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Created page with " == India's WION news network questions the effectiveness of Russia's weapons and asks the question: What kind of special operation last 6 months? == Please see: [https://y..."

== India's WION news network questions the effectiveness of Russia's weapons and asks the question: What kind of special operation last 6 months? ==

Please see: [https://youtu.be/qC0IaqsRZdg?t=621 India's WION news network questions the effectiveness of Russia's weapons and asks the question: What kind of special operation last 6 months?] [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 18:14, August 20, 2022 (EDT)
:WION makes some good points, but I do agree with this clip: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H99XlWQ9KsA The AK-47 - a clip from the movie Lord of War]. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 18:23, August 20, 2022 (EDT)

::I've watched WION for years. I like Palke Sharma, but they are seriously off-track on many issues. The name says it all - World Is One, i.e. gloablist one world order. They criticize the One World Order, while using One World Order news sources from the West and talking points. Republic broadcasting from India is pretty good, though. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 20:44, August 20, 2022 (EDT)

::Basically I gave up on WION about a month ago when the U.S. abortion ruling came down. [https://youtu.be/Zg93xB6vYT8 Watch the first 2 minutes here]. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 21:49, August 20, 2022 (EDT)

:::After those first 2 minutes, I haven't watched any WION til now, and still have no interest in adding it back to my watch list. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 21:54, August 20, 2022 (EDT)
::::I already knew WION was pro-abortion. I watch WION to avoid pro-NATO and pro-Russia propaganda. But sometimes I go to RT.com. I look at news from different sources. I plan on looking at the news less and looking at important trends and investing related info more. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 22:12, August 20, 2022 (EDT)
:::::WION's snarkiness in reporting on "conservatives" in the U.S. after the SCOTUS ruling was not appreciated, especially considering it had no reporters covering the subject. It was a dead giveaway of bias. While it has an anti-[[colonial]] bent for its domestic market, it still kisses the globalist ring. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 19:01, August 22, 2022 (EDT)

:::::Republic World is much better than WION. [https://youtu.be/D7PuKFUu6xs Arnab Goswami has made quite a name for himself]. He doesn't sit still for the usual Angelo-American talking points. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 22:31, August 20, 2022 (EDT)
:::::[https://youtu.be/WGtS7qquoHE Russia-Ukraine War: Is This The Ultimate Fall Of American Hegemony? | Arnab LIVE], Mar 12, 2022. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 22:35, August 20, 2022 (EDT)
:::::[https://youtu.be/iClkn7rfOm4 'UK Is The Last Country That Should Lecture India On Its Stand,' Says Tatiana Kukhareva]. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 22:39, August 20, 2022 (EDT)
::::If you really want the best daily updates, I'd recommend [https://www.youtube.com/c/AlexChristoforou/videos Alex Christoforou] reporting from Athens. He reads all the relevant sources overnight, and puts together a very good stream usually about 20-30 minutes. He's a Greek-Orthodox Christian, and makes a very interesting stream while doing a walking tour through various Greek or Cypriot land marks (he once showed us the post from which Apostle Paul was whipped). It may take 2 or 3 days to learn some of the code he's forced to speak in, for example he can't say "Zelensky" or "Nazi" cause of Youtube algorithms. So he calls Zelensky "Elensky" cause the letter "Z" is outlawed in several European "democratic" countries.
::::This is how social media should operate. You get somebody halfway around the world who reads all proper sources and reports them daily. For info on the internal situation in Russia, you have [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FuNXlmpSEKE iEarlGrey, a Brit living in St. Petersberg]. He's sort of copied Alex's style and shows us the sites in St. Petersberg while reading the news. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 22:55, August 20, 2022 (EDT)

::WION is nothing special. It has one reporter who covers DC & the UN in New York who recycles the usual AP, Reuters, NYT, WaPo, CNN pap. It is unreliable for reporting on Western Europe and the US. It's reporting on China and the Indo-Pacific region, Iran and the Middle East is pretty good (areas AP, Reuters, NYT, WaPo, CNN fail at) Its reporting on the collective West is just recycled NATO crap. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 18:46, August 22, 2022 (EDT)
::God forbid you should listen to any WION reporting on the [[Mar-a-Lago raid]] (which I haven't). It's probably just recycled CNN/MSNBC crap (just like it did with the 2020 election controversy. It had no reporters anywhere in the U.S. investigating [[election fraud]]). [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 18:50, August 22, 2022 (EDT)

:[https://youtu.be/XVzkWGsTubE Roundtable discussion with 5 of the best Youtube sources and commentators on Ukraine war.] [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 10:47, August 21, 2022 (EDT)

===Reporting===
Reporting is all about vetting sources (like a cop taking a police report or a lawyer preparing a witness for testimony in a jury trial). Names like ''Bloomberg'', ''New York Times'', ''Guardian'', ''WaPo'', CNN, WION, etc etc etc mean nothing anymore. You have to reach down the individual person giving testimony who establishes a reputation, like [[Tim Pool]] or [[James O'Keefe]]. Then, when a person like James O'Keefe establishes himself, you can use his institutional name like [[Project Veritas]]. This is how NYT and CNN had to establish their reputation years and years ago, which in this generation has been tossed away. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 19:11, August 22, 2022 (EDT)

It does not matter if you cite Bloomberg or RT citing Bloomberg, it's the same source and it only makes you look like an idiot. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 11:04, September 5, 2022 (EDT)
:I am not going to use merely primary sources for all my main page, mainspace and essays. That excludes many legitimate reports. Using your reasoning, much of the Gospel of Luke and the Book of Acts would have to be thrown out because Luke the physician did not personally witness various events. You continue to use the [[genetic fallacy]].

:And whether or not when want to accept this reality, conservatives care less about politics than the left because they have other interest to greater degree (family, businesses, church, etc) and a major reason why people own news organization is due to the political influence. So conservatvies are not going to pour into the news business amidst newspapers closing, etc. They would rather go into more profitable busineses. If conservatives cared about being more powerful than liberals/leftists when it came to news reporting or at least achieving parity, they probably would have done it by now.

:America conservatives were losing the culture for decades post 1950s. But due to their higher fertility rate, they are becoming more and more competitive in politics. In addition, right-wing politics is becoming more popular in Europe due to the failure of welfare states and growing Muslim populations within their countries and the political backlash relative to his matter. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 12:37, September 5, 2022 (EDT)

::Thank you. I love how you connect the dots between flawed GDP statistics and low leftist fertility rates. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 16:37, September 5, 2022 (EDT)
:::I don't see where you showed me that I used flawed GDP statistics. In fact, you didn't show this. And given your propensity to use logical fallacies and proof by assertion, I have no desire to have a discussion with you further. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 17:56, September 5, 2022 (EDT)

::::Have you read the [[GDP]] article or talk page? [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 19:19, September 5, 2022 (EDT)
::::We have discussed this before, very recently. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 19:20, September 5, 2022 (EDT)
:::::I just gave it a quick scan. You argue that services are not as valuable as goods and that countries can do currency manipulations.

:::::Lastly, looking over my time management and my promises to 3 companies/organizations, I fell short recently. This is very sad to me because my skills/knowledge set is very hard/impossibile for these companies/organizations to replace and these companies/organizations do good work. So I am not going to continue this discussion. I am going to roll up my sleeves and practice the Protestant work ethic. On a more positive note, I am guessing these organization will forgive my recent fall in output due to the good work that I did for them in the past and that I will do for them in the future. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 19:45, September 5, 2022 (EDT)

::::::Let me make two quick points:
::::::*The recent argument by the Biden regime that ''When is a recession not a recession?'', and
::::::*The fact that NATO's miscalculation to go to war with Russia was based upon flawed GDP figures
::::::means the whole [[macroeconomic]] field is in a state of flux right now, and nothing the traditional number crunchers publish can be taken as definitive. Some revisions claim China passed up the U.S. to be the world's largest economy in 2015.
::::::Until the scholarly and academic community can get its act together, we should not be publishing flawed or suspect information on MPR as being factual. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 20:03, September 5, 2022 (EDT)

:::::For a scriptural reference, see 1 Chron 21:1: ''[https://biblehub.com/kjv/1_chronicles/21.htm And Satan stood up against Israel, and provoked David to number Israel]''. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 20:10, September 5, 2022 (EDT)
I found out my deadline isn't until Wednesday so I have a little time (I thought it was tomorrow).

First, in a couple of my lines of work, I use tools/formulas/principles and in many cases there isn't perfection in any one of the tools/formulas/principles. And things are always changing. So you use multiple tools/formulas/principles to get a more complete picture of reality. The same with the standard formula used to calculate GNP. The GNP formula is not a perfect measure of what it seeks to measure and so a person/organization might want to look at several aspects of a country's economy to get the size/value of its economy. But to throw out the standard GNP formula just because it is not perfect is self-defeating. Outside of heaven, there isn't a lot of perfection. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 23:04, September 5, 2022 (EDT)
:The point is, it is in transition right now; the position that the U.S. is nolonger the world's largest economy has been hidden from the American people. Time is needed to sort things out. Throwing more fuel on the fire of what apparently is faulty information is not helpful. And in this election season, there is no need to add filler about India with what may be false information. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 23:57, September 5, 2022 (EDT)

::Anyway, go ahead and post it, but add some context to make sense of why it's an MPR item: "India passes up its British [[colonial]] masters in GDP while the UK tries to hang on to its relevance on the world stage by making war on Russia." [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 22:15, September 6, 2022 (EDT)

===WION update===
*WION: ''Russia is withholding energy supplies to Europe.'' [https://youtu.be/4bTX0yXHTMg]

Duh, yah maybe cause the EU refuses to pay for it?

Duh, sanctions prohibiting ships from buying insurance to transport Russian oil is "Russia withholding oil"? (because of the risk of oil spills, tankers must have insurance).

Basically, this type of reporting is insulting to a person of average or normal intelligence. It is hate-filled lies and [[racism]] from Western propaganda sources spewed back by WION to an international audience. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 20:25, August 26, 2022 (EDT)
:If I am not mistaken, most of the energy supply from Russia to Europe goes through pipelines. I recall listening to a financial expert on this matter.

:Anyways, a lot of this was also caused by Western powers engaging in global warming alarmism and being too against nuclear power. Nuclear reactors are a lot safer now. Nuclear power is one of the least deadly sources of energy.[https://archive.ph/R21nA#selection-591.32-591.90] We learned from Chernobyl, the Fukushima nuclear disaster and the Three Mile Island incident.[https://world-nuclear.org/information-library/safety-and-security/safety-of-plants/safety-of-nuclear-power-reactors.aspx] Also, [https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/safer-nuclear-reactors-are-on-the-way/ safer nuclear reactors are on the way]. In other words, "econuts" caused a lot of this problem. In addition, Europe should have built up strategic reserves if they were going to be so reliant on Russian energy. The Boy Scott motto is "be prepared'. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 21:26, August 26, 2022 (EDT)

::Your right. Most went through pipelines, but seizing bank assets and accounts prohibits Russia getting paid for it. So an alternative method of loading tankers in Murmansk and elsewhere was quashed by not allowing shippers to buy insurance to ship Russian oil or food. (For awhile, Russian tankers were loaded in Russia, then the crude offloaded at sea to a foreign tanker prohibited from visiting Russian ports, then brought into port in Europe). And winter is not even here yet.

::My point is, '''it's a bald face lie to say Russia is withholding it.'''

::Pesumably, WION has some multinational corporate advertisers it doesn't want to P-off, and Palke Sharma get's a pretty good income by India standards, so why bother doing some investigative journalism and report the truth when reports can just be copy-pasted from Western fake news sources? [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 21:37, August 26, 2022 (EDT)

:::<digression>There's still ways around these idiotic, suicidal Western sanctions, although the volume of gas won't be anywhere near what's needed this winter. And the sky-high prices encourage [[black market]] activity. Russia already is selling its crude to Saudi Arabia, which then marks it up and sells it as Saudi crude to the EU. Eventually they'll work out the delivery routes were "Saudi crude" can be shipped directly from Murmansk rather than having to be transferred at sea or in Saudi Arabia. Now it's not like the globalist idiots running the EU and the DC Swamp don't know this; they are banking on YOU being stupid and propagandized with hatred for Russia. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 21:54, August 26, 2022 (EDT)
::::I recall Russia saying they were having problems with the pipeline and the Western powers expressed doubt about this.
[[File:Ukro-nazis.jpg|right|250px|thumb|Ukrainian nationalists. Written on the wall: “Ukraine for Ukrainians.”<ref>https://futuristrendcast.wordpress.com/tag/upass-bandera-crimes/</ref>]]
::::Anyways, it looks like this war is going to be a combination of: a war of attrition, Russia putting pain on Europe through its gas/oil supplies during the winter and Russia being willing to gut it out more than the Europeans. On the war of attrition side, Ukraine has the advantage due to the war happening in Ukraine and Ukrainian nationalism kicking in. On the Russia putting pain on Europe through its gas/oil supplies during the winter and Russia being willing to gut it out more than the Europeans side of the ledger, Russia has the advantage because Ukraine is in their backyard and Europe needs Russian oil/gas to have prosperity (Unless the USA ramps up energy production perhaps).

::::On the whole, pain on both sides will probably cause each side to come to the bargaining table in 1-5 years. If I were to guess, I would guess the war will last 1-2 years longer. However, the Iraq War lasted 8 years, the Soviet–Afghan War lasted 10 years and the War in Afghanistan and the Vietnam War both lasted 20 years. Great powers can have modern wars last long. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 21:57, August 26, 2022 (EDT)

:::::Ukrainian nationalism is dead. All the able-bodied males of draft age went to Europe and 70-year-old men serv in their place. Do not confuse "Ukrainian nationalism" with "Russophobia", which fewer and fewer people are willing to die for.

:::::Ukraine has no food or heating oil for the winter (let alone the troops).
[[File:Galicia.jpg|right|300px|thumb|Galicia, the Ukrainian nationalist homeland. The ethnic Ukrainian people, as a distinct people and linguistic group, are not prepared to run a state with sovereignty over Russians, Hungarians, Jews, Gypsies, Bulgars, Greeks, Poles, Tater Muslims, Moldovans or any other people group outside their own clique or klan.]]
:::::I don't think you understand the level of corruption lawlessness, and banditry in Ukrainian society. Humanitarian workers who cross the border from Poland say that once their bag is inspected carrying medical supplies, as soon as they set it down it is stolen for sale on the blackmarket.

