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Talk:John 1-7 (Translated) (view source)
Revision as of 20:08, September 22, 2012
, 20:08, September 22, 2012→Strange change of perspective
Would you support, then, the translation of John 17:18 to "As You sent Me into us, I have sent them into us."? Same word there.<br />
Would you support, then, the translation of John 17:18 to "As You sent Me into us, I have sent them into us."? Same word there.<br />
I could get behind a translation to "men" or "the inhabitants of earth" as a translation for this, because that's what John was saying with "the world". God loves EVERYONE in the world, and so gave his Only Son. To use "Us", however, makes it sound like John is saying "Me, you, and them". Which he's not. He means everyone. For example, if I said "My parents really love us", would that mean they love everyone in the world, or me (PeterRyan), you (Aschlafly), and them (whoever else we have been talking about)? [[User:PeterRyan|PeterRyan]] 15:41, 22 September 2012 (EDT)
I could get behind a translation to "men" or "the inhabitants of earth" as a translation for this, because that's what John was saying with "the world". God loves EVERYONE in the world, and so gave his Only Son. To use "Us", however, makes it sound like John is saying "Me, you, and them". Which he's not. He means everyone. For example, if I said "My parents really love us", would that mean they love everyone in the world, or me (PeterRyan), you (Aschlafly), and them (whoever else we have been talking about)? [[User:PeterRyan|PeterRyan]] 15:41, 22 September 2012 (EDT)
:*I'm not against using punctuation - and I'm not ''per se'' against quotation marks. But I appreciate my ''Einheitsübersetzung'' which doesn't use them. In my opinion this helps with some more ambiguous parts like this one. Is Christ still speaking, or is it just a general statement?
:*Aschlafly, in your favor I assumed that you took this as a kind of general statement. But John doesn't use the first person until we have direct speech. This is a deliberate choice, please compare his style with the beginning of the Iliad or the Odyssey
:*If you take this as a part of Christ's speech, your translation becomes nonsensical: does Jesus include Himself in this ''we''? Shouldn't He use ''you''? But than it seems to be only about Nicodemus...
:*John 3:11: ἀμὴν ἀμὴν λέγω σοι How does this fit into your statement that ''the Greek style had not developed that improvement in writing style, to the point of using awkward constructs to avoid any first-person reference.''?
:[[User:AugustO|AugustO]] 16:08, 22 September 2012 (EDT)