Difference between revisions of "Talk:Essay: Hitler was a Communist in early 1919"

Revision as of 20:56, October 25, 2023

Hitler was not a communist in 1919. After the collapse (Nov. 1918), demobilization, and Hitler's return to Munich, Hitler was sent into various meetings of socialist, communist and revolutionary groups by a Reichswehr Captain to spy on the meetings in the revolutionary atmosphere of the times. One such group was what eventually became the NSDAP. Other groups were Bolshevik groups aligned with the ongoing Moscow revolutions.

Suggested readings:

• For biographical background on Hitler in this period: Konrad Heiden Hitler - widely viewed as most authentic and authoritive for this period (Heiden first met Hitler personally in 1923);

• Joseph Schumpeter, Capitalism, Socialism, and Democracy, Part V, A Historical Sketch of Socialist Parties, Chapter XXVII From the First to the Second World War, particularly Sections II, III, and IV for understanding the socio-political situation.

Simply attending a meeting as a spy doesn't make one a communist. This Essay is dangerously close to Holocaust revisionism. RobS^{Give Peace a Chance!} 16:19, October 25, 2023 (EDT)

Nice denialist effort there, pal. That precisely is the neo-Marxist narrative pushed by propagandist Ian Kershaw and refuted by TIKhistory; Hitler was elected into the Communist Bavarian Soviet Republic, which means Bavarian Communists considered him a qualified Communist leader. Kershaw himself admits that there isn't enough evidence to indicate Hitler was merely some opportunist (which the TIK video cites). Ernst Rohm once rebuked Hitler for joining the Communists instead of the Freikorps.

Regardless, Nazism is a form of Communism anyways. I hope this clarifies matters. —LT ^{Rev. 22:13} Wednesday, 16:38, October 25, 2023 (EDT)

No it doesn't clarify matters. RobS^{Give Peace a Chance!} 16:40, October 25, 2023 (EDT)

Too bad! I guess you don't like factual reality. —LT ^{Rev. 22:13} Wednesday, 16:41, October 25, 2023 (EDT)

No, I've only read all the background materials and had a step-grandfather who was present in Bavaria from 1919 to 1927. RobS^{Give Peace a Chance!} 16:45, October 25, 2023 (EDT)

The same Bavaria which ushered in a late-1910s Communist paradise later supported the Nazis. And the evidence for the Communist root of Nazism doesn't stop there! In Mein Kampf, Hitler attempts to distance himself from any involvement in Jewish Communist Kurt Eisner's Bavarian Soviet Republic (which again, TIK explains in his video). So any effort to disconnect Hitler from Bavarian Communism is itself Hitlerist propaganda.

Marxism denounced earlier forms of Socialism as "not real Socialism," and declared that "socializing the people" to create a Communist utopia meant a religiously motivated mass murder of bourgeois capitalists, seen as an outgrowth of Judaism. Nazism just took it a step further: instead of antisemitism limited to religion, it was racial, so the concept of race replaced "economic classes." For Nazism, Communism was the primary target of "not real Socialism™" because they posed the primary rivaling threat (just as Stalinism and Troskyism were rivals), and creating a Socialist utopia means mass-killing Jews on the basis of ethnicity, which as we know was the Holocaust. In 1941, Hitler admitted that "basically National Socialism and Marxism are the same." The fuhrer opposed Weimar Germany from the left wing, lamenting that they "had never read Marx." —LT ^{Rev. 22:13} Wednesday, 16:51, October 25, 2023 (EDT)

I don't think you even understand what communism is. RobS^{Give Peace a Chance!} 16:56, October 25, 2023 (EDT)