:::::The link I posted to the movie about how the war started in 2014 - watch the opening 5 minutes. Ukraine is an extraordinarily poor country, and Russians were perceived as being more prosperous. Ukraine is like Mexico in many respects, with an indigent population and tax base unable to support law enforcement. Banditry has always been rampant in wide swaths of the country outside cities. When the so-called "Russian-backed" government was forcibly deposed in 2014, the people you call "nationalists" got bolder in their crimes against Russians, thinking there would be no retribution from the central authorities in Kyiv.

:::::Many if not most of the people Western media call "Ukrainian nationalists" are merely criminals and Russophobic bigots, who wouldn't think twice about committing the same atrocities against a fellow "Ukrainian nationalist" they would deem a collaborator. The Ukrainian parliament just passed a law labelling [https://youtu.be/yuorltlUbWs taking food or medical service from a Russian as a crime punishable by 15 years;] in a society under martial law that just emptied its prisons of murderers to serve on the front line, a crime punishable by 15 years is the same as a death sentence that can be executed on the spot - which is EXACTLY what happened in the [[Bucha massacre]]. The parliament passed this law ''ex post facto''.

:::::Again watch the [https://s2.cdnstatic.space/wp-content/uploads/video/23.08.22_Solntsepyok.mp4 opening 10 minutes of this film] to see how "Ukrainian nationalists" reacted to the U.S. backed coup in 2014. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 23:05, August 26, 2022 (EDT)
I do understand how corrupt Ukraine is. I am not going to quibble with you about how poor Ukraine is, but they have the wealthy West backing them (Granted the West is in decline and in debt). I am skeptical of your claim about Ukrainian nationalism. In war, the home team generally has the morale advantage due to nationalism. And nationalism is one of the powerful forces in the modern world. One of the reasons, why the USA/Russia lost in Afghanistan is because people hate foreign occupiers and that is greatly due to nationalism (Granted the Taliban saw Russians/Americans as infidels too). John Mearsheimer agrees with me that being an occupier is no picnic due to nationalism and that is going to be troublesome to the Russians. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 23:43, August 26, 2022 (EDT)
:Here you are completely in error. Afghanistan has no national identity; hence "nationalism" does not exist. The people resident in Afghanistan never heard of Afghanistan until outside foreigners told them that's what outsiders call them. The U.S. spent 20 years "nation building" to build an "Afghan National Army" that collapsed in 10 days when the U.S. stopped paying them. Hence, I believe your understanding of what "nationalism" is is grossly flawed.
:In Ukraine, more and more ethnic Ukrainians are joining the Allied Forces fighting against the corrupt Kyiv regime every day; so which force has "Ukrainian nationalists"? [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 10:33, August 27, 2022 (EDT)

::It is in these territories here that [https://youtu.be/IFk5wgMl2k8 US-back atrocities have occurred since 2014] (from a Burisma promotional video).

::The State Dept. and CIA mistakenly used the Machiavellian concept that a slave will not notice trading one slave master for another when it overthrew the Russian stooge regime and replaced it with the US stooge regime. Since 1991, Russians inside and outside Russia have accepted everything the West said about democracy and human rights. It is the West that has abandoned democracy and human rights since 1991.

::Ukraine was never democratic. Russia is the most advanced model of democracy in all 15 former Soviet Republics. The problem is, you think the United States has acted from benevolent motives, and it has not.

::Russia is not an occupier. It's on its home turf. The U.S. remains an occupier in Germany and elsewhere, from which it could get booted out by the German people for destroying Germany's economy by next spring. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 00:11, August 27, 2022 (EDT)
:Anyways, the war is going to be a losing proposition for all involved plus it crunches food supplies - especially to Africa/Middle East. The sooner it is over, the better. And Russia is going to keep some of the land they gained during the war. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 23:49, August 26, 2022 (EDT)
::We're living in a new era now. We can't make predictions based solely on experience of the recent past. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 00:11, August 27, 2022 (EDT)

:Basically, what the United States has done in Ukraine since 2014, is what it has done in Iraq, Afghanistan, Vietnam, Africa, Libya, Syria, and elsewhere for a very long time - terrorize the civilian population into submission to get them to support the central government. It hasn't worked against the Russians of the former territory of Ukraine. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 00:18, August 27, 2022 (EDT)

:So, the next propaganda hurdle you need to redeem yourself from is realizing that "Ukrainian nationalism" = criminality and banditry. "Ultra-nationalist" = Nazi. So it's basically the difference between a murderer and a thief. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 00:26, August 27, 2022 (EDT)

===Putin, again===
::Switzerland is now leaning pro-Ukraine and it is not neutral.[https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-61320132] I am still nonaligned. :) I think both sides acted foolishly and both sides are corrupt. But I dislike Putin more than Zelensky because Putin lowered my chances of meeting a beautiful Russian woman for marriage in the future because many are anti-American now thanks to Russian state-controlled television! [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qtZUeHmpV6A Russian women want a man like Putin]. It's so unfair. Putin knows the sissy self-defense system of judo, but I studied taekwondo so I could kick his ass! [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 02:56, August 27, 2022 (EDT)
:::Geez, I wish it were that simple of liking this guy over that guy, and the moral questions of Nazism and nuclear war weren't involved. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 03:25, August 27, 2022 (EDT)

:::As to Putin and Zelensky, the difference between the two is like the difference between Queen Elizabeth and a guy who shovels horse manure for one of her thoroughbred race horses - one is a leader and head of state, the other is a guy you hire and fire. That's not to denigrate either the sh*t shoveler or Zelensky, but the difference should be obvious. When he accepted the $54 billion check, he's no longer "independent" or "sovereign". [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 03:32, August 27, 2022 (EDT)
::::The USA received a lot of financial support from France during the [[American Revolutionary War]] against the British. So much money at it was one of the causes of the French Revolution due to the economic hardship/instability it caused France. I hope the USA doesn't make the same mistake France did as far as Ukraine.

::::And technically, Ukraine and the Russian Federation are both young countries. The Russian Federation formed after the fall of the Soviet Union in 1991.

::::Right now, Putin and the Kremlin are keeping their eye out for a successor. Putin will probably have the most influence on who the successor is and he will not want to pick someone who will prosecute him for his corruption. Hopefully, down the pike, Russia will have a leader who is capable of thawing out the icy relations that Russia and the West currently have. But if Jesus tarries, it could be decades or never that the relationship is improved. I have a feeling that the West will be slow to remove the sanctions on Russia and one of the reasons is "sore loser syndrome"/"not getting everything it wants syndrome". Russia is likely going to keep some of the land gained during the war. On the other hand, it is in the United States' best interest to have good relations with Russia due to the China/USA frenemy/rivalry situation. And nations often do what is in their best interest to do. And technically, the USA/UK/Germany/France/Europe is not super duper gun-ho about this war or they would give Ukraine the arms it needs to have a shot at pushing the Russians out of Eastern Ukraine and/or sent NATO troops/planes into Ukraine. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 08:16, August 27, 2022 (EDT)

:::::The Russian state is 800 years old; Ukraine is a failed state after less than 25 years.

:::::Russia is the most democratic state of all former Soviet Republics.

:::::You've fallen into the trap of believing Western propaganda - that Putin is a Hitleresque/Saddam/bin Laden type figure. He's not. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 09:24, August 27, 2022 (EDT)

:::::In the 1960s, Khrushchev was sold in Western media (as part of the CIA's [[Operation Mockingbird]]) as the next Hitler who wanted to conquer the planet. Today he's remembered as a reformer who paved the way for Gorbachev, Solzhenitsyn, and the collapse of the Soviet Union. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 09:27, August 27, 2022 (EDT)

:::::Oh, and NATO doesn't have the weapons anymore to give Ukraine. They've depleted their stocks. Russia has exposed to the planet that NATO is a paper tiger.

:::::The problem is, the brilliant geniuses in NATO & the EU who concocted this scheme had only one strategy - sanctions. When that failed, they had no back up strategy beyond cleaning off the shelves of a day-old bakery with former Warsaw Pact Soviet stocks. Superior technology won't save them anymore than it did [[Custer]] or the Germans at [[Stalingrad]]. Using NATO's advanced technology only delivers it into Russian and Chinese hands for reverse engineering, and when the full mobilization of NATO and the Russian Federation finally does come, the only "secret weapons" left are those that cause earthquakes and climate change - which the Russians already have, and more. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 09:41, August 27, 2022 (EDT)

::::::Let me lay out some simple facts the controlled media of the West obscures or fails to report:
::::::*The war has been a war by NATO & its Kyiv puppet regime against civilians since 2014;
::::::*The bulk of the fighting on the [[Donbas]] front is done by the militia's of the [[Donetsk]] and [[Lugansk]] Republics, with the Russians only filling in the gaps and serving in logistical and support units for the [[DPR]] & [[LNR]];
::::::*talk about Kyiv "keeping land" makes about as much sense as saying the genocidal regime of Berlin had a legitimate claim in 1945 to retain Upper Silesia (where the war against civilians at [[Auschwitz]] was located).
::::::Master these facts, and Moscow then may be willing to negotiate. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 10:08, August 27, 2022 (EDT)

:::::::The DPR & LPR are independent states. Like the NATO alliance, they have a collective security agreement with the Russian Federation under Article 51 of the UN Charter. You are getting waaaay ahead of yourself talking about Russia keeping land in the former territory of Ukraine (as [[Metternich]] said of Italy, "Ukraine" is geographical expression). [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 10:16, August 27, 2022 (EDT)

::::::::Oh, and the Russian Federation was not born in 1991; it changed its name from the Russian Federated Soviet Socialist Republic and dropped the provision for Communist Party membership to serve in parliament or the bureaucracy. That's all. The Ukrainian Soviet Socialist Republic did the same thing. The [[Social Democrat]]s, affiliated with the German [[SPD]] and UK [[Labour Party]], become dominant in the state Duma. In Ukraine, the fascist World War II era and Soviet Cold War era resistance movement [[OUN]] took over the Rada or parliament. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 10:51, August 27, 2022 (EDT)
Putin is more rational that Adolf Hitler, Saddam Hussein and Bin Laden. But he is still corrupt and authoritarian. (which also applies to Zelensky).

Putin orders Russian military to beef up forces by 137,000.[https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-putin-moscow-armed-forces-1b3a54763df874238478c1cd5d958fd5]. Previously, I guessed that the war would drag on about 1-5 years, but as long as 20 years based on recent wars. But I guessed that the war would last about 2 years more. Putin ordering the military to increase forces by 137,000 makes me more pessimistic.

RobS says that estimating how long the war would last is an exercise in futility because we are in uncharted waters. There is some truth in that. However, maybe the war in Ukraine will last shorter than 20 years, like the Vietnam/Afghanistan wars did, due to: economic factors (recessions, inflation, drought in Europe, etc.); Ukraine/Russia having populations that are older/greyer than when the Vietnam/Afghanistan war did with more only sons; and the fact that the terrain is less brutal and slow going than it is in Vietnam (jungle) and Afghanistan (mountainous). [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 23:36, August 27, 2022 (EDT)

:Sorry, but you're citing fake news, again. The 137,000 were ''already added'' in 2022, and what you are citing is the budget request for 2023.

:So, we know. Putin planted the Laptop from Hell to interfere in the 2020 election and prevent Biden from being elected. And you are doing yeoman's service to protect the Deep State and Joe Biden with your credible sources. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 00:10, August 28, 2022 (EDT)
::There is nothing that is going to protect Joe Biden from what is coming his way. Although I don't have an airtight case, I suspect there is going to be a red wave in the 2020 midterm elections. If the GOP gains a majority in Congress, investigations will happen and there will also be gridlock. But I doubt the investigations will accomplish much in terms of major reforms of the system (That will require the quality of the electorate to rise). And I strongly suspect Biden will not be reelected and he may even face a primary challenge. Biden should be in jail for treason given the foreign bribery, but I doubt he or his son will ever see a day in jail due to the corruptness of the system.
::I hope that SCOTUS will rule his student loan forgiveness giveaway unconstitutional. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 01:00, August 28, 2022 (EDT)
:::''There is nothing that is going to protect Joe Biden''
:::Nothing but User:Cons constantly citing the same fake news sources spreading lies about the threat from Russia & Putin.
:::Interesting how you leave the most obvious "corrupt and authoritarian" leaders off - the Clintons, Obama, Biden - off the list with Putin, Hitler, Saddam. bin Laden and Zelensky. It was Obama and Biden that overthrew the legitimate democratically elected government of Ukraine, starting this war and getting the planet into this global mess and recession.
:::If I had to say, you're brainwashed by Western controlled media. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 01:13, August 28, 2022 (EDT)

::::Most Americans put Putin/Russia low on their priority/focus list and I am one of them. America is surrounded by two big oceans and two big countries (Although we could use a southern border wall). It also doesn't need Russian oil/gas. Putin's corruptness/authoritarianism mostly affects Russians and Ukraine, but it also affects Europe to a lesser degree. And even in Russia, if you work hard/smart, you can still have a decent life if you stay out of politics. Furthermore, Russia has a poor future due to its aging population and the fact that 36% of its male population are drunks.[https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/alcoholism-by-country]

::::It is uninteresting that I didn't mention Clintons, Obama and Biden when discussing Putin. Because I was discussing Putin - not the Clintons, Obama and Biden. Clear writing has clarity and focus. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 02:06, August 28, 2022 (EDT)

:::::Correct. I get it. Putin bad. Biden good. Trump bad. FBI good. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 02:45, August 28, 2022 (EDT)

{{quotebox-float|''"It was not until 2013 however that the anti-Russian rhetoric went hyperbolic. In that year, the Russian parliament passed its so-called “Gay Propaganada” law. The bill, described as “Protecting Children from Information harmful to their Health and Development,” explicitly banned [[Gay Pride]] parades, as well as other forms of [[LGBT]] material, such as books and pamphlets, which attempted to normalize [[homosexuality]] and to influence children in their attitudes to homosexuality. In actual fact, since around 2006 many districts in Russia had been imposing their own local bans on such material, though these rules had no power outside their own jurisdiction. '''The bill, which was signed into law by Putin on June 30 2013, was extremely popular, and passed through the Russian Parliament unanimously, with just one abstention. But the impact upon the Western [[nomenklatura]] who form the gatekeepers of acceptable opinion, was immediate. Almost unanimously, Western media outlets now began to compare Putin with Adolf Hitler; he was a “thug,” a “[[fascist]],” a “murderer.” Between bouts of seething rage, he became the butt of scathing satire. He was cast in the role of a caricature James Bond villain, routinely murdering and torturing those he held a grudge against.''' There is even evidence, admittedly somewhat circumstantial, that Western Intelligence bodies, such as the [[CIA]] and [[MI5]], became actively involved in anti-Russian [[propaganda]].

