Talk:Joan Crawford

= Crawford's Political Preference =

This article on Joan Crawford cites the following: "Crawford was a Democrat who particularly admired U.S. Presidents Franklin D. Roosevelt and John F. Kennedy, whom she believed were interested in the needs of the laboring class of Americans into which Crawford was born in San Antonio, Texas"

Joan Crawford never made her political views public. As a matter of fact, I have evidence that Joan Crawford was not a Democrat during this period of her life, but rather a supporter of Republican politicians, including Richard Nixon and Ronald Reagan.

This information is sourced by "AZQuotes.com," which can be edited by anyone without any type of screening process. --ConcludingChapter (talk) 00:01, August 15, 2021 (EDT)

There is nothing unusual about any of this, but yes, perhaps it could be explained clearer. Reagan, like Crawford was an enthusiastic supporter of FDR in the 30s and 40s. In 1960, she likely supported Kennedy over Nixon. In 1968 and 1972, assuming Nixon's Southern Strategy (she was born in San Antonio, Texas), where all the racist FDR and Kennedy supporters came over to Nixon is true, would not be surprising. And supporting her old longtime friend from Hollywood, Reagan, in 1980 and 1984 is not surprising either. RobS^{Free Kyle!} 00:24, August 15, 2021 (EDT)

Yes, however, isn't the article supposed to follow documented facts rather than assumptions? As is, I am curious to know if this "AZQuote" source can be removed from the article since it is not a proper source of information? Crawford never stated this quote, and did not discuss her political affiliation during interviews. --ConcludingChapter (talk) 09:30, August 15, 2021 (EDT)

There are several sources for all this. She meet FDR in 1937 at a highly publicized event. She spoke openly about her support of JFK. Like most sane Democrats, she supported Nixon after years of Marxist violence, riots, and burning down cities. Unlike DNC agitprop, support for Nixon from Democrats had nothing to do with race, and more to do with love of country. RobS^{Free Kyle!} 18:54, August 15, 2021 (EDT)

Could you please cite a source whereby Crawford ever voiced public support for FDR or Kennedy? I have researched Joan Crawford since 1999, and I have never once seen any such support by Crawford towards those political figures. If the source is simply that Crawford was photographed with these political figures, she was photographed with just as many, if not more, Republican figures. --ConcludingChapter (talk) 17:00, August 16, 2021 (EDT)

Oh. Are you saying she was photographed with Alf Landon in 1936? RobS^{Free Kyle!} 02:36, August 17, 2021 (EDT)

Could you tell me what photo you're referring to? In 22 years of researching Joan Crawford, I have never seen a photo of Crawford with Franklin D. Roosevelt. --ConcludingChapter (talk) 16:02, August 17, 2021 (EDT)

• A delegation of Hollywood stars, including Joan, greets presidential candidate Franklin Roosevelt in Los Angeles during his September/October train trip to Western stops. Mr. Hearst's Examiner announced: "A group of famous film stars will meet the Governor and help make his visit an eventful one. . . . Marion Davies, famous motion picture star, is chairman of the distinguished aggregation. . . . The following will assist Miss Davies: Joan Blondell, Bebe Daniels, Constance Bennett, Helen Hayes, Sally Eilers, Marie Dressier, Joan Crawford, Carole Lombard..." (Time Magazine, 9/19/32) [1]

This would be 6 weeks before the 1932 election. Also [2] RobS^{Free Kyle!} 16:40, August 17, 2021 (EDT)

• 1937: FDR meets Joan Crawford

1937. FDR in Poughkeepsie, New York, with Joan Crawford "Bride Wore Red" billboard. [3]

RobS^{Free Kyle!} 16:44, August 17, 2021 (EDT)

The 1937 meeting is interesting; it was after FDR won a landslide re-election, however shortly after that in 1937, the U.S. entered as second or 'double dip' recession, causing the "Second New Deal". FDR's approval crashed, and 1937-38 were not good years for FDR's popularity. Crawford, however, was at the height of her fame. FDR evidentally was blazing the trail here for what presidents with low approval have done ever since - latch on to a Hollywood celebrity to help bail them out. RobS^{Free Kyle!} 16:49, August 17, 2021 (EDT)

