Difference between revisions of "Talk:Great Achievements by Teenagers"

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::not really.  It is more like saying that 4 is an odd number because it is close to 5 which is an odd number.  --[[User:CPAdmin1|Tim]] <small>(CPAdmin1)</small><sup>[[User talk:CPAdmin1|talk]]</sup> 20:06, 30 December 2008 (EST)
 
::not really.  It is more like saying that 4 is an odd number because it is close to 5 which is an odd number.  --[[User:CPAdmin1|Tim]] <small>(CPAdmin1)</small><sup>[[User talk:CPAdmin1|talk]]</sup> 20:06, 30 December 2008 (EST)
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== Roger Mason entry ==
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The Roger Mason entry does not rise to the level of achievement of the others.  Even if it was a meaningful discovery, which is dubious, we don't have the shepherd who discovered the Dead Sea Scrolls and I don't see why would include Mason's "discovery" as a great achievement either.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 19:53, 13 August 2009 (EDT)
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:Although I didn't add that entry, I did feel it was right to change it to state it as ''what some believed'' rather state it as scientific fact. --[[User:TK|'''ṬK''']]<sub><small><small>/Admin</small></small></sub><sup>[[User_Talk:TK|/Talk]]</sup> 20:11, 13 August 2009 (EDT)
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:: I agree with your edit, and am suggesting that we go further and either toss the entry or downgrade it further in an appropriate way.  It just does not rise to the level of, say, David slaying Goliath.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 20:37, 13 August 2009 (EDT)

Revision as of 19:38, 13 August 2009

Clarification

Nearly all of those who accomplished great deeds while being teenagers made even greater contributions when they became adults. Especially, this list can't be used to bolster up the claim that most of the greatest works in history were accomplished by people who were teenagers BRichtigen 16:49, 26 December 2008 (EST)

Heavenly voices

Is hearing heavenly voices an acheivement? Is was it leading France to victory that was the acheivement? It rather reads as if the hearing of voices was the acheivement. --TCochrane 18:26, 26 December 2008 (EST)

Reversion

Obviously if someone produced a work before becoming a teenager it proves the same point; hence the reversion.--aschlafly 21:34, 26 December 2008 (EST)

Then how about renaming the page to keep it accurate? "Great Achievements by Minors", maybe? DRussell 21:40, 26 December 2008 (EST)

Karl Benz

I removed Karl Benz: Though he was a child prodigy, at the given age (15), he "only" passed the entrance exam of the University of Karlsruhe. His genius really flourished in his late thirties. --BRichtigen 07:10, 27 December 2008 (EST)


Later Achievments

  • 7 - Yehudi Menuhin: made his last recording age 82
  • 8 - Pablo Picasso Cubism: age 30
  • 8 - Frederic Chopin Piano Concert No. 1: age 20
  • 12 - Blaise Pascal "Traité du triangle arithmétique": age 30
  • 13 - John stays a mistery
  • 13 - Joan of Arc inspired and led France to victory in the Hundred Years War
  • 13 - Anne Frank began writing her diary, later published as "Anne Frank: The Diary of a Young Girl"
  • 14 - chess-player Bobby Fischer World Chess Champion: age 29
  • 14 - Mozart"Don Giovanni": age 32
  • 15 - Louis Braille invented the Braille system
  • 15 - Christopher Paolini writes the first draft of his Eragon trilogy which is published when he is 19.
  • 16 - Jean-François Champollion: deciphers the Rosetta Stone age 32
  • 18 - Mary Shelley writes Frankenstein (The Modern Prometheus) - it is only published when she is 21, however.
  • 20 - Carl Friedrich Gauss makes his first mathematical discoveries, which will lead to the completion of "Disquisitiones Arithmeticae", his magnum opus, at the age of 21.

So, most of the persons in the list made contributions to their field works overshadowing there achievements as teenagers.

BRichtigen 08:57, 27 December 2008 (EST)

A corrosive attitude is not beneficial. If, as Andy suggested, you opened your mind you might find nmany more examples to support this case. Bear in mind: demolition is easy, to build takes effort! Bugler 08:59, 27 December 2008 (EST)


Jesus

I'm not entirely certain I'm comfortable with including Jesus on a list of "teenagers." Part of that may just be a visceral reaction against applying the term to the Almighty, but setting that aside, I'm still not entirely sure he belongs on the list. After all, despite His physical age at the time he preached, He was still God, and therefore timeless and eternal. It's going to be a little hard for anyone, teenager or adult, to measure up to His list of accomplishments! --Benp 14:18, 28 December 2008 (EST)

IQ Peak

Although it is a hotly debated subject, there is no concrete evidence to suggest that IQ peaks in the pre-teen/teenage years. The linked article provides evidence to support that the rate of brain development peaks at this time, but this is idependant of a person's IQ.

