Debate: Can you be a true Christian and believe in evolution?

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NO

It is very simple - Jesus was born to rescue us from the original sin. If there is no Adam and Eve, there is no original sin. Hence the whole premise for Christianity will break down. So every true Christian should believe in creation account - literally. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Heffalump (talk)

Reply: So are you saying that all evolutionists deny original sin? Because Darwin didn't deny original sin. -Ethan

I think the nature of sin is one of the big different between creation and evolution.

Evolution doesn't really recognize sin, and see death and suffering as a part of nature and necessary process in evolution, to evolve to new species.

But bible says that death and suffering are because of sin, it is not what God wanted, and nothing nature and necessary about it.

I think Christians who still believe in evolution don't really realize the cruelty of evolution. 90% of a group have to die off in order for the rest of the 10& to "evolve".

God won't use death and suffering in His creation. And I think God is smart enough to make everything perfect in the beginning (just like what the bible says) instead of made a few amoebas and let them "evolve" over time.

For those of you who watched Dr. Kent Hovind's videos, I accept most of his views about this.Kmcheng 16:54, 25 December 2008 (EST)

YES

As humans are capable of believing two or more contradictory things, it entirely possible (and quite common) for someone who is truly a Christian to have a wrong view about parts of the Bible, including the parts that contradict evolution. So believing in evolution does not mean that you are not truly a Christian, even though you believe something quite anti-biblical. Philip J. Rayment 21:59, 11 March 2008 (EDT)

This is very difficult to answer. I agree with Mr. Rayment - probably yes. --JBuscombe 08:15, 14 March 2008 (EDT)

As said above. --UaSsAu 08:35, 14 March 2008 (EDT)

I don't understand. How can someone believe in two contradictory things? --Heffalump 18:31, 16 March 2008 (EDT) Can you give me an example of some thing you contradictory you believe in? --Heffalump 18:45, 16 March 2008 (EDT)

Most people who believe in two contradictory things don't realise that they believe in two contradictory things. They've never really thought through the implications of the things they believe to realise that there is a contradiction. That's not always true, though. Sometimes people do realise that they believe in two contradictory things, but choose to keep believing both of them. This I cannot understand, and I can't recall any examples. More common, however, would be those that have realised that two of the things they believe in are contradictory, but don't yet know how to solve that contradiction. Many people have become Christians but continued to believe in evolution. At first, they don't see the contradiction (believing, for example, that God used evolution to create). Later, many of them realise that there is a contradiction (their compromise doesn't actually work), but don't know how to resolve that. Fortunately, many of them ultimately resolve the contradiction by rejecting evolution, but there's many others who haven't done that last step, or haven't reached that last step yet.

But the point is, salvation is not dependent on the believer accepting every last detail of what the Bible says. Those described above who eventually come to reject evolution haven't finally become Christians at the point that they reject evolution; they were already Christians before that.

Philip J. Rayment 21:04, 16 March 2008 (EDT)

That is a great explanation, Philip. That kind of opened my eyes. --Heffalump 14:14, 17 March 2008 (EDT)

As a theistic evolutionist I think that the story of creation is more of an allegory. As for Adam and Even and Original Sin I haven't really decided whether or not they literally existed and Eve ate the forbidden fruit, or if that is an allegory as well. To be honest, I'm more of a passive evolutionist, fully realizing that I could very well be wrong while being glad that I'll be forgiven if I am. I'm just glad that the creationism v. evolution isn't really central to Christianity. FernoKlump 00:09, 25 May 2008 (EDT)

That's a defeatist attitude (don't take it personally!). Today you are a "passive evolutionists", tomorrow a "passive liberal". When will you be a "passive atheist"? Sorry for kidding, but think about it. If you don't take Creation literally, everything else in the Bible can be an "allegory". There are many allegories, metaphors, parables in the Bible, but the account of Creation is not. Nowhere it mentions that it shouldn't be taken literally. I'm sure Mr.Rayment will explain it better. --AdamE 11:18, 29 August 2008 (EDT)

