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Talk:John 8-14 (Translated) (view source)
Revision as of 02:36, December 25, 2022
, 02:36, December 25, 2022→What does the term "the Jews" specifically refer to? Presumably the Pharisees and scribes?
Out of the books in the New Testament, the Gospel of John is probably most controversial due to its vague denunciations of "the Jews," which has been horrifically abused by apostates to perpetrate and justify mass antisemitic atrocities throughout history (which runs contrary to the entire New Testament's message, evident in Paul's conversion and apostleship, of peacefully converting rather than persecuting). According to [https://jewsforjesus.org/answers/is-the-new-testament-jewish Jews for Jesus], it's a reference to the Jewish leadership coalition rather than the general populace which apparently mostly adored and followed Christ, and therefore the usage of the "Jews" likely refers to Pharisees and scribes. However, more sound evidence may need to be gathered before the corresponding verses in the CBP are changed. I think it's nonetheless important to make it clear that "the Jews" do '''not''' mean the Jewish people ''en masse''. —[[User:LT|<code><span style="background:#FF8181">'''LT'''</span></code>]] '''''[[User talk:LT|<sup>(Exodus 23:2)</sup>]]''''' Sunday, 21:12, December 24, 2022 (EST)
Out of the books in the New Testament, the Gospel of John is probably most controversial due to its vague denunciations of "the Jews," which has been horrifically abused by apostates to perpetrate and justify mass antisemitic atrocities throughout history (which runs contrary to the entire New Testament's message, evident in Paul's conversion and apostleship, of peacefully converting rather than persecuting). According to [https://jewsforjesus.org/answers/is-the-new-testament-jewish Jews for Jesus], it's a reference to the Jewish leadership coalition rather than the general populace which apparently mostly adored and followed Christ, and therefore the usage of the "Jews" likely refers to Pharisees and scribes. However, more sound evidence may need to be gathered before the corresponding verses in the CBP are changed. I think it's nonetheless important to make it clear that "the Jews" do '''not''' mean the Jewish people ''en masse''. —[[User:LT|<code><span style="background:#FF8181">'''LT'''</span></code>]] '''''[[User talk:LT|<sup>(Exodus 23:2)</sup>]]''''' Sunday, 21:12, December 24, 2022 (EST)
:You make another excellent point, LT. The [[Gospel of John]], if written afresh today, could be considered anti-Semitic by some. Perhaps some of its harsh language might be due to how it is translated. I'll look at the Greek and welcome further suggestions about this.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] ([[User talk:Aschlafly|talk]]) 21:24, December 24, 2022 (EST)
:You make another excellent point, LT. The [[Gospel of John]], if written afresh today, could be considered anti-Semitic by some. Perhaps some of its harsh language might be due to how it is translated. I'll look at the Greek and welcome further suggestions about this.--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] ([[User talk:Aschlafly|talk]]) 21:24, December 24, 2022 (EST)
::I think the context regarding who Jesus was referring to was magnitudes more obvious back in His day, since not all Jews supported him (many still did, and comprised much of the earliest church, from my understanding), and therefore it might've been simpler to just write "the Jews" instead of fully elaborating "the Pharisees, scribes, Sadducees, etc. who denied Jesus." In the generation that experienced the heavenly exhortations of Christ, obviously they would've been aware of the fact that not all Jews rejected Him. After all, the apostate antisemitism that occurred in later generations was by the point when the early church became comprised increasingly of Gentiles who ignored Jesus and the Apostles' message of compassion, and having chosen to harden their hearts in not associating with Jewish Christians and/or knowing them well enough, failed to understand the true meaning of the Gospel of John's references to "the Jews." —[[User:LT|<code><span style="background:#FF8181">'''LT'''</span></code>]] '''''[[User talk:LT|<sup>(Exodus 23:2)</sup>]]''''' Sunday, 21:36, December 24, 2022 (EST)