Can you point out where is there a mention that Crawford had a photograph with Roosevelt in 1936 (or even in 1932), as you stated above? The event you cited (which is a snippet from an article, without the entire context, was an MGM publicity event. It was not an event Crawford attended as her own person, but rather as an employee of MGM (as is everyone cited in that article snippet). Also, what is the source for "1937: FDR meets Joan Crawford"? If this is being used as a source, please cite what this "meeting" was regarding, and where it took place. As a vertern Crawford researcher, I adamantly contend no such meeting occurred. Additionally, you do know that "1937. FDR in Poughkeepsie, New York, with Joan Crawford "Bride Wore Red" billboard" is literally a photo of FDR on the road in Poughkeepsie, New York with a Joan Crawford film billboard (along with a soft drink advertisement billboard) in the background? This is not a photo of Crawford with FDR, nor is it an indication of her political affiliation. --ConcludingChapter (talk) 16:59, August 17, 2021 (EDT)

Look, it's pretty clear Crawford was a New Dealer who supported FDR and JFK (opposing Nixon in 1960); she switched to Nixon in 1968 and 1972, as many Democrats did (like Reagan) because of the far left takeover of the Democrat party in the 1960s by the New Left. And furthermore, that is no evidence that she ever became a Republican or left the Democrat party. RobS^{Free Kyle!} 17:05, August 17, 2021 (EDT)

Here's the facts: many New Dealers also made up Nixon's Silent Majority and later were Reagan Democrats. They never left the Democrat party. In 1994, I recall Ed Rollins explaining the Republican Revolution (1994) or Gingrich Revolution. He said, "the New Deal is dead." I thought it was almost blasphemous to hear someone utter such words openly with courage. RobS^{Free Kyle!} 17:10, August 17, 2021 (EDT)

Respectfully, this is all based on personal assumption without any reference or citation to even make an inference. A couple of things I would please like to point out: (1) "it's pretty clear Crawford was a New Dealer who supported FDR and JFK" Where is there an indication, or even a hint, this is fact regarding Joan Crawford? As a matter of fact, I have in my possession proof that Crawford (privately) supported Nixon in 1960. At the time, Nixon was associated with Pepsi-Cola (Crawford was a member of the board of directors for Pepsi during this time) and he was assisting Pepsi in the company's marketing attempts in the Soviet Union. So, the assumption that Crawford was a "New Dealer" for JFK in 1960 is not accurate. (2) "and furthermore, that is no evidence that she ever became a Republican or left the Democrat party" Can you please indicate where is the evidence she was ever a Democrat? As I mentioned, Crawford never commented publicly about her political affiliation, nor did she ever publicly endorse any political candidate of any party. Without evidence of such, I think it is wrong for a political affiliation to be mentioned in regard to Joan Crawford. --ConcludingChapter (talk) 17:32, August 17, 2021 (EDT)

It's just how things were done in those days. The Gallup Poll originated about 1937. Unemployment figures were never compiled to about 1938. The Hollywood contract system was still in play in 1932. And your insinuation that Joan Crawford supported Herbert Hoover, Alf Landon, or even Richard Nixon in 1960 is beyond hilarious parody. RobS^{Free Kyle!} 17:36, August 17, 2021 (EDT)

"It's just how things were done in those days." Again, this is a personal assumption. Source that this is fact in regard to Joan Crawford? As I stated, I have documentation of Crawford's support of Nixon in 1960. I am happy to post it. --ConcludingChapter (talk) 18:05, August 17, 2021 (EDT)

• Joan Crawford/John F. Kennedy

Few starlets mingled more thoroughly—and occasionally scandalously—with both the Hollywood and Washington elite than Joan Crawford. The actress, who had been close to John F. Kennedy's father Joseph years before, was received by JFK in the White House in 1963. The duo became so close that Crawford was in Dallas on the day Kennedy was assassinated later that year. [4] RobS^{Free Kyle!} 17:44, August 17, 2021 (EDT)