''The effect of this deluge of [[demonization]] upon ordinary Westerners soon began to show: Whereas in 2006 only 1% of Americans listed Russia as “America’s worst enemy” by 2019 32% of Americans, including 44% of [[Democrat]] voters, shared this view. Only 28% of [[Republican]]s however agreed; a remarkable reversal of opinion. During the Cold War, Republican voters, traditionally the more religious and nationalistic element of the American political divide, viewed the Russians as the major threat; now it was the less or non-religious (and more pro-LGBT) Democrats who held this opinion.

''But the Western [[elitism|elite]]s did not confine its efforts to irate editorials in the ''London Times'' or the ''Washington Post'': Economic sanctions now began to be discussed. There were immediate calls to boycott the Winter Olympics, held in February 2014 in Sochi, Russia. Whilst the call to boycott was generally resisted by athletes, many Western politicians refused to attend, and the Russophobic temperature in the Western media ratcheted up. And things were about to get much worse....[https://thesaker.is/the-conflict-between-the-west-and-russia-is-a-religious-one/]}}
[[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 03:30, August 28, 2022 (EDT)
:You wrote in relation to me: "Correct. I get it. Putin bad. Biden good. Trump bad. FBI good."

:When you have to put words in my mouth regarding my positions on Biden, Trump and FBI, it is apparent that you lost the argument/debate. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 18:08, August 28, 2022 (EDT)

::I'm not putting words in your mouth. I'm following the logic most readers see in the sources you cite. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 18:13, August 28, 2022 (EDT)

::If you want to cite the ''Associated Press'' as you did in your most recent external link, and the AP is mistaken or, worse yet, deliberately feeding false information and Russophobia, it's not a far stretch to say you are in agreement with ALL fake news and misinformation the AP has spread going as far back as the Russia-Collusion hoax. Call it an error on your part, for not properly qualifying the source and/or not disclaiming it. You present that B.S. as authoritive. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 18:17, August 28, 2022 (EDT)

:Now, what do you have to say or dispute about the excerpt I posted above from ''the-conflict-between-the-west-and-russia-is-a-religious-one''? Don't dodge this one. When we're finished with vetting the information presented in the second half of the first paragraph (which I can't imagine you'd dispute) we can move onto another excerpt earlier in that piece about [[abortion]] and Putin's role in curtailing it from Soviet times, if you care to dispute any of the claims the author makes.
:The author basically says Putinophobia and slanders began in the controlled Western media with his stance against abortion, and only accelerated to where you regurgitate it all as fact today when he banned gay pride parades and [[grooming]]. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 18:25, August 28, 2022 (EDT)
::Even a moron like Jpatt had Putin pegged [https://www.conservapedia.com/index.php?title=Vladimir_Putin&diff=536934&oldid=516242 as a murderous thug all the way back in 2008.] [[User:ConwayIII|ConwayIII]] ([[User talk:ConwayIII|talk]]) 18:34, August 28, 2022 (EDT)
:::Yep, that follows the timeline Eric Sweeney laid. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 18:43, August 28, 2022 (EDT)
:Sweeney excerpted, again:
{{quotebox-float|''"Putin made it clear that he regarded [[Orthodoxy]] as Russia’s national religion and the Church was accorded a favored legal position. And such symbolic gestures were backed by new legislation which began to transform Russian society: the country’s abortion laws, hitherto some of the most [[liberal]] in the world, were tightened. In October 2011, the Russian Parliament passed a law restricting abortion to the first 12 weeks of pregnancy, with an exception up to 22 weeks if the pregnancy was the result of rape. The new law also made mandatory a waiting period of two to seven days before an abortion could be performed, to allow the woman to “reconsider her decision.”

During this period, the portrayal of Russia in the Western media moved from one of condescension to outright hostility. '''As early as 2005, scholars Ira Straus and Edward Lozansky remarked upon a pronounced negative coverage of Russia in the US media''', contrasting negative media sentiment with largely positive sentiment of the American public and US government. As Russia displayed increasing signs of a [[Christian]] revival, so the [[media]] reporting in [[the West]] became increasingly hostile. Only rarely however did [[journalist]]s openly attack Russia for its “Christianization”; normally, columnists, conscious of the fact that large numbers of people in the West continued to describe themselves as Christian, portrayed their anti-Russian commentary as a result of Russia’s “aggression,” “corruption,” or “lack of [[democracy]].” All that however changed with the new abortion law of 2011. Now the attacks against Russia became explicitly ideological. The Russians, we were told, were oppressing women and turning their backs on “[[progressivism|progress]].”}}
::Yep, the period from 2005-2008 fits the timeline with JPatt's comments. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 18:50, August 28, 2022 (EDT)
::So, from 2001 when only 1% of Americans regarded Russia as an enemy, til 2005 "a pronounced negative coverage of Russia in the US media" developed to where commentators openly remarked about it. This was before the NATO Bucharest meeting were all the serious trouble began, but after Putin declared Christianity Russia's national religion. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 18:55, August 28, 2022 (EDT)
:::Yeah, man. Jesus was pretty clear on the whole ''murder thy critics'' thing. I'm reliably informed they're installing a special express elevator to get Putin up to Heaven when he dies. Like, whoosh, and then it's all high-fiving angels and a hearty pat on the back from the big lad Himself. ''"Great murdering, son. Been a real pleasure watching you work..."'' [[User:ConwayIII|ConwayIII]] ([[User talk:ConwayIII|talk]]) 19:25, August 28, 2022 (EDT)
::::Your snarkiness is ill-informed in this matter: Some of the most significant portions of the bible were written by two murderers - Moses and David. And God made it that way for a reason. And their names seem to be remembered, honored, and blessed today. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 20:26, August 28, 2022 (EDT)

:::The Sweeney excerpts are posted in reverse order. Here's more:
{{quotebox-float|''"by the mid-1990s the Russian Orthodox Church, as well as other branches of Christianity, began to experience noticeable growth. It was not however until the first decade of the twenty-first century, and the presidency of Vladimir Putin, that this movement became really significant.

''Putin had occupied a senior position in the Yeltsin administration, and he was no doubt viewed by the [[oligarch]]s, at that time the real rulers of Russia, as a safe pair of hands who could be relied upon to continue the policies which had allowed them to plunder the country for almost a decade. He was appointed Prime Minister on 9th August 1999 and, just four months later, in December, acting President of Russia, following the unexpected resignation of [[Boris Yeltsin]]. A presidential election on 20th March 2000 was easily won by Putin with 53% of the votes. One reason for Putin’s popularity was that he was seen as a strong leader during the Second Chechen War, which commenced on 7th August 1999, just two days before his appointment as Prime Minister. The war ended in April 2000, with [[Chechnya]] again part of the Russian Federation, a victory which enhanced Putin’s reputation as a strongman, willing and able to restore stability and enforce the law.

''Over the next five years, Putin showed that the ruling [[plutocrat]]s were very much deceived had they imagined him to be under their control and part of their team. On the contrary, the new president set about breaking their power. The next decade witenessed a series of legal cases and trials which left some of the oligarchs in prison and others forced to pay substantial compensation. Others, arguably the most [[criminal]], fled the country and their assets were confiscated. The breaking of the oligarchs’ power, together with that of the “Russian mafia” which enforced their corrupt rule, began to restore some form of normality.}}
:So yah, the journalists in the pay of corrupt oligarchs and Western globalists, maybe they were dealt with harshly. No more harshly than Yeltsin's mentor in running a stable democracy, Bill Clinton recommended (See [[Clinton_body_count#Investigators_and_reporters]]<ref>The [[Inslaw]] PROMIS software evolved into the modern [[SWIFT]] network.</ref>). Or [[Andrew Breitbart]], for example. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 19:39, August 28, 2022 (EDT)
::<digression>Incidentally, Zelensky has tried 'doing a Putin' in just the past month - he's whacked two oligarchs. Zelensky imagines himself a great leader now, following his role model, Vladimir Putin. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 19:52, August 28, 2022 (EDT)
::Hey, Conway, what do you think about the hit put out on the journalist [[Darya Dugina]]? I've yet to hear your two cents. Some say it's the biggest murder since [[Archduke Franz Ferdinand]]. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 19:57, August 28, 2022 (EDT)
::The Russians have yet to react. But when they do establish who's responsible, if it goes up to [[Boris Johnson]] and [[Avril Haines]], I wouldn't be surprised. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 20:00, August 28, 2022 (EDT)
::::I often use [[hostile witness|hostile witnesses]] to prove/make a point and the Western legal system has done this for a very long time. Even Christian apologists use hostile witnesses to defend the Christian faith. So citing liberal sources to demonstrate that they even agree with things conservatives have been saying is a legitimate form of rhetoric. Also, you are committing the [[genetic fallacy]]. Just because a source was errant about one matter, does not mean it is in error on all matters. Furthermore, conservatives haven't made big investments in news so your request that I use only American conservative news sources is ridiculous. There are no conservative news organizations with many foreign bureaus overseas - especially post internet where the news is less profitable.

::::As far as the whole I supposedly have Russiaphobia/Putinphobia, that is psychobabble. I live in the USA which is not going to be invaded by Russia during my lifetime and probably never.

::::Lastly, homosexuality is a sin and destructive for both individuals/societies. But just because a person/society is against homosexuality, doesn't mean the person/society gets a "get out of jail free" card for their various misdeeds. You can read [[Atheism and the persecution of homosexuals|HERE]] that Fidel Castro (Cuba), the Soviet Union and the Chinese communists have been against homosexuality. These people were not the salt of the earth and neither is Putin. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 20:17, August 28, 2022 (EDT)

:::::Looks like you're putting the cart before the horse. The sources you've used, ''Bloomberg'', ''Investment Insider'', ''The Economist'', ''AP'', ''et al'' have influenced your thinking. You have not used them to corroborate your own preconceived bias thinking.
:::::I asked you to use American sources? What are you talking about?
:::::Look, if anybody wants to hear anti-Putin hate speech, all they need to do is switch on [[CNN]]. They don't need to come here to have it regurgitated.
:::::If you were serious at all about discussing the life and times of Vladimir Putin, you'd investigate some of the excerpts I posted here above, beginning with portions on homosexuality, abortion, and Chrsitian revival. Wait a minute, I got a bit more right up you ally, on atheism.... 20:39, August 28, 2022 (EDT)
Sweeney again (all excerpts in reverse order from the original text):
{{quotebox-float|''"'''the thirty years that have passed since the fall of the [[Berlin Wall]] and the end of the [[Soviet Union]], has seen a complete reversal of roles; the collective West is now a [[totalitarian]] and aggressively anti-religious power-block that seeks to export its anti-Christian and anti-human ideology''' onto the rest of the world. And '''Russia is loathed by the West’s ruling elite precisely because it has resisted this process''' and moreover has gone in the opposite direction: having once been an active proponent of “scientific materialism” and atheism, '''Russia has reverted to its Orthodox Christian roots''' and has rolled back the more pernicious policies and attitudes of the Soviet era.

''In order to demonstrate the truth of this, we need to look at the history of Russia and its interaction with the West since the early 1990s....

''The euphoria of 1991 soon gave way and the 1990s turned out to be a catastrophic decade for Russia and her people. ...deaths from all causes, including murder, suicide, alcoholism, and drug addiction, rocketed. Russia was a country falling apart, and the population began to plummet....

''During all of this, the attitude of the West, or of those who control the West, was striking. '''Western media, by that time in the hands of a few mega-corporations, was almost gleeful in its reporting of Russia’s trauma.''' In their suffering, the Russian people became the butt of the West’s shadenfreude. And it should be borne in mind that it was precisely in the 1990s that American corporations commenced massive “outsourcing” of their industries to other, and less expensive, locations. Entire factories, together with their machinery and technology, were exported en masse, primarily to China. Almost nothing went to Russia. This in spite of the fact that [[China]] continued to be a [[Communist]] and indeed totalitarian country. Not even the massacre of [[Tiananmen Square]] (1989) and the subsequent brutal repression could halt the American plutocracy’s enthusiasm for exporting work and business. So Russia, which had held out the hand of friendship to the West, and had permitted the subjugated peoples to go free, continued to be treated as an enemy, and was effectively plundered by Western interests, whereas China, which did no such thing, was now treated as a favored trading and business partner. How to explain such an astonishing disparity?

''There seems to be no logical explanation other than to assume an underlying cultural/religious antipathy towards Russia and her people on the part of a very large segment of the West’s ruling plutocracy. I suggest that this is the case, and it is Russia’s [[religion]] that is at the root of it.

''During the Communist era, Christianity was suppressed in Russia and throughout the Soviet block. At its worst, under [[Lenin]] and [[Stalin]], the Communist regime massacred millions of Christians. Victims were mainly Orthodox, but Christians of every denomination suffered. Even after the death of Stalin and into the 1980s religion continued to be persecuted. All children were required to attend lessons in [[atheism]], during which Christianity and religious faith in general was mocked.}}
:So, wipe away your slobbering tears; I'm not beating up on you. Roll up your sleeves and get to work on factual information, and stop trying to defend the indefensible. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 20:56, August 28, 2022 (EDT)
::I read news sources from a variety of sources - including Rt.com. Conservapedia admin TerryH complained one time when I cited Rt.com on main page right. I have cited Rt.com several times at Conservapedia. So your Russiaphobia psychobabble related to me was nonsense. Lastly, Putin is not a religious man. He very occasionally attends church and he is divorced. He also had a child with another woman. As far as the abortion vs. pro-life issue, there are nonreligious/irreligious countries that are trying to boost their fertility through pronatal policies because their ideology contributes to low fertility rates (France has adopted a more pronatal policy and so has China). Because the Soviet Union was atheistic, it affected Russian culture so now Russia is trying to boost its fertility rate to make their country stronger (economically, militarily, etc.). China is doing the same after its foolish one-child policy. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 21:02, August 28, 2022 (EDT)
:::Nobody is saying he's a saint or hero. I'm saying the garbage you post about him is liberal, Western, elitist, [[gay]], socialist crap. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 21:09, August 28, 2022 (EDT)
{{quotebox-float|"By the end of Communism, the Orthodox Church was a small remnant of its former self under the Tsars, but that soon began to change. Hardship birthed a spiritual revival; by the mid-1990s the Russian Orthodox Church, as well as other branches of Christianity, began to experience noticeable growth. It was not however until the first decade of the twenty-first century, and the presidency of Vladimir Putin, that this movement became really significant.}}
[[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 21:09, August 28, 2022 (EDT)
::::It is good that Putin is not anti-religious and since he is a nationalist, it would not make sense for him to be pro-abortion. Even Hitler was for German women having babies. You can't have a big military or a thriving economy with a greying population. As far as how close the church should get to the state, there is always the risk that if the church becomes very closely associated with the state, it gets a black eye when state corruption surfaces. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 21:13, August 28, 2022 (EDT)
:::::Russia was [[desecularized]] in 1991, and hasn't stopped since. It's faith has only gotten stronger. Ukraine, the United States, and China have only become more secularized, more totalitarian, more intolerant, less democratic, and more spiritually maladjusted since 1991. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 21:20, August 28, 2022 (EDT)

:::::You are the expert on desecularization. You do not need to bring Putin into ''any'' discussion. But if you cannot recognize desecularization when it's before your face, people can only wonder.

