Difference between revisions of "Talk:Essay:Politicians Who Had a Real Career"

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(Definition of influence)
(Obama ???: Thomas Edison was named by Life magazine as the most influential person in the entire world in the second millennium. Yet he did not sign anything into law.)
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::::::Folks, position does not equal influence.  Jesus had no position at all.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 23:39, 7 August 2011 (EDT)
 
::::::Folks, position does not equal influence.  Jesus had no position at all.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 23:39, 7 August 2011 (EDT)
 
:::::::But Obama has huge influence. He can sign things into law that cause massive changes. How do you classify influence? [[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 23:41, 7 August 2011 (EDT)
 
:::::::But Obama has huge influence. He can sign things into law that cause massive changes. How do you classify influence? [[User:MaxFletcher|MaxFletcher]] 23:41, 7 August 2011 (EDT)
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::::::::[[Thomas Edison]] was named by Life magazine as the most influential person in the entire world in the second millennium.  Yet he did not sign anything into law.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 00:46, 8 August 2011 (EDT)
  
 
== Definition of influence ==
 
== Definition of influence ==

Revision as of 22:46, 7 August 2011

This is interesting

Just to clarify do you mean people who are not "career politicians"? MaxFletcher 18:06, 7 August 2011 (EDT)

Oh yeah, I added Herman Cain. Would he qualify (don't know much about US politics). MaxFletcher 18:09, 7 August 2011 (EDT)

Significance, and alphabetization

The list is for significant politicians who have had some influence. Many who have been added do not qualify. They need to be moved to the lower category.

Also, why alphabetize rather than rank by influence?--Andy Schlafly 20:33, 7 August 2011 (EDT)

What would qualify as significance? I moved Franken because, though his career was perhaps less-than-serious, as a senator, he makes law. Perhaps that could be the judge of influence? And I thought alphabetization would be effective for the purposes of locating a certain name following the explansion of the article. --Chouston 21:03, 7 August 2011 (EDT)
Good point about the value of alphabetization ... if there are enough names whereby it becomes an issue. Many of the names need to be moved to the "not significant" category. For example, unless you can identify a real influence that Al Franken has had, then he does not belong on the real list.--Andy Schlafly 21:08, 7 August 2011 (EDT)
I moved Franken.--JamesWilson 21:12, 7 August 2011 (EDT)
(edit conflict) Until such a time, I think alphabetization is still desirable, to avoid getting into arguments over who is more influential than whom. Regarding Franken, he has presided over two Supreme Court Justice confirmations, intoduced a bill to provide service dogs to disabled veterans as well as an amendment to the appropriations bill regarding contract disputes, and was in the national news a good deal due to his election controversies. (This is assuming that the positivity or negativity of influence is moot). --Chouston 21:17, 7 August 2011 (EDT)

Land surveying

I see Thomas Jefferson and Abraham Lincoln were moved out of the list. Both were land surveyors for several years, which is a "real" job. They might not have been hugely successful at the position, but it is a job that has real responsibility and there are legal consequences if done incorrectly. Mount Rushmore have 3 surveyors on it - only Theodore Roosevelt had the poor judgement of not attempting the profession. --SharonW 21:21, 7 August 2011 (EDT)

Eisenhower

He was a five-star general in the Army and was very influential in WWII. He helped with the Invasion of Normandy.--JamesWilson 21:22, 7 August 2011 (EDT)

Obama

Whether you like him or hate him, he is the president of the United States. How can it be said he isn't "significant" in politics? What has all the fighting been about the past three years then? --SharonW 21:24, 7 August 2011 (EDT)

Edited to add - if he's insignificant, why does CP have so many articles about him and his administration's policies? --SharonW 21:30, 7 August 2011 (EDT)

Obama ???

I am curious about edit. Obama had a very wealthy career as a attorney and author before stepping into the political fray. Why does it not count? MaxFletcher 21:49, 7 August 2011 (EDT)

(Edit conflict) Also, why would there be question marks by Obama's name, but attorney by Santorum's, despite Santorum only having 4 years under his law belt and Obama having 9+? --Chouston 21:51, 7 August 2011 (EDT)
And what does "no clear influence in politics mean"? He's the president!!! Can't get much more influential than that! MaxFletcher 22:08, 7 August 2011 (EDT)
Surely influence means more than someone's title or position. Otherwise, the 44 most influential people in American history would be the 44 presidents, which is obviously not the case.--Andy Schlafly 23:06, 7 August 2011 (EDT)
But he has quite a clear influence. He is the President. MaxFletcher 23:17, 7 August 2011 (EDT)
So Barack Obama is no longer destroying the country? What a glorious day for America. --Chouston 23:19, 7 August 2011 (EDT)
Folks, position does not equal influence. Jesus had no position at all.--Andy Schlafly 23:39, 7 August 2011 (EDT)
But Obama has huge influence. He can sign things into law that cause massive changes. How do you classify influence? MaxFletcher 23:41, 7 August 2011 (EDT)
Thomas Edison was named by Life magazine as the most influential person in the entire world in the second millennium. Yet he did not sign anything into law.--Andy Schlafly 00:46, 8 August 2011 (EDT)

Definition of influence

Andy, please give a definition of "influence" for us to work with. Thanks. --SharonW 00:15, 8 August 2011 (EDT)

I am curious as well. I am reluctant to add any more names until a clearer pattern emerges. --SteveK 00:22, 8 August 2011 (EDT)