Talk:Video games

Alright... The source given at the end of the first paragraph is, honestly, useless. It doesn't prove any claim made in the paragraph, let alone the last sentence, and some of the stuff given there sounds absolutely ludicrious. 124 incidents of violence in 10 minutes? Unless you're counting every punch as an incident, that's incredibly high...

Anyway. Under normal circumstances I'd simply delete the reference and replace it with a citation needed tag, but given that I'm coming fresh of a banning for misinterpreting instructions, I leave it to you to decide whether or not to remove a source that really adds nothing to the article. Cheers. Barikada 23:33, 22 January 2008 (EST)

Alright. Should nobody post a response to this in the next... Ehh, few hours, I'm going to replace that source with a fact tag. Reason: Source is irrelevant to that section of the article. Barikada 15:55, 25 January 2008 (EST)

Oh dang. I just noticed the what the previous edits said about the series. It's about purging evil in a make believe world! Narnia is almost the same. (both have magic/occult themes!)

I've been playing the series for a while, what homosexuality has there been besides Kefka, the arguable transvestite, from FFVI? And transvestism?! So what if Cloud was needed to infiltrate an area via "en femme"? It's a short section of the game and it was a pixelated mess.

Sexuality, let me think (my memory is half good on gaming). VI, nope. VII, nope (Tifa was "top-heavy"). VIII, didn't play. IX, nope. X, underwater make-out scene and Lulu's attire is iffy. X-2, that massage mini-game freaked me out and their attire. XI, didn't play due to online. XII, still playing and the only dispute are the Vieras' attire. Undercover cops in prostitution have just as much sexuality, but it's a necessary good, no?

Suicide... not really (from my experience). Homicide, very much so. Sephiroth killed Aerith, so Cloud killed Sephiroth. The only time I can think of was when Tidus (FFX) jumped off the Fahrenheit at the end, but he was just an apparition anyway. Also, it's not like it glorifying it either.

Religion. FFXII, the villains defy "the gods/fates". What do they get? Most are burned up by their manufactured idols ("manufacted nethicite") while the others are destroyed by Ashelia and the crew. Gabranth also comes to see the errors of his ways and joins the final fight for good against his superior, Vayne. Gabranth was saved in one way or another. Ruling out the villains of Final Fantasy, there hasn't been--if my memory serves correct--a defiance/negativity towards religion... except maybe the false religion of Yevon, which said that a summoner should die for their people to rid the world of pain for 3 years, "Sin". FFX was about defeating "Sin" and the false gods. I think I am done with my ranting for today. I would like to see some counter-points though. +_+ _{always tired} Nate 22:18, 4 June 2008 (EDT)

Many characters are unnecessarily sexualized (specially on concept art), just look at FFX-2. There's also a few sexual references here and there. (Though its not as bad as other games.) Also, Faris and Kuja are definitely transvestives.

There's also plenty of suicide in FFVI, with at least two of your main characters practicing it. There's also Dyne in FFVII committing it.

And if Final Fantasy Tactics wasn't a subtle attempt at subversion against Christianity, I don't know what it is. WilliamH 00:33, 5 June 2008 (EDT)

it isn't a subtle attempt at subverting christianity, it was a successful attempt to make money by creating a video game that took place in a fantasy world. (and as for the other things i have no idea cause i dont play FF, although their are other games with more violence and sexuallity, try picking on gta, that will be easier)-Greenmeanie 00:56, 5 June 2008 (EDT)

Well, yes, but more specifically it was a successful attempt to make money by creation a video game that took place in a fantasy world were Christianity is basically evil. I'll eventually get to work on the gta articles though. WilliamH 01:02, 5 June 2008 (EDT)

FFX-2 was Square's only first attempt to make an actual sequel. With the name that sequel brings it immediately brings less sales. How to counteract that? Scanty clothing! It's about making money. I preferred to use a party of 2 white mages and one dark knight (most amount of clothing), with the exception of using special dress-spheres when necessary (Riku's and Paine's special form were fully clothed). Gunner, hot pants and side skirt. Gun Mage, side skirt and midriff. Alchemist, nothing revealing. Warrior, bike shorts(?) at least. Dark Knight, nothing. Samurai, tube top Riku. Berserker, major problem. Songstress, miniskirt balanced with really up high boots/stockings. Black Mage, mix samurai with songstress format. White Mage, nothing. Lady Luck, problem. Mascot, definitely nothing wrong. Trainer, same top as Ashelia from FFXII--reveals top 1/3 of breasts. Actually useful dress-spheres: Berserker, White Mage, Lady Luck (if your timing is correct), Warrior, Songstress (if you give it time), and the special spheres.

Weren't Kuja and Zidane both genderless genomes? How can a mechanically engineered, soulless being be a transvestite? They were containers for the souls of Terra. Souls have gender/sex. True nature, a purified version of the body/container God made for us to use. If you have no soul, and you're just a container, then you have no true nature/gender. Kuja absorbed a plethora of souls of the Terrans... woman, child, man. Wouldn't that make "him" multi-gendered?

And.. I never played FF Tactics. I've played Mystic Quest, FFIII (JP), FFVI, FFVII, FFIX, FFX (best game ever! - spent 300 hours on it, 250 on one file), FFX-2 (just wanted to see how a sequel would be and what happened to Tidus), FFXII (still playing, good vocabulary too). +_+ _{always tired} Nate 15:08, 5 June 2008 (EDT)

Oh, I don't doubt the sexualizing of women in the series (not just FFX-2) was made in an effort to increase sales for the games (I would even say it applies to other themes not suitable for children such as profanity), however, that doesn't make it right or more appropriate.