:::::Re-read what Sweeney said about a reversal of roles between East & West since 1991. And there are plenty, plenty more sources on that same subject since then.

:::::How do you explain the success of the [[homosexual agenda]] in the West since 1991, when nobody ever even heard of it then? [[Dr. Dobson]] laid it all out in 1996, and was laughed at and mocked as a conspiracy theorist. Russia has led the resistance to the gay agenda and atheism ''globally'' since 1991. We in the West, and the U.S., have failed. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 21:28, August 28, 2022 (EDT)
Pew Research:

:"Roughly a quarter of a century after the fall of the Iron Curtain and subsequent collapse of the Soviet Union, a major new Pew Research Center survey finds that religion has reasserted itself as an important part of individual and national identity in many of the Central and Eastern European countries where communist regimes once repressed religious worship and promoted atheism.

:Today, solid majorities of adults across much of the region say they believe in God, and most identify with a religion. Orthodox Christianity and Roman Catholicism are the most prevalent religious affiliations, much as they were more than 100 years ago in the twilight years of the Russian and Austro-Hungarian empires...

:Many people in the region embrace religion as an element of national belonging even though they are not highly observant. Relatively few Orthodox or Catholic adults in Central and Eastern Europe say they regularly attend worship services, pray often or consider religion central to their lives. For example, a median of just 10% of Orthodox Christians across the region say they go to church on a weekly basis."[https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/2017/05/10/religious-belief-and-national-belonging-in-central-and-eastern-europe/]

Unfortunately, the Russian Orthodox religion in Russia is a mile wide, but an inch deep. So the high rate of male alcoholism in Russia and Russia having the [https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/divorce-rates-by-country 3rd highest divorce rate in the world] is a consequence of this.

Jesus did say, "You shall know them by their fruits." Most Russians aren't strongly religious/Christian. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 21:47, August 28, 2022 (EDT)

:[https://youtu.be/sykhG0Q9zTA How Communism seeped into western society] (after 1991 and Russia was desecularized).

:How many fenantyl deaths does the U.S. have? You argument is like the pot calling the kettle black.

:And repeated reference to a low birth rate are meaningless; the only thing that has sustained U.S. population growth since 1972 is [[immigration]]; its natural birth rate (less that of immigrants birth rate) is on a par with Russia & Germany - in a death spiral. So just shut up about this, as if it has any meaning or significance.

:And your statement yesterday about "Aghan nationalism" shows you haven't any idea what "nationalism" is, so you need to study up on that before you insult me anymore with your nonsense about nationalism, national identity, or national belonging. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 21:59, August 28, 2022 (EDT)

::You need to stick with the issue under discussion, and stop with the "look at this shiny thin, alcoholism and birth rates."

::You never responded to my question about Putin killing off the [[gay agenda]] and making [[grooming]] illegal. So, I hope this is the last I'll hear you sounding like Brian Stelter or Rachel Maddow talking about Vladimir Putin. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 22:11, August 28, 2022 (EDT)

:::Fatwa envy ftw. [[User:ConwayIII|ConwayIII]] ([[User talk:ConwayIII|talk]]) 17:47, August 29, 2022 (EDT)

::::[https://youtu.be/hohrGa1DKJI] [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 18:07, August 29, 2022 (EDT)

:::::Poor lad. He did a proper west bank of the Dnieper on himself there, like. [[User:ConwayIII|ConwayIII]] ([[User talk:ConwayIII|talk]]) 18:24, August 29, 2022 (EDT)

===Back to Ukraine===
“Never underestimate how wrong you can be!” - Business coach Dan Peña

It's too bad that Vladimir Putin didn't read that Dan Peña quote before he launched his "special military operation" that has lasted 6 months now. When WION's anchor Palki Sharma said, "Whoever heard of a special operation lasting 6 months?", I chuckled. The Soviets/Russians were comeback kids in WWII. So far Russia is winning, but at a steep price. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 19:26, August 29, 2022 (EDT)
::Russia's holding back; they're waiting for NATO to put its mouth where its money is and step into the fight. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 20:07, August 29, 2022 (EDT)
:::As World War I & World War II teaches, whoever mobilizes last, wins (big lesson from WWI; they used to think whoever mobilized first had the advantage, but powers that mobilize later, like the US in WWI or the US & USSR in WWII, are fresher facing a tired force. This is the whole strategy you see from the idiots in the Pentagon with all their provocations in the Taiwan Strait, [[Kaliningrad]] and terrorist assassinations in Moscow - they are trying to provoke Russia & China into mobilization. NATO's whole "attack against one is an attack against all" is built around the concept of delayed mobilization. The problem is, NATO & the boys in the Pentagon are idiots who don't know they are up against the most powerful, experienced, professional military on the planet that has seen every trick in the book, from Genchis Khan, Attila the Hun, Napolean Bonaparte, and Adolf Hitler, and his whipped them all. The US just got beat by a bunch of goat herders in its latest exploit, and Russia had 20 years to observe closely NATO commanders, strategic doctrine and thinking). [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 20:19, August 29, 2022 (EDT)
::::This is a problem the United States has suffered from in both its strategic warfare and intelligence doctrines since at least WWII - an overreliance on technology & gadgets, and neglect of human intelligence, emotion, and motivations, which are the things that win wars, not machines, or more appropriately, faith in machines. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 20:31, August 29, 2022 (EDT)
::::Americans, for example, think a machine (lie detector) can determine the truth. The U.S. government has believed this since at least the 1950s. You might as well tape a sign to your butt saying "kick me" is how the rest of that planet, or anybody with an ounce of common sense, views this. But the U.S. government just goes right on doing it with blind faith in technology and machines. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 20:36, August 29, 2022 (EDT)
::::So in the absence of doing the hard intelligence work of building relationships and networks, the U.S. thinks it can just bribe anybody. So we go into places like Baghdad or Afghanistan with no Arab or Urdo speakers, and hire local translators for $100 a day, with no loyalties, who are just going to tell you what you want to hear. Same with Chinese, Russian, Persian, or anything else. Well, not everybody is corrupt and can be bribed, as U.S. intelligence assumes. Some have actual, real loyalties to family, tribe, or custom, and just cause they speak English doesn't mean they have any real love or affection for the U.S. or Western culture. But this doesn't bother the geniuses at the CIA or Pentagon. Hence you have incidents like [[Nidal Hasan]] among dozens, if not hundreds of such incidents over the past 20 years. All because the U.S. relies on spy gadgets and machines, and doesn't know how to do the real work of an intelligence service of building relationships with people. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 20:48, August 29, 2022 (EDT)
:::::Fully 1/3 of all U.S. casualties in the Afghan war were killed by "Afghan National Army" soldiers during training. This shows even the CIA & Pentagon do not know what "nationalism" is. Further, it shows how much respect the [[MIC]] has for US soldiers and their families.
:::::I don't know, blame it on the US educational system or media or something, that raised these idiots in the press and national security apparatus, but don't toss around terms like "nationalism" when no one agrees or even understands what it is (I'm not going into a big discussion here about it, or its pros & cons). Let me just say this: it is stupid and naive when school teachers, professors, Pentagon & intelligence people, and media toss around the word "nationalism" to describe things that they do not understand.
:::::Most important - when these so-called "nationalists" in the "National Army" - which we invented - start killing us, not only is that a clue something is seriously wrong, we the citizens have a responsibility to speak up. All of us sound like that idiot, Joe Biden, when he expressed full faith and confidence in the 300,000 strong "Afghan National Army" a week before they got their butt kicked. There never was an Afghan "National Army". There were 300,000 people bribed to sell out everything they understood about the world and were willing to say "yes" to whatever the Americans said - regardless if it was under a Democrat or Republican administration. And the idiots in Washington ''still'' haven't learned a dang thing about life on this planet, evidenced by tossing around phrases like "Ukrainian nationalism" to explain the [[xenophobia]] of a segment of the Ukrainian population.

:::::Ethnic Russians in Ukraine have '''''proven''''' themselves to be more "Ukrainian nationalist" both before and after US interference in 2014. The issue will be decided in less than two weeks when referendums are held.
:::::Some will say, "the referendums are illegitimate". What does that mean? A "Ukrainian nationalist" can force a Russian to be a Ukrainian against their will? Thomas Jeferson was both a Virginian and an American.
:::::We can talk about why Ukrainian nationalists tape Gypsies to trees later. Right now, is that something to be proud of? [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 23:25, August 30, 2022 (EDT)
:::::IOW, when Prof. So-and-so, Jen Psaki, that idiot spokesman at the Pentagon, or CNN say "Afghan nationalists" or "Ukrainian nationalists", they really are saying "Afghan WTF" or "Ukrainian WTF" cause they don't understand or have the words to describe who or what they are talking about. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 23:58, August 30, 2022 (EDT)

:::Stop speculating how long the war will last. What is almost a certainty right now is, when it's over there will be three dismembered parties to the conflict: (1) Ukraine, (2) NATO and (3) the EU. That's why NATO and the EU are desperate to provoke Russian mobilization (with sinking the ''Moskva'', attacking the Kerch Strait bridge, setting wheat fields on fire in Russia, border incidents, terrorist attacks on pipelines near Stalingrad, shelling the nuclear power plant, Kalingrad blockade, NATOizing Finland, sending Polish "peacekeepers" to Lviv, or the assassination of [[Darya Dugina]] in the Russian capital) cause with every tick of the clock their end draws nearer. It's Putin's nickel in the juke box, and Putin calls the tune. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 21:29, August 29, 2022 (EDT)

:Palki's a nice looking girl, but I don't know if I could live with that mouth from someone with an IQ close to body temperature. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 19:18, August 29, 2022 (EDT)

::::[https://youtube.com/watch?v=raFkw4POD44 Putin's jukebox rn.] Thoughts & prayers. [[User:ConwayIII|ConwayIII]] ([[User talk:ConwayIII|talk]]) 18:50, August 30, 2022 (EDT)

:::::[https://www.bitchute.com/video/w8T94gw9aAHF/ Why would you want to mess with Russians? You don't have a clue what you're messing with.] [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 18:55, August 30, 2022 (EDT)

::::::My man, the Russians have spent huge chunks of their history getting their asses handed to them on a plate by the regional power du jour. Charitably, it's some reasonable justification for their weird imperial grandiosity / inferiority complex combination and their perennial sense of victimhood. [[User:ConwayIII|ConwayIII]] ([[User talk:ConwayIII|talk]]) 19:32, August 30, 2022 (EDT)

:::::::America's great military successes are stacking up daily: 30 killed in Baghdad Parliament yesterday, dozens killed in Libya in recent days as, 6 million children starving in Afghanistan as Biden withholds humanitarian aid, and 100,000 people marching in the streets to protest LGBT parades in Serbia. All great victories for democracy and human rights over the paast 25 years, huh? [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 20:09, August 30, 2022 (EDT)

:::::::I understand, democracy is messy, when I see the fighting inside the Iraqi Parliament that thousands of Americans died to make possible. But 30 dead for a country with one tenth the population compared to the US and J6 makes no sense. Nothing like that happened under Saddam. You liberal totalitarians will need a bigger strongman than Joe Biden. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 20:22, August 30, 2022 (EDT)

::::::::If there's a point in there about why anyone should think Russians are an inherently fearsome people, then I'm damned if I can see it, man. If they're reliably weapons-grade on anything, it's the sheer weight of angst & yearning in their classic literature & drama. Some great stuff, tbf, but you've gotta be in the mood. [[User:ConwayIII|ConwayIII]] ([[User talk:ConwayIII|talk]]) 19:49, August 31, 2022 (EDT)
:::::::::Let's go back to school momentarily. The purpose of war is ''supposed'' to be a political object, not just killing people for fun or experiment. There is a danger for a great military power to use its strength to justify its existence, maintain readiness, and be a pain in the butt to its neighbors. These really are not "political objectives," as most rational people understand the concept of a political object. These rationalizations are called "militarism", which in the modern world always has the danger of evolving into fascism.

