Talk:Cafeteria Christianity

Deletion of Examples of Commonly Ignored Bible Verses

I recently edited this article to include some examples of Bible verses commonly ignored by Cafeteria Christians, but my changes were reverted without explanation. Mr. Schlafly, if you read this could you please help me understand why this is? I am quite certain that for each example given, there is a significant number of Americans who either violate the law directly or who tacitly approve of such violation, often without even acknowledging their sins. Is there some nuance in the definition of "Cafeteria Christian" that I am not picking up on, or is the definition not made clear in the article? --Toadaron 13:06, 2 February 2011 (EST)

All or none

What about the Christians that don't believe it's o.k. to stone unruly teenagers to death? Or the ones that disagree with the part that says its alright to beat your slave, so long as he doesn't die? Or where it says not to eat shellfish or pork? These things aren't commonly accepted in modern Christianity, but wouldn't that still be cafeteria Christianity? Either the Bible is the word of God, and everything in it should be regarded as true, or it isn't the word of God and it shouldn't be treated as such. If the part condemning homosexuality cannot be disregarded, then these parts cannot either. --Jab512 19:56, 25 July 2011 (EDT)

Those things were taken from the law of the Pentateuch (Leviticus, Deuteronomy, part of Exodus). Much of that law was repudiated in the Sermon on the Mount by Jesus himself. It's not that the entire Bible is the word of the Lord - Song of Songs, for example, is just the word of Solomon. The Lord makes no appearance. The same goes for Ecclesiastes, which is Solomon's word. The part about homosexuality, however, was repeated in the New Testament and still goes.--Abcqwe (talk) 15:33, 3 April 2017 (EDT)

Other Common Names

I've heard this approach to Christianity called 'Pick-and-Mix', 'Pick-and-choose' (sometimes hyphenated, sometimes not) and 'McDonalds Christanity' (which I believe is a reference to fast food buffets), would it be OK to add these to the article? JRegden 02:41, 26 April 2012 (EDT)

I don't see why not. DavidE 13:17, 26 April 2012 (EDT)

Hypocrisy...

Hypocrisy! Both Scripture and Conservapedia condemn Cafeteria Christianity, yet Mr. Shlafly does this very thing with his Bible Project.

"Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you are like whitewashed tombs, which outwardly appear beautiful, but within are full of dead people's bones and all uncleanness." - Matthew 23:27 —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Quidestveritas (talk)

I absolutely love when somebody tries to use scripture against Christians. But it matters most when you use scripture against non-believers. I bet you would condemn the translation of the bible from Latin to English. Move along trouble maker.--Jpatt 22:39, 1 June 2012 (EDT)

I don't believe that addresses my point. This article condemns Mr. Shlafly's behavior! Mr. Shlafly wants to remove passages from the Bible because of their liberal nature. Yet, this page quotes Jesus as saying man must live by ALL of God's Word. Apparently, Mr. Shlafly doesn't want to do that. "The counterargument of many cafeteria Christians is that the word of the authors of certain parts of the Bible is not necessarily the word of God." Then, this page deems this argument circular! Isn't that Mr. Shlafly's argument? You're arguing with yourselves!

"If a house is divided against itself, that house cannot stand." - Mark 3:25

Perhaps I should take my complaints to the Bible Project page instead... - quidestveritas

Are you referring to how Mr. Schlafly (that has a "c" in it) hasn't translated the whole Bible? It's a work in progress, "whatistruth".--Abcqwe (talk) 15:33, 3 April 2017 (EDT)

What a mess

• "Espousing cafeteria Christianity invalidates a person's Christian witness."

Do I have to pass judgement on being judgmental? Who's gonna cast the first stone on this allegedly bible based, scholarly article? It doesn't say a word about "babes in Christ". It teaches us nothing about God, Christ, or Bible.

And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ. I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able.

Was Paul a "cafateria christian" cause he spoke, chose, quoted, and taught only the milk of the gospel, and not the meat?