Its true that Kuja is a genome, but they still have male bodies and are treated essentially like men in the game, in fact, you don't even get to know they aren't really human until nearly the end of the game. Also, even taking these technicalities in account, Faris (from FFV) is still transvestite. WilliamH 16:44, 5 June 2008 (EDT)

They also kind of had to assign a gender. You couldn't go a whole referring to the main antagonist as "it", "Kuja" or "zhe" (zhe is what some "genderless" people like to be called).

I have never actually played more than 10 minutes of FFV before deciding it wasn't worth the effort of not spending time on Dofus (a French-based MMORPG). +_+ _{always tired} Nate 23:58, 5 June 2008 (EDT)

"He" works as a pronoun for both genders, doesn't it? WilliamH 19:36, 6 June 2008 (EDT)

For conservatives, it does. My friend--"genderless by choice", born a she, and liberal--wishes to be known as "zhe". Also, Society builds on being politically correct. Companies can't go about saying every unknown gendered person, Quina Quen (FFIX), is a he... that would offend too many potential consumers. Turning off potential consumers means a loss for future profits too. Nate 12:01, 9 June 2008 (EDT)

I always thought that was an attempt at comedy actually. WilliamH 21:17, 19 June 2008 (EDT)

I found something useful in an older release of the Official Playstation Magazine about sex in videogames.

• 1982 - Custer's Revenge (Atari 2600) - The goal of the game was to have sex with a Native American woman by dodging arrows.
• 1990 - River City Ransom (Nintendo Entertainment System) - During a certain part of the game you can enter the sauna and it shows a naked man-butt.
• 1996 - Tomb Raider (PS1) - Introduced polygon breasts to the gaming world.
• 1998 - Metal Gear Solid (PS1) - "bathroom scene"
• 2000 - Dead or Alive 2: Hardcore (PS2) - "perfected" polygon breasts by adding a realistic bouncing effect.
• 2001 - Fear Effect 2: Retro Helix (PS1) - featured a lesbian couple for protagonists and several make-out scenes and partial nudity.
• 2001 - Rez (PS2 - Japan) - A trance music game with optional USB vibrator accessory.
• 2002 - BMX XXX (PS2) - nude characters and unlockable strip tease videos
• 2004 - Leisure Suit Larry (PS2) - sex-themed minigames
• 2004 - GTA: San Andreas (PS2) - "Hot Coffee"
• 2005 - Playboy: The Mansion (PS2) - sexual scenes (kind of obvious)
• 2005 - God of War (PS2) - topless female characters
• 2005 - Pornographic UMDs (PSP - Japan)

^[1]

Uh, buddy boy, that Lara Croft code was an April Fool's joke. DannyRedful 14:37, 13 June 2008 (EDT)

Right, right. I forgot about that... I never was one for reading the entire article. Nate 15:32, 13 June 2008 (EDT)

I'm adding a section about this if nobody minds. WilliamH 00:28, 14 June 2008 (EDT)

God of War also included mini-games involving the lead character having sex with various women. While the acts were not pictured on screen (the in-game views were moved to different parts of the rooms), the player had to press various buttons at the right time and was treated to all the sounds of the sex acts. Additionally, during one of the sex scenes, the camera focused on a fountain statue of a urinating young boy which achieved an erection during the scene and "ejaculated." This filth can be viewed on YouTube if anyone (i.e. any liberal) doubts me. Jinxmchue 12:47, 9 September 2008 (EDT)

I think the statement in the first paragraph—I added a {{fact}} tag but took it out after some consideration— needs a link to some sort of study linking the two, or it needs to be reworded. I don't believe a singular incident can be evidence for this claim. --Jeffrey W. Lauttamus_Discussion 11:59, 9 September 2008 (EDT)

It's clear that crimes have been associated with video games (the Columbine killers made custom levels in Doom that matched their school or some such), so the statement as written is true. The problem comes if you try to make a large scale correlation -- outside of anecdotal evidence, I don't think any evidence has ever been found. What few individual correlations I've heard, there's no evidence that the video game caused the violence. HelpJazz 21:49, 20 September 2008 (EDT)

1. ↑ Ashley, Robert. "The Secret History of Videogame Sex." Official Playstation Magazine Feb. 2006: 96-99.

Maybe we should remove the mention of Jack Thompson? He wasn't really a "target" of the media, and with his recent disbarrment, it might make a stronger case without mention of him. LiamG 17:40, 11 October 2008 (EDT)

Alternatively, it makes his criticisms seem more like the goofiness that they realy are ;-) You are right about the "target" thing though; most "targeted" media coverage was from gamer sites and comics. If the main stream media had anything about him he wasn't really a "target". HelpJazz 19:37, 11 October 2008 (EDT)

Can we get some people who actually play video games to edit this article? It's becoming biased based on what some editors see on TV.

Sure the popular games are the ones seen on TV or the ones that already have loyal fans, but there are still a majority of non-violent games out there.

Don't generalize because you don't understand. JonG^{Tennisu no Boifriendo} 21:10, 27 June 2009 (EDT)

Violence retort

And a funny retort to the violence "found" in gamers can be responded with:

"Violence in gamers is not caused by video games themselves, but rather, the crappy movies that are "based" off of the video games." --VGCats & Beep Boop

JonG^{Tennisu no Boifriendo} 21:19, 27 June 2009 (EDT)