Talk:Mystery:Why is Phonics Taught in the UK but not the US?

Illiterate democrat votes

Can I see the source that states that the Dems rely heavily on illiterate votes?

Even Fox News will tell you that Obama gets most of his support from the well-educated and younger, upwardly mobile, voters. AdenJ 01:11, 11 May 2008 (EDT)

AdenJ, you're simply wrong when you claim that Obama "gets most of his support from the well-educated ... voters." Overall, Dems rely on illiterate voters more than Republicans do.--Aschlafly 20:51, 11 May 2008 (EDT)

Aschlafly - I'll direct your attention to this, from Fox News... "Obama, who consistently leads Clinton among highly educated and wealthy voters, has tried to make up ground with middle-class America, where Clinton is strong. He has managed to score several wins in rural states like Idaho, Kansas and North Dakota." There is plently more evidence of this. Can you show it is wrong? AdenJ 05:32, 12 May 2008 (EDT)

Not according to this, which says the opposite in the 2004 election. Perhaps you have a source that says otherwise? Murray 20:59, 11 May 2008 (EDT)

I guess there is no source that says that "Dems rely on illiterate voters more than Republicans do". I'm surprised. Murray 20:43, 12 May 2008 (EDT)

UK

"The Labour Party is not struggling and does not fear losing power". Do you have any idea about UK politics? Did you see the recent election results where Labour came in third? Have you read any UK newspapers or watched any UK news reports? All of them would contradict the notion that the Labour Party is not struggling. Henry8th 08:14, 11 May 2008 (EDT)

That's a very recent development. This entry takes a longer frame of reference. The Labour Party has (predictably) held commanding power in the U.K. ever since sweeping gun control was imposed there in the mid-1990s.--Aschlafly 09:30, 11 May 2008 (EDT)

US Phonics

Most school systems in the U.S. do teach phonics- I was taught phonics in Texas, where the school districts are allowed to choose curriculum on an independent basis. Other school districts in the same state did not. The only state I've heard of that unilaterally does not teach phonics is South Carolina, though there may be others. SBaynham 09:22, 11 May 2008 (EDT)

Most public schools in the U.S. do not teach phonics, and I'm skeptical whether you learned from real phonics. Often a "look and say" approach will be labeled phonics by schools to stop parental complaints.--Aschlafly 09:31, 11 May 2008 (EDT)

Look and say, teaching the "shape" of words, is the only other commonly-applied theory in the United States, so I am quite aware of the difference, and I was taught phonics. As I said, I have a friend in South Carolina who attended a school that taught the word shape method. Your understanding of this issue is quite contrary to reality: her teachers conspired to teach phonics against administration demands (which stemmed from parent demands), and a teacher was fired when they were found out. I haven't asked extensively about who was taught what, but it was always my understanding that South Carolina's aversion to phonics was closely related to their 49th in the nation status in education.

Constance Weaver

Here is a link to the Education Resources Information Center page about the teachers' text book, Reading Process and Practice, From Socio-Psycholinguistics to Whole Language by Constance Weaver. It looks fairly innocuous, doesn't it? Weaver, as you can see, is an advocate of "look-say" over phonics. ERIC, it should be borne in mind, is the organization used by "education researchers, teachers, librarians, administrators, education policymakers, instructors and students in teacher-preparation programs". What that page doesn't tell you is what Weaver has to say about phonics. Those researchers, teachers policymakers, etc are all informed - in the textbook! - that phonics is nothing short of a "far right plot... to promote a religious agenda" and inculcate "docility and obedience on the part of the lower classes." When cuckoos like that are allowed to write the textbooks, and "policymakers" read them too, it should come as no surprise that American children are being denied the head start in literacy that phonics provides. 10px Fox (talk|contribs) 07:10, 12 May 2008 (EDT)

Ah, there's the answer: liberals claim that phonics is a "far right plot" and thereby block it in the U.S.--Aschlafly 08:58, 12 May 2008 (EDT)

One of the external links from the Phonics page is to an interesting article which states: "In many [British] teachers minds, phonics equals right-wing, traditional, drill and skill, boring, anti-child-centred Gradgrind education. Over in the United States, phonics is portrayed as being closely aligned to the Christian fundamentalist right. The No child left behind act mandated phonics. Hell, Dubya loves phonics, so it follows that all right-minded progressive folks need to be against them." 10px Fox (talk|contribs) 10:20, 12 May 2008 (EDT)