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Talk:Brokeback Mountain (view source)
Revision as of 16:35, October 8, 2008
, 16:35, October 8, 2008→Name recognition of the actors: Reply to Pickering
:There, I just proved Leonardo DiCaprio was a no name actor before he appeared in Titanic, even though he was a major selling point for that movie, and he was a household name before its release. DiCaprio was a very big star before Titanic, and a bigger one after, much like Heath Ledger. An example of a no name actor getting a starring role in a major film might be Cillian Murphy in 28 Days Later. No one had heard of him before that movie (and he’s still not exactly universally recognized). That is far different than Ledger before Brokeback Mountain.
:There, I just proved Leonardo DiCaprio was a no name actor before he appeared in Titanic, even though he was a major selling point for that movie, and he was a household name before its release. DiCaprio was a very big star before Titanic, and a bigger one after, much like Heath Ledger. An example of a no name actor getting a starring role in a major film might be Cillian Murphy in 28 Days Later. No one had heard of him before that movie (and he’s still not exactly universally recognized). That is far different than Ledger before Brokeback Mountain.
:Also, “no name” actors do not get their names “Above the Title” as they say. Look at the posters for [http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/c/cb/The_Four_Feathers_2002_movie.jpg The Four Feathers] and [http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.impawards.com/2005/posters/brothers_grimm.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.impawards.com/2005/brothers_grimm.html&h=755&w=509&sz=101&hl=en&start=1&sig2=rqQ0CHuY5_8OExmU6feO8g&um=1&usg=__LVwEiH86G9xHIdmpl7RzVKS8FIg=&tbnid=yvtmpcxwA2liRM:&tbnh=142&tbnw=96&ei=87LsSJ-GKqDMedT9odEL&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dbrothers%2Bgrimm%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-US:official%26sa%3DN The Brothers Grimm]. Ledger was a star. Not of the highest level yet, but a star nevertheless. [[User:KPickering|KPickering]] 09:24, 8 October 2008 (EDT)
:Also, “no name” actors do not get their names “Above the Title” as they say. Look at the posters for [http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/c/cb/The_Four_Feathers_2002_movie.jpg The Four Feathers] and [http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.impawards.com/2005/posters/brothers_grimm.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.impawards.com/2005/brothers_grimm.html&h=755&w=509&sz=101&hl=en&start=1&sig2=rqQ0CHuY5_8OExmU6feO8g&um=1&usg=__LVwEiH86G9xHIdmpl7RzVKS8FIg=&tbnid=yvtmpcxwA2liRM:&tbnh=142&tbnw=96&ei=87LsSJ-GKqDMedT9odEL&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dbrothers%2Bgrimm%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-US:official%26sa%3DN The Brothers Grimm]. Ledger was a star. Not of the highest level yet, but a star nevertheless. [[User:KPickering|KPickering]] 09:24, 8 October 2008 (EDT)
::I disagre with your logic. First, to clarify, I did not say that "no-name" actors do not get their names "Above the Title". They do, but on lesser movies they starred in (like Four Feathers). On big studio productions, if they're not a big name themselves, they don't get billing above the title (see the posters for The Day After Tomorrow<ref>http://www.impawards.com/2004/day_after_tomorrow_ver3.html</ref>).
::Secondly, there's a BIG difference between Leonardo DiCaprio and Heath Ledger/Jake Ghyllenhaal. DiCaprio may have starred in smaller films, but this films garnered him recognition through Oscar, Golden Globe and other nominations. As I recall, DiCaprio became famous because he was nominated for the Oscar for What's Eating Gilbert Grape back in 1994.<ref>http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000138/awards</ref>. He was nominated again for Best Actor this time in 2004 for The Aviator, the year before Brokeback came out. Getting nominations like those are a major way of getting your name popularly recognized. Ledger and Gyllenhal didn't get any award nominations from major organizations prior to Brokeback Mountain. The exceptions: Ledger from a few Australian organizations (support Philip's point more) and several nominations from MTV and the Teen Choice Awards (supporting my point that he was just teen crush of the month). Gyllenhall: again Teen Choice and YoungStar and other popularity contests with teens. So if you don't have either a) big returns on at least some of your films, or b) awards recognition, then what do you have to make you a popular star? Apparently well-known star means being whoever the teen girls go gaga over at the time.
::You also claimed there were no other bankable young stars at the time. Hmm.... Freddie Prinze Jr made $72 million off a $17 million movie (I Know What You Did Last Summer) and another $40 million squeezed out of a sequel (did Ledger or Ghylenhaal have any sequels?). She's All That was a $63 million movie from a $10 million budget. In the early 2000s he was a very bankable star (where he's gone since then is another matter...) Another example is Ryan Phillippe: $38 million off an $11 million movie with Cruel Intentions. These actors reliably produced big profit margins, making them stars. DiCaprio, Matt Damon, Ben Affleck, etc got their names known through major awards. But before Brokeback, neither Ledger nor Gyllenhaal had any real claims to fame. -[[User:Foxtrot|Foxtrot]] 12:35, 8 October 2008 (EDT)