Could you please cite the source of this information beyond a poorly researched internet blog? Joan Crawford was, indeed, in Dallas, Texas on November 22, 1963. However, she was not in Dallas for Kennedy. She was in Dallas to represent Pepsi-Cola at the annual Pepsi-Cola company convention at the Baker hotel. Do you know who she traveled with to Dallas, and who she was with at the Baker Hotel? - Richard Nixon. Please feel free to verify. --ConcludingChapter (talk) 18:02, August 17, 2021 (EDT)

Let's cut to the chase: you're implying Crawford/Nixon/David Kendall/Augusto Pinochet were all in bed as early as 1960, is that the point? RobS^{Free Kyle!} 18:09, August 17, 2021 (EDT)

Joan Crawford, Richard Nixon and DONALD Kendall (Not David Kendall) were all employed by Pepsi-Cola. Nixon was not officially employed by the company until 1961, when he was hired as the company's attorney. Yes, they all knew one another and shared common politics. As a matter of fact, Kendall (like Crawford) was an ardent supporter of Nixon during his 1968 and 1972 presidential campaigns. So much so that Kendall feared that he may be tied into the Watergate scandal. My source for this is the Nixon White House tapes - which I have listened to - and have Nixon and Kendall discussing this topic in 1973. Augusto Pinochet has nothing to do with this situation. It was Nikita Khrushchev who Nixon was attempting to negotiation the marketing of Pepsi to the Soviet Union in 1959. Feel free to verify, this is all very well-known and documented information.

I would also like to clarify the 1963 White House visit. Joan Crawford was received at the White House in 1963. the exact date was May 3rd, 1963. She was not at the White House for personal reasons, nor in any personal capacity. She was representing the "Stars For Mental health" organization, who was presenting Kennedy with an award for his efforts for mental health. She was the chairwoman of the organization. Again, please feel free to verify. --ConcludingChapter (talk) 18:24, August 17, 2021 (EDT)

The Pepsi/Coke Wars predate the construction of the Berlin Wall. [5] I don't doubt it may have been Crawford who hooked up Nixon with Donald Kendall. RobS^{Free Kyle!} 18:27, August 17, 2021 (EDT)

From the Nixon Library:

• Richard Nixon awoke in the Baker Hotel. There was a policeman stationed in the hallway outside his door, but the officer was there not so much to protect the former Vice President as to deter jewel thieves or autograph seekers from bothering movie star Joan Crawford who was a few doors down from RN. Both the Hollywood legend and the future President were in town for the same reason – to attend the annual convention of the American Bottlers of Carbonated Beverages. Both were there on behalf of the Pepsi-Cola corporation – Miss Crawford as a member of its board of directors (she was the widow of its chairman), and RN in his capacity as an attorney working on Pepsi’s behalf. [6]

There is nothing unusual about this, either. James Farley, former DNC chairman under FDR, was chairman of Coca-Cola and granted the former Nazi boxing champ Max Schmelling, who lost to African American heavyweight champ Joe Louis, CoCa-Cola distributors rights in West Germany, making him a millionaire (while Joe Louis got nothing). RobS^{Free Kyle!} 18:37, August 17, 2021 (EDT)

I would like to point out that Dallas was brought into this conversation due to the blog article you cited, which claimed Crawford was in Dallas for Kennedy. I corrected that blog's false claim with fact. Regardless, this has been a long discussion, and I have still not seen any evidence presented that Joan Crawford was a member of the Democratic party at any time during her life, or that she publicly supported any political candidate of any party. I understand there is a lot of "Google" scrambling happening between our exchanges in an attempt to debate this fact, however, as a 22-year researcher/historian of Joan Crawford, I can assure you that no such evidence to the contrary exists. --ConcludingChapter (talk) 18:52, August 17, 2021 (EDT)

(ec) From Wikipedia:

• Farley guided and remained at the helm of Coca Cola International as chairman for over 30 years and was responsible for the company's global expansion as a quasi-government agency in World War II.
• Schmelling worked for The Coca-Cola Company. Schmeling became friends with Louis, and their friendship lasted until the latter's death in 1981.