:::::::::Now, since World War II, the United States is winless in any of its major wars (some may dispute this citing the [[Gulf War]] of 1991 as a "win", however smashing a bug with a sledge hammer while failing to deliver the political object of democracy is disputable. Others may call it a perfect example of militarism and fascism). [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 01:39, September 1, 2022 (EDT)
::::::::::The Gulf War was about oil - not about democracy. There is a common saying about people that also applies to countries. The quote is: "A man always has two reasons for doing anything: a good reason and the real reason." [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 03:48, September 1, 2022 (EDT)
:::::::::::Furthermore, South Korea is free. So the Korean War was not a total failure. But it was a costly war for the USA because 36,914 Americans lost their lives. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 03:57, September 1, 2022 (EDT)
::::::::::::Okay, so we upheld the Kuwaiti regime which violates women's rights and uses slave labor. Good call. In the ROK (Republic of Korea) the United States still functions as an occupation force 70 years later; any nation that depends on another nation for its defense is not sovereign. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 04:18, September 1, 2022 (EDT)
::::::::::::You can call the ROK "free" if you like, but in today's definition that means free to hold LGBT parades and have gay marriage (whether the host country wants gay marriage or not). But it's not sovereign. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 04:22, September 1, 2022 (EDT)
::::::::::::In both these instances, the stated political objective in American domestic propaganda is to insure national sovereignty and freedom; the bigger winners are U.S., Kuwaiti, and Asian [[oligarch]]s while U.S. fails to deliver the political object for use of military force.
::::::::::::If the U.S. truly believes it can kick Russian and/or Chinese butt as people boast about right now, why has it failed to liberate the remaining portions of the northern Korean peninsula for the past 70 years? [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 04:31, September 1, 2022 (EDT)
::::::::::::[[Gay marriage]] is now a democratic right in the American Empire; [[gay parade]]s, like [[abortion]], is a condition for U.S. aid. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 04:43, September 1, 2022 (EDT)
::::::::::::Woodrow Wilson wanted to make the world safe for democracy, but what he really meant was to make the world safe for gay marriage in the [[Liberal World Order]]. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 04:45, September 1, 2022 (EDT)

American business people are practical people who know they are not going to radically change the Quran's teachings about women which says among other things that a Muslim man can have 4 wives and beat disobedient wives (Quran 4:34). Exxon is one of the biggest investors in the UAE and not once has it seriously tried to transform Islamic theology about women because it cares more about profits than Muslim theology. And special interests control Washington. In addition, the American business class does not want war with China. Nor do Americans want a direct war with Russia which is a nuclear power. The present U.S. administration would prefer the present conflict with Russia to be a proxy war. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 04:54, September 1, 2022 (EDT)
:You got it. So rather than justify upholding a non-demoractic regime like Kuwait or Ukraine, for domestic propaganda purposes, Saddam become Hitler or Putin becomes Hitler. They can't explain the global economic issues at work, for example Western oligarchs buying up Ukrainian state-run enterprises for a nickel on the dollar (as they did in Russia in the 1990s) and now even Ukraine's rich agricultural land, Putin becomes Hitler and we're fighting to make the world safe for gay marriage. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 05:18, September 1, 2022 (EDT)
::Democracy is overrated. I prefer living in a constitutional republic. [[Aristotle]] said, "In a democracy the poor will have more power than the rich, because there are more of them, and the will of the majority is supreme." A lot of people in the USA and the West are poor because they spend too much time on entertainment and not enough time on work. And I don't want to pay for someone's bills or retirement because they spent too much time playing video games and watching television. The Bible gives one day of rest. The unions want two days of rest. Given the size of the USA federal debt and the sovereign debt of many Western nations, I think the Bible has more insight about work than many Western governments. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 05:33, September 1, 2022 (EDT)
::::Speaking of Aristotle, [https://youtu.be/u6veOwRo3K0 Alex Christoforou showed us 'Aristotle's school' in Athens this morning]. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 16:01, September 1, 2022 (EDT)
::::@23:04, citing a CNN article from yesterday, Alex explains exactly what the Pentagon means by "parity". ''"We will gladly trade Ukrainian lives for Russian artillery fire and let's see who wins in the end."'' [https://youtu.be/u6veOwRo3K0] [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 16:34, September 1, 2022 (EDT)
:::::In speaking of a political object first articulated by Biden in Poland calling for the overthrow of Putin and regime change in Moscow, [[Lloyd Austin]], days later as reported in ''The Guardian'', "Pentagon chief’s Russia remarks show shift in US’s declared aims in Ukraine,"[https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/apr/25/russia-weakedend-lloyd-austin-ukraine] a shift from victory and regime change in Moscow to a [[Verdun]] strategy of attrition in war they know they cannot win (had the [[Nuremberg]] precendents existed after WWI, several German and French commanders could have been charged with war crimes). [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 16:45, September 1, 2022 (EDT)
:::::[https://youtu.be/uqVPM0KSUpo 2019 RAND Paper Warned US of Failure During Ukraine Conflict]. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 17:25, September 1, 2022 (EDT)

:::A Constitutional republic is a form of democracy.
:::Machievelli says there two forms of government, an inherited fiefdom (a principality or monarchy) and republics. Let's take the transition of the Second German Empire to a republican form of government: For centuries Germany and most of Europe were ruled by an elite, inbred, aristocratic ruling class. With the [[Weimar Republic]], the common man could enter politics and rise to be head of state. The worst elements of the society - the Nazis, did just that. So that's the danger of a Constitutional republic or democracy vs an inherited monarchy. Monarchies and aristocracies aren't without their own insane or corrupt rulers either, but there is risk in transitioning from a monarchy to a democracy, with numerous examples of the most corrupt elements of society being first in line to exploit the change. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 06:13, September 1, 2022 (EDT)

:(ec) The case of [[Paul Manafort]] and [[Oleg Deripaska]] is an interesting case in point; Deripaska, a Russian aluminum magnate, invested $150 million with Manafort to create a cable TV company (Black Sea Cable) in Ukraine. Presumably Manafort had no real specialized knowledge in cable TV, or even spoke Ukrainian. But he did have contacts in the Ukrainian government and industry. So he entrusted the $150 million to them to buy trucks, rent buildings, rent backhoes, erect towers, etc. Needless to say, the $150 million disappeared relatively quickly in the most corrupt regime of Europe. Manafort didn't have the resources to investigate what happened to the money or fight in the Ukrainian judicial system, so Deripaska ends up sueing Manafort in U.S. court to get his money back.
:The corrupt U.S.-backed Maidan regime, which took its orders from the Obama State Dept., handed DNC operative [[Alexandra Chalupa]] a bunch of documents alleging Manafort [[collusion]] with Russia. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 05:40, September 1, 2022 (EDT)
::So Manafort gets sued by a Russian oligarch, but somehow this becomes evidence that Trump's campaign manager is in bed with a Putin stooge. Now does anyone believe FBI investigators and journalists are that stupid to discern facts? If anything, Manafort did at one time collude with a Russian oligarch to improve the lives of the Ukrainian people. Biden should give him the Presidential Medal of Freedom. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 06:13, September 1, 2022 (EDT)

ConwayIII, I will try to keep what you said in mind as the British people shiver this winter while the Russians enjoy their toasty homes and warm borscht. Cheerio!

By the way, the Russians are known for being tough negotiators[https://embahs.skolkovo.ru/en/emba-hs/blog/culture-and-negotiations-the-russian-style/] [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 20:20, August 31, 2022 (EDT)

:Yeah, man. Their most recent round of drone-begging sent a shiver down the spines of the diplomatic corps the world over. Rumour has it they even went as far as ''"pwitty pwitty pweeze"'' and puppy eyes. The Iranians were so terrified they signed the deal just to make sure they got out of there alive. [[User:ConwayIII|ConwayIII]] ([[User talk:ConwayIII|talk]]) 19:22, September 1, 2022 (EDT)
::Yah but the Russians weren't taken in by that. [https://www.bitchute.com/video/zIIZXFD8Uwja/ The Iranians learned a lot from the US MIC, Hollywood, and the Javelin missile program.] [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 19:43, September 1, 2022 (EDT)

:::From the link Cons shared: ''"Western negotiation paradigm is based on sharing information; such disclosure is seen as a prerequisite for establishing an effective cooperative win-win process. In Russia, in contrast, negotiators do not want to volunteer any information. "''
:::So you see, liberal totalitarians in the West, like in the Twitter/Elon Musk negotiations, have adopted what the essay calls "Russian negotiation tactics". For my part, I would hesitate to describe it as "Russian", but rather "Soviet", "Leftist", or "liberal totalitarian". The article title is based upon outmoded Cold War era stereotypes of Russians.
:::The Russians laid all their cards on the table in December 2021 with written treaty proposals with the US & NATO, that the Biden junta and NATO refused to look at - cause they too rely on outmoded stereotypes, and have adopted this Liberal totalitarian negotiating tactic themselves. The war could have been avoided. And we hacen't even mentionsed the deceptiveness of the West with "not one inch further" and NATO expansion. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 20:02, September 1, 2022 (EDT)

===1991 Chicken Kiev speech===
In August 1991, George H.W. Bush delivered his "Chicken Kiev" speech, written by [[Condoleeza Rice]], to the Ukrainian Rada, urging the Rada to remain within the Russian Federation: [https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Chicken_Kiev_speech]
:'''''Freedom is not the same as independence.''' Americans will not support those who seek independence in order to replace a far-off tyranny with a local despotism. They will not aid those who promote a suicidal nationalism based upon ethnic hatred. We will support those who want to build democracy. By democracy, we mean a system of government in which people may vie openly for the hearts -- and yes, the votes -- of the public. We mean a system of government that derives its just power from the consent of the governed, that retains its legitimacy by controlling its appetite for power.''

Bush however, was overtaken by events of his time, and [[Clinton]]ism, [[despotism]], [[corruption]], ethnic [[hatred]], [[poverty]], chaos, and war ultimately won out.

The far-off tyranny of Soviet Moscow was replaced by the local despotism of Kyiv. The "suicidal nationalism" is global now with those who "Stand with Ukraine." Zelensky has outlawed opposition, arrests and assassinates opponents. So much for democracy, just powers, and consent of the governed. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 11:14, August 27, 2022 (EDT)

:Critics of [[Papa Bush]] will say he lied when he said "''Americans will not aid those who promote a suicidal nationalism based upon ethnic hatred"'', because that is EXACTLY what Obama, Biden, and anyone who voted for Trump's first impeachment did. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 11:36, August 27, 2022 (EDT)

:*''a system of government that derives its just power from the consent of the governed''
:Seriously now, do you think the Russians in Donbas are fools, and did not witness what happened when the United States overthrew the democratically elected government of Kyiv in 2014? They knew the United States was behind the coup, when they found themselves on the other end of bayonets held by Americans and American trained mercenaries. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 16:10, August 27, 2022 (EDT)
:*''government that derives its just power from the consent of the governed''
Yes indeed. This is the "Change you can believe in" Obama promised - getting White Europeans killing each other rather than Third Worlders, for a change. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 16:13, August 27, 2022 (EDT)

===The forest from the trees===
Cons: Your much touted "European rightwing populist movement" is a competition between the powers that be, EU & NATO, and Vladimir Putin and Russia. You need to wake up and smell the coffee. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 22:59, September 6, 2022 (EDT)

The EU and NATO wants net zero carbon emissions and LGBT rights in a [[Liberal World Order]]; Putin wants cheap energy, fertilizers, abundant food production, and sovereign rights for nations (NATO forces EU member states to give up their sovereign rights to Washington). [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 23:04, September 6, 2022 (EDT)

== America will still be the leading power for the foreseeable future ==
[[File:Biden's Hellscape.jpg|right|300px|thumb|Biden's hellscape speech where he declared Civil War on American citizens.]]
See: [[Essay: The United States will be the leading power in the world for the foreseeable future|The United States will be the leading power in the world for the foreseeable future]]

Summary: America will probably be the strongest country for the foreseeable future due to the weakness of China and Russia. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 07:17, August 21, 2022 (EDT)

:You forgot this one about America: "Lack of good governance. Lots of corruption and an authoritarian government with oppression and human rights violations of political opposition." [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 10:34, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
::I mentioned the Democrats are a bad political party. And my intuition is that the Democrats are heading for the political wilderness. Latinos and Black men are leaving the Democratic Party. And Joe Biden is going to hurt the Democrat brand even more than he has already done. In addition, Americans like cheap gas and the radical green politics of the Democrats prevents Americans from getting cheap gas.

:::America is a single party state with rigged elections. Democracy does not exist in America. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 10:44, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
::::I added: Corruption and over politicization problem in FBI, CIA, U.S. Justice Department and IRS.

::::America is not a single party state. Democrats and Republicans fight like cats and dogs. Also, the GOP made the election laws more secure plus Trump supporters are not more active as far as being in the election process apparatus. Also, America is not a democracy because it is a constitutional republic. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 10:58, August 21, 2022 (EDT)

:::::The United States has made a huge mistake in driving Russia and China closer together and thinking it can win a war against both. This will affect relations and the peace of the world for the next 30 years. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 11:46, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
China is heading for some very choppy waters. Regardless, putting the carrot in front of Ukraine that it might join NATO was a big mistake. So was the CIA's and/or USA's apparent role in the Orange/Color revolution in Ukraine.[https://foreignpolicy.com/2013/03/18/why-the-color-revolutions-failed/] [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 11:58, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
:If you believe any of that, why is America supporting the fascist [[Kyiv regime]] now and needlessly getting 500 Ukrainian soldiers killed daily? [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 12:00, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
::Because the television cameras are showing the results of the Russian artillery barrages on Ukrainians who many people associate as being a part of Western/European civilization/Christendom. People are very visual. There has been less European outcry about Ukrainian refugees than say Muslim refugees. And because Russia launched a big invasion and many Europeans (particularly European, liberal leaders) and Democrats dislike Putin/Russia even though it supplies a lot of gas/oil to Europe. It's really that simple. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 12:13, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
[[File:Florence Gaub.PNG|right|300px|thumb|NATO propaganda to dehumanize Russians. Russia is considered by many people to not be part of the West.]]
:::Russia is kind of a half-brother to the West. It has absorbed a lot of Western culture and it has the [[Russian Orthodox Church]], but it is considered by many people (including many Russians I am guessing) to not be fully a part of the West. Now Russia is reaching out to the East. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 12:21, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
::::Florence Gaub, deputy director of the European Union Institute for Security Studies (EUISS), which describes itself as “the Union’s agency dealing with the analysis of foreign, security and defence policy issues,” used this racist language to dehumanize Russians on April 12, 2022,
{{quotebox-float|“We should not forget, even if Russians look European, they are not European, in a cultural sense. They [Russians] think differently about violence or death. They have no concept of a [[liberal]], [[post-modern]] life, a concept of life that each individual can choose. Instead, life simply can end early with death."[https://www.memri.org/reports/liberal-post-modern-life]}}
[[File:Furthest Nazi expansion.jpg|left|300px|thumb|Furthest Nazi expansion.[https://www.britannica.com/place/Third-Reich/The-Nazi-empire] Ukraine became a NATO protectorate in 2014; Finland was added in 2022. Why did Finland rejoin the Fascist alliance?]]