If someone does not do a serious overhaul, it probably should be de-linked from other pagers, or even deleted. RobS^{Live Free or Die} 00:44, 13 June 2020 (EDT)

Question

Should information be added about christians who ignore scriptural verses about Christ dying once for all and preach non-scriptural doctrines such as purgatory - doctrines that are directly antithetical to who Christ is? RobS^{Trump 2Q2Q} 11:09, 18 July 2020 (EDT)

What a pile of garbage

• "Espousing cafeteria Christianity invalidates a person's Christian witness."

I guess the Bible is just nonsense according to this article.

• Who are you to pass judgment on the servant of another? It is before his own master that he stands or falls. And he will be upheld, for the Lord is able to make him stand. - Romans 14:4.

How much more anti-God, anti-Biblical, Satanic nonsense is in this article? RobS^{Trump 2Q2Q} 20:23, 19 July 2020 (EDT)

• "Confusion as to just how literally Biblical texts should be taken abounds"

Meanwhile, the Bible says,

• God is not the author of confusion 1 Corinthians 14:3

How many more Satanic lies and deception's are in this article? RobS^{Trump 2Q2Q} 20:39, 19 July 2020 (EDT)

Pure comedy

• "even amongst those who generally accept the Bible to be the word for God"

Well duh. wouldn't that be the definition of a cafeteria Christian? RobS^{Trump 2Q2Q} 20:36, 19 July 2020 (EDT)

This section needs overhaul

• "However, cafeteria Christianity is not limited to the left side of the political spectrum; some conservative Christians are also fond of citing Scripture selectively in order to expose hypocrisy while explaining away the same issues in their own camp (such as criticizing the Catholic Church for covering up child molestation among its priests—arguing that the problem is due to the Church's prohibition against priests marrying—while ignoring similar cases involving married pastors or leaders within major Protestant churches or denominations). A notable example of "right-wing" cafeteria Christianity is the Westboro Baptist Church; their followers quote verses about God's judgment but ignore those about mercy."

If I don't get some help within 72 hours, I'll rewrite it myself, and no one will be happy with it, not even me. RobS^{Trump 2Q2Q} 20:54, 19 July 2020 (EDT)

Never mind the rather lame argument for a moment; the example is truly absurd. Is there some context or relationship between a church with a dozen members and the 12,000 victims of priest sexual abuse, without even a citation from Westboro criticizing the Catholic church?

Even more troubling and absurd: God is not going to damn somebody and send them to hell for criticizing a church, let alone speaking the truth about it. This less than irrelevant paragraph, with no bearing whatsoever on a person's salvation or final destiny, should be removed particularly from the Intro. It is ludicrous to think criticizing priestly pedophile makes someone a non-Christian and condemns them to hell, and then use the Westboro Baptist Church of all things to support the argument. RobS^{Trump 2Q2Q} 22:03, 19 July 2020 (EDT)

Now to the substance of the argument:

• "some conservative Christians are also fond of citing Scripture selectively ....such as criticizing the Catholic Church for covering up child molestation"

Wow. You mean there are other scriptures that support pedophilia? Whowuddathunkit? RobS^{Trump 2Q2Q} 22:14, 19 July 2020 (EDT)

I'm just going to remove the paragraph. Talking about pedophilia in any church does not remove a person's Christian witness and there are no scriptures that selectively support pedophilia. RobS^{Trump 2Q2Q} 09:23, 20 July 2020 (EDT)

Furthermore: The whole idea of "left wing" and "rightwing" churches is a non-scriptural concept that deserves treatment elsewhere. RobS^{Trump 2Q2Q} 09:25, 20 July 2020 (EDT)

Bible believing, conservative Protestant Christianity doesn't have a big problem with pedophilia. I have never seen this being a problem in my local area and I don't see it happening nationally. But the Catholic Church has a huge problem with this. The report released Thursday by the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops said the 2019 report — which covered July 2018 through June 2019 — counted 4,434 allegations of clergy sex abuse against minors.[1] A global look at the Catholic Church’s sex abuse problem.[2], Associated Press, 2019

I have never seen statistics supporting that conservative Protestants have a major pedophilia problem. If someone does have such data, please cite it.

