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Talk:Geocentric theory (view source)
Revision as of 17:45, November 3, 2008
, 17:45, November 3, 2008→Jupiter moons
Your reversion of SamD's edits didn't improve the text:
Your reversion of SamD's edits didn't improve the text:
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<li> Ptolemy build his theories on the groundwork of Plato and Aristotle. That's why he put the earth in the center.<li>''The geocentric theory is a system for describing the universe with Earth-centered coordinates.'': That doesn't mean very much. Earth-centered coordinates are used all the time. This is something different from saying that the earth lies in the center of the universe, or - to use the original platonic/Aristotelian/Ptolemaic idea that ''the earth is the center of the mot<ref>http://galileo.rice.edu/sci/observations/jupiter_satellites.html</ref>ions of the universe''.
<li> Ptolemy build his theories on the groundwork of Plato and Aristotle. That's why he put the earth in the center.
<li>''The geocentric theory is a system for describing the universe with Earth-centered coordinates.'': That doesn't mean very much. Earth-centered coordinates are used all the time. This is something different from saying that the earth lies in the center of the universe, or - to use the original platonic/Aristotelian/Ptolemaic idea that ''the earth is the center of the mot<ref>http://galileo.rice.edu/sci/observations/jupiter_satellites.html</ref>ions of the universe''.
<li>A very minor point is that the adherents of the historic geocentric world view didn't know the concept of coordinates at all.
<li>A very minor point is that the adherents of the historic geocentric world view didn't know the concept of coordinates at all.
<li>The idea that the universe has just one center of motions, i.e., earth, was a main idea of the geocentric world view. It's a beautiful, simple, striking thought, a thought which seemed to suit the One God of the monotheistic religion, but it was utterly wrong. And that it was wrong was shown by Galileo, who found ''another'' center of motion.
<li>The idea that the universe has just one center of motions, i.e., earth, was a main idea of the geocentric world view. It's a beautiful, simple, striking thought, a thought which seemed to suit the One God of the monotheistic religion, but it was utterly wrong. And that it was wrong was shown by Galileo, who found ''another'' center of motion.
: BRichigen, I question all 4 of your points. Can you cite any sources? Where does Ptolemy explain why he put the earth in the center? In the Almagest or elsewhere? Where does Ptolemy make the distinction in point 2? Why do you say that they didn't know the concept of coordinates? Do you mean that Ptolemy didn't understand coordinates? I don't see why an earth-centered view is more suitable to monotheism than an sun-centered view. Do you have any evidence that ancient astronomers had such an opinion? [[User:RSchlafly|RSchlafly]] 10:23, 3 November 2008 (EST)
: BRichigen, I question all 4 of your points. Can you cite any sources? Where does Ptolemy explain why he put the earth in the center? In the Almagest or elsewhere? Where does Ptolemy make the distinction in point 2? Why do you say that they didn't know the concept of coordinates? Do you mean that Ptolemy didn't understand coordinates? I don't see why an earth-centered view is more suitable to monotheism than an sun-centered view. Do you have any evidence that ancient astronomers had such an opinion? [[User:RSchlafly|RSchlafly]] 10:23, 3 November 2008 (EST)
:#Ptolemy hadn't to explain why he put an unmovable earth in the center - he followed the tradition of Plato and Aristotle. Putting the earth '''not''' into the center needed explanation. If you read Ptolemy's introduction to the '''Tetrabiblos''', you'll find that he doesn't remark at this point at all, it was just the natural thing to do.
:#A coordinate system can be attached to a moving point. The idea of an ''unmovable earth'' as a center of the universe is much more stronger. That should be obvious.
:#The term ''coordinates'' was introduced by Leibniz, following the ideas of Descartes. Ptolemy was an excellent mathematician, and we'd say that he described his universe with somewhat like spherical coordinates. So, using the word ''concept'' was to accurate, but that's just me, struggling with the English language.
:#Yours is a modern view - untainted by numerology and astrology. Half of Ptolemy's text consider astrological, not astronomical aspects. And it's not about which object is the center, but about how many centers there are. If there are two centers, why not three, four, infinite - and the same is true for two Gods :-) --[[User:BRichtigen|BRichtigen]] 12:45, 3 November 2008 (EST)