::::<s>Yah, especially during Volynia massacre when [[Banderite]]s murdered tens of thousands of their fellow Slavic Poles. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 15:14, August 21, 2022 (EDT)</s> [Ed. Note: I misread the statement. I thought it read "Ukrainians consider themselves half-brothers of the West." RS.]
::::[[Fascism]] is a Western European phenomenon that has twice now in the span of 80 years attempted to destroy Russia and exterminate Russians. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 22:34, August 21, 2022 (EDT)

:::(ec) Before the Russian incursion, the Kyiv regime had murdered over 400 children (User:Conservative has written off Russia because of a low birth rate, but doesn't seem to understand how valuable children are to a society with a low birth rate. They feel the whole nation is being hunted and exterminated). Add to that more than 200 since February. So the number now approaches 700 children in Ukraine's genocidal campaign against Russians. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 15:14, August 21, 2022 (EDT)

==Darya Dugin murdered by CIA-backed Security Services of Ukraine==
[[File:Myrotvorets.PNG|right|1200px|thumb|The Myrotovets ("Peacemaker") website, a kill list authorizing on the spot execution of journalists and anyone deemed a "Russian sympathizer", shows Langley, Virgina home of the CIA as its headquarters.[https://myrotvorets.center]]]
[https://youtu.be/8U2FmE31igU?t=1832 This is Darya Dugin reporting] from inside [[Azovstal]] after the siege. She was just [https://youtu.be/nUpzbWPfcGs assassinated in Moscow a few hours ago.] Her name was on the [[SBU]] "[[Security_Service_of_Ukraine#Myrotvorets |peacemaker]]" hit list. CIA occupies an entire floor in SBU headquarters in downtown Kyiv. The SBU hit list website says it's based in Langley, Virginia (upper right hand corner), home of the CIA. This marks a significant escalation, not so much between the U.S. and Russian government, but between the Russian people and American government. The Russian people will demand action from Putin. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 23:31, August 20, 2022 (EDT)

:Look what other city is listed in the photo: Warsaw. If this doesn't convince conservatives and populists that Poland is not the anti-globalist bulwark it claims to be, then perhaps nothing will.--[[User:Geopolitician|Geopolitician]] ([[User talk:Geopolitician|talk]]) 23:57, August 20, 2022 (EDT)

::While Poland kisses up to NATO to be teachers pet, it is involved in some serious disputes with the EU & Germany. The EU withheld a bunch of covid relief funds, and Poland right now is accusing Germany of wanting to take back Polish territory as US/NATO warmongers want Germany to spend more on defense.

::[[Lavrov]] is absolutely correct: the driving force behind tensions between Russia and NATO is Polish extremists. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 00:15, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
:::While Ukrainian nationalist hate Russians, Russians do not hate Ukrainians. OTOH, there is no love lost, at all, between Russians and Poles. Since Poland joined NATO, Poland has worked overtime to instigate war between Russia and Ukraine. The US has only followed Poland's lead. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 00:18, August 21, 2022 (EDT)

::::Actually, it's the other way around. Poland is following the US' lead, as the current Polish government is a puppet of the American Deep State. Thus, it's debatable whether Poland's ultranationalistic warmongering is actually organic. That being said Russia probably doesn't care who's following whose lead, as it sees a strong independent Poland as a potential national security threat regardless.
::::If we go by Dugin's geostrategy, Russia's long-term plans for Poland include overthrowing the post-1989 regime and installing a puppet loyal to Moscow. However, those plans do ''not'' include Germany or any other country taking away territory from Poland. While Russia certainly prefers a nationalist government in Germany, it only does so because such a government would be inevitably anti-American. It does ''not'' want Germany to fully revert to its pre-1945 expansionist tendencies, and is even willing to give Germany back Kaliningrad as an act of appeasement in exchange for it remaining anti-American.--[[User:Geopolitician|Geopolitician]] ([[User talk:Geopolitician|talk]]) 13:46, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
::::::To further elaborate, Dugin implies in ''Foundations of Geopolitics'' that the ideal model for a new German government would be a [https://www.conservapedia.com/National_Bolshevism#Variant_4:_Niekischism National Bolshevik regime of the Niekischist variant]. In other words a totalitarian regime where the ruling party is a more nationalist, socially conservative, and openly anti-Semitic incarnation of East Germany's Socialist Unity Party, with the official platform being based on Ernst Jünger's ''Der Arbeiter''.--[[User:Geopolitician|Geopolitician]] ([[User talk:Geopolitician|talk]]) 14:21, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
:::::Polish and Baltic [[Russophobe]]s in government have provided the justification and leadership for NATO's continued existence. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 14:14, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
:::::After 1991, the CIA picked up [[climate change]] to justify its continued funding and existence; NATO picked up the Baltics and Poland to justify its continued funding and existence. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 14:16, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
::::::And neither of those justifications are the true reason they refuse to disband. At the end of the day, it's all about preserving the unipolar world order, first and foremost.--[[User:Geopolitician|Geopolitician]] ([[User talk:Geopolitician|talk]]) 14:23, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
:::::::Alexander Dugin really has no relationship to Putin. He's a college professor, that's all. It is Polish Intelligence that has spread the fake news that Dugin is a "Putin advisor" and Dugin's writings are Putin's ''Mein Kampf'', etc., which of coarse has become the CNN line. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 14:26, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
::::::::Putin takes far more influence from Dugin’s geopolitical writings than from his ideological writings. He’d be okay with allying with National Bolsheviks, but he certainly doesn’t identify as one of them.--[[User:Geopolitician|Geopolitician]] ([[User talk:Geopolitician|talk]]) 19:51, August 21, 2022 (EDT)

:'''Breaking:''' [https://medium.com/war-is-boring/moscows-alpha-group-is-one-of-the-world-s-most-vicious-commando-teams-7f59d42793a4 Putin activates Alpha Team.] ''What is Alpha Team? In 1984, U.S.-supported Afghan jihadis kidnapped 3 Russian diplomats. Alpha kidnaped the ringleaders family, chopped up one of the members body into more than a dozen boxes and mailed the packages to where the hostages were being held. The hostages were released the next day. This is how Russia fights terrorism. The CIA & SBU made a big error in murdering Dugina. Aplha Team will make it personal to any CIA operative involved in this murder.'' [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 12:21, August 21, 2022 (EDT)

:So, in the U.S. [[intelligence community]], any American who volunteers or is assigned to be an advisor to the SBU ought to be an unmarried, childless orphan before they take the assignment. The message is clear. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 12:27, August 21, 2022 (EDT)

:That's the advantage of assassination - a U.S. operative working with the SBU can have his family blown up in Langley, Virginia without the U.S. invoking Article 5 of the NATO Charter. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 12:31, August 21, 2022 (EDT)

:And with Biden's open border, Alpha Group can get in easily. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 12:32, August 21, 2022 (EDT)

::The U.S. Congress made a colossal error when it appropriated $54 billion to carry on insurgent terrorist activities even after Ukraine's armed forces were defeated in the field. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 12:42, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
[[File:C9Pak4-W0AIldKy (1).jpg|right|450px|thumb|[[Biden]] [[national security advisor]] and [[Trump-Russia hoax]]er [[Jake Sullivan]] [http://www.defenddemocracy.org/a-conversation-with-jake-sullivan-video/] to Hillary Clinton: "[[Al Qaeda]] is on our side."]]
:'''Update:''' Head of the SBU in Kirovgrad found [[Arkancide]]d at home. [https://www.rt.com/news/561241-ukraine-sbu-kirovograd-zelensky/] That was quick. Looks like they're on the job already. But it doesn't stop there. If I were one of Zelensky's new appointees to regional heads of SBU, I'd be looking over my shoulder everywhere. They probably don't have enough SBU agents to guard the boss in every region and do their job of [https://www.rt.com/shows/news/561107-rtnews-august-19-20msk/ arresting "Russian collaborators" who accept food from Russians and shoot Ukrainian deserters for retreating without orders.] We've entered a new phase of the conflict, and I don't think CIA & NATO personnel, in or outside Ukraine (outside cause of all the recent attacks on Russian territory), will be spared.
:If it wasn't a big enough mistake to give Ukrainian Nazi's $54 billion to carry on this type of warfare, get used to it cause the next phase is nuclear. Since the U.S. employs ISIS terrorists and Ukrainian Nazis, read your history, the Russians are prepared and have defeated both. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 17:17, August 21, 2022 (EDT)

It appears that the target of the attack was Aleksandr Dugin himself, with his daughter (probably) being collateral damage. The SUV which was blown up was owned by Dugin, who survived with only minor injuries due to him deciding to ride in another vehicle at the last moment.[https://www.business-standard.com/article/international/putin-s-close-aide-dugin-could-have-been-the-target-of-explosion-report-122082100232_1.html][https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SrnRba1h_r0]--[[User:Geopolitician|Geopolitician]] ([[User talk:Geopolitician|talk]]) 14:09, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
:Dugin's been hospitalized I guess, in emotional shock. I can't imagine the guilt he feels knowing he was the target. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 14:14, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
:They say it was bomb under the driver side; looking at the flames, to me it looks more like a Javelin missile. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 14:21, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
::One Russian civilian murdered, 5000 plus Ukrainian Civilians murdered. Time for some perspective I think.--[[Special:Contributions/176.251.208.208|176.251.208.208]] 14:32, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
:::Right. 14,000 people killed in the Donbas by the U.S.-backed [[Maidan regime]] from 2014-2021. Yes, we need perspective. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 14:38, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
::::Which of course never happened. The only sources you can provide are Putin's propaganda machine and some nutjob Youtuber. I don't get it, you, a so called conservative backs someone like Putin who kills and jails his political opponents and has demolished free speech. These things are totally against conservative values. How is life today my liberal friend?--[[Special:Contributions/176.251.208.208|176.251.208.208]] 14:45, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
:::::Sorry, I'm citing Wikipedia for my sources. I can't understand people who criticize Putin for running Russia the way the Clinton's ran Arkansas or Biden runs America. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 14:48, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
::::::If Biden ran America the way Putin runs Russia you would be serving a 20 year sentence for sedition. Do you think Russians are allowed to trash Russia online the way you do The US? Of course they are not.--[[Special:Contributions/176.251.208.208|176.251.208.208]] 14:52, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
:::::::PS. Wikipedia is a liberal propaganda site that cannot be trusted. It has been stated as so countless times on Conservapedia and is the main reason this site was set up in the first place.--[[Special:Contributions/176.251.208.208|176.251.208.208]] 14:54, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
::::::::Me? The Biden junta isn't after small fish like myself who aren't already in the [[DC gulag]], yet. They're after Trump, Navarro, Bannon, Flynn, Stone, Manafort, etc.
::::::::As to WP, I checked the sources. It's OSCE, UNHCR, Ukraine govt, Donetsk & Lugansk Republics, etc., overall deemed credible. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 14:57, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
::::::::I will admit the 14,000 figure is somewhat misrepresented by some; it is the figure from both sides, about 9,000 from the Donbas Republics and 5,000 from Ukraine. Civilians from Donbas however are higher, with about 4,000 civilian and 5,000 militia. On the Ukrainian side, its reported as about 4,000 military and 1,000 civilian. But the Kyiv regime started the war - with the intent to kill civilians with tanks before the militias were organized - so all deaths can be laid on the Kyiv regime. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 15:04, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
::::::::: The Ukrainians started the war by invading the Russian south region and attack Rostov on Don and Sochi did they? Total bull. The Russians started the war when they invaded The Ukraine. You talk about Nazis, your rhetoric mirrors the real Nazi's claims that Poland started WW2. It's always so easy to blame the victims, the thing is is that blame is always baseless and never holds water.
::::::::::In one post you state that Putin runs Russian exactly the same way Biden runs America. So that makes it right does it? And why do you love it when it happens in another country but not your own? Having said that in your very next post you say that Biden does not go after small fry when Putin does, how is that exactly the same? Admit it, Putin enabled Trump and Zelensky denied him and no-one denies the Dear Leader, that is what this was all about.--[[Special:Contributions/176.251.208.208|176.251.208.208]] 15:24, August 21, 2022 (EDT)--[[Special:Contributions/176.251.208.208|176.251.208.208]] 15:24, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
::::::::::::If Putin goes after the small fry, that's a testament to how few they are. The fascists running America can't go after the small guy cause there's just too many dissidents. OTOH, adding 87,000 armed IRS psycho-killers is a first step. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 16:50, August 21, 2022 (EDT)

:::::::::::The war actually started in April 2014 when Nazi Kraken forces attacked Kharkiv, but here's video of [https://youtu.be/Ba543Ax9B5A Ukrainian tanks attacking civilians in Mariupol] during the May 9 [[Victory Day]] celebrations over the defeat of fascism. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 15:31, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
:::::::::::You need to follow [https://www.youtube.com/c/GrahamPhillipsUK/videos Graham Phillips], he's been reporting on the war from Donbas since 2014, is fluent in both English and Russian. He calls his Youtube channel "Graham Phillips lite" cause of his recent ban for reporting on civilians murdered by Ukrainian forces trying to evacuate Mariupol, so the real reports on U.S./Ukrainian Crimes Against Humanity are reserved for Rumble. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 15:40, August 21, 2022 (EDT)

===Zelensky's nuclear terrorism===
[[File:Campbell propaganda.PNG|right|500px|thumb|'''Western propaganda and nuclear terrorism.''' Dr. John Campbell, a [[Youtube]]r with 2.4 million followers, deliberately mislocates the location of the Zaporozhye Nuclear Power Plant to his followers showing it outside Russian control.[https://youtu.be/8JKoTpKj9RM?t=96] The red markings show the plant's actual location. Zelensky and Western propagandists claimed the Russians were firing on themselves to create a nuclear hazard. [https://youtu.be/b28sN1tcbg] ]]
:iEarlGrey caught a [https://youtu.be/XVzkWGsTubE?t=2829 great example of Western propaganda that has brainwashed millions] a few hours ago. I caught virtually an [[Russia-Ukraine_war#Zaporozhye_line|identical instance from a Youtuber with 2.4 million followers]] a few days ago. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 16:10, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
::If you study these two examples closely, you will realize this is not sloppy editing and research on a serious subject like the threat of nuclear contamination to a wide section of Europe, but deliberate deception and war propaganda to mislead you and make you believe things that blatantly are not true. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 16:21, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
::In both the CNN & Dr. Campbell example, they would like you to believe that Russia is shelling a nuclear power plant ''outside'' Russia's control (per Zelensky), whereas the simple fact is Zelensky is shelling a nuclear power plant and creating a threat to all of Europe. That is nuclear blackmail of civilians, which these propagandists are willing to go along with. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 16:27, August 21, 2022 (EDT)