To highlight the diparate viewpoints, it is possible to show an IQ peak at anywhere from 14-16yrs old, all the way up to 50yrs+ - depending on what you measure, how you measure and how you interpret your findings (as with many stats i suppose).

More info: http://www.albion.edu/psychology/fac_psyc/jwilson/psy101/intell.htm

Hope my edit is satisfactory --J00ni 18:22, 28 December 2008 (EST)

Mary as "17"

Can I suggest using the word "uncertain" for Mary's age instead of assuming that it's 17? That takes nothing away from the assumption that she was a teenager when she gave birth, but it doesn't seem right for CP to state a specific age as if it were a fact when the comment goes on to acknowledge that the actual age was unknown. --DinsdaleP 09:20, 30 December 2008 (EST)

The footnote is clear enough. No one doubts she was a teenager, and 17 was an average age of betrothal. The purpose of this list is plainly not to pinpoint precise ages, but merely to show the teenagers as a group.--aschlafly 09:24, 30 December 2008 (EST)
I don't disagree with that. I've added an asterisk after her age to highlight that it's an approximation, and leaving the rest as-is. --DinsdaleP 10:03, 30 December 2008 (EST)
It could be even earlier; in the middle ages it was not uncommon for girls to give birth at 14, so in this case I think it could be as young as 15 (but I think it's 16, personally). ETrundel 14:29, 30 December 2008 (EST)
I too was given to believe she was younger than 17 at the time. My maternal family line has a long tradition of Mary-derived names in firstborn daughters, (I'm Regina, yes, that's Mary Derived, have "Ave Regina") and my mother always told the story that she was around 15. When I was little that seemed quite grown up, but when I was 15 myself, it struck me just how very brave she was, and how young. I think the note of approximation is important for this reason, it is true she could have been as old as 17, but at that young age, two years is a world of difference in maturity and self assurance. If she was indeed younger than 17, bumping up her age underestimates the greatness of her faith. Best err on the side of caution and reverence. Birdie 13:25, 30 December 2008 (EST)
I side with Birdie, I have always understood it as the age of 15. --Jpatt 14:27, 30 December 2008 (EST)

Bill Gates

A 13-year-old programming is not a remarkable achievement, and Gates' significant accomplishments occurred as a young adult, not a teen. --DinsdaleP 14:06, 30 December 2008 (EST)

I understand your point and I for one do not wish to glorify an atheist. By todays standards, that is not an achievement. At age thirteen in 1968, think about the computer he was working with? It is a bright child that succeeded, is it a great achievement? --Jpatt 14:24, 30 December 2008 (EST)
Under further scrutiny, I have decided against including Bill Gates. What did he achieve at 13? computer skills, not a great achievement. Also, he has enough accolades, believes in the God of nothing (catch that prying eyes?), listed next to Anne, no way the two should reside together :) --Jpatt 20:28, 31 December 2008 (EST)

remove some or move the page?

If it is going to be Great achievements be teenagers, then we need to limit the list to teenagers only, not 8 and 10 year olds and 20 year olds. We need to remove the non-teenagers from the list, or else change it to something like "great achievements by young people" --Tim (CPAdmin1)talk 19:55, 30 December 2008 (EST)

12 year olds are also not teenagers. It sounds like we're getting technical, but saying that 8, 10, 12 and 20 year olds are teenagers is effectively the same as saying girls who wear pants are boys. NormanS 20:02, 30 December 2008 (EST)
not really. It is more like saying that 4 is an odd number because it is close to 5 which is an odd number. --Tim (CPAdmin1)talk 20:06, 30 December 2008 (EST)

Roger Mason entry

The Roger Mason entry does not rise to the level of achievement of the others. Even if it was a meaningful discovery, which is dubious, we don't have the shepherd who discovered the Dead Sea Scrolls and I don't see why would include Mason's "discovery" as a great achievement either.--Andy Schlafly 19:53, 13 August 2009 (EDT)

Although I didn't add that entry, I did feel it was right to change it to state it as what some believed rather state it as scientific fact. --ṬK/Admin/Talk 20:11, 13 August 2009 (EDT)
I agree with your edit, and am suggesting that we go further and either toss the entry or downgrade it further in an appropriate way. It just does not rise to the level of, say, David slaying Goliath.--Andy Schlafly 20:37, 13 August 2009 (EDT)