Of course, there is no link between the two pages by the Wikipedia fascists. In the 2010 German film about Schmelling, you see Farley hires Schmelling, Schmelling gets rich, and supports Joe Louis for the remainder of Joe Louis's life. [7] I can see why inconvenient facts like this are repulsive to leftist propagandists. RobS^{Free Kyle!} 19:03, August 17, 2021 (EDT)

So what is the real story here? Max Schmelling was granted white privilege by New Deal Democrat chairman James Farley, while the Nazi and white supremacist icon Max Schmelling supported the African American boxing champ Joe Louis for his the rest of his life, who Democrats and his own country could care less if he lived or died. This should be a caveat, to anyone studying the propaganda of that time period, and taking much of it as real history. RobS^{Free Kyle!} 19:21, August 17, 2021 (EDT)

Could you please explain how any of that is relevant to the topic at hand? - Which is Joan Crawford's political affiliation. --ConcludingChapter (talk) 19:32, August 17, 2021 (EDT)

Your whole premise here is based on the Coke/Pepsi wars, beginning in the mid to late 1950s.

Crawford was an early feminist Hollywood icon, an unwed mother who proved she didn't need a man to have both a successful career and family. As she got older, she married a globalist, and was repulsed by the violent far-left take over of the Democrat party. That's the story. RobS^{Free Kyle!} 19:42, August 17, 2021 (EDT)

The Silent film era ended in 1927. By 1932, the new technology of "talkies" and the Hollywood film industry was glamourizing anti-family single motherhood through Joan Crawford, who stood almost alone among Hollywood stars in that regard. Short of burning down cities, that was considered radical far left ideology in the 1930s. RobS^{Free Kyle!} 19:50, August 17, 2021 (EDT)

"Your whole premise here is based on the Coke/Pepsi wars" - No. That's not correct. THIS discussion is about Joan Crawford's political affiliation - not the Coke/Pepsi wars. The entire topic of Pepsi and the Soviet Union was brought into this discussion when you cited incorrect (and unsourced) information above, by claiming Crawford did not support Nixon in 1960.

Crawford did not adopt any children during the 1930s. She officially adopted her first child, Christina, in June 1940. Her second child, Christopher, was adopted in 1942 while she was married to Phillip Terry. I have copies of the adoption records.

"As she got older, she married a globalist, and was repulsed by the far-leftist take over the Democrat party. That's the story." - What is your source for this information?

As it stands, this discussion is going in circles, with irrelevant topics being introduced to divert the subject of this discussion. Can you please offer any factual source for your claim that Crawford was ever a Democrat - beyond your own personal assumption? --ConcludingChapter (talk) 20:02, August 17, 2021 (EDT)

Well no. You brought up Pepsi, presumably to imply somehow a Republican connection. And we've well established the racist connections of Coke-a-Cola to the Democrat party and New Deal. Not to mention globalism, per Wikipedia (" the company's global expansion as a quasi-government agency in World War II"). RobS^{Free Kyle!}

Pepsi was mentioned in regard to Crawford and Nixon, and to correct the false information you posted in regard to Joan, Kennedy and Dallas in 1963. The subject of any racism regarding Coke is totally irrelevant to this topic, and as far as I can see was only mentioned as a diversion tactic from the subject at hand.

Again, as asked repeatedly - Can you please offer any factual source for your claim that Crawford was ever a Democrat - beyond your own personal assumption? --ConcludingChapter (talk) 20:19, August 17, 2021 (EDT)

<-- Look, we all see where you're going with this: [8]

• NYT: Donald Kendall, Pepsi’s chief during cola wars, is dead, By SAM ROBERTS New York Times Sep 26, 2020.