:'''Update:''' [https://youtu.be/5oCKbF7Owfc Crisis Day for Ukraine as Russia Advances on Nikolayev in SW Ukraine, Makes Further Advance Donbass]. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 02:25, August 22, 2022 (EDT)

:*[https://youtu.be/mqsXGoxkU0A Ukrainians turn on Zelensky].
:*[https://youtu.be/xvvg9D4oS9k Zelensky goes bonkers]. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 20:45, August 23, 2022 (EDT)

===New phase of the war===
Russian criminal investigators establish SBU responsible for terrorist act in Moscow. [https://ria.ru/20220822/ubiystvo-1811301366.html] This makes the United States a state sponsor of terror. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 14:48, August 22, 2022 (EDT)

===Will the UK continue to stand with Ukraine as they see their energy bills rise?===
This sounds like a challenge to the people of the UK to stand with the xenophobic and [[Russophobic]] West and the terrorist-sponsoring NATO alliance that commits war crimes and arms Nazis in Ukraine. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 15:34, August 22, 2022 (EDT)

:Sugestion: Drop the phrase "Stand with Ukraine" completely. No sense in embarrassing innocent people who got caught up in lies to support Ukrainian Nazism. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 17:05, August 22, 2022 (EDT)
::It wasn't a challenge. It was merely a question. Personally, based on my reading of Exodus, it is human nature to grumble in the wilderness. I have a feeling the "stand with Ukraine" herd is going to thin out and join the grumbling/disgruntled herd. Yes, people will stand against people like Hitler/Stalin/Soviets, but I don't think people think Putin is Hitler/Stalin/Soviet Union. My guess is that once the Democrats face 2024, they will be more likely to pressure Ukraine to accept land loss as a part of a negotiated settlement. But I could be wrong. It all depends on how ideological/committed Biden/NATO are to supporting the Ukrainians. It is hard for me to put myself in their mindset. But the general tendency is that liberals/[[SJW]]s always double down. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 17:48, August 25, 2022 (EDT)
:::Your right about Exodus, and it is human nature. But who were they whose carcasses fell in the wilderness? [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 18:17, August 25, 2022 (EDT)

:::''"pressure Ukraine to accept land loss as a part of a negotiated settlement"''. What you have not seemed to grasp yet is, the entire post-1919 and post-1945 international structure has changed in the past six months, and we '''''will not''''' return to the rules you have been accustomed to your whole life for settling international disputes, short of nuclear war. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 18:22, August 25, 2022 (EDT)

::::Who is going to enforce a "negotiated settlement"? The same parties that negotiated the [[Minsk Accords]], Germany, France, the United Nations, Ukraine and the [[Donetsk Republic]]? Who is going to prevent the United States from interfering in a "negotiated settlement", given the US lies, interference, support for Nazism, and the senseless slaughter of 80,000 Ukrainian pawns? Who is going to stop the US from using [[coup]]s, as it did to bring the [[Maidan regime]] to power and start this crisis? Or assassination, terrorism, illegal weapons transfers, and sabotage as the US and NATO are doing right now, in a "negotiated settlement"? Do you really believe the Russians are that stupid to fall for, what you call, a "negotiated settlement"? Just cause you read about that in Western propaganda media don't mean diddly squat. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 18:31, August 25, 2022 (EDT)

::::::Conservapedia proven right: [https://youtu.be/qgig6C8xvs0 Leonid Slutsky, the Chairman of the Russian Parliament's International Affairs Committee speaks.] [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 18:05, August 27, 2022 (EDT)

:::::The United States, EU, and the whole collective West including Australia, Japan, Canada and others need to [[rollback]] 9,000 sanctions '''first''', as a gesture of ''[[good faith]]'', before Russia will begin to ''think'' about a "negotiated settlement" with [[NATO]]. The Ukraine business will come later. Or at least what is left of a landlocked Ukraine by that time. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 18:36, August 25, 2022 (EDT)

:::::Oh, and we haven't talked about NATO aggressive actions in [[Finland]], either. Or U.S. & EU weapons flow on the blackmarket to Syria, Europe, and the rest of the planet to destabilize peace. Russia hasn't done that since the [[Cold War]] ended (in fact, that's what the Cold War was all about). But now the U.S. is doing it bigtime. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 18:50, August 25, 2022 (EDT)

:::::The Russian do not trust any talk or written agreements with [[the West]]. So that is the West's problem to fix, not Russia's. And short of nuclear war, the West cannot fix this problem of not talking or making written agreements on the battlefield. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 19:05, August 25, 2022 (EDT)

:::::When a relationship is broken due to mistrust, be it a marriage, a friendship, or between nations, it is not the aggrieved party's responsibility to mend. It is the perpetrators problem, to fix, if indeed they sincerely want to mend the breach at all.

:::::For a person, entity, or nation that has committed the breach of faith, and truly wants to restore the relationship, it's usually done through confidence-building measures. However the Russian people now, for good reason, are very leery about any confidence-building measures the West may try. The whole collective West has to now show itself anti-Nazi and repentant. That may seem like a tall demand, but it's not even a demand by the Russians right now. The West must put this demand on ''itself'', if it wants global peace and a "negotiated settlement." [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 19:13, August 25, 2022 (EDT)

:::::Trust me, America's support for Nazism didn't play well in [[Africa]] and much of the rest of the world. And you need to get off that horse quickly, as well. And take a moral stand. I don't care what BS you read, hear, post, and share in Western propaganda media. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 19:21, August 25, 2022 (EDT)

"stand with Ukraine" has thinned out. Propaganda 101: drop using the phrase. You're only rubbing dirt in the face of naive people who committed to it and regret it now. You're only creating resistance to them having second thoughts. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 17:57, August 25, 2022 (EDT)

What you mean to say is phraseology such as, "Will the people of UK allow their government to continue to '''support''' Ukraine....", which is much more effective in making the point. The people do not support suicidal economic programs which the global elite have initiated with Russian sanctions.

You have confused the people of UK with the government of UK. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 18:02, August 25, 2022 (EDT)
[[File:Ukronazi.PNG|right|300px|thumb|Your tax dollars at work: NATO-trained Ukronazi.]]
:Bottomline: If you truly do not favor one side over the other, and ''oppose'' a prolonged war, ''Why do you use pro-warmongering phrases to prolong the war?'' [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 18:12, August 25, 2022 (EDT)
::Bottomline: I am never going to be as pro-Russia as you want me to be. And I don't want to be. Ukraine/Russia both have corrupt/authoritarian leaders. I am not a fan of Zelensky dressed as a transvestite or Ukraine's gay parades. Nor am I fan on how Zelensky treats the political opposition in his country. I am not a fan of Putin's palace and how Putin treats some of the people that criticize him. I am also not a fan of this conflict still being called a special operation. Special operations don't last 6 months! [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 19:34, August 25, 2022 (EDT)

:::Oh, but you don't condemn U.S. support for Nazism, either. Interesting to know. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 19:43, August 25, 2022 (EDT)

::::No one has asked you to support Putin or Zelensky, Russia or Ukraine. But your absence of condemning you own government for its support of Nazism is glaring, as well as your efforts to justify yourself with lame attacks on Putin. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 22:41, August 25, 2022 (EDT)

:::::Ever see ''[https://youtu.be/4KpP4Wx2Ar4?t=18 Taking Sides]''? Great movie. You may find yourself in the same seat as Furtwangler some day. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 23:13, August 25, 2022 (EDT)

:::When you see all the pretty yellow T-shirts on kids 12-years-old and up with Nazi insignia in Ukraine, where do you suppose the Azov Battalion and government of Ukraine got all the money to print them, given Ukraine is the poorest country in Europe? Do you think each individual shelled out $10 to $30 for these pretty Nazi embossed T-shirts? The shirts were probably made in Indonesia or Thailand. WHo do you suppose authorized and made all those arrangements with the $5 billio [[Victoria Nuland]] spent in 2014?

:::And all we're talking about are T-shirts. What about the coffee mugs, posters, pamphlets, books, radio stations and podcasts? Is Nazism what you support to fight corrupt Russian authoritarianism? (Don't look to your usual Western propaganda sources for an answer. You find one.) [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 19:51, August 25, 2022 (EDT)
::::Putin is an ex-KGB agent who is divorced and he has had a daughter with another woman. He only occasionally attends church and isn't particularly religious. And he is very corrupt and has killed/harmed his enemies. You can pretend he is St. Putin, but he is definitely not. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 21:59, August 25, 2022 (EDT)
::::::So what? The savior of humanity in its darkest hour is a [[cocaine]] addict who plays the piano with his wee-wee on national TV. And his sugar daddy is a demented old man who persecutes his political opponents with law enforcement. So there. Tit-for-tat. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 22:30, August 25, 2022 (EDT)
:::::Oh, ok. I get it and understand completely. The United States should have supported fascist Germany rather than Stalin, who was more corrupt and authoritarian than Putin.

:::::Yes, anybody who reads your CIA talking points understands perfectly. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 22:12, August 25, 2022 (EDT)

:::::Heck, if we took your advice, there never would have been a Cold War, Warsaw Pact, or need for NATO. We wouldn't be paying higher gas and electricity prices now cause we could get all the fuel and coal we need out of Germany's [[Lebensraum]]. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 22:16, August 25, 2022 (EDT)

::::::You evidently believe in the [[progressive]] view of [[history]], that somehow the human species is better and smarter than its forebears. That "[[democracy]]" has progressed from the [[homophobic]] and [[segregation]]ist anti-woman forces that [[Normandy Invasion|stormed the beaches of Normandy]] to liberate humanity for gay marriage and transgenderism today. Yes, I understand your logic, reasoning, thought processes, and sources of information very well. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 22:22, August 25, 2022 (EDT)

===SMO v. war===
(a) There is currently no legal justification under U.S. law, i.e. an [[AUMF]], for the U.S. military occupation and war in Syria; (b) the 10-year war in Iraq was not a "war" under U.S. law; (c) the 20-year war in Afghanistan was not a "war" under U.S. law; (d) Russian conscripts cannot be used in Ukraine during a special military operation under Russian law, and they are not being used. Only volunteer or contract soldiers are being used in Ukraine; (d) due to certain provision of the Constitution of the Russian Federation, the special military operation cannot be called a war.

User:Cons: you need to dig up better talking points than the lame ones you get from Western media and Rationalwiki [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 20:19, August 25, 2022 (EDT)

:''Special operations don't last 6 months!''
There is no comparison between US and Russian military doctrine, operations, or objectives. In Iraq and Afghanistan, the United States did not invade countries to liberate their own people and hold territory in perpetuity.

The Russians defeated the German Army in February 1943; yet it still took more than two years to clear German occupied territory, and set up buffer states against a hostile regime that refused to acknowledge its defeat. By the time Ike and the Americans entered the fray, Hitler was face down on the mat in the 14th round of a 15 round fight.

If the Soviets or Russians are to be criticized for anything, it's that they never rooted out Nazism in Ukraine the way they did in East Germany and [[East Prussia]]. That means shooting or hanging war criminals, and re-educating the rest of the population that had been spoon-fed crap by a controlled media since birth. This generation of Russians is determined to finish the job their grandfathers left unfinished. And if that means clearing out the multinational corporate global fascist elite who control Western Europe & North America, and are trying destroy the Russian state and exterminate the Russian people, the Russian people already know conventional arms can't do this. So that means nuclear destruction unless NATO and the West throw in the towel and admit their defeat. The Russian people will never bow the knee to U.S.-Western globalism and hegemony, again. You will have to nuke them first, which is your own suicide.

So go ahead. Just keep talking crap if you think it serves any purpose. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 04:46, August 26, 2022 (EDT)

'''More on Russian tactics:''' The Russians set up a kill zone in a town, and rubblize the town. The Russians do not advance. Meanwhile, in the Ukrainian rear, desertions occur and fighting between Ukrainian units. Then Ukraine sends in reinforcements to re-occupy the town. Wash, rinse, repeat. The Russian objective is demilitatization, i.e. reduce Ukraine combat fighting power. Zelensky keeps throwing troops in senselessly to their death. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 18:50, August 26, 2022 (EDT)
:It should be noted, the Russians have very few "friendly fire" incidents, cause they are not in a hurry, or desperate. In the 1991 Gulf War, more American soldiers were killed by Americans than by the enemy. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 20:19, August 26, 2022 (EDT)

===Significance of Darya Dugina assassination===
There is no question of CIA & MI6 collaboration with SBU in the assassination of Darya Dugina. In the New Cold War, which will continue in the foreseeable future beyond any ceasefire in Ukraine, these terrorist and sabotage acts by the West & Ukraine make civilians, academics, and other non-combatants legitimate targets for killing, not because of any activity on their part, but merely because of their political views.

So, these rules and precedents were established by the U.S. CIA and UK MI6, in the absence of a "negotiated settlement" in the New Cold War. Now a serious student of intelligence matters must learn to distinguish between an action and a reprisal - politically motivated action and a reprisal action, absent Western media open source propaganda and spin. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 18:26, August 26, 2022 (EDT)

== The Trump indictment is coming ==

So says ''[https://washingtonmonthly.com/2022/08/19/trump-will-be-indicted/ The Washington Monthly].'' I hope the next Republican president indicts Garland, Joe Biden, Hunter Biden, Hillary Clinton, Bill Gates, Tony Fauci, Peter Daszak, and the rest of the gang. A million Americans died of covid and so there has been no accountability. [[User:PeterKa|PeterKa]] ([[User talk:PeterKa|talk]]) 02:48, August 21, 2022 (EDT)

:America has a very individualistic country with a patchwork of state laws. It also has a large population of fat, out of shape people with preexisting conditions. And unlike Taiwan, it did not have a great pandemic plan before the pandemic struck. Also, the FDA is slow-moving and offered a mix of bad/good ideas. So America was kind of dead in the water for pandemic preparedness no matter who was president. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 07:25, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
== Russia may go on a big offensive on August 24, 2022 which is Ukraine's Independence Day ==

*[https://www.businessinsider.com/zelenskyy-vicious-russian-attack-ukraine-independence-day-2022-8 Reports of Russia amassing missiles in Belarus as Zelenskyy warns of 'vicious' attack ahead of Ukraine Independence Day]

*[https://youtu.be/7qV0fyixh58?t=993 India's WION news network on Russia potentially going on a big offensive on August 24, 2022].

