks and fundamentalists, it has stood as the bulwark of anti-evolution arguments: 'For evolution to be true there had to be thousands, millions of transitional forms making an unbroken chain' (Anon., 1967-From a Jehovah's Witnesses pamphlet)."<ref>http://www.blackwellpublishing.com/ridley/classictexts/eldredge.asp</ref> Evolutionary theory, in short, is unable to explain the complete lack of transitional forms. Rather than showing constant, gradual transitions between species, instead it shows only microevolution but not macro, with very minimal evolution within species where they do not change controversially at the Genus level, and then suddenly, poof - whole new complexity in the fossil record. Punctuated Equilibrium sought to explain away the evidence of the fossil record by suggesting evolution went too rapidly during short periods (punctuated) and very slowly the rest of the time (equilibrium).<ref>http://evolution.berkeley.edu/evosite/evo101/VIIA1bPunctuated.shtml</ref>  </div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'>−</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #ffe49c; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>2. Numerous fossils discovered in recent years are contrary to conventional evolutionary theory, showing unusual complexity or that previously supposed descendants coexisted and thus could not be evolved from one another. E.g., Ardi, Sahelanthropus, and Orrorin Tungenensis show signs of bipedality and complexity, even though they are dated radiometrically as millions of years older than the alleged human-ape split around 3-4 million years ago. Erectus and Habilis coexisted. Ramidus and Afarensis (Lucy) coexisted. I wrote the page, "Recent Controversy in Hominid Ancestry" providing numerous sources regarding these finds.<ref>http://creationwiki.org/Recent_controversy_in_hominid_ancestry</ref> As a result of them, the human evolutionary tree is now being called a "messy bush".<ref>http://www.thedailybeast.com/newsweek/2007/08/07/the-human-family-shrub.html<br>http://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/26/science/26ance.html?pagewanted=all<br>http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2009/10/091001-oldest-human-skeleton-ardi-missing-link-chimps-ardipithecus-ramidus.html<br>http://discovermagazine.com/2011/may/25-homo-sapiens-meet-new-astounding-family/article_view?b_start:int=3&-C=<br>http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2001-03-22/news/0103220207_1_early-species-direct-human-ancestor-human-ancestry<br>http://www.nytimes.com/2007/08/09/science/09fossil.html</ref></div></td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins class="diffchange diffchange-inline">* </ins>2. Numerous fossils discovered in recent years are contrary to conventional evolutionary theory, showing unusual complexity or that previously supposed descendants coexisted and thus could not be evolved from one another. E.g., Ardi, Sahelanthropus, and Orrorin Tungenensis show signs of bipedality and complexity, even though they are dated radiometrically as millions of years older than the alleged human-ape split around 3-4 million years ago. Erectus and Habilis coexisted. Ramidus and Afarensis (Lucy) coexisted. I wrote the page, "Recent Controversy in Hominid Ancestry" providing numerous sources regarding these finds.<ref>http://creationwiki.org/Recent_controversy_in_hominid_ancestry</ref> As a result of them, the human evolutionary tree is now being called a "messy bush".<ref>http://www.thedailybeast.com/newsweek/2007/08/07/the-human-family-shrub.html<br>http://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/26/science/26ance.html?pagewanted=all<br>http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2009/10/091001-oldest-human-skeleton-ardi-missing-link-chimps-ardipithecus-ramidus.html<br>http://discovermagazine.com/2011/may/25-homo-sapiens-meet-new-astounding-family/article_view?b_start:int=3&-C=<br>http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2001-03-22/news/0103220207_1_early-species-direct-human-ancestor-human-ancestry<br>http://www.nytimes.com/2007/08/09/science/09fossil.html</ref></div></td></tr>
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<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>--[[User:Jzyehoshua|Jzyehoshua]] 20:17, 20 July 2012 (EDT)</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>--[[User:Jzyehoshua|Jzyehoshua]] 20:17, 20 July 2012 (EDT)</div></td></tr>
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<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>== References ==</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>== References ==</div></td></tr>
</table>JZambranohttps://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=Debate:Creationist&diff=994877&oldid=prevJZambrano at 00:17, July 21, 20122012-07-21T00:17:35Z<p></p>
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<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>your primary shot against evolution is how life can come from non-life. but isn't that notion you seem so ready to ridicule the center piece of your own argument? how can you be so hypocritical well you probably learned it wathing "fair and balanced" FOX news. ([[User:Gosweden|Gosweden]])</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>your primary shot against evolution is how life can come from non-life. but isn't that notion you seem so ready to ridicule the center piece of your own argument? how can you be so hypocritical well you probably learned it wathing "fair and balanced" FOX news. ([[User:Gosweden|Gosweden]])</div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;"></ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">==Jzyehoshua's Arguments for Creationism==</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">The following are two  of the key arguments I make at CreationWiki for Creationism:</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;"></ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">1. The fossil record is entirely contrary to the theory of evolution, as shown by the development of Punctuated Equilibrium. The famous paper by Gould and Eldredge on Punctuated Equilibrium acknowledges that, "Under the influence of phyletic gradualism, the rarity of transitional series remains as our persistent bugbear. From the reputable claims of a Cuvier or Agassiz to the jibes of modern cranks and fundamentalists, it has stood as the bulwark of anti-evolution arguments: 'For evolution to be true there had to be thousands, millions of transitional forms making an unbroken chain' (Anon., 1967-From a Jehovah's Witnesses pamphlet)."