• ...Kendall cultivated a close personal and professional relationship with Richard Nixon, who early on represented Pepsi as a lawyer and in 1965 played the piano at Kendall’s second wedding, at the Pierre hotel in Manhattan.
• In 1959, Kendall was seeking to open a Pepsi plant in the Soviet Union and saw an opportunity at an exhibition of American products being held in Moscow that year (the same exhibition where Vice President Richard Nixon conducted his celebrated “kitchen debate” with the Soviet leader Nikita Khrushchev).
• At Kendall’s request, Nixon steered Khrushchev to the Pepsi display.
• ...“Cola Captivates Soviet Leaders,” The New York Times headline proclaimed.
• A manufacturing agreement was finally signed in 1973 after both parties overcame currency exchange complications: PepsiCo accepted Soviet-made Stolichnaya vodka as payment instead of rubles.
• According to government documents and the 2007 book “Legacy of Ashes: The History of the CIA,” by Tim Weiner, a former Times reporter, in 1970 Kendall introduced Nixon to a Chilean media magnate and Pepsi bottling-plant owner who was seeking Washington’s help in overthrowing President Salvador Allende, who had been democratically elected in Chile on a Marxist platform. Allende was deposed in 1973 by the military and replaced by the dictator Gen. Augusto Pinochet.

Evidentally, tying a premier Hollywood feminist to the murder of Allende and Augusto Pinochet is too much for leftists. Let's talk more about Farley and the Coke/Pepsi wars. Or the anti-Catholicism of FDR and the New Deal. RobS^{Free Kyle!} 20:27, August 17, 2021 (EDT)

Again, as asked repeatedly: Can you please offer any factual source for your claim that Crawford was ever a Democrat - beyond your own personal assumption? Can you please answer this direct question in regard to the sole topic at hand? --ConcludingChapter (talk) 20:36, August 17, 2021 (EDT)

Well, that a problem. You insinuated in your initial posting here that she was a supporter of Republicans, whereas the truth is, cancel culture in Hollywood goes back to the early days of the New Deal for anyone who did not toe the Democrat party line. RobS^{Free Kyle!} 20:53, August 17, 2021 (EDT)

"You insinuated in your initial posting here that she was a supporter of Republicans" I did not insinuate it, I stated she DID support Republican politicians, and named Nixon and Reagan as two examples. However, I never said she was a Democrat or Republican. The topic at hand is the factual evidence regarding Crawford's political affiliation. The political affiliation cited on this website's article for Joan Crawford states Crawford was a "Democrat." This is cited without any factual evidence.

So, going back to the topic of this thread, can you please offer any factual source for your claim that Crawford was ever a Democrat - beyond your own personal assumption? --ConcludingChapter (talk) 21:12, August 17, 2021 (EDT)

As any serious celebrity or business person knows, you don't discuss politics so as not to offend segments of your customer or fan base. A lesson only now some Hollywood, sports, and business interests are re-learning. But we have enough evidence to show that she was a feminist New Dealer throughout her entire life. RobS^{Free Kyle!} 21:22, August 17, 2021 (EDT)

Donald Trump is a great example. He was an icon and role model, particularly even for blacks - until he ran for president under a party banner. RobS^{Free Kyle!} 21:24, August 17, 2021 (EDT)

Actually, many celebrities, particularly film actors and actresses, did make their political affiliation known, including Bette Davis - who was as large of a star as Crawford. I would also challenge your above (unsourced) claim that Hollywood was predominantly Democratic pre-1960s. However, this aspect is besides the point of this topic, and is not a source of evidence or fact in regard to Crawford. It would simply be another diversion tactic in order to go in circles around the fact there are no sources for the claim that Crawford was ever a Democrat.

"we have enough evidence to show that she was a feminist New Dealer throughout her entire life." - What is this "evidence"? I contend no such evidence exists. The few examples you have provided above are not fact-based, and in most incidences I have corrected those examples with facts. In regard to your repeated mention of "feminism," just so you know, Crawford spoke out publicly against the Women's Lib movement. This is well-documented.

Can you please offer any factual source for your claim that Crawford was ever a Democrat - beyond your own personal assumption? --ConcludingChapter (talk) 21:41, August 17, 2021 (EDT)

Bingo, the radical Women's Lib movement of the 1960s. In her early film career, she and the Hollywood moguls just focused on breaking down traditional stereotypes of unwed mothers and the family unit. Turns out, she was directly connected to child tafficers. RobS^{Free Kyle!} 23:17, August 17, 2021 (EDT)

Thank you for demonstrating that you will not be able to provide any factual information regarding the topic of this thread. --ConcludingChapter (talk) 23:53, August 17, 2021 (EDT)