Ukraine may be facing a 3 front war.

Ukraine attacked Crimea. "Newton's law of politics" may happen as a result. For every political action, there is an opposite reaction. Russia will probably seek retribution. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 17:58, August 21, 2022 (EDT)

:Old news. It started a week ago. WION is not a good source. [https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCUnc496-PPmFZVKlYxUnToA/videos Military Summary] remains the best. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 20:43, August 21, 2022 (EDT)

::In recent days, because of the threat the United States is to Russia with HIMARs, the Kremlin has made the political decision to cut off the Ukrainian rump state from sea access and to take Odessa. The city of Nikoleav has to be taken first, and movement toward that city is underway (after the failure of the much vaunted Ukrainian "Kherson counteroffensive" slated for August since last May). Movement to encircle and liberate Ukraine's second largest city, Kharkiv, an ethnic Russian city under Ukrainian neo-Nazi Kraken group occupation, is underway. The siege of Kharkiv may last all winter if the Zelensky regime survives that long. The 8-year stalemate at Avdiivka has been broken, and AFU soldiers captured in that sector may face prosecution for war crimes against the civilians of Donetsk. There is a breakout on the Izyium front. Bakhmut & Soledar are under siege, meaning the Russian cities of Siversk, Slovyansk, and Kramatorsk will soon be liberated. When that happens, there is nothing standing between Russian and Allied forces and the Dneiper River (how much territory Russian and Allied forces capture between the cities of Dniepropetrovsk and Kyiv is up to the idiots running the United States & European Union, and how long they want to senselessly and shamelessly keep funding and arming Ukrainians to die for no reason at all remains to be seen). [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 21:10, August 21, 2022 (EDT)

:As to the Belarussian front: troops are assembled there as a countermove to the presence of NATO forces (82nd Airborne & Polish forces) on the Polish side of the border. Some think the NATO cavalry will still ride to the rescue to save the ethnic Russian city of Odessa from being liberated by Russia. That's another WWIII scenario, but I don't think Biden, Austin, and Sullivan have the cahoonies for it, despite how hard Polish Russophobes and fascists in the Polish government push for it. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 21:36, August 21, 2022 (EDT)

:'''Analogy:''' When Stalingrad fell in 1943, the only thing standing between Stalingrad and Berlin was Warsaw. Both cities were razed to the ground. When Kramatorsk and Karkhov (Russian cities occupied by Ukronazis) fall, the only thing standing between Kramatorsk and Kyiv is the Ukronazi-occupied Russian city of Dnepropetrovsk. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 22:25, August 21, 2022 (EDT)

:'''Update:''' According to a Belarusian source, the Russian reprisal action for the U.S.-backed Moscow terrorist attack, and the U.S.-backed Ukrainian attempt to kill the President of the [[Donetsk Republic]] with [[HIMARS]], is slated for August 25, the day after Ukrainian Independence Day. It's rumored to be an attack on [[Kyiv]]. The Russian Duma evidently has to be consulted and advised. The Polish President Duda evidently is in Kyiv on the 24th, which may be one cause for the delay.
:Anyways, it's mere speculation right now, but these are rumors circulating in Kyiv, in Russia and Belarus right now.
:U.S.-backed Ukrainian security services carrying out a terrorist bombing in a nation's capital was a serious provocation and mistake (frankly, it reeks of desperation cause NATO/US/Kyiv cannot defeat Russia on the ground). If the Russian reprisal is not carried out tomorrow, that only delays the day where and when it will be carried out. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 18:30, August 24, 2022 (EDT)

'''August 27 Update: Looks like your propaganda sources were full of BS, again.

Here's an interesting challenge: Find one source you've cited in the past six months that has been right on anything. Note: Any source that has ever said Ukraine is winning and Russia is losing is automatically eliminated. Ukraine has yet to conduct a single sustained counteroffensive anywhere across Ukraine in six months, or win any major battle. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 03:51, August 27, 2022 (EDT)

== The Biden Administration botched its Ukraine policy and continues to botch it ==

The Biden Administration's botched pullout of Afghanistan gave a signal to Russia that the Biden Administration was weak and now was an opportune time to attack Ukraine. It's green energy public policy, which made the USA less energy independent, didn't help either.

Biden official admits US refused to address Ukraine and NATO before Russian invasion.[https://responsiblestatecraft.org/2022/04/14/biden-official-admits-us-refused-to-address-ukraine-and-nato-before-russian-invasion/] Prior to the war, many analysts said it would be reasonable to deny or delay Kyiv’s ascension into NATO to stave off conflict.[https://responsiblestatecraft.org/2022/04/14/biden-official-admits-us-refused-to-address-ukraine-and-nato-before-russian-invasion/]

Even the USA's ally Germany has its mainstream press admitting that the USA/NATO is not supplying enough military support to Ukraine to push the Russians out (tanks, etc.): [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TzAEIuDJvhU As the Ukraine war grinds on: Can either side break the stalemate? | To The Point], DW News.

My guess is that the Biden Administration does not want to send us a huge amount of arms to Ukraine, which would be very unpopular among Americans, before the 2022 midterm elections. And that the Biden Administration fears Putin launching tactical nukes in response which is a real possibility.

But there may be a large social unrest in Europe if the war is not ended before winter due to fuel shortages in Europe. This could greatly undercut European support for the war in Ukraine. It could also cause right-wing politics to rise in Europe as a whole. Right-wing politics rising in Europe gave Donald Trump some wind in his back during his 2016 election.

Zelensky and other Ukrainian hardliners do not want to stop the war until the Russians are pushed out of Ukraine. But even if they did, if the Russians were urged to stop the war by the Biden Administration, Russia may not want to stop the war right now in order to get more concessions.

Given the Biden Adminstration's botched pullout of Afghanistan, it is hard to believe that the Biden Administration is playing a sophisticated game of military/political 3D chess as far as its policy concerning Ukraine. [[Occam's razor|Occam's razor]] and Hanlon's razor (The adage or rule of thumb that states "never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity.") would seem to indicate the best explanation is that the Biden Administration is foolish. It seems like the Biden Administration got themselves into a war that will become unpopular by the 2024 election. The USA sending military aid to Ukraine during an economic recession/stagflation is probably not going to be politically popular - especially if European support for the war craters. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 22:39, August 21, 2022 (EDT)

:Bzzzt. Wrong. The Biden regime pulled out of Afghanistan precisely so it could focus on its aggression against Russia in Ukraine. This should have been obvious since Trump's first impeachment trial for downgrading and ''not'' focusing on the plans for war with Russia. "We fight them there so we don't have to fight them here" - Lead impeachment manager [[Adam Schiff]], recipient of donations from Ukrainian oligarch and arms trader Victor Pinchuk. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 23:05, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
:Incidentally, the United States purchased 17 helicopters from Russia in the closing days of the Afghan war with funds designated for the Afghan military which it then transferred to Ukraine [https://youtu.be/WOEXvkbOYCs] (Afghan pilots were trained on U.S. equipment, whereas Ukrainians on Russian). If that's not evidence of premeditation and fraud, I don't know what is. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 23:11, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
::As to Germany, iEarlGrey, who monitors European press, reports the Germans are being told gas and heating price increases are imaginary and Putin propaganda. I'm still waiting for a link, but I have no reason to doubt it. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 23:16, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
:::Here's the link. [https://rumble.com/v1gke7u-us-intervention-in-ukraine.-gas-shortages-and-price-rise-claims-are-russian.html]

::Lemee 'splain how this works. The US and Russia are major competitors in the arms trafficing industry (Russian products generally are about 70% the cost and deemed more reliable in the field). In 1979, as a result of the [[Camp David Accords]], Egypt became a U.S. client state and was re-equipped with U.S. arms. The U.S. took possession of all its Soviet made equipment (which it had acquired since the 1956 [[Suez Crisis]]) and shipped it off to Afghanistan. When the Mujahadeen captured Soviet trucks, tanks, Ak-47's etc, it learned how to operate Soviet equipment, and had spare parts and ammunition. Not until the Russians abandoned Afghanistan in 1989 did the Mujahadeen (rebranded Taliban) get its hands on few abandoned helicopters. So it had a few pilots in the 1990s. From 2001-2021, all the remaining Soviet equipment was destroyed and replaced with U.S. equipment. The Afghan National Army was trained to fly U.S. helicopters - there were no Afghan National Army pilots ever trained on Russian equipment, and Taliban had no pilots or Russian helicopters left by 2021.
::Now, the same thing is occurring in Europe. Poland, Czechia, Slovakia, Romania, the Baltic states, disposed of their outdated Russian equipment (MiGs, T-72s, etc) and are to be resupplied with modern NATO (U.S. German, UK & French) equipment. That is all that this war is about. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 23:43, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
::So when the Pentagon purchased helicopters from Russia for Afghanistan, some DOD Inspector General should have raised an eyelid, but didn't cause the U.S. funneling Russian equipment to Afghanistan was nothing new. OTOH, the Russian [[GRU]] is not stupid, and knew immediately what the Pentagon had in mind when it purchased the equipment. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 23:48, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
:::This is typical of the historic idiocy of U.S. intelligence - it makes no effort to conceal its plans from its intended targets or enemies, but deceives the American people with BS, not to mention the corruption and incompetence in the Pentagon and Deep State. Cockiness and stupidity is the only way to describe it. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 23:52, August 21, 2022 (EDT)
::::The root of the problem is that Ukraine should have adopted a policy of nonalignment like India does. Instead, it indicated it wanted to join NATO. That sealed its fate to be invaded by Russia. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 00:06, August 22, 2022 (EDT)

::::The root of the problem is the United States should not have deceived Ukraine. The US should not have overthrown Ukrainian democracy.

::(ec) Now, as to the sources and narratives you cite: this is the pivot away from Zelensky worship to Zelensky the fall guy, which has been underway in Western propaganda media for the past 6-8 weeks (it even peppers in bs like, "the Biden Administration fears Putin launching tactical nukes in response which is a real possibility," etc.)

::But the real story is, Zelensky's responsible for the loss of a war that NATO knew from the beginning Ukraine could not win. The whole planet has to be re-propagandized now, which seems to be working on you. Only now are the Ukrainian people beginning to realize that they have been lied to and deceived by Zelensky. Everyday, new stories are coming out in Ukrainian media how Zelensky had details of the attack, and lied to the Ukrainian people that it wouldn't happen, costing innocent people's lives. Yesterday the story was Zelensky withheld key intelligence from the military. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 00:12, August 22, 2022 (EDT)

::There are even reports that some Ukrainian troops at the front are still waiting for the NATO cavalry to rescue them as they were assured, which doesn't seem likely now.

::Zelensky confessed on national television that he didn't warn of the impending attack cause Ukraine would have been defeated in 3 days, which most people took as an insult. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 00:20, August 22, 2022 (EDT)
:::If a car buyer buys a lemon, ultimately he has to take responsibility. It doesn't matter that some Americans told Ukraine that they might be able to join NATO down the pike. The root of the problem is that Ukraine should have adopted a policy of nonalignment like India does.

:::U.S. Retired Lieutenant Colonel Alexander Vindman who was the Director for European Affairs for the United States National Security Council (NSC) until he was reassigned on February 7, 2020 (who also was born in the Ukrainian Soviet Socialist Republic): “If Russia Wins, The U.S. Is In Enormous Peril”.[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OrgnY-5Hpso] Is Russia planning on invading Alaska, fighting their way through Canada and overwhelming the USA military on the US/Canada border? Madness! [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 00:24, August 22, 2022 (EDT)
:::::Go back to the quote by the other CIA disinformation specialist: '''''"it's not a regional war between Ukraine and Russia. This is more of a Russian attempt to challenge the status quo and the status quo of America in the world."''''' [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 01:48, August 22, 2022 (EDT)
::::The root of the problem is the United States should not have overthrown the legitimate democratically elected government for the purposes of deceiving the illegitimate regime with a promise to join NATO so NATO could conduct a war against Russia.

::::The argument that the illegitimate regime should have remained neutral fails on its face.

::::[[Vindman]] was [[Eric Ciaramella]]'s source in the Trump impeachment fraud. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 00:32, August 22, 2022 (EDT)
:::::When Adam bit into the forbidden fruit, God didn't buy Adam's excuse that it was Eve's fault. And God didn't buy Eve's excuse that it was the serpent's fault.

:::::Ukraine elects adults to public office - not children. Zelensky is an adult. At the end of the day, Ukraine bears the responsibility for not adopting a policy of nonalignment like India does. [[User:Conservative|Conservative]] ([[User talk:Conservative|talk]]) 00:40, August 22, 2022 (EDT)

::::::At the end of the day, the [[Maidan regime]] is an illegitimate regime and Russia is perfectly within its [[Monroe Doctrine]] ([[Near abroad]]) rights to remove a hostile regime installed by another hostile regime. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 01:29, August 22, 2022 (EDT)

::::::The US overthrew the legitimate government of Ukraine because it wanted Crimea and Sevastopol for a NATO base; Putin applied the same solution Ronald Reagan did when the Soviets attempted to build a base in [[Grenada]]. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 01:38, August 22, 2022 (EDT)

:::::::When the Soviets attempted to establish a base in Grenada, Reagan said, "The hell you are. We can get there first." When the US attempted to establish a base in Crimea by overthrowing the legitimate government of Ukraine, Putin said, "The hell you are. We can get there first."

:::::::Needless to say, this threw a monkey wrench into NATO's plans. Hence, with the idea of Sevastopol as a NATO naval base out, the plan had to switch to an airbase in Donetsk. When that failed, it switched to an airbase in Luhansk. When that failed, it switched to an airbase in Kramatorsk, yet all along the primary aim has remained to provoke a war with Russia to gain a NATO Naval base at Sevastopol. Too late, cause Crimea is now sovereign Russian territory.
:::::::And the idiots who brought in the HIMARs now will lose the Odessa naval base, as well. [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 02:10, August 22, 2022 (EDT)

::::::For the argument regarding the United States overthrowing the democratically elected government of Ukraine and the Russian people's reaction to it after being lectured for decades by the US, NATO, and the West about "democracy", review [https://youtu.be/8X7Ng75e5gQ Vladimir Posner's Yale lecture.] [[User:RobSmith|RobS]][[User talk:RobSmith|Ich bin ein breakfast taco]] 03:18, August 22, 2022 (EDT)

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