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→‎Luke 11:43: reply re: οὐαὶ ὑμῖν
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Pretty minor point. I respectfully disagree with the choice of "reckoning to you" for οὐαὶ ὑμῖν.  ''Ouai'' is an extremely common interjection in Greek usually translated as "woe"  or "alas" along with its object. In this case the object is the plural dative pronoun of su, which means "you all." The combination of ''ouai su'' is so commonly used in the Bible that it's idiomatic. The idiom corresponds to those we're famliar with in English: "woe to you," "woe unto you," or "alas for you." So this is an example of where I think the KJV correctly translates the idiom and is perhaps the reason it is familiar to us as English speakers so many hundreds of years later. My only point here is that since I've never heard someone say "reckoning to you" and to the extent a familiar English idiom directly corresponds to the meaning of a Greek idiom I don't think it should not be discarded. Idioms like this have the ability to powerfully and effectively convey their meaning. I also think "reckoning is textually incorrect because the Gospel writers had word for "reckoning"  or "judgment," depending on the context you intended. [[User:Cambrian|Cambrian]] 13:53, 16 January 2010 (EST)
 
Pretty minor point. I respectfully disagree with the choice of "reckoning to you" for οὐαὶ ὑμῖν.  ''Ouai'' is an extremely common interjection in Greek usually translated as "woe"  or "alas" along with its object. In this case the object is the plural dative pronoun of su, which means "you all." The combination of ''ouai su'' is so commonly used in the Bible that it's idiomatic. The idiom corresponds to those we're famliar with in English: "woe to you," "woe unto you," or "alas for you." So this is an example of where I think the KJV correctly translates the idiom and is perhaps the reason it is familiar to us as English speakers so many hundreds of years later. My only point here is that since I've never heard someone say "reckoning to you" and to the extent a familiar English idiom directly corresponds to the meaning of a Greek idiom I don't think it should not be discarded. Idioms like this have the ability to powerfully and effectively convey their meaning. I also think "reckoning is textually incorrect because the Gospel writers had word for "reckoning"  or "judgment," depending on the context you intended. [[User:Cambrian|Cambrian]] 13:53, 16 January 2010 (EST)
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:You make good points.  Thank you.  I have an open mind about this, and think "reckoning" might be improved.  But "woe to you" or "alas to you"?  Those strike me as very archaic and ambiguous.  Is it a curse?  No, I don't think that is the original intent.  People just don't talk that way anymore, and a listener to those phrases does not understand the original intent.  Also, as to "you all," that's too colloquial for a Bible translation, don't you think?--[[User:Aschlafly|Andy Schlafly]] 14:33, 16 January 2010 (EST)
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