<ref>http://www.blackwellpublishing.com/ridley/classictexts/eldredge.asp</ref> Evolutionary theory, in short, is unable to explain the complete lack of transitional forms. Rather than showing constant, gradual transitions between species, instead it shows only microevolution but not macro, with very minimal evolution within species where they do not change controversially at the Genus level, and then suddenly, poof - whole new complexity in the fossil record. Punctuated Equilibrium sought to explain away the evidence of the fossil record by suggesting evolution went too rapidly during short periods (punctuated) and very slowly the rest of the time (equilibrium).<ref>http://evolution.berkeley.edu/evosite/evo101/VIIA1bPunctuated.shtml</ref> </ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">2. Numerous fossils discovered in recent years are contrary to conventional evolutionary theory, showing unusual complexity or that previously supposed descendants coexisted and thus could not be evolved from one another. E.g., Ardi, Sahelanthropus, and Orrorin Tungenensis show signs of bipedality and complexity, even though they are dated radiometrically as millions of years older than the alleged human-ape split around 3-4 million years ago. Erectus and Habilis coexisted. Ramidus and Afarensis (Lucy) coexisted. I wrote the page, "Recent Controversy in Hominid Ancestry" providing numerous sources regarding these finds.<ref>http://creationwiki.org/Recent_controversy_in_hominid_ancestry</ref> As a result of them, the human evolutionary tree is now being called a "messy bush".<ref>http://www.thedailybeast.com/newsweek/2007/08/07/the-human-family-shrub.html<br>http://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/26/science/26ance.html?pagewanted=all<br>http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2009/10/091001-oldest-human-skeleton-ardi-missing-link-chimps-ardipithecus-ramidus.html<br>http://discovermagazine.com/2011/may/25-homo-sapiens-meet-new-astounding-family/article_view?b_start:int=3&-C=<br>http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2001-03-22/news/0103220207_1_early-species-direct-human-ancestor-human-ancestry<br>http://www.nytimes.com/2007/08/09/science/09fossil.html</ref></ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;"></ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">--[[User:Jzyehoshua|Jzyehoshua]] 20:17, 20 July 2012 (EDT)</ins></div></td></tr>
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<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>== References ==</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>== References ==</div></td></tr>
</table>JZambranohttps://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=Debate:Creationist&diff=678610&oldid=prevGosweden: /* Accusations against creationism and creationists */2009-06-26T23:25:19Z<p><span dir="auto"><span class="autocomment">Accusations against creationism and creationists</span></span></p>
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<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>As you can see, we've heard it all before, and we continue to hear it--and a lot worse than this, but I see no reason to bore everybody with all the ugly [[ad hominem]] details.--[[User:TerryH|TerryH]]<sup>[[User talk:TerryH|Talk]]</sup> 14:59, 26 December 2007 (EST)</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>As you can see, we've heard it all before, and we continue to hear it--and a lot worse than this, but I see no reason to bore everybody with all the ugly [[ad hominem]] details.--[[User:TerryH|TerryH]]<sup>[[User talk:TerryH|Talk]]</sup> 14:59, 26 December 2007 (EST)</div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;"></ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">your primary shot against evolution is how life can come from non-life. but isn't that notion you seem so ready to ridicule the center piece of your own argument? how can you be so hypocritical well you probably learned it wathing "fair and balanced" FOX news. ([[User:Gosweden|Gosweden]])</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>== References ==</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>== References ==</div></td></tr>
</table>Goswedenhttps://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=Debate:Creationist&diff=610467&oldid=prevAddisonDM at 00:56, January 15, 20092009-01-15T00:56:44Z<p></p>
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</table>AddisonDMhttps://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=Debate:Creationist&diff=601318&oldid=prevJessicaT: Discussion:Creationist moved to Debate:Creationist2009-01-04T05:41:05Z<p><a href="/Discussion:Creationist" class="mw-redirect" title="Discussion:Creationist">Discussion:Creationist</a> moved to <a href="/Debate:Creationist" title="Debate:Creationist">Debate:Creationist</a></p>
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</td></tr></table>JessicaThttps://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=Debate:Creationist&diff=595289&oldid=prevKmcheng: /* What a creationist is not */2008-12-27T21:38:23Z<p><span dir="auto"><span class="autocomment">What a creationist is not</span></span></p>
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<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>A creationist is not necessarily a holder to the scientific paradigm of [[intelligent design]]. All that an ID scientist sees is that the world looks very much like a thing planned and built, not a thing that "got here" by accident. An ID thinker never troubles himself to discover or even to think about ''who did the planning and the building.'' A creationist would think about things like that, but not an ID man. And while an intelligent design for the world and life might be ''part'' of any workable model of creation, identifying the Creator is not part of intelligent-design theory.</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>A creationist is not necessarily a holder to the scientific paradigm of [[intelligent design]]. All that an ID scientist sees is that the world looks very much like a thing planned and built, not a thing that "got here" by accident. An ID thinker never troubles himself to discover or even to think about ''who did the planning and the building.'' A creationist would think about things like that, but not an ID man. And while an intelligent design for the world and life might be ''part'' of any workable model of creation, identifying the Creator is not part of intelligent-design theory.</div></td></tr>
