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Talk:Essay:Worst Liberal Movies (view source)
Revision as of 02:55, October 26, 2017
, 02:55, October 26, 2017→Changed title: new section
I think it was the Xuans or something, not the Huns. It may have just been pronounced that way because the X may be pronounced like an H in Chinese or something. Also, it's debatable that it's liberal because Mulan does all of that to save her father's life. He wouldn't have made it due to his older age. She was at least doing some honor to her father by risking her life to protect him from going off to a war she didn't think he'd live through. Also, she did risk her neck to save her country despite being looked down upon for being a woman. (That's actually counter Leftist in a way because the Leftist whine about being discriminated against and support policies that hurt their country. Mulan, on the other hand, had no guarantee that she would get honored for what she did. In fact, she knew quite well she could be executed for pretending to be a fictional brother of hers. Also, the character Mulan is a Chinese legend. On the other hand, the ancestor worship was a form of paganism, but, on the other hand, probably was historically accurate. [[User:PatriotMongoose|PatriotMongoose]] ([[User talk:PatriotMongoose|talk]]) 19:30, 13 October 2017 (EDT)
I think it was the Xuans or something, not the Huns. It may have just been pronounced that way because the X may be pronounced like an H in Chinese or something. Also, it's debatable that it's liberal because Mulan does all of that to save her father's life. He wouldn't have made it due to his older age. She was at least doing some honor to her father by risking her life to protect him from going off to a war she didn't think he'd live through. Also, she did risk her neck to save her country despite being looked down upon for being a woman. (That's actually counter Leftist in a way because the Leftist whine about being discriminated against and support policies that hurt their country. Mulan, on the other hand, had no guarantee that she would get honored for what she did. In fact, she knew quite well she could be executed for pretending to be a fictional brother of hers. Also, the character Mulan is a Chinese legend. On the other hand, the ancestor worship was a form of paganism, but, on the other hand, probably was historically accurate. [[User:PatriotMongoose|PatriotMongoose]] ([[User talk:PatriotMongoose|talk]]) 19:30, 13 October 2017 (EDT)
:Most of that (save for maybe the Xuans) was already mentioned when I moved Mulan to the Debatable whether Liberal section. I also noted that it was actually very pro-Military as a Conservative point. [[User:Pokeria1|Pokeria1]] ([[User talk:Pokeria1|talk]]) 21:55, 13 October 2017 (EDT)
:Most of that (save for maybe the Xuans) was already mentioned when I moved Mulan to the Debatable whether Liberal section. I also noted that it was actually very pro-Military as a Conservative point. [[User:Pokeria1|Pokeria1]] ([[User talk:Pokeria1|talk]]) 21:55, 13 October 2017 (EDT)
== Changed title ==
Whoever posted Das Boot on this page obviously didn't see the same movie I saw. Das Boot is, literally, the greatest war film ever made, and it is not anti-American, or pro-American, or pro-Nazi. If anything, it is anti-war, but being anti-war is not exclusive to the Liberal camp. I'm opposed to war, and I'm a former soldier, but I'm for American victory, but not for war for the sake of war. Liberals are not anti-war, but anti-American victory.
Das Boot is about a bunch of Germans who have to get into a steel tube that can submerge underwater, and have to survive a voyage in 1942, and by this year of the war it really sucks being aboard a German submarine because the Allies are getting much better at defending their convoys. It starts out with the sailors and officers at a party getting completely drunk, which is important, because these guys know the hell that awaits them. These guys are about to go aboard the next day aboard a machine where, for the next several weeks they have to live in very tight, confined spaces, for most of them not seeing the sun so it bleaches out their skin for lack of Vitamin D. The film vividly captures this in all it's disgusting glory, from the scene where they have to eradicate the crabs that stowed-away (and not the sea-going crabs), to the scene where the officers are picking out the mold that has appeared on their bread so they can eat!
There is one dedicated Nazi aboard, and he's from Mexico, but he only has one scene where he talks about believing in the Nazi cause, and it's promptly followed by the captain ordering the song "It's a Long Way to Tipperary" to be played aboard the ship. This is not interpreted as hyperbolic patriotism under the belief they'll end up shopping in Piccadilly when the war is over, but a way to let off some steam and even to admire their enemies. The captain even criticizes the regime a bit, wondering where the air cover they're supposed to get from Hermann Goering. Where are their fleets screening the North Sea?
We get into the tedium of operating the sub, with a couple of incidents where the captain is frustrated that he can't engage enemy fleets to support other sub attacks because they're just too damn far away. They can hear them, but the sub only moves at roughly 10 knots on a good day if they're not submerged, even slower when they are because they're usually on batteries. When they do initially engage, they are chased away by a destroyer, and this is one of the few WWII sub films I know of where the sub doesn't retaliate against the destroyers because fighting destroyers is extremely difficult even if everything is going well for you because destroyers move and turn very fast. When they do manage to sink a ship, they're shocked to learn that the convoy didn't send anyone out to help these poor guys, and in a tragic scene, the sub has to back away from survivors who are trying to swim to them, and they can't take them on because to do so would be detrimental to them; too many guys aboard could affect if they can even submerge, affect their food stores, and other issues, so they have to let them drown.
Then they have orders to go through the Straits of Gibraltar, which is heavily defended, in order to be able to operate in the Mediterranean. Getting those orders is rough on morale, because everyone knows it's practically a suicide mission. When they make the attempt, we get one of the most horrendously riveting scenes in all filmdom; the depth-charging scene, which lasts several freakin' minutes. If you've never seen this before, you're wondering when this is going to end! This is intentional because the film's screenplay was written by a former German sub-commander, and he wanted you to know what it was like for these guys. They bottom out, and are so far deep it's amazing they weren't crushed by the water pressure. Are they going to survive? Are they ever going to get the sub to surface again? They have to put the crew on O2 and get most of them to sleep in order that they do not use up their remaining O2. When they do surface, you just don't care that they're Germans, but just Men who are trying to survive!!
And that's what real war is like. Once, I was stupid enough to ask my grandfather, who survived Guadalcanal and Okinawa, what the worst thing to happen to America was, and I thought he'd say the 60's or something, and he said WWII. When I said, "Why? We won," he looked at me as if I said something stupid, and he replied, "Son, you win a war like you win an earthquake." When you're in it, you've got ONE thing on your mind - survival. Sure, you want to succeed at missions, because, like the captain of the sub in Das Boot, you want that success to contribute to victory in the hope that the war will end! Nobody wants to die, and for those who end up dying on the battlefield we hope that their deaths were not in vain. But, sometimes, in real war, they are, because sometimes it doesn't matter if you succeed at your mission or not, as in the case of Das Boot at the end. We can admire an enemy's valour and still be patriots.