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Talk:Essay:Calming the Storm (view source)
Revision as of 19:38, April 4, 2017
, 19:38, April 4, 2017→Statement on Translations: There is no compelling reason to believe that Jesus stayed silent
::As to your third point, Jesus spoke in Aramaic when uttering an emotional, spontaneous remark to others who spoke Aramaic. This '''''is''''' basic and is not disputed. There are numerous instances in the [[Gospels]].
::As to your third point, Jesus spoke in Aramaic when uttering an emotional, spontaneous remark to others who spoke Aramaic. This '''''is''''' basic and is not disputed. There are numerous instances in the [[Gospels]].
::As to your fourth point, Mark did use Aramaic in those situations. See, e.g., "Talitha kuom" in Mark 5:41. He did not use Aramaic in the encounter with the sea, and hence Mark was probably not quoting Jesus. Of course, there are additional reasons to conclude that Mark was not quoting Jesus as well.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] ([[User talk:Aschlafly|talk]]) 14:42, 4 April 2017 (EDT)
::As to your fourth point, Mark did use Aramaic in those situations. See, e.g., "Talitha kuom" in Mark 5:41. He did not use Aramaic in the encounter with the sea, and hence Mark was probably not quoting Jesus. Of course, there are additional reasons to conclude that Mark was not quoting Jesus as well.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] ([[User talk:Aschlafly|talk]]) 14:42, 4 April 2017 (EDT)
*John 18:4 indicates that Jesus has generally no need for spontaneous statements.
*Jesus spoke Aramaic. The not so basic question is to which extant did He use the Greek language? Take the discussion with His pupils on the boat which is given in Greek in Luke, Mark, and Matthew. Did it not happen? There are small varieties between these versions, but nevertheless those are His words, given to us in Greek.
*What you describe as "childish putdowns" isn't censorship, it's a nuisance at best. Abuse of blocking power is censorship - have you seen the last block of [[User:SamHB]]?
*yes, Mark 5:41 does use a short Aramaic phrase - while the same episode in Luke 8:54 only uses the Greek phrase. Both is marked as direct speech. So, at best, the use of Aramaic is not consistent over the Gospels.
*Frankly, there are no additional reasons to conclude that Mark was not quoting Jesus - as I wrote elsewhere:
::{|class="wikitable" style="background:lightgrey"
|
#Mark 4:39, Matthew 8:26, and Luke 8:24 use the verb ἐπιτιμάω to state that Jesus rebuked the sea. This may or may not be done verbally.
#Luke 8:25 uses the verb ἐπιτάσσω which indicates a spoken order.
#Mark 4:39 uses the verb λέγω, indicating that Jesus spoke to the sea.
Nothing in these verses contradicts the idea that Jesus gave a verbal command. The idea that Jesus gave a silent command or just made an observation isn't consistent with the second and the third point. There is no compelling reason to believe that Jesus stayed silent.
|}
--[[User:AugustO|AugustO]] ([[User talk:AugustO|talk]]) 15:38, 4 April 2017 (EDT)