Liberal Christianity/Protestantism may have a problem with pedophilia (see my next post below).

I deleted a section in the article about conservative Protestants and pedophilia.Conservative (talk) 12:07, 20 July 2020 (EDT)

I know there are homosexual, liberal Protestants and liberal Protestantism embrace homosexuality. And Bill Donahue of the Catholic League points out that it was male children who were primarily molested by Catholic priests and there was a male, homosexual Catholic priest problem in the USA.[3][4] I hear many reports about homosexual priests in the USA and in the Vatican (and staunch Catholics like Michael Voris are reporting on this matter too). See the video by the staunch, Catholic Michael Voris at: The Vortex — The Homosexual Papacy?.

On other hand, conservative Protestants reject homosexuality and homosexuality is not a big problem within conservative Protestantism. And again, I don't see a lot of reports/statistics about conservative Christians having a pastor/pedophilia problem.

I did find these statistics about Protestants/pedophilia, but it doesn't differentiate between liberal Protestantism and conservative/biblical Protestantism: Letter: Book reveals pedophila in Protestant churches.Conservative (talk) 12:29, 20 July 2020 (EDT)

This is the biggest bunch of hooey I've ever seen:

• "conservative Christians are also fond of citing Scripture selectively in order to expose hypocrisy while explaining away the same issues in their own camp (such as criticizing the Catholic Church for covering up child molestation"

Right, the bible condemns pedophilia in some places and condones it in others. Sheesh. RobS^{Trump 2Q2Q} 12:39, 20 July 2020 (EDT)

Ohhhh, I see where this going. Mary was about 14 years old (which she likely was) when she got pregnant by the Holy Spirit. With a formal acknowledgement of that non-scriptural "scholarly" fact, it would make this paragraph make some sense. Homosexual molestation is another issue. CP would do best to drop this paragraph from this article and deal with these controversies elsewhere.

With those sentences in it looks like CP condones homosexual pedophile molestation with a rather shocking defense of it. It's hard to believe this is even a controversy. RobS^{Trump 2Q2Q} 12:48, 20 July 2020 (EDT)

Billy James Hargis

From Spartacus International excerpted:

Hargis organized Christian Crusade, as "a Christian weapon against Communism and its godless allies". Hargis also ran an Annual Anti-Communist Leadership School. His daily broadcasts were carried by around 250 television and 500 radio stations across the United States.

A close friend of General Edwin Walker he became a member of the John Birch Society. Hargis used his national media network to promote right-wing politicians. This included writing speeches for Joseph McCarthy. ...

Hargis was a strong supporter of Barry Goldwater in the 1964 Presidential Election. In one radio broadcast Hargis accused the journalist, Fred Cook, of smearing Goldwater. When Red Lion, a Pennsylvania Radio Station refused Cook a right of reply, he sued. As a result of this case the Supreme Court established the "fairness doctrine".

In 1966 Hargis set up American Christian College in Tulsa. In his radio broadcasts he attacked the Beatles, long hair, the Anti-Defamation League, women's liberation and sex education and X-rated movies. He also promoted his college choir, the "All-American Kids".

It was rumoured that Hargis had been seducing members of his college. In 1974 two of his students claimed that they had had sex with him - one was female, one was male (they had discovered they had both had sex with Hargis on their wedding night) - other students corroborated the story. This story was revealed by Time Magazine in 1976. As a result of the scandal Hargis was forced to close his American Christian College....

None of this kinda garbage belongs in a article like this. It can go elsewhere. RobS^{Trump 2Q2Q} 13:08, 20 July 2020 (EDT)