Debate:Define torture

From Conservapedia
This is an old revision of this page, as edited by Myk (Talk | contribs) at 07:56, 6 April 2007. It may differ significantly from current revision.

Jump to: navigation, search

Torture needs defining because liberals have blurred the true meaning. Is torture to stand on one foot with a black hood over your head? Maybe it is when you cut a persons fingers off. Is torture a degrading naked pyramid of men? Or maybe it is hammering nails into someones skull. Is torture having a scary dog bark at your face? Maybe it is beating your face silly with brass knuckles. Is torture three square meals a day, tropical skies, a free Koran? Or maybe it is locked in a cold dungeon, no light, starving to death. Help, the issue is so distorted. Jpatt (Signature added by Teresita)(Teresita, good guess, how did you know?)

Torture is any cruel or unusual punishment, forbidden by the 8th Amendment of the Bill of Rights in the highest law of our Republic, assuming we still have a Republic. Teresita 03:22, 6 April 2007 (EDT)

So to call you a bad name, that is torture?--jp 03:34, 6 April 2007 (EDT)

Thee square meals a day, tropical skies and a free Koran? You make prison sound like club med. Answer honestly, who was treated worse: enemy combatants and terrorists held by US forces in Abu Graib, or innocent British sailors captured by the Iranians?

There is no real line where you can say 'interregation stops here, then torture begins.' Horrible things go on in American prisons, but no one raises holy hell. The fact of the matter is that the US is supposed to be a moral nation, based on individual rights and liberty. When the world hears we stick people in jail without trial and use techniques like water boarding...well, how are we any better than those we are trying to fight in their eyes? Czolgolz 08:53, 6 April 2007 (EDT)

Any act by which severe pain or suffering, whether physical or mental, is intentionally inflicted on a person for such purposes as obtaining from him or a third person information or a confession, punishing him for an act he or a third person has committed or is suspected of having committed, or intimidating or coercing him or a third person, or for any reason based on discrimination of any kind, when such pain or suffering is inflicted by or at the instigation of or with the consent or acquiescence of a public official or other person acting in an official capacity. It does not include pain or suffering arising only from, inherent in or incidental to lawful sanctions.[1]
Well its a start...
WhatIsG0ing0n 09:01, 6 April 2007 (EDT)

How do you suggest that we get information, Ask nicely?

That might not work ... on the other hand there are aparrently people trained in non-torturous interrogation who do know how to get information out of people. Their success rate is quite high and the information is usually of good quality. Under torture people are likely to admit to anything. One never knows if the information acquired is any good or not. Then again ... if you just like being cruel to people...
WhatIsG0ing0n 09:39, 6 April 2007 (EDT)
like what? truth serum?Jaques 09:45, 6 April 2007 (EDT)
Never mind. Just carry on recruiting terrorists.
WhatIsG0ing0n 09:47, 6 April 2007 (EDT)

I think that only American citizens should be protected by the constitution (even the 8th ammendment). We are better than the terrorists because they attacked us, and because we are the ones who will eventually win. I don't think that we should use anything that I personally would define as torture (sticking splinters up their fingernails, skining and salting them, etc.) but we could definately be doing alot better to persuade them to confess. I suggest that we:

  1. Regularly starve them for a week or so; nothing life threatening but we don't want them to get comfortable.
  2. when we do feed them it should be nothing very good.
  3. Put them in solitary confinment; we might do this already but I wouldn't know.
  4. We can certainly pretend that we're going to do something cruel. I suggest we have somebody realy good at special effects make a video to show them of some horrible torture method. --BenjaminS 09:25, 6 April 2007 (EDT)
  • my definition of torture: techniques that cause irreversible physical or psychological damage. Jaques 09:37, 6 April 2007 (EDT)
You know torure is not an effective means of getting accurate information, right? And you do know that the best way to get accurate information is, in fact, to be nice to them. It's like good cop bad cop, but they're already in prison so you don't even need a bad cop. Just the good cop.
And Benjamin, while your ethnocentrism is to be applauded on this site, our various governmental documents don't make any allowance for all men to be created equal and certain unalienable rights... except then not so much for people that are different. And you say that "we are better than the terrorists because they attacked us." Well... how exactly do you know that the man you have in custody is a terrorist or was responsible for attacking us? So you're going to detain a man, deprive him of food on suspicion of being a terrorist? Well guess what: you can never let this man out because when you do, he's going to be a terrorist. And regardless of whether you let him out, his friends and brothers will be terrorists. And "they will be better than us because they wrongfully imprisoned my brother."
Maybe we should abide by the laws we write and the treaties we sign, hm? Myk 09:56, 6 April 2007 (EDT)