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<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Nor is a creationist a shaman or other practitioner of "magic" or any "secret art" or "black art." We make no secret of what we presuppose--nor do we pretend to have any secret knowledge.</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>Nor is a creationist a shaman or other practitioner of "magic" or any "secret art" or "black art." We make no secret of what we presuppose--nor do we pretend to have any secret knowledge.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;"></ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;"></ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;"></ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;"></ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;"></ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">Although "identifying the Creator is not part of intelligent-design theory", but when you know there is someone behind the creation, it is perfectly logical to ID the creator as the next step. Just like when we see a good picture, painting or an art, or eat a good dish, or see a good job done, it is natural for us to right away ask who did/made this, and then probably give the person a compliment.</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;"></ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">That's why it is entirely different between to think there is someone who created the world and to think the world is "self existence", like what the humanists claimed. This "self existence" idea is really ridiculous - nothing in the world can self exists, they all got to be made/come from somewhere. Even those humanists who claimed this, they are born from their mothers' bodies. Here is a challenge: find something in the world that is "self existence" and explain how this thing "self exists".</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;"></ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">They want to exclude the creator is one thing, but saying something can "self exists" is way too much.[[User:Kmcheng|Kmcheng]] 16:38, 27 December 2008 (EST)</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>== Presuppositions of creationism ==</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>== Presuppositions of creationism ==</div></td></tr>
</table>Kmchenghttps://conservapedia.com/index.php?title=Debate:Creationist&diff=358740&oldid=prevQwestor at 13:08, December 27, 20072007-12-27T13:08:26Z<p></p>
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<td colspan='2' style="background-color: white; color:black; text-align: center;">Revision as of 13:08, December 27, 2007</td>
</tr><tr><td colspan="2" class="diff-lineno">Line 32:</td>
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<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>: First of all, thanks for your correction to my mistake in [[dot product]].</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>: First of all, thanks for your correction to my mistake in [[dot product]].</div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;"></ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">You are welcome! [[User:Qwestor|Qwestor]] 08:01, 27 December 2007 (EST)</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>: To your point above, however, the term "creationist" would ostensibly apply to anyone who accepts a creation.  But that is not how the term is used, which makes it confusing.  Also, it is often used in a pejorative manner as an expression of bigotry, making it unsuitable for enlightened discourse.--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 14:15, 26 December 2007 (EST)</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>: To your point above, however, the term "creationist" would ostensibly apply to anyone who accepts a creation.  But that is not how the term is used, which makes it confusing.  Also, it is often used in a pejorative manner as an expression of bigotry, making it unsuitable for enlightened discourse.--[[User:Aschlafly|Aschlafly]] 14:15, 26 December 2007 (EST)</div></td></tr>
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<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>::Fact is that the opposition has to call them ''something''. "Creationism" and "Creationist" seem to be the most widely recognized terms, officially used (for example) by the Northwest Creation Network.</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>::Fact is that the opposition has to call them ''something''. "Creationism" and "Creationist" seem to be the most widely recognized terms, officially used (for example) by the Northwest Creation Network.</div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>::Speaking from personal experience, nobody in these parts of the world thinks that a "Creationist" believes in the Flying Spaghetti Monster or [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Origin_belief some other] story. However, if you want to be precise, then those articles could be edited to specify "Young Earth Creationist" (or "Old Earth Creationist") where applicable. It would be more precise, but on this site, it would strike me as somewhat redundant. --[[User:JakeC|JakeC]] 14:47, 26 December 2007 (EST)</div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div>::Speaking from personal experience, nobody in these parts of the world thinks that a "Creationist" believes in the Flying Spaghetti Monster or [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Origin_belief some other] story. However, if you want to be precise, then those articles could be edited to specify "Young Earth Creationist" (or "Old Earth Creationist") where applicable. It would be more precise, but on this site, it would strike me as somewhat redundant. --[[User:JakeC|JakeC]] 14:47, 26 December 2007 (EST)</div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;"></ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td colspan="2"> </td><td class='diff-marker'>+</td><td style="color:black; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><ins style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;">I can fully appreciate your concern over the pejorative connotation that the term has acquired since it is looked on with disdain by many in the intelligentsia. I guess I prefer to continue to use the term in its denotative sense, and on the occasions when it is used in a pejorative connotation, show that that usage is unreasonable and uncharitable.  [[User:Qwestor|Qwestor]] 08:01, 27 December 2007 (EST)</ins></div></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"></td></tr>
<tr><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><nowiki>========= Start of long post by TerryH =========</nowiki></div></td><td class='diff-marker'> </td><td style="background-color: #f9f9f9; color: #333333; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #e6e6e6; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;"><div><nowiki>========= Start of long post by TerryH =========</nowiki></div></td></tr>
</table>Qwestor