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→You Just Gotta Be Kidding Me
:::::: Three major problems with his theory are apparent. First things first - the amount of heat that would have been released from such rapid subduction would have basically boiled the oceans of the world. Secondly - citing mantle tectonics on Venus and comparing it to Earth is like comparing apples and oranges. The Earth has very active plate tectonics, with subduction being helped - or perhaps lubricated would be a better word - by water. Venus has no water and no plate tectonics, something which leads to heat building up in the mantle that can only be released by catastrophic mantle upwellings that seem to resurface the face of the planet periodically. Thirdly, and most fatally for Baumgardner, there's the little issue of the seamounts and islands that form volcanic island chains like Hawaii. Rapid subduction should have led to huge gaps in the chain. The problem is that there aren't any. You can trace the chain from Hawaii to Midway. I think that it goes northwards along the Emperor Seamount chain from there. I'm sorry, but I do not find Baumgardner at all plausible. Thank you for the link though. [[User:Darkmind1970|Darkmind1970]] 09:06, 15 January 2008 (EST)
:::::: Three major problems with his theory are apparent. First things first - the amount of heat that would have been released from such rapid subduction would have basically boiled the oceans of the world. Secondly - citing mantle tectonics on Venus and comparing it to Earth is like comparing apples and oranges. The Earth has very active plate tectonics, with subduction being helped - or perhaps lubricated would be a better word - by water. Venus has no water and no plate tectonics, something which leads to heat building up in the mantle that can only be released by catastrophic mantle upwellings that seem to resurface the face of the planet periodically. Thirdly, and most fatally for Baumgardner, there's the little issue of the seamounts and islands that form volcanic island chains like Hawaii. Rapid subduction should have led to huge gaps in the chain. The problem is that there aren't any. You can trace the chain from Hawaii to Midway. I think that it goes northwards along the Emperor Seamount chain from there. I'm sorry, but I do not find Baumgardner at all plausible. Thank you for the link though. [[User:Darkmind1970|Darkmind1970]] 09:06, 15 January 2008 (EST)
::::::: Baumgardner himself admits that not all the problems with his model have been solved. But the same is true of evolutionary/uniformitarian/materialistic/naturalistic scenarios. They have unsolved problems also. The point is that we have a respected scientist who has a model of tectonic plate movement that works ''best'' (albeit not without problems) as a rapid process (i.e. within the year of the flood). So your comment that prompted this line of discussion ("Rapid plate tectonics? Blaming the reversals of the Earth's magnetic field on the flood? This is scientifically stretching the facts until they fit an argument. ") was nothing more than your bigotry showing. Neither side has all the answers, but that doesn't mean that creationists are abusing science. They simply have a different theory about what happened, and there's absolutely nothing wrong with that, and it doesn't deserve derision. [[User:Philip J. Rayment|Philip J. Rayment]] 09:23, 15 January 2008 (EST)
::::::: Baumgardner himself admits that not all the problems with his model have been solved. But the same is true of evolutionary/uniformitarian/materialistic/naturalistic scenarios. They have unsolved problems also. The point is that we have a respected scientist who has a model of tectonic plate movement that works ''best'' (albeit not without problems) as a rapid process (i.e. within the year of the flood). So your comment that prompted this line of discussion ("Rapid plate tectonics? Blaming the reversals of the Earth's magnetic field on the flood? This is scientifically stretching the facts until they fit an argument. ") was nothing more than your bigotry showing. Neither side has all the answers, but that doesn't mean that creationists are abusing science. They simply have a different theory about what happened, and there's absolutely nothing wrong with that, and it doesn't deserve derision. [[User:Philip J. Rayment|Philip J. Rayment]] 09:23, 15 January 2008 (EST)
:::::::: Yes, but no-one else has supported his work, and Baumgardner's theory suffers from the problems that I outlined above - and I'm just an amateur geologist. For his theory to be right, everything that we know about sciences like geology, vulcanology, plate tectonics, hydrogeology, palaeontology and so on, have to be massively wrong. Now, science isn't perfect and it does admit its mistakes - but Baumgardners theory is massively at variance with mainstream thought. For his theory to be right, there must be some links, some proof, to connect it with the mainstream, as that's the way that evidence works. But there aren't, as far as I can see. The point I mentioned about the sea mounts and island chains is a killer for his theory - it just cannot explain it. For that amount of subduction to have taken place, then the amount of vulcanism must have also increased, as the old sea floor melts in the mantle, but it hasn't. Come to that, the sea floor must all be the same age - but it's not. I'm sorry that you see my disbelief as derision, but I just don't think that this works as a concept. Plus I must stop writing comments when I'm tired and cranky. [[User:Darkmind1970|Darkmind1970]] 11:55, 15 January 2008 (EST)