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Debate:The Groyper Wars (view source)
Revision as of 19:39, November 20, 2021
, 19:39, November 20, 2021no edit summary
:::I think you're right about Richard Spencer. And I would like both Ben Shapiro and TPUSA to put more emphasis on social conservatism and less emphasis on free-market economics (as Michael Knowles and Matt Walsh have advocated for the broader conservative movement several times). Shapiro is sort of libertarian, and so are Charlie Kirk and most of the people at Turning Point. I'm not really a fan of libertarianism. I'm a huge fan of Walsh and Knowles partly because neither of them is remotely libertarian. As well, Shapiro in particular seems to support free-market absolutism and neoliberal, globalized capitalism, though I also just heard him say that America should put tariffs on non-American companies that use child labour and American companies that do so should be punished. I think some people on the dissident right tend to overlook the positives about Ben Shapiro and The Daily Wire: an alt-Hollywood, an alt-publishing company. Openly defying Biden's vaccine mandate and suing him over it. TPUSA has been engaging in conservative activism all over the U.S. for years at this point, and they've improved over time. Charlie Kirk now talks about demographics, marriage, and the nuclear family. Ben Shapiro talks about corporate tyranny. They're human, not controlled opposition. And I'm all for "telling whites to embrace their heritage and take action against the anti-white agenda." That's great. It's something Matt Walsh talks about all the time, at least in 2021. But here's what I mean by saying Nick advocates for white identity politics: [https://tv.gab.com/channel/three_spoons/view/nick-fuentes-white-americans-are-61619c89645a5a7fe897dd5e here], at 31:24, Nick says "White racial identity politics is not going away." And it's not just that. Nick has explicitly rejected "multi-racial, working-class populism" and grouping together as Americans, patriots, conservatives, or even Christians in favour of white identitarianism. ---[[User:BernieandTrumpFan|BernieandTrumpFan]] ([[User talk:BernieandTrumpFan|talk]]) 20:58, November 18, 2021 (EST)
:::I think you're right about Richard Spencer. And I would like both Ben Shapiro and TPUSA to put more emphasis on social conservatism and less emphasis on free-market economics (as Michael Knowles and Matt Walsh have advocated for the broader conservative movement several times). Shapiro is sort of libertarian, and so are Charlie Kirk and most of the people at Turning Point. I'm not really a fan of libertarianism. I'm a huge fan of Walsh and Knowles partly because neither of them is remotely libertarian. As well, Shapiro in particular seems to support free-market absolutism and neoliberal, globalized capitalism, though I also just heard him say that America should put tariffs on non-American companies that use child labour and American companies that do so should be punished. I think some people on the dissident right tend to overlook the positives about Ben Shapiro and The Daily Wire: an alt-Hollywood, an alt-publishing company. Openly defying Biden's vaccine mandate and suing him over it. TPUSA has been engaging in conservative activism all over the U.S. for years at this point, and they've improved over time. Charlie Kirk now talks about demographics, marriage, and the nuclear family. Ben Shapiro talks about corporate tyranny. They're human, not controlled opposition. And I'm all for "telling whites to embrace their heritage and take action against the anti-white agenda." That's great. It's something Matt Walsh talks about all the time, at least in 2021. But here's what I mean by saying Nick advocates for white identity politics: [https://tv.gab.com/channel/three_spoons/view/nick-fuentes-white-americans-are-61619c89645a5a7fe897dd5e here], at 31:24, Nick says "White racial identity politics is not going away." And it's not just that. Nick has explicitly rejected "multi-racial, working-class populism" and grouping together as Americans, patriots, conservatives, or even Christians in favour of white identitarianism. ---[[User:BernieandTrumpFan|BernieandTrumpFan]] ([[User talk:BernieandTrumpFan|talk]]) 20:58, November 18, 2021 (EST)
::::I think Nick is making perfect sense in the video you linked. I don't think he means "identity politics" in the Obama-esque "I'm black n y'all gotta do everything I say or you racist" sort of sense here. Sounds to me like he's talking about political ideology that prioritizes white identity. (''White-identity'' politics, rather than white ''identity-politics'', if that makes sense). Also, he's not saying we can't come together as American patriots or Christians, he's just saying that many conservatives pretend that race isn't a thing, and that we can't properly fight the anti-white agenda if we don't recognize whiteness. [[User:Vince Did 7-14|Vince Did 7-14]] ([[User talk:Vince Did 7-14|talk]]) 14:22, November 20, 2021 (EST)
::::I think Nick is making perfect sense in the video you linked. I don't think he means "identity politics" in the Obama-esque "I'm black n y'all gotta do everything I say or you racist" sort of sense here. Sounds to me like he's talking about political ideology that prioritizes white identity. (''White-identity'' politics, rather than white ''identity-politics'', if that makes sense). Also, he's not saying we can't come together as American patriots or Christians, he's just saying that many conservatives pretend that race isn't a thing, and that we can't properly fight the anti-white agenda if we don't recognize whiteness. [[User:Vince Did 7-14|Vince Did 7-14]] ([[User talk:Vince Did 7-14|talk]]) 14:22, November 20, 2021 (EST)
:::::From 37:30 - "Race is the basis, and I wish it wasn't that way. Understand, you know, people look at me and they say, 'That's the guy! That's the white supremacist that wants to make everything racist!' I didn't make it that way. Don't point the finger at me, don't blame me! I'm looking at the world and telling you how it is, I'm explaining it to you. I didn't make the world, okay? Don't blame me, I didn't make America the way it is!... We do have to acknowledge where we differ, and we have to account for those things so that we can live together in harmony... To the extent that it is possible that we get along, the way that we get along is by understanding our differences, accommodating for those differences, and then we can flourish. Not ignoring them, not pretending that they don't exist."