Talk:Molotov-Ribbentrop pact

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Your gonna need a bunch a redirects, Molotov-Ribbentrop, Ribbentrop-Molotov, Hitler-Stalin, Nazi-Soviet, German-Soviet, Soviet-German,and probably a few more. RobS 01:24, 18 April 2007 (EDT)

A question - "Communazi?" I've read quite a bit of WWII history in English and French and have never seen such a term before. Where does it come from, which historians coined it/use it today? PeterW 16:36, 4 October 2007 (EDT)

Filmeaker Agnieszka Holland, who grew up in Poland, 58 sec. film depiction of the Hitler Stalin pact. RobSGive Peace a Chance! 10:30, September 29, 2023 (EDT)
Here's a Time magazine article from the Communazi period, June 3, 1940.[1] Soviet propagandists and apologists attempted to dispose of the term after 1945. Rob Smith 16:49, 4 October 2007 (EDT)

Here we go again

Lvov pogrom, June-July 1941.

The problem with the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact is, Hitler's violation of the pact on June 22, 1941 with the invasion of the Soviet Union was a key cause to the charge of "Crimes Against Peace" at the Nuremberg Tribunal which adjudicated the Pact as authentic and legal. Fast forward. Can Russia now claim the Baltic States as breakaway separatists, much as Ukraine claims Lugansk, Donetsk, and Crimea as their territory? RobSZ+ 14:35, June 15, 2022 (EDT)

LT, research a little about the Matsuoka Pact. It's the Japanese version of the Molotov-Ribbentrop. (Note: WP doesn't even have an article on it.) RobSGive Peace a Chance! 01:13, September 28, 2023 (EDT)

Interesting. But doesn't Wikipedia technically have an article under the title "Soviet–Japanese Neutrality Pact"? —LT Rev. 22:13 Thursday, 01:24, September 28, 2023 (EDT)
My bad. That's it. They need a redirect.

(ex) Here's what happened: within hours after the pact was broken by Hitler, the picture at the right was on the streets of Lvov. The Soviets had kept the peace by locking up some 10,000 Ukrainian nazis in the gulag. As German forces advanced, the NKVD killed all the prisoners and withdrew. But they didn't get all the nazis, like the kid in the picture with the stick. These punks took out their revenge on the Poles, Jews, Russians, Romanians, Gypsies, Hungarians any none-Ukrainian, and not on the Soviet communists who withdrew. This was the Nazi system. But as the German Nazis advanced, they local nazis were forced by the Germans to become better organized.

Kind of looks like the streets of Chicago recently, or the 2020 BLM riots. Just wait til they get better organized.

So today's Ukrainian nazis are descendants of Ukrainian nazis from days of yore whose families were ostracized in the Soviet system and by Soviet society. See, the whole issue of outlawing capital punishment in modern times, (on a worldwide scale) began in Czarist times. Russia always needed workers in Siberia and the Far East, so capital punishment was outlawed (Russian culture deemed themselves "progressive", humane, and civilized even before Soviet times). The Soviets prided themselves by keeping it illegal; (they just resorted to terrorism of whole villages if they deemed it necessary to compel compliance in the early days). RobSGive Peace a Chance! 01:52, September 28, 2023 (EDT)