On the type of text of the creation account, see Creation week. If there was no Adam and Eve, there was no original sin. If there is no original sin, then we don't need a Saviour to save us from it. Therefore we don't need Jesus. If there was no first Adam, there is no need of a last Adam. You're right; it's not central at all! Philip J. Rayment 11:34, 1 September 2008 (EDT)

As for this argument using the Adam and Eve story, this and the Theory of Evolution are not related. They are not alternatives of each other. The account of creation in the Bible is just that. It refers only to how things were created in the beginning. The Theory of Evolution concerns how life on earth has changed over time. If one is not satisfied with that argument, then perhaps this one: the Bible does not explain the means by which most forms of life were created by God. Is it not possible that God used evolution to further the variance of Earth's life forms? This idea is reminiscent of the ancient ways of explaining the universe: the apple falls from the tree because God wills it so. While this is still true, it has since been discovered that God created gravity, and this law of nature is most directly the cause of the apple's fall. It is most probable that God created evolution in the same way, to govern nature's life forms and the way that they change over time.--JArneal 21:55, 9 October 2008 (EDT)

Sure, why not? Ironheart777 11:59 (PST) 25 november

/* YES */ Of course! As long as you BELIEVE that Christ exists in your heart, than you can believe whatever the hell you want to go along with it. For example, I heard this story not to long ago, dealing with the Pope. This took place a couple years ago, so I hear, and has only happened once.

True story, look it up:

The Pope was sitting at his table, endulging in a breakfast of Chuck Steak and Poached eggs with Sour Cream on the side. Delicious, right? Well, as we all know, when you're done eating you sometimes have to go and do that thing we all know about in the bathroom correct?

So, the Pope had realized this just an hour after his appetizingly, delicious meal. Now, Benedict here had been intestinally corked for a few days, so there was a lot of garbage in the dumpster; thus, he had taken a gelatine stool softener after his meal. After thinking about it for a good five minutes or so, just getting out of digestion, Benedict felt a large rumbling in his stomach. So intense and massive this rumbling, it could have been at the force of a tank!

The wonderously pious man warp sped his way towards the toilet...

The hit was so sudden and intense that there was a chance he could have already "made the brownies" so to speak. Thus, when he finally made his way into the Bathroom, shutting the door was the last thing on his mind!

Unfortunately for our main man here, as soon as he had let his pants down, he discovered a sticky, brown wonder inside of them. This was stressful. He was old, but not that old. It must have been those damned stool softeners! The palm of his hand was covering his face for a few minutes while the disaster was deterring out from his most certainly 'uncorked' bowel.

After many "horn-like" noises and ghastly "ahhhhhs" from the Pope, it was finally over. Now, it was time for the worst of it all. He knew damn well this was going to be messy, as well as going to take a long, long while.

He glanced to his right...

No! There was nothing. Just a few slivers left of a roll! None left in the reserves? The maid must have certainly switched the roll by now...

He let out a long sigh... wondering what the hell he was going to do. It was truly amazing how a human's normal functions of waste could really be stressful at times.

He then glanced to his left...

There, on the table next to him, in a brown sleeve and with a golden sliver hanging out, was none other than the "Holy Bible." The Pope, while angry at himself for it, thus knew what had to be done. Of all the people in this world, he himself would be the LAST person to suspect doing something so foul and blasphemous. Unfortunately, desperate times called for desperate measures.

Naturally, he put his hands together and chanted "Dear God, oh Lord: please forgive me for what I am about to do. I have no other choice", his head shaking sadly at the chant.........

Shelly the Maid had trotted in the bathroom door yet again for another day of the Bathroom cleaning. Her eyes lit up when she saw the experiment lying on the floor. What the hell had happened? Why was there a Bible with HALF of its pages missing??? What's with the shit on the floor? The fan wasn't even on!

She shook her head and planned out within a week what she was going to do with her life. First step was going to be putting in her resignation...