Hmm, I see. All the liberal shills who've told me in the past one-and-a-half years that "the Ukrainians" are so innocent need a reality check. Apparently those people know next to nothing about the depths of racial hatred in Eastern Europe. —LT Rev. 22:13 Thursday, 01:57, September 28, 2023 (EDT)
It's a real tragedy. But you're young and you're witnessing it. Remember, however historians write about it - it is NATO exterminating the male population living in Ukraine. Maybe NATO thinks they're getting rid of all the Nazis, but they are not. The nazis aren't serving on the front line - it is untrained Russians born in Ukraine, Hungarians, etc being pressed into service who are being killed in 3 or 4 days on the front. RobSGive Peace a Chance! 02:08, September 28, 2023 (EDT)
Hmm... I guess it would then be accurate to say NATO = Nazi Abetting Terrorist Organization. —LT Rev. 22:13 Thursday, 02:11, September 28, 2023 (EDT)
I note things I refer to as a "historical fluke". After WWII, there never was a formal peace treaty (now some will say it was the UN Charter. It wasn't. And largely due to FDR's premature death. He didn't live long enough to see his "Grand Design" develop as he envisioned it. Some of this is covered in Hillary's Inner Goldwater Girl). So technically, WWII never ended. Even in the Cold War, Soviet propaganda continued its war with the West, or Western fascism. They said the US & UK simply switched sides and joined the fascist alliance with Germany (Axis Powers), and they were continuing their war against fascism, while in the West we claimed fascism was defeated. I understood that was how Soviet communists saw things. Now the Soviet communists are gone. But never was that view more true than today. RobSGive Peace a Chance! 02:37, September 28, 2023 (EDT)
Let me restate it: we claim fascism was defeated in WWII and the Cold War was capitalism v. communism; the USSR claimed the war against fascism began in 1941 and ended wit the collapse of the USSR in 1991; now fascism has resumed its war against the Russian Federation.
From the Russian view, the West isn't fighting an ideology anymore. NATO, like the Nazis, are fighting to exterminate the Russian people, language, culture, religion. RobSGive Peace a Chance! 02:47, September 28, 2023 (EDT)
uncivil remarks
Peace treaty?! Which bit of unconditional surrender are you struggling with, man? I can only see two bits, so this should be an easy fix, even with your broken brain. ConwayIII (talk) 15:05, September 28, 2023 (EDT)
They even had the presence of mind to write it down for posterity, just for idiots like you. ConwayIII (talk) 15:12, September 28, 2023 (EDT)
A surrender document is not a peace treaty. FDR tried to turn the Allies of WWII into an institution with the United Nations. But it didn't work. RobSGive Peace a Chance! 22:34, September 28, 2023 (EDT)
A "treaty" is required to agree "terms". There are no "terms" offered or received when the surrender is unconditional. One side has literally just said: "We give up. The war is over. You won. Do with us what you will." This is basic stuff, man. ConwayIII (talk) 13:50, September 29, 2023 (EDT)
There were two "treaties" as you say - in violation of the Big Three agreement not to accept separate surrender or "peace" agreements. It was the UK that violated that agreement with the "Surrender at Rheims", as it is known. RobSGive Peace a Chance! 14:33, September 29, 2023 (EDT)
There is a logical contradiction in your argument. Either the USSR had fallen and thus would be unable to hold any opinion on any matter, let alone when the war against fascism had ended, or else the USSR had not fallen, which is plainly false. Unless you are saying that the USSR and post-Soviet Russia are the same thing? It is okay to have areas of mental incompetency – we all do. You just have to know when to back off and let those who do have a discussion. MayGodBless (talk) 16:23, September 28, 2023 (EDT)
There was a war between Germany and the USSR in 1945, but there was no war between Germany and Russia during 1945. Unless the Russians are to be held as one and the same with the Soviets? Surely you know better. MayGodBless (talk) 16:25, September 28, 2023 (EDT)
Was the Reagan presidency fascist? That would have to be true if we are to say the cold war was the Soviets vs. the fascist. MayGodBless (talk) 16:27, September 28, 2023 (EDT)
I am praying for you, RobSmith. You need to be shown the right path, and learn when you are mentally incompetent. Being an administrator on one website does not mean your geopolitical views are correct. Nor does censorship of hate speech make you correct. Put your faith in Jesus, and realize that the Soviets are evil. MayGodBless (talk) 16:31, September 28, 2023 (EDT)
What is celebrated on Victory Day? MayGodBless (talk) 16:44, September 28, 2023 (EDT)
Victory Day is celebrated on May 9. For decades the West celebrated Victory in Europe or VE-8 day as May 8 cause they did not accept the May 9 surrender of German forces in the capital of Berlin as legitimate. VE-E Day is now largely forgotten, and everyone recognizes the holiday established by the Soviet Union as the legitimate surrender date and terms. As User:Conway said above, the Germans told the Soviet Union "Do with us what you will." RobSGive Peace a Chance! 15:29, September 29, 2023 (EDT)
It was a rhetorical question. MayGodBless (talk) 00:38, October 1, 2023 (EDT)
I'm saying Soviet propaganda throughout the Cold War called NATO fascist. That's what they taught school children. In the 1990s, they tried out capitalism, and it didn't work out the way it was sold to them by the West. Yes, it's become a consumer society, but here in the US most people have consumerism confused with capitalism. n
Today you have more than 25 million people in their mid 30s on up whose birth certificates say they were born in the Soviet Union, and most aren't happy with the way they are treated everywhere except in Russia. Can't blame 'em. They didn't do anything to warrant the kind of discrimination they face. RobSGive Peace a Chance! 22:34, September 28, 2023 (EDT)
Are you really so Russophobic to claim that the sub-human Russians could not think for two seconds and realize that was utter bullcrap? Being told "we are fighting the Nazis" while having a massive celebration for the defeat of the Nazis on Victory Day is something a toddler could see through. MayGodBless (talk) 00:38, October 1, 2023 (EDT)
Even after the German surrender in Berlin in 1945, the Soviet Union continued fighting Ukrainian Nazis, armed by the United States, in Ukraine until 1954. RobSGive Peace a Chance! 02:18, October 1, 2023 (EDT)
Basically, it's why James Forrestal got tossed out of the 17th floor window of Bethesda Naval Hospital - cause somebody found out he was arming Nazis. RobSGive Peace a Chance! 02:22, October 1, 2023 (EDT)
In swearing allegiance to Hitler, Ukrainian nationalists proceeded from the same arguments that guide modern Ukraine, voluntarily becoming dependent on the United States. This was announced on the channel "Wild live" by the Ukrainian political scientist Konstantin Bondarenko, the correspondent of "PolitNavigator" reports.
"We have, in fact, today there is a war for a new addiction. Somehow it turned out that a little more than 30 years ago, having left dependence on the Soviet Union, on Russia, and so on, we fall into a new dependence - dependence on the United States and convince ourselves that "well, they are more civilized, they are more advanced, they are more technologically advanced, so it is not a sin to be dependent on such people."
"This is what the leaders of the Organization of Ukrainian Nationalists were guided by at one time, who considered the independence of Ukraine in the late 30s and early 40s as a new dependence on Germany or on this new Europe, which Hitler then promoted. Well, in this situation, history does not teach anything," Bondarenko said.
The host of the channel, Vitaly Dikiy, asked if the current situation could be compared with that.
"And the fact is that any parallel is conditional. But I'm just getting to this: unfortunately, our elites do not consider Ukraine as a self-sufficient value. Even before the war, discussions between politicians for the same 30 years were held over who is better to attach Ukraine to, who is better to lease it to - east or west," the political scientist replied.
RobSGive Peace a Chance! 02:37, September 29, 2023 (EDT)